Re: [sword-devel] moving away from freenode

[Caleb Maclennan]

Yes, the Freenode meltdown is *way* ahead of schedule. I've been 
watching the train wreck from a safe distance and it's one of the most 
reckless and wantonly irresponsible series of events I've witnessed in 
internet history. In 2021 that's saying something. Everything there 
needs to be evacuated post haste.


Personally I'd like to see the IRC channel survive and migrate to either 
Libera or OFTC. Both of those networks now have operational Matrix 
bridges. That brings three of the largest open chat platforms used for 
open source (Gitter, Matrix, & IRC) able to interact in the same 
channels seamlessly. This means end users can connect from any of 
hundreds of apps from web clients to terminal clients to native desktop 
apps to mobile apps. With bridging enabled all three ecosystems operate 
natively as if everybody was in the same place.


Discord is a cool system, but it is a closed source platform and 
relatively closed ecosystem. It is not easy to connect to from the 
terminal, and the mobile app isn't something I'm going to leave running, 
etc. Since there isn't much choice in apps I'm kind of stuck with their 
version, which may or may not suite different needs. I've been okay with 
it for special purposes like a conference, but find it too high friction 
to stay connected indefinitely.


Caleb

P.S. I would suggest the same for #xiphos as well. Note #bibletime has 
gone with OFTC.


 On 2021-05-26 23:12, Karl Kleinpaste wrote:


https://twitter.com/nazunalika/status/1397632808458219522

(Context: For those unaware, Rocky Linux is a 1:1 replacement for 
Centos, now that Centos 8 is in its premature last year, becoming a 
"stream" release positioned between Fedora and RHEL, rather than in a 
post-RHEL rebuild position.)


I was not aware until now that channels were being branded with "topic 
violations," and then "seized" somehow. So it appears that the freenode 
meltdown is proceeding ahead of expected pace. And it seemed previously 
that opinion is widely that we should finish abandoning freenode in 
favor of some{where,thing} else.


Personally I'm in favor of Discord, mostly from simple familiarity.
Any other concrete suggestions that folks would be interested in 
bringing into existence promptly?


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Re: [sword-devel] Versification Mapping

[Caleb Maclennan]

On Sat, May 9, 2020 at 9:45 AM Tobias Klein  wrote:

> @all: Who would be interested in this in general? We could start with tags
> / topical verse lists.
>

I would.

For my tastes and potential use cases something that split the difference
between a complete live persistence and a static import/export would be
much more useful. Specifically I would like to intervene in the middle of
the import/export process and store the dump format in version control. If
the format were carefully considered with this use case in mind this would
allow merging content from different sources and basically providing a
synchronization mechanism. Not a live persistent connection perse, but with
a little outside setup it could be used as an eventually-consistent sync
mechanism. How much hand holding would go into fixing merge conflicts would
be dependent on how well thought out the schema was.
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Re: [sword-devel] AUR build fails in Manjaro (Was Re: Xiphos 4.2.1)

[Caleb Maclennan]

Yes I maintain the biblesync package as well.

Your issue is that `pacmac` does not seem to understand how to resolve
library dependencies. Yes installing the biblesync package will fix it for
you, but the way it is specified now is, I believe, correct for Arch Linux.
Depending on the SO module itself instead of on the package name adds a
bunch of tooling to the build process that checks versions and understands
when it can and cannot swap out a library without rebuilding dependent
packages. In this case if I just specified 'biblesync' as a dependency it
would let the system upgrade the biblesync package willy-nilly without
caring what happened to other packages. With the libbibilesync.so
dependency it understands that the software was compiled with a dynamically
linked library dependency and that if it updates that library it has to
also get an updated version of dependents that is compatible with the major
SO version.

Manjaro is mostly Arch under the hood, but not quite. And AUR helpers such
as pacmac are definitely explicitly not supported.

I'll look into whether I can legitimately specify both kinds of
dependencies to ease this pain, but at the end of the day the first
priority is going to be on correct Arch packaging. If you want to ease the
pain a little bit you can probably nab the pre-compiled packages from my
repo here:
https://wiki.archlinux.org/index.php/Unofficial_user_repositories#alerque —
I think they should work in Manjoro because pacman understands how to
resolve those dependencies.

On Fri, May 8, 2020 at 10:36 PM Israel Dahl  wrote:

> Error Message from GUI tool:
> "could not satisfy dependencies:
> unable to satisfy dependency 'libbiblesync.so' required by xiphos"
>
> this uses pamac-manager
>
> I've found biblesync 2.0.1-1 (at the time of writing)
>
> The line in the build script (at least for manjaro) should simply have
> biblesync, AFAIK.  At least, building/installing biblesync fixes it.
>
> I am assuming the relations between Ubuntu/Debian is similar to
> Manjaro/Arch, and they seem to use the same repos, and internals so it
> may fail on arch if you do not previously install biblesync.  Do you
> maintain the AUR for biblesync?
>
> Easy bug to overlook, when you are so used to having something you
> always use installed!
>
>
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Re: [sword-devel] Xiphos 4.2.1

[Caleb Maclennan]

On Thu, May 7, 2020 at 11:12 PM Israel Dahl  wrote:
> Do you maintain the AUR build scripts for Arch?

I maintain the AUR builds for xiphos (and xiphos-git). 4.2.1 was
released there already.

> And also do you think this will be able to get into Debian?

I can't really speak to Debian. I think for Ubuntu the answer is no,
but we're working on an official Xiphos PPA. I believe the packaging
for that is basically the same as Debian. I believe there are some
Debian folks here that can speak to that better though.

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Re: [sword-devel] Bishop 1.4.0 translation UPDATED2

[Caleb Maclennan]

On Thu, May 7, 2020 at 6:33 PM Troy A. Griffitts  wrote:
> I am learning more about gitlab as we go.  It appears that public
> projects on gitlab are browsable at the public/ link, e.g.,

No worries. Having maintained a couple Gitlab instances for a few
years I'm well aware of how much a bug-bear it can be to Administer. A
great system when it's working, but not the lightest thing to get off
the ground.

> https://git.crosswire.org/public

So I believe there is a mechanism where you can customize what shows
up on the login page, to which you should be able to add a "browse
public repos" link or something like that to the above URL.

I did receive your invitation, but I can't accept it. It's a catch 22
of some kind, when I click the link in the invite email I am told "To
accept this invitation, sign in." and shown a sign in form. If I could
sign in I wouldn't be needing the invitation.

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Re: [sword-devel] Bishop 1.4.0 translation UPDATED2

[Caleb Maclennan]

As Greg mentioned, the root of the Gitlab instance redirects to the
login. There are actually several projects that are publicly
browseable but you can only start doing so with a deep link to one of
them.

I would appreciate an invite as well, if nothing else to participate
in issues on Bishop!

On Thu, Apr 2, 2020 at 7:18 PM Greg Hellings  wrote:
>
>
>
> On Wed, Apr 1, 2020 at 10:04 PM Troy A. Griffitts  
> wrote:
>>
>> Our Gitlab instance is available for any official CrossWire projects who 
>> wish to use it.  We don't have the resources to manage open subscriptions 
>> but any CrossWire project wishing to make our gitlab their home is welcome 
>> to an account and to send invites to their contributors.
>>
>> We backup all repos regularly and multiple backups of a sprawling public 
>> gitlab instance would quickly fill our disk capacity.  Github.com is great 
>> for public sandboxing, personal projects, and even importing and working on 
>> project with upstream from out gitlab instance.  You can directly import on 
>> Github by selecting  [+], Import repository, and then specify one of our 
>> gitlab project clone URLs.  Of course, if you are a regular contributor to a 
>> project, you are welcome to an account on our gitlab instance for that 
>> purpose.
>>
>> Hope this makes sense,
>
> It makes sense, and it's exactly what I would expect for a privately hosted 
> instance. However, I think the instance is more locked down than you intend. 
> Any URL leading into git.crosswire.org, including the "/" path, redirects me 
> to login. So without an account I can't even see what code is up there.
>
> --Greg
>>
>> Troy
>>
>>
>> On 4/1/20 10:14 AM, Greg Hellings wrote:
>>
>> How does one sign up for access to our gitlab instance?
>>
>> --Greg
>>
>> On Wed, Apr 1, 2020 at 11:21 AM Troy A. Griffitts  
>> wrote:
>>>
>>> I hope everyone isn't going too crazy sitting at home.
>>>
>>> I'm about to push this release of Bishop out.  If anyone has anything else 
>>> they'd like to get into the release, please send me a merge request on our 
>>> repo:
>>>
>>> https://git.crosswire.org/main/bishop
>>>
>>> or send me an email with your update.
>>>
>>> Thank you for all the feedback, translations, testing, and encouragement!
>>>
>>> May God use this to draw many to Himself,
>>>
>>> Troy
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> On 3/21/20 4:22 AM, Troy A. Griffitts wrote:
>>>
>>> Updated list of new strings (comment lines start with # and don't need to 
>>> be translated):
>>>
>>> Show Gospel Parallels=Show Gospel Parallels
>>> # This option is used as a choice for Study Bible to use for Verse Study, 
>>> Word Study, etc.
>>> # First Active means that the first Bible selected in the 3 display 
>>> dropdowns which has language data will be used.
>>> # This choice says, "I don't wish to choose a specific Bible, just use the 
>>> first one I am currently diplaying which has the ability."
>>> First Active=First Active
>>> Nothing to display.=Nothing to display.
>>> No Modules Installed=No Modules Installed
>>> No Modules Available.  Try pressing the [↻] button.=No Modules Available.  
>>> Try pressing the [↻] button.
>>> You have received an application update since your last run.=You have 
>>> received an application update since your last run.
>>> Would you like to check for updates to your Bibles and other study 
>>> resources?=Would you like to check for updates to your Bibles and other 
>>> study resources?
>>> Update Resources=Update Resources
>>> Installation Sources=Installation Sources
>>> Updates Available=Updates Available
>>> No installed resources have updates available. New study resources can be 
>>> added by first selecting an installation source at the top.=No installed 
>>> resources have updates available. New study resources can be added by first 
>>> selecting an installation source at the top.
>>> Below is a list of installed resources which have updates available. Click 
>>> on any row to update the resource.=Below is a list of installed resources 
>>> which have updates available. Click on any row to update the resource.
>>> You have asked to show Gospel parallels. For this feature, we need to 
>>> download a small set of data.  Is this OK?=You have asked to show Gospel 
>>> parallels. For this feature, we need to download a small set of data.  Is 
>>> this OK?
>>> Install Module=Install Module
>>> Font: Reading=Font: Reading
>>> Font: App=Font: App
>>>
>>> On 3/21/20 3:42 AM, Cyrille wrote:
>>>
>>> Please add Fonts: Reading and Fonts: App to the list. I'm waiting for them 
>>> before a new merge request.
>>>
>>> Le 21/03/2020 à 11:38, Troy A. Griffitts a écrit :
>>>
>>> Updated list of new strings (comment lines start with # and don't need to 
>>> be translated):
>>>
>>> Show Gospel Parallels=Show Gospel Parallels
>>> # This option is used as a choice for Study Bible to use for Verse Study, 
>>> Word Study, etc.
>>> # First Active means that the first Bible selected in the 3 display 
>>> dropdowns which has language data 

Re: [sword-devel] trying to get proper xhtml to work in webkit

[Caleb Maclennan]

On Sun, Apr 19, 2020 at 1:27 AM Karl Kleinpaste  wrote:

> On 4/18/20 5:25 PM, Troy A. Griffitts wrote:
>
> Do you have a module and entry key value I can use for testing?
>
> ESV2011, intro commentary paragraphs at every book's 1:1.
>

The ESV modules have been pulled from every public SWORD repository that I
know of.
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Re: [sword-devel] Build Failure in path with spaces

[Caleb Maclennan]

You don't need to worry about non-ASCII characters on the Linux side of
things. Almost all file systems and tooling on almost all distros will
handle almost any Unicode UTF-8 characters in filenames and paths just
fine. The only thing you need to watch out for typically are spaces (can be
used, but they must be escaped or the paths quoted), quote marks (can screw
with poorly implemented quoting of spaces), null characters, newlines
(technically valid in filenames, but many scripts forget this and they tend
to break), backslashes (also valid, but tend to confuse people escaping
them). It's also valid but unpleasant when filenames begin with a dash or
semicolon because these make it hard to use filenames as arguments.

Besides those ASCII issues, non ASCII localized path and filenames are
pretty much a non-issue.

On Mon, Apr 13, 2020 at 12:31 PM David Haslam  wrote:

> How might a build work or fail if the SWORD path contains any non-ASCII
> characters?
>
> This is certainly conceivable for Windows users whose locale is not
> English.
> I cannot speak for Linux users.
>
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Re: [sword-devel] Firefox to remove support for the FTP protocol | ZDNet

[Caleb Maclennan]

I don't think code sharing code with browsers is even the issue here, the
issue is the FTP ecosystem is going away — and surprising quickly for
something that used to be so ubiquitous. I've already bumped into several
ISP's just flat out blocking all FTP traffic, probably because they didn't
know of or care about any ongoing uses for it. With browsers dropping
support, it's validity as a protocol is going to quickly go by the wayside.
All existing FTP based systems should be ported to HTTPS (and only 'S') at
the earliest convenience.

On Fri, Mar 20, 2020 at 5:22 PM Greg Hellings 
wrote:

>
>
> On Fri, Mar 20, 2020 at 2:20 AM David Haslam 
> wrote:
>
>> The writing is on the wall for FTP.
>>
>> Firefox to remove support for the FTP protocol | ZDNet
>> https://flip.it/AY-TTt
>>
>> How will this trend affect how we design and communicate?
>>
>
> Since we don't use or rely on Mozilla or Chrome code, I imagine it won't
> affect much of anything.
>
> --Greg
>
>>
>> Best regards,
>>
>> David
>>
>> Sent from ProtonMail Mobile
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Re: [sword-devel] Ezra Project 0.12.0 released

[Caleb Maclennan]

>
> I don't see anything in here about needing the SWORD library or its
> headers. Is that somehow fetched and bundled? How are you gaining access to
> it?
>

The "culprit" here is the node-sword-interface module. Currently the
default setup of this module includes install time hooks that use curl,
git, cmake, etc. to fetch build and bundle a copy of the SWORD source code
inside the node package. The built files subsequently get bundled inside
the electron package.

This arrangement of fetching sources out of band and building them
(requiring special tooling) is unacceptable for Arch Linux, so I hand to
come up with some workarounds. Tobias also helped provide a workaround. You
can see some of the discussion here:

https://github.com/tobias-klein/node-sword-interface/issues/3

In the end node packaging I came up with is here:

https://aur.archlinux.org/cgit/aur.git/tree/PKGBUILD?h=nodejs-sword-interface

That builds a copy of the node module that builds itself against a system
installed SWORD library.

https://aur.archlinux.org/cgit/aur.git/tree/PKGBUILD?h=ezra-project

The next piece of the puzzle is actually getting Ezra Project to use that.
At least on Arch bundling the electron executable is also inappropriate, so
I basically have start with the source, then strip out the dependencies
from package.json that are going to be provided by the system (in my case
electron, node-gyp, node-prune, node-addon-api, pug-cli,
node-sword-interface). Next I step through the steps the original build
process takes, replacing them when relevant with local system resources,
symlinking in the above built sword module, etc.

In the end the generated sword library interfaces still get bundled in the
electron source asar, but at least they are linked against the system SWORD.

If you have questions I can help with let me know. This gave me conniptions
to get working, but I think I understand it a bit now. There are probably
quite o few things "we" could to to make Ezra Project easier to package for
distros.

Caleb


> And does it depend on NodeJS 10, as the setup seems to initialize?
> Currently in Fedora is NodeJS 12, so it would want to be packaged with that
> if we can support it.
>
> --Greg
>
> On Wed, Mar 18, 2020 at 3:39 PM Tobias Klein  wrote:
>
>> Hi Greg,
>>
>> This Dockerfile defines the environment that I'm using to generate the
>> RPM package for Fedora:
>>
>> https://github.com/tobias-klein/ezra-project/blob/master/docker/Fedora31_Dockerfile
>>
>> This is the build script for Linux which is then executed in a Docker
>> container based on the above image (also used for all other Linux-based
>> targets):
>>
>> https://github.com/tobias-klein/ezra-project/blob/master/build_scripts/build.sh
>>
>> And this is the RPM configuration (also documenting the package
>> dependencies) that I'm using to generate the Fedora packages (used by
>> electron-installer-redhat):
>>
>> https://github.com/tobias-klein/ezra-project/blob/master/package_config/rpm_config_fedora29.json
>>
>> Some general instructions regarding the Build process on Linux can be
>> found here:
>> https://github.com/tobias-klein/ezra-project/blob/master/BUILD.md#linux
>>
>> Let me know if you have more questions.
>>
>> Best regards,
>> Tobias
>>
>> On 3/18/20 8:08 PM, Greg Hellings wrote:
>>
>> Tobias,
>>
>> What would I need in place to make this available in Fedora?
>>
>> --Greg
>>
>> On Wed, Mar 18, 2020 at 2:07 PM Tobias Klein  wrote:
>>
>>> Thanks for the packaging efforts and your feedback, Caleb! I appreciate
>>> it! :)
>>>
>>> Tobias
>>>
>>> Am 18. März 2020 12:53:56 MEZ schrieb Caleb Maclennan :
>>>
>>>>
>>>> Great work Tobias.
>>>>
>>>> Arch Linux packaging is also updated, 0.12.0 can be built from the AUR
>>>> (manually or using any aur helper of your choice) or installed from my
>>>> prebuilt packages in this repository:
>>>> https://wiki.archlinux.org/index.php/Unofficial_user_repositories#alerque
>>>>
>>>> Caleb
>>>>
>>>> On Wed, Mar 18, 2020 at 1:24 AM Tobias Klein 
>>>> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> Hi all,
>>>>>
>>>>> *Ezra Project 0.12.0* has been released. Ezra Project is a topical
>>>>> bible study tool.
>>>>>
>>>>> https://github.com/tobias-klein/ezra-project/releases/tag/0.12.0
>>>>>
>>>>> Note-worthy *improvements* are:
>>>>>
>>>>>- SWORD module unlock support
>>>>>- French tra

Re: [sword-devel] Ezra Project 0.12.0 released

[Caleb Maclennan]

Great work Tobias.

Arch Linux packaging is also updated, 0.12.0 can be built from the AUR
(manually or using any aur helper of your choice) or installed from my
prebuilt packages in this repository:
https://wiki.archlinux.org/index.php/Unofficial_user_repositories#alerque

Caleb

On Wed, Mar 18, 2020 at 1:24 AM Tobias Klein  wrote:

> Hi all,
>
> *Ezra Project 0.12.0* has been released. Ezra Project is a topical bible
> study tool.
>
> https://github.com/tobias-klein/ezra-project/releases/tag/0.12.0
>
> Note-worthy *improvements* are:
>
>- SWORD module unlock support
>- French translation (Thanks to Cyrille and Tom)
>- Internal design change: Load Bible text directly from SWORD modules
>instead of database
>
> Detailed changes are recorded in the Change Log
> 
> .
>
> *Downloads* are available for:
>
>- Windows (tested on Windows 10)
>- macOS (tested on Catalina)
>- Ubuntu 18.04 + 19.04
>- Debian 10
>- Linux Mint 18
>- Fedora 29 (also works with Fedora 30)
>- Fedora 31
>- CentOS 8
>- OpenSuse Leap 15.1
>
> Feedback is appreciated!
>
> Best regards,
> Tobias
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Re: [sword-devel] NASB, NBLA, LBLA

[Caleb Maclennan]

On Thu, Mar 12, 2020 at 7:45 AM Troy A. Griffitts 
wrote:

> It's been a long long road, but after much negotiation and many
> volunteers contributing to the conversion efforts, we have finally been
> granted permission to distribute Lockman's:
>
> New American Standard Bible (NASB)
> Nueva Biblia de las Américas (NBLA)
> La Biblia de las Américas (LBLA)


I big thank you to Lockman's and all the CrossWire folks who made this
happen. This is great.
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Re: [sword-devel] Next Sword release - timeline?

[Caleb Maclennan]

>From the downstream distro packager's perspective it would be really nice
to have an upstream release! Packaging software that depends on other
unreleased library versions is always a hassle and frequently a reason
packages get held up entirely.

On Fri, Feb 21, 2020 at 7:50 PM Tobias Klein  wrote:

> Dear Troy,
>
> Could you provide a timeline for when the next Sword release will be
> published?
>
> I'm at the point where I can release Ezra Project 0.12.0, which depends
> on features in Sword trunk (for the individual unlock keys).
>
> Now I'm wondering whether I should release based on Sword trunk or
> whether a new official version could be used.
>
> Thanks for your efforts!
>
> Best regards,
> Tobias
>
>
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Re: [sword-devel] Turkish to English glossary problem

[Caleb Maclennan]

Hey DM,

I am fluent in Turkish and can help out here. That being said I'm a little
confused what you're into here. Can you point me at where to see the source
files for this in context and where it comes out in an app?

It looks from the bits you pasted like a file somewhere along the line got
read and interpreted with the wrong code-page. Of the text you pasted, all
of it is wrong, but it is all off with a 1-to-1 character transpose that
could make it right. All the "O"s are "İ" and all the "1"s are "I" in the
dictionary list for example.

Caleb

On Tue, Jan 5, 2016 at 4:56 PM, DM Smith  wrote:

> Does anyone know Turkish that can help figure out a problem I am having?
>
> Background: In ASCII the first 32 characters (00 to 1F) are control
> characters and most are not valid for XML, but are valid for UTF-8.
>
> In one of our modules, ERtr_en, I am seeing data such as:
> For the 26th entry, the entry looks like
>
> AUSTOS 1. August
>
> However, the key AUSTOS has a non-printable between A and U of the control
> character with the hex value 1F:
> ‘A’ ‘1F’ ‘U’ ’S’ ’T’ ‘O’ ’S’
>
> What is the correct value?
>
> Note: There are hundreds of such problems in this module. And I’m seeing
> such non-printables in many other modules from the same source (
> wordgumbo.com).
>
> For those that are interested, here are the first entries in the
> dictionary, none of which see right to me (ran a few of the definitions
> through google translate):
> index offset size key value
> 0 33132 22 0NCIL 1. Bible
> 1 33156 72 0NGILIZ 1. English2. Englishman; Sassenach...
> 2 33260 32 0NGILIZ KAM1_1 1. bamboo
> 3 33230 28 0NGILIZCE 1. English
> 4 33294 44 0NGILTERE 1. England2. England
> 5 33340 28 0RAN 1. Iran; Persia
> 6 33370 25 0RANL1 1. Iranian
> 7 33397 26 0RLANDA 1. Ireland
> 8 33425 43 0RLANDAL1 1. Irish2. Irishman
> 9 33470 21 0SA 1. Christ
> 10 33493 22 0SLAM 1. Islam
> 11 33517 24 0SPANYA 1. Spain
> 12 33543 28 0SPANYOL 1. Spaniard
> 13 33573 39 0SRAIL 1. Israel2. Israel
> 14 33614 28 0STANBUL 1. Istanbul
> 15 33644 24 0SVEÇ 1. Sweden
> 16 33670 41 0SVEÇLI 1. Swedish2. Swede
> 17 33713 31 0SVIÇRE 1. Switzerland
> 18 33746 41 0SVIÇRELI 1. Swiss2. Swiss
> 19 33789 23 0TALYA 1. Italy
> 20 33814 42 0TALYAN 1. Italian2. Italian
> 21 33858 44 0TALYANCA 1. Italian2. Italian
> 22 33904 26 0ZLANDA 1. Iceland
> 23 33086 20 1L1K 1. warm
> 24 33108 22 1RMAK 1. river
> 25 7062 25 AUSTOS 1. August
>
>
> Thanks in advance!
>
> In Him,
> DM Smith
>
>
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Re: [sword-devel] Turkish to English glossary problem

[Caleb Maclennan]

DM,

Honestly I'm willing to put some effort into this if it will be beneficial
to anybody using Turkish scriptures, but the Wayback Machine link you
provided is not encouraging. Not only is the encoding garbage, but the data
itself is rife with mistakes.Not a full minute of skimming it and I found
several misspelled Turkish words (not just wrong encoding, actual
misspellings) and outright bogus definitions. It's a very low quality data
set. Is what's an the page representative of what is going to come out even
if I dive down an archaic Windows rabbit hole and manage to surface with a
properly encoded list? Is such a dictionary really helping anybody? It
doesn't seem to have much in the way of Biblical/theological terminology
anyway. Is this just for looking up word definitions in while reading a
text or does it serve some purpose for cross referencing translations?

I have a copy of Xiphos handy, but for some reason Turkish isn't showing up
in the dictionary modules available for download. Is this not in the
default CrossWire repo?

Caleb

On Tue, Jan 5, 2016 at 8:11 PM, DM Smith <dmsm...@crosswire.org> wrote:

> Thanks Caleb,
>
> I’m working on JSword which is the Java version of the SWORD engine. As
> such I run all the modules I can get my hands on through a process that
> reads all of each module reporting what it cannot handle. It was that
> effort that made me look closer at the module. Either the problem was in
> JSword or it was in the module.
>
> With Peter, David and your input, we can safely say that it is the
> module’s problem.
>
> Most front-ends don’t display the module as a list (i.e. browse the
> contents). Bible Desktop does. Most front-ends allow you to select a word
> and look it up in a dictionary. The Glossary modules allow you to look up a
> word in one language and display it in another. Bible Desktop doesn’t.
>
> If you let us know which front-end you use, we can explain how to download
> the module for it and how to use it in that program.
>
> The SWORD utility mod2imp will dump a module’s content in imp format.
> Since this module is a RawLD module, the *dat file is readable. In your
> modules folder it would be:
> modules/lexdict/rawld/glossaries/ertr_en/ertr_en.dat. The ertr_en.idx file
> is not readable as it is in a proprietary binary format.
>
> While it certainly is possible to take the dump from mod2imp, edit it and
> rebuild the module, we prefer not to do that. What is best is to get the
> source again and create a module from it. And if the source was not the
> original location, it is best to identify the original and get it from
> there. In the case of our source, we got it from:
> http://www.wordgumbo.com/al/tur/ertureng.htm
> Currently this site is down, so I found it via the Internet Wayback
> Machine:
>
> https://web.archive.org/web/20131124010613/http://www.wordgumbo.com/al/tur/ertureng.htm
>
> I noted that WordGumbo sourced the files from Ergane. That is the
> originator of the data and it can be found here:
> http://download.travlang.com//
>
> Ergane is software that runs under Windows only. It doesn’t run under
> Windows 10 (64-bit). I haven’t tried Windows 7 (64-bit). The software
> requires various zips to be installed to be useful. I downloaded one of the
> zip files and it contained an MDB file, which I’m pretty sure is a Windows
> database file, perhaps Access. From the website’s description of the
> program:
>
> Ergane is a multilingual <http://users.nccs.gov/~rickyk/scicomp/> translation
> dictionary for Windows that uses the artificial language Esperanto to
> translate words and short expressions from one natural language to another.
> Ergane is a product of Majstro Aplikaĵoj
> <http://www.majstro.com/Bedrijf/contact_eng.html>.
>
>
> and
>
> You won't need a masters in computer science
> <https://cisonline.bu.edu/master-of-science-in-computer-information-systems/> 
> to
> download Ergane ,but make sure you do have Windows.
>
> Windows 95 or higher.
>
> Ideally, the output of the program for the Turkish to English needs to be
> obtained from it, converted into UTF-8, if it isn’t and a module source
> file created for it. Proof-reading is invaluable.
>
> Let us know what you are willing to do.
>
> In Him,
> DM
>
> On Jan 5, 2016, at 12:28 PM, Caleb Maclennan <ca...@alerque.com> wrote:
>
> Hey DM,
>
> I am fluent in Turkish and can help out here. That being said I'm a little
> confused what you're into here. Can you point me at where to see the source
> files for this in context and where it comes out in an app?
>
> It looks from the bits you pasted like a file somewhere along the line got
> read and interpreted with the wrong code-page. Of the text you pasted, all
> of it is

Re: [sword-devel] Turkish to English glossary problem

[Caleb Maclennan]

Disregard about the module, I found it in a different section of the module
manager. So I have the ERtr_en module now, but as far as I can figure in
Xephos it's useless. Turkish is an agglutinated language and almost no
words in an actual text like the Bible appear in their root or stem form as
found in a dictionary. Ergo no words (except a handful of conjunctions,
numbers, etc. that sometimes have no suffixes) you click on to look up in
the dictionary even have a chance of coming up with an actual meaning. Even
if you know how to parse words and type the stems into the dictionary
lookup bar, it rarely has them and throws the closest match (Alphabetical?
Levenshtein distance?) which is less than useless.

Unless I'm missing something, it might be just as well to disable the
module as insult anybody that tries to use it with data this useless. Am I
missing something? Is there a use-case that makes it worth trying to
cleanup the character set issue? I'll still look into it if you say it's
worth some time to do.

Caleb

On Tue, Jan 5, 2016 at 8:39 PM, Caleb Maclennan <ca...@alerque.com> wrote:

> DM,
>
> Honestly I'm willing to put some effort into this if it will be beneficial
> to anybody using Turkish scriptures, but the Wayback Machine link you
> provided is not encouraging. Not only is the encoding garbage, but the data
> itself is rife with mistakes.Not a full minute of skimming it and I found
> several misspelled Turkish words (not just wrong encoding, actual
> misspellings) and outright bogus definitions. It's a very low quality data
> set. Is what's an the page representative of what is going to come out even
> if I dive down an archaic Windows rabbit hole and manage to surface with a
> properly encoded list? Is such a dictionary really helping anybody? It
> doesn't seem to have much in the way of Biblical/theological terminology
> anyway. Is this just for looking up word definitions in while reading a
> text or does it serve some purpose for cross referencing translations?
>
> I have a copy of Xiphos handy, but for some reason Turkish isn't showing
> up in the dictionary modules available for download. Is this not in the
> default CrossWire repo?
>
> Caleb
>
> On Tue, Jan 5, 2016 at 8:11 PM, DM Smith <dmsm...@crosswire.org> wrote:
>
>> Thanks Caleb,
>>
>> I’m working on JSword which is the Java version of the SWORD engine. As
>> such I run all the modules I can get my hands on through a process that
>> reads all of each module reporting what it cannot handle. It was that
>> effort that made me look closer at the module. Either the problem was in
>> JSword or it was in the module.
>>
>> With Peter, David and your input, we can safely say that it is the
>> module’s problem.
>>
>> Most front-ends don’t display the module as a list (i.e. browse the
>> contents). Bible Desktop does. Most front-ends allow you to select a word
>> and look it up in a dictionary. The Glossary modules allow you to look up a
>> word in one language and display it in another. Bible Desktop doesn’t.
>>
>> If you let us know which front-end you use, we can explain how to
>> download the module for it and how to use it in that program.
>>
>> The SWORD utility mod2imp will dump a module’s content in imp format.
>> Since this module is a RawLD module, the *dat file is readable. In your
>> modules folder it would be:
>> modules/lexdict/rawld/glossaries/ertr_en/ertr_en.dat. The ertr_en.idx file
>> is not readable as it is in a proprietary binary format.
>>
>> While it certainly is possible to take the dump from mod2imp, edit it and
>> rebuild the module, we prefer not to do that. What is best is to get the
>> source again and create a module from it. And if the source was not the
>> original location, it is best to identify the original and get it from
>> there. In the case of our source, we got it from:
>> http://www.wordgumbo.com/al/tur/ertureng.htm
>> Currently this site is down, so I found it via the Internet Wayback
>> Machine:
>>
>> https://web.archive.org/web/20131124010613/http://www.wordgumbo.com/al/tur/ertureng.htm
>>
>> I noted that WordGumbo sourced the files from Ergane. That is the
>> originator of the data and it can be found here:
>> http://download.travlang.com//
>>
>> Ergane is software that runs under Windows only. It doesn’t run under
>> Windows 10 (64-bit). I haven’t tried Windows 7 (64-bit). The software
>> requires various zips to be installed to be useful. I downloaded one of the
>> zip files and it contained an MDB file, which I’m pretty sure is a Windows
>> database file, perhaps Access. From the website’s description of the
>> program:
>>
>> Er

Re: [sword-devel] DVCS (was Re: Project Free Scriptures started)

[Caleb Maclennan]

On Wed, Mar 19, 2014 at 6:59 PM, Peter Von Kaehne ref...@gmx.net wrote:

 That is a misunderstanding. For historical reasons our source commit
 mailing list is still called sword-cvs, but we use svn for many many years.


My mistake. The last time I mucked around with it it was CVS and recent
discussions have included indications that some parts still were. In that
event a transition to DVCS will be more gain for less pain.

Caleb
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Re: [sword-devel] DVCS (was Re: Project Free Scriptures started)

[Caleb Maclennan]

As I understand it the issue here is that most SWORD stuff is in CVS, not
SVN and it's a little harder to use git as a front end client for CVS than
it is for SVN. It can be done (see http://stackoverflow.com/a/586225/313192),
but isn't easy. There is a high barrier to entry even for those familiar
with _both_ systems.

I know the subject is being beaten to death lately but to add one more
voice: there are those of us out here just waiting to contribute and
participate when the toolset becomes less arcane. Non-distributed version
control simply makes it too hard and too frustrating to experiment and then
cleanup those experiments for contribution. The result is fewer
contributions and less quality review and cooperation on the ones that do
happen.

I have quite a bit of git know-how including migrations from other VCS
systems and would be willing to help anybody on the SWORD team with
migration issues or just coming up to speed with DVS in general. I also
have experience hosting git servers including Gitlab if they would like to
run something like that internally to coordinate (and control)
contributions. In fact I would be willing to donate hosting a Gitlab
instance if that's what it takes. This would allow fairly fine grained
control over repos and even branches, specifying who is and isn't allowed
to push to which ones. At the same time as keeping a tight reign on the
quality of the master fork and branch, folks could also freely have their
own copies of the repo and easily submit pull requests for for review
similar to how the Github workflow functions.

Feel free to contact me on or off list about any of the above and know that
there will be much rejoicing out here when migration does happen!

Caleb


On Thu, Mar 13, 2014 at 8:34 AM, Baiju M baiju.m.m...@gmail.com wrote:

 Using git-svn, it is possible to use git as a client for svn:
 http://blogs.atlassian.com/2013/12/git-svn-tips-and-tricks/

 Regards,
 Baiju M

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Re: [sword-devel] Internationalization for Turkish: Dotted and Dotless Letter I

[Caleb Maclennan]

2012/1/10 David Haslam dfh...@googlemail.com:
 Many software and web applications that are already internationalized and are
 successfully supporting many languages, often suffer catastrophic failure
 when they add support for the Turkish language.

David et-all,

True story. Turkish is a deceptively simple issue that wreaks havoc
on most any software that handles text strings even if it appears to
work just like any other language at first pass.

If any Sword related software projects are interested in supporting
Turkish and/or having issues doing so, I'd be happy to listen and
perhaps lend a hand. I speak Turkish and am familiar with the issues
it tends to raise.

Caleb

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Re: [sword-devel] Turkish

[Caleb Maclennan]

Hey David,

Thanks for your efforts on this. Can I ask what the status is on the
new module getting into the sword repo? I don't mean to be impatient I
was just wondering since it was announced as a couple of days but I
haven't seen it yet.

Another guy and I have already finished the Turkish localization for
And-Bible. It's in beta and I think we're waiting on the new sword
module showing up in the repo to publish to the Android market. I have
also been working on a localization for Xiphos. That project is moving
kind of slow right now in general but we're getting there.

Caleb

2011/12/6 David Haslam dfh...@googlemail.com:
 With the updated Turkish Bible module becoming available presently, there is
 an opportunity for front-end developers to add Turkish localization to their
 applications.

 Peter and I are in direct contact with the General Secretary of the
 Translation Trust.

 I'm sure that he would be keen to facilitate providing user interface
 translations for all the notable Sword and JSword applications.

 Please send your requests to either myself or Peter, and we'll ensure that
 they are forwarded to the Gen Sec.

 David Haslam
 Go Bible project leader



 --
 View this message in context: 
 http://sword-dev.350566.n4.nabble.com/Turkish-tp4113535p4165107.html
 Sent from the SWORD Dev mailing list archive at Nabble.com.

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Re: [sword-devel] Chromium OS and CrossWire?

[Caleb Maclennan]

2011/1/19 Greg Hellings greg.helli...@gmail.com:
 How any of that ties in to Chromium OS, people who know more about the
 OS will have to tell me.

I think the good news here is that what you've learned about the
browser is applicable to to the OS. The OS underneath the browser
doesn't much matter, the whole idea is that the browser has been
upgraded from an app to the shell / window manager / THE THING.

I am following this discussion with some interest. I have been running
a bible website for some time (Turkish language) and have been toying
with the idea of making it available offline with a few HTML5-ish
stunts.

If I can also be of service to the greater community by helping on
similar projects I would like to keep in touch with whoever else is
interested.

Caleb

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Re: [sword-devel] CrossWire lacks a Content Management System

[Caleb Maclennan]

Troy and Chris et all,

I cannot speak for what David felt as the exact problem, but I can
tell you why I jumped in with a comment. Troy it's hard to come up
with a specific example because the problem might be best described as
general discombobulation. The main crosswire site and the sword sub
site are both navigational catastrophes. This happens over time as
people come and go and projects eb and flow. I know how it is. The top
level layout has lost focus and usefulness to newcomers and content
has stagnated.

Chris you mention the issue of balancing devel news / nightly snapshot
type updates and releases that the public aught to be informed about.
I realize this is an issue, but it was pointed out just last week on
this list that the information for diatake on the site is some ten
years old and there is no indication that it has actually been
maintained to this day. Surely that's erring on the side of not enough
up to date information.

Also it was pointed on on another thread that there is a crosswire
wiki. Even new module developers seem to miss that this exists. I
looked and didn't see any reference to it on the crosswire home page.
Furthermore a quick glace at each area shows massive duplication of
content between the main site and the wiki, usually with the scales
tipping to the wiki for being up to date. A little more poking shows
even further duplication and even older content on the sword specific
sub-site.

Troy you mention the word involved in committing to the maintenance
of another framework. From the outside it looks like there are
already at least a trio if not half a dozen frameworks that don't
interact and are in various states of disrepair. I chimmed in on this
thread because it sounded like David was suggesting getting all of the
above under one heading so there is only one framework that actually
CAN be reasonably maintained.

Further thoughts?

Caleb

On Sat, Nov 6, 2010 at 14:49, Troy A. Griffitts scr...@crosswire.org wrote:
 I agree with Chris on this issue.  CMS has been a debated topic in the past.

 From my conservative position, you must give a specific, real world
 problem we currently have which is not easily solved with our current
 infrastructure, or a real world benefit we are currently lacking because
 we do not have something labeled a CMS, for us to even consider
 committing to the maintenance of another framework.

 Troy



 On 11/06/2010 12:22 PM, Chris Little wrote:


 On 11/6/2010 3:49 AM, David Haslam wrote:
 We have an ftpmirror that does not keep track of updates to scripts and
 other software tools that we host.

 What you're referring to here (linking directly to the SVN versions of
 perl scripts that we maintain) would be akin to replacing every single
 binary we provide with nightly builds. We don't need to be publishing an
 SVN commit that I made just over 12 hours ago when it hasn't even
 undergone testing beyond one or two USFM docs. The perl scripts change
 seldom and slowly, and they are used and tested by very few people.

 --Chris

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Re: [sword-devel] CrossWire lacks a Content Management System

[Caleb Maclennan]

I agree that this is a serious shortcoming of the overall project.

I would be willing to pitch in some experience in this area. If the
interested and or responsible parties would like perhaps we can get a
discussion going. Depending on the direction I may be willing to lend
a hand with coding and implementation.

I'll keep an eye on this thread.

Caleb

On Sat, Nov 6, 2010 at 12:49, David Haslam d.has...@ukonline.co.uk wrote:

 No doubt this topic may have been discussed in the past, but even with my
 limited experiences of IT, it seems to be the case that CrossWire lacks an
 overall Content Management System.

 Far too much of what we do is ad hoc and the result is that links in the
 wiki pages as well as the main website swiftly become out of date.

 We have an ftpmirror that does not keep track of updates to scripts and
 other software tools that we host.

 The result for users, especially newcomers, can be very frustrating.

 Though this might read like a gripe, please understand that I'm trying to be
 constructive.

 I'm putting myself in the place of a user, and looking to those of you who
 are far more experts in IT than I'll ever hope to be (at my age) to put in
 some effort to try and improve the total experience that we want our
 customers to have.

 Yours in Christ's service,
 David Haslam

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Re: [sword-devel] Xiphos 3.1.4 source tarball is released

[Caleb Maclennan]

On Mon, Oct 18, 2010 at 19:13, David Haslam d.has...@ukonline.co.uk wrote:
 Should we expect that the Xiphos packages will be built using SWORD 1.6.2 ?

Xihpos 3.1.4 does not seem to have any strict dependencies on SWORD
1.6.2. As such you should NOT expect it to be compiled against
anything in particular, whatever happens to be in the distro. Since
1.6.2 is not out yet, Xiphos 3.1.4 is already in some distros compiled
against SWORD 1.6.1. If there was some reason not to do this there
should have been an explicit dependence and the release should have
held off until the dependency is released.

Anybody packaging for a distro should be aware that when the next
version of sword comes out, it would be worth bumping the distro
release/build number on Xiphos so it get's built against the latest
sources.

Caleb

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Re: [sword-devel] question regarding Android front end

[Caleb Maclennan]

On Thu, Sep 30, 2010 at 01:31, Peter von Kaehne ref...@gmx.net wrote:
 On 29/09/10 23:11, Caleb Maclennan wrote:
 I love Google Translate and their various language tools, but let's
 put the effort into finding local translators before throwing software
 out there!

 Caleb, I agree and disagree at the same time.

 I am at this now for several years - a fair number of translations
 across the board in CrossWire in various languages are mine, inspired by
 me or mentored by me.

 There is an enormous power in a bad translation - it draws out guys who
 would never dream of doing something. Several translations we have and
 many many imporvements would never have come about if we had not
 presented a rough and ready mock-up

 With this in mind I am committing right now a google translated entire
 translation for Xiphos in Arabic. I am fed up to the core that we do not
 have an Arabic translation, I have tried to recruit translators for the
 language for 5 years and now I will make some people shame faced and
 steaming with anger when they see the poor translation. And - hopefully
 - next release we will have a nice one

 Peter

Hey Peter,

I'm sorry if my posted sounded critical of work that HAS gone into
getting Xiphos and other sword projects localized. I do appreciate,
and thank you for your efforts.

I hear your frustration with not being able to get translations and
think think there is something to be said for your argument. I don't
sustain an objection to posting machine translations is a way to
attract real translations, but because of the general embarrassment
that they are I would suggest they be tagged as such. Translated
languages, untranslated languages and machine translated draft
languages or something like that.

Also, I'm wondering if the entry barrier could be lowered a little bit
for would be translators. The Xiphos website section on translating
yammers on about ide's and po files and there are all these hash marks
and other funky symbols. How do you think that makes average Joe or
Mustafa or مصطفى feel? Ya not too comfortable. I spend most of my day
in vim writing shell scripts, so it doesn't phase me but I know I
would have a hard time getting any of my Turkish speaking friends to
give us a translation by sending them to that page.

I see Xiphos has some translation stuff setup on launchpad. Can we
perhaps tweak the website so it walks people through getting setup to
translate there? I feel like anybody who knows what a po file is can
figure out how to deal with them on their own.

I'm sorry I don't speak Arabic but I'll keep my eyes open for somebody
to help with that translation!

Caleb

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Re: [sword-devel] question regarding Android front end

[Caleb Maclennan]

On Wed, Sep 29, 2010 at 15:53, Martin Denham mjden...@gmail.com wrote:
... has proposed doing a translation of all languages using a Google tool
 but I don't know how well the Google tool would handle Chinese

I haven't seen the original discussion context that this comment
references, but having had some experience in the area of translated
software I wanted to make a comment about the viability of machine
translation for software interfaces:

Forget about how well it handles or doesn't handle Chinese -- for
which there is undoubtedly a large corpus of documents and hand fixed
translations to at least give it a fighting chance -- but this is a
crazy idea for many minority languages more recently introduced to the
world of machine translation. I've seen some software interfaces that
were obviously done this way and they are the subject of nothing but
ridicule even if the base software might have been a good thing.

I love Google Translate and their various language tools, but let's
put the effort into finding local translators before throwing software
out there!

Caleb

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Re: [sword-devel] Sword 1.6.2 NOW!

[Caleb Maclennan]

On Tue, Sep 14, 2010 at 12:58, Karl Kleinpaste k...@kleinpaste.org wrote:
 Since there has probably been no announcement from Sword that distros
 should patch,

 Um...  Procession from false assumption.  Anyone who's involved enough
 to be doing distribution of Sword software ought to be involved enough
 to be seeing discussion about such things as the curl bug and its patch
 here.

As a developer at PLD-Linux I long ago applied to patch in our package
repository: 
http://cvs.pld-linux.org/cgi-bin/cvsweb/packages/sword/sword.spec?rev=HEAD

However I would like to weigh in to this discussion to say that any
known bug that has to be patched in every major distribution before
release ought to be enough to warrant a point release in the upstream
project. There is no excuse for making every individual maintainer go
to the trouble of figuring out what is wrong with a broken package and
patching it.

Caleb

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