Re: [Tagging] To tag opening_hours=by appointment

2015-07-02 Thread André Pirard
On 2015-06-30 14:04, Marc Gemis wrote :
 Everything between quotes is considered a comment, and can contain
 values in the local language (e.g  123 nach␣Vereinbarung
 http://taginfo.openstreetmap.org/tags/opening_hours=%22nach%20Vereinbarung%22
  --
 German for by appointment)
 IMHO this means that there is nothing to formalize. This also means
 that ...Sa 09:00-18:00 + appointment is a comment and nothing has to
 be parsed.
 This should be  ...; Sa 09:00-18:00; Sa also by appointment

 see
 also http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Key:opening_hours/specification  at
 the bottom.

 m.

IMVHO, documentation improvement and some sort of formalization is
needed because:

  * I had asked the same question here before in the same terms
(appointment) and it is asked again
  * I had overlooked on appointment  10 times in a page that states
rules in examples to be grasped
  * Key:opening_hours
http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Key:opening_hours  does not
contain the word comment and, as I read before, mappers don't have
15 min to spend reading the full specification down to the end
  * comments should be explained in the syntax, including explicitly
that they're used to be displayed on user screen, because this
example doesn't seem to be the case : /on appointment; PH off But
not on public holidays (always closed). You don’t need to write this
comment for values in OSM. Documentation purpose only./
  * and probably add by schedule (see Web page) for scheduled occurrences
  * I've had a look at Osmand and, albeit they show opening-hours, they
will *not* show opening_hours=by appointment.
  * if Osmand did not understand the doc, there *is* a problem (IMVHO)
  * I first wanted to improve my simplified syntax with this, but as I
was scolded for writing it and as as it got erased, I will let you
do that.

Cheers

André.


 On Tue, Jun 30, 2015 at 12:26 PM, Warin 61sundow...@gmail.com
 mailto:61sundow...@gmail.com wrote:

 On 30/06/2015 8:09 PM, Warin wrote:
 Hi,

 I have a place that has by appointment .. and I have tagged it


 Arr now read the discussion on this subject hidden on the wiki
 discussion page. I think it needs to go on the 'front' page...

 Changed entry to
 open_hours=by appointment
 That covers my case,  but see example below..
 There is a fair amount of use of 'appointment' for opening hours
 with lots of variety.

 Favourites are

 the simple ones

 on appointment
 by appointment

 Few with capitols.


 Then the 'problem' ones ..these are few .. but people are tagging
 them so they exist and should have some solution?

 And few with things like
 Mo-Tu,Th-Fr 09:00-13:00,14:00-18:00;We 09:00-13:00; Sa
 by_appointment
 
 http://taginfo.openstreetmap.org/tags/opening_hours=Mo-Tu%2CTh-Fr%2009%3A00-13%3A00%2C14%3A00-18%3A00%3BWe%2009%3A00-13%3A00%3B%20%22Sa%20by_appointment%22

 It would be nice to formalise this use on the wiki before it becomes 
 very diverse? 
 Perhaps the simple use of 'appointment' without 'by' or 'on' would be 
 simplest? 
 The above example could become 
 Mo-Tu,Th-Fr 09:00-13:00,14:00-18:00;We 09:00-13:00; Sa 09:00-18:00 
 +_appointment 
 http://taginfo.openstreetmap.org/tags/opening_hours=Mo-Tu%2CTh-Fr%2009%3A00-13%3A00%2C14%3A00-18%3A00%3BWe%2009%3A00-13%3A00%3B%20%22Sa%20by_appointment%22

 To mean that an appointment is required for Saturday between 9 am and 6 
 pm. 
 Thoughts? 


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Re: [Tagging] To tag opening_hours=by appointment

2015-07-02 Thread Warin

On 3/07/2015 1:37 AM, André Pirard wrote:

On 2015-06-30 14:04, Marc Gemis wrote :
Everything between quotes is considered a comment, and can contain 
values in the local language (e.g  123 nach␣Vereinbarung 
http://taginfo.openstreetmap.org/tags/opening_hours=%22nach%20Vereinbarung%22 -- 
German for by appointment)
IMHO this means that there is nothing to formalize. This also means 
that ...Sa 09:00-18:00 + appointment is a comment and nothing has 
to be parsed.

This should be  ...; Sa 09:00-18:00; Sa also by appointment

see also 
http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Key:opening_hours/specification 
 at the bottom.


m.




Marc, it is not a matter now of formalising, but of documentation in a 
simple easily understood form.


IMVHO, documentation improvement and some sort of formalization is 
needed because:


  * I had asked the same question here before in the same terms
(appointment) and it is asked again
  * I had overlooked on appointment  10 times in a page that states
rules in examples to be grasped
  * Key:opening_hours
http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Key:opening_hours does not
contain the word comment and, as I read before, mappers don't
have 15 min to spend reading the full specification down to the end
  * comments should be explained in the syntax, including explicitly
that they're used to be displayed on user screen, because this
example doesn't seem to be the case : /on appointment; PH off
But not on public holidays (always closed). You don’t need to
write this comment for values in OSM. Documentation purpose only./
  * and probably add by schedule (see Web page) for scheduled
occurrences
  * I've had a look at Osmand and, albeit they show opening-hours,
they will *not* show opening_hours=by appointment.
  * if Osmand did not understand the doc, there *is* a problem (IMVHO)
  * I first wanted to improve my simplified syntax with this, but as
I was scolded for writing it and as as it got erased, I will let
you do that.

Cheers

André.



Thanks André.

The secondary syntax page is written in computerees ... understandable 
by those practised in that language. For the general public it is not 
understandable.
I'll be making some entry to the wiki  that makes a simple clear 
statement of how to add by appointment to the opening hours ... and 
will resist any deletion of such. In fact I'll add the reasons for that 
to the discussion page and the syntax pages' discussion page in order to 
dissuade deletion of the added text.



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Re: [Tagging] To tag opening_hours=by appointment

2015-07-02 Thread Marc Gemis
On Fri, Jul 3, 2015 at 12:55 AM, Warin 61sundow...@gmail.com wrote:

 Marc, it is not a matter now of formalising, but of documentation in a
 simple easily understood form.


Sorry, misunderstood you. Of course,  I have no problem with documenting it
better.

m
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