Re: [Tagging] How to tag a Driver and Vehicle Licensing Agency (US:DMV)
On 6/12/15 04:28 , Eugene Alvin Villar wrote: On Tue, Jun 9, 2015 at 7:12 PM, Martin Koppenhoefer dieterdre...@gmail.com mailto:dieterdre...@gmail.com wrote: that's why I suggested to use a multi tag approach. One tag to say it is a government office, one to say at which level (admin level) and then tags for the stuff you can do there (property list) or about the general classification (e.g. tax office, ministry of education, torture agency, ...) +1 So long term are we going to retag courts, townhalls, libarties, post offices etc. too ? __ openstreetmap.org/user/AndiG88 wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/User:AndiG88 ___ Tagging mailing list Tagging@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/tagging
Re: [Tagging] How to tag a Driver and Vehicle Licensing Agency (US:DMV)
2015-06-12 10:45 GMT+02:00 Andreas Goss andi...@t-online.de: So long term are we going to retag courts, townhalls, libarties, post offices etc. too ? we'll see. I did not aim at that, from a logical point of view some aspects of townhalls might integrate well, but they are also something special (council-legislation), not just an office/agency. The properties for the services offered could be interesting to add to townhalls as well. Regarding courts I don't know much about it on a global level, from looking at the map and list here, it seems as if the court districts in Germany fit the existing admin entities and could get an admin_level tag on the court object. https://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Liste_deutscher_Gerichte They are not considered government agency or government office. (Those might be inside the building as well) post_offices are more tricky, as they might have responsibilities of public administration or not, depending on the country and company. I wouldn't recommend to retag libraries, museums, schools, ..., the idea was not to retag stuff for which we have common tags, but to introduce a more detailed semantic system for government agencies/offices. Currently these are only classified by their name and office=government. Cheers, Martin ___ Tagging mailing list Tagging@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/tagging
Re: [Tagging] How to tag a Driver and Vehicle Licensing Agency (US:DMV)
On Tue, Jun 9, 2015 at 7:12 PM, Martin Koppenhoefer dieterdre...@gmail.com wrote: that's why I suggested to use a multi tag approach. One tag to say it is a government office, one to say at which level (admin level) and then tags for the stuff you can do there (property list) or about the general classification (e.g. tax office, ministry of education, torture agency, ...) +1 I prefer this approach. ___ Tagging mailing list Tagging@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/tagging
Re: [Tagging] How to tag a Driver and Vehicle Licensing Agency (US:DMV)
From experience, the opposite isn't true; Oregon expects you to explicitly have an Oregon license plate or trip permit (a big reason why the first exit in Oregon on all four freeways is DMV DOT Permits. This seems to only be enforced in a rather haphazard way that's just ripe for police abuse, however, especially in the Portland area. On Tue, Jun 9, 2015 at 4:34 PM, Janko Mihelić jan...@gmail.com wrote: What's the difference in handling? When you register your car in Oregon, you can drive it across the USA. For cases when you can only get a drivers license for inside Oregon we can use: driver_licensing=yes + driver_licensing:admin_level=4 uto, 9. lip 2015. 23:15 John Eldredge j...@jfeldredge.com je napisao: In the USA, how it is handled varies from state to state, so there is at least one country where it isn't uniformly handled on a national level. ___ Tagging mailing list Tagging@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/tagging ___ Tagging mailing list Tagging@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/tagging
Re: [Tagging] How to tag a Driver and Vehicle Licensing Agency (US:DMV)
Am 10.06.2015 um 01:51 schrieb John Willis jo...@mac.com: The name for them is revenue_stamp http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Revenue_stamp this article names tax stamp and fiscal stamp as synonyms in the first sentence It is also proof that a fee has been paid (you have the stamp!) so they are sometimes affixed to non-paperwork objects (alcohol bottles,etc) to prove that the proper payment has been made to the proper agency regulating the good before sale - where sales tax would then be applied. in German at least, these are slightly different concepts (Stempelmarke vs. Steuersiegel), the latter is typically found on tobacco products while the former isn't in use anymore since around 2002 (Austria and Germany) http://imginfo.fotofinder.net/42/D1B5793540834622/half/WMW04130.jpg cheers Martin ___ Tagging mailing list Tagging@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/tagging
Re: [Tagging] How to tag a Driver and Vehicle Licensing Agency (US:DMV)
Tax stamps are for any stamp or seal for which a tax is paid. Most commonly, you find tax stamps on license plates and cigarette packs (California has cool looking bear shaped stamps on their packs). On Tue, Jun 9, 2015 at 10:15 AM, p...@trigpoint.me.uk wrote: On Tue Jun 9 16:06:40 2015 GMT+0100, Martin Koppenhoefer wrote: 2015-06-09 14:37 GMT+02:00 Paul Johnson ba...@ursamundi.org: How would you tag a shop that sells tax stamps and licenses, but is not a government office, and does not provide other services? The Oklahoma Tax Commission uses such a system throughout the state (authorized tag agents) to save people the hassle of having to drive down to their office on the capitol mall in Oklahoma City. In Italy you can buy tax stamps at the tobacco shop. Your case can be a shop=tax_stamps_and_licenses? How do people call it? Is a tax stamp some sort of vehicle tax? Phil (trigpoint) -- Sent from my Jolla ___ Tagging mailing list Tagging@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/tagging ___ Tagging mailing list Tagging@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/tagging
Re: [Tagging] How to tag a Driver and Vehicle Licensing Agency (US:DMV)
On Wed, 2015-06-10 at 01:26 +0200, Andreas Goss wrote: Don't know why people are so keen on subtags on this one. Nobody would tag a fastfood restaurant buildng=yes + food=burgers. But we do: building=yes amenity=fast_food cuisine=burger -- Shawn K. Quinn skqu...@rushpost.com ___ Tagging mailing list Tagging@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/tagging
Re: [Tagging] How to tag a Driver and Vehicle Licensing Agency (US:DMV)
On Jun 10, 2015, at 7:30 PM, Martin Koppenhoefer dieterdre...@gmail.com wrote: The name for them is revenue_stamp http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Revenue_stamp http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Revenue_stamp this article names tax stamp and fiscal stamp as synonyms in the first sentence Ah, and we are talking about paying for paperwork (100% revenue), not a tax on a product, so in this situation, it is definitely a Revenue stamp. I don’t buy so much alcohol (an occasional bottle of wine or limoncello, and never tobacco, so I don’t come across it’s cousin the tax stamp in my daily life. Javbw___ Tagging mailing list Tagging@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/tagging
Re: [Tagging] How to tag a Driver and Vehicle Licensing Agency (US:DMV)
On Jun 10, 2015, at 7:30 PM, Martin Koppenhoefer dieterdre...@gmail.com wrote: this article names tax stamp and fiscal stamp as synonyms in the first sentence http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Revenue_stamp http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Revenue_stamp Title says it all. ___ Tagging mailing list Tagging@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/tagging
Re: [Tagging] How to tag a Driver and Vehicle Licensing Agency (US:DMV)
On Wed, 2015-06-10 at 01:26 +0200, Andreas Goss wrote: Don't know why people are so keen on subtags on this one. Nobody would tag a fastfood restaurant buildng=yes + food=burgers. But we do: building=yes amenity=fast_food cuisine=burger Except you put in a amenity=fast_food which specifies that type of POI very clearly. __ openstreetmap.org/user/AndiG88 wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/User:AndiG88 ___ Tagging mailing list Tagging@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/tagging
Re: [Tagging] How to tag a Driver and Vehicle Licensing Agency (US:DMV)
Am 09.06.2015 um 08:12 schrieb Bryce Nesbitt bry...@obviously.com: Maybe pretty it up with a namespace. office=goverment admin_level=4 office:type:california=DMV office=goverment admin_level=4 office:type:massachusetts=RMV name=Massachusetts Registry of Motor Vehicles There's a whole set of assumptions about each type of goverment office that would be impossible to consistently capture with generic tags. I tend to disagree. The details might be different what you can expect at a certain kind of office but that doesn't imply that we have to use different values. e.g a tag like public_office=vehicle_registration could mean DMV in California and RMV in Massachusetts. or vehicle_registration=yes etc. Generally we should avoid abbreviations. cheers Martin ___ Tagging mailing list Tagging@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/tagging
Re: [Tagging] How to tag a Driver and Vehicle Licensing Agency (US:DMV)
There's got to be a better way to do this. Oregon, this would be handled by the DMV in rural areas, and the Department of Environmental Quality in the Metro and Lane County regions. In Oklahoma, this would be handled by the Oklahoma Tax Commission, same as you'd get a fishing license. Driver's licenses are similarly weird; Oregon you'd do the whole thing in a Soviet breadline-like marathon at the DMV. Oklahoma, you go to a Department of Public Safety office, and have a reserve state trooper perform your driving test, then you get an 8x11 inch piece of paper that says you're allowed to drive in Oklahoma. If you want to drive in other states, then you go to the Oklahoma Tax Commission and pay the $35 to get the card other states recognize (and can be used as state ID). On Mon, Jun 8, 2015 at 9:48 AM, Andreas Goss andi...@t-online.de wrote: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Driver_and_Vehicle_Licensing_Agency https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Department_of_Motor_Vehicles amenity=driver_vehicle_licensing_agency Seems a bit long and while it's the name of the agency in the UK it also describes what it does very well. Maybe without acency? Using + isn't a good idea, right? amenity=driver_vehicle_licensing Or is there a more general term so we could subtag this in case some countries don't combine it. __ openstreetmap.org/user/AndiG88 wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/User:AndiG88 ___ Tagging mailing list Tagging@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/tagging ___ Tagging mailing list Tagging@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/tagging
Re: [Tagging] How to tag a Driver and Vehicle Licensing Agency (US:DMV)
2015-06-09 12:27 GMT+02:00 Paul Johnson ba...@ursamundi.org: There's got to be a better way to do this. Oregon, this would be handled by the DMV in rural areas, and the Department of Environmental Quality in the Metro and Lane County regions. In Oklahoma, this would be handled by the Oklahoma Tax Commission, same as you'd get a fishing license. Driver's licenses are similarly weird; Oregon you'd do the whole thing in a Soviet breadline-like marathon at the DMV. Oklahoma, you go to a Department of Public Safety office, and have a reserve state trooper perform your driving test, then you get an 8x11 inch piece of paper that says you're allowed to drive in Oklahoma. If you want to drive in other states, then you go to the Oklahoma Tax Commission and pay the $35 to get the card other states recognize (and can be used as state ID). that's why I suggested to use a multi tag approach. One tag to say it is a government office, one to say at which level (admin level) and then tags for the stuff you can do there (property list) or about the general classification (e.g. tax office, ministry of education, torture agency, ...) cheers, Martin ___ Tagging mailing list Tagging@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/tagging
Re: [Tagging] How to tag a Driver and Vehicle Licensing Agency (US:DMV)
These are very specific government agencies. This may be a place where regionally specific tags work best. Maybe pretty it up with a namespace. office=goverment admin_level=4 office:type:california=DMV office=goverment admin_level=4 office:type:massachusetts=RMV name=Massachusetts Registry of Motor Vehicles There's a whole set of assumptions about each type of goverment office that would be impossible to consistently capture with generic tags. Here the Duck of duck typing says call it by whatever it is known locally. ___ Tagging mailing list Tagging@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/tagging
Re: [Tagging] How to tag a Driver and Vehicle Licensing Agency (US:DMV)
On Jun 9, 2015, at 3:12 PM, Bryce Nesbitt bry...@obviously.com wrote: There's a whole set of assumptions about each type of goverment office that would be impossible to consistently capture with generic tags. Here the Duck of duck typing says call it by whatever it is known locally. I think there is still an umbrella it can fit under, saying it is related to cars and licensing. A place that registers your car and a place that licenses you for driving may be a different facility (or combo), but the government office(s) that handles that can at least have some kind of tag to get put in some kind of group. government=motor_vehicle_admin or civic_admin=motor_vehicle We don’t assume the government is selling cars or car parts, and administration isn’t related to enforcement (tickets/impound), sales, nor maintenance, so it isn’t so ambiguous. and the name will tell the locals the rest. (Liscence Center, Automobile Registration center, Dept of Motor Vehecles, etc) Unless we want to get into the same subcategory system that shop=* should have, and we start documenting specific government facilities (which I wanted to do with civic_admin and landuse=civic). Javbw ___ Tagging mailing list Tagging@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/tagging
Re: [Tagging] How to tag a Driver and Vehicle Licensing Agency (US:DMV)
2015-06-09 14:37 GMT+02:00 Paul Johnson ba...@ursamundi.org: How would you tag a shop that sells tax stamps and licenses, but is not a government office, and does not provide other services? The Oklahoma Tax Commission uses such a system throughout the state (authorized tag agents) to save people the hassle of having to drive down to their office on the capitol mall in Oklahoma City. In Italy you can buy tax stamps at the tobacco shop. Your case can be a shop=tax_stamps_and_licenses? How do people call it? Cheers, Martin ___ Tagging mailing list Tagging@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/tagging
Re: [Tagging] How to tag a Driver and Vehicle Licensing Agency (US:DMV)
On Tue Jun 9 16:06:40 2015 GMT+0100, Martin Koppenhoefer wrote: 2015-06-09 14:37 GMT+02:00 Paul Johnson ba...@ursamundi.org: How would you tag a shop that sells tax stamps and licenses, but is not a government office, and does not provide other services? The Oklahoma Tax Commission uses such a system throughout the state (authorized tag agents) to save people the hassle of having to drive down to their office on the capitol mall in Oklahoma City. In Italy you can buy tax stamps at the tobacco shop. Your case can be a shop=tax_stamps_and_licenses? How do people call it? Is a tax stamp some sort of vehicle tax? Phil (trigpoint) -- Sent from my Jolla ___ Tagging mailing list Tagging@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/tagging
Re: [Tagging] How to tag a Driver and Vehicle Licensing Agency (US:DMV)
2015-06-09 17:15 GMT+02:00 p...@trigpoint.me.uk: Is a tax stamp some sort of vehicle tax? you can use them universally for payments of government taxes and fees, typically you have to stick them onto forms or other documents to make them valid. cheers, Martin ___ Tagging mailing list Tagging@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/tagging
Re: [Tagging] How to tag a Driver and Vehicle Licensing Agency (US:DMV)
On Tue Jun 9 16:26:36 2015 GMT+0100, Martin Koppenhoefer wrote: you can use them universally for payments of government taxes and fees, typically you have to stick them onto forms or other documents to make them valid. Tax_stamp sounds good, I have never heard of a UK equivalent. Phil (trigpoint) -- Sent from my Jolla ___ Tagging mailing list Tagging@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/tagging
Re: [Tagging] How to tag a Driver and Vehicle Licensing Agency (US:DMV)
I'm guessing we don't need admin_level with vehicle registration, because it's always the same within a certain country. So let's keep it simple: building=yes + vehicle_registration=yes + driver_licensing=yes. uto, 9. lip 2015. 17:42 p...@trigpoint.me.uk je napisao: On Tue Jun 9 16:26:36 2015 GMT+0100, Martin Koppenhoefer wrote: you can use them universally for payments of government taxes and fees, typically you have to stick them onto forms or other documents to make them valid. Tax_stamp sounds good, I have never heard of a UK equivalent. Phil (trigpoint) -- Sent from my Jolla ___ Tagging mailing list Tagging@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/tagging ___ Tagging mailing list Tagging@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/tagging
Re: [Tagging] How to tag a Driver and Vehicle Licensing Agency (US:DMV)
In the USA, how it is handled varies from state to state, so there is at least one country where it isn't uniformly handled on a national level. -- John F. Eldredge -- j...@jfeldredge.com Darkness cannot drive out darkness; only light can do that. Hate cannot drive out hate; only love can do that. -- Martin Luther King, Jr. On June 9, 2015 4:03:33 PM Janko Mihelić jan...@gmail.com wrote: I'm guessing we don't need admin_level with vehicle registration, because it's always the same within a certain country. So let's keep it simple: building=yes + vehicle_registration=yes + driver_licensing=yes. uto, 9. lip 2015. 17:42 p...@trigpoint.me.uk je napisao: On Tue Jun 9 16:26:36 2015 GMT+0100, Martin Koppenhoefer wrote: you can use them universally for payments of government taxes and fees, typically you have to stick them onto forms or other documents to make them valid. Tax_stamp sounds good, I have never heard of a UK equivalent. Phil (trigpoint) -- Sent from my Jolla ___ Tagging mailing list Tagging@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/tagging -- ___ Tagging mailing list Tagging@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/tagging ___ Tagging mailing list Tagging@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/tagging
Re: [Tagging] How to tag a Driver and Vehicle Licensing Agency (US:DMV)
I would like to roll town hall into civic_admin, or similar, but realistically i can't, because the tag os so popular. But since almost every single other government agency or service is currently untagged, there is still plenty to be done. Javbw. On Jun 9, 2015, at 10:58 PM, Andreas Goss andi...@t-online.de wrote: What I don't get is why everyone is on this office=government and government=* tag, when even in your proposal most of the stuff that would fall under civic_admin is currently just tagged as amenity. I mean I would not have an issue with a government= tag, but then we would have to be consistent and long term stuff like amenity=townhall should be government=townhall. And the biggest issue as already mentioned a bit further down in the discussion is that there often is no clear line you can draw. In some countries a service is run by the government, in others it's not and sometimes that's even the case within a country. On 6/9/15 08:48 , johnw wrote: On Jun 9, 2015, at 3:12 PM, Bryce Nesbitt bry...@obviously.com wrote: There's a whole set of assumptions about each type of goverment office that would be impossible to consistently capture with generic tags. Here the Duck of duck typing says call it by whatever it is known locally. I think there is still an umbrella it can fit under, saying it is related to cars and licensing. A place that registers your car and a place that licenses you for driving may be a different facility (or combo), but the government office(s) that handles that can at least have some kind of tag to get put in some kind of group. government=motor_vehicle_admin or civic_admin=motor_vehicle We don’t assume the government is selling cars or car parts, and administration isn’t related to enforcement (tickets/impound), sales, nor maintenance, so it isn’t so ambiguous. and the name will tell the locals the rest. (Liscence Center, Automobile Registration center, Dept of Motor Vehecles, etc) Unless we want to get into the same subcategory system that shop=* should have, and we start documenting specific government facilities (which I wanted to do with civic_admin and landuse=civic). Javbw ___ Tagging mailing list Tagging@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/tagging -- __ openstreetmap.org/user/AndiG88 wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/User:AndiG88 ___ Tagging mailing list Tagging@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/tagging ___ Tagging mailing list Tagging@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/tagging
Re: [Tagging] How to tag a Driver and Vehicle Licensing Agency (US:DMV)
Also in the U.K. as Northern Ireland had its own system. On 9 June 2015 23:13:55 CEST, John Eldredge j...@jfeldredge.com wrote: In the USA, how it is handled varies from state to state, so there is at least one country where it isn't uniformly handled on a national level. -- John F. Eldredge -- j...@jfeldredge.com Darkness cannot drive out darkness; only light can do that. Hate cannot drive out hate; only love can do that. -- Martin Luther King, Jr. On June 9, 2015 4:03:33 PM Janko Mihelić jan...@gmail.com wrote: I'm guessing we don't need admin_level with vehicle registration, because it's always the same within a certain country. So let's keep it simple: building=yes + vehicle_registration=yes + driver_licensing=yes. uto, 9. lip 2015. 17:42 p...@trigpoint.me.uk je napisao: On Tue Jun 9 16:26:36 2015 GMT+0100, Martin Koppenhoefer wrote: you can use them universally for payments of government taxes and fees, typically you have to stick them onto forms or other documents to make them valid. Tax_stamp sounds good, I have never heard of a UK equivalent. Phil (trigpoint) -- Sent from my Jolla ___ Tagging mailing list Tagging@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/tagging -- ___ Tagging mailing list Tagging@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/tagging ___ Tagging mailing list Tagging@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/tagging ___ Tagging mailing list Tagging@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/tagging
Re: [Tagging] How to tag a Driver and Vehicle Licensing Agency (US:DMV)
Using one global scheme could make rendering easier, but muddy the meaning of the place. Usnig regional schemes would match map reader expectations, but likely lag in terms of rendering support and processnig support. ___ Tagging mailing list Tagging@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/tagging
Re: [Tagging] How to tag a Driver and Vehicle Licensing Agency (US:DMV)
Sent from my iPhone On Jun 10, 2015, at 12:15 AM, p...@trigpoint.me.uk wrote: On Tue Jun 9 16:06:40 2015 GMT+0100, Martin Koppenhoefer wrote: 2015-06-09 14:37 GMT+02:00 Paul Johnson ba...@ursamundi.org: How would you tag a shop that sells tax stamps and licenses, but is not a government office, and does not provide other services? The Oklahoma Tax Commission uses such a system throughout the state (authorized tag agents) to save people the hassle of having to drive down to their office on the capitol mall in Oklahoma City. In Italy you can buy tax stamps at the tobacco shop. Your case can be a shop=tax_stamps_and_licenses? How do people call it? Is a tax stamp some sort of vehicle tax? I imagine it is either the governmental revenue stamp, or the seal that goes on the car itself. In CA, you need to go to the DMV for the tags (if not by mail) and pay with money. I guess i have seen storefronts that do it too... In Japan, almost any government service - or some kind of fee for a service performed (license renewal, visa application, etc) are paid for by buying stamps, (sometimes for large amounts) and then sticking them on the application for the service in the right place. This separates the people handling the forms from the people handling money. Usually most government offices (city halls, regional capitals) have a convenience store inside that sells food for lunch and these stamps. But The *office* that *administrates* the program is not the store, nor the authorized agents in Oklahoma - it is some office or building in a government facility. Im interested in mapping government and civic agency buildings that run (administer) public programs. If a shop sells vehicle tags, great - lets set up a vending item or something - but they do not (AFAIK) administer the program. If you have a paperwork problem or a grievance, i bet you have to go to the main office. I had to have my car smog checked in California at a smog check shop (~$50), and I have to have my Japanese car inspected and have mandatory service at a local shop every two years ($800USD) - but these people are not where the program is administered - just as a place that sells hot dogs is not a hot dog factory. This is the difference between mapping the amenity and mapping the buildings. I want to map the hot dog factory. You guys are talking about mapping all the places to buy hot dogs. Perhaps we need both ^_^ Javbw ___ Tagging mailing list Tagging@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/tagging
Re: [Tagging] How to tag a Driver and Vehicle Licensing Agency (US:DMV)
Sent from my iPhone On Jun 10, 2015, at 12:40 AM, p...@trigpoint.me.uk wrote: On Tue Jun 9 16:26:36 2015 GMT+0100, Martin Koppenhoefer wrote: you can use them universally for payments of government taxes and fees, typically you have to stick them onto forms or other documents to make them valid. Tax_stamp sounds good, I have never heard of a UK equivalent. The name for them is revenue_stamp http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Revenue_stamp Tax is a surcharge on another service (sales tax) - this for a fee paid directly for a service - which is revenue for the government agency accepting the money. It is also proof that a fee has been paid (you have the stamp!) so they are sometimes affixed to non-paperwork objects (alcohol bottles,etc) to prove that the proper payment has been made to the proper agency regulating the good before sale - where sales tax would then be applied. Javbw. Phil (trigpoint) -- Sent from my Jolla ___ Tagging mailing list Tagging@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/tagging ___ Tagging mailing list Tagging@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/tagging
Re: [Tagging] How to tag a Driver and Vehicle Licensing Agency (US:DMV)
What's the difference in handling? When you register your car in Oregon, you can drive it across the USA. For cases when you can only get a drivers license for inside Oregon we can use: driver_licensing=yes + driver_licensing:admin_level=4 uto, 9. lip 2015. 23:15 John Eldredge j...@jfeldredge.com je napisao: In the USA, how it is handled varies from state to state, so there is at least one country where it isn't uniformly handled on a national level. ___ Tagging mailing list Tagging@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/tagging
Re: [Tagging] How to tag a Driver and Vehicle Licensing Agency (US:DMV)
On 6/9/15 5:48 PM, John Eldredge wrote: The department that issues drivers' licenses varies from state to state. The rules dividing regular drivers' licenses from specialized licenses, such as restricted licenses for minors, commercial licenses (needed to drive a vehicle for hire, and/or various large vehicles), and motorcycle licenses, vary from state to state. Some states have the same department handle both vehicle licenses and drivers' licenses, some don't. and the states have reciprocity agreements to recognize each other's licenses. the map of reciprocity agreements is complete, but there was a time when it wasn't. as near as i can tell, many/most Canadian provinces have agreements with the various states as well. richard -- rwe...@averillpark.net Averill Park Networking - GIS IT Consulting OpenStreetMap - PostgreSQL - Linux Java - Web Applications - Search signature.asc Description: OpenPGP digital signature ___ Tagging mailing list Tagging@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/tagging
Re: [Tagging] How to tag a Driver and Vehicle Licensing Agency (US:DMV)
On Tue, Jun 9, 2015 at 6:12 AM, Martin Koppenhoefer dieterdre...@gmail.com wrote: 2015-06-09 12:27 GMT+02:00 Paul Johnson ba...@ursamundi.org: There's got to be a better way to do this. Oregon, this would be handled by the DMV in rural areas, and the Department of Environmental Quality in the Metro and Lane County regions. In Oklahoma, this would be handled by the Oklahoma Tax Commission, same as you'd get a fishing license. Driver's licenses are similarly weird; Oregon you'd do the whole thing in a Soviet breadline-like marathon at the DMV. Oklahoma, you go to a Department of Public Safety office, and have a reserve state trooper perform your driving test, then you get an 8x11 inch piece of paper that says you're allowed to drive in Oklahoma. If you want to drive in other states, then you go to the Oklahoma Tax Commission and pay the $35 to get the card other states recognize (and can be used as state ID). that's why I suggested to use a multi tag approach. One tag to say it is a government office, one to say at which level (admin level) and then tags for the stuff you can do there (property list) or about the general classification (e.g. tax office, ministry of education, torture agency, ...) How would you tag a shop that sells tax stamps and licenses, but is not a government office, and does not provide other services? The Oklahoma Tax Commission uses such a system throughout the state (authorized tag agents) to save people the hassle of having to drive down to their office on the capitol mall in Oklahoma City. ___ Tagging mailing list Tagging@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/tagging
Re: [Tagging] How to tag a Driver and Vehicle Licensing Agency (US:DMV)
On Tue, 2015-06-09 at 07:37 -0500, Paul Johnson wrote: The Oklahoma Tax Commission uses such a system throughout the state (authorized tag agents) to save people the hassle of having to drive down to their office on the capitol mall in Oklahoma City. Texas does the same thing (allows e.g. grocery store courtesy booths to issue tag renewals), except in this case it's to avoid a long line at the county courthouse who would otherwise handle it. -- Shawn K. Quinn skqu...@rushpost.com ___ Tagging mailing list Tagging@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/tagging
Re: [Tagging] How to tag a Driver and Vehicle Licensing Agency (US:DMV)
What I don't get is why everyone is on this office=government and government=* tag, when even in your proposal most of the stuff that would fall under civic_admin is currently just tagged as amenity. I mean I would not have an issue with a government= tag, but then we would have to be consistent and long term stuff like amenity=townhall should be government=townhall. And the biggest issue as already mentioned a bit further down in the discussion is that there often is no clear line you can draw. In some countries a service is run by the government, in others it's not and sometimes that's even the case within a country. On 6/9/15 08:48 , johnw wrote: On Jun 9, 2015, at 3:12 PM, Bryce Nesbitt bry...@obviously.com wrote: There's a whole set of assumptions about each type of goverment office that would be impossible to consistently capture with generic tags. Here the Duck of duck typing says call it by whatever it is known locally. I think there is still an umbrella it can fit under, saying it is related to cars and licensing. A place that registers your car and a place that licenses you for driving may be a different facility (or combo), but the government office(s) that handles that can at least have some kind of tag to get put in some kind of group. government=motor_vehicle_admin or civic_admin=motor_vehicle We don’t assume the government is selling cars or car parts, and administration isn’t related to enforcement (tickets/impound), sales, nor maintenance, so it isn’t so ambiguous. and the name will tell the locals the rest. (Liscence Center, Automobile Registration center, Dept of Motor Vehecles, etc) Unless we want to get into the same subcategory system that shop=* should have, and we start documenting specific government facilities (which I wanted to do with civic_admin and landuse=civic). Javbw ___ Tagging mailing list Tagging@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/tagging -- __ openstreetmap.org/user/AndiG88 wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/User:AndiG88 ___ Tagging mailing list Tagging@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/tagging
Re: [Tagging] How to tag a Driver and Vehicle Licensing Agency (US:DMV)
I believe we have a huge gap at tags for government agencies. We could start drafting a system with subtags, eg a tag that says a place is a government agency, a subtag for the administration level (eg municipal, regional, national, could maybe be the same as admin_level?), more subtags for the stuff you can do there (eg register your place of residence, or the birth of a child, request a passport, register a car, ...) AND/OR the class of agency (eg foreign affairs, tax agency, commerce chamber, ...) While I agree that there is a gap, I'm also not really sure where to start and what we are actually missing. I have been looking a bit at the categories of other services and that's where DMV caught my eyes. http://blumenthals.com/Google_LBC_Categories And in Germany for example pretty much all you listed apart from car registration is done in the townhall. __ openstreetmap.org/user/AndiG88 wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/User:AndiG88 ___ Tagging mailing list Tagging@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/tagging
Re: [Tagging] How to tag a Driver and Vehicle Licensing Agency (US:DMV)
On 08.06.2015 16:48, Andreas Goss wrote: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Driver_and_Vehicle_Licensing_Agency office=government name=Driver and Vehicle Licensing Agency short_name=DVLA https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Department_of_Motor_Vehicles office=government name=Massachusetts Registry of Motor Vehicles short_name=Registry of Motor Vehicles -- Friedrich K. Volkmann http://www.volki.at/ Adr.: Davidgasse 76-80/14/10, 1100 Wien, Austria ___ Tagging mailing list Tagging@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/tagging
Re: [Tagging] How to tag a Driver and Vehicle Licensing Agency (US:DMV)
Am 08.06.2015 um 16:48 schrieb Andreas Goss andi...@t-online.de: Seems a bit long and while it's the name of the agency in the UK it also describes what it does very well. Maybe without acency? Using + isn't a good idea, right? amenity=driver_vehicle_licensing Or is there a more general term so we could subtag this in case some countries don't combine it. I believe we have a huge gap at tags for government agencies. We could start drafting a system with subtags, eg a tag that says a place is a government agency, a subtag for the administration level (eg municipal, regional, national, could maybe be the same as admin_level?), more subtags for the stuff you can do there (eg register your place of residence, or the birth of a child, request a passport, register a car, ...) AND/OR the class of agency (eg foreign affairs, tax agency, commerce chamber, ...) cheers Martin ___ Tagging mailing list Tagging@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/tagging
Re: [Tagging] How to tag a Driver and Vehicle Licensing Agency (US:DMV)
Am 08.06.2015 um 18:33 schrieb Andreas Goss andi...@t-online.de: This could then expand for other things requiring a license, shotgun=yes? Which I'm not sure is so great as it could expand endlessly. And there is also stuff like motorsport licenses etc. +1, and the tagging with shotgun=yes is way too generic, if we should adopt this style I'd wish for tags like license:shotgun=yes or issues:license:shotgun=yes cheers Martin ___ Tagging mailing list Tagging@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/tagging
Re: [Tagging] How to tag a Driver and Vehicle Licensing Agency (US:DMV)
On Mon, Jun 8, 2015 at 11:08 AM, p...@trigpoint.me.uk wrote: On Mon Jun 8 15:48:01 2015 GMT+0100, Andreas Goss wrote: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Driver_and_Vehicle_Licensing_Agency https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Department_of_Motor_Vehicles amenity=driver_vehicle_licensing_agency I typically use office=government for this sort of thing. In Ontario there is ServiceOntario which is an office for renewing driver's licenses, health cards and other things in Ontario. ___ Tagging mailing list Tagging@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/tagging
[Tagging] How to tag a Driver and Vehicle Licensing Agency (US:DMV)
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Driver_and_Vehicle_Licensing_Agency https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Department_of_Motor_Vehicles amenity=driver_vehicle_licensing_agency Seems a bit long and while it's the name of the agency in the UK it also describes what it does very well. Maybe without acency? Using + isn't a good idea, right? amenity=driver_vehicle_licensing Or is there a more general term so we could subtag this in case some countries don't combine it. __ openstreetmap.org/user/AndiG88 wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/User:AndiG88 ___ Tagging mailing list Tagging@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/tagging
Re: [Tagging] How to tag a Driver and Vehicle Licensing Agency (US:DMV)
On Mon Jun 8 15:48:01 2015 GMT+0100, Andreas Goss wrote: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Driver_and_Vehicle_Licensing_Agency https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Department_of_Motor_Vehicles amenity=driver_vehicle_licensing_agency Seems a bit long and while it's the name of the agency in the UK it also describes what it does very well. Maybe without acency? Using + isn't a good idea, right? amenity=driver_vehicle_licensing Or is there a more general term so we could subtag this in case some countries don't combine it. __ openstreetmap.org/user/AndiG88 wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/User:AndiG88 ___ Tagging mailing list Tagging@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/tagging -- Sent from my Jolla ___ Tagging mailing list Tagging@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/tagging
Re: [Tagging] How to tag a Driver and Vehicle Licensing Agency (US:DMV)
On Mon, 2015-06-08 at 16:48 +0200, Andreas Goss wrote: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Driver_and_Vehicle_Licensing_Agency https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Department_of_Motor_Vehicles amenity=driver_vehicle_licensing_agency Seems a bit long and while it's the name of the agency in the UK it also describes what it does very well. Maybe without acency? Using + isn't a good idea, right? amenity=driver_vehicle_licensing Or is there a more general term so we could subtag this in case some countries don't combine it. Maybe something like: office=licensing licensing:vehicle=yes licensing:driver=yes In the US, they are not combined. In Texas, the driver licensing is a completely different office from motor vehicle registration. The individual states that require inspections for vehicles (the US equivalent of a MOT inspection) usually let individual repair shops (anything from oil change shops all the way up to full service garages) handle this. -- Shawn K. Quinn skqu...@rushpost.com ___ Tagging mailing list Tagging@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/tagging
Re: [Tagging] How to tag a Driver and Vehicle Licensing Agency (US:DMV)
On Mon Jun 8 15:48:01 2015 GMT+0100, Andreas Goss wrote: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Driver_and_Vehicle_Licensing_Agency https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Department_of_Motor_Vehicles amenity=driver_vehicle_licensing_agency Seems a bit long and while it's the name of the agency in the UK it also describes what it does very well. Maybe without acency? Using + isn't a good idea, right? amenity=driver_vehicle_licensing Or is there a more general term so we could subtag this in case some countries don't combine it. Sounds reasonable, there are local offices in the UK, or at least in GB. Or amenity=licensing, driver=yes, vehicle=yes. This could then expand for other things requiring a license, shotgun=yes? Phil (trigpoint ) -- Sent from my Jolla ___ Tagging mailing list Tagging@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/tagging
Re: [Tagging] How to tag a Driver and Vehicle Licensing Agency (US:DMV)
Maybe something like: office=licensing licensing:vehicle=yes licensing:driver=yes I fell like long term that tag would completely blow up, considering you can get a license for almost everything. And this seems to be a very specific government institution in many countries. In the US, they are not combined. In Texas, the driver licensing is a completely different office from motor vehicle registration. Yeah, kinda expected that to be the case in some countries. The individual states that require inspections for vehicles (the US equivalent of a MOT inspection) usually let individual repair shops (anything from oil change shops all the way up to full service garages) handle this. http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Tag:amenity%3Dvehicle_inspection __ openstreetmap.org/user/AndiG88 wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/User:AndiG88 ___ Tagging mailing list Tagging@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/tagging
Re: [Tagging] How to tag a Driver and Vehicle Licensing Agency (US:DMV)
Or amenity=licensing, driver=yes, vehicle=yes. This could then expand for other things requiring a license, shotgun=yes? Which I'm not sure is so great as it could expand endlessly. And there is also stuff like motorsport licenses etc. I typically use office=government for this sort of thing. In Ontario there is ServiceOntario which is an office for renewing driver's licenses, health cards and other things in Ontario. Government can just be anything, so I wouldn't put everything in there if it is something that is a very speficic agency in many countries, especially if it's something many people will be looking for. Also seems interesting to foreigners where it also helps when you have a special tag. I mean I guess it's fine in Canada when this agency offers a lot of different services. __ openstreetmap.org/user/AndiG88 wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/User:AndiG88 ___ Tagging mailing list Tagging@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/tagging
