Re: [talk-au] Oz tagging of speed cameras
On 15/8/22 08:40, Graeme Fitzpatrick wrote: I did wonder about that, looking at the two boxes on poles that are visible? Here at least, that arrangement means they are red light cameras only, combined red light & speed have a much larger camera box, & plain speed cameras are a single small unit. They are combined functions in the one unit. This has an explanation of the the ones they use in SA: https://www.police.sa.gov.au/__data/assets/pdf_file/0017/2555/fixed_safety_camera_operating_practices.pdf In OSM you'd map these as a speed camera node and an enforcement relation (or put both enforcements in relations https://www.openstreetmap.org/node/9952073137). ___ Talk-au mailing list Talk-au@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-au
Re: [talk-au] Oz tagging of speed cameras
Graeme: You are possibly / likely correct about assumptions regarding size (I'm not local, I haven't seen the devices, I don't know of any standardisation / competition-in-the-traffic-camera-marketplace you have in Oz). However, also, you might 'not' be correct about assumptions regarding size. Please be careful. Speed cameras are notoriously "cat-and-mouse" about where they are, how legal they might be in the jurisdiction, what technology is available / deployed, how many decoys there might be (obvious or not), what sort of categorization based upon visual elements of a box on a pole there might be Careful, is all I'm sayin'. Sometimes things are as they appear to be, sometimes a bit more care must be taken. Speed cameras are in the realm of "take a bit of care to get it right." ___ Talk-au mailing list Talk-au@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-au
Re: [talk-au] Oz tagging of speed cameras
On Sun, 14 Aug 2022 at 19:46, Andrew Davidson wrote: > > The other odd thing is that most "speed cameras" are also red light > cameras but they haven't been mapped that way. > I did wonder about that, looking at the two boxes on poles that are visible? Here at least, that arrangement means they are red light cameras only, combined red light & speed have a much larger camera box, & plain speed cameras are a single small unit. Thanks Graeme ___ Talk-au mailing list Talk-au@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-au
Re: [talk-au] Oz tagging of speed cameras
On 14/8/22 07:57, Graeme Fitzpatrick wrote: Thanks! But by that wiki, they should be mapped beside the camera location, not at the traffic lights? A quick look round shows that the ones in SA have been mapped at the stop line. In VIC and NSW they seem to have been mostly mapped where the camera is. There is some confusion about what the ref tag is for: https://overpass-turbo.eu/s/1kZB I doubt that is what is says on the control box. The other odd thing is that most "speed cameras" are also red light cameras but they haven't been mapped that way. ___ Talk-au mailing list Talk-au@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-au
Re: [talk-au] Oz tagging of speed cameras
On Sat, 13 Aug 2022 at 17:14, Ben Kelley wrote: > > This page describes what to do if you are only mapping the camera (map it > on the highway) > https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Tag:highway%3Dspeed_camera > On Sat, 13 Aug 2022 at 20:25, Andrew Davidson wrote: the most common approach is to connect the speed_camera to the way > Thanks! But by that wiki, they should be mapped beside the camera location, not at the traffic lights? > > It doesn't look like this was ever discussed. No, I couldn't remember any mention of it? Thanks Graeme ___ Talk-au mailing list Talk-au@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-au
Re: [talk-au] Oz tagging of speed cameras
On 13/8/22 14:48, Graeme Fitzpatrick wrote: The message was to tell me that "every single speed camera in South Australia is already on the map" & can be viewed on OT, that "they are placed on the roads that they target exactly like traffic lights are placed. This is a standard that is agreed upon in the Australian OSM community", & that they've "deleted all the duplicate ones that you have added". It doesn't look like this was ever discussed. However, looking at how they are mapped now the most common approach is to connect the speed_camera to the way or to include it in an enforcement relation. There are 801 speed_camera mapped in AU and 165 of them are not connected to a highway or enforcement relation: https://overpass-turbo.eu/s/1kYC Checking a number of EU countries indicates that this seems to be the most common way of modelling this (80~90% of cases). ___ Talk-au mailing list Talk-au@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-au
Re: [talk-au] Oz tagging of speed cameras
Hi. This page describes what to do if you are only mapping the camera (map it on the highway) https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Tag:highway%3Dspeed_camera This page describes what to do if you want to map both the device (e.g. on the footpath), and also the point on the road where the camera enforces the speed limit https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Relation:enforcement - Ben. On Sat, 13 Aug 2022 at 14:51, Graeme Fitzpatrick wrote: > Just had a message come through OSM (think it may have been sent to > multiple people?) concerning mapping speed cameras. > > I've added a number of them from Notes, & have always added them as a > Speed Camera node on the actual camera location usually visible on the > footpath. > > The message was to tell me that "every single speed camera in South > Australia is already on the map" & can be viewed on OT, that "they are > placed on the roads that they target exactly like traffic lights are > placed. This is a standard that is agreed upon in the Australian OSM > community", & that they've "deleted all the duplicate ones that you have > added". > > One of the cameras that I'd added was here > https://www.openstreetmap.org/edit?node=8654391473#map=20/-34.96839/138.55505 > & I'd mapped it where the camera box is visible on the footpath, but they > have it on the actual road marking near the traffic lights. Which is right? > I've just had a look at the guidelines & can't see any agreed standard for > mapping them - do we have one? > > Thanks > > Graeme > ___ > Talk-au mailing list > Talk-au@openstreetmap.org > https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-au > ___ Talk-au mailing list Talk-au@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-au
[talk-au] Oz tagging of speed cameras
Just had a message come through OSM (think it may have been sent to multiple people?) concerning mapping speed cameras. I've added a number of them from Notes, & have always added them as a Speed Camera node on the actual camera location usually visible on the footpath. The message was to tell me that "every single speed camera in South Australia is already on the map" & can be viewed on OT, that "they are placed on the roads that they target exactly like traffic lights are placed. This is a standard that is agreed upon in the Australian OSM community", & that they've "deleted all the duplicate ones that you have added". One of the cameras that I'd added was here https://www.openstreetmap.org/edit?node=8654391473#map=20/-34.96839/138.55505 & I'd mapped it where the camera box is visible on the footpath, but they have it on the actual road marking near the traffic lights. Which is right? I've just had a look at the guidelines & can't see any agreed standard for mapping them - do we have one? Thanks Graeme ___ Talk-au mailing list Talk-au@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-au
