Re: [Talk-ca] BC Open Data License compatibility

[SteveC]

On 9/4/2011 6:51 PM, john whelan wrote:
The issue with using data like this with OSM is when you contribute it 
under the new contribution terms you accept that OSM can change the 
license at a later date.  Practically speaking it makes it impossible 
to respect any other license so currently only PD data and things you 
have explicitly mapped yourself are safe.


In the OSM talk thread there are people who seem to think that all 
imports are bad and I suspect the license change clause was put in by 
them to discourage imports.


No, it was put in because we didn't want to have a rerun of all this 
mess if something better came along next time.


Steve




Cheerio John

On 4 September 2011 19:35, Russell Porter > wrote:


Hi,

What is the status on the BC Open Data site launched earlier this
year?

License: http://www.data.gov.bc.ca/dbc/admin/terms.page?

It looks fine to me, but i know licensing is a big problem with osm.

In particular, i am looking at doing a manual import of protected
areas amd hiking trails (I imported a bunch of NrCan protected
areas a while back)

Finally, another license question. Since Sam V. (across canada
trails) released his contribs as PD, cant i just re-import them
into OSM on my account under odbl?

Thanks,
Russell
___
Talk-ca mailing list
Talk-ca@openstreetmap.org 
http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-ca




___
Talk-ca mailing list
Talk-ca@openstreetmap.org
http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-ca


___
Talk-ca mailing list
Talk-ca@openstreetmap.org
http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-ca

[Talk-ca] Fwd: walking papers website having trouble??

[SteveC]

Steve

stevecoast.com

Begin forwarded message:

> From: Michal Migurski 
> Date: June 11, 2011 18:41:41 GMT+01:00
> To: SteveC 
> Subject: Re: [Talk-ca] walking papers website having trouble??
> 

> It's been a long week so I've had to ignore WP for a few days - I know about 
> the problem, will fix today or tomorrow and hopefully make it not a problem 
> in the future. Garbage input, me not protecting against garbage input.
> 
> -mike.
> 
> On Jun 11, 2011, at 6:05 AM, SteveC wrote:
> 
>> Mike?
>> 
>> Steve
>> 
>> stevecoast.com
>> 
>> On Jun 11, 2011, at 13:27, "Connors, Bernie (SNB)"  
>> wrote:
>> 
>>> I have been waiting 17 hours for a map to generate at walking-papers.org.  
>>> Is anybody aware of problems??
>>> 
>>> http://walking-papers.org/print.php?id=qztkwgs3
>>> 
>>> Bernie.
>>> ___
>>> Talk-ca mailing list
>>> Talk-ca@openstreetmap.org
>>> http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-ca
>>> 
>> 
> 
> 
> michal migurski- m...@stamen.com
> 415.558.1610
> 
> 
> 
> 
___
Talk-ca mailing list
Talk-ca@openstreetmap.org
http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-ca

Re: [Talk-ca] walking papers website having trouble??

[SteveC]

Mike?

Steve

stevecoast.com

On Jun 11, 2011, at 13:27, "Connors, Bernie (SNB)"  
wrote:

> I have been waiting 17 hours for a map to generate at walking-papers.org.  Is 
> anybody aware of problems??
> 
> http://walking-papers.org/print.php?id=qztkwgs3
> 
> Bernie.
> ___
> Talk-ca mailing list
> Talk-ca@openstreetmap.org
> http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-ca
> 

___
Talk-ca mailing list
Talk-ca@openstreetmap.org
http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-ca

Re: [Talk-ca] US SOTM

[SteveC]

And by US... I really mean north america, it's easy enough to have an  
event in CA.

Yours &c.

Steve


On Nov 4, 2009, at 12:17 PM, SteveC wrote:
> Dear all
>
> On the US chapter call this week we briefly discussed doing a SOTM in
> the USA a couple of weeks before or after the main SOTM.
>
> If you'd like to be involved with this, the first call will be at
>
>   Monday Nov 9th
>   5:30PM PST/8:30PM EST (immediately after the US chapter call)
>
>   +1 218-486-3891 x 224699644
>
>   Agenda: http://docs.google.com/Doc?id=dkbvxqx_7g83v5kjm
>   (please feel free to suggest topics)
>
> Yours &c.
>
> Steve
>
> ___
> Talk-ca mailing list
> Talk-ca@openstreetmap.org
> http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-ca
>


___
Talk-ca mailing list
Talk-ca@openstreetmap.org
http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-ca

[Talk-ca] US SOTM

[SteveC]

Dear all

On the US chapter call this week we briefly discussed doing a SOTM in  
the USA a couple of weeks before or after the main SOTM.

If you'd like to be involved with this, the first call will be at

Monday Nov 9th
5:30PM PST/8:30PM EST (immediately after the US chapter call)

+1 218-486-3891 x 224699644

Agenda: http://docs.google.com/Doc?id=dkbvxqx_7g83v5kjm
(please feel free to suggest topics)

Yours &c.

Steve

___
Talk-ca mailing list
Talk-ca@openstreetmap.org
http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-ca

Re: [Talk-ca] Road and Trail Maps available for Ontario, Canada at no cost

[SteveC]

Hi, sounds like this should go to talk-ca

Yours &c.

Steve


On 28 Aug 2009, at 08:41, Albertson, Carol Anne (MNR) wrote:

> Hi,
>
> I am not sure if you are accessing Provincial or Federal warehouses  
> for data but currently Ontario road and trail data can be accessed  
> at no cost at Land Information - the data layers are Ontario Road  
> Network and the Ontario Trail Network.  The Provincial data is  
> available in a GIS format and can be converted to your proprietary  
> mapping.  Please visit http://www.mnr.gov.on.ca/en/ 
> STEL02_168321.html or call 705-755-2175.
>
> If you are looking for Canadian Road data I would also suggest you  
> go to Geobase http://www.geobase.ca/ where you can directly download  
> data freely for Canadian roads and other data.  The provinces are  
> working with the Federal government to provide data at no cost to  
> users.  Shortly street names and address ranges for Ontario will be  
> available through Geobase.
>
> If you have any questions please do not hesitate to contact me,
>
> Carol-Anne Albertson
> Project Manager, Land Information Ontario
> Ontario Ministry of Natural Resources
> P.O. Box 7000, 300 Water Street, 2nd Floor North Tower
> Peterborough, ON K9J 8M5 Telephone: 705.755.2175
> Email: carolanne.albert...@ontario.ca
>
> Do We Have Your Trail? Land Information Ontario has developed a web  
> map showing trail locations based on information we have received  
> from Ontario municipalities and trail organizations.  By adding your  
> trail to the Ontario Trail Network your trail along with other  
> trails will be accessible at no cost to government ministries and  
> other organizations for planning, analysis and emergency management.  
> Check to see if we have your trail in French or English!
>
>


___
Talk-ca mailing list
Talk-ca@openstreetmap.org
http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-ca

Re: [Talk-ca] [Osmf-talk] EVERYONE: PLEASE VOTE

[SteveC]

On 20 Aug 2009, at 00:32, Jochen Topf wrote:

> On Wed, Aug 19, 2009 at 06:12:46PM -0700, SteveC wrote:
>> But lets look at the real issue, Frederik. You're intensely jealous
>> that your own firm, GeoFabrik, which you didn't bother to declare in
>> your anti-CM email, has had little success compared to CloudMade.  
>> Your
>
> You probably shouldn't post things like this without talking to your
> lawyer. We are not going to sue you over this, but other companies
> might not like talk like this.

Sorry, what would you sue me for?

>> jealous to the point of stripping all references to me out of your
>> book on OpenStreetMap. You don't want anyone who's not from Germany  
>> to
>
> Steve, please, if you lie, then lie in a way that can't be checked  
> by looking
> in our book on page 164 in chapter 14.6 titled "Karten von  
> CloudMade" ("Maps
> from CloudMade"). The first sentence says: "Die englische Firma  
> Cloudmade, zu
> deren Gründern der OpenStreetMap-Erfinder Steve Coast  
> gehört, ..." (The English
> company CloudMade, to whichs founders belongs the OpenStreetMap- 
> Inventor Steve
> Coast, ...) (Sorry for the bad translation, I have tried to keep to  
> the
> original.) This quote is from the 2nd Edition (ISBN  
> 978-3-86541-320-8).
>
> Sorry if I don't have respect for people who lie and know it.  
> Because Frederik
> any you have talked about this very issue already.

Oh sorry, there is only one mention at the back, therefore it's ok.  
Why don't you remind everyone what page I was on in the first edition?  
But really it doesn't matter, your jealousy is well known.

>> come to your German-only German SOTM your planning because you want
>> your own little empire and fame.
>
> Where did you get this from?

You and Frederik.

> Everybody is of course welcome to the conference
> we are planning. The conference language will be German, because  
> thats the
> language that people here in Germany speak. I am sorry that this  
> excludes
> a few billion people on this planet, but it includes the people in  
> Germany
> who don't feel as comfortable with the English language. We already  
> have an
> English language international conference (SOTM) and the one the  
> German
> community is planning just caters to a different audience.

So why don't you run an international SOTM?

Yours &c.

Steve
___
Talk-ca mailing list
Talk-ca@openstreetmap.org
http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-ca

Re: [Talk-ca] [Osmf-talk] EVERYONE: PLEASE VOTE

[SteveC]

First I think you just breached the data protection act and are using  
data which even I don't have access to, but lets ignore that and the  
fact that Nick has actually been pushing to make the list more open. A  
list which only you, Mike and 80n have.

I really wish we could just pay people in Kiev to do exactly what I  
say, but we can't. It's insulting to their integrity and intelligence  
to suggest that they simply become members of OSMF to vote for Nick or  
I. Everyone at CloudMade is encouraged to be a member of the  
Foundation. From me, to the ambassadors we had, to our executives to  
our developers. The majority of us have been members for some time. I  
don't know all the details as I don't deal with them on a daily basis  
but from my understanding is that this 'mass joining' was simply  
because they didn't have individual credit cards that would work from  
the Ukraine on paypal.

To be clear, we've not told staff at CloudMade to vote for anyone. You  
clearly have no respect for Nick, me or anyone we employ in the  
Ukraine, but you could ask some of our London team to confirm this if  
you have any respect for them?

We're in a very difficult position and don't always make the right  
choices. CloudMade has contributed tens of thousands of pounds in cash  
to the Foundation for things like sponsorship and servers. We've spent  
man years on coding work. Nick, me and many other in CloudMade spend  
far beyond 9-5 working to promote OSM and make it fly. But if we make  
a small mistake we're hung up to dry by people like Frederik as some  
kind of map-based Darth Vader figure.

If we don't encourage people to join then we're not part of the  
community and engaged. If we do then you can interpret it as being a  
take over. So we walk a fine balancing act. That's just the way it is,  
and we try hard to make the right decisions. This is something we'll  
learn from. But I sincerely hope that the majority of people look at  
how much hard work we've put in and the good we've done for OSM  
despite a sometimes fractious community and the pot shots like this  
taken.

 From a practical point of view I have no idea what conspiracy we'd be  
trying to achieve anyway. If we really were deranged enough to try and  
'take over' then firstly we could just register tens or hundreds of  
fake people with hotmail email addresses and avoid this. Second, I  
don't know what we'd be taking over. The data has very clear  
protections all over it to stop people taking it over and I want them  
only to be made stronger (not weaker Public Domain which is what  
Frederik wants). The Foundation has very little assets and I've put  
the last 5 years of my life in to making OSM better since I founded.  
It would be super dumb, gain me nothing and destroy my reputation and  
OSM to be Evil and do any of that.

Anyway, the Ukraine has it's own strong community, just have a look at 
http://mapping.in.ua/ 
  and I think you have your numbers wrong in assuming everyone in the  
Ukraine works for CloudMade.

I and CloudMade are very open to learning from these kinds of hiccups  
and am all ears for how we can do better. I'd go so far as to suggest  
that maybe we could ask our Ukraine staff not to vote at all, but that  
would lack the same respect you don't have for them.

But lets look at the real issue, Frederik. You're intensely jealous  
that your own firm, GeoFabrik, which you didn't bother to declare in  
your anti-CM email, has had little success compared to CloudMade. Your  
jealous to the point of stripping all references to me out of your  
book on OpenStreetMap. You don't want anyone who's not from Germany to  
come to your German-only German SOTM your planning because you want  
your own little empire and fame.

I wouldn't normally point to all of that because I have a lot of  
respect for you and I want GeoFabrik, ITO World and all the other  
companies using OpenStreetMap to succeed. But you keep doing this  
stuff without getting any push back, and if you're going to attack  
people like this in public then you should declare the other side of  
the coin.

We have a larger goal. OpenStreetMap is going to be the best map of  
the world and we need to work together to make it happen. Let's not  
squabble over this stuff because we're David right now and there is a  
Goliath in terms of TeleAtlas and NavTeq. We need mappers, the  
Foundation, the sysadmin team, developers, academia and companies to  
work together in an ecosystem to make it happen. Let's deal with each  
other in a more respectful way, don't automatically assume people are  
evil and assume that people are acting in good faith.

That way, we can all work on a better map.

I'm very contactable by anyone who has any concerns over this and  
encourage people to judge me and Nick on what we do and not what  
Frederik says. Feel free to phone me, IM or whatever. Details here: 
http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/User:Steve

Yours &c.

Steve

Re: [Talk-ca] Charlottetown, PE, Mapping Party

[SteveC]

Wish I could go, it's super beautiful.

Yours &c.

Steve


On 16 Aug 2009, at 11:06, Robert Shand wrote:
> Hi Everyone,
>
> http://ruk.ca/content/openstreetmap-mapping-party-august-26-2009
>
> Peter Rukivina is looking at doing a mapping party on the 26th. The
> more merrier.
>
> Best wishes
>
>
>
> ___
> Talk-ca mailing list
> Talk-ca@openstreetmap.org
> http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-ca
>


___
Talk-ca mailing list
Talk-ca@openstreetmap.org
http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-ca

Re: [Talk-ca] Cleaning up after the GeoBase import

[SteveC]

On 12 Jun 2009, at 18:54, Richard Degelder wrote:

> William Lachance wrote:
>
> Look at this from another angle: Should we split up all the existing  
> OSM
> road data that people have put in to add in GeoBase UUID information?
> The simple answer is that at some point we are going to have to.
>
> If we want to add the attributes available from GeoBase, and to be  
> able to update it from future GeoBase updates, then we are going to  
> have to find a way to add the GeoBase UUID information and,

Stupid question but my understanding is that TIGER claims to reuse  
UIDs from release to release but doesn't really. So, what is the  
probability with GeoBase? Just saying it might be worth thinking about  
before doing all the work.


> to do so, split the ways into the came segments that GeoBase uses.   
> If we do it manually, which will be a lot of work, or someone  
> develops a script to do it we are going to have to do it to utilize  
> the data available from GeoBase for the map.  Not doing it means we  
> cannot import the GeoBase UUID an cannot benefit from the other  
> attributes available within the GeoBase data which will leave us  
> with two classes of roadways, those that have all of the current  
> data available and those that are going to require that users  
> manually add any additional details in order for them to appear.
>
> At some point we are going to have to go through the entire data set  
> within Canada in OSM and look to add the GeoBase UUID and any  
> additional data from GeoBase.  We will not need to give attribution  
> to GeoBase for data submitted from users nor the method that the  
> GeoBase data was recorded but we will have to insert the GeoBase  
> UUID for those segments.  From that point those ways originally  
> created by users will be handled exactly the same as every other  
> segment originating from GeoBase.
>
>
>
> Michael  Barabanov suggested:
>
> Let me be a devil's advocate here for a while.  The 2 alternatives  
> that make more sense are
>
> - Delete the existing street data and start fresh with GeoBase, and  
> always
>
>maintain the UUIDs properly. Given how many inconsistencies/ 
> topology
>errors there are in OSM data for Greater Vancouver, it may just  
> be the right thing to do.
>Otherwise we'll be spending months joining exising OSM data to  
> newly
>
>imported segments. Not a great way to spend resources.
>
> - Don't pay attention to preserving UUIDs/segments, and re-run  
> RoadMatcher when we need to import more data.
>
> What we're doing right now is neither here nor there. No benefit of
>
> GeoBase/UUIDs for existing OSM data and confused renderers for the  
> imported GeoBase ones.
>
> Michael.
> I would suggest that we do neither.  Although the GeoBase data is  
> generally very good, frequently excellent, there are times where it  
> is wrong or less than ideal.  This can be for a number of reasons,  
> many not within the control of GeoBase either.  Where we have had  
> good people working on OSM, using GPS tracks as the basis of their  
> work, we usually also get pretty good quality, maybe not to the  
> exacting quality that GeoBase has the potential to get.  When we  
> started the import we agreed that we would preserve the user  
> generated data as much as possible.  One of the guidelines for mass  
> imports also is to preserve user generated data.  Where the user  
> generated data is faulty or wrong then we are going to replace it,  
> in the same way that we would if we were manually editing the data.
>
> One of the reason that the GeoBase data may not accurately reflect  
> what is really there is because it is only updated periodically.   
> Thus new roadways, changes to existing roadways, and other changes  
> are only going to be reflected in the GeoBase data sporadically.  It  
> takes time for the original data to be transferred up from the  
> municipal level, where much of it originates, through the provincial  
> level and finally into GeoBase itself and allow GeoBase to release a  
> new update for the province.  We want to have users continue to map  
> and add to the map to keep it really up to date.
>
> Some of the data within GeoBase is also pretty old and generated  
> from poor quality sources, some simular to the Yahoo! satellite  
> imagery that we also have access to.  If we can get a local mapper  
> to correct the data then it can be better than the original GeoBase  
> data and improve the map.  I will frequently take good locally  
> generated data over that from GeoBase and so I would be very  
> reluctant to support the idea of wiping out locally generated data  
> in favour of that from GeoBase.
>
> If, on the other hand, we ignore the preservation of the UUIDs and  
> segments and instead merge them then we are going to go through a  
> great deal of work every time we want t add a new feature from  
> GeoBase.  Are we going to create the new GeoBase compatible data set  
> on th

Re: [Talk-ca] 092g07 imported and uploaded

[SteveC]

On 1 Jun 2009, at 22:36, Sam Vekemans wrote:
> I decided not to add these tag to the  
> 'TR_1760009_1roads_segment_GeoBase', because the Geobase roads are  
> more uptodate, and dont want people to be updating the area will the  
> most complete data.  The house numbering system, of having it  
> imbedded in the road, is rather difficult to get it rendered right,  
> and doesnt match the current system of addressing roads.  So the  
> best solution is to omit those house number:first:last:left:right  
> tags, and deal with them separartly.

Yes - I think you should follow the Karlsruhe Schema, which is what  
everyone else is doing addresses in these days.

Best

Steve


___
Talk-ca mailing list
Talk-ca@openstreetmap.org
http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-ca

Re: [Talk-ca] 092g07 imported and uploaded

[SteveC]

I think that'd be super cool.

On 1 Jun 2009, at 13:27, Richard Weait wrote:
> On Mon, 2009-06-01 at 11:08 +0100, SteveC wrote:
>> Stupid question, you guys importing addressing too?
>
> The Canadian government data does not include addressing information  
> for
> all jurisdictions.  This area (British Columbia) has no addressing
> available[1].
>
> The earlier import in Alberta does claim block face address data but  
> my
> quick look at Fairview Alberta does not show the addressing data.  It
> does have the source uuid so perhaps we can get the addressing on the
> next pass.
>
> [1] http://geobase.ca/geobase/en/data/nrn/status.html
>
>
> ___
> Talk-ca mailing list
> Talk-ca@openstreetmap.org
> http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-ca
>

Best

Steve


___
Talk-ca mailing list
Talk-ca@openstreetmap.org
http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-ca

Re: [Talk-ca] 092g07 imported and uploaded

[SteveC]

Stupid question, you guys importing addressing too?

On 31 May 2009, at 21:38, Michael Barabanov wrote:

> > It is nice to see more people importing the GeoBase data.  Are you  
> going to be doing more areas in BC?
>
> Yes, starting with adjacent areas to south and east.
>
> Michael.
>
> On Sun, May 31, 2009 at 1:01 PM, Steve Singer  
>  wrote:
> On Sun, 31 May 2009, Michael Barabanov wrote:
>
>
> This includes parts of Burnaby, North Vancouver, Coquitlam, Port  
> Coquitlam,
> Port Moody. See on OSM:
> http://www.openstreetmap.org/?minlon=-123&minlat=49.25&maxlon=-122.5&maxlat=49.5&box=yes
>
> Looks good.
>
> It is nice to see more people importing the GeoBase data.  Are you  
> going to be doing more areas in BC?
>
> Steve
>
>
>
> I've also captured my notes at
> http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/More_details_on_GeoBase_import_processand
> fixed minor details in
> http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Geobase_NRN_-_OSM_Map_Feature. If  
> people
> think the additional notes are useful, I can merge this info into the
> description on the main Geobase import page.
>
> BTW, I've compared the NRN data to Canvec, and found that NRN data  
> is more
> up to date (some new streets are only present in NRN).
>
> Michael.
>
>
>
> ___
> Talk-ca mailing list
> Talk-ca@openstreetmap.org
> http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-ca

Best

Steve


___
Talk-ca mailing list
Talk-ca@openstreetmap.org
http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-ca

Re: [Talk-ca] Reminder: Toronto, ON mapping party - Jan 31st.

[SteveC]

I can't make it but just a note that this is superb it's happening

On 30 Jan 2009, at 11:24, Colin McGregor wrote:

> Just a quick reminder note, there will be a mapping party in  
> Toronto, Ontario
>
> When: Saturday, January 31, 2009 1:00 PM
>
> Where
> Aroma Espresso Bar
> 500 Bloor St W
> Toronto ON M5S 1Y3
> 416-303-454
>
> Short walk from the Bathurst subway station
>
> Colin McGregor
>
> ___
> Talk-ca mailing list
> Talk-ca@openstreetmap.org
> http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-ca
>

Best

Steve


___
Talk-ca mailing list
Talk-ca@openstreetmap.org
http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-ca

Re: [Talk-ca] About OpenStreetMap

[SteveC]

I really don't have time to do your homework for you, but maybe  
someone on talk-ca@ or newbies@ will help you.

Best

Steve


On 6 Jan 2009, at 18:33, Nyaladzani Nkhwanana wrote:
> Hi Steve,
>
> My name is Nyaladzani Nkhwanana, a Masters student at the university  
> of New Brunswick, Fredericton, Canada. I am currently undertaking a  
> research (Thesis) on assessing credibility on volunteered geographic  
> information. Im interested in how openstreetmap works, e.g. The  
> trust algorithms you use ( I see you have classes of users,  
> administrators, to new users), I want to know how this rankings are  
> archieved.
> Also I am interested in how you validate the contributed data, who  
> has the final say and also how you get to ban users contributing  
> wrong information. Please if you can prepare this in a document that  
> will be great, thanks.
>
> Basically I am a fan of OpenStreetMap work, Im a citizen of  
> Botswana, Southern Africa. If you can check it out you will find  
> that there is very little contributed there. As I complete my  
> studies end of this year I hope to be of assist for the benefit of  
> users back home.
>
> -- 
> Nyaladzani Jairo Nkhwanana
> 807 Burden Street
> Fredericton, NB
> E3B 4C5
> Canada
> Home: (+1506) 455 0508
> Office: (+1506) 447 3259
> Mobile (+1506) 292 5214


___
Talk-ca mailing list
Talk-ca@openstreetmap.org
http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-ca

[Talk-ca] Interview with me online this evening

[SteveC]

Watch & listen online:

5:30PM PST tonight

http://www.ustream.tv/channel/the-wftl-show

Best

Steve


___
Talk-ca mailing list
Talk-ca@openstreetmap.org
http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-ca

Re: [Talk-ca] Garmin Maps made from OSM listed on MapCenter2

[SteveC]

On 18 Jul 2008, at 22:31, Corey Burger wrote:

> On Fri, Jul 18, 2008 at 4:05 PM, Sam Vekemans
> <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>> Hi,
>> I noticed that Montreal seems to be the only city in Canada which  
>> has a
>> garmin map of the city posted to http://Mapcenter2.cgpsmapper.com  
>> with a
>> source reference to OSM.
>>
>> I am wondering who uploaded this file, and also if we can have a list
>> growing of all the cities which other people are working on, to  
>> have those
>> maps made into a downloadable garmin map. .. so then this way  
>> (unfortunatly
>> mapcenter is not wiki, so others cant add on maps to an existing  
>> mapset) so
>> its the person who uploaded it would be responsable to update this  
>> map for
>> everyone to download.
>> Or maybe someone out there knows how todo it easily? ..
>>
>> Seing as how this is the final product, showing this map on the  
>> garmin .. ..
>> there is no sence on having more than 1 person doing the compiling  
>> for the
>> same area.
>>
>> .. and perhaps this (compiled from OSM), garmin map can be made  
>> available on
>> eaach cities page? .. and the overall list can be shown on the main  
>> Canada
>> page?
>
> Cloudmade is creating .img files for the whole world. The canada one
> can be found at:
> http://downloads.cloudmade.com/north_america/canada
>
> I am suspicious of the package size, so I am about to load it on my  
> gps.

any problem let me know...

>
>
> Of course, it would be nicer to get some smaller stuff for individual
> cities. It probably wouldn't be that hard to pull a rectange out of
> OSM each day and build .img files automatically. I recently purchased
> mappingfreedom.ca so I might do that when I get the time/bandwidth.
>
> Corey
>
> ___
> Talk-ca mailing list
> Talk-ca@openstreetmap.org
> http://lists.openstreetmap.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/talk-ca
>

Best

Steve


___
Talk-ca mailing list
Talk-ca@openstreetmap.org
http://lists.openstreetmap.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/talk-ca

Re: [Talk-ca] SOTM 2008: The State of The (Canada) Map

[SteveC]

On 9 Jul 2008, at 06:58, James Ewen wrote:
> Steve, if you have the magic touch that can make people jump out of
> the woodwork, and get OSM activity going where there's nothing, have
> at Alberta. There are a few people in Edmonton, a few more in Calgary,
> a guy down in the Crowsnest Pass, and that's about it.

It's really not super complex. I'm doing one in Denver, CO right now.  
Just cold emailing the geography department, linux user group, cycle  
group, department of geography at Denver U.

That's all it takes.

Best

Steve


___
Talk-ca mailing list
Talk-ca@openstreetmap.org
http://lists.openstreetmap.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/talk-ca

Re: [Talk-ca] SOTM 2008: The State of The (Canada) Map

[SteveC]

James you sound super sarcastic and skeptical, do you really want to  
run something like this?

On 8 Jul 2008, at 20:44, James Ewen wrote:

> On Tue, Jul 8, 2008 at 8:00 PM, Richard Weait <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>  
> wrote:
>
>> When is your party?  I have some GPSes for loan to other OSMers in
>> Canada.  That goes for other Canadian mappers as well.  Let me know  
>> and
>> we'll work something out.
>
> I haven't planned any yet, but it sounds like all I need to do is
> create a web page template and then simply change the name of the
> city/town/village/highway/road network, and post that to the wiki...
>
> On the how-to page though, there are a few things that seem to be a
> bit of a problem that I might need help figuring out...
>
>*  When Once you have a rough venue ('London' or 'Berlin') and a
> couple of people, then put up a wiki page with all the details and
> confirming the date. The rest is easy. On the day, unless you get a
> lot of newbies, it will all just happen.
>
> I have lots of venues, but where do I come up with the couple people?
>
>* Where The simplest venue is a pub, preferably with free WIFI.
> You may find though that you can get a local company, arts centre,
> library or hall to provide free space for the weekend.
>
> I don't know all the local "pubs"... Most small locales in Alberta
> don't have internet access let alone free wifi...
>
>* Who The next thing is to get some people signed up. It's a good
> idea to contact two or three local mappers in advance and find out
> what dates would suit them. If possible, get them committed before you
> make a general announcement.
>
> When there are no local mappers, who do you contact?
>
>
> The problem is that these mapping parties are designed for areas with
> OSM mappers in the area. We might be able to swing a mapping party in
> Edmonton. There are 10 OSM members within 20 km of my location, which
> covers all the users in Edmonton (a metro area of 1 million people).
> We could possibly garner enough interest to map out a neighborhood.
>
> This leaves the other 95% of the province as an empty page.
>
> Again I will ask, is there a provision for finding OSM users in a
> specific geographical area?
>
>> I like Alberta.  Let me know when you are planning and perhaps I can
>> bring the GPSes personally.  Air Canada isn't going to send me for  
>> free,
>> but if I can combine a business trip with some fun mapping; why  
>> wouldn't
>> I?
>
> Yup, having someone else foot the bill is certainly a good way to
> defer the costs involved. I make use of my work trips around the
> province as an opportunity to gather GPS tracks. You can tell where I
> go to work by looking for GPS tracks uploaded by VE6SRV...
>
>>> I'm also not sure how you keep the OSM project a secret from these
>>> people that you get to map out an area for you. It sure seems like  
>>> you
>>> would be spreading the word, and bringing more people into the OSM
>>> community through these activities.
>>
>> Why would we keep it a secret?  Who's doing that?  It seems silly  
>> to try
>> to keep OSM secret when you are showing people the osm site, the  
>> wiki,
>> sample maps, the svn ...
>
> Read this thread... I'm trying to say that we need more OSM members to
> be able to make local interest mapping happen, let alone mapping
> parties.
>
> James
>
> ___
> Talk-ca mailing list
> Talk-ca@openstreetmap.org
> http://lists.openstreetmap.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/talk-ca
>

Best

Steve


___
Talk-ca mailing list
Talk-ca@openstreetmap.org
http://lists.openstreetmap.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/talk-ca

Re: [Talk-ca] SOTM 2008: The State of The (Canada) Map

[SteveC]

On 8 Jul 2008, at 19:48, James Ewen wrote:

> On Tue, Jul 8, 2008 at 8:21 PM, SteveC <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
>>> So, do you send these distant groups free GPS units? Do you attend
>>> these mapping parties? If so, how do you get there at no cost?
>>
>> I'm not going to tie myself to this 'no cost' thing as it seems to be
>> reductio ad absurdum
>
> Thank you... this was my point exactly... while it is pretty easy to
> say that you can walk around your block, and map that at "no cost"
> (after buying a GPS, and a computer, internet connection, etc), when
> it comes to mapping places further afield, there are costs that will
> be incurred.

You should include the cost of your breakfast, shoes, clothes, car,  
toothbrush, toothpaste... etc surely!?

Best

Steve


___
Talk-ca mailing list
Talk-ca@openstreetmap.org
http://lists.openstreetmap.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/talk-ca

Re: [Talk-ca] SOTM 2008: The State of The (Canada) Map

[SteveC]

On 8 Jul 2008, at 18:46, James Ewen wrote:

> On Tue, Jul 8, 2008 at 6:41 PM, SteveC <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
>>> We need to find and enlist GPS enabled users currently... I found  
>>> out
>>> about OSM from the Geocaching community, if I recall correctly.  
>>> Hmm, I
>>
>> Disagree again - I carry around a pack of 10 GPS units to lend to
>> people at mapping parties.
>
> Cool, where do I find those 10 packs of GPS units at no cost? I'm
> still using my Garmin GPSII+. I managed to find BSGPS which will log
> my travels so I don't have to stop every 1024 seconds to download my
> track.

There are several people, including the foundation, who have sets of  
GPS units to lend out.

>>> We need to spread the
>>> word and build the membership base around here currently.
>>
>> Absolutely wrong. I'm running lots of mapping parties in the US where
>> OSM is totally unknown. I contact the geography departments, hikers,
>> cyclists and so on and the results are good.
>
> So, do you send these distant groups free GPS units? Do you attend
> these mapping parties? If so, how do you get there at no cost?

I'm not going to tie myself to this 'no cost' thing as it seems to be  
reductio ad absurdum

> I'm also not sure how you keep the OSM project a secret from these
> people that you get to map out an area for you. It sure seems like you
> would be spreading the word, and bringing more people into the OSM
> community through these activities.

Well, I try.

Best

Steve


___
Talk-ca mailing list
Talk-ca@openstreetmap.org
http://lists.openstreetmap.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/talk-ca

Re: [Talk-ca] SOTM 2008: The State of The (Canada) Map

[SteveC]

On 8 Jul 2008, at 17:32, James Ewen wrote:

> On Tue, Jul 8, 2008 at 4:12 PM, SteveC <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
>> But you're sort of giving up before you started. OSM didn't start by
>> having universal member density throughout Europe or something.
>
> I agree, however, you need to entice people into the concept before
> you can put them to work. You are talking about putting on events when
> there are no members to attend these events. We need to spread the
> word and build the membership base around here currently.

Absolutely wrong. I'm running lots of mapping parties in the US where  
OSM is totally unknown. I contact the geography departments, hikers,  
cyclists and so on and the results are good.

> We need to find and enlist GPS enabled users currently... I found out
> about OSM from the Geocaching community, if I recall correctly. Hmm, I

Disagree again - I carry around a pack of 10 GPS units to lend to  
people at mapping parties.

Best

Steve


___
Talk-ca mailing list
Talk-ca@openstreetmap.org
http://lists.openstreetmap.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/talk-ca

Re: [Talk-ca] SOTM 2008: The State of The (Canada) Map

[SteveC]

On 8 Jul 2008, at 15:07, James Ewen wrote:

> On Tue, Jul 8, 2008 at 3:17 PM, SteveC <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
>> I think you're being obtuse. From looking at the map it wouldn't take
>> me much time to map the whole place myself so it doesn't need a  
>> party.
>
> That gets you one small city, now add in the rest of Canada. The
> problem is the sheer size of the country, and the low OSM member
> density. There are no OSM members in Ft. McMurray, and it is a 5 hour
> drive to the city from my home. There are a whole lot of other towns
> and villages, not to mention hundreds of thousands of miles of rural
> highways, and county roads to map as well. Mapping parties are fine
> when you can get a bunch of members together. Since this thread is
> about the state of the (Canada) map, I am talking about issues seen
> here, not issues seen in areas where the member density is much
> higher.

But you're sort of giving up before you started. OSM didn't start by  
having universal member density throughout Europe or something.

You run a mapping party in I don't know, Calgary. Someone there gets  
really interested and his brother is a Geography teacher in, I don't  
know, Ft. McMurray and he emails him about it, he runs a class and it  
gets mapped.

See? Networks effect is everything and you have to start somewhere.


>> I know I'm helplessly stupid and lame, but, to run a party in my
>> nearest city (San Francisco) basically costs nothing. I get a space
>> for free (or just go to starbucks). I drive, cycle or walk there. I
>> put out the publicity using the internet. People turn up, we do some
>> mapping and I show them how to do stuff, then we grab a drink
>> afterward. None of these costs are different from any other Saturday.
>
> I am not insinuating that you are stupid, nor lame. I am suggesting
> that if I want an OSM map of Fort McMurray, AB, that it is not going
> to be a zero cost event. Can you show me how to find users in a
> specific area? I know that I can find users located near me on my home
> page. Is there a way to query for users located near a specific
> location? I'd be willing to bet that I am probably in the top ten
> closest members to Fort McMurray.

See above - just try and make a start somewhere.

>>> On another tangent, if the licensing issues can be settled, we might
>>> soon have a base map provided by the Government of Canada upon which
>>> to build. This is probably our best avenue to pursue. A base map  
>>> will
>>> get 95% of the roads in the database, and making minor edits and
>>> adding new roads can then become the priority.
>>
>> I'm working on that from the OSMF PoV
>
> That's going to be the way that the majority of Canadian roads get
> added to the OSM map. There's simply not enough user density to be
> able to effectively map Canada any other way within my lifetime.

That kind of ignores the better than exponential user take up and is  
being super negative.

Best

Steve

___
Talk-ca mailing list
Talk-ca@openstreetmap.org
http://lists.openstreetmap.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/talk-ca

Re: [Talk-ca] [Talk-us] Fwd: shape files of US states and great lakes

[SteveC]

my goal is to make this

http://www.openstreetmap.org/?lat=38.8&lon=-95.9&zoom=4

look something like this

http://maps.yahoo.com/#mvt=m&lat=39.463135&lon=-93.818625&zoom=5


On 8 Jul 2008, at 14:43, Adam Schreiber wrote:

> On Tue, Jul 8, 2008 at 5:38 PM, SteveC <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>>
>> On 8 Jul 2008, at 14:37, Adam Schreiber wrote:
>>
>>> On Tue, Jul 8, 2008 at 5:30 PM, SteveC <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>>>>> I've had a chat with jon who runs the tile server and an interim
>>>>> solution to getting the great lakes and US/CA state borders on the
>>>>> map is if there are Free shapefile(s) somewhere with said stuff on
>>>>> it.
>>>>>
>>>>> Can anyone help?
>>>
>>> The US state borders are all in already.  I don't know a source for
>>> the CA province borders though.
>>
>> the problem as I understand it is that extracting them and rendering
>> them will take a while, and this is a stop gap
>
> I'm not sure it's clear what your goal in this respect is.  The
> borders are already rendered by [EMAIL PROTECTED] if not by mapnik.
>

Best

Steve


___
Talk-ca mailing list
Talk-ca@openstreetmap.org
http://lists.openstreetmap.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/talk-ca

Re: [Talk-ca] [Talk-us] Fwd: shape files of US states and great lakes

[SteveC]

On 8 Jul 2008, at 14:37, Adam Schreiber wrote:

> On Tue, Jul 8, 2008 at 5:30 PM, SteveC <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>>> I've had a chat with jon who runs the tile server and an interim
>>> solution to getting the great lakes and US/CA state borders on the
>>> map is if there are Free shapefile(s) somewhere with said stuff on  
>>> it.
>>>
>>> Can anyone help?
>
> The US state borders are all in already.  I don't know a source for
> the CA province borders though.

the problem as I understand it is that extracting them and rendering  
them will take a while, and this is a stop gap

>
>
> Cheers,
>
>
> Adam
>

Best

Steve


___
Talk-ca mailing list
Talk-ca@openstreetmap.org
http://lists.openstreetmap.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/talk-ca

[Talk-ca] Fwd: shape files of US states and great lakes

[SteveC]

probably better sent with the address that I subscribed with...

Begin forwarded message:

> From: SteveC <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> Date: 8 July 2008 14:26:02 PDT
> To: talk-us <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>, talk-ca@openstreetmap.org
> Subject: shape files of US states and great lakes
>
> Hi
>
> I've had a chat with jon who runs the tile server and an interim  
> solution to getting the great lakes and US/CA state borders on the  
> map is if there are Free shapefile(s) somewhere with said stuff on it.
>
> Can anyone help?
>
> Best
>
> Steve
>

Best

Steve


___
Talk-ca mailing list
Talk-ca@openstreetmap.org
http://lists.openstreetmap.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/talk-ca

Re: [Talk-ca] SOTM 2008: The State of The (Canada) Map

[SteveC]

On 8 Jul 2008, at 13:55, James Ewen wrote:

> On Tue, Jul 8, 2008 at 12:27 PM, SteveC <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
>> I would just run some mapping parties, and remember to go for a drink
>> afterward. They're basically proven effective and shouldn't cost
>> anything at all to run.
>
> Sure thing... how many people here want to fly in to Fort McMurray, AB
> to map it? I wonder how many people are going to be able to do that
> for free.

I think you're being obtuse. From looking at the map it wouldn't take  
me much time to map the whole place myself so it doesn't need a party.

> Sorry I don't agree on your statement of "shouldn't cost anything at
> all to run". My employer subsidizes most of my OSM mapping, but they
> don't know it. Unfortunately I keep going back to the same places over
> and over again. I get in a little bit of deviations from the norm when
> I can, but it's going to take a long time to be able to map all of
> Northern Alberta this way.

I know I'm helplessly stupid and lame, but, to run a party in my  
nearest city (San Francisco) basically costs nothing. I get a space  
for free (or just go to starbucks). I drive, cycle or walk there. I  
put out the publicity using the internet. People turn up, we do some  
mapping and I show them how to do stuff, then we grab a drink  
afterward. None of these costs are different from any other Saturday.

> On another tangent, if the licensing issues can be settled, we might
> soon have a base map provided by the Government of Canada upon which
> to build. This is probably our best avenue to pursue. A base map will
> get 95% of the roads in the database, and making minor edits and
> adding new roads can then become the priority.

I'm working on that from the OSMF PoV

Best

Steve


___
Talk-ca mailing list
Talk-ca@openstreetmap.org
http://lists.openstreetmap.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/talk-ca

Re: [Talk-ca] SOTM 2008: The State of The (Canada) Map

[SteveC]

I would just run some mapping parties, and remember to go for a drink  
afterward. They're basically proven effective and shouldn't cost  
anything at all to run.

http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/index.php/Mapping_Party_Howto


On 8 Jul 2008, at 07:52, Gerald A wrote:

>
>
> On Wed, Jul 2, 2008 at 9:58 PM, James Ewen <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> Here's the problem, more people need to step up to the plate and add a
> little more. Many hands make light work. We need to work on spreading
> the word about OSM, and get more people interested in the project and
> working on the map.
>
> While I agree with this in principal, it's harder to action in  
> practice. While I mention and promote OSM when I can, it would be  
> easier with funding and an organization.  Even something informal,  
> to offset printing costs could be helpful.
>
> With the large expanse of area that is Canada, the chances of walking
> or cycling all of the roads are minimal. With the ever increasing cost
> of fuel, the chances of driving all roads to gather gps data is
> getting slimmer. More high resolution imagery from Yahoo would allow
> more mapping without having to drive the roads. Getting Google to
> allow use of the imagery found on GoogleEarth would help also.
>
> While this kind of mapping lays the foundation, without someone to  
> visit the roads and then label the yahoo derived drawn maps, it  
> helps but doesn't really provide useful information.
>
> I'm not sure we can ever get away from boots on the ground to do  
> effective mapping, in the long run. We might be able to get some  
> foundation data from government to prime the pump (like AND in  
> Europe or Tiger in the US), but our strength is being able to keep  
> up with changes on the ground in a more agile fashion. In a perfect  
> world, we'd get map companies aggregating data with us to save the  
> earth and reduce fuel costs. I have my doubts, but we can hope.
>
> The long term solution is to build as much as we can, and make it  
> easy for people to add and make use of the maps, and then let people  
> know about it.
>
> Gerald
> ___
> Talk-ca mailing list
> Talk-ca@openstreetmap.org
> http://lists.openstreetmap.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/talk-ca

Best

Steve


___
Talk-ca mailing list
Talk-ca@openstreetmap.org
http://lists.openstreetmap.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/talk-ca

Re: [Talk-ca] Great Lakes - coastlines / lakes

[SteveC]

it would seem they just dont render on mapnik for some reason

On 18 Apr 2008, at 10:08, Gerald A wrote:
>
>
> On Fri, Apr 18, 2008 at 1:01 PM, Jason Reid <[EMAIL PROTECTED] 
> > wrote:
> SteveC wrote:
> >
> > The great lakes are missing off the map!
> >
> > Anyone here able to import them or something magically? If not I'll
> > turn over to the dev/talk list but I thought people here might be
> > interested themselves :-)
> >
> >
> They show up on osmarender, I haven't checked the data yet but its
> possible they are entered as natural=water instead of coastline. I'll
> take a look at this over lunch if no one else gets to it first.
>
> Are they missing for the map DB, or from the slippy map? Living on  
> the North side of one, I'd have noticed if it disappeared from the  
> main slippy map. Might be a rendering lag, (They also appear in  
> Potlatch, so I'm not sure where this is manifesting itself).
>
> Thanks for the note, more details would be helpful if you could.
>
> thanks,
> Gerald.

Best

Steve


___
Talk-ca mailing list
Talk-ca@openstreetmap.org
http://lists.openstreetmap.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/talk-ca

[Talk-ca] Great Lakes - coastlines / lakes

[SteveC]

Hi

The great lakes are missing off the map!

Anyone here able to import them or something magically? If not I'll  
turn over to the dev/talk list but I thought people here might be  
interested themselves :-)

Best

Steve


___
Talk-ca mailing list
Talk-ca@openstreetmap.org
http://lists.openstreetmap.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/talk-ca