Re: [Talk-us] Use without Attribution

[Brian May]

That did the trick. I never thought to try and close that. So its hidden 
by default, whereas on the weather forecast map that you see first, it 
is not. And Mapbox is prominently displayed on the lower left, so I 
figured that was the attribution.


Thanks,

Brian

On 6/12/2017 8:01 PM, joe.saple...@charter.net wrote:


If you close the All Layers window it appears in the lower right, just 
like on the other implementations on their site.  Is this what you are 
looking for?


Joe

*From: *Brian May 
*Sent: *Monday, June 12, 2017 9:38 AM
*To: *talk-us@openstreetmap.org 
*Cc: *hans.dekryge...@gmail.com 
*Subject: *Re: [Talk-us] Use without Attribution

I used that MapBox form a couple months ago to notify missing OSM 
attribution for the WunderMap at wunderground.com, e.g. 
https://www.wunderground.com/wundermap?lat=27.17=-80.29=1


Just checked and no changes. I'm pretty sure its an OSM basemap due to 
checking features I have added that aren't on other maps.


Brian

 On 6/9/2017 5:50 PM, Hans De Kryger wrote:

Report it here
https://www.mapbox.com/blog/report-attribution-problems/


*Regards,*

*Hans*

On Fri, Jun 9, 2017 at 2:44 PM, Mike Thompson > wrote:

Looks like I am no longer a member of the "Talk" mailing list,
so I will try here:

https://mapnoco.org/results-intersection-quality

The above site uses OSM as a basemap.

Looks like the tiles come from Mapbox:

https://a.tiles.mapbox.com/v3/uis.map-561ra9g7/15/6814/12356.png

I was unable to find any attribution that credits OSM.

1) Did I miss the attribution? Is it somewhere on the page?

2) Does someone have a nicely worded template that uses all of
the proper terminology which I could adapt and send to the
site owner?

Thanks,

Mike


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Re: [Talk-us] Use without Attribution

[joe.sapletal]

If you close the All Layers window it appears in the lower right, just like on 
the other implementations on their site.  Is this what you are looking for?

Joe



From: Brian May
Sent: Monday, June 12, 2017 9:38 AM
To: talk-us@openstreetmap.org
Cc: hans.dekryge...@gmail.com
Subject: Re: [Talk-us] Use without Attribution

I used that MapBox form a couple months ago to notify missing OSM attribution 
for the WunderMap at wunderground.com, e.g. 
https://www.wunderground.com/wundermap?lat=27.17=-80.29=1

Just checked and no changes. I'm pretty sure its an OSM basemap due to checking 
features I have added that aren't on other maps. 

Brian

 On 6/9/2017 5:50 PM, Hans De Kryger wrote:
Report it here https://www.mapbox.com/blog/report-attribution-problems/


Regards,
Hans

On Fri, Jun 9, 2017 at 2:44 PM, Mike Thompson  wrote:
Looks like I am no longer a member of the "Talk" mailing list, so I will try 
here: 

https://mapnoco.org/results-intersection-quality   
   
The above site uses OSM as a basemap.    
   
Looks like the tiles come from Mapbox:   
https://a.tiles.mapbox.com/v3/uis.map-561ra9g7/15/6814/12356.png   
   
I was unable to find any attribution that credits OSM.

1) Did I miss the attribution? Is it somewhere on the page? 
2) Does someone have a nicely worded template that uses all of the proper 
terminology which I could adapt and send to the site owner?

Thanks,

Mike

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Re: [Talk-us] NJ mass road demotions?

[Kevin Kenny]

On Mon, Jun 12, 2017 at 2:55 PM, Richard Fairhurst  wrote:
> * highway=motorway: interstate or other long-distance restricted-access road
> * highway=trunk: fast, busy State Highway or US Highway, often NHS/STRAHNET
> * highway=primary: major State Highway or US Highway
> * highway=secondary: other State Highway or major County Road
> * highway=tertiary: other through route, often a County Road, usually paved
> with centreline
> * highway=unclassified: rural minor route, sometimes a County Road, paved
> unless tagged otherwise
> * highway=residential: minor public road intended for residential access
> rather than through route, paved unless tagged otherwise
>   (N.B. currently not safe to assume paved in rural areas where
> tiger:reviewed=no)
> * highway=track: ungraded or rough, but usable by some four-wheeled vehicles

Sounds close to what I've been doing. I don't recall whether I tagged
the road in question as 'unclassified' or 'track' without looking it
up, but I certainly added smoothness=very_bad, surface=compacted,
vehicle:conditional=no @ snow. It's a numbered and placarded county
highway, but seasonal and limited use, and I wouldn't take a car with
low ground clearance on it even in dry weather.

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Re: [Talk-us] NJ mass road demotions?

[Wolfgang Zenker]

* Richard Fairhurst  [170612 20:55]:
> Kevin Kenny wrote:
>> Is there *anyone* that actually can speak to what *is* common 
>> practice in the US? When I've asked, I've always drawn a lot of 
>> replies and come away more confused than before.

> I've been doing vast amounts of rural TIGER fixup over the past couple of
> years and this is what broadly seems to be what I've seen, bearing in mind
> standard practice in other developed countries and the idea that the
> highway= tag combines the importance in the highway network with some
> assurance of construction quality:

> * highway=motorway: interstate or other long-distance restricted-access road
> * highway=trunk: fast, busy State Highway or US Highway, often NHS/STRAHNET
> * highway=primary: major State Highway or US Highway
> * highway=secondary: other State Highway or major County Road
> * highway=tertiary: other through route, often a County Road, usually paved
> with centreline
> * highway=unclassified: rural minor route, sometimes a County Road, paved
> unless tagged otherwise
> * highway=residential: minor public road intended for residential access
> rather than through route, paved unless tagged otherwise
>   (N.B. currently not safe to assume paved in rural areas where
> tiger:reviewed=no)
> * highway=track: ungraded or rough, but usable by some four-wheeled vehicles

> There are many, many variations, especially because the US doesn't have a
> single nationwide system like most European countries, but if I had to sum
> it up in a few words I'd choose the above.

While most places in the US commonly use some variation of the above,
not all places use the same variation (and that wouldn't make sense
either). Using a common tagging scheme is probably much easier on a
state by state level, so we should have wiki pages describing how
suggested tagging in one specific state is different than the one
described on the US road tagging guide. We have those pages for some
states; problem is that many "drive-by-mappers" don't bother to look at
them but use their one (undocumented) criteria. One example would be a
mapper who changed all highways in Montana connecting to a port of entry
and onward to a Canadian highway to primary. Many of these are unpaved
"Montana Secondary State Highways" which I converted back to tertiary,
as described on the Montana/Highways wiki page.

Wolfgang

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[Talk-us] Fwd: Re: NJ mass road demotions?

[Charlotte Wolter]

I have a similar situation.
I have tagged many numbered, but unpaved, roads on the 
Navajo reservation as "tertiary." They aren't "unmaintained," because 
they are plowed by the Navajo Nation, but with varying degrees of regularity.
The whole road system there has been getting better 
steadily, but there still are roads that are questionable as 
"tertiary," despite having numbers. So, I'm regularly downgrading 
some of those to "unclassified," as I discover them. I think that is 
the best practice for this area.


Charlotte



On Mon, Jun 12, 2017 at 12:07 PM, Richard Fairhurst 
<rich...@systemed.net> wrote:

It would be really helpful if there were one single place where US common
practice was explained, succinctly (not like the verbal diarrhoea[2] on the
US Roads Tagging page) and unambiguously, and in a way that accords with
international usage in OSM. As an auslander it's not my job to do it, but
perhaps someone sensible on this list might like to?


Is there *anyone* that actually can speak to what *is* common practice
in the US? When I've asked, I've always drawn a lot of replies and come
away more confused than before.

Of course, a lot of what I map is in a gray area where 'tertiary,'
'residential', 'unclassified' and 'track' tend to have blurred boundaries,
and 4WD vehicles are strongly recommended. The road where I'm parked
in 
https://www.flickr.com/photos/ke9tv/14041171575 
is a signed and

numbered county highway, but I couldn't bring myself to tag it 'tertiary.'
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Charlotte Wolter
927 18th Street Suite A
Santa Monica, California
90403
+1-310-597-4040
techl...@techlady.com
Skype: thetechlady

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Re: [Talk-us] NJ mass road demotions?

[Richard Fairhurst]

Kevin Kenny wrote:
> Is there *anyone* that actually can speak to what *is* common 
> practice in the US? When I've asked, I've always drawn a lot of 
> replies and come away more confused than before.

I've been doing vast amounts of rural TIGER fixup over the past couple of
years and this is what broadly seems to be what I've seen, bearing in mind
standard practice in other developed countries and the idea that the
highway= tag combines the importance in the highway network with some
assurance of construction quality:

* highway=motorway: interstate or other long-distance restricted-access road
* highway=trunk: fast, busy State Highway or US Highway, often NHS/STRAHNET
* highway=primary: major State Highway or US Highway
* highway=secondary: other State Highway or major County Road
* highway=tertiary: other through route, often a County Road, usually paved
with centreline
* highway=unclassified: rural minor route, sometimes a County Road, paved
unless tagged otherwise
* highway=residential: minor public road intended for residential access
rather than through route, paved unless tagged otherwise
  (N.B. currently not safe to assume paved in rural areas where
tiger:reviewed=no)
* highway=track: ungraded or rough, but usable by some four-wheeled vehicles

There are many, many variations, especially because the US doesn't have a
single nationwide system like most European countries, but if I had to sum
it up in a few words I'd choose the above.

cheers
Richard



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Re: [Talk-us] Mapping traffic signals and stop signs using MapRoulette

[Kevin Kenny]

On Mon, Jun 12, 2017 at 11:35 AM, Paul Johnson  wrote:

> So we're ignoring that nodes don't inherit the directionality of the
> underlying way?  Really sounds like you're trying to suggest using
> direction=forward/backwards when a relation is what's actually needed.
>

There are already tens of thousands of STOP signs tagged with direction=*.
The semantics don't imply that a node has a direction. They assert 'traffic
must stop at this point when approaching the node in the given direction on
any way.'

JOSM is smart enough to warn if you reverse a way that has a STOP sign on
it. There are some guidance and navigation programs that correctly
recognize directional stop signs, with the direction tag on the node
referring to the direction of the approaching way. It appears that the
infrastructure is rapidly coming to accommodate the current tagging scheme.

You clearly don't like the practice, but it is indeed widespread. There
simply aren't a lot of STOP signs tagged at all in my area, which is why my
initial Overpass queries failed to turn up good examples when I asked the
question a couple of months ago.

Have you even posted a proposal for the relation-based schema that you're
advocating? You sent a link when we had this discussion before, but the
link went to a page about traffic cameras that had no mention of STOP or
GIVE WAY signs at all. Does any extant guidance and navigation software
recognize your schema? Do JOSM, Meerkartor or iD offer any assistance with
the appropriate tagging?
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Re: [Talk-us] NJ mass road demotions?

[Kevin Kenny]

On Mon, Jun 12, 2017 at 12:07 PM, Richard Fairhurst 
wrote:

> It would be really helpful if there were one single place where US common
> practice was explained, succinctly (not like the verbal diarrhoea[2] on the
> US Roads Tagging page) and unambiguously, and in a way that accords with
> international usage in OSM. As an auslander it's not my job to do it, but
> perhaps someone sensible on this list might like to?
>

Is there *anyone* that actually can speak to what *is* common practice
in the US? When I've asked, I've always drawn a lot of replies and come
away more confused than before.

Of course, a lot of what I map is in
a gray area where 'tertiary', 'residential', 'unclassified' and 'track'
tend to have blurred boundaries, and 4WD vehicles are strongly
recommended. The road where I'm parked in
https://www.flickr.com/photos/ke9tv/14041171575 is a signed and
numbered county highway, but I couldn't bring myself to tag it
'tertiary'.
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Re: [Talk-us] NJ mass road demotions?

[Richard Fairhurst]

Albert Pundt wrote:
> This seems like a way overboard change.

I've just received a changeset message back from someone else who had made a
few unusual reclassifications, in this case highway=secondary for dirt roads
in Nebraska. The user explained that they had been working from this wiki
page:

  
https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Highway_Functional_Classification_System

which is a pretty misleading page for a newcomer to stumble upon, and
doesn't accord with common practice. The page was created by one user in
2009 and has barely been touched since.[1]

There are other very verbose pages:

https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/United_States_roads_tagging
https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Talk:Highway_tag_usage

and, of course, US information on international pages like
https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Highway:International_equivalence .

It would be really helpful if there were one single place where US common
practice was explained, succinctly (not like the verbal diarrhoea[2] on the
US Roads Tagging page) and unambiguously, and in a way that accords with
international usage in OSM. As an auslander it's not my job to do it, but
perhaps someone sensible on this list might like to?

Richard

[1] I've now added big messy warnings at the top of the page
[2] it does actually include the phrase "according to the criteria
heretofore described", which is marvellous



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Re: [Talk-us] Mapping traffic signals and stop signs using MapRoulette

[Paul Johnson]

So we're ignoring that nodes don't inherit the directionality of the
underlying way?  Really sounds like you're trying to suggest using
direction=forward/backwards when a relation is what's actually needed.

On Mon, Jun 12, 2017 at 8:38 AM, Horea Meleg 
wrote:

> Hi all,
>
> Me and my Telenav colleagues found useful open source data for Wayne
> County regarding traffic signals and stop signs. We made a blogpost about
> this: http://blog.improve-osm.org/en/2017/06/mapping-traffic-
> signals-and-stop-signs-using-maproulette/ and created two MapRoulette
> challenges to facilitate the mapping process: one for traffic signals
> http://www.maproulette.org/view/2593 and the other for stop signs:
> http://www.maproulette.org/view/2564. Our team will start mapping traffic
> signals and everyone who is keen on mapping is welcomed to help us with any
> of the challenges.
>
> Thank you,
>
> Horea
>
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Re: [Talk-us] Use without Attribution

[David Kewley]

Wunderground was what got me into OSM a year ago -- I noticed an apparent
error on the map when viewing Wunderground, so clicked on the link to edit
in OSM. The map on their main forecast page was what got me, and it still
does acknowledge OSM.
https://www.wunderground.com/cgi-bin/findweather/getForecast?query=new%20york%20city
.

As Brian pointed out, their full-page "Wundermap" doesn't acknowledge OSM,
but I'm 100% sure it's using OSM based on my own edits.

David

On Mon, Jun 12, 2017 at 7:36 AM, Brian May  wrote:

> I used that MapBox form a couple months ago to notify missing OSM
> attribution for the WunderMap at wunderground.com, e.g.
> https://www.wunderground.com/wundermap?lat=27.17=-80.29=1
>
> Just checked and no changes. I'm pretty sure its an OSM basemap due to
> checking features I have added that aren't on other maps.
>
> Brian
>
>
>  On 6/9/2017 5:50 PM, Hans De Kryger wrote:
>
> Report it here https://www.mapbox.com/blog/report-attribution-problems/
>
> *Regards,*
> *Hans*
>
> On Fri, Jun 9, 2017 at 2:44 PM, Mike Thompson  wrote:
>
>> Looks like I am no longer a member of the "Talk" mailing list, so I will
>> try here:
>>
>> https://mapnoco.org/results-intersection-quality
>>
>> The above site uses OSM as a basemap.
>>
>> Looks like the tiles come from Mapbox:
>> https://a.tiles.mapbox.com/v3/uis.map-561ra9g7/15/6814/12356.png
>>
>> I was unable to find any attribution that credits OSM.
>>
>> 1) Did I miss the attribution? Is it somewhere on the page?
>> 2) Does someone have a nicely worded template that uses all of the proper
>> terminology which I could adapt and send to the site owner?
>>
>> Thanks,
>>
>> Mike
>>
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Re: [Talk-us] Use without Attribution

[Brian May]

I used that MapBox form a couple months ago to notify missing OSM 
attribution for the WunderMap at wunderground.com, e.g. 
https://www.wunderground.com/wundermap?lat=27.17=-80.29=1


Just checked and no changes. I'm pretty sure its an OSM basemap due to 
checking features I have added that aren't on other maps.


Brian

 On 6/9/2017 5:50 PM, Hans De Kryger wrote:

Report it here https://www.mapbox.com/blog/report-attribution-problems/

*Regards,**
*
*Hans*

On Fri, Jun 9, 2017 at 2:44 PM, Mike Thompson > wrote:


Looks like I am no longer a member of the "Talk" mailing list, so
I will try here:

https://mapnoco.org/results-intersection-quality

The above site uses OSM as a basemap.
Looks like the tiles come from Mapbox:
https://a.tiles.mapbox.com/v3/uis.map-561ra9g7/15/6814/12356.png

I was unable to find any attribution that credits OSM.

1) Did I miss the attribution? Is it somewhere on the page?
2) Does someone have a nicely worded template that uses all of the
proper terminology which I could adapt and send to the site owner?

Thanks,

Mike

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[Talk-us] Mapping traffic signals and stop signs using MapRoulette

[Horea Meleg]

Hi all,
Me and my Telenav colleagues found useful open source data for Wayne County 
regarding traffic signals and stop signs. We made a blogpost about this: 
http://blog.improve-osm.org/en/2017/06/mapping-traffic-signals-and-stop-signs-using-maproulette/
 and created two MapRoulette challenges to facilitate the mapping process: one 
for traffic signals http://www.maproulette.org/view/2593 and the other for stop 
signs: http://www.maproulette.org/view/2564. Our team will start mapping 
traffic signals and everyone who is keen on mapping is welcomed to help us with 
any of the challenges.
Thank you,
Horea
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