Palm sync - attachments appear on desktop

[Ashima Munjal]

Hi,
  I am a new user for the bat. I am using Palm Vx and I followed the
palm instructions in the faq. While I sync the messages to the palm,
all the attachments appear on my computer desktop.

Any suggestions would be greatly appreciated.
Thanks
Ashima
  


-- 
Using The Bat! v1.62i on Windows XP 5.1 Build  2600
Service Pack 1

Ashima Munjalmailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Department of Computer Science
Johns Hopkins University



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Re[2]: Palm Sync.

[Joseph N.]

   On Friday, July 12, 2002, Tim Musson wrote in
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]">mid:[EMAIL PROTECTED]>:

TM> You should not need to touch the .ini files.  I only included it in
TM> the FAQ because I found it interesting

Tim,

Very interesting...  And Peter's post said he didn't change anything
but used the Eudora settings.  I'm surprised it would work like that,
since the .ini file is more specific than simply pointing to the MAPI
default.  But I'll take both your knowledgeable words on it and won't
experiment

-- 
JN



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Re: Palm Sync.

[Peter Palmreuther]

Hello Joseph,

On Friday, July 12, 2002 at 5:39:13 PM you wrote in
[EMAIL PROTECTED]">mid:[EMAIL PROTECTED] (at least in part):

JN> If you mean Tim Musson's technique, yes, I know. Tim's technique
JN> works, but it is not useful for those who do not have the time or
JN> willingness to change .ini files. So it seems to me likely that, if
JN> someone is going to develop a conduit for the TB! AB, it would also
JN> take care of the TB! inbox.

I can't recall how Tim did it exactly. I just spoke from my own
experiences.
Recently I got my first Palm (derived device ... a Sony Clié running Palm
OS), installed "Palm Desktop" and set it up to sync w/ Eudora which is done
using MAPI. The Bat! is set up as MAPI handler since ... aeons and the very
first try sync-ed my Palm device w/ my Inbox of the primary account ...

No .ini files to change or something similar ...
-- 
Regards
Peter Palmreuthermailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
(The Bat! v1.61 on Windows 2000 5.0 Build 2195 Service Pack 2)

Ah, come on, just this one last little feature.



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Re: Palm Sync.

[Tim Musson]

Hey Joseph,

My MUA believes 'The Bat! (v1.61) Business' was used
to write [EMAIL PROTECTED]">mid:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
on Friday, July 12, 2002 at 11:39:13 AM.

JN> If you mean Tim Musson's technique, yes, I know. Tim's technique
JN> works, but it is not useful for those who do not have the time or
JN> willingness to change .ini files.

You should not need to touch the .ini files.  I only included it in
the FAQ because I found it interesting, and was going to try to get
more information from Palm about the format.  Unfortunately, Palm said
'we don't support changing the .ini file by hand, so we are not going
to give you any information about it.'

If someone were to write a conduit to sync Palm mail and TB mail, it
would be similar customizations.

JN> So it seems to me likely that, if someone is going to develop a
JN> conduit for the TB! AB, it would also take care of the TB! inbox.

I am involved in trying to get the AB conduit put together, and there
has not been any discussion about adding eMail sync...

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Re: Palm Sync.

[Tim Musson]

Hey Joseph,

My MUA believes 'The Bat! (v1.61) Business' was used
to write [EMAIL PROTECTED]">mid:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
on Friday, July 12, 2002 at 11:16:34 AM.

JN> If anyone develops a conduit for TB!, the synchronization of the AB
JN> and the mailboxes should be kept separate.

If I am involved, that is what I would push for.  Actually, I had
never even thought of doing anything with the eMail sync that works
just fine...

JN> The user should be allowed to determine whether the AB information
JN> will be sync'ed.

Agreed.

-- 
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Using The Bat! eMail v1.60q
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Dain Bramaged



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Re: Palm Sync.

[Tim Musson]

Hey Freddie,

My MUA believes 'The Bat! (v1.60q) Personal' was used
to write [EMAIL PROTECTED]">mid:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
on Friday, July 12, 2002 at 10:51:05 AM.

FF> I want to add my 2 cents as well. PLEASE, we need an address book
FF> (and email) conduit for the Palm OS.

You can already sync eMail via the standard MAPI feature of both TB &
Palm.  I have not even heard of any rumors about adding to that
functionality...

We are trying to get something together to allow an AB Sync.

-- 
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Using The Bat! eMail v1.60q
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Re[2]: Palm Sync.

[Joseph N.]

   On Friday, July 12, 2002, Peter Palmreuther wrote in
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]">mid:[EMAIL PROTECTED]>:

JN>> If anyone develops a conduit for TB!, the synchronization of the AB
JN>> and the mailboxes should be kept separate.

PP> It already is. TB! is able to be sync'ed using MAPI and it works. OK, it's
PP> only 'Inbox' of primary account that's sync'ed, but the mail sync already
PP> is there ...

PP> So another conduit will only be for AB ...

Peter,

If you mean Tim Musson's technique, yes, I know. Tim's technique
works, but it is not useful for those who do not have the time or
willingness to change .ini files. So it seems to me likely that, if
someone is going to develop a conduit for the TB! AB, it would also
take care of the TB! inbox.

-- 
JN



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Re: Palm Sync.

[Peter Palmreuther]

Hello Joseph,

On Friday, July 12, 2002 at 5:16:34 PM you wrote in
[EMAIL PROTECTED]">mid:[EMAIL PROTECTED] (at least in part):

JN> If anyone develops a conduit for TB!, the synchronization of the AB
JN> and the mailboxes should be kept separate.

It already is. TB! is able to be sync'ed using MAPI and it works. OK, it's
only 'Inbox' of primary account that's sync'ed, but the mail sync already
is there ...

So another conduit will only be for AB ...
-- 
Regards
Peter Palmreuthermailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
(The Bat! v1.61 on Windows 2000 5.0 Build 2195 Service Pack 2)

SENILE.COM found . . . Out Of Memory . . .



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Re[3]: Palm Sync.

[John Thomas]

Hello Freddie, 

This is a response to your (FF's) message dated July 12, 2002, with
the subject: [Palm Sync.].

FF> I want to add my 2 cents as well.  PLEASE, we need an address book
FF> (and email) conduit for the Palm OS.

E-mail (for one folder only, the Inbox on the primary account) is
available already through MAPI, according to the FAQ.

-- 
Best regards,
John Thomas





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Re[3]: Palm Sync.

[Joseph N.]

   On Friday, July 12, 2002, Freddie Freeloader wrote in
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]">mid:[EMAIL PROTECTED]>:

FF> I want to add my 2 cents as well.  PLEASE, we need an address book
FF> (and email) conduit for the Palm OS.

If anyone develops a conduit for TB!, the synchronization of the AB
and the mailboxes should be kept separate. The user should be allowed
to determine whether the AB information will be sync'ed. I am sure
there are many users like me who would be glad to sync their mail, but
would *not* want the handheld AB to sync with TB!'s AB. My handheld AB
is fine just the way it is, sync'ing with Lotus Organizer.

-- 
JN



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Re[2]: Palm Sync.

[Freddie Freeloader]

Hello Tim,

Monday, July 8, 2002, 4:58:02 AM, you wrote:

I want to add my 2 cents as well.  PLEASE, we need an address book
(and email) conduit for the Palm OS.

TM> As far as I know, RIT has no plans to do anything along these lines,
TM> but I am trying to get something put together from people on this
TM> list. Will keep the list informed.




-- 
Best regards,
 Freddiemailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]



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Re: Palm Sync.

[Tim Musson]

Hey Rick,

My MUA believes 'The Bat! (v1.60q) Personal' was used
to write [EMAIL PROTECTED]">mid:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
on Monday, July 8, 2002 at 8:29:20 AM.

RR> On Monday, July 8, 2002, 8:27:38 AM, Britt Malka wrote:

TM>>> Are you saying you wanted to sync eMail with the Palm?

RR>  Actually all I care about is synching the address book. I want my
RR>  contacts to be the same in both places. I don't care about doing
RR>  the e-mail synch although for some I'm sure this would be nice.

I want both of course .

BTB Rick, your sig delimiter is missing the space.  Yours is '--' and
should be '-- '.  TB will automagically rip out everything after '-- '
so all the people who reply to your msg don't need to do it manually!

To see what I mean, reply to your msg, then reply to mine.

RR> --

RR> Rick

===8<---footers snipped

-- 
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
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Re: Palm Sync.

[Tim Musson]

Hey Britt,

My MUA believes 'SecureBat! (Malka)' was used
to write [EMAIL PROTECTED]">mid:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
on Monday, July 8, 2002 at 8:27:38 AM.

BM> Yes, I know, I tried it once, but only with the inbox, isn't that
BM> right?

Yes, mail only syncs with the inbox, but I think to do other folders,
it would take a different mail app on the Palm.

-- 
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Using The Bat! eMail v1.60q
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#include ;



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Re[2]: Palm Sync.

[Britt Malka]

Dear Marck,
 


Monday, July 8, 2002 at 2:31:03 PM you wrote:


MDP> I thought mail synchronisation is already working as documented in the
MDP> FAQ.

It is, but the average user will not know that. It is either included
in The Bat! help file or in the desk top program from Palm.

MDP> What is being done off-list is a conduit for Address Book
MDP> synchronisation.

Yes, and this is a good idea.


-- 

Kind regards,

Britt Malka

 |\/|
 | \__/ | 
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 |  | 
  \\  //  
   \  /   
\/

... - A social life?  Where can I download THAT?

... www.malka.it - www.malka.dk - www.supermalka.dk ...

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Re: Palm Sync.

[Marck D Pearlstone]

-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-
Hash: SHA1

Hi Britt,

@08 July 2002, 14:06 +0200 (13:06 UK time)  Britt Malka [BM] in
[EMAIL PROTECTED]">mid:[EMAIL PROTECTED] said to Tim Musson:

BM> I am very much interested too. Recently we had a Danish request about
BM> how to convert The Bat! mails into Outlook messages, because I wanted
BM> to be able to syncronise with his Palm. It would be enough to write a
BM> conduit, but unfortunately I don't know how to do that.

I thought mail synchronisation is already working as documented in the
FAQ. What is being done off-list is a conduit for Address Book
synchronisation.

- --
Cheers -- .\\arck D. Pearlstone -- List moderator
SB! v1.60q/Post3 on Windows 2000 5.0.2195 Service Pack 2
'
-BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE-
Version: GnuPG v1.1.90-nr1 (Windows 2000)

iD8DBQE9KYYKOeQkq5KdzaARAjSBAJ9TDOBst8C4MFPtt86jHq/j5xpgMgCg9KU0
W/4W4dR/ZWv+BUyoeaaF9TI=
=FdXi
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Re[3]: Palm Sync.

[Rick Reumann]

On Monday, July 8, 2002, 8:27:38 AM, Britt Malka wrote:

TM>> Are you saying you wanted to sync eMail with the Palm?

 Actually all I care about is synching the address book. I want my
 contacts to be the same in both places. I don't care about doing
 the e-mail synch although for some I'm sure this would be nice.

--

Rick

mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]



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Re[2]: Palm Sync.

[Britt Malka]

Dear Tim,
 


Monday, July 8, 2002 at 2:13:08 PM you wrote:


BM>> I am very much interested too. Recently we had a Danish request
BM>> about how to convert The Bat! mails into Outlook messages, because
BM>> I wanted to be able to syncronise with his Palm.

TM> Are you saying you wanted to sync eMail with the Palm?

No, I was babling, sorry :-)

*He* wanted to sync with his Palm. Not only his mail, but everything,
i.e. address books as well.


TM> That has worked for quite a while (via MAPI).

Yes, I know, I tried it once, but only with the inbox, isn't that
right?


TM> What we are trying to get now is the AB Sync working (which will
TM> require a conduit).

Yes, that is it.


-- 

Kind regards,

Britt Malka

 |\/|
 | \__/ | 
 \/\/ 
 |  | 
  \\  //  
   \  /   
\/

... Your flattering remarks are both desperate and obvious.

... www.malka.it - www.malka.dk - www.supermalka.dk ...

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Re: Palm Sync.

[Tim Musson]

Hey Britt,

My MUA believes 'SecureBat! (Malka)' was used
to write [EMAIL PROTECTED]">mid:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
on Monday, July 8, 2002 at 8:06:16 AM.

BM> I am very much interested too. Recently we had a Danish request
BM> about how to convert The Bat! mails into Outlook messages, because
BM> I wanted to be able to syncronise with his Palm.

Are you saying you wanted to sync eMail with the Palm? That has worked
for quite a while (via MAPI). What we are trying to get now is the AB
Sync working (which will require a conduit).

BM> It would be enough to write a conduit, but unfortunately I don't
BM> know how to do that.

Me either, but... 

-- 
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Re[2]: Palm Sync.

[Britt Malka]

Dear Tim,
 


Monday, July 8, 2002 at 1:58:02 PM you wrote:

TM> As far as I know, RIT has no plans to do anything along these lines,
TM> but I am trying to get something put together from people on this
TM> list. Will keep the list informed.

I am very much interested too. Recently we had a Danish request about
how to convert The Bat! mails into Outlook messages, because I wanted
to be able to syncronise with his Palm. It would be enough to write a
conduit, but unfortunately I don't know how to do that.


-- 

Kind regards,

Britt Malka

 |\/|
 | \__/ | 
 \/\/ 
 |  | 
  \\  //  
   \  /   
\/

... And those who ate were about five thousand men, besides women and children.

... www.malka.it - www.malka.dk - www.supermalka.dk ...

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Re: Palm Sync.

[Tim Musson]

Hey Rick,

My MUA believes 'The Bat! (v1.60q) Personal' was used
to write [EMAIL PROTECTED]">mid:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
on Monday, July 8, 2002 at 12:29:19 AM.

RR> Does anyone know if the Bat team has some plans to include some
RR> kind of synching for the Palm? It would be an awesome feature and
RR> one I've been dying to have.

As far as I know, RIT has no plans to do anything along these lines,
but I am trying to get something put together from people on this
list. Will keep the list informed.

-- 
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Using The Bat! eMail v1.60q
Windows 2000 5.0.2195 (Service Pack 2)
I have an imaginary friend who refuses to play with me.



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Re[2]: Palm Sync.

[Rick Reumann]

On Sunday, July 7, 2002, 9:04:42 AM, Mike Smith wrote:


MS> If anyone's watching this thread for feedback on Palm/The Bat users,
MS> add me to the growing list!

Does anyone know if the Bat team has some plans to include some
kind of synching for the Palm? It would be an awesome feature and
one I've been dying to have.

--

Rick

mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]



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Re: Palm Sync.

[Mike Smith]

At Thursday, June 13, 2002, 2:24:55 PM, Freddie wrote:
> Hello Tim,

> Wednesday, June 12, 2002, 6:27:49 AM, you wrote:


TM>>  (and in the scheme of
TM>> things, the people that want to sync their Palm's and the TBab are a
TM>> fairly small number of registered TBers...)

> I do not know how many Palm users there are in The Bat! world, but I
> would be willing to bet that there are plenty!  Also, having a Palm
> conduit to TB's address book gives me one more very useful reason to
> recommend TB to other users.  It would really help.


If anyone's watching this thread for feedback on Palm/The Bat users,
add me to the growing list!

Sounds like an interesting project.  Sign me as being fatigued coding
Windows all day.  I moonlight coding phone communications s/w -
flipping thru Palm programming books looked kind of interesting.

Endora seem to have their desktop/palm synching in beta.

-- 
 Mikemailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Using The Bat! v1.60n on Windows 2000
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Re: Palm Sync.

[Tim Musson]

Hey Rick,

My MUA believes you used The Bat! (v1.60m) Personal
to write the following on Thursday, June 13, 2002 at 12:32:38 AM.

TM>>> (and in the scheme of things, the people that want to sync their
TM>>> Palm's and the TBab are a fairly small number of registered
TM>>> TBers...)

FF>> I do not know how many Palm users there are in The Bat! world,
FF>> but I would be willing to bet that there are plenty! Also, having
FF>> a Palm conduit to TB's address book gives me one more very useful
FF>> reason to recommend TB to other users. It would really help.

I agree, I want it enough to pay for it. What I meant is my guess at
the number of Palm/TB users is less than 5-10% the number of TB users.

RR> I, as well, know plenty of people that won't switch to The Bat
RR> since it doesn't synch to the Palm.

TB has 2 things that match apps on the Palm - mail and AB, so I
wouldn't say that TB doesn't sync to the Palm. It just doesn't sync
the AB.

RR> More and more people like having all their devices integrated.

I am one of them.

RR> That's one advantage Outlook
~Shudder~
RR> has in the market right now. It's very frustrating that I have one
RR> set of contacts in my palm and then another in the bat (then
RR> another in my cell phone..but that's not the Bat's fault:) and yet
RR> none of them synch with each other.

I am trying to get something coordinated, but, I don't program in
anything that would be appropriate (perl is my language), so about all
I can do is hope/push/facilitate/coordinate/whatever... 

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Re: Palm Sync.

[Tim Musson]

Hey Joseph,

My MUA believes you used The Bat! (v1.60q) Business
to write the following on Thursday, June 13, 2002 at 1:01:58 AM.

RR>> I, as well, know plenty of people that won't switch to The Bat since it
RR>> doesn't synch to the Palm.

It doesn't sync the address book to the Palm, the Palm-TB! MAPI mail
sync works just fine in my exp. As a matter of fact, in the 1.60 set
they improved it! Used to be that you needed to have TB! the active
app, but now TB! has taken care of it for you. Also, it is faster I
think (never timed it) - My Palm inbox has 230 msgs, and it only takes
a couple of seconds to sync the mail (Pentium III 1.2, and USB port sync).
 Below cut from "What's new in The Bat! 1.60?"
 [-] Focusing problem upon MAPI calls
 [-] Some bugs in the MAPI support subsystem
 
JN> First, TB!'s inbox can go into the Palm. It's not designed to do
JN> that, and the conduits won't support it,

The Palm conduits support using MAPI to sync your mail, so it is
supported, but don't bother asking Palm for support getting it set
up... 

JN> but Tim Musson (whose name I hope I didn't misspell too badly)

Nope, got it right on, but can you pronounce it correctly? 

JN> has instructions in the Bat! archives

It is also in the FAQ that Marck maintains.

JN> on how to set the user configuration file to load TB! into a Palm.
JN> I do it all the time and it works.

Me to, but I have a separate account for my Palm - looks like it came
from this one though  isn't TB! the best!

JN> The AB is different. Personally, I would prefer to have something
JN> fully integrated like Outlook or Notes, but Outlook is not a good
JN> PIM, and Notes is only for larger or more complex organizations
JN> than I am. So I use Lotus Organizer, which is a really good PIM,
JN> and combine it with TB! Simple MAPI should make the Org AB work
JN> seamlessly in TB! (as it does in Eudora and Becky), but no such
JN> luck. So I import it into TB! But I also synch Organizer directly,
JN> so what results is this:

JN> My Palm has all my contacts and it has my inbox (sometimes
JN> attachments, too, but that's another story), as well as tasks,
JN> etc. TB! also has my contacts. It all works together very well,
JN> but it requires a love for this geeky stuff or else a clearly
JN> written guide.

Not a bad solution, but still manual to get in and out of TB! AB...

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Re[4]: Palm Sync.

[Joseph N.]

   On Wednesday, June 12, 2002, Rick Reumann wrote in
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]">mid:[EMAIL PROTECTED]>:

RR> I, as well, know plenty of people that won't switch to The Bat since it
RR> doesn't synch to the Palm. More and more people like having all their
RR> devices integrated. That's one advantage Outlook has in the market
RR> right now. It's very frustrating that I have one set of contacts in my
RR> palm and then another in the bat (then another in my cell phone..but
RR> that's not the Bat's fault:) and yet none of them synch with each
RR> other.

Rick,

While Outlook and Notes are clearly ahead of everyone else in terms of
unified messaging and integrated, downloadable PIM functions, it's not
all bleak for TB!  First, TB!'s inbox can go into the Palm.  It's not
designed to do that, and the conduits won't support it, but Tim Musson
(whose name I hope I didn't misspell too badly) has instructions in
the Bat! archives on how to set the user configuration file to load
TB! into a Palm.  I do it all the time and it works.

The AB is different.  Personally, I would prefer to have something
fully integrated like Outlook or Notes, but Outlook is not a good
PIM, and Notes is only for larger or more complex organizations than I
am.  So I use Lotus Organizer, which is a really good PIM, and combine
it with TB!  Simple MAPI should make the Org AB work seamlessly in TB!
(as it does in Eudora and Becky), but no such luck.  So I import it
into TB!  But I also synch Organizer directly, so what results is this:

My Palm has all my contacts and it has my inbox (sometimes attachments, too,
but that's another story), as well as tasks, etc.  TB! also has my
contacts.  It all works together very well, but it requires a love for
this geeky stuff or else a clearly written guide.

-- 
JN



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Re[3]: Palm Sync.

[Rick Reumann]

I, as well, know plenty of people that won't switch to The Bat since it
doesn't synch to the Palm. More and more people like having all their
devices integrated. That's one advantage Outlook has in the market
right now. It's very frustrating that I have one set of contacts in my
palm and then another in the bat (then another in my cell phone..but
that's not the Bat's fault:) and yet none of them synch with each
other.

On Thursday, June 13, 2002, 12:24:55 AM, Freddie Freeloader wrote:

FF> Hello Tim,

FF> Wednesday, June 12, 2002, 6:27:49 AM, you wrote:


TM>>  (and in the scheme of
TM>> things, the people that want to sync their Palm's and the TBab are a
TM>> fairly small number of registered TBers...)

FF> I do not know how many Palm users there are in The Bat! world, but I
FF> would be willing to bet that there are plenty!  Also, having a Palm
FF> conduit to TB's address book gives me one more very useful reason to
FF> recommend TB to other users.  It would really help.




--

Rick

mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]

"I think my new thing will be to try to be a real happy guy. I'll just
walk around being real happy until some jerk says something stupid to
me."
  -Jack Handey



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Re[2]: Palm Sync.

[Freddie Freeloader]

Hello Tim,

Wednesday, June 12, 2002, 6:27:49 AM, you wrote:


TM>  (and in the scheme of
TM> things, the people that want to sync their Palm's and the TBab are a
TM> fairly small number of registered TBers...)

I do not know how many Palm users there are in The Bat! world, but I
would be willing to bet that there are plenty!  Also, having a Palm
conduit to TB's address book gives me one more very useful reason to
recommend TB to other users.  It would really help.

-- 
Best regards,
 Freddiemailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]



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Re[2]: Palm Sync.

[Aaron Green]

RMR> I think there wasn't any results, but I would really want something
RMR> like that too!
Me, too. Really, really want it :)



Best regards,
Aaron


Aaron Green, MD
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Re[2]: Palm Sync.

[Ricardo M. Reyes]

El miércoles 12 de junio de 2002, 10.27, Tim Musson decía:

TM> but I don't think he has had a chance to (and in the scheme of
TM> things, the people that want to sync their Palm's and the TBab are a
TM> fairly small number of registered TBers...)

May be only a few of us are interested, but still, if RIT Labs accepts to
make the AB format available, I bet someone will do it. I might even
try, although I never wrote a conduit before. Is there a better way to
learn something than doing what you want and need?

If I could sync my palm with TB, that would be the last step to kick
Outlook out of my house, and for good. :)

-- 
Ricardo M. Reyes | [EMAIL PROTECTED]
 | (Mar del Plata - Argentina)
 | Usando The Bat! 1.60c

This is a follow up to: [EMAIL PROTECTED]">mid:[EMAIL PROTECTED]



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Re: Palm Sync.

[Tim Musson]

Hey Rick,

My MUA believes you used The Bat! (v1.60) Personal
to write the following on Tuesday, June 11, 2002 at 7:47:55 PM.

FF>>> There was a thread a few months ago about someone writing a
FF>>> conduit to synchronize The Bat! address book with Palm devices.

RR> Yes, I remember that thread also. I think he(she) was going to see
RR> about teaming up with a company maybe that is already doing synch
RR> software? Can't be certain of that, though. Regardless it was a
RR> while ago now.

I believe 'he' was going to try to get the ab format from RIT and
write the conduit himself. (The sync software mentioned was Intelisync
which I have used before with no problems, but I think the consensus
was to not go with something like that. Instead have a RIT solution or
something especially written for TB)

I have also been trying to help along those lines, Stefan did tell me
the last time this came up that he would try to write up the info
need, but I don't think he has had a chance to (and in the scheme of
things, the people that want to sync their Palm's and the TBab are a
fairly small number of registered TBers...)

RR> Certainly would be great to synch up my palm contacts with the bat
RR> though.

In a perfect world, eh... My project load has lightened a bit at work
so maybe I can spend some time trying to get this coordinated...
Unfortunately I only program in Perl, so I won't be writing the
conduit (if it were in Perl, you would have to have Perl installed as
it is a 'run time' language), but will help out any way I can...
Probably best to write it in Delphi - the same as TB.



-- 
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Re[2]: Palm Sync.

[Rick Reumann]

On Tuesday, June 11, 2002, 3:27:08 PM, Ricardo wrote:

FF>> There was a thread a few months ago about someone writing a conduit to
FF>> synchronize The Bat! address book with Palm devices.

 Yes, I remember that thread also. I think he(she) was going to
 see about teaming up with a company maybe that is already doing
 synch software? Can't be certain of that, though. Regardless it
 was a while ago now.

 Certainly would be great to synch up my palm contacts with the
 bat though.




-- 

Rick
mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]

"I think my new thing will be to try to be a real happy guy. I'll just
walk around being real happy until some jerk says something stupid to
me." 
  -Jack Handey



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Re: Palm Sync.

[Ricardo M. Reyes]

El martes 11 de junio de 2002, 1.12, Freddie Freeloader decía:

FF> There was a thread a few months ago about someone writing a conduit to
FF> synchronize The Bat! address book with Palm devices.  I had to go off
FF> line for a while and was wondering what, if anything, was the result
FF> of that discussion?

I think there wasn't any results, but I would really want something
like that too!


-- 
Ricardo M. Reyes | [EMAIL PROTECTED]
 | (Mar del Plata - Argentina)
 | Usando The Bat! 1.60c

This is a follow up to: [EMAIL PROTECTED]">mid:[EMAIL PROTECTED]



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Palm Sync.

[Freddie Freeloader]

Hello The Bat Users,

There was a thread a few months ago about someone writing a conduit to
synchronize The Bat! address book with Palm devices.  I had to go off
line for a while and was wondering what, if anything, was the result
of that discussion?

Thanks for your responses!

-- 
Best regards,
 Freddie  mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]



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Re[2]: Palm Sync Sloooow

[Ray]

No, the FAQ works great! It's the darn Palm. :)

thanks anyway!
-Ray

***
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Raymond A. Dorman
Lighting Technician/Design
Las Vegas, NV
***  
> -BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-
> Hash: SHA1

> Hi Ray,

> On 18 January 2002 at 14:09:29 -0800 (which was 22:09 where I live)
> Ray wrote to Marck D Pearlstone and made these points:

>> Yeah, I've tried this again and again. Still isn't working for me.
>> ;(

> What, the FAQ or the tip therein? If it's the FAQ then I'll send you
> the article. If not, then I can't help any further since I don't use a
> Palm myself.

> - --
> Cheers -- .\\arck D. Pearlstone -- List moderator

> \ BrainStorm - free thinking - www: http://www.brainstormsw.com /
>  \ PGP Key ID: 0x929DCDA0  |  www: http://www.silverstones.com /
> ·
> TB! v1.54 Beta/30-14F4B4B2 on Windows NT 5.0.2195 Service Pack 2
> ·
> -BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE-
> Version: GnuPG v1.0.6 (MingW32)

> iD8DBQE8SMYYOeQkq5KdzaARAujjAJ4hNzz567f5zPIMWI3KpxCeSFR6zgCeLbKZ
> 4DY2Uf6pNCkz+7UFQqV/Yio=
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Re: Palm Sync Sloooow

[Marck D Pearlstone]

-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-
Hash: SHA1

Hi Ray,

On 18 January 2002 at 14:09:29 -0800 (which was 22:09 where I live)
Ray wrote to Marck D Pearlstone and made these points:

> Yeah, I've tried this again and again. Still isn't working for me.
> ;(

What, the FAQ or the tip therein? If it's the FAQ then I'll send you
the article. If not, then I can't help any further since I don't use a
Palm myself.

- --
Cheers -- .\\arck D. Pearlstone -- List moderator

\ BrainStorm - free thinking - www: http://www.brainstormsw.com /
 \ PGP Key ID: 0x929DCDA0  |  www: http://www.silverstones.com /
·
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·
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Re[2]: Palm Sync Sloooow

[Ray]

Hi,

Yeah, I've tried this again and again.  Still isn't working for me. ;(

***
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Raymond A. Dorman
Lighting Technician/Design
Las Vegas, NV
***  
> -BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-
> Hash: SHA1

> Hi Michael,

> On 17 January 2002 at 08:23:02 -0500 (which was 13:23 where I live)
> Michael Rudnick wrote to Ray and made these points:

>> Start by reading the info on TB FAQ
>> (http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/howdoi.html. Then go to How to
>> sync The Bat! with your Palm device  (by Tim Musson))

> http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/howdoi.html#186E will get you
> directly to the article.

> - --
> Cheers -- .\\arck D. Pearlstone -- List moderator
>  ~~~
> \ BrainStorm - free thinking - www: http://www.brainstormsw.com /
>  \ PGP Key ID: 0x929DCDA0  |  www: http://www.silverstones.com /
> ·
> TB! v1.54 Beta/29-14F4B4B2 on Windows NT 5.0.2195 Service Pack 2
> ·
> -BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE-
> Version: GnuPG v1.0.6 (MingW32)

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Re: Palm Sync Sloooow

[Marck D Pearlstone]

-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-
Hash: SHA1

Hi Michael,

On 17 January 2002 at 08:23:02 -0500 (which was 13:23 where I live)
Michael Rudnick wrote to Ray and made these points:

> Start by reading the info on TB FAQ
> (http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/howdoi.html. Then go to How to
> sync The Bat! with your Palm device  (by Tim Musson))

http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/howdoi.html#186E will get you
directly to the article.

- --
Cheers -- .\\arck D. Pearlstone -- List moderator
 ~~~
\ BrainStorm - free thinking - www: http://www.brainstormsw.com /
 \ PGP Key ID: 0x929DCDA0  |  www: http://www.silverstones.com /
·
TB! v1.54 Beta/29-14F4B4B2 on Windows NT 5.0.2195 Service Pack 2
·
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Re: Palm Sync Sloooow

[Ray]

> I have been using TB for several months and have been syncing
> successfully to my Palm.

Could you please share how you are doing this? Is is possible without
buying 3rd party software? I've been trying forever

Thanks,
Ray

***
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Raymond A. Dorman
Lighting Technician/Design
Las Vegas, NV
***  
> I have been using TB for several months and have been syncing
> successfully to my Palm. But I've it's very slow when syncing. The
> slowness is fully dependant on the size of the Inbox, which makes some
> sense. But the mail sync is an average of 10 seconds per message (or
> around 1 minute for a mere 6 messages in my Inbox). I never had that
> problem with Outlook Express (but experienced other problems ).

> I've gone through the settings and reviewed Tim Musson's entries in
> the Silverstones FAQ. All seems to be OK. Is anyone else having this
> problem? Does anyone have any suggestions?

> Thanks
> --
> Michael Rudnick 
> [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> Using The Bat! 1.53d on Windows 5.0 (2195) Service Pack 2


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Re: Palm Sync Sloooow

[Joseph N.]

Can't give any help except to say that my syncs do not take that long.
They go quickly, unless there are attachments.

JN


 Michael Rudnick wrote on Wednesday, January 16, 2002:

> I have been using TB for several months and have been syncing
> successfully to my Palm. But I've it's very slow when syncing. The
> slowness is fully dependant on the size of the Inbox, which makes some
> sense. But the mail sync is an average of 10 seconds per message (or
> around 1 minute for a mere 6 messages in my Inbox). I never had that
> problem with Outlook Express (but experienced other problems ).

> I've gone through the settings and reviewed Tim Musson's entries in
> the Silverstones FAQ. All seems to be OK. Is anyone else having this
> problem? Does anyone have any suggestions?


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Palm Sync Sloooow

[Michael Rudnick]

I have been using TB for several months and have been syncing
successfully to my Palm. But I've it's very slow when syncing. The
slowness is fully dependant on the size of the Inbox, which makes some
sense. But the mail sync is an average of 10 seconds per message (or
around 1 minute for a mere 6 messages in my Inbox). I never had that
problem with Outlook Express (but experienced other problems ).

I've gone through the settings and reviewed Tim Musson's entries in
the Silverstones FAQ. All seems to be OK. Is anyone else having this
problem? Does anyone have any suggestions?

Thanks
--
Michael Rudnick 
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Using The Bat! 1.53d on Windows 5.0 (2195) Service Pack 2


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Re[2]: Palm sync so slow?

[Tim Musson]

Hey Bat'ers interested in Palm mail sync,

Wednesday, May 09, 2001, 7:40:22 AM, you wrote:

I can confirm most of the following.

KA>> You don't need the thing to have your palm
KA>> "account" selected as the default for mailto.

KA>> You just need to edit "sync.ini" in your palm desktop user directory, and
KA>> have:

KA>> Profile=palmsync
KA>> UserAccount=palmsync
KA>> PostOffice=palmsync

KA>> where "palmsync" = the account name you want to sync, in the Bat.

sync.ini settings did have an effect, but not quite like the above.

My sync.ini looks like this:
  [SmapiPlugin]
  MsgHostName=Eudora 3.0.1 or higher
  [SmapiPlugin Eudora 3.0.1 or higher]
  UserAccount=
  UserData=

  [Messaging]
  MsgHostId=SMAPIMsgHost
  MsgHostName=Eudora 3.0.1 or higher

  [Mail]
  System=Eudora 3.0.1 or higher
  Interface=MAPI32
  [EMAIL PROTECTED]
  [EMAIL PROTECTED]
  [EMAIL PROTECTED]
  Gateway=
  Password=

Note: 2 "UserAccount=" fields! The only one that had any effect is the
one under the [SmapiPlugin Eudora 3.0.1 or higher] subsection (if you
have something other than Eudora selected, you would have to use that
subsection). I set up a "Palm" account, then put "Palm" after the
UserAccount= setting mentioned above. (Yes, I did try the other first,
but it did not do anything.) I am _guessing_ that if you don't specify
anything for UserAccount=, then it will go with the mailto: default.

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Re[2]: Palm sync so slow?

[Serge Skorokhodov]

Hello André,

Wednesday, 9 May 2001, you wrote:

AE> Hello Kiyan,

AE> On Wednesday, May 09, 2001 at 20:33:55GMT -0400 (which was
AE> 2:33:55 AM where I live) you wrote:

KA>> Out of curiosity, what is it that makes the palmsync with TB so slow?

Synchronizing a TheBat!'s account with Palm relies on MAPI32.
TheBat!'s implementation of MAPI32 is pretty inefficient as it
envokes TB! through special command file (I don't remember the
name of the file but you can look it up in the docs if you wish
for it is used for other things as well) for _every MAPI
transaction_:( So each MAPI transaction (asking if a message
exists, if it is new etc.) involves several disk operation and it
does take lo-o-ong:( Whether RitLabs team is going to make their
MAPI32 interface more efficient or release a specific conduit for
Palm HotSynch is a good question. I don't know the answer
though:(

AE> I have heard from a couple of people that syncing their Palms
AE> with TB! is extremely slow.

AE> I have no idea what would cause that and also I am not
AE> affected by this problem. Syncing my Palm with TB! takes only
AE> little more than a second or two for each email.

AE> All I did was set up the conduit to Eudora and run this reset
AE> mapi program because I was using Eudora before TB!

It is very interesting as I am affected! Can you tell more on
what this Eudora conduit really is and where to obtain it?
Please:)

AE> I'm using WinME, a Palm Vx on serial port and no special
AE> utilities or stuff. Just good old plain standard hotsync
AE> program.

Best regards,
 Serge Skorokhodovmailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]

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Re: Palm sync so slow?

[Tim Musson]

Hey Kiyan,

Tuesday, May 08, 2001, 8:33:55 PM, you wrote:

KA> Out of curiosity, what is it that makes the palmsync with TB so slow?

There was a msg on this list previously describing another users
experiences syncing TB mail with the Palm.  The msg said that if you
make TB the "Active" program when it is syncing mail, the sync goes
*much* faster!  I tried it a little, and I also see this...  Please
give it a try and let me know.  If you see an improvement also I will
update the FAQ section on Palm sync.

KA> Oh and here's something else. You don't need the thing to have your palm
KA> "account" selected as the default for mailto.

KA> You just need to edit "sync.ini" in your palm desktop user directory, and
KA> have:

KA> Profile=palmsync
KA> UserAccount=palmsync
KA> PostOffice=palmsync

KA> where "palmsync" = the account name you want to sync, in the Bat.

KA> In my experience marking it as the default for mailto URLs does
KA> absolutely nothing. I found this out when I was trying to switch what I
KA> used to have synced to my palm, to a new account that was just a container
KA> for msgs I wanted to sync. Even though I marked the new account as the
KA> default, the sync conduit kept syncing the old one... so I edited sync.ini
KA> manually.

Now, this is *very* cool to know.  I was thinking of setting up
another account as you have just for my palm.  I will play with the
sync.ini and update the FAQ...

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Re: Palm sync so slow?

[André Engelhardt]

Hello Kiyan,

 On Wednesday, May 09, 2001 at 20:33:55GMT -0400 (which was 2:33:55 AM where I live) 
you wrote:

KA> Out of curiosity, what is it that makes the palmsync with TB so slow?

I have heard from a couple of people that syncing their Palms with TB!
is  extremely slow.

I  have  no  idea  what would cause that and also I am not affected by
this  problem.  Syncing my Palm with TB! takes only little more than a
second or two for each email.

All  I  did  was  set up the conduit to Eudora and run this reset mapi
program because I was using Eudora before TB!

I'm  using WinME, a Palm Vx on serial port and no special utilities or
stuff. Just good old plain standard hotsync program.


-- 
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 André Engelhardt

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Palm sync so slow?

[Kiyan Azarbar]

Out of curiosity, what is it that makes the palmsync with TB so slow?

I made a folder called palmsync, to which I copy mail I want to
sync. I set it as the default account for mailto, and I set the conduit
as Eudora 3.0.3 or higher. Then I sync, and it looks like it's hung
forever, it takes almost 5 minutes. The weird thing is, even if I add only
one message, it still takes 5 minutes. Five minutes to check that only one
new message is in the folder and sync it?

I tried the MS Outlook Express conduit too, same problem.

Oh and here's something else. You don't need the thing to have your palm
"account" selected as the default for mailto.

You just need to edit "sync.ini" in your palm desktop user directory, and
have:

Profile=palmsync
UserAccount=palmsync
PostOffice=palmsync

where "palmsync" = the account name you want to sync, in the Bat.

In my experience marking it as the default for mailto URLs does
absolutely nothing. I found this out when I was trying to switch what I
used to have synced to my palm, to a new account that was just a container
for msgs I wanted to sync. Even though I marked the new account as the
default, the sync conduit kept syncing the old one... so I edited sync.ini
manually.


-- 
Kiyan Azarbar
M.A. Program in Linguistics
University of Ottawa

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Re[3]: Palm Sync

[Tim Musson]

Hey Peter,

Wednesday, March 14, 2001, 10:38:15 AM, you wrote:

PC> What  kind  of sync'ing is this? Is this with only the email or both
PC>   email and addressbook? Thanks in advance.

AFAIK there is no conduit written to sync the Palm add book with TB's.
So it would only be eMail...

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Re[3]: Palm Sync

[Peter Chiou]

Please  disregard...previously  answered...but continually searching
for solution.



--
Wednesday, March 14, 2001, 7:38:15 AM, Peter Chiou wrote:

PC> Hello Stefan,

PC> Friday, March 02, 2001, 12:06:30 AM, you wrote:

JC>>> I've tried everything as you suggest. I can get Outlook Express to
JC>>> sync up fine, but as soon as I re-install TB as the default client
JC>>> (with the InstallMapi option), it fails again.

ST>> Important note: you should set The Bat! account you want to
ST>> synchronise with Palm as the default for mailto: URL handling...



PC> --

PC>   What  kind  of sync'ing is this? Is this with only the email or both
PC>   email and addressbook? Thanks in advance.






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Re[2]: Palm Sync

[Peter Chiou]

Hello Stefan,

Friday, March 02, 2001, 12:06:30 AM, you wrote:

JC>> I've tried everything as you suggest. I can get Outlook Express to
JC>> sync up fine, but as soon as I re-install TB as the default client
JC>> (with the InstallMapi option), it fails again.

ST> Important note: you should set The Bat! account you want to
ST> synchronise with Palm as the default for mailto: URL handling...



--

  What  kind  of sync'ing is this? Is this with only the email or both
  email and addressbook? Thanks in advance.

-- 
Best regards,
 Peter   



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Re[3]: Palm Sync

[Serge Skorokhodov]

Hello everybody,

JC>>> I've tried everything as you suggest. I can get Outlook
JC>>> Express to sync up fine, but as soon as I re-install TB as
JC>>> the default client (with the InstallMapi option), it fails
JC>>> again.

ST>> Important note: you should set The Bat! account you want to
ST>> synchronise with Palm as the default for mailto: URL
ST>> handling...

1.51 seems to be much faster in palm-synch. Does somebody have
similar impression? No apparent reason for better performance can
be drawn from the release info.

Best regards,
 Serge Skorokhodovmailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]



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Re[2]: Palm Sync

[Jerry Cook]

Hello Stefan,

Friday, March 02, 2001, 8:06:30 AM, you wrote:

ST> Hi Jerry, 

JC>> I've tried everything as you suggest. I can get Outlook Express to
JC>> sync up fine, but as soon as I re-install TB as the default client
JC>> (with the InstallMapi option), it fails again.

ST> Important note: you should set The Bat! account you want to
ST> synchronise with Palm as the default for mailto: URL handling...

ST> Hope this helps...



Thanks Stefan - I have it all working now.

Thanks again

Best regards,
 Jerrymailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]

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Re[2]: Palm Sync

[Serge Skorokhodov]

Hello Stefan,

ÐÑÔÎÉÃÁ, 2 ÍÁÒÔÁ 2001 Ç., you wrote:

ST> Hi Jerry, 

JC>> I've tried everything as you suggest. I can get Outlook
JC>> Express to sync up fine, but as soon as I re-install TB as
JC>> the default client (with the InstallMapi option), it fails
JC>> again.

I'll try this. I synchronize with my Palm successfully even
without this option set:)

Best regards,
 Serge Skorokhodovmailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]



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Re: Palm Sync

[Stefan Tanurkov]

Hi Jerry, 

JC> I've tried everything as you suggest. I can get Outlook Express to
JC> sync up fine, but as soon as I re-install TB as the default client
JC> (with the InstallMapi option), it fails again.

Important note: you should set The Bat! account you want to
synchronise with Palm as the default for mailto: URL handling...

Hope this helps...


-- 
All the Best!
 Stefan 

...You'll know if you married a virgin, as when she wakes she will ask you:
   "Are you still stiff from last night?"


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Re[3]: Palm Sync

[Serge Skorokhodov]

Hello Peter,

âòîðíèê, 27 ôåâðàëÿ 2001 ã., you wrote:

PC> Hello Serge,

PC> Monday, February 26, 2001, 8:30:30 AM, you wrote:

Serge>> Hello Jerry,

JC>>> Hello TBUDL,

JC>>> Has anybody had any success synchronizing TB with a Palm
JC>>> handheld?

Serge>> 

Serge>> I have. The suggestions are like that:



PC> --

PC>   How about sync'ing up the address book?

The only way I know is to manually import all vCards from Palm to
TB! The opposite direction seems not to work as TB! generated
vCards frequently prove to be "wry":( So /dev/hands is the best
automation technique for this purpose:), I'm afraid. It may be
possible to export TB! address book in ldap or ldif format but
I've never tried though...

Best regards,
 Serge Skorokhodovmailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]



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Re[3]: Palm Sync

[Tim Musson]

Hey Peter,

Monday, February 26, 2001, 5:20:22 PM, you wrote:

PC> How about sync'ing up the address book?

The Palm Mail conduit is the only one that interfaces with MAPI, so
you will not be able to Sync the Address book. You could do it
manually (export/import), or write your own conduit (if you do, I
would be interested  ).

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Palm Sync

[Jerry Cook]

Hi Serge

Thanks for all your feedback - really appreciated. Unfortunately I
still have the same problem:

> -- Mail
> - Failed while trying to log on to the Desktop Mail System. Please
>check your Palm Mail settings. Launch Mail Setup through the Windows
>Start menu on your desktop. Select Programs, Palm Desktop program
>group, and choose the Mail Setup icon.

I've tried everything as you suggest. I can get Outlook Express to
sync up fine, but as soon as I re-install TB as the default client
(with the InstallMapi option), it fails again.

I know the InstallMapi option is working because it changes the
MAPI32.DLL file from 131,072 bytes (Outlook Express) to 69632 bytes
(The Bat). What is the size of your MAPI32.DLL file?

Thanks again for your help.


Best regards,
 Jerry  mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]

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Re[2]: Palm Sync

[Peter Chiou]

Hello Serge,

Monday, February 26, 2001, 8:30:30 AM, you wrote:

Serge> Hello Jerry,

JC>> Hello TBUDL,

JC>> Has anybody had any success synchronizing TB with a Palm
JC>> handheld?

Serge> 

Serge> I have. The suggestions are like that:



--

  How about sync'ing up the address book?


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Re: Palm Sync

[Serge Skorokhodov]

Hello Jerry,

26.02.2001 you wrote:

JC> Hello TBUDL,

JC> Has anybody had any success synchronizing TB with a Palm
JC> handheld?



I have. The suggestions are like that:

  1. TB! _must_ be set as default mail client in
  Internet/Programs page in Windows Control Client. It is a good
  idea to run TB! from command line with the switch /InstallMAPI
  at least once. Alternatively, you can use the program fixmapi
  from the Net (unfortunately I don't have a link). Reboot. Win98
  do not accept changes before that (from experience) and I don't
  know about W2K.

  2. Palm mail conduit can synchronize with a single account
  only. It's not the case with other mail applications but I
  found standard Palm Mail the most convenient client. So I had
  to create a dummy account (named "To Palm", isn't it a
  surprize:) to synchronize with. In all "real" accounts I
  created a _manual_ filter that copies all unread messages that
  are newer than 1 day old from the corresponding Inbox to //To
  Palm/Inbox. Thus, if I don't read the message on the computer,
  I manually copy it to the Palm and read it there. I suggest you
  to follow my example 'cause I draw it from experience to be the
  most flexible solution.

  3. Now I use PalmDesktop 4. The previous version uses a bit
  different format of synch.ini file but it should be
  transparent. So, perform mail setup with your Palm software.
  Choose either Eudora or Outlook 4 or MS Exchange (if you use
  Palm Desktop 3 -- frankly I just don't remember, just try one
  way or another; with PD4 use Eudora 3 settings). Edit the
  synch.ini file in your Palm data folder in order the fields
  "Profile", "UserAccount" and "PostOffice" contain the name of
  TB!'s account you want to synchronize. Interface or protocol
  fields should be "MAPI32". See my synch.ini file as example.
  Just remember it is for Palm Desktop 4 version!

  4. Be patient. Synchronization with The Bat! is real slow! Just
  wait while nothing moves on HotSynch window etc. It will be
  successful some day;-)! That's why I set "Do Nothing" as my
  default mail action in HotSynch! I normally synchronize only
  once or two time a day.

Best regards,
 Serge Skorokhodovmailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
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[ attachment or non text part has been remove by MDaemon ]

Palm Sync

[Jerry Cook]

Hello TBUDL,

  Has anybody had any success synchronizing TB with a Palm handheld?

  Each time I try to syncronize, I get the following error in the log:
> -- Mail
>- Failed while trying to log on to the Desktop Mail System.

  TB MAPI files are all installed correctly, and MAPI compliance works
  in all other respects. I get the same problem on Win98 and 2000.

  Any ideas/help would be very much appreciated - thanks


Best regards,
 Jerry  mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]

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