[time-nuts] Ovenaire oscillator
I have an Ovenaire 10 MHz oscillator that was pulled from some junked equipment. Just for fun, I put it on the bench and hooked it up to a variable power supply. Watching the frequency output with a counter, I powered it up. According to the schematic, the onboard voltage regulator circuit produces 15 VDC into the OCXO. The fine frequency adjust is done by a trim pot on the board (I haven't touched that yet). I set the DC supply to 18 V to allow for some losses through the onboard regulator circuit. At startup, the Ovenaire draws about 250 mA. As the oven heats up, the current slowly drops. After less than ten minutes, it is at 170 mA and still falling. I'll let things run for a while to stabilize. At the moment, the Ovenaire is a few Hz low. After first powering the Ovenaire on, I wanted to see how it would react to a lowered supply voltage. To my surprise, it continued to put out near 10 MHz as I dropped the supply voltage all the way down to 9 V into the onboard regulator. Remember, the schematic showed 15 V into the OCXO. After messing around with things as they are for a bit, I'll have to hook up the T.I. counter and the GPIB for comparison against my Z3801A. I know I'm still a time novice, but this stuff can be interesting :-) Joe Gray W5JG ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
Re: [time-nuts] 2201A GPS
I remember them designing this box. Lead engineer was a lovely guy called John Bowell. His wife Beth also worked for the company. I left Austron in 1988, but worked again as UK product manager for ACAL handling all Datum products including Austron between 1991 1992. Can't recall whether this product was introduced late 80s or early 90s. Rob Kimberley -Original Message- From: time-nuts-boun...@febo.com [mailto:time-nuts-boun...@febo.com] On Behalf Of Paramithiotti, Luciano Paolo S Sent: 11 April 2011 8:47 AM To: Discussion of precise time and frequency measurement Subject: Re: [time-nuts] 2201A GPS more info for you: Input/output: +15VDC Diplexer for 10Mhz input for LO multiplier chain and 75.42 Mhz output to receiver. The LO, 1500Mhz, is obtained from 10 Mhz standard coming from GPS receiver as follow: X3=30Mhz x5=150Mhz x5=750Mhz x2=1500Mhz. RF path 3 stage amplifier and filter for a total gain of 32dB (antenna is passive right-hand circular polarization). RF BW is 150Mhz IF path 4 mmic stages and filter for a total gain of more/less 50dB. IF BW is 20Mhz This is a 1990 project. Luciano P. S. Paramithiotti -Original Message- From: time-nuts-boun...@febo.com [mailto:time-nuts-boun...@febo.com] On Behalf Of paul swed Sent: domenica 10 aprile 2011 15.44 To: Discussion of precise time and frequency measurement Subject: Re: [time-nuts] 2201A GPS Rob understood what you meant. My comment was that the 1st mixer and local oscillator is at 1500 Mhz. So the system has to multiply 10 MHz to 1500 and mix it to produce the 75.42 MHZ IF. Luciano was saying it was a multiplier chain and I was thinking out loud about the numbers that could have been used. Anyhow we will see what he adds to the discussion. Regards Paul. On Sun, Apr 10, 2011 at 4:02 AM, Rob Kimberley r...@timing-consultants.comwrote: Another thought - I know it was 75 MHz coming down, as they had some problems from interference from a VHF transmitter on one installation which was in that band. Rob K -Original Message- From: time-nuts-boun...@febo.com [mailto:time-nuts-boun...@febo.com] On Behalf Of paul swed Sent: 08 April 2011 6:35 PM To: Discussion of precise time and frequency measurement Subject: Re: [time-nuts] 2201A GPS Rob you are correct but the 10 MC is a ref for the pll. Luciano goes into more detail on the diode mixer/doubler and this makes sense. It would be simple, but would not be very sensitive. So by feeding the converter as he has with a modern antenna he gains a lot and most likely a lower frontend noise floor. All good things. Luciano would like to see the schematic. Regards Paul. On Fri, Apr 8, 2011 at 12:55 PM, Rob Kimberley r...@timing-consultants.comwrote: From what I remember from my days at Austron, antenna had 10 Mhz LO and 75 MHz IF. Rob K -Original Message- From: time-nuts-boun...@febo.com [mailto:time-nuts-boun...@febo.com] On Behalf Of paul swed Sent: 08 April 2011 5:04 PM To: Discussion of precise time and frequency measurement Subject: Re: [time-nuts] 2201A GPS Luciano, The 750 may be made up by the use of a pll and then doubled to 1500. With the information I see they never went into any detail about the converter. Just maybe you have those details. Regards On Fri, Apr 8, 2011 at 11:08 AM, Paramithiotti, Luciano Paolo S luciano.paramithio...@hp.com wrote: Hi all, I have an Austron 2200 with antenna. I think is the same antenna used with 2201. Internally the converter is very simple to rebuilt with patient and time to spend. From the mainframe you have DC power, a 10 MHz fx to be multiplied for LO,and back the IF frequency. In the antenna assembly is also present an rf preamplifier and filter,a mixer and IF amp. The more complex part is the multiplier and the LO and RF filter. All other components can be replaced by mmic and minicircuits mixer. If I well remember the LO mixer input is 1/2 fLO =750Mhz. I have the manual but at the moment I am out of my laboratory and I cannot verify it. Luciano Luciano P. S. Paramithiotti IZ5JHJ -Original Message- From: time-nuts-boun...@febo.com [mailto:time-nuts-boun...@febo.com] On Behalf Of paul swed Sent: venerdì 8 aprile 2011 15.18 To: Discussion of precise time and frequency measurement Subject: Re: [time-nuts] 2201A GPS WT Interesting there are at least 3 total people now that have the 2201. All on time-nuts. I have been working on my 2201 with the help of another time-nut and home brewed the antenna/downconverter. But the way I did it is really not reproducible. Unless you have a 1600 MC very stable external lockable signal generator. Like a HP8660. It does receive satellites. But it appears that the almanac is not correct. There were several issues before the year 2000 and the 2201 was out of production by the time the issues
Re: [time-nuts] Ovenaire OCXOs
Interesting. I have several Ovenaire OCXOs of differing models. I used to think they were pretty stable until I compared them to my Z3801. Compared to a '3801, they stink. But then, a rubidium stinks compared to a 3801. Most have a voltage input for frequency adjustment but one has a trimmer cap for coarse and a pot for fine. Over a period of several days, I would think it had settled down only to come back and find it had suddenly shifted. As they say, stable is a relative term. About all I can say after testing maybe a half dozen from different manufacturers it that the specifications should be taken with a liberal dose of salt. I have seen TCXOs do better than a lot of OCXOs over the limited temperature range of my lab. I have a chamber and keep saying I am going to do some temperature testing but work is always getting in the way. ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
Re: [time-nuts] Ovenaire OCXOs
After running overnight, the current draw has stabileized at 160 mA. I tweaked the trim pot to set the frequency to 10,000,000.00 Hz, which is the resolution of my counter. The counter is synced to the Z3801A. The Ovenaire is exposed to ambient air, so I expect things to change as the day warms up. Using an IR thermometer, the OCXO metal can temperature varies a bit, but has a hot spot at 37.6 C. I'll have to dig out a contact temperature probe for more accurate readings. Later on, I'll put this thing in an enclosure, which should minimize temperature effects. Then I can see where the temperature stabilizes from the oven heat. The T.I. comparison will have to wait a few days, as I need my laptop for something else tomorrow night. Joe Gray W5JG On Tue, Apr 12, 2011 at 7:27 AM, John Green wpxs...@gmail.com wrote: Interesting. I have several Ovenaire OCXOs of differing models. I used to think they were pretty stable until I compared them to my Z3801. Compared to a '3801, they stink. But then, a rubidium stinks compared to a 3801. Most have a voltage input for frequency adjustment but one has a trimmer cap for coarse and a pot for fine. Over a period of several days, I would think it had settled down only to come back and find it had suddenly shifted. As they say, stable is a relative term. About all I can say after testing maybe a half dozen from different manufacturers it that the specifications should be taken with a liberal dose of salt. I have seen TCXOs do better than a lot of OCXOs over the limited temperature range of my lab. I have a chamber and keep saying I am going to do some temperature testing but work is always getting in the way. ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there. ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
[time-nuts] HP5370 board needed
Hi all, Do someone have an interpolation board for HP5370A pn 05370-60119 to sell? I have an Error 04 PLL not locked and vco range is out of range at +2.xx Volts on one of the two boards. Thanks, Luciano Luciano P. S. Paramithiotti -Original Message- From: time-nuts-boun...@febo.com [mailto:time-nuts-boun...@febo.com] On Behalf Of Joseph Gray Sent: martedì 12 aprile 2011 17.37 To: Discussion of precise time and frequency measurement Subject: Re: [time-nuts] Ovenaire OCXOs After running overnight, the current draw has stabileized at 160 mA. I tweaked the trim pot to set the frequency to 10,000,000.00 Hz, which is the resolution of my counter. The counter is synced to the Z3801A. The Ovenaire is exposed to ambient air, so I expect things to change as the day warms up. Using an IR thermometer, the OCXO metal can temperature varies a bit, but has a hot spot at 37.6 C. I'll have to dig out a contact temperature probe for more accurate readings. Later on, I'll put this thing in an enclosure, which should minimize temperature effects. Then I can see where the temperature stabilizes from the oven heat. The T.I. comparison will have to wait a few days, as I need my laptop for something else tomorrow night. Joe Gray W5JG On Tue, Apr 12, 2011 at 7:27 AM, John Green wpxs...@gmail.com wrote: Interesting. I have several Ovenaire OCXOs of differing models. I used to think they were pretty stable until I compared them to my Z3801. Compared to a '3801, they stink. But then, a rubidium stinks compared to a 3801. Most have a voltage input for frequency adjustment but one has a trimmer cap for coarse and a pot for fine. Over a period of several days, I would think it had settled down only to come back and find it had suddenly shifted. As they say, stable is a relative term. About all I can say after testing maybe a half dozen from different manufacturers it that the specifications should be taken with a liberal dose of salt. I have seen TCXOs do better than a lot of OCXOs over the limited temperature range of my lab. I have a chamber and keep saying I am going to do some temperature testing but work is always getting in the way. ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there. ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there. ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
Re: [time-nuts] HP5370 board needed
It's recommended to start your own thread, rather than hijack someone else's. Having totally irrelevant questions tacked on to an existing thread is very confusing and considered bad manners. Joe Gray W5JG On Tue, Apr 12, 2011 at 10:37 AM, Paramithiotti, Luciano Paolo S luciano.paramithio...@hp.com wrote: Hi all, Do someone have an interpolation board for HP5370A pn 05370-60119 to sell? I have an Error 04 PLL not locked and vco range is out of range at +2.xx Volts on one of the two boards. Thanks, Luciano Luciano P. S. Paramithiotti -Original Message- From: time-nuts-boun...@febo.com [mailto:time-nuts-boun...@febo.com] On Behalf Of Joseph Gray Sent: martedì 12 aprile 2011 17.37 To: Discussion of precise time and frequency measurement Subject: Re: [time-nuts] Ovenaire OCXOs After running overnight, the current draw has stabileized at 160 mA. I tweaked the trim pot to set the frequency to 10,000,000.00 Hz, which is the resolution of my counter. The counter is synced to the Z3801A. The Ovenaire is exposed to ambient air, so I expect things to change as the day warms up. Using an IR thermometer, the OCXO metal can temperature varies a bit, but has a hot spot at 37.6 C. I'll have to dig out a contact temperature probe for more accurate readings. Later on, I'll put this thing in an enclosure, which should minimize temperature effects. Then I can see where the temperature stabilizes from the oven heat. The T.I. comparison will have to wait a few days, as I need my laptop for something else tomorrow night. Joe Gray W5JG On Tue, Apr 12, 2011 at 7:27 AM, John Green wpxs...@gmail.com wrote: Interesting. I have several Ovenaire OCXOs of differing models. I used to think they were pretty stable until I compared them to my Z3801. Compared to a '3801, they stink. But then, a rubidium stinks compared to a 3801. Most have a voltage input for frequency adjustment but one has a trimmer cap for coarse and a pot for fine. Over a period of several days, I would think it had settled down only to come back and find it had suddenly shifted. As they say, stable is a relative term. About all I can say after testing maybe a half dozen from different manufacturers it that the specifications should be taken with a liberal dose of salt. I have seen TCXOs do better than a lot of OCXOs over the limited temperature range of my lab. I have a chamber and keep saying I am going to do some temperature testing but work is always getting in the way. ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there. ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there. ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there. ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
Re: [time-nuts] HP5370 board needed
Hey Joe... I don't know that he really hijacked it or intended to, as he did change the subject line. He apparently just slipped up and left your message text in his new topic message. I agree that hijacking or piggybacking or whatever name it gets makes it hard to search the archive, which is what makes the idea of threads valuable here. We all make mistakes at times. It only becomes bad manners when the same mistake is committed repeatedly or intentionally. :-). Tom Holmes, N8ZM Tipp City, OH EM79 -Original Message- From: time-nuts-boun...@febo.com [mailto:time-nuts-boun...@febo.com] On Behalf Of Joseph Gray Sent: Tuesday, April 12, 2011 1:10 PM To: Discussion of precise time and frequency measurement Subject: Re: [time-nuts] HP5370 board needed It's recommended to start your own thread, rather than hijack someone else's. Having totally irrelevant questions tacked on to an existing thread is very confusing and considered bad manners. Joe Gray W5JG On Tue, Apr 12, 2011 at 10:37 AM, Paramithiotti, Luciano Paolo S luciano.paramithio...@hp.com wrote: Hi all, Do someone have an interpolation board for HP5370A pn 05370-60119 to sell? I have an Error 04 PLL not locked and vco range is out of range at +2.xx Volts on one of the two boards. Thanks, Luciano Luciano P. S. Paramithiotti -Original Message- From: time-nuts-boun...@febo.com [mailto:time-nuts-boun...@febo.com] On Behalf Of Joseph Gray Sent: martedì 12 aprile 2011 17.37 To: Discussion of precise time and frequency measurement Subject: Re: [time-nuts] Ovenaire OCXOs After running overnight, the current draw has stabileized at 160 mA. I tweaked the trim pot to set the frequency to 10,000,000.00 Hz, which is the resolution of my counter. The counter is synced to the Z3801A. The Ovenaire is exposed to ambient air, so I expect things to change as the day warms up. Using an IR thermometer, the OCXO metal can temperature varies a bit, but has a hot spot at 37.6 C. I'll have to dig out a contact temperature probe for more accurate readings. Later on, I'll put this thing in an enclosure, which should minimize temperature effects. Then I can see where the temperature stabilizes from the oven heat. The T.I. comparison will have to wait a few days, as I need my laptop for something else tomorrow night. Joe Gray W5JG On Tue, Apr 12, 2011 at 7:27 AM, John Green wpxs...@gmail.com wrote: Interesting. I have several Ovenaire OCXOs of differing models. I used to think they were pretty stable until I compared them to my Z3801. Compared to a '3801, they stink. But then, a rubidium stinks compared to a 3801. Most have a voltage input for frequency adjustment but one has a trimmer cap for coarse and a pot for fine. Over a period of several days, I would think it had settled down only to come back and find it had suddenly shifted. As they say, stable is a relative term. About all I can say after testing maybe a half dozen from different manufacturers it that the specifications should be taken with a liberal dose of salt. I have seen TCXOs do better than a lot of OCXOs over the limited temperature range of my lab. I have a chamber and keep saying I am going to do some temperature testing but work is always getting in the way. ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there. ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there. ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there. ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there. ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
Re: [time-nuts] HP5370 board needed
I don't think there was any bad intent in the changed email, but the point is that if the OT message was posted this way it will probably happen again. Email message headers contain a thread-index number. Any decent email program groups the messages into threads using this (normally hidden) information. If you hit REPLY this thread information is put into the new message header; changing the subject field does not start a new thread. You need to write a new message, not hit reply, or your message may start an off-topic chain that does hijack the original thread. We all make mistakes, but if no one points out the problem it probably will continue. On 4/12/2011 10:47 AM, Tom Holmes wrote: Hey Joe... I don't know that he really hijacked it or intended to, as he did change the subject line. He apparently just slipped up and left your message text in his new topic message. I agree that hijacking or piggybacking or whatever name it gets makes it hard to search the archive, which is what makes the idea of threads valuable here. We all make mistakes at times. It only becomes bad manners when the same mistake is committed repeatedly or intentionally. :-). Tom Holmes, N8ZM Tipp City, OH EM79 -Original Message- From: time-nuts-boun...@febo.com [mailto:time-nuts-boun...@febo.com] On Behalf Of Joseph Gray Sent: Tuesday, April 12, 2011 1:10 PM To: Discussion of precise time and frequency measurement Subject: Re: [time-nuts] HP5370 board needed It's recommended to start your own thread, rather than hijack someone else's. Having totally irrelevant questions tacked on to an existing thread is very confusing and considered bad manners. Joe Gray W5JG On Tue, Apr 12, 2011 at 10:37 AM, Paramithiotti, Luciano Paolo S luciano.paramithio...@hp.com wrote: Hi all, Do someone have an interpolation board for HP5370A pn 05370-60119 to sell? I have an Error 04 PLL not locked and vco range is out of range at +2.xx Volts on one of the two boards. Thanks, Luciano Luciano P. S. Paramithiotti -Original Message- From: time-nuts-boun...@febo.com [mailto:time-nuts-boun...@febo.com] On ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
Re: [time-nuts] Ovenaire OCXOs
Hi Joe, You should have left the frequency adjustment alone for at least 30 days and more like 90 days. On a high quality oscillator it takes at least 30 days minimum for the package to stabilize. Otherwise you will just be chasing all the mechanical stresses, including the crystal itself, that take that long to settle out. Changing the adjustment causes additional stresses that need time to settle. It does not have to be spot on frequency to determine the drift and the Adev. Unless the thing is so far off as to be outside the range of your measurement process, it would have been better to leave it alone. BillWB6BNQ Joseph Gray wrote: After running overnight, the current draw has stabileized at 160 mA. I tweaked the trim pot to set the frequency to 10,000,000.00 Hz, which is the resolution of my counter. The counter is synced to the Z3801A. The Ovenaire is exposed to ambient air, so I expect things to change as the day warms up. Using an IR thermometer, the OCXO metal can temperature varies a bit, but has a hot spot at 37.6 C. I'll have to dig out a contact temperature probe for more accurate readings. Later on, I'll put this thing in an enclosure, which should minimize temperature effects. Then I can see where the temperature stabilizes from the oven heat. The T.I. comparison will have to wait a few days, as I need my laptop for something else tomorrow night. Joe Gray W5JG On Tue, Apr 12, 2011 at 7:27 AM, John Green wpxs...@gmail.com wrote: Interesting. I have several Ovenaire OCXOs of differing models. I used to think they were pretty stable until I compared them to my Z3801. Compared to a '3801, they stink. But then, a rubidium stinks compared to a 3801. Most have a voltage input for frequency adjustment but one has a trimmer cap for coarse and a pot for fine. Over a period of several days, I would think it had settled down only to come back and find it had suddenly shifted. As they say, stable is a relative term. About all I can say after testing maybe a half dozen from different manufacturers it that the specifications should be taken with a liberal dose of salt. I have seen TCXOs do better than a lot of OCXOs over the limited temperature range of my lab. I have a chamber and keep saying I am going to do some temperature testing but work is always getting in the way. ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there. ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there. ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
Re: [time-nuts] HP5370 board needed
Thanks, Rex; I did not know that. Another marvelous hidden feature that gives all of us the chance to look like idiots at one time or another. Tom Holmes, N8ZM Tipp City, OH EM79 -Original Message- From: time-nuts-boun...@febo.com [mailto:time-nuts-boun...@febo.com] On Behalf Of Rex Sent: Tuesday, April 12, 2011 4:04 PM To: Discussion of precise time and frequency measurement Subject: Re: [time-nuts] HP5370 board needed I don't think there was any bad intent in the changed email, but the point is that if the OT message was posted this way it will probably happen again. Email message headers contain a thread-index number. Any decent email program groups the messages into threads using this (normally hidden) information. If you hit REPLY this thread information is put into the new message header; changing the subject field does not start a new thread. You need to write a new message, not hit reply, or your message may start an off-topic chain that does hijack the original thread. We all make mistakes, but if no one points out the problem it probably will continue. On 4/12/2011 10:47 AM, Tom Holmes wrote: Hey Joe... I don't know that he really hijacked it or intended to, as he did change the subject line. He apparently just slipped up and left your message text in his new topic message. I agree that hijacking or piggybacking or whatever name it gets makes it hard to search the archive, which is what makes the idea of threads valuable here. We all make mistakes at times. It only becomes bad manners when the same mistake is committed repeatedly or intentionally. :-). Tom Holmes, N8ZM Tipp City, OH EM79 -Original Message- From: time-nuts-boun...@febo.com [mailto:time-nuts-boun...@febo.com] On Behalf Of Joseph Gray Sent: Tuesday, April 12, 2011 1:10 PM To: Discussion of precise time and frequency measurement Subject: Re: [time-nuts] HP5370 board needed It's recommended to start your own thread, rather than hijack someone else's. Having totally irrelevant questions tacked on to an existing thread is very confusing and considered bad manners. Joe Gray W5JG On Tue, Apr 12, 2011 at 10:37 AM, Paramithiotti, Luciano Paolo S luciano.paramithio...@hp.com wrote: Hi all, Do someone have an interpolation board for HP5370A pn 05370-60119 to sell? I have an Error 04 PLL not locked and vco range is out of range at +2.xx Volts on one of the two boards. Thanks, Luciano Luciano P. S. Paramithiotti -Original Message- From: time-nuts-boun...@febo.com [mailto:time-nuts-boun...@febo.com] On ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there. ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
Re: [time-nuts] Ovenaire OCXOs
On 04/12/2011 10:05 PM, WB6BNQ wrote: Hi Joe, You should have left the frequency adjustment alone for at least 30 days and more like 90 days. On a high quality oscillator it takes at least 30 days minimum for the package to stabilize. Otherwise you will just be chasing all the mechanical stresses, including the crystal itself, that take that long to settle out. Changing the adjustment causes additional stresses that need time to settle. It does not have to be spot on frequency to determine the drift and the Adev. Unless the thing is so far off as to be outside the range of your measurement process, it would have been better to leave it alone. It soo depends on the quality. For lesser OCXOs the daily shifts have the frequency walk around sufficiently anyway. Still, you want the oscillator run for quite some time for the normal termal related drift (many sources) to settle down. Cheers, Magnus ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
Re: [time-nuts] HP5370 board needed
At 04:03 PM 4/12/2011, Rex wrote... Email message headers contain a thread-index number. Any decent email program groups the messages into threads using this (normally hidden) information. The Thread-Index: header (and Thread-Topic:) is a completely proprietary, non-standard header created by Microsoft. From that, decent email program does not follow. The correct header to use is References:, as defined in RFC 1036 (and RFC 2822), and to a lesser extent, In-Reply-To:, which is a mess. But, since both References: and In-Reply-To: were very loosely defined when originally created in RFC 822, threading is, and always will be, unreliable. The OP apparently replied to an existing message and put a new subject in. His MUA put in fresh Thread-*: headers, and handled References: and Reply-To: properly. Your MUA used the updated References and/or Reply-To to place that message into an existing thread. None of that is unreasonable, none of it violates standards, yet it breaks threading, because support for threading was never properly specified to begin with. Pointing fingers at someone is misplacing blame, and pissing into the wind, too. ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
[time-nuts] Fluke 203A Distribution Amp available
I have a nice Fluke 203A , modified from one 5 MHz in and 12 out to one 10 MHz in and 12 outputs for sale. This is a 2U rack unit similar in function to the -hp- 5087A with metering etc., with a printed copy of the pdf manual. Please contact me direct if interested with any offers before this goes to ebay. Dan ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
[time-nuts] Thread hijacking, etc.
In a previous thread, that I and others were totally corrupting by posting how not to do exactly what we were doing, Mike S replied to me... On 4/12/2011 1:53 PM, Mike S wrote: At 04:03 PM 4/12/2011, Rex wrote... Email message headers contain a thread-index number. Any decent email program groups the messages into threads using this (normally hidden) information. The Thread-Index: header (and Thread-Topic:) is a completely proprietary, non-standard header created by Microsoft. From that, decent email program does not follow. The correct header to use is References:, as defined in RFC 1036 (and RFC 2822), and to a lesser extent, In-Reply-To:, which is a mess. But, since both References: and In-Reply-To: were very loosely defined when originally created in RFC 822, threading is, and always will be, unreliable. The OP apparently replied to an existing message and put a new subject in. His MUA put in fresh Thread-*: headers, and handled References: and Reply-To: properly. Your MUA used the updated References and/or Reply-To to place that message into an existing thread. None of that is unreasonable, none of it violates standards, yet it breaks threading, because support for threading was never properly specified to begin with. Pointing fingers at someone is misplacing blame, and pissing into the wind, too. OK. Please forgive me. I gave the wrong explanation of what part of the email headers causes a REPLY message with a new subject, to still show up in the original thread. People responding to that misplaced message (like we just did) corrupt the intent of the original poster and can make the original message become lost, dissipated or irrelevant. -- Sorry, Joe. I still suggest that the simple solution is to be aware not to use REPLY to an existing message when writing a new post that has no relationship to the message you are replying to. Changing the subject field seems logical but is insufficient because of header information. I don't think that pointing that out is, misplacing blame, or pissing into the wind. ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
Re: [time-nuts] Ovenaire OCXOs
Bill and Magnus, Thanks for the tips. At this point I was mostly curious to see if the oscillator worked and if it was reasonably stable. To let it cook for a while, I will definitely have to put everything in a box. I am getting a battery and putting the pieces together to run it off battery or AC. I have a nice portable enclosure that has been on the shelf for months. This would be a good use for it. Later, I want to replace the OCXO with a Rubidium. In the mean time, I'll have the OCXO to play with. When I get the Rubidium, I'll replace the OCXO and have a much better portable standard. I just happened to have the OCXO and the enclosure lying around, so I thought I'd start there. Joe Gray W5JG On Tue, Apr 12, 2011 at 2:48 PM, Magnus Danielson mag...@rubidium.dyndns.org wrote: On 04/12/2011 10:05 PM, WB6BNQ wrote: Hi Joe, You should have left the frequency adjustment alone for at least 30 days and more like 90 days. On a high quality oscillator it takes at least 30 days minimum for the package to stabilize. Otherwise you will just be chasing all the mechanical stresses, including the crystal itself, that take that long to settle out. Changing the adjustment causes additional stresses that need time to settle. It does not have to be spot on frequency to determine the drift and the Adev. Unless the thing is so far off as to be outside the range of your measurement process, it would have been better to leave it alone. It soo depends on the quality. For lesser OCXOs the daily shifts have the frequency walk around sufficiently anyway. Still, you want the oscillator run for quite some time for the normal termal related drift (many sources) to settle down. Cheers, Magnus ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there. ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
Re: [time-nuts] Fluke 203A Distribution Amp available
From: Dan Rae dan...@verizon.net I have a nice Fluke 203A , modified from one 5 MHz in and 12 out to one 10 MHz in and 12 outputs for sale. This is a 2U rack unit similar in function to the -hp- 5087A with metering etc., with a printed copy of the pdf manual. Please contact me direct if interested with any offers before this goes to ebay. Dan -- Dan, I have a good Fluke 203A and manual also, but it's a standard unit, only having standard 1MHz and 5MHz input and output modules. Are the 10MHz modules from Fluke or did you make the mods? If the 10MHz mods have been documented, amd it's possible for you, could you scan and post the applicable pages for those modules? Many thanks, Dave M dgminala at mediacombb dot net ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
Re: [time-nuts] HP5370 board needed
This conversation is beginning to sound like the doctoral students and post-docs in my lab one-upping each other on an afternoon when no one has much else to do. On Tue, Apr 12, 2011 at 4:53 PM, Mike S mi...@flatsurface.com wrote: At 04:03 PM 4/12/2011, Rex wrote... Email message headers contain a thread-index number. Any decent email program groups the messages into threads using this (normally hidden) information. The Thread-Index: header (and Thread-Topic:) is a completely proprietary, non-standard header created by Microsoft. From that, decent email program does not follow. The correct header to use is References:, as defined in RFC 1036 (and RFC 2822), and to a lesser extent, In-Reply-To:, which is a mess. But, since both References: and In-Reply-To: were very loosely defined when originally created in RFC 822, threading is, and always will be, unreliable. The OP apparently replied to an existing message and put a new subject in. His MUA put in fresh Thread-*: headers, and handled References: and Reply-To: properly. Your MUA used the updated References and/or Reply-To to place that message into an existing thread. None of that is unreasonable, none of it violates standards, yet it breaks threading, because support for threading was never properly specified to begin with. Pointing fingers at someone is misplacing blame, and pissing into the wind, too. ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there. ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
Re: [time-nuts] Fluke 203A Distribution Amp available
On 4/12/2011 4:27 PM, Dave M wrote: From: Dan Rae dan...@verizon.net I have a nice Fluke 203A , modified from one 5 MHz in and 12 out to one 10 MHz in and 12 outputs for sale. This is a 2U rack unit similar in function to the -hp- 5087A with metering etc., with a printed copy of the pdf manual. Please contact me direct if interested with any offers before this goes to ebay. Dan -- Dan, I have a good Fluke 203A and manual also, but it's a standard unit, only having standard 1MHz and 5MHz input and output modules. Are the 10MHz modules from Fluke or did you make the mods? If the 10MHz mods have been documented, amd it's possible for you, could you scan and post the applicable pages for those modules? Dave, I don't think Fluke ever made any 10 MHz modules, from the manual anyway. I kept all the inductors as is; in the pre-amp, changed the tuning Cs C1 and C2 from 1000 pF to 220 pF. In the output amp change: C1 and C2 to 220 pF C3 to 68 pF C5 and C8 to 22pF I also put a 2k2 resistor across T2 in the output amps. The modified modules peak up nicely like that with the cores not far off where they were before. Ive had it going for about five years and just rechecked it, it seems pretty reliable :^) Dan ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
[time-nuts] GPS position averaging software?
Just got a pair of GPS antennas on the roof and I'm interested in both getting as accurate a position survey as I can, and in comparing the performance of the two antennas -- one is a choke ring, the other a Motorola Timing2000. I'm using an M12+ receiver. I have TAC32 but am interested in other software that may have more focus on positioning, e.g. showing a plot of the wander and providing statistics about the averaging. Any suggestions? John ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
Re: [time-nuts] GPS position averaging software?
John, I use WinOncore12, it's written by motorola, but no longer supported by them. You can get the install file from here http://www.jackson-labs.com/support.html On 2011-04-13 11:44, John Ackermann N8UR wrote: Just got a pair of GPS antennas on the roof and I'm interested in both getting as accurate a position survey as I can, and in comparing the performance of the two antennas -- one is a choke ring, the other a Motorola Timing2000. I'm using an M12+ receiver. I have TAC32 but am interested in other software that may have more focus on positioning, e.g. showing a plot of the wander and providing statistics about the averaging. Any suggestions? John -- Cheers, Ken vk7...@users.tasmanet.com.au www.vk7krj.com 'It seems hard to sneak a look at God's cards. But that He plays dice and uses telepathic methods is something that I cannot believe for a single moment.' (Einstein's famous quote on Quantum theory) No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 9.0.894 / Virus Database: 271.1.1/3569 - Release Date: 04/13/11 04:35:00 ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
[time-nuts] GPS position averaging software?
Why Lady Heather, of course! Requires a Thunderbolt. Use the S)urvey P)recision command. You can specify the number of hours to run for (default is 48). During the survey all the fixes are written to the file LLA.LLA and plotted on the screen (each hour in a different color). It does some pseudo sophisto statisto mumbo jumbo on the fixes and comes up with a pretty good guess where you are and saves that as your location. You can also read in a .LLA file and it will plot the fixes, or you can process them with your own software. You can stop a survey early if you want (I don't rememeber if it saves the position if you do that) I have tested lots of different antennas and the differences can be rather significant. My best survey grade choke ring comes in within less than a foot. Crappy patch antennas can be off over 10 feet. If you just have to use the M12 receiver, you could format the fixes into a .LLA file and then read it with Lady Heather. You can start the program with the /0 option to disable its attempt to use a serial port to talk to a thunderbolt. Also note that the program does not buffer the fixes... if you redraw the screen, etc, the plot goes away. And you can't zoom the LLA plot to full screen. - Just got a pair of GPS antennas on the roof and I'm interested in both getting as accurate a position survey as I can, and in comparing the performance of the two antennas -- one is a choke ring, the other a Motorola Timing2000. ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
[time-nuts] Odetics GPSStar eproms on Ko4bb site now
Have uploaded a copy of the 4 Odetics GPSStar receivers eproms to the rom folder under GPS odetics for anyone that might need the images. Thanks for your site Diddier. Regards Paul WB8TSL ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
[time-nuts] GPS clock error.
This morning at 10 AM CDT my GPS clock read 8 PM July 5th. My wife reported that the time had been 2 hours off at 6 AM local time. She didn't notice if it was AM or PM. The parabolic dish icon was missing from the display. I manually set the time and date but when compared to my two WWVB clocks it was clear it was in holdover mode. I waited about 3 hours then removed the batteries and reinstalled them. I set the time zone and left it to it's own devices. It set itself correctly in about 10 minutes and the dish icon was back. I wonder what happened. Could their have been a shortage of satellites that caused the receiver to lose lock? Why wouldn't it reacquire on it's own? If I had been a little more patient would it have reacquired on its own? I'm sure no one knows the answer to the last question. Speculation is welcome. Regards. Max. K 4 O D S. Email: m...@maxsmusicplace.com Transistor site http://www.funwithtransistors.net Vacuum tube site: http://www.funwithtubes.net Music site: http://www.maxsmusicplace.com To subscribe to the fun with transistors group send an email to. funwithtransistors-subscr...@yahoogroups.com To subscribe to the fun with tubes group send an email to, funwithtubes-subscr...@yahoogroups.com ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
Re: [time-nuts] GPS position averaging software?
John, Visual GPS (http://visualgps.net/) will do this for you. RTKLIB may also be of interest (http://gpspp.sakura.ne.jp/rtklib/). -Kevin - Original Message - From: John Ackermann N8UR j...@febo.com To: Discussion of precise time and frequency measurement time-nuts@febo.com Sent: Tuesday, April 12, 2011 6:44 PM Subject: [time-nuts] GPS position averaging software? Just got a pair of GPS antennas on the roof and I'm interested in both getting as accurate a position survey as I can, and in comparing the performance of the two antennas -- one is a choke ring, the other a Motorola Timing2000. I'm using an M12+ receiver. I have TAC32 but am interested in other software that may have more focus on positioning, e.g. showing a plot of the wander and providing statistics about the averaging. Any suggestions? John ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there. ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
Re: [time-nuts] GPS position averaging software?
John, try out the u-Blox Control Center at www.ublox.com. Primarily writte for their suite of GPS units, but works just fine with any NMEA enabled receiver. 73s Achim, DH2VA ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
