[time-nuts] Trueposition GPSDO CTS version for UK buyers

[gandalfg8--- via time-nuts]

This is a nice GPSDO but there doesn't seem to be too many about these days 
compared with the earlier Bliley version, and searching the usual channels from 
the UK currently seems to brings up just one, Ebay ref 152981122366.


39.99 USD is a pretty good price, and despite being described as used it does 
look pretty much like new from the photo, but shipping to the UK is 55 USD, so 
already a total of 95 USD, plus a fair chance of tax and handling charges on 
top.


A slightly different search though brings up Ebay ref 162691061234 for a 
complete Trueposition LMU300, with said GPSDO still safely tucked inside, and 
that for only 39 USD, plus shipping and taxes paid up front via the global 
shipping program. 

The total works out at just under 85USD each, and with no local charges to 
worry about, what was that about no brainer? :-)



Ok, so it's no longer quite your $40 GPSDO, and aside from a few cables and 
fans, and perhaps the box, much of the rest of it is probably not to 
useful, but again all looks to be as new, cal seals intact on the one I've had 
arrive so far, and it does seem to be the cheapest option for UK buyers, which 
leaves me a bit surprised these haven't sold out sooner.



Usual disclaimer, no vested interest whatsover, but with just three left if you 
hesitate I might buy another whilst you're thinking about it:-)



Nigel, GM8PZR





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Re: [time-nuts] 5950 Crystal impedance meter manual

[Tim Shoppa]

I don't know how to use that particular Boonton unit. BUT...

This is a different (more automated) unit which came maybe 10 years later.
The guy does a good job showing how it works and uses it on real crystals:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=y-rCgumTn4Q=youtu.be=4m37s

Experimental Methods in RF Design shows how to a couple different simple
benchtop jigs to measure crystal motional parameters and compute Q.

Tim N3QE

On Wed, May 23, 2018 at 4:44 AM, tim...@timeok.it  wrote:

>
>Hi all,
>I found this Crystal Impedande Meter produced by RFL Industries inc,
> Boonton.
>I would like to understand how to use it and I do not have any
> documentation.
>I'm not even able to figure out if it works properly.
>I would like to ask you if someone owns the service/operating manual
> and can share it with me.
>Look at the picture thanks
>Luciano
>
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Re: [time-nuts] 5950 Crystal impedance meter manual

[Bob kb8tq]

Hi

Basically when the modern era of network analyzer / standards calibrated 
devices came along, it was the
end of most of these magic test sets with knobs and dials. The Saunders stuff 
lived on well into that era, 
mainly because it was relatively inexpensive and most of the calibration was 
simple to do. The conversion
to what we would now call network analyzer techniques was well underway in the 
1970’s. It took us quite
a bit of work to get from there to where we are today. 

The operating principle of the older magic boxes is fairly simple. Build up an 
oscillator circuit that can be 
switched around to run over a wide range of frequencies and impedances. It 
generally is a very poor 
oscillator, but that’s not the point. Come up with a way to “zero” it to a 
given impedance and frequency. 
Plug in crystals and see how they deviate in impedance and nominal frequency. 
Shove in a load capacitance  
change and note the frequency change. From that data, you can calculate the 
crystal parameters.  To
the degree all the stray this and that is nulled out, your data will be more or 
less accurate.

Bob

> On May 24, 2018, at 1:40 AM, Bernd Neubig  wrote:
> 
> Hello,
> on the website of my company you can find a list of papers on the subject of 
> crystal measurement techniques.
> http://www.axtal.com/English/TechnicalNotes/TechnicalArticlesPublications/LiteratureaboutQuartzCrystals/
> 
> The actual standard procedure for crystal  measurement is by using modern 
> network analyzers with error correction, as given in the IEC publication 
> 60444-5. 
> A description of the method and its variants can be found in my 2012 paper 
> listed on the mentioned website.
> Enjoy
> 
> Bernd DK1AG
> 
> 
> -Ursprüngliche Nachricht-
> Von: time-nuts [mailto:time-nuts-boun...@febo.com] Im Auftrag von Brooke 
> Clarke
> Gesendet: Mittwoch, 23. Mai 2018 20:13
> An: tim...@timeok.it; Discussion of precise time and frequency measurement 
> 
> Betreff: Re: [time-nuts] 5950 Crystal impedance meter manual
> 
> Hi Luciano:
> 
> I have some web pages about crystals and testing them:
> http://www.prc68.com/I/CrystalImpedanceMeters.html - Crystal Impedance Meters 
> (Saunders 150) http://www.prc68.com/I/Xtal.shtml#TE - Crystals in general & 
> Test Equipment (see Trivia below) http://www.prc68.com/I/Xam.html - Crystal 
> Activity Meters http://www.prc68.com/I/Xec.shtml - Equivalent Circuit 
> http://www.prc68.com/I/4395A.shtml#ZT - The Z transform method is also used 
> in commercial crystal test sets like the HP E4915, E4916, E5100.
> 
> Trivia: The HP 4194 may be the only instrument that can really characterize 
> watch crystals ( 32768 Hz) for impedance which is in the meg Ohms range.  
> Some of the HP network analyzers can fit swept frequency data into an 
> equivalent crystal equivalent circuit.
> 
> --
> Have Fun,
> 
> Brooke Clarke
> http://www.PRC68.com
> http://www.end2partygovernment.com/2012Issues.html
> 
>  Original Message 
>>Hi all,
>>I found this Crystal Impedande Meter produced by RFL Industries inc, 
>> Boonton.
>>I would like to understand how to use it and I do not have any 
>> documentation.
>>I'm not even able to figure out if it works properly.
>>I would like to ask you if someone owns the service/operating manual and 
>> can share it with me.
>>Look at the picture thanks
>>Luciano
>> 
>> 
>> ___
>> time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to 
>> https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts
>> and follow the instructions there.
> 
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Re: [time-nuts] 5950 Crystal impedance meter manual

[Gerhard Hoffmann]

The DG8SAQ vector network analyzer has a built-in routine to 
characterize crystals.


It may not be "correct" to simply plug them on port 1, but the results 
are quite


reasonable. The right thing to sort out a bag of NOS crystals and 
finding the good ones


or to get a somewhat realistic simulation model.

regards, Gerhard


Am 24.05.2018 um 08:07 schrieb Magnus Danielson:

Hi Bernd,

On 05/24/2018 07:40 AM, Bernd Neubig wrote:


(good stuff snipped)
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[time-nuts] Test set 193 (British) and TS-683A/TSM Crystal Impedance Meters

[Peter Worrall via time-nuts]

Would anyone here be able to send me or point me to an electronic copy of 
manuals for either of these=
test sets?

I have one of each and would like to better understand how to use them.
 Pre-liminary digging around the Internet revealed very little.

Peter Worrall
G4GJL
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Re: [time-nuts] 5950 Crystal impedance meter manual

[Magnus Danielson]

Hi Bernd,

On 05/24/2018 07:40 AM, Bernd Neubig wrote:
> Hello,
> on the website of my company you can find a list of papers on the subject of 
> crystal measurement techniques.
> http://www.axtal.com/English/TechnicalNotes/TechnicalArticlesPublications/LiteratureaboutQuartzCrystals/
> 
> The actual standard procedure for crystal  measurement is by using modern 
> network analyzers with error correction, as given in the IEC publication 
> 60444-5. 
> A description of the method and its variants can be found in my 2012 paper 
> listed on the mentioned website.

I was hoping you would chime in on this thread eventually. Looks very
interesting.

It seems I should do some software processing after sweeping using my
HP4195A. It hss some internal matching, but you have warned that it gets
confused about wide-band or narrow-band properties :)

> Enjoy

Always! :)

Cheers,
Magnus

> Bernd DK1AG
> 
> 
> -Ursprüngliche Nachricht-
> Von: time-nuts [mailto:time-nuts-boun...@febo.com] Im Auftrag von Brooke 
> Clarke
> Gesendet: Mittwoch, 23. Mai 2018 20:13
> An: tim...@timeok.it; Discussion of precise time and frequency measurement 
> 
> Betreff: Re: [time-nuts] 5950 Crystal impedance meter manual
> 
> Hi Luciano:
> 
> I have some web pages about crystals and testing them:
> http://www.prc68.com/I/CrystalImpedanceMeters.html - Crystal Impedance Meters 
> (Saunders 150) http://www.prc68.com/I/Xtal.shtml#TE - Crystals in general & 
> Test Equipment (see Trivia below) http://www.prc68.com/I/Xam.html - Crystal 
> Activity Meters http://www.prc68.com/I/Xec.shtml - Equivalent Circuit 
> http://www.prc68.com/I/4395A.shtml#ZT - The Z transform method is also used 
> in commercial crystal test sets like the HP E4915, E4916, E5100.
> 
> Trivia: The HP 4194 may be the only instrument that can really characterize 
> watch crystals ( 32768 Hz) for impedance which is in the meg Ohms range.  
> Some of the HP network analyzers can fit swept frequency data into an 
> equivalent crystal equivalent circuit.
> 
> --
> Have Fun,
> 
> Brooke Clarke
> http://www.PRC68.com
> http://www.end2partygovernment.com/2012Issues.html
> 
>  Original Message 
>> Hi all,
>> I found this Crystal Impedande Meter produced by RFL Industries inc, 
>> Boonton.
>> I would like to understand how to use it and I do not have any 
>> documentation.
>> I'm not even able to figure out if it works properly.
>> I would like to ask you if someone owns the service/operating manual and 
>> can share it with me.
>> Look at the picture thanks
>> Luciano
>>
>>
>> ___
>> time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to 
>> https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts
>> and follow the instructions there.
> 
> ___
> time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to 
> https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts
> and follow the instructions there.
> 
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> and follow the instructions there.
> 
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