Re: [time-nuts] One more free thing...
Why don't you sell it in ebay? German collectors go mad on that kind of stuff... They are even collecting rotring china ink pens... Cheers, Andre Esteves 2018-06-08 22:38 GMT+01:00 Burt I. Weiner : > Gang, > > There's one more free thing left from the stuffs I posted a week or so ago. > I know everyone, almost everyone uses computers for drafting. That said, > there is a drafting table complete wit a Drafting Machine and various > attachments. There are also French Curves, compassesessess and other > related stuffs. It would really be a shame to see it go to the dump :( > This has to go right away and you have to come and pick it up in the Sierra > Madre area near Pasadena. If you or anyone you know might be interested, > please have them contact me direct via: b...@att.net Pictures are > available. > > Thanks, > > Burt, K6OQK > > Burt I. Weiner Associates > Broadcast Technical Services > Glendale, California U.S.A. > b...@att.net > K6OQK > ___ > time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com > To unsubscribe, go to > https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts > and follow the instructions there. ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
[time-nuts] One more free thing...
Gang, There's one more free thing left from the stuffs I posted a week or so ago. I know everyone, almost everyone uses computers for drafting. That said, there is a drafting table complete wit a Drafting Machine and various attachments. There are also French Curves, compassesessess and other related stuffs. It would really be a shame to see it go to the dump :(This has to go right away and you have to come and pick it up in the Sierra Madre area near Pasadena. If you or anyone you know might be interested, please have them contact me direct via: b...@att.net Pictures are available. Thanks, Burt, K6OQK Burt I. Weiner Associates Broadcast Technical Services Glendale, California U.S.A. b...@att.net K6OQK ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
Re: [time-nuts] Raw phase data of super-5065
Hi With ADEV, you really need something closer to 100X your tau to get accurate data. The utter impossibility of doing this for long Tau is what has driven the development of other evaluation methods. Bob > On Jun 8, 2018, at 10:36 AM, tim...@timeok.it wrote: > > > Hi Adrian, > as you know, to get real data up to 100K sec range, you should acquire at > least 500K 1M sec. > I say this from my personal experience. Soon I will have my 30 days run for > both the A and B version of the HP5065. > Very interesting the response of the GPSDO in the range 1 to 100 sec that I > had never had the chance to see for lack of an instrument as your A7. > ciao, > Luciano > > > Da "time-nuts" time-nuts-boun...@febo.com > A time-nuts@febo.com > Cc > Data Fri, 8 Jun 2018 15:46:50 +0200 > Oggetto Re: [time-nuts] Raw phase data of super-5065 > This is a 6 days run of a modified 5065'B' against GPS. > > Adrian > > Am 08.06.2018 um 14:05 schrieb tim...@timeok.it: >> Here a ten days simultaneously run of the A and B version compared with my >> HP Z3816A GPSDO. >> Luciano >> >> >> Da "time-nuts" time-nuts-boun...@febo.com >> A kb...@n1k.org >> Cc "time-nuts" time-nuts@febo.com >> Data Wed, 6 Jun 2018 08:18:27 +0200 >> Oggetto Re: [time-nuts] Raw phase data of super-5065 >> >> Hi, >> >> certainly the environmental effects are significant and it is precisely for >> this reason that >> acquisitions have been made simultaneously on two 5065, one modified and the >> other not. >> To verify the results the same measures were taken with another pair of >> 5065, one modified and the other not. >> This second test was carried out at another site 300Km from the first one. >> Both tests showed a better and more consistent medium/long term ADEV than >> the unmodified HP5065A. >> I want to clarify that these measures have the objective of verifying the >> medium / long term stability and not the short term stability of the Super >> version I agree it is improved.. >> Luciano >> >> >> Da "Bob kb8tq" kb...@n1k.org >> A "Luciano Paramithiotti" tim...@timeok.it,"Discussion of precise time and >> frequency measurement" time-nuts@febo.com >> Cc >> Data Tue, 5 Jun 2018 10:05:34 -0400 >> Oggetto Re: [time-nuts] Raw phase data of super-5065 >> Hi >> >> It is pretty well known that without “help” ( beyond the filter stuff on the >> super) the 5065 has fairly poor temperature >> stability and somewhat variable response to pressure and humidity. Taking >> two samples right off the production line >> likely would have given you different long term data as a result. >> >> If you are going to the trouble of watching these devices for a long time, >> monitor temperature, pressure and humidity. >> I suspect you will find correlations …. >> >> Bob >> >>> On Jun 5, 2018, at 5:44 AM, tim...@timeok.it wrote: >>> >>> >>> Hi Attila, >>> I am doing the long therm stability test on a couple of HP5065, one >>> original A type, the second B or "super" compared with my best long therm >>> stability, a GPSDO HPz3816A. >>> This test will be 30 days long. It is a second test, with a second couple >>> of HP5065A/B, to verify the long therm stability of both the version. >>> >>> Up to now the data available for version B or "super" only concerned the >>> improvement of phase noise. >>> >>> From the first results it seems that the HP5065A is more stable within >>> 30days than the modified version with the filter. >>> It must be considered that the short-term stability of 5065 is better than >>> the GPSDO / TICC up to 10-80k sec then, in this test configuration the >>> valid data will be beyond these values. >>> The results will be ready within 28 days and I will be happy to share them >>> in order to have everyone's opinion. >>> Regards, >>> Luciano >>> >>> >>> Da "time-nuts" time-nuts-boun...@febo.com >>> A "Discussion of precise time and frequency measurement" time-nuts@febo.com >>> Cc >>> Data Mon, 4 Jun 2018 10:11:50 +0200 >>> Oggetto [time-nuts] Raw phase data of super-5065 >>> Hoi zäme! >>> >>> Would one (preferably multiple) of the owners of a super-5065 be so kind >>> and share the raw phase data of an super-5065 against a stable reference >>> with me? The longer the data trace, the better. >>> >>> Thanks in advance! >>> >>> Attila Kinali >>> >>> -- >>> It is upon moral qualities that a society is ultimately founded. All >>> the prosperity and technological sophistication in the world is of no >>> use without that foundation. >>> -- Miss Matheson, The Diamond Age, Neil Stephenson >>> ___ >>> time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com >>> To unsubscribe, go to >>> https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts >>> and follow the instructions there. >>> ___ >>> time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com >>> To unsubscribe, go to >>> https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts >>>
Re: [time-nuts] Raw phase data of super-5065
Hi Adrian, as you know, to get real data up to 100K sec range, you should acquire at least 500K 1M sec. I say this from my personal experience. Soon I will have my 30 days run for both the A and B version of the HP5065. Very interesting the response of the GPSDO in the range 1 to 100 sec that I had never had the chance to see for lack of an instrument as your A7. ciao, Luciano Da "time-nuts" time-nuts-boun...@febo.com A time-nuts@febo.com Cc Data Fri, 8 Jun 2018 15:46:50 +0200 Oggetto Re: [time-nuts] Raw phase data of super-5065 This is a 6 days run of a modified 5065'B' against GPS. Adrian Am 08.06.2018 um 14:05 schrieb tim...@timeok.it: > Here a ten days simultaneously run of the A and B version compared with my HP Z3816A GPSDO. > Luciano > > > Da "time-nuts" time-nuts-boun...@febo.com > A kb...@n1k.org > Cc "time-nuts" time-nuts@febo.com > Data Wed, 6 Jun 2018 08:18:27 +0200 > Oggetto Re: [time-nuts] Raw phase data of super-5065 > > Hi, > > certainly the environmental effects are significant and it is precisely for this reason that > acquisitions have been made simultaneously on two 5065, one modified and the other not. > To verify the results the same measures were taken with another pair of 5065, one modified and the other not. > This second test was carried out at another site 300Km from the first one. > Both tests showed a better and more consistent medium/long term ADEV than the unmodified HP5065A. > I want to clarify that these measures have the objective of verifying the medium / long term stability and not the short term stability of the Super version I agree it is improved.. > Luciano > > > Da "Bob kb8tq" kb...@n1k.org > A "Luciano Paramithiotti" tim...@timeok.it,"Discussion of precise time and frequency measurement" time-nuts@febo.com > Cc > Data Tue, 5 Jun 2018 10:05:34 -0400 > Oggetto Re: [time-nuts] Raw phase data of super-5065 > Hi > > It is pretty well known that without “help” ( beyond the filter stuff on the super) the 5065 has fairly poor temperature > stability and somewhat variable response to pressure and humidity. Taking two samples right off the production line > likely would have given you different long term data as a result. > > If you are going to the trouble of watching these devices for a long time, monitor temperature, pressure and humidity. > I suspect you will find correlations …. > > Bob > > > On Jun 5, 2018, at 5:44 AM, tim...@timeok.it wrote: > > > > > > Hi Attila, > > I am doing the long therm stability test on a couple of HP5065, one original A type, the second B or "super" compared with my best long therm stability, a GPSDO HPz3816A. > > This test will be 30 days long. It is a second test, with a second couple of HP5065A/B, to verify the long therm stability of both the version. > > > > Up to now the data available for version B or "super" only concerned the improvement of phase noise. > > > > From the first results it seems that the HP5065A is more stable within 30days than the modified version with the filter. > > It must be considered that the short-term stability of 5065 is better than the GPSDO / TICC up to 10-80k sec then, in this test configuration the valid data will be beyond these values. > > The results will be ready within 28 days and I will be happy to share them in order to have everyone's opinion. > > Regards, > > Luciano > > > > > > Da "time-nuts" time-nuts-boun...@febo.com > > A "Discussion of precise time and frequency measurement" time-nuts@febo.com > > Cc > > Data Mon, 4 Jun 2018 10:11:50 +0200 > > Oggetto [time-nuts] Raw phase data of super-5065 > > Hoi zäme! > > > > Would one (preferably multiple) of the owners of a super-5065 be so kind > > and share the raw phase data of an super-5065 against a stable reference > > with me? The longer the data trace, the better. > > > > Thanks in advance! > > > > Attila Kinali > > > > -- > > It is upon moral qualities that a society is ultimately founded. All > > the prosperity and technological sophistication in the world is of no > > use without that foundation. > > -- Miss Matheson, The Diamond Age, Neil Stephenson > > ___ > > time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com > > To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts > > and follow the instructions there. > > ___ > > time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com > > To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts > > and follow the instructions there. > ___ > time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com > To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.
Re: [time-nuts] Raw phase data of super-5065
Hi Having run tens of thousands of standards on these sorts of tests … the one that is more temperature / pressure sensitive *will* show up as having worse long term stability. 1) If your environment swings +/- 1C over 48 hours. 2) If unit A is 1 ppb 0 to 50 ( = 20 ppt / C) 3) If unit B is -0.2 ppb 0 to 50C ( = -4 ppt / C) 4) Both will have degraded stability on a plot that shows 2 days of data 5) Unit A is “at spec” for the 5065, unit B is better than the rated performance. After many decades .. who knows what the spec is …. Unit B will show up as 5X better on a long term test than unit A with both in *exactly* the same environment. Holding 1 C over 2 days is doing well even for some ( but not all ) environmental chambers. I’m by no means claiming that this *is* the only source of the difference. The point is that the temperature stability rating on these devices is not very good. They are quite temperature sensitive. There are a lot of OCXO’s out there that do much better on stability than a 5065 temperature wise. Bob > On Jun 8, 2018, at 10:07 AM, tim...@timeok.it wrote: > > Hi, > > This test requires that the two Rubidiun be installed in the same cabinet so > they are subject to the same temperature and atmospheric pressure. > Acquisitions were made simultaneously.To confirm the data collected, the same > test was repeated in another site with two different HP5065, one modified in > B or "supe" and the other unmodified. > > The results were very similar, that is, both the Super version has a worse > lmedium term Adev than the unmodified version. > All this suggests that the modification with the addition of the 780nm filter > worsens the medium term stability of the HP5065. > > Therefore I would tend to exclude that the results obtained depend on the > different sensitiveness towards atmospheric pressure or to the variations of > the environmental temperature. > > It would be interesting that for further confirmation of what I have deduced > other people could carry out the same tests in the medium and long term Adev > stability. > > Luciano > www.timeok.it > > > > > > Da "Bob kb8tq" kb...@n1k.org > A "Luciano Paramithiotti" tim...@timeok.it,"Discussion of precise time and > frequency measurement" time-nuts@febo.com > Cc > Data Fri, 8 Jun 2018 09:02:34 -0400 > Oggetto Re: [time-nuts] Raw phase data of super-5065 > > Hi > > Ok, so this question should not come as a great surprise: Does one of the > 5065’s have about 3X the temperature > sensitivity of the other? ( or pressure or humidity ). > > Bob > > > > > On Jun 8, 2018, at 8:05 AM, tim...@timeok.it wrote: > > > > > > Here a ten days simultaneously run of the A and B version compared with my > > HP Z3816A GPSDO. > > Luciano > > > > > > Da "time-nuts" time-nuts-boun...@febo.com > > A kb...@n1k.org > > Cc "time-nuts" time-nuts@febo.com > > Data Wed, 6 Jun 2018 08:18:27 +0200 > > Oggetto Re: [time-nuts] Raw phase data of super-5065 > > > > Hi, > > > > certainly the environmental effects are significant and it is precisely for > > this reason that > > acquisitions have been made simultaneously on two 5065, one modified and > > the other not. > > To verify the results the same measures were taken with another pair of > > 5065, one modified and the other not. > > This second test was carried out at another site 300Km from the first one. > > Both tests showed a better and more consistent medium/long term ADEV than > > the unmodified HP5065A. > > I want to clarify that these measures have the objective of verifying the > > medium / long term stability and not the short term stability of the Super > > version I agree it is improved.. > > Luciano > > > > > > Da "Bob kb8tq" kb...@n1k.org > > A "Luciano Paramithiotti" tim...@timeok.it,"Discussion of precise time and > > frequency measurement" time-nuts@febo.com > > Cc > > Data Tue, 5 Jun 2018 10:05:34 -0400 > > Oggetto Re: [time-nuts] Raw phase data of super-5065 > > Hi > > > > It is pretty well known that without “help” ( beyond the filter stuff on > > the super) the 5065 has fairly poor temperature > > stability and somewhat variable response to pressure and humidity. Taking > > two samples right off the production line > > likely would have given you different long term data as a result. > > > > If you are going to the trouble of watching these devices for a long time, > > monitor temperature, pressure and humidity. > > I suspect you will find correlations …. > > > > Bob > > > >> On Jun 5, 2018, at 5:44 AM, tim...@timeok.it wrote: > >> > >> > >> Hi Attila, > >> I am doing the long therm stability test on a couple of HP5065, one > >> original A type, the second B or "super" compared with my best long therm > >> stability, a GPSDO HPz3816A. > >> This test will be 30 days long. It is a second test, with a second couple > >> of HP5065A/B, to verify the long therm stability of both the version. > >> > >> Up to now the data available for ver
Re: [time-nuts] Raw phase data of super-5065
Hi, This test requires that the two Rubidiun be installed in the same cabinet so they are subject to the same temperature and atmospheric pressure. Acquisitions were made simultaneously.To confirm the data collected, the same test was repeated in another site with two different HP5065, one modified in B or "supe" and the other unmodified. The results were very similar, that is, both the Super version has a worse lmedium term Adev than the unmodified version. All this suggests that the modification with the addition of the 780nm filter worsens the medium term stability of the HP5065. Therefore I would tend to exclude that the results obtained depend on the different sensitiveness towards atmospheric pressure or to the variations of the environmental temperature. It would be interesting that for further confirmation of what I have deduced other people could carry out the same tests in the medium and long term Adev stability. Luciano www.timeok.it Da "Bob kb8tq" kb...@n1k.org A "Luciano Paramithiotti" tim...@timeok.it,"Discussion of precise time and frequency measurement" time-nuts@febo.com Cc Data Fri, 8 Jun 2018 09:02:34 -0400 Oggetto Re: [time-nuts] Raw phase data of super-5065 Hi Ok, so this question should not come as a great surprise: Does one of the 5065’s have about 3X the temperature sensitivity of the other? ( or pressure or humidity ). Bob > On Jun 8, 2018, at 8:05 AM, tim...@timeok.it wrote: > > > Here a ten days simultaneously run of the A and B version compared with my HP Z3816A GPSDO. > Luciano > > > Da "time-nuts" time-nuts-boun...@febo.com > A kb...@n1k.org > Cc "time-nuts" time-nuts@febo.com > Data Wed, 6 Jun 2018 08:18:27 +0200 > Oggetto Re: [time-nuts] Raw phase data of super-5065 > > Hi, > > certainly the environmental effects are significant and it is precisely for this reason that > acquisitions have been made simultaneously on two 5065, one modified and the other not. > To verify the results the same measures were taken with another pair of 5065, one modified and the other not. > This second test was carried out at another site 300Km from the first one. > Both tests showed a better and more consistent medium/long term ADEV than the unmodified HP5065A. > I want to clarify that these measures have the objective of verifying the medium / long term stability and not the short term stability of the Super version I agree it is improved.. > Luciano > > > Da "Bob kb8tq" kb...@n1k.org > A "Luciano Paramithiotti" tim...@timeok.it,"Discussion of precise time and frequency measurement" time-nuts@febo.com > Cc > Data Tue, 5 Jun 2018 10:05:34 -0400 > Oggetto Re: [time-nuts] Raw phase data of super-5065 > Hi > > It is pretty well known that without “help” ( beyond the filter stuff on the super) the 5065 has fairly poor temperature > stability and somewhat variable response to pressure and humidity. Taking two samples right off the production line > likely would have given you different long term data as a result. > > If you are going to the trouble of watching these devices for a long time, monitor temperature, pressure and humidity. > I suspect you will find correlations …. > > Bob > >> On Jun 5, 2018, at 5:44 AM, tim...@timeok.it wrote: >> >> >> Hi Attila, >> I am doing the long therm stability test on a couple of HP5065, one original A type, the second B or "super" compared with my best long therm stability, a GPSDO HPz3816A. >> This test will be 30 days long. It is a second test, with a second couple of HP5065A/B, to verify the long therm stability of both the version. >> >> Up to now the data available for version B or "super" only concerned the improvement of phase noise. >> >> From the first results it seems that the HP5065A is more stable within 30days than the modified version with the filter. >> It must be considered that the short-term stability of 5065 is better than the GPSDO / TICC up to 10-80k sec then, in this test configuration the valid data will be beyond these values. >> The results will be ready within 28 days and I will be happy to share them in order to have everyone's opinion. >> Regards, >> Luciano >> >> >> Da "time-nuts" time-nuts-boun...@febo.com >> A "Discussion of precise time and frequency measurement" time-nuts@febo.com >> Cc >> Data Mon, 4 Jun 2018 10:11:50 +0200 >> Oggetto [time-nuts] Raw phase data of super-5065 >> Hoi zäme! >> >> Would one (preferably multiple) of the owners of a super-5065 be so kind >> and share the raw phase data of an super-5065 against a stable reference >> with me? The longer the data trace, the better. >> >> Thanks in advance! >> >> Attila Kinali >> >> -- >> It is upon moral qualities that a society is ultimately founded. All >> th
Re: [time-nuts] Raw phase data of super-5065
Hi Ok, so this question should not come as a great surprise: Does one of the 5065’s have about 3X the temperature sensitivity of the other? ( or pressure or humidity ). Bob > On Jun 8, 2018, at 8:05 AM, tim...@timeok.it wrote: > > > Here a ten days simultaneously run of the A and B version compared with my > HP Z3816A GPSDO. > Luciano > > > Da "time-nuts" time-nuts-boun...@febo.com > A kb...@n1k.org > Cc "time-nuts" time-nuts@febo.com > Data Wed, 6 Jun 2018 08:18:27 +0200 > Oggetto Re: [time-nuts] Raw phase data of super-5065 > > Hi, > > certainly the environmental effects are significant and it is precisely for > this reason that > acquisitions have been made simultaneously on two 5065, one modified and > the other not. > To verify the results the same measures were taken with another pair of > 5065, one modified and the other not. > This second test was carried out at another site 300Km from the first one. > Both tests showed a better and more consistent medium/long term ADEV than > the unmodified HP5065A. > I want to clarify that these measures have the objective of verifying the > medium / long term stability and not the short term stability of the Super > version I agree it is improved.. > Luciano > > > Da "Bob kb8tq" kb...@n1k.org > A "Luciano Paramithiotti" tim...@timeok.it,"Discussion of precise time and > frequency measurement" time-nuts@febo.com > Cc > Data Tue, 5 Jun 2018 10:05:34 -0400 > Oggetto Re: [time-nuts] Raw phase data of super-5065 > Hi > > It is pretty well known that without “help” ( beyond the filter stuff on > the super) the 5065 has fairly poor temperature > stability and somewhat variable response to pressure and humidity. Taking > two samples right off the production line > likely would have given you different long term data as a result. > > If you are going to the trouble of watching these devices for a long time, > monitor temperature, pressure and humidity. > I suspect you will find correlations …. > > Bob > >> On Jun 5, 2018, at 5:44 AM, tim...@timeok.it wrote: >> >> >> Hi Attila, >> I am doing the long therm stability test on a couple of HP5065, one original >> A type, the second B or "super" compared with my best long therm stability, >> a GPSDO HPz3816A. >> This test will be 30 days long. It is a second test, with a second couple of >> HP5065A/B, to verify the long therm stability of both the version. >> >> Up to now the data available for version B or "super" only concerned the >> improvement of phase noise. >> >> From the first results it seems that the HP5065A is more stable within >> 30days than the modified version with the filter. >> It must be considered that the short-term stability of 5065 is better than >> the GPSDO / TICC up to 10-80k sec then, in this test configuration the valid >> data will be beyond these values. >> The results will be ready within 28 days and I will be happy to share them >> in order to have everyone's opinion. >> Regards, >> Luciano >> >> >> Da "time-nuts" time-nuts-boun...@febo.com >> A "Discussion of precise time and frequency measurement" time-nuts@febo.com >> Cc >> Data Mon, 4 Jun 2018 10:11:50 +0200 >> Oggetto [time-nuts] Raw phase data of super-5065 >> Hoi zäme! >> >> Would one (preferably multiple) of the owners of a super-5065 be so kind >> and share the raw phase data of an super-5065 against a stable reference >> with me? The longer the data trace, the better. >> >> Thanks in advance! >> >> Attila Kinali >> >> -- >> It is upon moral qualities that a society is ultimately founded. All >> the prosperity and technological sophistication in the world is of no >> use without that foundation. >> -- Miss Matheson, The Diamond Age, Neil Stephenson >> ___ >> time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com >> To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts >> and follow the instructions there. >> ___ >> time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com >> To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts >> and follow the instructions there. > ___ > time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com > To unsubscribe, go to > https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts > and follow the instructions there. > ___ > time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com > To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts > and follow the instructions there. ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
[time-nuts] EROS-800-MA-90 pinout?
Hi, I have four EROS 5MHz oscillator brand new. The external connections are via an octal connector. On the top there are coarse and fine tuning trim. Does anyone have the pin connection and technical data? Thank you Luciano ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
