Re: [time-nuts] 5071A with ATTENTION flashing
Hi Tom It looks very clean inside. I think they should be from some lab. There is one with a label CEVA xx on it. I told him all the information I collected from the serial port. As a reward to travel 200km help him determine the status of these 5071s, he gave me 2 PRS10 rubidium oscillators. I also told him to keep the leaky one running for days and see what's going on. If it goes to normal, price will x2 or more. regards Li Ang ---Original--- From: "Tom Van Baak"<t...@leapsecond.com> Date: 2016/11/13 19:34:59 To: "Discussion of precise time and frequency measurement"<time-nuts@febo.com>; Subject: Re: [time-nuts] 5071A with ATTENTION flashing > Since the ion pump current was dropping slowly.(80uA to 76uA in 1 hour), is > it possible to be back to normal? Hi Li, Yes, is it possible. Never give up on ion current. Give it hours, give it days if necessary. Monitor the LCD or syst:print? periodically and plot the trend. The trend may be linear (you may only need to wait for hours). The trend my be logarithmic (you may need to wait for days). If the trend looks like it will eventually drop below 1 uA that is good news. You just have to wait. If the 5071A gives a fatal error and turns off the ion pump for safety, then power cycle to try again. What you are seeing is not normal behavior. But given the chance that you might get a tube that works, even for a little while, that is worth something. Do you know where these 5071A were installed, or what they were used for? If it looks like the ion pump current will never drop to 1 uA, even after several days, then you may have a vacuum leak or failed ion pump or too much outgassing or something. Try swapping tubes to see if the new frame shows a similar ion pump reading and trend. If so, then both frames are ok and the tube is bad. I don't know of a fix for this. Cesium tubes fail for many reasons, not just running out of cesium. /tvb ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there. ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
Re: [time-nuts] 5071A with ATTENTION flashing
> Since the ion pump current was dropping slowly.(80uA to 76uA in 1 hour), is > it possible to be back to normal? Hi Li, Yes, is it possible. Never give up on ion current. Give it hours, give it days if necessary. Monitor the LCD or syst:print? periodically and plot the trend. The trend may be linear (you may only need to wait for hours). The trend my be logarithmic (you may need to wait for days). If the trend looks like it will eventually drop below 1 uA that is good news. You just have to wait. If the 5071A gives a fatal error and turns off the ion pump for safety, then power cycle to try again. What you are seeing is not normal behavior. But given the chance that you might get a tube that works, even for a little while, that is worth something. Do you know where these 5071A were installed, or what they were used for? If it looks like the ion pump current will never drop to 1 uA, even after several days, then you may have a vacuum leak or failed ion pump or too much outgassing or something. Try swapping tubes to see if the new frame shows a similar ion pump reading and trend. If so, then both frames are ok and the tube is bad. I don't know of a fix for this. Cesium tubes fail for many reasons, not just running out of cesium. /tvb ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
Re: [time-nuts] 5071A with ATTENTION flashing
HI I just came back from another 5071a seller. #1-#3 fatal error: max emult. #4 fatal error: overcureent (about 80uA) I put the tube from #1 to #4. #4 became a "max emult" one. I think the tube #1 is really dead and the circuit of #4 is functional. Since the ion pump current was dropping slowly.(80uA to 76uA in 1 hour), is it possible to be back to normal? regards LiAng BI7LNQ ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
Re: [time-nuts] 5071A with ATTENTION flashing
Hi I have said goodbye to this one. There are 5 more 5071A with yellow led flashing to visit this weekend. Regards LiAng BI7LNQ ---Original--- From: "Tom Van Baak"<t...@leapsecond.com> Date: 2016/11/10 06:28:45 To: "Discussion of precise time and frequency measurement"<time-nuts@febo.com>; Subject: Re: [time-nuts] 5071A with ATTENTION flashing Hi Li, 1) When there is a "fatal error" the unit goes back into standby mode, where the Cs oven is turned off. Hence the Cs oven temperature error will again be at its maximum value (which is that -9.55 number). This is by design. I use a script to send a scpi syst:print? command once a minute, in additional to logging diagnostic information. That way you can see the unit slowly warm up and see how each of the readings stabilizes over time. What you may find is that the temp error starts at -9.55 and then slowly decreases to zero as the Cs oven warms up. If lock is not achieved the oven is turned off and the error slowly climbs back down to -9.55. This is by design. 2) Under ideal conditions a 5071A will lock within 10 to 15 minutes. But if the tube has been idle for months or years it can take half an hour or more. During this time the ion pump slowly improves the vacuum. So having a log file of periodic syst:print output allows you to follow the progress; of the ion pump, of the ovens, etc. The fact that the log has only one entry suggests that someone cleared the entire log before you saw the instrument. That's unfortunate. It gives the impression the seller had something to hide. 3) Some comments on the diag information: > Cs oven is up This suggests there's nothing wrong with the ion pump or the cesium oven. Your oven heater and controller are fine. > Low Cs beam signal = 3 This is consistent with a tube that's used up all its cesium. > Raising emult voltage... > Low Cs signal (37) with max Emult This is consistent with a 5071 that's trying very hard to get enough beam signal, but there just isn't enough cesium left. If a high-performance tube, this is expected after 7 to 10 years of use. > Fatal Error (see Log) Unlike older cesium standards, the 5071A is quite clever. When there's nothing else to do, it does a clean shutdown of ovens and reports a fatal error. The unit goes into standby. When I refuse to give up I try powering up the unit again and again several times a day. If I suspect the tube is the problem I swap tubes from a working 5071 frame. This is a very simple way to decide if the problem is the frame or the tube. After a couple of days of trying, and if the diag messages and fatal errors are consistent, then I finally admit defeat and mark the tube bad. The good news is you then have an entire frame of spare parts! And also a Cs tube to put on the "Dremel" pile! Finally, remember that even in standby mode, a 5071A makes a very attractive, high-quality 10 MHz quartz standard, with multiple output frequencies, with high-resolution digital frequency tuning, a LED clock and 1PPS input/output. You can turn it into a GPSDO by sending phase or frequency step SCPI commands. That is, there's no need for a DAC or EFC; we've talked before on the list about the advantages of a DDS-based GPSDO instead of the traditional DAC/EFC method. /tvb - Original Message - From: Li Ang To: Tom Van Baak ; Discussion of precise time and frequency measurement Sent: Tuesday, November 08, 2016 10:48 PM Subject: Re: [time-nuts] 5071A with ATTENTION flashing Hi Tom I have collected the log from it. Log level is service. The 9.2G pll pass the test today. The log during the power-up process is also included. Regards Li Ang / BI7LNQ - scpi > MJD0 02:02:18 CBT ID: 3128A00642(H) Status summary: Fatal Error (see Log) ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there. ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
Re: [time-nuts] 5071A with ATTENTION flashing
Hi Li, 1) When there is a "fatal error" the unit goes back into standby mode, where the Cs oven is turned off. Hence the Cs oven temperature error will again be at its maximum value (which is that -9.55 number). This is by design. I use a script to send a scpi syst:print? command once a minute, in additional to logging diagnostic information. That way you can see the unit slowly warm up and see how each of the readings stabilizes over time. What you may find is that the temp error starts at -9.55 and then slowly decreases to zero as the Cs oven warms up. If lock is not achieved the oven is turned off and the error slowly climbs back down to -9.55. This is by design. 2) Under ideal conditions a 5071A will lock within 10 to 15 minutes. But if the tube has been idle for months or years it can take half an hour or more. During this time the ion pump slowly improves the vacuum. So having a log file of periodic syst:print output allows you to follow the progress; of the ion pump, of the ovens, etc. The fact that the log has only one entry suggests that someone cleared the entire log before you saw the instrument. That's unfortunate. It gives the impression the seller had something to hide. 3) Some comments on the diag information: > Cs oven is up This suggests there's nothing wrong with the ion pump or the cesium oven. Your oven heater and controller are fine. > Low Cs beam signal = 3 This is consistent with a tube that's used up all its cesium. > Raising emult voltage... > Low Cs signal (37) with max Emult This is consistent with a 5071 that's trying very hard to get enough beam signal, but there just isn't enough cesium left. If a high-performance tube, this is expected after 7 to 10 years of use. > Fatal Error (see Log) Unlike older cesium standards, the 5071A is quite clever. When there's nothing else to do, it does a clean shutdown of ovens and reports a fatal error. The unit goes into standby. When I refuse to give up I try powering up the unit again and again several times a day. If I suspect the tube is the problem I swap tubes from a working 5071 frame. This is a very simple way to decide if the problem is the frame or the tube. After a couple of days of trying, and if the diag messages and fatal errors are consistent, then I finally admit defeat and mark the tube bad. The good news is you then have an entire frame of spare parts! And also a Cs tube to put on the "Dremel" pile! Finally, remember that even in standby mode, a 5071A makes a very attractive, high-quality 10 MHz quartz standard, with multiple output frequencies, with high-resolution digital frequency tuning, a LED clock and 1PPS input/output. You can turn it into a GPSDO by sending phase or frequency step SCPI commands. That is, there's no need for a DAC or EFC; we've talked before on the list about the advantages of a DDS-based GPSDO instead of the traditional DAC/EFC method. /tvb - Original Message - From: Li Ang To: Tom Van Baak ; Discussion of precise time and frequency measurement Sent: Tuesday, November 08, 2016 10:48 PM Subject: Re: [time-nuts] 5071A with ATTENTION flashing Hi Tom I have collected the log from it. Log level is service. The 9.2G pll pass the test today. The log during the power-up process is also included. Regards Li Ang / BI7LNQ - scpi > MJD0 02:02:18 CBT ID: 3128A00642(H) Status summary: Fatal Error (see Log) ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
Re: [time-nuts] 5071A with ATTENTION flashing
Regarding error codes in the 5071A. This "feature" was an afterthought. All of us hardware designers brought out test points that were easy to implement and then the microcontroller polled them and software was written to give error reports. We did what was easy on already finished board designs; not what would be optimum if designing from the ground up. If you can repair a 5071 based on the error code, consider yourself lucky. It is analogous to that old gag about the drunk who is crawling around under the only street light in the neighborhood. A bystander asks him what he is doing and he says he is searching for his wallet that he lost. The bystander asks him where he lost it and he says "on the next block". The bystander asks him why search here and he says this is the only place with light. Rick ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
Re: [time-nuts] 5071A with ATTENTION flashing
Yes, I'm sorry about that. On Wed, Nov 9, 2016 at 5:18 PM, paul swed <paulsw...@gmail.com> wrote: > Adrian > I think you may have responded to the wrong thread?? > Regards > Paul > > On Wed, Nov 9, 2016 at 10:21 AM, Adrian Godwin <artgod...@gmail.com> > wrote: > > > I'm still struggling to get the acrylic I need. I've been into London a > few > > times but not been able to get to the shop in business hours. Guess I > could > > order online if necessary but it will cost a fair bit more. > > > > On Wed, Nov 9, 2016 at 3:19 PM, paul swed <paulsw...@gmail.com> wrote: > > > > > I saw the low CBT temp also and 10 degrees C seem like allot. However > in > > > the 5060/5061 Frankenstein I run the oven at +10 degrees (approx.) to > > what > > > the tube asks for. To drive C fumes out of the oven. A possible > > assumption > > > is the cooler oven is emitting fewer C's and the emult is trying to > make > > up > > > for it. > > > > > > Li > > > If it were mine and I checked the other suggestions. I would if > > convenient > > > actually attempt to raise the oven temp a bit to see what happens. I > > would > > > measure current and use an external supply to match it and then gently > > > increase the current. But from the thread you do not own it and I > think a > > > large amount of money was at stake. > > > > > > Regards > > > Paul > > > WB8TSL > > > > > > > > > On Wed, Nov 9, 2016 at 7:52 AM, Scott McGrath <scmcgr...@gmail.com> > > wrote: > > > > > > > that's telling you that the CBT oven is not up to temp so you could > > have > > > > a failed heater in the tube or the oven controller is malfunctioning > > > > > > > > The former well you need a new tube which symmetricom will be happy > to > > > > sell you for a 5 figure price tag. > > > > > > > > The latter is limited by your repair skills and parts and data > > > availability > > > > > > > > Content by Scott > > > > Typos by Siri > > > > > > > > > On Nov 9, 2016, at 7:42 AM, Li Ang <379...@qq.com> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > According to the Log, "CBT Oven Err: -9.55 C" might be something > > wrong. > > > > However, I can't find the correct range in the manual. Does anyone > have > > > the > > > > information about this parameter? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Regards > > > > > Li Ang > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > -- Original -- > > > > > From: "Li Ang";<379...@qq.com>; > > > > > Date: Wed, Nov 9, 2016 02:48 PM > > > > > To: "Tom Van Baak"<t...@leapsecond.com>; "Discussion of precise > time > > > > and frequency measurement"<time-nuts@febo.com>; > > > > > > > > > > Subject: Re: [time-nuts] 5071A with ATTENTION flashing > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Hi Tom > > > > > > > > > > I have collected the log from it. Log level is service. The 9.2G > pll > > > > pass the test today. The log during the power-up process is also > > > included. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Regards > > > > > > > > > > Li Ang / BI7LNQ > > > > > > > > > > - > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > scpi > > > > > > > > > > > MJD0 02:02:18 > > > > > > > > > > CBT ID: 3128A00642(H) > > > > > > > > > > Status summary: Fatal Error (see Log) > > > > > > > > > > Power source: AC > > > > > > > > > > Log status: One entry > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Freq Offset: 0e-15 Osc. control: -9.56 % > > > > > > > > > > RF amplitude 1: 6.3 %RF amplitude 2: 6.3 % > > > > > > > > > > Zeeman Freq: 39949 Hz C-field curr:12.213 mA > > > > > > > > > > E-multiplier: 2553 VSign
Re: [time-nuts] 5071A with ATTENTION flashing
Adrian I think you may have responded to the wrong thread?? Regards Paul On Wed, Nov 9, 2016 at 10:21 AM, Adrian Godwin <artgod...@gmail.com> wrote: > I'm still struggling to get the acrylic I need. I've been into London a few > times but not been able to get to the shop in business hours. Guess I could > order online if necessary but it will cost a fair bit more. > > On Wed, Nov 9, 2016 at 3:19 PM, paul swed <paulsw...@gmail.com> wrote: > > > I saw the low CBT temp also and 10 degrees C seem like allot. However in > > the 5060/5061 Frankenstein I run the oven at +10 degrees (approx.) to > what > > the tube asks for. To drive C fumes out of the oven. A possible > assumption > > is the cooler oven is emitting fewer C's and the emult is trying to make > up > > for it. > > > > Li > > If it were mine and I checked the other suggestions. I would if > convenient > > actually attempt to raise the oven temp a bit to see what happens. I > would > > measure current and use an external supply to match it and then gently > > increase the current. But from the thread you do not own it and I think a > > large amount of money was at stake. > > > > Regards > > Paul > > WB8TSL > > > > > > On Wed, Nov 9, 2016 at 7:52 AM, Scott McGrath <scmcgr...@gmail.com> > wrote: > > > > > that's telling you that the CBT oven is not up to temp so you could > have > > > a failed heater in the tube or the oven controller is malfunctioning > > > > > > The former well you need a new tube which symmetricom will be happy to > > > sell you for a 5 figure price tag. > > > > > > The latter is limited by your repair skills and parts and data > > availability > > > > > > Content by Scott > > > Typos by Siri > > > > > > > On Nov 9, 2016, at 7:42 AM, Li Ang <379...@qq.com> wrote: > > > > > > > > According to the Log, "CBT Oven Err: -9.55 C" might be something > wrong. > > > However, I can't find the correct range in the manual. Does anyone have > > the > > > information about this parameter? > > > > > > > > > > > > Regards > > > > Li Ang > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > -- Original -- > > > > From: "Li Ang";<379...@qq.com>; > > > > Date: Wed, Nov 9, 2016 02:48 PM > > > > To: "Tom Van Baak"<t...@leapsecond.com>; "Discussion of precise time > > > and frequency measurement"<time-nuts@febo.com>; > > > > > > > > Subject: Re: [time-nuts] 5071A with ATTENTION flashing > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Hi Tom > > > > > > > > I have collected the log from it. Log level is service. The 9.2G pll > > > pass the test today. The log during the power-up process is also > > included. > > > > > > > > > > > > Regards > > > > > > > > Li Ang / BI7LNQ > > > > > > > > - > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > scpi > > > > > > > > > MJD0 02:02:18 > > > > > > > > CBT ID: 3128A00642(H) > > > > > > > > Status summary: Fatal Error (see Log) > > > > > > > > Power source: AC > > > > > > > > Log status: One entry > > > > > > > > > > > > Freq Offset: 0e-15 Osc. control: -9.56 % > > > > > > > > RF amplitude 1: 6.3 %RF amplitude 2: 6.3 % > > > > > > > > Zeeman Freq: 39949 Hz C-field curr:12.213 mA > > > > > > > > E-multiplier: 2553 VSignal Gain: 14.4 % > > > > > > > > > > > > CBT Oven: 0.0 VCBT Oven Err: -9.55 C > > > > > > > > Osc. Oven: -9.1 VIon Pump: 0.4 uA > > > > > > > > HW Ionizer:-0.1 VMass spec:12.3 V > > > > > > > > SAW Tuning: 0.0 VDRO Tuning: 7.3 V > > > > > > > > 87MHz PLL: 0.8 VuP Clock PLL: 1.8 V > > > > > > > > +12V supply: 12.3 V-12V supply: -12.3 V > > > > > > > > +5V supply:5.4 VThermometer: 46.2 C > > &
Re: [time-nuts] 5071A with ATTENTION flashing
I'm still struggling to get the acrylic I need. I've been into London a few times but not been able to get to the shop in business hours. Guess I could order online if necessary but it will cost a fair bit more. On Wed, Nov 9, 2016 at 3:19 PM, paul swed <paulsw...@gmail.com> wrote: > I saw the low CBT temp also and 10 degrees C seem like allot. However in > the 5060/5061 Frankenstein I run the oven at +10 degrees (approx.) to what > the tube asks for. To drive C fumes out of the oven. A possible assumption > is the cooler oven is emitting fewer C's and the emult is trying to make up > for it. > > Li > If it were mine and I checked the other suggestions. I would if convenient > actually attempt to raise the oven temp a bit to see what happens. I would > measure current and use an external supply to match it and then gently > increase the current. But from the thread you do not own it and I think a > large amount of money was at stake. > > Regards > Paul > WB8TSL > > > On Wed, Nov 9, 2016 at 7:52 AM, Scott McGrath <scmcgr...@gmail.com> wrote: > > > that's telling you that the CBT oven is not up to temp so you could have > > a failed heater in the tube or the oven controller is malfunctioning > > > > The former well you need a new tube which symmetricom will be happy to > > sell you for a 5 figure price tag. > > > > The latter is limited by your repair skills and parts and data > availability > > > > Content by Scott > > Typos by Siri > > > > > On Nov 9, 2016, at 7:42 AM, Li Ang <379...@qq.com> wrote: > > > > > > According to the Log, "CBT Oven Err: -9.55 C" might be something wrong. > > However, I can't find the correct range in the manual. Does anyone have > the > > information about this parameter? > > > > > > > > > Regards > > > Li Ang > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ------ Original ------ > > > From: "Li Ang";<379...@qq.com>; > > > Date: Wed, Nov 9, 2016 02:48 PM > > > To: "Tom Van Baak"<t...@leapsecond.com>; "Discussion of precise time > > and frequency measurement"<time-nuts@febo.com>; > > > > > > Subject: Re: [time-nuts] 5071A with ATTENTION flashing > > > > > > > > > > > > Hi Tom > > > > > > I have collected the log from it. Log level is service. The 9.2G pll > > pass the test today. The log during the power-up process is also > included. > > > > > > > > > Regards > > > > > > Li Ang / BI7LNQ > > > > > > - > > > > > > > > > > > > scpi > > > > > > > MJD0 02:02:18 > > > > > > CBT ID: 3128A00642(H) > > > > > > Status summary: Fatal Error (see Log) > > > > > > Power source: AC > > > > > > Log status: One entry > > > > > > > > > Freq Offset: 0e-15 Osc. control: -9.56 % > > > > > > RF amplitude 1: 6.3 %RF amplitude 2: 6.3 % > > > > > > Zeeman Freq: 39949 Hz C-field curr:12.213 mA > > > > > > E-multiplier: 2553 VSignal Gain: 14.4 % > > > > > > > > > CBT Oven: 0.0 VCBT Oven Err: -9.55 C > > > > > > Osc. Oven: -9.1 VIon Pump: 0.4 uA > > > > > > HW Ionizer:-0.1 VMass spec:12.3 V > > > > > > SAW Tuning: 0.0 VDRO Tuning: 7.3 V > > > > > > 87MHz PLL: 0.8 VuP Clock PLL: 1.8 V > > > > > > +12V supply: 12.3 V-12V supply: -12.3 V > > > > > > +5V supply:5.4 VThermometer: 46.2 C > > > > > > > > > > > > scpi > > > > > > > scpi > ? > > > > > > E-103> exit > > > > > > E-113> > > > > > > E-113> Log status: One entry > > > > > > > > > Log 000 of MJD0 00:12:40: Low Cs signal (60) with max Emult > > > > > > > > > PASS: CBT register test > > > > > > PASS: CBT window comp test > > > > > > PASS: CBT therm test > > > > > > PASS: CBT Cs oven test > > > > > > PASS: CBT hw ion test > > > > > > PASS: CBT mass spec test > > > > > > PASS: CPU RTDS tes
Re: [time-nuts] 5071A with ATTENTION flashing
I saw the low CBT temp also and 10 degrees C seem like allot. However in the 5060/5061 Frankenstein I run the oven at +10 degrees (approx.) to what the tube asks for. To drive C fumes out of the oven. A possible assumption is the cooler oven is emitting fewer C's and the emult is trying to make up for it. Li If it were mine and I checked the other suggestions. I would if convenient actually attempt to raise the oven temp a bit to see what happens. I would measure current and use an external supply to match it and then gently increase the current. But from the thread you do not own it and I think a large amount of money was at stake. Regards Paul WB8TSL On Wed, Nov 9, 2016 at 7:52 AM, Scott McGrath <scmcgr...@gmail.com> wrote: > that's telling you that the CBT oven is not up to temp so you could have > a failed heater in the tube or the oven controller is malfunctioning > > The former well you need a new tube which symmetricom will be happy to > sell you for a 5 figure price tag. > > The latter is limited by your repair skills and parts and data availability > > Content by Scott > Typos by Siri > > > On Nov 9, 2016, at 7:42 AM, Li Ang <379...@qq.com> wrote: > > > > According to the Log, "CBT Oven Err: -9.55 C" might be something wrong. > However, I can't find the correct range in the manual. Does anyone have the > information about this parameter? > > > > > > Regards > > Li Ang > > > > > > > > > > -- Original -- > > From: "Li Ang";<379...@qq.com>; > > Date: Wed, Nov 9, 2016 02:48 PM > > To: "Tom Van Baak"<t...@leapsecond.com>; "Discussion of precise time > and frequency measurement"<time-nuts@febo.com>; > > > > Subject: Re: [time-nuts] 5071A with ATTENTION flashing > > > > > > > > Hi Tom > > > > I have collected the log from it. Log level is service. The 9.2G pll > pass the test today. The log during the power-up process is also included. > > > > > > Regards > > > > Li Ang / BI7LNQ > > > > - > > > > > > > > scpi > > > > > MJD0 02:02:18 > > > > CBT ID: 3128A00642(H) > > > > Status summary: Fatal Error (see Log) > > > > Power source: AC > > > > Log status: One entry > > > > > > Freq Offset: 0e-15 Osc. control: -9.56 % > > > > RF amplitude 1: 6.3 %RF amplitude 2: 6.3 % > > > > Zeeman Freq: 39949 Hz C-field curr:12.213 mA > > > > E-multiplier: 2553 VSignal Gain: 14.4 % > > > > > > CBT Oven: 0.0 VCBT Oven Err: -9.55 C > > > > Osc. Oven: -9.1 VIon Pump: 0.4 uA > > > > HW Ionizer:-0.1 VMass spec:12.3 V > > > > SAW Tuning: 0.0 VDRO Tuning: 7.3 V > > > > 87MHz PLL: 0.8 VuP Clock PLL: 1.8 V > > > > +12V supply: 12.3 V-12V supply: -12.3 V > > > > +5V supply:5.4 VThermometer: 46.2 C > > > > > > > > scpi > > > > > scpi > ? > > > > E-103> exit > > > > E-113> > > > > E-113> Log status: One entry > > > > > > Log 000 of MJD0 00:12:40: Low Cs signal (60) with max Emult > > > > > > PASS: CBT register test > > > > PASS: CBT window comp test > > > > PASS: CBT therm test > > > > PASS: CBT Cs oven test > > > > PASS: CBT hw ion test > > > > PASS: CBT mass spec test > > > > PASS: CPU RTDS test > > > > PASS: CPU clock locked test > > > > PASS: DDFS register test > > > > PASS: 87MHz PLL test > > > > PASS: 9.2 GHz PLL test > > > > PASS: Servo register test > > > > PASS: Servo convertor timeout test > > > > PASS: Interface register test > > > > PASS: Interface abus test > > > > PASS: Pps register test > > > > PASS: Pps interrupt test > > > > PASS: power logic signals test > > > > PASS: CBT register test > > > > PASS: CBT window comp test > > > > PASS: CBT therm test > > > > PASS: CBT Cs oven test > > > > PASS: CBT hw ion test > > > > PASS: CBT mass spec test > > > > PASS: CPU RTDS test > > > > PASS: CPU clock locked test > > > > PASS: DDFS register test > > > > PASS: 87MHz PLL test > > > > PASS
Re: [time-nuts] 5071A with ATTENTION flashing
that's telling you that the CBT oven is not up to temp so you could have a failed heater in the tube or the oven controller is malfunctioning The former well you need a new tube which symmetricom will be happy to sell you for a 5 figure price tag. The latter is limited by your repair skills and parts and data availability Content by Scott Typos by Siri > On Nov 9, 2016, at 7:42 AM, Li Ang <379...@qq.com> wrote: > > According to the Log, "CBT Oven Err: -9.55 C" might be something wrong. > However, I can't find the correct range in the manual. Does anyone have the > information about this parameter? > > > Regards > Li Ang > > > > > -- Original -- > From: "Li Ang";<379...@qq.com>; > Date: Wed, Nov 9, 2016 02:48 PM > To: "Tom Van Baak"<t...@leapsecond.com>; "Discussion of precise time and > frequency measurement"<time-nuts@febo.com>; > > Subject: Re: [time-nuts] 5071A with ATTENTION flashing > > > > Hi Tom > > I have collected the log from it. Log level is service. The 9.2G pll pass the > test today. The log during the power-up process is also included. > > > Regards > > Li Ang / BI7LNQ > > - > > > > scpi > > > MJD0 02:02:18 > > CBT ID: 3128A00642(H) > > Status summary: Fatal Error (see Log) > > Power source: AC > > Log status: One entry > > > Freq Offset: 0e-15 Osc. control: -9.56 % > > RF amplitude 1: 6.3 %RF amplitude 2: 6.3 % > > Zeeman Freq: 39949 Hz C-field curr:12.213 mA > > E-multiplier: 2553 VSignal Gain: 14.4 % > > > CBT Oven: 0.0 VCBT Oven Err: -9.55 C > > Osc. Oven: -9.1 VIon Pump: 0.4 uA > > HW Ionizer:-0.1 VMass spec:12.3 V > > SAW Tuning: 0.0 VDRO Tuning: 7.3 V > > 87MHz PLL: 0.8 VuP Clock PLL: 1.8 V > > +12V supply: 12.3 V-12V supply: -12.3 V > > +5V supply:5.4 VThermometer: 46.2 C > > > > scpi > > > scpi > ? > > E-103> exit > > E-113> > > E-113> Log status: One entry > > > Log 000 of MJD0 00:12:40: Low Cs signal (60) with max Emult > > > PASS: CBT register test > > PASS: CBT window comp test > > PASS: CBT therm test > > PASS: CBT Cs oven test > > PASS: CBT hw ion test > > PASS: CBT mass spec test > > PASS: CPU RTDS test > > PASS: CPU clock locked test > > PASS: DDFS register test > > PASS: 87MHz PLL test > > PASS: 9.2 GHz PLL test > > PASS: Servo register test > > PASS: Servo convertor timeout test > > PASS: Interface register test > > PASS: Interface abus test > > PASS: Pps register test > > PASS: Pps interrupt test > > PASS: power logic signals test > > PASS: CBT register test > > PASS: CBT window comp test > > PASS: CBT therm test > > PASS: CBT Cs oven test > > PASS: CBT hw ion test > > PASS: CBT mass spec test > > PASS: CPU RTDS test > > PASS: CPU clock locked test > > PASS: DDFS register test > > PASS: 87MHz PLL test > > PASS: 9.2 GHz PLL test > > PASS: Servo register test > > PASS: Servo convertor timeout test > > PASS: Interface register test > > PASS: Interface abus test > > PASS: Pps register test > > PASS: Pps interrupt test > > PASS: power logic signals test > > PASS: CBT register test > > PASS: CBT window comp test > > PASS: CBT therm test > > PASS: CBT Cs oven test > > PASS: CBT hw ion test > > PASS: CBT mass spec test > > PASS: CPU RTDS test > > PASS: CPU clock locked test > > PASS: DDFS register test > > PASS: 87MHz PLL test > > PASS: 9.2 GHz PLL test > > PASS: Servo register test > > PASS: Servo convertor timeout test > > PASS: Interface register test > > PASS: Interface abus test > > PASS: Pps register test > > PASS: Pps interrupt test > > PASS: power logic signals test > > PASS: CBT register test > > PASS: CBT window comp test > > PASS: CBT therm test > > PASS: CBT Cs oven test > > PASS: CBT hw ion test > > > E-113> > > E-113> PASS: CBT register test > > PASS: CBT window comp test > > PASS: CBT therm test > > PASS: CBT Cs oven test > > PASS: CBT hw ion test > > PASS: CBT mass spec test > > PASS: CPU RTDS test > > PASS: CPU
Re: [time-nuts] 5071A with ATTENTION flashing
According to the Log, "CBT Oven Err: -9.55 C" might be something wrong. However, I can't find the correct range in the manual. Does anyone have the information about this parameter? Regards Li Ang -- Original -- From: "Li Ang";<379...@qq.com>; Date: Wed, Nov 9, 2016 02:48 PM To: "Tom Van Baak"<t...@leapsecond.com>; "Discussion of precise time and frequency measurement"<time-nuts@febo.com>; Subject: Re: [time-nuts] 5071A with ATTENTION flashing Hi Tom I have collected the log from it. Log level is service. The 9.2G pll pass the test today. The log during the power-up process is also included. Regards Li Ang / BI7LNQ - scpi > MJD0 02:02:18 CBT ID: 3128A00642(H) Status summary: Fatal Error (see Log) Power source: AC Log status: One entry Freq Offset: 0e-15 Osc. control: -9.56 % RF amplitude 1: 6.3 %RF amplitude 2: 6.3 % Zeeman Freq: 39949 Hz C-field curr:12.213 mA E-multiplier: 2553 VSignal Gain: 14.4 % CBT Oven: 0.0 VCBT Oven Err: -9.55 C Osc. Oven: -9.1 VIon Pump: 0.4 uA HW Ionizer:-0.1 VMass spec:12.3 V SAW Tuning: 0.0 VDRO Tuning: 7.3 V 87MHz PLL: 0.8 VuP Clock PLL: 1.8 V +12V supply: 12.3 V-12V supply: -12.3 V +5V supply:5.4 VThermometer: 46.2 C scpi > scpi > ? E-103> exit E-113> E-113> Log status: One entry Log 000 of MJD0 00:12:40: Low Cs signal (60) with max Emult PASS: CBT register test PASS: CBT window comp test PASS: CBT therm test PASS: CBT Cs oven test PASS: CBT hw ion test PASS: CBT mass spec test PASS: CPU RTDS test PASS: CPU clock locked test PASS: DDFS register test PASS: 87MHz PLL test PASS: 9.2 GHz PLL test PASS: Servo register test PASS: Servo convertor timeout test PASS: Interface register test PASS: Interface abus test PASS: Pps register test PASS: Pps interrupt test PASS: power logic signals test PASS: CBT register test PASS: CBT window comp test PASS: CBT therm test PASS: CBT Cs oven test PASS: CBT hw ion test PASS: CBT mass spec test PASS: CPU RTDS test PASS: CPU clock locked test PASS: DDFS register test PASS: 87MHz PLL test PASS: 9.2 GHz PLL test PASS: Servo register test PASS: Servo convertor timeout test PASS: Interface register test PASS: Interface abus test PASS: Pps register test PASS: Pps interrupt test PASS: power logic signals test PASS: CBT register test PASS: CBT window comp test PASS: CBT therm test PASS: CBT Cs oven test PASS: CBT hw ion test PASS: CBT mass spec test PASS: CPU RTDS test PASS: CPU clock locked test PASS: DDFS register test PASS: 87MHz PLL test PASS: 9.2 GHz PLL test PASS: Servo register test PASS: Servo convertor timeout test PASS: Interface register test PASS: Interface abus test PASS: Pps register test PASS: Pps interrupt test PASS: power logic signals test PASS: CBT register test PASS: CBT window comp test PASS: CBT therm test PASS: CBT Cs oven test PASS: CBT hw ion test E-113> E-113> PASS: CBT register test PASS: CBT window comp test PASS: CBT therm test PASS: CBT Cs oven test PASS: CBT hw ion test PASS: CBT mass spec test PASS: CPU RTDS test PASS: CPU clock locked test PASS: DDFS register test PASS: 87MHz PLL test PASS: 9.2 GHz PLL test PASS: Servo register test PASS: Servo convertor timeout test PASS: Interface register test PASS: Interface abus test PASS: Pps register test PASS: Pps interrupt test PASS: power logic signals test PASS: CBT register test PASS: CBT window comp test PASS: CBT therm test PASS: CBT Cs oven test PASS: CBT hw ion test PASS: CBT mass spec test PASS: CPU RTDS test PASS: CPU clock locked test PASS: DDFS register test PASS: 87MHz PLL test PASS: 9.2 GHz PLL test PASS: Servo register test PASS: Servo convertor timeout test PASS: Interface register test PASS: Interface abus test PASS: Pps register test PASS: Pps interrupt test PASS: power logic signals test PASS: CBT register test PASS: CBT window comp test PASS: CBT therm test PASS: CBT Cs oven test PASS: CBT hw ion test PASS: CBT mass spec test PASS: CPU RTDS test PASS: CPU clock locked test PASS: DDFS register test PASS: 87MHz PLL test PASS: 9.2 GHz PLL test PASS: Servo register test PASS: Servo convertor timeout test PASS: Interface register test PASS: Interface abus test PASS: Pps register test PASS: Pps interrupt test PASS: power logic signals test PASS: CBT register test PASS: CBT window comp test PASS: CBT therm test PASS: CBT Cs oven test PASS: CBT hw ion test PASS: CBT mass spec test PASS: CPU RTDS test PASS: CPU clock locked test PASS: DDFS register test PASS: 87MHz PLL test PASS: 9.2 GHz PLL test PASS: Servo register test PASS: Servo convertor
Re: [time-nuts] 5071A with ATTENTION flashing
Pps register test PASS: Pps interrupt test PASS: power logic signals test PASS: CBT register test PASS: CBT window comp test PASS: CBT therm test PASS: CBT Cs oven test PASS: CBT hw ion test E-113> E-113> scpi > scpi > Performing hardware tests PASS: CBT register test PASS: DDFS register test PASS: Servo register test PASS: Interface register test PASS: Pps register test Warming up Osc. oven is up MJD0 00:00:29 CBT ID: 3128A00642(H) Status summary: Warming up Power source: AC Log status: One entry Freq Offset: 0e-15 Osc. control: -9.56 % RF amplitude 1: 6.3 %RF amplitude 2: 6.3 % Zeeman Freq: 39949 Hz C-field curr:12.213 mA E-multiplier: 1524 VSignal Gain: 14.4 % CBT Oven: 20.6 VCBT Oven Err: -9.55 C Osc. Oven: -9.0 VIon Pump: 0.4 uA HW Ionizer: 1.0 VMass spec:12.3 V SAW Tuning: 0.0 VDRO Tuning: 7.3 V 87MHz PLL: 0.8 VuP Clock PLL: 1.8 V +12V supply: 12.2 V-12V supply: -12.2 V +5V supply:5.4 VThermometer: 45.0 C scpi > Cs oven is up F(z) = 39948.9 Hz Low Cs beam signal = 3 Raising emult voltage... Low Cs signal (37) with max Emult Fractional freq. offset is -0.00e+00 Fatal Error (see Log) scpi > scpi > Log status: 2 entries Log 000 of MJD0 00:12:40: Low Cs signal (60) with max Emult Log 001 of MJD0 00:09:59: Low Cs signal (37) with max Emult MJD0 00:13:46 CBT ID: 3128A00642(H) Status summary: Fatal Error (see Log) Power source: AC Log status: 2 entries Freq Offset: 0e-15 Osc. control: -9.56 % RF amplitude 1: 6.3 %RF amplitude 2: 6.3 % Zeeman Freq: 39949 Hz C-field curr:12.213 mA E-multiplier: 2553 VSignal Gain: 14.4 % CBT Oven: 0.0 VCBT Oven Err: -8.22 C Osc. Oven: -9.1 VIon Pump: 1.0 uA HW Ionizer: 0.0 VMass spec:12.2 V SAW Tuning: 0.0 VDRO Tuning: 7.3 V 87MHz PLL: 0.8 VuP Clock PLL: 1.7 V +12V supply: 12.3 V-12V supply: -12.3 V +5V supply:5.4 VThermometer: 46.4 C scpi > Log status: 2 entries Log 000 of MJD0 00:12:40: Low Cs signal (60) with max Emult Log 001 of MJD0 00:09:59: Low Cs signal (37) with max Emult ---Original--- From: "Tom Van Baak"<t...@leapsecond.com> Date: 2016/11/4 00:42:46 To: "Discussion of precise time and frequency measurement"<time-nuts@febo.com>; Subject: Re: [time-nuts] 5071A with ATTENTION flashing Hi Li, The "Low cs signal with max Emult" is the classic error indicating it's out of gas. That's a bad sign. But the "9.2GHz PLL test 10.3v" is something else. So maybe there's hope? Or maybe you have two big problems instead of one. Rick might know. For additional information, connect a PC to the serial port and capture the diagnostic information. Right after power up, press TOP -> CONFIG -> LOG -> SERVICE to set the unit into verbose diagnostic mode. You should see lines print every now and then as it undergoes self test and calibration. You can also press TOP -> INFO -> PRINT to get a nicely formatted summary. Or TOP -> LOG -> PRINT to get the entire log history. That sometimes has lots of clues. The advantage of using the serial port is you get a permanent record of all this information. Viewing all this by the LCD screen can be tedious. There's more information in 05071-90040, the 5071A Assembly-Level Service Manual, copies of which are on the web. Also 05071-90041, Operating and Programming Manual. /tvb - Original Message - From: "Li Ang" <379...@qq.com> To: "time-nuts" <time-nuts@febo.com> Sent: Thursday, November 03, 2016 8:10 AM Subject: [time-nuts] 5071A with ATTENTION flashing > Hi > Today I met one HP 5071A with option 001 at one secondhand equipment > company. This one can not enter CONTINUOUS OPERATION status, the ATTENTION > led flashes. > There is a "Low cs signal with max Emult" error in the log. I have run the > self-test, and it stopped at "9.2GHz PLL test 10.3v". I can only remember > the the pump current was 0.8uA or less, C-filed was about 12mA. > The seller is asking for about 4000$, I am wondering if it's repairable. > Since it is a "HP" branded 5071A with 001 option, I do not know if the Cs > tube is dying or not, according to the two current values? > How do I know one 5071A/5061/5062 is dying or is still in good health by > the readings? > > > Thanks > > > de BI7LNQ ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.fe
Re: [time-nuts] 5071A with ATTENTION flashing
Hi Tom Thanks for the info. I think I should pay a visit to this 5071a again. There are 5 more 5071a 200km away, I need to visit them next week. :) regards Li Ang / BI7LNQ ---Original--- From: "Tom Van Baak"<t...@leapsecond.com> Date: 2016/11/4 00:42:46 To: "Discussion of precise time and frequency measurement"<time-nuts@febo.com>; Subject: Re: [time-nuts] 5071A with ATTENTION flashing Hi Li, The "Low cs signal with max Emult" is the classic error indicating it's out of gas. That's a bad sign. But the "9.2GHz PLL test 10.3v" is something else. So maybe there's hope? Or maybe you have two big problems instead of one. Rick might know. For additional information, connect a PC to the serial port and capture the diagnostic information. Right after power up, press TOP -> CONFIG -> LOG -> SERVICE to set the unit into verbose diagnostic mode. You should see lines print every now and then as it undergoes self test and calibration. You can also press TOP -> INFO -> PRINT to get a nicely formatted summary. Or TOP -> LOG -> PRINT to get the entire log history. That sometimes has lots of clues. The advantage of using the serial port is you get a permanent record of all this information. Viewing all this by the LCD screen can be tedious. There's more information in 05071-90040, the 5071A Assembly-Level Service Manual, copies of which are on the web. Also 05071-90041, Operating and Programming Manual. /tvb - Original Message - From: "Li Ang" <379...@qq.com> To: "time-nuts" <time-nuts@febo.com> Sent: Thursday, November 03, 2016 8:10 AM Subject: [time-nuts] 5071A with ATTENTION flashing > Hi > Today I met one HP 5071A with option 001 at one secondhand equipment > company. This one can not enter CONTINUOUS OPERATION status, the ATTENTION > led flashes. > There is a "Low cs signal with max Emult" error in the log. I have run the > self-test, and it stopped at "9.2GHz PLL test 10.3v". I can only remember > the the pump current was 0.8uA or less, C-filed was about 12mA. > The seller is asking for about 4000$, I am wondering if it's repairable. > Since it is a "HP" branded 5071A with 001 option, I do not know if the Cs > tube is dying or not, according to the two current values? > How do I know one 5071A/5061/5062 is dying or is still in good health by > the readings? > > > Thanks > > > de BI7LNQ ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there. ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
Re: [time-nuts] 5071A with ATTENTION flashing
Hi Li, The "Low cs signal with max Emult" is the classic error indicating it's out of gas. That's a bad sign. But the "9.2GHz PLL test 10.3v" is something else. So maybe there's hope? Or maybe you have two big problems instead of one. Rick might know. For additional information, connect a PC to the serial port and capture the diagnostic information. Right after power up, press TOP -> CONFIG -> LOG -> SERVICE to set the unit into verbose diagnostic mode. You should see lines print every now and then as it undergoes self test and calibration. You can also press TOP -> INFO -> PRINT to get a nicely formatted summary. Or TOP -> LOG -> PRINT to get the entire log history. That sometimes has lots of clues. The advantage of using the serial port is you get a permanent record of all this information. Viewing all this by the LCD screen can be tedious. There's more information in 05071-90040, the 5071A Assembly-Level Service Manual, copies of which are on the web. Also 05071-90041, Operating and Programming Manual. /tvb - Original Message - From: "Li Ang" <379...@qq.com> To: "time-nuts" <time-nuts@febo.com> Sent: Thursday, November 03, 2016 8:10 AM Subject: [time-nuts] 5071A with ATTENTION flashing > Hi > Today I met one HP 5071A with option 001 at one secondhand equipment > company. This one can not enter CONTINUOUS OPERATION status, the ATTENTION > led flashes. > There is a "Low cs signal with max Emult" error in the log. I have run the > self-test, and it stopped at "9.2GHz PLL test 10.3v". I can only remember > the the pump current was 0.8uA or less, C-filed was about 12mA. > The seller is asking for about 4000$, I am wondering if it's repairable. > Since it is a "HP" branded 5071A with 001 option, I do not know if the Cs > tube is dying or not, according to the two current values? > How do I know one 5071A/5061/5062 is dying or is still in good health by > the readings? > > > Thanks > > > de BI7LNQ ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
[time-nuts] 5071A with ATTENTION flashing
Hi Today I met one HP 5071A with option 001 at one secondhand equipment company. This one can not enter CONTINUOUS OPERATION status, the ATTENTION led flashes. There is a "Low cs signal with max Emult" error in the log. I have run the self-test, and it stopped at "9.2GHz PLL test 10.3v". I can only remember the the pump current was 0.8uA or less, C-filed was about 12mA. The seller is asking for about 4000$, I am wondering if it's repairable. Since it is a "HP" branded 5071A with 001 option, I do not know if the Cs tube is dying or not, according to the two current values? How do I know one 5071A/5061/5062 is dying or is still in good health by the readings? Thanks de BI7LNQ ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
