Re: [time-nuts] What is it ??
Do you have a description ? Picture? Connector and cables attached to this item ? It may be similar to another brand ? Is it possible to dissemble the item and check inside. Stanley Just picked up a GPS Adapter made by Enhanced Messaging Systems no luck on the web on this item.. Can anyone help Thanks Tom ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To subscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there. ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
Re: [time-nuts] Fw: Low noise voltage regulators
Sorry file ext was upper case, fixed now ... also the source label HP 10811A/B ... moved to the bottom of post, I was trying to attach the picture but it bounced as too big. Stanley - Original Message From: Brian Kirby kilodelta4foxm...@gmail.com To: Discussion of precise time and frequency measurement time-nuts@febo.com Sent: Thu, February 25, 2010 1:15:11 PM Subject: Re: [time-nuts] Fw: Low noise voltage regulators Stanley Reynolds wrote: Sorry, the page you requested was not found - Forwarded Message From: Stanley Reynolds stanley_reyno...@yahoo.com To: Discussion of precise time and frequency measurement time-nuts@febo.com Sent: Thu, February 25, 2010 1:00:58 PM Subject: Re: [time-nuts] Low noise voltage regulators From the : 2-11. A single source of +20 to +30V dc with 10% regulation may be used to power both the oven and oscillator amplifier circuits if a simple IC regulator is used. A suggested circuit is shown in Figure 2-1. The resistor and capacitor connected to terminals 3 and 4 of the IC minimize ripple and noise in the regulated output. www.n4iqt.com/hp/12volt-reg.jpg I have planed to separate the power supplies from my test stands as my next project for the 10811's so I'm also interested in a suitable supply. Considered a battery supply with a regulator for the 12 V side. Stanley 10811A/B Quartz Crystal Oscillator Operating Service Manual (V2) ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there. ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there. ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
[time-nuts] Fw: Low noise voltage regulators
- Forwarded Message From: Stanley Reynolds stanley_reyno...@yahoo.com To: Discussion of precise time and frequency measurement time-nuts@febo.com Sent: Thu, February 25, 2010 1:00:58 PM Subject: Re: [time-nuts] Low noise voltage regulators From the : 2-11. A single source of +20 to +30V dc with 10% regulation may be used to power both the oven and oscillator amplifier circuits if a simple IC regulator is used. A suggested circuit is shown in Figure 2-1. The resistor and capacitor connected to terminals 3 and 4 of the IC minimize ripple and noise in the regulated output. www.n4iqt.com/hp/12volt-reg.jpg I have planed to separate the power supplies from my test stands as my next project for the 10811's so I'm also interested in a suitable supply. Considered a battery supply with a regulator for the 12 V side. Stanley 10811A/B Quartz Crystal Oscillator Operating Service Manual (V2) ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
Re: [time-nuts] Achieving maximum performance when driving 5370A/B inputs
I have a bnc type connector with two pins inside the shield on a FTS cesium standard labeled DS1 must be a phone industry jack. Stanley - Original Message From: Bob Camp li...@rtty.us To: Discussion of precise time and frequency measurement time-nuts@febo.com Sent: Sat, February 27, 2010 8:53:16 PM Subject: Re: [time-nuts] Achieving maximum performance when driving 5370A/B inputs Hi I don't even have the counter and already we're butchering it The big issue is suitable twin-ax connectors and cable. I have both, but they are *big*. They never really made it into the world of miniature connectors and miniature cable. Shielded twisted pair would be another option. That eliminates the cable as an issue. Small connectors (BNC drop in) are still an issue though. Bob On Feb 27, 2010, at 9:48 PM, Bruce Griffiths wrote: Since the input amplifier and trigger circuit are located on a small daughter board it wouldn't be too difficult to replace this with an LVDS to CML stage. The only remaining isue would be what input connector to use (twinax??, SATA??). Bruce Bob Camp wrote: Hi Gee, LVDS what an unusual approach :) It would be nice if these instruments had a balanced input. Common mode noise is indeed an issue in a lot of cases. Of course wrapping the coax headed to the counter 10X around a fairly large core can help things a bit. Bob On Feb 27, 2010, at 9:32 PM, Bruce Griffiths wrote: If one is feeling paranoid about ground loop noise (and wishes to avoid transformers, optoisolators , or fibre optics), etc one could always use an LVDS driver with a batter powered(?) LVDS to CMOS receiver/translator right at the 5370A/B input BNC connector. This may be useful for a DMTD system that uses a 5370A/B. Bruce Bob Camp wrote: Hi AC cmos will easily drive an L pad to match a 50 ohm cable at these levels. That's true at either 3.3 or at 5.0 volts. There are a lot of cmos families out there that beat AC for speed and match the output drive capability. Bob On Feb 27, 2010, at 9:12 PM, Bruce Griffiths wrote: 1) One method with 5V CMOS is to add a resistive voltage divider at the CMOS driver output with a 50 ohm output impedance at the tap that drives the 5370A/B input. 2) If one has a 5V 50 ohm driver (eg Thunderbolt PPS output) use a 50 ohm attenuator at the 5370A/B input. For a 5370A an attenuation of at least 11dB is required. For a 5370B an attenuation of at least 3dB is required. 3) One can always use the 10x input attenuation setting built in to the 5370A/B however this reduces the signal swing to 0.5V at the trigger amplifier input (5V CMOS input). 4) Attenuate the output of the logic signal by a factor of 2 and use an npn emitter follower to drive the 50 ohm load. 5) Use 3.3V CMOS signal levels for the 5370B. 6) Use a current mode emitter or source coupled switch to drive the 5370A/B input. The switching jitter of the above drivers will be much lower than the internal noise of the 5370A/B as long as HCMOS or faster logic is employed. Bruce Bob Camp wrote: Hi Which *still* carefully avoids the issue of how . Bob On Feb 27, 2010, at 8:52 PM, Bruce Griffiths wrote: Oops! a small correction (2nd paragraph): For the 5370A attenuating the 5V CMOS signal to a 1V swing with the threshold set to 0.5V is close to optimum. An input signal with limits of 0V and +1.4V with a trigger threshold of 0.7V is the maximum usable (for high performance). An input signal with limits of 0V and +0.3V with a trigger threshold of 0.15V is the minimum usable (for high performance). For the 5370B attenuating the 5V CMOS signal to a 2V swing with the threshold set to 1V is close to optimum. An input signal with limits of 0V and +3.5V with a trigger threshold of 0.7V is the maximum usable (for high performance). An input signal with limits of 0V and +0.3V with a trigger threshold of 0.15V is the minimum usable (for high performance). Thus using the PPS output (~270 ohm is series with a 5V 74AC04 output) from a Synergy evaluation board that uses an M12M or M12+ GPS timing receiver to drive the inputs (with a 0-750mV signal) of a 5370A or 5370B is well within the recommended input signal range for high performance. This avoids having to adding an external 5V 50 ohm driver that some would use. Bruce Bob Camp wrote: Hi So exactly how did you know that I bought a (cheap) 5370B a few hours ago on the e-place and was just about to ask about how best to use it. H... Bob On Feb 27, 2010, at 7:01 PM, Bruce Griffiths wrote: The attached excerpts from the 5370A and 5370B manuals indicate that for best performance, that the common practice of driving the 5370A/B 1x inputs directly from a 5V CMOS logic signal is a bad idea. For the 5370A
Re: [time-nuts] Achieving maximum performance when driving 5370A/B inputs
found a picture of the Twin BNC here: http://drawings.amphenolrf.com/pdf/172.pdf ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
Re: [time-nuts] Rock, gas, and air
A while back we had a thread about Paris and a network of air synced clocks ? Stanley - Original Message From: Bruce Griffiths bruce.griffi...@xtra.co.nz To: Discussion of precise time and frequency measurement time-nuts@febo.com Sent: Sun, February 28, 2010 7:41:20 PM Subject: Re: [time-nuts] Rock, gas, and air Bill Hawkins wrote: Rock I take to be crystal. How about gas and air? Bill Hawkins -Original Message- From: Magnus Danielson Sent: Sunday, February 28, 2010 5:15 PM To: p...@b737.co.uk; Discussion of precise time and frequency measurement Subject: Re: [time-nuts] My DIY frequency counter and a request for help --%-- I think I have a fairly good setup including bunches of rock, gas and air clocks alongside a fair set of counters, so I could probably do some testing, but I am located over in Sweden. Gas = rubidium vapour?? Bruce ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there. ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
Re: [time-nuts] Missing GPS satellites
News story a few days back that in parts of Afghanistan wireless which has 99% vs 1% wired phones would go out every nite, on orders of the Taleban, to prevent civilians from reporting activity to Coalition forces. Think the wireless networks would last a little longer than a few hours without timing info but you never know , does your cell phone still work? Stanley - Original Message From: paul swed paulsw...@gmail.com To: j...@quik.com; Discussion of precise time and frequency measurement time-nuts@febo.com Sent: Thu, March 25, 2010 12:17:10 PM Subject: Re: [time-nuts] Missing GPS satellites They wouldn't really do that would they? ;-) On Thu, Mar 25, 2010 at 12:36 PM, J. Forster j...@quik.com wrote: It might be that the DoD is turning the civilian signals off in combat areas to deny GPS to the Taliban and others. -John == Ahem!, time-nuts. Please release all GPS satellites you are holding up on the other side of the world. I don't seem to have any over my head over Asia. I wonder what happens to those guided missiles that depend of GPS or those in vehicles looking for directions ? Cheers -- Raj, VU2ZAP Bangalore, India. ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there. ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there. ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there. ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
Re: [time-nuts] Missing GPS satellites
Link to new story: http://www.cbsnews.com/8301-503543_162-20001083-503543.html http://online.wsj.com/article/SB20001424052748704117304575137541465235972.html Stanley ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
Re: [time-nuts] Making a HP 10811 better
Is the source of the vibration important ? I'm thinking that any vibration that is not on the same axis as gravity. Walking across the lab vs a fan that is out of balance close by. Would a suspended mass mounting help with vibration isolation and damping with rubber pads and springs or would that just make a seismograph ? Stanley - Original Message From: Peter Vince pvi...@theiet.org To: Discussion of precise time and frequency measurement time-nuts@febo.com Sent: Sat, March 27, 2010 10:51:07 AM Subject: Re: [time-nuts] Making a HP 10811 better Warren, If you turn over an oscillator, is the frequency change completely reversible (to your under 1e-12 resolution) when it is restored? Thinking aloud, if an hour-glass is turned over twice, the final level will be the same, but the grains will be mixed. A quartz crystal, however, is solid, so hopefully nothing actually moves. Presumably the zero-G axis is with the axis of oscillation at 90 degrees to gravity? Peter (the other one :-) Another thing I use it for is to test high resolution Freq meters. Using a calibrated wedge that I can then slide under one edge of the zero-G Osc box, I can make small, variable, repeatable, freq changes of under 1e-12 resolution, something pretty hard to do otherwise. If I want to make BIG changes like 1e-10, I can rotate the box on any of its sides and still use the wedge, and for a quick check of new equipment, I just turn the box over which then gives a couple of parts in 1e-9 freq change. It makes a weird but simple and indispensable variable freq source that is useful for many things, such as checking the LOOP TC of a TBolt. ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there. ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
Re: [time-nuts] OT Question - Surplus Places
I'm in Birmingham and even the thrift stores here list their stuff on ebay, could give you a list of closed places, was one in Decatur ... You can find places using ebay and see if they will let you come by for a look, no joy for time-nuts stuff but for other stuff this has worked for me. UAB has had auctions in the past but checking their web site no updates ... Hamfest are the best bet to pickup items not on ebay but to be honest my favorites are in Georgia. Stanley - Original Message From: paul swed paulsw...@gmail.com To: les...@veenstras.com; Discussion of precise time and frequency measurement time-nuts@febo.com Sent: Wed, March 31, 2010 8:16:52 AM Subject: Re: [time-nuts] OT Question - Surplus Places Never heard of elis and I have been out here 12 years. NH had some places and as mentioned a few exist. I used to visit some just across the ma/nh boarder. But most of what I have seen has been the very very bottom of the barrel. Oh for the flea market days when trucks of test equipment showed up at and was about $25 per unit at the end of the day. Carry away sales. The stuff was maybe 10 years old. Sure it may or may not have worked. But the gamble was worth it. I learned a lot about how to build and engineer equipment from the repair of that stuff. And to this day I still remember The one that got away. The trunk was already loaded/jammed with goodies. End of the flea market, back of a large truck was a full voltage cal lab for about $50. Good shape physically. These were the fluke standards and voltage amplifiers DC and AC the whole shootin match. Oh well those were the days. Good memories. On Wed, Mar 31, 2010 at 1:27 AM, Lester Veenstra les...@veenstras.comwrote: I guess this means Eli's is gone ! Lester B Veenstra MØYCM K1YCM les...@veenstras.com m0...@veenstras.com k1...@veenstras.com US Postal Address: PSC 45 Box 781 APO AE 09468 USA UK Postal Address: Dawn Cottage Norwood, Harrogate HG3 1SD, UK Subject: Re: [time-nuts] OT Question - Surplus Places As to Boston, there is little in the Boston/Cambridge area any more. ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there. ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there. ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
Re: [time-nuts] Surplus Places...
Learned my lesson You can read the terms at : https://www.govliquidation.com/terms.html , but they don't list all the terms and leave out they way it works, and amount of time/paper work required to keep them happy. They may refund for the return expenses only if you can get a manager to approve it after you pay. BTDT Stanley - Original Message From: J. Forster j...@quik.com To: Discussion of precise time and frequency measurement time-nuts@febo.com Sent: Thu, April 1, 2010 11:50:45 AM Subject: Re: [time-nuts] Surplus Places... Mike is active on the ArmyRadios Yahoo Group. He won't export because of the erratic and irrational policies of the US authorities. In his opinion, it is just not worth the effort and risk involved. Apparently, the US authorities can come back, years after an item has been sold, and demand it back and not compensate for costs. Ot just does not pay and he's NOT going to jail for some small sale. Can't say I blame him. Best, -John === Also in S. California is Murphys surpus. http://www.murphyjunk.bizland.com/ Too keep it on topic he has VLF/OMEGA receivers and a Rockwell NavCore GPS listed. Won't export anything though, I think he's been put on notice. Robert G8RPI. ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there. ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
Re: [time-nuts] Thunderbolt Group Buy, part 3 - Thunderbolt quits
Do anyone have a troubleshooting suggestion? Cold solder joint on RS232 connector. Stanley ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
Re: [time-nuts] oscillator choice question
Does anyone use mechanical adjustment with a servo, gear train and microcontroller? Might be useful as a tool to calibrate standards without electronic fine adjustment but would think it would ware out the capacitor if used to make continuous adjustments. Wonder if they make adjustment tools with a gear train ? Stanley ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
[time-nuts] GPS antenna distribution from a DTV multi switch
Have been using a sat passive splitter and most of my cables are using F connectors so I'm thinking of modifying a DTV multi switch to provide 5 volts instead of 13 volts on the LNB/antenna port. Antenna is a Trimble bullet II 5 volt antenna. The switch is active and I would ignore the 22Khz and 18V inputs, just need the extra outputs and amplification. I've opened it up and it ( a eagle aspen DTV4X8 ) has two lm317's maybe for 18 and 13 volts as well as a ua78m06 for the amps and volt/22Khz switches. options: 1) add a 78m05 for the GPS antenna between the 13 volt supply and the RF choke (my first choice) 2) adjust the 13 volt lm317 regulator to 5 volts by adding a resistor in parallel with the existing resistor 3) cut the 13 volt feed and add a diode .7 volt drop from the 6 volt supply Please let me know what you think. I have read the 50 ohm vs 75 ohm cable discussions and due to cost and ease of using f-connectors will live with the mismatches for now. Stanley ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
Re: [time-nuts] GPS antenna distribution from a DTV multi switch
I've opened it up and it ( a eagle aspen DTV4X8 ) has two lm317's maybe for 18 and 13 volts as well as a ua78m06 for the amps and volt/22Khz switches. Pictures here : www.n4iqt.com/dtv4x8 Stanley ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
Re: [time-nuts] GPS antenna distribution from a DTV multi switch
Yes, not using most of it. Has a 22khz tone and voltage level detector for all 8 outputs I don't need, but my cost with power brick was $10, ebay has them under $20 now. Stanley - Original Message From: Bob Camp li...@rtty.us To: Discussion of precise time and frequency measurement time-nuts@febo.com Sent: Sat, May 8, 2010 7:53:02 PM Subject: Re: [time-nuts] GPS antenna distribution from a DTV multi switch Hi There's a *lot* ore in there than in a normal GPS splitter. Bob snip ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
Re: [time-nuts] GPS antenna distribution from a DTV multi switch
It works picture www.n4iqt.com/dtv4x8/5vreg-mod.JPG The feed for 13v to the antenna was a ferite bead with 3 turns, it was attached to the board with orange hot glue. It connected to the 13v input to the ua78m06, for the mod I added a 7805 from the 18v lm317 to the bead rf choke. Stanley ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
Re: [time-nuts] GPS antenna distribution from a DTV multi switch
Well at least hot glue is recyclable as long as I don't get it too hot ;-) Doesn't a RF choke need low Q ? Or at least very lousily at 1.5 Ghz ? Will connect some more receivers today to get a better idea about how well it works my Brandywine is the most deaf, will start with that one. Stanley - Original Message From: Bob Camp li...@rtty.us To: Discussion of precise time and frequency measurement time-nuts@febo.com Sent: Mon, May 10, 2010 6:30:10 AM Subject: Re: [time-nuts] GPS antenna distribution from a DTV multi switch Hi I'm sure that's high performance microwave certified hot glue (from Lowes) and not the common garden variety kind (from Home Depot). Bob On May 9, 2010, at 11:05 PM, Stanley Reynolds wrote: It works picture www.n4iqt.com/dtv4x8/5vreg-mod.JPG The feed for 13v to the antenna was a ferite bead with 3 turns, it was attached to the board with orange hot glue. It connected to the 13v input to the ua78m06, for the mod I added a 7805 from the 18v lm317 to the bead rf choke. Stanley ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there. ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there. ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
Re: [time-nuts] time-nuts Digest, Vol 70, Issue 31
That would not explain the lessing of the effect as the clocks are moved father from each other or arranged as sides of a triangle. Maybe gravity between the pendulums or more likely vibrations. http://www.scholarpedia.org/article/Synchronization http://www.siam.org/pdf/news/481.pdf http://www.bhi.co.uk/hj/Coupled%20Pendulums%20Quadrature%20and%20Clocks%20by%20John%20Haine.pdf http://www.ralph-abraham.org/articles/MS%2344.Resonance/ms44.pdf Stanley - Original Message From: Alan Melia alan.me...@btinternet.com To: Discussion of precise time and frequency measurement time-nuts@febo.com Sent: Wed, May 12, 2010 7:12:55 PM Subject: Re: [time-nuts] time-nuts Digest, Vol 70, Issue 31 Is it possible that mechanical (pendulum) clocks could couple not due to energy transfer between the clocks but external mechanical events such as seismic events of a very low level ?? or even gravitational or lunar gravitational effects.?? Maybe the same for water clocks ?? Alan G3NYK - Original Message - From: Christopher Hoover c...@murgatroid.com To: time-nuts@febo.com Sent: Thursday, May 13, 2010 1:00 AM Subject: Re: [time-nuts] time-nuts Digest, Vol 70, Issue 31 On 5/12/2010 10:41 AM, Jim Lux wrote: It never occurred to me that they might couple, although almost every other mechanical clock does. What would the mechanism be? Perhaps if all of them run off the same reservoir ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there. ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there. ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
Re: [time-nuts] time-nuts Digest, Vol 70, Issue 31
Like other environmental effects this external impulse would have to have a precise period to move a set of non-synced clocks toward sync otherwise it is just noise. If the impulse is strong then it becomes the clock, or if it is precise again it is the clock, otherwise it is noise the clock maker would like to remove. This reminds me of chaos theory clocks tend toward random periods. Stanley - Original Message From: Alan Melia alan.me...@btinternet.com To: Discussion of precise time and frequency measurement time-nuts@febo.com Sent: Thu, May 13, 2010 5:09:02 AM Subject: Re: [time-nuts] time-nuts Digest, Vol 70, Issue 31 Nice reference thanks for those Stanley...interesting, thought provoking reading! Moving apart and possibly changining the relative positions of the plane of the swing too to test the coupling. There are ways of measuring this if you have the time :-)) My thought was that even an uncoupled set might move closer together if all subject to the same external impulse? Alan - Original Message - From: Stanley Reynolds stanley_reyno...@yahoo.com To: Discussion of precise time and frequency measurement time-nuts@febo.com Sent: Thursday, May 13, 2010 2:19 AM Subject: Re: [time-nuts] time-nuts Digest, Vol 70, Issue 31 That would not explain the lessing of the effect as the clocks are moved father from each other or arranged as sides of a triangle. Maybe gravity between the pendulums or more likely vibrations. http://www.scholarpedia.org/article/Synchronization http://www.siam.org/pdf/news/481.pdf http://www.bhi.co.uk/hj/Coupled%20Pendulums%20Quadrature%20and%20Clocks%20by%20John%20Haine.pdf http://www.ralph-abraham.org/articles/MS%2344.Resonance/ms44.pdf Stanley - Original Message From: Alan Melia alan.me...@btinternet.com To: Discussion of precise time and frequency measurement time-nuts@febo.com Sent: Wed, May 12, 2010 7:12:55 PM Subject: Re: [time-nuts] time-nuts Digest, Vol 70, Issue 31 Is it possible that mechanical (pendulum) clocks could couple not due to energy transfer between the clocks but external mechanical events such as seismic events of a very low level ?? or even gravitational or lunar gravitational effects.?? Maybe the same for water clocks ?? Alan G3NYK - Original Message - From: Christopher Hoover c...@murgatroid.com To: time-nuts@febo.com Sent: Thursday, May 13, 2010 1:00 AM Subject: Re: [time-nuts] time-nuts Digest, Vol 70, Issue 31 On 5/12/2010 10:41 AM, Jim Lux wrote: It never occurred to me that they might couple, although almost every other mechanical clock does. What would the mechanism be? Perhaps if all of them run off the same reservoir ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there. ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there. ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there. ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there. ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
Re: [time-nuts] Z3805 utility, Was: AW: (no subject)
- Original Message From: Jeff Hook jeffh...@comcast.net To: Discussion of precise time and frequency measurement time-nuts@febo.com Sent: Sun, May 23, 2010 12:42:45 PM Subject: Re: [time-nuts] Z3805 utility, Was: AW: (no subject) Bob My 3805 cables look like this DB9 DB25 2 2 3 3 5 7 (Null Modem) Jeff snip straight cable is 2 to 2 to 3 to 3 null modem would be 2 3 3 2 normal usage would be: terminal (straight cable) modem (phone line) modem (straight cable) computer computer (straight cable) modem (phone line) modem (straight cable) computer or if no modems : terminal (null modem) computer As has been mentioned many exceptions to the rule. Stanley ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
Re: [time-nuts] Z3805 utility, Was: AW: (no subject)
- Original Message From: Robert Benward rbenw...@verizon.net To: Discussion of precise time and frequency measurement time-nuts@febo.com Sent: Sun, May 23, 2010 4:38:43 PM Subject: Re: [time-nuts] Z3805 utility, Was: AW: (no subject) Jeff, Generally for a given DTE, there is a swap of 23 when going from DB9 to DB25 and vice-versa. For a normal serial cable, DTE to DCE, pins 23 are swapped. RS-232 states that pin 2 is the TX data, DCE or DTE, on a DB25. It's TX on pin 3 for a DB9. Therefore to hook a DCE to a DTE, you must swap pins 23. The fact that you are going from 2-2 and 3-3 probably means you've inserted a null modem in between, and you are using a standard serial cable. In the old days... it was a Data Terminal Equipment (DTE) that communicated with Data Communications Equipment (DCE) to the mainframe. Stanley's assessment is correct, although I'm not sure if the mainframes of yesteryear were DTEs. snip Dec computers / terminal servers were as I described, but many brands were different. Still have a BOB aka break out box with LEDs to indicate levels, matching transmit and receive is easy, getting the hardware flow control / signaling right was a little more difficult. straight cable = pin to pin crossed cable = null modem = swapped pins The phrase null modem comes from no modems or the configuration that allows two singular ports to be connected, this cable would cross the receive and transmit pins, and some would call it a cross over cable. A null modem cable would be used to connect two computers together and a program like kermit used to transfer files. I think the phrase standard cable which could be null or straight depending on the use is the confusing part. Phone cables RJ11 and RJ45 swap the wires which is standard. Network cables match the wires with the same color always on the right which is standard. But even when a phone cable is standard it is not interchangeable with a standard network cable. Again we have a need for cross as well as straight network cables. So a standard cable for connecting a terminal to a Dec computer would be a null cable. A standard cable for connecting a terminal to a IBM mainframe could be straight. But I disagree that a standard cable can always be straight or null. Stanley ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
Re: [time-nuts] Z3805 utility, Was: AW: (no subject)
Bob, The best way to get it right is to use a break out box, if both lights connected to the data pins are on then it is right else swap the pins. If no BOB then measure pin 2 to ground and pin 3 to ground one should be near zero the data receive pin and the transmit pin should read a negative voltage the transmit pin. Connect transmit on one device to receive on the other as well as ground to ground. If hardware flow control is needed then cts and rts would be done the same way as the data pins, measure voltage match neg voltage to no voltage. Trying to understand the terminology is nice but not as easy as just looking at which pin is the source, has voltage and matching it to a pin without voltage. Stanley - Original Message From: Robert Benward rbenw...@verizon.net To: Discussion of precise time and frequency measurement time-nuts@febo.com Sent: Sun, May 23, 2010 8:27:01 PM Subject: Re: [time-nuts] Z3805 utility, Was: AW: (no subject) OK. I think I know where some of this confusion I'm having is coming from.. All these descriptions are misleading in that they (Wiki) call pin 2 TX. On wiki's page, both DCE and DTE are TX=2. The table below shows the same except that TX is defined from the DTE's point of view. Thus DTE to DTE needs 23 crossed, and DTE and DCE needs 2-2 3-3. If your device is a DCE, then pin 2 is really a RX input, not a TX output. DB-25 DB-9 Common EIA Pin # Pin # Name Name CCITT DTE-DCE Formal Name - - - - - --- --- 1 FG AA 101 - Frame Ground 2 3 TD BA 103 Transmitted Data, TxD 3 2 RD BB 104 Received Data, RxD 4 7 RTS CA 105 Request To Send 5 8 CTS CB 106 Clear To Send 6 6 DSR CC 107 Data Set Ready 7 5 SG AB 102 Signal Ground, GND 8 1 DCD CF 109 Data Carrier Detect Stanley, Did I get it right this time?Sorry to all for my previous ramblings.Bob- Original Message - From: jimlux jim...@earthlink.net To: Discussion of precise time and frequency measurement time-nuts@febo.com Sent: Sunday, May 23, 2010 8:58 PM Subject: Re: [time-nuts] Z3805 utility, Was: AW: (no subject) Stanley Reynolds wrote: snip Dec computers / terminal servers were as I described, but many brands were different. Still have a BOB aka break out box with LEDs to indicate levels, matching transmit and receive is easy, getting the hardware flow control / signaling right was a little more difficult. straight cable = pin to pin crossed cable = null modem = swapped pins The phrase null modem comes from no modems or the configuration that allows two singular ports to be connected, this cable would cross the receive and transmit pins, and some would call it a cross over cable. A null modem cable would be used to connect two computers together and a program like kermit used to transfer files. Yep.. DTE cable to DCE communications medium(phoneline) DCE to DTE DCE == Modem (e.g. a Bell 202 or 212, for instance) There were the flow control (RTS/CTS) used to turn around a half duplex link. And, there are also the secondary transmit and receive (for a low rate reverse channel). If you were receiving data from the link (DCE), you'd assert RTS, and when the modem had switched, it would tell you CTS, and off you'd go. (fancy modems used the reverse channel to send the request to the far end, which would acknowledge... others just use a fixed time delay) There are also pins for the clock (since some of these modems were used on synchronous data links). the crossover occured in the DCE to DCE link (that is, you'd transmit from one DCE to the other DCE's receiver)... the nominal cable between DTE and DCE was straight through. With no real convention on male/female.. most devices had female sockets, and the cables usually were male male plugs. IBM PCs had male on the chassis for DTE, as did some PDT-110 (VT-100/LSI-11 smart terminals), but most other terminals (the LSI ADM-x, Hazeltines, etc.) all seemed to have female, as did the TI 800 series printer/terminals. So, a null modem was a cable that emulated the DCE to DCE connection.. there are/were various strategies on how sophisticated the reverse is.. do you also send the secondary channel? What about clocks? Most folks ignored all that and used RTS/CTS Or you strap RTS to CTS on your side, the other side does the same. I think the phrase standard cable which could be null or straight depending on the use is the confusing part. Phone cables RJ11 and RJ45 swap the wires which is standard. Network cables match the wires with the same color always on the right which is standard. But even when a phone cable is standard it is not interchangeable with a standard
Re: [time-nuts] Z3805 utility, Was: AW: (no subject)
My fix for ground loops was to cut the shield at the terminal end and leave it connected at the computer end, worked most of the time. Other fixes were short-hall modems, isolation transformer for the terminal, and last fiber optic drivers with fiber optic cable. Stanley - Original Message From: Robert Benward rbenw...@verizon.net To: Discussion of precise time and frequency measurement time-nuts@febo.com Sent: Mon, May 24, 2010 7:20:32 AM Subject: Re: [time-nuts] Z3805 utility, Was: AW: (no subject) Steve, If you are worried about ground loops you should be using RS-422. I can almost guarantee you that pin 7 is attached to the PCB ground plane which in turn is connected to chassis. Hopefully everyone is plugged into the same outlet and the RS-232 signaling levels are sufficient to overcome the common mode noise. Bob - Original Message - From: Steve Rooke sar10...@gmail.com To: Discussion of precise time and frequency measurement time-nuts@febo.com Sent: Monday, May 24, 2010 1:40 AM Subject: Re: [time-nuts] Z3805 utility, Was: AW: (no subject) On 24 May 2010 15:22, Robert Benward rbenw...@verizon.net wrote: My experience with the term straight through is that I've seen RS-232 cable that have the ground pin connected to the shell. In a straight through the pins are one to one and the only thing connected to the shell would be the shield if one is available. There is a difference between the signal ground on pin 7 and the shell which forms a shield around the connector and may be connected to a shield on the cable if there is one. You have to be careful with this sort of setup though as earth loops can be caused by connecting the chassis earth on two bits of equipment via the cable shield. That's why pin 7 is the signalling earth and it really should not be connected to earth at either end, IE. attempts at doing 2 wire signalling et al. Steve Bob - Original Message - From: Bob Camp li...@rtty.us To: Discussion of precise time and frequency measurement time-nuts@febo.com Sent: Sunday, May 23, 2010 9:21 PM Subject: Re: [time-nuts] Z3805 utility, Was: AW: (no subject) Hi Long ago I decided to go with the terms straight and null modem for the cables I use. NM and ST are easy to mark and hard to confuse. Bob On May 23, 2010, at 8:58 PM, jimlux wrote: Stanley Reynolds wrote: snip Dec computers / terminal servers were as I described, but many brands were different. Still have a BOB aka break out box with LEDs to indicate levels, matching transmit and receive is easy, getting the hardware flow control / signaling right was a little more difficult. straight cable = pin to pin crossed cable = null modem = swapped pins The phrase null modem comes from no modems or the configuration that allows two singular ports to be connected, this cable would cross the receive and transmit pins, and some would call it a cross over cable. A null modem cable would be used to connect two computers together and a program like kermit used to transfer files. Yep.. DTE cable to DCE communications medium(phoneline) DCE to DTE DCE == Modem (e.g. a Bell 202 or 212, for instance) There were the flow control (RTS/CTS) used to turn around a half duplex link. And, there are also the secondary transmit and receive (for a low rate reverse channel). If you were receiving data from the link (DCE), you'd assert RTS, and when the modem had switched, it would tell you CTS, and off you'd go. (fancy modems used the reverse channel to send the request to the far end, which would acknowledge... others just use a fixed time delay) There are also pins for the clock (since some of these modems were used on synchronous data links). the crossover occured in the DCE to DCE link (that is, you'd transmit from one DCE to the other DCE's receiver)... the nominal cable between DTE and DCE was straight through. With no real convention on male/female.. most devices had female sockets, and the cables usually were male male plugs. IBM PCs had male on the chassis for DTE, as did some PDT-110 (VT-100/LSI-11 smart terminals), but most other terminals (the LSI ADM-x, Hazeltines, etc.) all seemed to have female, as did the TI 800 series printer/terminals. So, a null modem was a cable that emulated the DCE to DCE connection.. there are/were various strategies on how sophisticated the reverse is.. do you also send the secondary channel? What about clocks? Most folks ignored all that and used RTS/CTS Or you strap RTS to CTS on your side, the other side does the same. I think the phrase standard cable which could be null or straight depending on the use is the confusing part. Phone cables RJ11 and RJ45 swap the wires which is standard. Network cables match the wires with the same color always on the right which is standard. But even when a phone cable is standard it is not interchangeable with a standard network cable. Again we have a need for cross
Re: [time-nuts] IRIG B
Example of IRIG-B generator and decoder implemented in LabVIEW FPGA: http://zone.ni.com/devzone/cda/epd/p/id/3396 Stanley ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
Re: [time-nuts] Mu Metal
- Original Message From: ewkeh...@aol.com ewkeh...@aol.com To: time-nuts@febo.com Sent: Fri, May 28, 2010 6:21:02 AM Subject: Re: [time-nuts] Mu Metal Who is Electr. Goldmine. How do I contact them. Bert Kehren snip http://www.goldmine-elec.com/ Phone Numbers: Toll-Free Sales: (800) 445-0697 International Sales: (480) 451-7454 Technical Support: (480) 451-7454 Fax Numbers: Sales: (480) 661-8259 Email: sa...@goldmine-elec.com orderi...@goldmine-elec.com Web Sites: The Electronic Goldmine: http://www.goldmine-elec.com The Electronic Goldmine Online Store: http://www.goldmine-elec-products.com Mailing Address: The Electronic Goldmine PO Box 5408 Scottsdale, AZ 85261 Corporate Headquarters: The Electronic Goldmine 9322 N. 94th Way Suite 104 Scottsdale, AZ 85258 ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
Re: [time-nuts] Mu Metal
http://www.goldmine-elec-products.com/prodinfo.asp?number=G16600A ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
Re: [time-nuts] preferred GPS
CW25-TIM http://www.navsync.com/docs/CW25_TIM.pdf Stanley - Original Message From: Bob Bownes bow...@gmail.com Sent: Wed, June 2, 2010 11:54:56 AM Subject: [time-nuts] preferred GPS So, do folks have a preferred GPS module to discipline clocks? Clearly some are better than others. I'd like one that will output in NMEA so I can use it to drive some other things as well, but other than that, it has become clear that the Rockwell MicroTrack TU00 just isn't going to cut it as it only locks to 4 satellites, has quite a bit of jitter, doesn't hold a very good 3D lock (+/-100m just isn't good enough for me...) Thanks, Bob ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there. ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
Re: [time-nuts] A philosophy of science view on the tight pll discussion
I have no problem with strong points of view, in some ways it increases my enthusiasm for the topic. The medium of email does have it's limits, but why censor or ignore the discussion if it includes these indications of a strong belief in ones view ? We have many dry papers to read please don't censor your self because it may upset some one, but try to express your self as well as your view point. We all are responsible for our own feelings, but not everyone's. As to the current discussion it still has value for me, I thank all that have advanced my understanding. Stanley ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
Re: [time-nuts] Tbolts
Important to add the shipping I saw the $199 but it had $100 for shipping, total $299 One unit I saw had a connector to plug the unit into a card rack, without the card rack it was not clear how much modification would be needed to run it stand alone. Stanley - Original Message From: John Green wpxs...@gmail.com To: time-nuts@febo.com Sent: Sat, June 5, 2010 11:23:49 AM Subject: Re: [time-nuts] Tbolts I have a couple of TBOLTs as well as a Z3801. If it were me, I would spend the extra and get a Z3801 or something similar. There is a Z3805 on eBay right now for $199. I didn't notice if it was an auction or buy it now. Z3801s seem to vary widely in price. I have seen them for under $200 but right now, they seem to be in the $400 to $500 range. If I didn't have a Z3801 and got a TBOLT, I would probably think it was great. But after comparing them I'd go with the Z3801. I am not putting down the TBOLT. In use one for a frequency reference for a ham repeater and love it in that application. ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there. ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
Re: [time-nuts] Odd FTS 4060 Behavior
Adrian Pure speculation from a shade tree time-nut: As my tube became weaker the unit became heat sensitive and would stay locked if I keep the room cooler. It also did better on battery power vs the internal supply. I attributed this to signal to noise level changing as the the tube aged. Stanley - Original Message From: Adrian rfn...@arcor.de To: time-nuts@febo.com Sent: Sat, June 12, 2010 10:03:15 AM Subject: [time-nuts] Odd FTS 4060 Behavior I have a FTS 4060 Caesium Frequency Standard that I never managed to get working properly. When powered on, it locks properly after some 10 minutes and keeps running until it jumps off by about +1E-7. That is, the 10 MHz output then reads 10,000,001 Hz, and the red alarm light is on. When I tried it yesterday again, it worked for about 2 hours before the shift appeared. Oddly enough, the green 'Locked' light was still on. This happens every 2...20 hours. Any ideas what could cause that failure? Adrian ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there. ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
Re: [time-nuts] Odd FTS 4060 Behavior
Pictures of 1000b dissembled here: http://www.n4iqt.com/fts1000b/pictures/ Believe it is similar. Stanley - Original Message From: Adrian rfn...@arcor.de To: Discussion of precise time and frequency measurement time-nuts@febo.com Sent: Mon, June 14, 2010 6:17:30 AM Subject: Re: [time-nuts] Odd FTS 4060 Behavior Bert, I was surprised how easy oven disassembly was. Remove the 4 (8?) screws that hold the connector plate and pull it out. Take 3 layers of rubber foam out. Gently pull on the flex board to pull the oven out of the dewar (avoid pulling on the tiny coaxial cable). The dewar may come out of the outer box when you're pulling. It's just wrapped with a layer of foam. I held mine back to keep it inside. Don't worry about pulling a bit stronger if required, the oven assy will start sliding out of the dewar. When the assy is out, carefully remove the brittle hard foam shell. Remove the heater transistor screws. Unsolder the temperature sensor flex wires from the bottom PCB (mine looked like they were just sticked in the PCB contacts, but were actually soldered in). Gently pull the oven out of the PCB connector. Pull both PCB's out of the oven at the same time. They might stick a little because there is some silicone rubber on the opposite edge. Adrian ewkeh...@aol.com schrieb: Adrian, you did actually broke it down to the inside oven level. Is there any thing to look out for. I have a FTS 1200 that has a problem 2 Hz off but I have been reluctant to open it up. Any advice? Thanks Bert In a message dated 6/14/2010 6:02:38 A.M. Eastern Daylight Time, rfn...@arcor.de writes: Only the turned edge connector pins of the two PCB's inside the oven appear to have that problem. I looked under a good microscope, and the female contacts as well as the trimmer cap, both gold plated, looked good. Now 12 hours later, the 4060 is still running fine with no alarm light on and no signs of instability. Adrian Magnus Danielson schrieb: On 06/14/2010 05:45 AM, Glenn Little WB4UIV wrote: This is known as gold embrittlement. The gold has to be removed before a good solder connection is made. To remove the gold, tin the gold plated area. Desolder the tinning. Retin and remove the solder three times. This should remove the gold which forms an amalgam with the solder. After the gold has been removed, a reliable solder connection can be made. This is a common failure mode of radio power amplifiers. If you can undo the connection without adding heat, you will see a black area between the gold plating and the solder. I do not know why the manufacturers insist on gold plating leads that are designed to be soldered. Silver plating seems like a better solution. In this case, it appears that pins were soldered that were not designed to be soldered. Glad that you found the problem. Removing gold is the simple option, it just take time and effort to perform. Gold and tin can under certain mixture relations from a gold-tin alloy which is brittle, this is the problem. When soldering, gold dissolves up into the tin blob very easily, that's why the above procedure work, and also why it can become a real problem. However, this is not an issue of the gold-tin relationship is sufficiently low on gold. When soldering BGA on gold-plated PCB, the amount of tin in the ball is given, but sufficiently thin gold plating is safe. We had this problem in a time when the PCB maker didn't have proper control, but once they got that the issue disappeared. There is a huge difference between brittle and proper solder joints. We still use gold on out board, and it works. We don't get any returns due to that failure mode. So, gold isn't that bad, but you need to be careful and aware. I have many old instruments (Tek, HP) that uses gold-plated boards among other things. None of them has failed due to that problem. Good that you localized that issue with the FTS1200 as I believe more people have that issue with them. Cheers, Magnus ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there. ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there. ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there. ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
Re: [time-nuts] Is quartz crystal aging really a logarithmic curve?
check this paper: http://www.mti-milliren.com/MTIPapers/Ext_Aging_Perf_Results.pdf stanley - Original Message From: Bob Camp li...@rtty.us To: Discussion of precise time and frequency measurement time-nuts@febo.com Sent: Thu, June 24, 2010 10:26:42 PM Subject: Re: [time-nuts] Is quartz crystal aging really a logarithmic curve? Hi If you have a *really bad* crystal, it will follow a very nice log aging cure. A good crystal is much less predictable. The reason is fairly simple, the bad crystal has a single dominant cause for it's aging. It missed a step somewhere along the line and it's got a problem. A precision part is going to be run through a process that results in no single effect being dominant. Bob On Jun 24, 2010, at 2:40 PM, Don Cross wrote: Hi, my name is Don. I have been lurking on this list for a while, so here is my first post. I am a hobbyist who has just built my second home-made quartz digital clock. Both are based on a microcontroller that counts timer interrupts and uses software tricks to allow me to tune the clock rate based on comparison with atomic time via NTP. The second clock uses a temperature sensor and a heater (a grid of resistors) enclosed with the microcontroller board in a glass jar to regulate its own temperature. Of course, I am noticing a drift in the clock rate over time due to crystal aging. The frequency of the crystal is gradually increasing over time. For example, on June 2, the frequency was 15.99927052 MHz. As of yesterday it is hovering around 15.99927796 MHz. I have read through several online resources, including the very interesting one that was posted here recently: http://www.am1.us/Papers/U11625%20VIG-TUTORIAL.PDF On page 4-7 of that document there is a slide titled Typical Aging Behaviors where it shows that long-term crystal aging can be represented as a sum of logarithmic functions. I was wondering if this is just an approximation, or if there is a theoretical reason why logarithms would describe such phenomena? Looking at the causes of aging, they seem to do with changes in the bonding with the electrodes, deposition or oxidation of the components inside the crystal enclosure, etc. I am thinking about trying to measure the aging process over the coming months, and then try to model and even predict future aging. If I can get that to work, perhaps I can even incorporate the formula for predicted aging right into my software. Any insights on this would be much appreciated. FYI, here is a link to what I did on my first clock. I have not yet finished the web page for the second clock, but I will get around to it, eventually. http://cosinekitty.com/digitalclock/ I do have the firmware for my second clock online, along with some crude schematics, if anyone is interested: http://cosinekitty.com/thermalclock/thermal_clock_firmware.cpphttp://cosinekitty.com/thermalclock/main_board_schematic.pnghttp://cosinekitty.com/thermalclock/heater_switch.png - Don _ Hotmail has tools for the New Busy. Search, chat and e-mail from your inbox. http://www.windowslive.com/campaign/thenewbusy?ocid=PID28326::T:WLMTAGL:ON:WL:en-US:WM_HMP:042010_1 ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there. ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there. ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
[time-nuts] FE-405 DOCXO info request
I have a FEI Communications FE-405B DOCXO looking for info. Sales flyer and pictures of the unit here: www.n4iqt.com/fei-fe405b The Sales flyer listed the 405A and I have the 405B don't know the difference. A manual that shows the digital error correction via the i/o port would be great, even better would be info on changing the frequency of the synthesizer. Thank You, Stanley ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
Re: [time-nuts] yet another GPSDO design, or so
I have been thinking about a faster counter also but the Shera board was depending on the jitter in the 24 Mhz clock to average out the +- count. The faster clock would reduce the need for this but without the right amount of jitter we lose the benefit of this average. Stanley - Original Message From: ewkeh...@aol.com ewkeh...@aol.com To: time-nuts@febo.com Sent: Sat, June 26, 2010 8:14:02 PM Subject: Re: [time-nuts] yet another GPSDO design, or so Attilia What you want is basically a Shera Board. That design has been around for quite some time and has served me very well. I have a total of six running including two controlling Rubidium. There are in my opinion a couple of problems: not every 4066 works on the design the 18 bit D/A is very hard to find and now expensive and the single step of the D/A is intended for a 1.7 E-13 frequency step. I have build a input section that counts 100 MHz in stead of 24 MHZ making the unit create steps of 4.3 E-14 which works better on my Rubidium's and Datum FTS 1000. Also it eliminates the 4066's. Since I do not know how to write code that was my solution. I have also designed a later version Shera, with less IC's and a low cost dual D/A but I do not have the programming skill. If you contact me directly I will send you a copy of the QST Shera article, my design and the D/A data sheet.. I am sure you can replace the PIC with an Atmel device. In a message dated 6/26/2010 1:16:09 P.M. Eastern Daylight Time, att...@kinali.ch writes: Moin, I recently had a look at the data sheet of the LEA6-T GPS module from ublox, which now features a second time pulse output that is capable of delivering a 10MHz signal, synchronized to GPS. After thinking quite some time quite some time about building my own GPSDO and struggling with the question how to synchronize a 10MHz signal to a 1Hz signal that has some substantial phase noise, the new LEA6-T module seems like to make things a lot easier. Although the LEA6 specs do not say anything about how the timepulse output is generated or how it is synchronized to GPS, i assume that it will either have some jumps or phase/frequency noise due to oszillator and synchronization imperfections. But, it should be possible to use the LEA6-T together with some OCXO and a PLL setup to stabilize the OCXO to get a high quality frequency standard. Unfortunately, my knowledge in that field is rather limited, thus before starting to make wrong design decisions i'd like to ask for some advice here. My basic idea is to feed the 10MHz output of the LEA6-T and the 10MHz OCXO into a current output PFD, do some low-order filtering of the output signal. Feed that into an ADC which is read by a uC which in turn controls an DAC that sets over some amplifier stage the EFC input of the OCXO. As PFD i thought about using a ADF4002 from Analog, which is actually an PLL, but allows to bypass the input dividers, so that it can be used as pure current output PFD. I'm not yet sure what kind of output filter i want to use. I probably have to add at least one low noise opamp there, to isolate the PFD output/filter from the ADC. I'm also not sure what filter frequency i should use here. It will have to be below 10MHz for sure, probably in the lower kHz range, but how low is the question. The lower the easier gets the ADC stage and the less work has to be done in the uC, but using a low frequency filter either means using an active filter (noise) or high value R or L (again noise, especially the L might couple in 50Hz noise from the enviroment or show microphone effects). The ADC will be either a low-noise 16bit type or a 24bit type. This will largely depend on the sample rate to be used and the availabilty of the ADCs. Any good advices on what to use here? Should there be some form of signal conditioning done? If, what form of conditioning would you advise me to use? As a uC i thought about using a AT91SAM7 variant from Atmel. I know these beasts (and their bugs) pretty well by now and already have some code ready for those. I thought about clocking the uC with a 40MHz crystal that is synchronized to the 10MHz OCXO using a PLL. This would allow me to generate quite precise+accurate digital signals. Unfortunately, there doesnt seem to be VCXOs at 40MHz available so that means that i'd have to build one by hand. The loopfilter is going to end up in the uC as it is easier to build such low frequency filters digitally than in analog. I havent put much thought into how that filter should look like, as this can be easily changed later. The DAC will probably be a 16bit type (there does not seem any higher resolution DAC with sane specs and still reasonable availability). The amplifier for the DAC output will be a two stage amplifier. One stage that adds an (adjustable) offset and one stage that adds the (again adjustable) amplification. This approach is choosen as the needed
Re: [time-nuts] yet another GPSDO design, or so
Yes I see your need for a reduced range with smaller steps. But I was looking for smaller steps to improve the tracking accuracy without a loss of the benefit of averaging. From the QST article: Interestingly, it is desirable to have the frequency of U7 drift slightly rather than being synchronized with the VCXO. A slight random drift averages out the count ambiguity that is inherent in any pulse-counting device. My measurements indicate that the simple phase-measuring circuit I use is consistently accurate to 2 or 3 ns (for a 30-second measurement), while without drift, the resolution would be limited to 42 ns. The $5 crystal oscillator module drifts adequately So the drift should just cover the area of uncertainty that is one cycle, too much drift would reduce accuracy, not enough and the average is of no benefit. One extreme no jitter, average doesn't work as it doesn't distribute the samples over the range of uncertainty. The other case too much jitter and the best to expect is an average weighted to one side or the other (+-1 count) with the extreme producing multiple counts of error. Something about this makes me nervous maybe the part about slight random drift what is slight at 24 Mhz is it also slight at 100 Mhz ? An average of 30 samples does have a limit to what it will correct. Stanley - Original Message From: ewkeh...@aol.com ewkeh...@aol.com To: time-nuts@febo.com Sent: Sun, June 27, 2010 8:58:55 AM Subject: Re: [time-nuts] yet another GPSDO design, or so Stanley the faster counter also has the jitter, no change, as long as it is not tied to the input frequency. The 24 MHz is not unique, the 100 MHz is same technology just four times faster and thus gives me smaller steps on the D/A and since I use it on Rub. the full range of the 18 bit covers the full tuning range of the Rub. Bert In a message dated 6/27/2010 9:05:12 A.M. Eastern Daylight Time, stanley_reyno...@yahoo.com writes: I have been thinking about a faster counter also but the Shera board was depending on the jitter in the 24 Mhz clock to average out the +- count. The faster clock would reduce the need for this but without the right amount of jitter we lose the benefit of this average. Stanley snip ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
Re: [time-nuts] yet another GPSDO design, or so
Without knowing your 100Mhz clock would it not need less jitter to average out +- one count at 100Mhz vs one count at 24Mhz? The GPS error has improved with better hardware/software in the receivers as well as turning off SA. So I'm not so sure the GPS error will wash out the counter's error. Even if it does, as a want to be time nut I need a better counter which is why more is better, a faster count with a recipical counter equals better unless the faster counter no longer averages out the +- count. Stanley - Original Message From: ewkeh...@aol.com ewkeh...@aol.com To: time-nuts@febo.com Sent: Sun, June 27, 2010 1:17:51 PM Subject: Re: [time-nuts] yet another GPSDO design, or so Going from 24 to 100 MHz only gives you smaller steps (resolution) every thing else stays the same. If the he saw 2 to 3 nsec should be more like 8, going to 100 MHz will improve it by a factor of 4. In a redesign of the total system I would have two sample sizes maybe stay with 30 or go to 50/60 and in the Rub. mode 200 maybe 300 sec. Let us not forget what we start out with the GPS signal does not allow us to take advantage of the full resolution. Do not forget I did this to get smaller D/A steps and am not able to rewrite the code, basically fooling the controller that the error should call for a 1.7 E-13 correction when in reality the error is 4.3 E-14 and the resulting step is also 4.3 E-14 per D/A bit. Bert In a message dated 6/27/2010 1:43:40 P.M. Eastern Daylight Time, stanley_reyno...@yahoo.com writes: Yes I see your need for a reduced range with smaller steps. But I was looking for smaller steps to improve the tracking accuracy without a loss of the benefit of averaging. From the QST article: Interestingly, it is desirable to have the frequency of U7 drift slightly rather than being synchronized with the VCXO. A slight random drift averages out the count ambiguity that is inherent in any pulse-counting device. My measurements indicate that the simple phase-measuring circuit I use is consistently accurate to 2 or 3 ns (for a 30-second measurement), while without drift, the resolution would be limited to 42 ns. The $5 crystal oscillator module drifts adequately So the drift should just cover the area of uncertainty that is one cycle, too much drift would reduce accuracy, not enough and the average is of no benefit. One extreme no jitter, average doesn't work as it doesn't distribute the samples over the range of uncertainty. The other case too much jitter and the best to expect is an average weighted to one side or the other (+-1 count) with the extreme producing multiple counts of error. Something about this makes me nervous maybe the part about slight random drift what is slight at 24 Mhz is it also slight at 100 Mhz ? An average of 30 samples does have a limit to what it will correct. Stanley - Original Message From: ewkeh...@aol.com ewkeh...@aol.com To: time-nuts@febo.com Sent: Sun, June 27, 2010 8:58:55 AM Subject: Re: [time-nuts] yet another GPSDO design, or so Stanley the faster counter also has the jitter, no change, as long as it is not tied to the input frequency. The 24 MHz is not unique, the 100 MHz is same technology just four times faster and thus gives me smaller steps on the D/A and since I use it on Rub. the full range of the 18 bit covers the full tuning range of the Rub. Bert In a message dated 6/27/2010 9:05:12 A.M. Eastern Daylight Time, stanley_reyno...@yahoo.com writes: I have been thinking about a faster counter also but the Shera board was depending on the jitter in the 24 Mhz clock to average out the +- count. The faster clock would reduce the need for this but without the right amount of jitter we lose the benefit of this average. Stanley snip ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there. ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there. ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
Re: [time-nuts] yet another GPSDO design, or so
Jitter may not be the correct word. I also don't know how accurate or repeatable the averaging effect is as described in the article. But I do believe the amount of drift is important for this to work as stated before. Independent is required, if locked then this is the extreme case of no drift and average value will be the same as all the samples are the same integer number. To see the fraction between the integer we need our data set to have some number of samples above and below and hopefully in a ratio to indicate the real measurement. If the drift is too small then we will tend to calculate an average too small, as more samples will fall to the low side the high side is never reached. If the drift is too big we will over shoot to the next higher integer number and this will bias the average up too high. Stanley - Original Message From: ewkeh...@aol.com ewkeh...@aol.com To: time-nuts@febo.com Sent: Sun, June 27, 2010 4:27:39 PM Subject: Re: [time-nuts] yet another GPSDO design, or so Stanley I am not an expert but it is not only the jitter it is the fact that since the two sources are not linked the independent drift of the 100 MHz causes a distribution of the count. Again even with the same resolution the count error will be four X and the subsequent correction will be to scale, with out changing the code. Bert In a message dated 6/27/2010 4:00:59 P.M. Eastern Daylight Time, stanley_reyno...@yahoo.com writes: Without knowing your 100Mhz clock would it not need less jitter to average out +- one count at 100Mhz vs one count at 24Mhz? The GPS error has improved with better hardware/software in the receivers as well as turning off SA. So I'm not so sure the GPS error will wash out the counter's error. Even if it does, as a want to be time nut I need a better counter which is why more is better, a faster count with a recipical counter equals better unless the faster counter no longer averages out the +- count. Stanley - Original Message From: ewkeh...@aol.com ewkeh...@aol.com To: time-nuts@febo.com Sent: Sun, June 27, 2010 1:17:51 PM Subject: Re: [time-nuts] yet another GPSDO design, or so Going from 24 to 100 MHz only gives you smaller steps (resolution) every thing else stays the same. If the he saw 2 to 3 nsec should be more like 8, going to 100 MHz will improve it by a factor of 4. In a redesign of the total system I would have two sample sizes maybe stay with 30 or go to 50/60 and in the Rub. mode 200 maybe 300 sec. Let us not forget what we start out with the GPS signal does not allow us to take advantage of the full resolution. Do not forget I did this to get smaller D/A steps and am not able to rewrite the code, basically fooling the controller that the error should call for a 1.7 E-13 correction when in reality the error is 4.3 E-14 and the resulting step is also 4.3 E-14 per D/A bit. Bert In a message dated 6/27/2010 1:43:40 P.M. Eastern Daylight Time, stanley_reyno...@yahoo.com writes: Yes I see your need for a reduced range with smaller steps. But I was looking for smaller steps to improve the tracking accuracy without a loss of the benefit of averaging. From the QST article: Interestingly, it is desirable to have the frequency of U7 drift slightly rather than being synchronized with the VCXO. A slight random drift averages out the count ambiguity that is inherent in any pulse-counting device. My measurements indicate that the simple phase-measuring circuit I use is consistently accurate to 2 or 3 ns (for a 30-second measurement), while without drift, the resolution would be limited to 42 ns. The $5 crystal oscillator module drifts adequately So the drift should just cover the area of uncertainty that is one cycle, too much drift would reduce accuracy, not enough and the average is of no benefit. One extreme no jitter, average doesn't work as it doesn't distribute the samples over the range of uncertainty. The other case too much jitter and the best to expect is an average weighted to one side or the other (+-1 count) with the extreme producing multiple counts of error. Something about this makes me nervous maybe the part about slight random drift what is slight at 24 Mhz is it also slight at 100 Mhz ? An average of 30 samples does have a limit to what it will correct. Stanley - Original Message From: ewkeh...@aol.com ewkeh...@aol.com To: time-nuts@febo.com Sent: Sun, June 27, 2010 8:58:55 AM Subject: Re: [time-nuts] yet another GPSDO design, or so Stanley the faster counter also has the jitter, no change, as long as it is not tied to the input frequency. The 24 MHz is not unique, the 100 MHz is same technology just four times faster and thus gives me smaller steps on the D/A and since I use it on Rub. the full range of the 18 bit covers the full tuning range of the Rub. Bert In a message
Re: [time-nuts] yet another GPSDO design, or so
My last statement is not quite correct. If the drift is too big we will over shoot to the next higher integer number and this will bias the average up too high. In the case where the 100Mhz clock drifts both up and down the number could average to the correct fraction. But now the rate of drift as well as it's magnitude would need to be correct. Accuracy is not important here just the precision, as the number is not important just the rate of change of the number indicates error. I need to think more about this Stanley - Original Message From: Stanley Reynolds stanley_reyno...@yahoo.com To: Discussion of precise time and frequency measurement time-nuts@febo.com Sent: Sun, June 27, 2010 5:23:13 PM Subject: Re: [time-nuts] yet another GPSDO design, or so Jitter may not be the correct word. I also don't know how accurate or repeatable the averaging effect is as described in the article. But I do believe the amount of drift is important for this to work as stated before. Independent is required, if locked then this is the extreme case of no drift and average value will be the same as all the samples are the same integer number. To see the fraction between the integer we need our data set to have some number of samples above and below and hopefully in a ratio to indicate the real measurement. If the drift is too small then we will tend to calculate an average too small, as more samples will fall to the low side the high side is never reached. If the drift is too big we will over shoot to the next higher integer number and this will bias the average up too high. Stanley - Original Message From: ewkeh...@aol.com ewkeh...@aol.com To: time-nuts@febo.com Sent: Sun, June 27, 2010 4:27:39 PM Subject: Re: [time-nuts] yet another GPSDO design, or so Stanley I am not an expert but it is not only the jitter it is the fact that since the two sources are not linked the independent drift of the 100 MHz causes a distribution of the count. Again even with the same resolution the count error will be four X and the subsequent correction will be to scale, with out changing the code. Bert In a message dated 6/27/2010 4:00:59 P.M. Eastern Daylight Time, stanley_reyno...@yahoo.com writes: Without knowing your 100Mhz clock would it not need less jitter to average out +- one count at 100Mhz vs one count at 24Mhz? The GPS error has improved with better hardware/software in the receivers as well as turning off SA. So I'm not so sure the GPS error will wash out the counter's error. Even if it does, as a want to be time nut I need a better counter which is why more is better, a faster count with a recipical counter equals better unless the faster counter no longer averages out the +- count. Stanley - Original Message From: ewkeh...@aol.com ewkeh...@aol.com To: time-nuts@febo.com Sent: Sun, June 27, 2010 1:17:51 PM Subject: Re: [time-nuts] yet another GPSDO design, or so Going from 24 to 100 MHz only gives you smaller steps (resolution) every thing else stays the same. If the he saw 2 to 3 nsec should be more like 8, going to 100 MHz will improve it by a factor of 4. In a redesign of the total system I would have two sample sizes maybe stay with 30 or go to 50/60 and in the Rub. mode 200 maybe 300 sec. Let us not forget what we start out with the GPS signal does not allow us to take advantage of the full resolution. Do not forget I did this to get smaller D/A steps and am not able to rewrite the code, basically fooling the controller that the error should call for a 1.7 E-13 correction when in reality the error is 4.3 E-14 and the resulting step is also 4.3 E-14 per D/A bit. Bert In a message dated 6/27/2010 1:43:40 P.M. Eastern Daylight Time, stanley_reyno...@yahoo.com writes: Yes I see your need for a reduced range with smaller steps. But I was looking for smaller steps to improve the tracking accuracy without a loss of the benefit of averaging. From the QST article: Interestingly, it is desirable to have the frequency of U7 drift slightly rather than being synchronized with the VCXO. A slight random drift averages out the count ambiguity that is inherent in any pulse-counting device. My measurements indicate that the simple phase-measuring circuit I use is consistently accurate to 2 or 3 ns (for a 30-second measurement), while without drift, the resolution would be limited to 42 ns. The $5 crystal oscillator module drifts adequately So the drift should just cover the area of uncertainty that is one cycle, too much drift would reduce accuracy, not enough and the average is of no benefit. One extreme no jitter, average doesn't work as it doesn't distribute the samples over the range of uncertainty. The other case too much jitter and the best to expect is an average weighted to one side or the other (+-1 count) with the extreme producing multiple counts
Re: [time-nuts] PICTIC II
done www.n4iqt.com/picticii/circuit.jpg www.n4iqt.com/picticii/PICTICII.bmp both above as pdf www.n4iqt.com/picticii/circuit-pcb.pdf Stanley - Original Message From: Joseph Gray jg...@zianet.com To: Discussion of precise time and frequency measurement time-nuts@febo.com Sent: Sun, June 27, 2010 6:01:28 PM Subject: Re: [time-nuts] PICTIC II As asked by another, please post a PDF of the schematic. I don't have any software installed that can read the files you posted. Joe Gray W5JG On Sun, Jun 27, 2010 at 3:54 PM, Magnus Danielson mag...@rubidium.dyndns.org wrote: On 06/26/2010 09:11 AM, Richard H McCorkle wrote: Fellow Time-Nuts, When I first uploaded the Simple PICTIC interpolating time interval counter to the K04BB site in 12/08 and presented it to the group as a Christmas present my goal was to get amateurs building their own interpolating time interval counters for GPS monitoring and making improvements to my design. The interpolator in the PICTIC was “borrowed” from an early HP counter with minor modifications so I didn’t design it and had no personal attachment to it. Which counter? Just curious. Over the last 18 months I have developed a new diode switched interpolator based on the comments made on line and have thoroughly tested it. Some suggestions made improvements in the performance and some resulted in poorer performance. I incorporated those suggestions that made improvements, eliminated those that made things worse, and once I was satisfied I sent the revised interpolator design directly to Bruce off line. Based on comments and suggestions he returned during a long series of emails I incorporated additional changes in the code, front-end, and interpolator designs and tested those changes until I was satisfied with the performance and he had no further comments. I am finally satisfied with the new design and admit that by incorporating the majority of the suggestions made the new interpolator has significantly better linearity than the HP interpolator used in the PICTIC and it is now suitable for higher resolutions. I was reluctant to post the PICTIC II in this forum, as I don’t want to get in another public discussion of its faults without any discussion of the merits of a $50 serial output interpolating TIC on a 3.8” x 2.5” thru-hole board designed for amateur construction. The K04BB WIKI PICTIC page was recently updated to include the PICTIC II code and ExpressPCB board layout and schematic files for those that might be interested. http://www.ko4bb.com/dokuwiki/doku.php?id=precision_timing:pictic The PICTIC II incorporates the new interpolator, requires a delay between the inputs, and uses a low stability XO timebase with software peak detection for calibration with provision for an external timebase like the PICTIC to minimize size and cost. Sounds interesting. What is the ball-park figures? Resolution, jitter, linearity? Cheers, Magnus ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there. ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there. ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
Re: [time-nuts] PICTIC II
Sorry, my mistake, updated the pdf. Stanley - Original Message From: Magnus Danielson mag...@rubidium.dyndns.org To: time-nuts@febo.com Sent: Mon, June 28, 2010 2:57:34 AM Subject: Re: [time-nuts] PICTIC II On 06/28/2010 01:46 AM, Stanley Reynolds wrote: done www.n4iqt.com/picticii/circuit.jpg www.n4iqt.com/picticii/PICTICII.bmp both above as pdf www.n4iqt.com/picticii/circuit-pcb.pdf Looks like page 2 of the schematic isn't there. The analog interpolator is there... if the overall schematic is anything like the PICTIC. I was unable to open up the schematic, but I may have made a mistake... Cheers, Magnus ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there. ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
Re: [time-nuts] FE-405 DOCXO info request
Thanks, looking into it now, maybe they left the door unlocked. Stanley - Original Message From: Magnus Danielson mag...@rubidium.dyndns.org To: time-nuts@febo.com Sent: Mon, June 28, 2010 3:33:12 PM Subject: Re: [time-nuts] FE-405 DOCXO info request On 06/27/2010 12:31 AM, Stanley Reynolds wrote: I have a FEI Communications FE-405B DOCXO looking for info. Sales flyer and pictures of the unit here: www.n4iqt.com/fei-fe405b The Sales flyer listed the 405A and I have the 405B don't know the difference. A manual that shows the digital error correction via the i/o port would be great, even better would be info on changing the frequency of the synthesizer. I hope you realize that J513 is the ISP connector, and if you look into the datasheet of the 89C52 you will realize that it has a read out command. You could readout the FLASH that way. The datasheet even points to the tool: http://www.flashmagictool.com/ So, it could be a bit of wiring to pull the FLASH out. You can dig a lot of useful info out of such an image. Cheers, Magnus ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there. ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
Re: [time-nuts] FE-405 DOCXO info request
I have not looked at that side of the PCB yet, the plate it is on looks too thick to be just support, maybe a heat sink / heat spreader. It has the name Double Oven CXO and I can see the Crystal oven not sure how the second oven works but think that plate may not come off easy. To be honest I lost my nerve at that point, I was afraid the main spring would come flying out and I never recovered at that point on my previous attempts:-) Need to build the RS232/buffer as described in the reader manual too. Stanley - Original Message From: Magnus Danielson mag...@rubidium.dyndns.org To: time-nuts@febo.com Sent: Mon, June 28, 2010 5:01:35 PM Subject: Re: [time-nuts] FE-405 DOCXO info request On 06/28/2010 11:25 PM, Stanley Reynolds wrote: Thanks, looking into it now, maybe they left the door unlocked. You will not know until you try the handle. You would need to take a photo of the other side of the PCB. I tried to find it among your photos, but no luck. I would have been happy to traced up the full pinning on that connector for you. What you want to know is the commands. You should be able to figure those out. The patent is clear enough on the overall scheme of things. Cheers, Magnus ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there. ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
Re: [time-nuts] yet another GPSDO design, or so
If we lower the size of each step to over lap more would this lower the error ? Software would adjust both converters at the cross over point so neither would change it's full range at this point. Two 12 bit converters would form one 18 or 20 bit converter. I guess taken to the extreme we could interweave any number of converters so hopefully the errors would average out :-) 64 times 12 bit converters making a 20 bit converter each with an equal contribution at each step. Stanley - Original Message From: Bruce Griffiths bruce.griffi...@xtra.co.nz To: Discussion of precise time and frequency measurement time-nuts@febo.com Sent: Tue, June 29, 2010 5:31:50 AM Subject: Re: [time-nuts] yet another GPSDO design, or so The problem is that the gain and offset of the 2 DACs changes with time and temperature so that the required corrections also change. Ideally an autocalibration technique would be used to dynamically track such changes. Since changes in the coarse DAC are only required infrequently and the mismatch only affects the region around coarse DAC transitions which are relatively infrequent (or should be) most designers choose to live with the increased loop settling time at such transitions. With sufficient overlap between the coarse and fine DACs only small fine DAC changes should be required to compensate for mismatch between the coarse and fine DACs after a change in the coarse DAC output. The coarse + fine DAC approach is used in some GPSDOs and in particle accelerator control systems. Bruce snip ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
Re: [time-nuts] PICTIC II
OK, email me off list the number of boards and address so I can calculate postage and I will order them. Stanley - Original Message From: Steve Rooke sar10...@gmail.com To: Discussion of precise time and frequency measurement time-nuts@febo.com Sent: Thu, July 1, 2010 8:34:57 AM Subject: Re: [time-nuts] PICTIC II Me too! On 2 July 2010 00:50, Jeroen Bastemeijer j.bastemei...@tudelft.nl wrote: Dear Richard, and other Time-Nuts, Congratulations! Looks like a very nice design! One remark and one question: * Remark: For those running a non-windows-OS, use Virtualbox (for exampe the free version from Oracle). This works perfect and allows e.g. Linux users to run windows applications, like ExpressPCB. * Question: Is there someone in the US willing to organize a group-buy of PCBs? When people from outside the US want to order ExpressPCB boards they have to pay about the double prices and taxes will be added This would make 17USD board (3 for 51USD as metioned by Richard) cost around 60 USD per board(!) (including shipping overseas, taxes and duties). This project looks very nice for doing some experiments. I had a fun time playing with the simple Pictic, looking forward to playing with the Pictic II! Best regards, Jeroen Richard H McCorkle wrote: Time-Nuts, The PICTIC WIKI page has been updated to include a PDF of the schematic and board layout as requested. Richard On 06/28/2010 01:46 AM, Stanley Reynolds wrote: done www.n4iqt.com/picticii/circuit.jpg www.n4iqt.com/picticii/PICTICII.bmp both above as pdf www.n4iqt.com/picticii/circuit-pcb.pdf Looks like page 2 of the schematic isn't there. The analog interpolator is there... if the overall schematic is anything like the PICTIC. I was unable to open up the schematic, but I may have made a mistake... Cheers, Magnus ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there. ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there. ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there. -- Steve Rooke - ZL3TUV G8KVD The only reason for time is so that everything doesn't happen at once. - Einstein ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there. ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
Re: [time-nuts] PICTIC II
The price would be at my cost and actual shipping, no packaging or processing charges added by me. Not sure of price till I have the number of boards but hope as a group we will get a better price. This would also allow us to order just 1 if that is the need. I can take paypal but that has their cost as well. I would not expect money till I've received the boards and I'm ready to ship. Stanley ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
[time-nuts] PICTIC II PCB group buy
Am 01.07.2010 16:44, schrieb Stanley Reynolds: OK, email me off list the number of boards and address so I can calculate postage and I will order them. The price would be at my cost and actual shipping, no packaging or processing charges added by me. Not sure of price till I have the number of boards but hope as a group we will get a better price. This would also allow us to order just 1 if that is the need. I can take papal but that has their cost as well. I would not expect money till I've received the boards and I'm ready to ship. ebay fee 2.9% + $0.30 USD, outside USA 3.9% + $0.30 USD + currency conversion fee ( not shown on papal site with my first look for it ) I will ship to any country for which it is possible from the post office. If a lot of paper work is required for your country then guess we need a export/import broker as this is my first experience with this. Stanley ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
[time-nuts] Pictic II PCB group buy board cost $8
I expect the board cost to be $8 each + shipping. Will email everyone I receive a request from in a few days and then post here for any lost emails / last call. Stanley ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
[time-nuts] Pic programing for the PICTIC II
I see some $20 programmers on the auction site. Goggle turns up many designs with the warning that your PC serial port needs 11 to 12 volts. Did see a design that used a external power supply. A zif socket maybe over kill if you are only using it once. Any volunteers to supply preprogrammed 16f688 chips ? As we cover the world shipping could be a big factor so more than one volunteer would be great. FAQ about PICTIC II My only connection to this project is to supply circuit boards at cost. Richard has done all the hard work. Developed by Richard H McCorkle see wiki site : http://www.ko4bb.com/dokuwiki/doku.php?id=precision_timing:pictic No smd parts, standard through the hole parts and dip ic chips. programmer links: http://www.kmitl.ac.th/~kswichit/IspPgm30a/ISP-Pgm30a.html http://webs.uolsinectis.com.ar/nancy/pic/pic_en.html ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
Re: [time-nuts] Pic programing for the PICTIC II
- Original Message From: paul swed paulsw...@gmail.com To: Discussion of precise time and frequency measurement time-nuts@febo.com Sent: Fri, July 2, 2010 10:27:26 AM Subject: Re: [time-nuts] Pic programing for the PICTIC II Whats your board count so far?? 23 people my guess is 40-50 boards Better ? How many16f688s are we talking here? My thinking is less than 10 as only two people have asked. Don't know how many have not asked. Thanks snip ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
Re: [time-nuts] Pic programing for the PICTIC II
Thank you but I have all I want to do with the boards later I may change my mind. Stanley - Original Message From: Chuck Harris cfhar...@erols.com To: Discussion of precise time and frequency measurement time-nuts@febo.com Sent: Fri, July 2, 2010 10:30:25 AM Subject: Re: [time-nuts] Pic programing for the PICTIC II I'm not too excited about all of the individualshipping, but if you can tell me how many you want, I could buy them, program them, and ship them to you to be distributed with the boards. -Chuck Harris Stanley Reynolds wrote: I see some $20 programmers on the auction site. Goggle turns up many designs with the warning that your PC serial port needs 11 to 12 volts. Did see a design that used a external power supply. A zif socket maybe over kill if you are only using it once. Any volunteers to supply preprogrammed 16f688 chips ? As we cover the world shipping could be a big factor so more than one volunteer would be great. FAQ about PICTIC II My only connection to this project is to supply circuit boards at cost. Richard has done all the hard work. Developed by Richard H McCorkle see wiki site : http://www.ko4bb.com/dokuwiki/doku.php?id=precision_timing:pictic No smd parts, standard through the hole parts and dip ic chips. programmer links: http://www.kmitl.ac.th/~kswichit/IspPgm30a/ISP-Pgm30a.html http://webs.uolsinectis.com.ar/nancy/pic/pic_en.html ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there. ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
[time-nuts] PICTIC II PCB order placed
Oops, I didn't know this was on the list been getting a lot of off list stuff. Some of my own emails to the list get lost before they get to me, others are delayed this is a on going problem probably a yahoo spam filter overload. UPDATE on order: I have placed the order for more boards than needed and hope to receive them in less than 2 weeks. As far as shipping think it will be easy for me if we call it 1 USD per board. I will let everyone gage when they need to mail their US funds check/money order. If you are paying by paypal add 50 cents per board for a total of 9.50. No need for payment till I receive the boards unless you are unsure how long it will take for me to receive it. Stanley Reynolds 225 Alpine Street Birmingham, AL 35210 USA If your software will only work with Irondale and not Birmingham this is OK Stanley Reynolds 225 Alpine Street Irondale, AL 35210 USA paypal stanley_reyno...@yahoo.com - Original Message From: Bob Bownes bow...@gmail.com To: Discussion of precise time and frequency measurement time-nuts@febo.com Sent: Fri, July 2, 2010 10:45:36 AM Subject: Re: [time-nuts] Pic programing for the PICTIC II Ok. I think there are a few of us who can/would program these up for folks who need one. On Fri, Jul 2, 2010 at 11:43 AM, Stanley Reynolds stanley_reyno...@yahoo.com wrote: Thank you but I have all I want to do with the boards later I may change my mind. Stanley snip ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
Re: [time-nuts] PICTIC II PCB order placed
Best source of info is : http://www.ko4bb.com/dokuwiki/doku.php?id=precision_timing:pictic A simple time interval counter to connect at a PC serial port. Sort of a experimenter's way to understand how the instrument works without too much complexity. Stanley - Original Message From: Richard W. Solomon w1...@earthlink.net To: Discussion of precise time and frequency measurement time-nuts@febo.com Sent: Fri, July 2, 2010 12:44:48 PM Subject: Re: [time-nuts] PICTIC II PCB order placed All this talk about the PICTIC has aroused my curiosity ... I missed the beginning of the thread, what is it for ? I may want on the wagon too !! 73, Dick, W1KSZ -Original Message- From: Stanley Reynolds stanley_reyno...@yahoo.com Sent: Jul 2, 2010 9:46 AM To: Discussion of precise time and frequency measurement time-nuts@febo.com Subject: [time-nuts] PICTIC II PCB order placed Oops, I didn't know this was on the list been getting a lot of off list stuff. Some of my own emails to the list get lost before they get to me, others are delayed this is a on going problem probably a yahoo spam filter overload. UPDATE on order: I have placed the order for more boards than needed and hope to receive them in less than 2 weeks. As far as shipping think it will be easy for me if we call it 1 USD per board. I will let everyone gage when they need to mail their US funds check/money order. If you are paying by paypal add 50 cents per board for a total of 9.50. No need for payment till I receive the boards unless you are unsure how long it will take for me to receive it. Stanley Reynolds 225 Alpine Street Birmingham, AL 35210 USA If your software will only work with Irondale and not Birmingham this is OK Stanley Reynolds 225 Alpine Street Irondale, AL 35210 USA paypal stanley_reyno...@yahoo.com - Original Message From: Bob Bownes bow...@gmail.com To: Discussion of precise time and frequency measurement time-nuts@febo.com Sent: Fri, July 2, 2010 10:45:36 AM Subject: Re: [time-nuts] Pic programing for the PICTIC II Ok. I think there are a few of us who can/would program these up for folks who need one. On Fri, Jul 2, 2010 at 11:43 AM, Stanley Reynolds stanley_reyno...@yahoo.com wrote: Thank you but I have all I want to do with the boards later I may change my mind. Stanley snip ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there. ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there. ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
[time-nuts] Pictic II mods
Looking at Richard's code in PICTICII.ASM : bsf TXSTA,BRGH ;set USART hi speed mode movlw D'51' ;set async rate at 9600 baud (51. for 8 MHz int, BRGH=1) movwf SPBRG Then '25' would be 19,200 baud and '12' would be 38,400 baud Need to test this but could be a way to get more data out. Stanley ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
Re: [time-nuts] Pictic II mods
yes, internal clock, may need to tune the osc or try +- one number, external osc pins are in use. Stanley - Original Message From: Bob Camp li...@rtty.us To: Discussion of precise time and frequency measurement time-nuts@febo.com Sent: Fri, July 2, 2010 4:11:11 PM Subject: Re: [time-nuts] Pictic II mods Hi I believe he's using the internal clock on the PIC. It's not super accurate, so running a lot of data can be an issue. Bob -Original Message- From: time-nuts-boun...@febo.com [mailto:time-nuts-boun...@febo.com] On Behalf Of Stanley Reynolds Sent: Friday, July 02, 2010 3:41 PM To: time-nuts@febo.com Subject: [time-nuts] Pictic II mods Looking at Richard's code in PICTICII.ASM : bsf TXSTA,BRGH ;set USART hi speed mode movlw D'51' ;set async rate at 9600 baud (51. for 8 MHz int, BRGH=1) movwf SPBRG Then '25' would be 19,200 baud and '12' would be 38,400 baud Need to test this but could be a way to get more data out. Stanley ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there. ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there. ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
Re: [time-nuts] Pic programing for the PICTIC II
Joe, Will add you to my list for boards, perhaps someone else here can help with the PIC chips. Stanley - Original Message From: J. L. Trantham jlt...@att.net To: Discussion of precise time and frequency measurement time-nuts@febo.com Sent: Fri, July 2, 2010 6:33:56 PM Subject: Re: [time-nuts] Pic programing for the PICTIC II I requested 4 boards and I will need 4 of the 16F688's. However, one of my goals for this is to learn to do the programming. Therefore, getting some 'pre-programmed' chips to compare with my own programmed chips will be very helpful. Joe -Original Message- From: time-nuts-boun...@febo.com [mailto:time-nuts-boun...@febo.com] On Behalf Of Stanley Reynolds Sent: Friday, July 02, 2010 10:37 AM To: Discussion of precise time and frequency measurement Subject: Re: [time-nuts] Pic programing for the PICTIC II - Original Message From: paul swed paulsw...@gmail.com To: Discussion of precise time and frequency measurement time-nuts@febo.com Sent: Fri, July 2, 2010 10:27:26 AM Subject: Re: [time-nuts] Pic programing for the PICTIC II Whats your board count so far?? 23 people my guess is 40-50 boards Better ? How many16f688s are we talking here? My thinking is less than 10 as only two people have asked. Don't know how many have not asked. Thanks snip ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there. ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there. ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
Re: [time-nuts] PICTIC II PCB order placed
No problem, I expect to have the boards 7/21, I will have plenty. Stanley - Original Message From: Robert Berg bo...@pobox.com To: Discussion of precise time and frequency measurement time-nuts@febo.com Sent: Sat, July 3, 2010 9:26:49 AM Subject: Re: [time-nuts] PICTIC II PCB order placed Stanley, If it's not too late, could I order 2 boards, please? Thanks! Robert Berg ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there. ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
Re: [time-nuts] PICTIC II PCB group buy
No problem, I expect to have the boards 7/21, I will have plenty. Stanley - Original Message From: Randall Prentice randall.prent...@pscconsulting.com To: Discussion of precise time and frequency measurement time-nuts@febo.com Sent: Fri, July 2, 2010 11:21:46 PM Subject: [time-nuts] PICTIC II PCB group buy Add me to the list please. Thanks 73s Randall ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there. ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
Re: [time-nuts] PICTIC II PCB group buy
No problem, I expect to have the boards 7/21, I will have plenty. Stanley - Original Message From: Al Digit l_di...@yahoo.com To: time-nuts@febo.com Sent: Fri, July 2, 2010 11:10:03 PM Subject: [time-nuts] PICTIC II PCB group buy Add me to the list. Thanks ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there. ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
[time-nuts] Preprogramed PICTIC Chips
Starting this thread as a place for people wanting chips and people who can supply them to meet. Sorry I can not do the chips and also have time for my projects. Stanley ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
Re: [time-nuts] PICTIC II PCB order placed
No problem you are on the list, expect to have plenty boards 7/21. Stanley - Original Message From: Arnold Tibus arnold.ti...@gmx.de To: Discussion of precise time and frequency measurement time-nuts@febo.com Sent: Sat, July 3, 2010 1:06:01 PM Subject: Re: [time-nuts] PICTIC II PCB order placed Hello Stanley, I wrote already twice offline, but it looks like it doesn't arrive. So I ask this way, if it is not too late, can I order as well 2 ea.? Who can provide the programmed pics (best in Europe for Germany)? Many thanks, Arnold Am 03.07.2010 18:27, schrieb Stanley Reynolds: No problem, I expect to have the boards 7/21, I will have plenty. Stanley - Original Message From: Robert Berg bo...@pobox.com To: Discussion of precise time and frequency measurement time-nuts@febo.com Sent: Sat, July 3, 2010 9:26:49 AM Subject: Re: [time-nuts] PICTIC II PCB order placed Stanley, If it's not too late, could I order 2 boards, please? Thanks! Robert Berg ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there. ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there. ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
Re: [time-nuts] PICTIC II PCB order placed
You are on the list. Stanley - Original Message From: f1ehx f1...@wanadoo.fr To: Discussion of precise time and frequency measurement time-nuts@febo.com Sent: Sun, July 4, 2010 3:50:16 AM Subject: Re: [time-nuts] PICTIC II PCB order placed Please, Add me for 2 pieces, Thank-you, Bernard, F1EHX. - Original Message - From: Stanley Reynolds stanley_reyno...@yahoo.com To: Discussion of precise time and frequency measurement time-nuts@febo.com Sent: Friday, July 02, 2010 6:46 PM Subject: [time-nuts] PICTIC II PCB order placed Oops, I didn't know this was on the list been getting a lot of off list stuff. Some of my own emails to the list get lost before they get to me, others are delayed this is a on going problem probably a yahoo spam filter overload. UPDATE on order: I have placed the order for more boards than needed and hope to receive them in less than 2 weeks. As far as shipping think it will be easy for me if we call it 1 USD per board. I will let everyone gage when they need to mail their US funds check/money order. If you are paying by paypal add 50 cents per board for a total of 9.50. No need for payment till I receive the boards unless you are unsure how long it will take for me to receive it. Stanley Reynolds 225 Alpine Street Birmingham, AL 35210 USA If your software will only work with Irondale and not Birmingham this is OK Stanley Reynolds 225 Alpine Street Irondale, AL 35210 USA paypal stanley_reyno...@yahoo.com - Original Message From: Bob Bownes bow...@gmail.com To: Discussion of precise time and frequency measurement time-nuts@febo.com Sent: Fri, July 2, 2010 10:45:36 AM Subject: Re: [time-nuts] Pic programing for the PICTIC II Ok. I think there are a few of us who can/would program these up for folks who need one. On Fri, Jul 2, 2010 at 11:43 AM, Stanley Reynolds stanley_reyno...@yahoo.com wrote: Thank you but I have all I want to do with the boards later I may change my mind. Stanley snip ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there. --- Orange vous informe que cet e-mail a ete controle par l'anti-virus mail. Aucun virus connu a ce jour par nos services n'a ete detecte. ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there. ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
Re: [time-nuts] DS-1 from 10MHz
I have a board that does this, I could send you. See Pictures here: www.n4iqt.com/fts4040/ds1 www.n4iqt.com/fts4040/ds1/FTSds1001.JPG www.n4iqt.com/fts4040/ds1/FTSds1002.JPG www.n4iqt.com/fts4040/ds1/FTSds1003.JPG Stanley - Original Message From: J.D. Schoedel jdschoe...@verizon.net To: Discussion of precise time and frequency measurement time-nuts@febo.com Sent: Sun, July 4, 2010 11:57:44 AM Subject: [time-nuts] DS-1 from 10MHz All, I would like to generate a DS-1 timing reference from 10 MHz, e.g a T-bolt. Thought someone here might be able to suggest a starting point. Thanks, J.D. ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there. ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
Re: [time-nuts] PICTIC II Programmed 16f688 chips
That is the correct chip. Stanley - Original Message From: Robert Darlington rdarling...@gmail.com To: Discussion of precise time and frequency measurement time-nuts@febo.com Sent: Sun, July 4, 2010 7:05:36 PM Subject: Re: [time-nuts] PICTIC II Programmed 16f688 chips How many chips are we talking? I'm very happy to buy them, program them, and then send them to you for distribution to end users at cost. Is this the chip we're talking about, in this package? http://search.digikey.com/scripts/DkSearch/dksus.dll?Detailname=PIC16F688-I/P-ND -Bob On Sun, Jul 4, 2010 at 5:55 PM, James Robbins jsrobb...@earthlink.netwrote: Is there anyone here in the US who can offer the 16f688 chips for sale and/or provide programming for the chips? All associated costs would be paid, of course. Many thanks. Jim Robbins N1JR jsrobb...@earthlink.net ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there. ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there. ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
Re: [time-nuts] PICTIC II Programmed 16f688 chips
Google pic programming mac os turns up many links. http://www.mactech.com/articles/mactech/Vol.20/20.02/PICMicrocontroller/index.html http://www.1710.co.uk/cms/pics-on-mac Stanley - Original Message From: Thomas A. Frank ka2...@cox.net To: Discussion of precise time and frequency measurement time-nuts@febo.com Sent: Wed, July 7, 2010 10:56:29 AM Subject: Re: [time-nuts] PICTIC II Programmed 16f688 chips Hi Bob; When I can buy one of those programmers that runs on the MAC OS, please let me know. I would much prefer to offer a fellow enthusiast $20 to provide a programmed chip then get involved with Windows (even if it would open the opportunity for Lady Heather...humm). I get too much exposure to it at work to be willing to bring such suffering home. Sadly, I cannot use my work machines for anything along these lines or this would be easy. I do have a DOS machine...an LX200. Tom Frank, KA2CDK On Jul 5, 2010, at 9:35 AM, Bob Camp wrote: Hi One thing to consider: If you Google PIC Programmer there are a number of hits for sub $20 gizmos that are everything you would ever need as the hardware is concerned. The programming software is a free download off the Microchip site. It runs on any and all Windows operating systems. Programing parts is pretty simple and essentially foolproof. PIC's are pretty common, so you probably will use the programmer again. On a similar note - I would put the PIC on the board in a socket. If there are future software enhancements, the chip will need to be pulled to be re-programmed. Bob On Jul 4, 2010, at 11:36 PM, Thomas A. Frank wrote: I'd like to make the same request. Thanks! Tom Frank, KA2CDK On Jul 4, 2010, at 7:55 PM, James Robbins wrote: Is there anyone here in the US who can offer the 16f688 chips for sale and/or provide programming for the chips? All associated costs would be paid, of course. Many thanks. Jim Robbins N1JR jsrobb...@earthlink.net ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there. ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
Re: [time-nuts] PICTIC II Parts at Mouser
I was thinking of using a 74F175 not as fast uses more power but I have it. Stanley snip 7) The 74AC175 is un-obtanium in a PDIP package the project shows a 74ACT SOIC version, you'll have to kludge it on to the board Logic levels on the clock may impact accuracy (but probably won't). snip ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there. ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
Re: [time-nuts] Loran-C POSAID2 Software
dos program here : http://www.loran.org/gptotd.zip info here : http://www.loran.org/Coordinates.htm Stanley - Original Message From: J. Forster j...@quik.com To: Discussion of precise time and frequency measurement time-nuts@febo.com Sent: Fri, July 9, 2010 5:14:59 PM Subject: Re: [time-nuts] Loran-C POSAID2 Software A definite maybe. In the late 1970s, Raytheon farmed out their small boat LORAN receivers to a New Hampshire company, Appelco. They made 8085 based LORAN receivers w/ LED readout of time differences. Later, Appelco produced an upgraded version with a daughter board, also with an 8085, that took the data from the mother board and converted it to Lat/Long readout. Obviously, that daughter board had the needed SW in its ROM. Mine certainly worked on the bench and gave consistent positions to within about 100 feet. The model number was LC? I'm not certain there were many produced, but it might be worth a look. BTW, Raytheon places a muli-million dollar order w/ Appelco, then pulled the plug on a technicality. Appelco went bust. I got the stuff at their bankrupcy auction. The down side is I cannot put my hands on it any time soon. FWIW, -John The Coast Guard Research and Development Center has developed Coast Guard POSAID2 ver 2.1a, a DOS-based program for converting LORAN-C time differences (TDs) to latitude and longitude. As the old link at the USCG site is apparently broken, I wonder if someone in this novel group still has such an interesting program. Thanks in advance, Antonio CT1TE ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there. ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there. ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
Re: [time-nuts] PICTIC II Parts - SOIC to PDIP Adaptor
The ebay item will fit the .3 inch spacing of the pcb. Looks like the futurlec is .6 inch spacing like many of the other ebay items. Stanley - Original Message From: Joseph Gray jg...@zianet.com To: Discussion of precise time and frequency measurement time-nuts@febo.com Sent: Fri, July 9, 2010 10:44:28 PM Subject: Re: [time-nuts] PICTIC II Parts - SOIC to PDIP Adaptor http://www.futurlec.com/SMD_Adapters.shtml Joe Gray W5JG On Fri, Jul 9, 2010 at 9:06 PM, Tom Clifton kc0...@yahoo.com wrote: Would something like eBay 180460919851 be a suitable adaptor? The description says that it takes .1 header pins on .3 centers 'ready for socket insertion'. I'm sure that there are other places (Sparkfun) that sell similar adaptors for those that have an aversion to on-line auction sites for one reason or another. ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there. ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there. ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
Re: [time-nuts] PICTIC II Parts - SOIC to PDIP Adaptor
From ad : 0.700 accross: Not DIP socket insertable for solderless breadboarding custom pcb only Stanley - Original Message From: Joseph Gray jg...@zianet.com To: Discussion of precise time and frequency measurement time-nuts@febo.com Sent: Fri, July 9, 2010 10:53:25 PM Subject: Re: [time-nuts] PICTIC II Parts - SOIC to PDIP Adaptor Same ebay seller, different layout. http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItemitem=18046092rvr_id=crlp=1_263602_263622UA=%3F*%3F%3FGUID=7c4b40741290a0b3f8f587f5ff797212itemid=18046092ff4=263602_263622 Joe Gray W5JG On Fri, Jul 9, 2010 at 9:06 PM, Tom Clifton kc0...@yahoo.com wrote: Would something like eBay 180460919851 be a suitable adaptor? The description says that it takes .1 header pins on .3 centers 'ready for socket insertion'. I'm sure that there are other places (Sparkfun) that sell similar adaptors for those that have an aversion to on-line auction sites for one reason or another. ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there. ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there. ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
Re: [time-nuts] PICTIC II Parts - SOIC to PDIP Adaptor
No, the ebay item 180460919851 looks correct, data sheet for 74ac175 has the same pin out for all packages. Attached a picture pin 1 to pin 1 no crossed pins. Stanley - Original Message From: Hal Murray hmur...@megapathdsl.net To: Discussion of precise time and frequency measurement time-nuts@febo.com Sent: Fri, July 9, 2010 11:09:18 PM Subject: Re: [time-nuts] PICTIC II Parts - SOIC to PDIP Adaptor stanley_reyno...@yahoo.com said: The ebay item will fit the .3 inch spacing of the pcb. Check the pinout. It's turned sideways. -- These are my opinions, not necessarily my employer's. I hate spam. ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there. attachment: smt18.jpg___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
[time-nuts] PICTIC Backend
A terminal emulator like PuTTY is a good starting point to talk to PICTIC. But I was thinking of a GUI that would appear like a virtual instrument. Buttons instead of the @ commands, display of various settings and data. My language of choice is Basic looking at Just Basic now. Wonder if anyone else is thinking about this ? Stanley ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
Re: [time-nuts] Rubidium oscillator controlled clock
Very Nice, but way too neat, tell me you cleaned up for the pictures. Stanley - Original Message From: ulm...@vaxman.de ulm...@vaxman.de To: TIME-NUTS@febo.com Sent: Sun, July 11, 2010 2:40:01 PM Subject: [time-nuts] Rubidium oscillator controlled clock Dear list members - a couple of weeks ago I found the time-nuts mailing list and had a wonderful time reading through old posts as well as having a look at the web pages of some of its participants. This triggered a long desire of mine to have some kind of a homebrew atomic clock - not necessarily based on a cesium primary standard, but maybe something built around a cheaper rubidium oscillator. Since I was lucky to find an EFRATOM LPRO-101 for a quite reasonable price, I decided to build my own frequency standard and clock around this. I am sure this does not (yet? :-) ) qualify me as a time nut, but maybe you will like my contraption which is described at http://www.vaxman.de/projects/rb_clock/ Best regards - sincerely, Bernd. :-) ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there. ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
Re: [time-nuts] 74AC175PC availability
I found them yesterday, and they show my order shipped today, let you know when I receive it. Stanley - Original Message From: Peter Vince pvi...@theiet.org To: Discussion of precise time and frequency measurement time-nuts@febo.com Sent: Mon, July 12, 2010 2:30:14 PM Subject: [time-nuts] 74AC175PC availability Previous commentators have reported a shortage of this part, but a quick Google brought up Quest Components in Industry, California, who supposedly have over 2000 in stock (http://tinyurl.com/2wxk6lh). I've not tried ordering from them as I'm on the other side of the Atlantic, perhaps a member living a bit closer could try and report any success. Peter ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there. ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
Re: [time-nuts] 74AC175PC availability
A order with BIGeSTOCK.com did not work out last week, I think some of these people don't stock but re-list others stock. In this case they came back with a price 5 times what they said when I ordered. Stanley - Original Message From: Stanley Reynolds stanley_reyno...@yahoo.com To: Discussion of precise time and frequency measurement time-nuts@febo.com Sent: Mon, July 12, 2010 2:54:39 PM Subject: Re: [time-nuts] 74AC175PC availability I found them yesterday, and they show my order shipped today, let you know when I receive it. Stanley - Original Message From: Peter Vince pvi...@theiet.org To: Discussion of precise time and frequency measurement time-nuts@febo.com Sent: Mon, July 12, 2010 2:30:14 PM Subject: [time-nuts] 74AC175PC availability Previous commentators have reported a shortage of this part, but a quick Google brought up Quest Components in Industry, California, who supposedly have over 2000 in stock (http://tinyurl.com/2wxk6lh). I've not tried ordering from them as I'm on the other side of the Atlantic, perhaps a member living a bit closer could try and report any success. Peter ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there. ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there. ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
[time-nuts] 74AC logic differences between manufactures
Learning about the differences between families now know why a 74F is not a substitute for 74AC. But remembering something I read in Brooks Shera, W5OJM GPSDO notes Take care about which 4046 chips you use for U1 and U3. The Phillips 74HCT4046 chips (formerly sold by Radio Shack) are fine. So are CD74HC4046 chips made by Harris or T.I. Do not use chips made by Fairchild and do not use CD4046 chips; both have a different design and will not work in this circuit. Does anyone know about any differences in Fairchild and National Semiconductor 74AC175PC ? Stanley ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
Re: [time-nuts] PIC-TIC boards
Claude, No problem you are on the list, the 74AC175PC is correct chip, not 74ACT175PC. Stanley - Original Message From: Claude Houde va2...@aei.ca To: time-nuts@febo.com Sent: Tue, July 13, 2010 8:15:25 PM Subject: [time-nuts] PIC-TIC boards Hello ! I know I'm a bit late, but is it still possible to order three boards, and have shipped to Canada ? I can program my own PIC's and have access to 74ACT175. Also, I would be willing to program chips for other Time Nuts if it can help someone. Thanks ! Claude ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there. ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
Re: [time-nuts] Did my Tbolt die ?
Adam, Cold solder joints on the connector or chip would be my first guess after the power supply was checked. Stanley - Original Message From: Adam Feigin a...@iis.ee.ethz.ch To: time-nuts@febo.com Sent: Sun, July 18, 2010 3:53:36 AM Subject: Re: [time-nuts] Did my Tbolt die ? Well, I wish it were all that simple. I was originally running the Tbolt with tboltd under Linux to provide data to one of my ntp servers, on a real(tm) serial port. Sometime after a reboot (or maybe during ??) it just stopped working, at least the serial portion. I've tried a bunch of different machines, including attaching the thing to a Moxa Serial device server, and i dont get anything out at all. I've let it sit overnight, power cycling, tried different machines, (VirtualBox, Wine with USB serial and direct serial) all to no avail. It simply gives no output at all. Oh well, I suppose it was good while it lasted. I'm off over to the pond for holiday, so maybe I'll get lucky and it will get happy after I get back, otherwise I'll have to rip it apart and attempt to figure out whats wrong -- probably just the serial chip blown somehow. Date: Sat, 17 Jul 2010 08:40:23 -0400 From: Stan, W1LE stanw...@verizon.net Subject: Re: [time-nuts] Did my Tbolt die ? Hello Adam, I suspect that: Upon rebooting, the OS came up and did not recognize the (serial) COM port assignment you had used before. Check the COM port assignments in the control panel, and adjust accordingly, to match the actual COM port you are using Looks like the TB is good, I suspect the PC end. Stan, W1LE ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there. ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
Re: [time-nuts] surface mount (was PICTIC II Parts from Mouser)
Bob, Thank you for the video Now all we need is a robot and software to filter the jitter from my hands. Maybe a little less expensive than the da Vinci robot. http://www.davincisurgery.com/ Stanley - Original Message From: Bob Bownes bow...@gmail.com To: Discussion of precise time and frequency measurement time-nuts@febo.com Sent: Mon, July 19, 2010 11:09:50 PM Subject: Re: [time-nuts] surface mount (was PICTIC II Parts from Mouser) A few short videos shot with the camera/usb video capture setup I mentioned earlier: http://www.fastbobs.com/bob/radio/video1.mpg Video 1 - Black White inspection of a prototype power sensor. Low magnification http://www.fastbobs.com/bob/radio/video2.mpg Video 2 - Colour inspection of same sensor. Same magnification. About 2-3x http://www.fastbobs.com/bob/radio/video3.mpg Video 3 - Longer version of #2. Note lighting changes in 2nd half. http://www.fastbobs.com/bob/radio/video4.mpg Video 4 - Short, color, higher magnification http://www.fastbobs.com/bob/radio/video5.mpg Video 5 - Longest, highest magnification. Same probe as earlier shots. Note lighting changes as the light source is moved around showing shadows. On Mon, Jul 19, 2010 at 9:22 PM, Robert J Marinelli b...@stanford.edu wrote: Hi Richard, Yes, used to feel that way - until acquiring a surplus dissecting (stereo) microscope, now I actually *prefer* surface mount. Much easier to move parts around, it's easy to apply paste solder entire boards in a $50 toaster oven, and access to all the latest parts. Hard to believe, but really is easier once you can clearly see. For some nice tuturials, see the sparkfun website, also the schmartboard website. Also, when I lay out surface mount boards, they tend to be smaller overall, and so a bit lower cost. Please do try with a low cost stereo microscope - it changes everything :) -Bob p.s. Finger size is no issue - tweezers work nicely. Oh and surface mount resistors caps are unbelievably low cost in cut tape, and super easy to handle that way. Much better than loose parts IMO. On Jul 19, 2010, at 4:59 PM, Richard H McCorkle wrote: The TS272CN is an acceptable substitute for the TS272ACN in the PICTIC II but as noted has a higher input offset voltage. This can be compensated for in the second stage by adjustment of the offset trimmer. I selected premium parts for temperature stability in the application. Sorry the manufacturers are making human compatible devices obsolete and only carrying over surface mount devices as they go Pb free for the EU market. Makes it difficult to keep up with what's available and harder for amateurs with fat fingers and poor eyesight like myself to build simple projects! Richard Here we go again! The TS272ACN has just gone 'non-stocked' at Mouser. Will the TS272CN degrade the performance? It looks like the difference between the two is the TS272CN has a higher input offset voltage. Ed ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there. ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there. ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there. ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there. ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
[time-nuts] Pictic II boards are here !
Paypal to stanley_reyno...@yahoo.com . Yes I still have extra boards. Stanley ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
Re: [time-nuts] Pictic II boards are here !
Picture of board here: www.n4iqt.com/stanley_reynolds/picticii/Picticboard001.JPG - Original Message From: Stanley Reynolds stanley_reyno...@yahoo.com To: time-nuts@febo.com Sent: Tue, July 20, 2010 5:08:22 PM Subject: [time-nuts] Pictic II boards are here ! Paypal to stanley_reyno...@yahoo.com . Yes I still have extra boards. Stanley ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there. ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
Re: [time-nuts] Pictic II boards are here !
Corrected link to picture: www.n4iqt.com/picticii/Picticboard001.JPG - Original Message From: Stanley Reynolds stanley_reyno...@yahoo.com To: Discussion of precise time and frequency measurement time-nuts@febo.com Sent: Tue, July 20, 2010 5:26:44 PM Subject: Re: [time-nuts] Pictic II boards are here ! Picture of board here: www.n4iqt.com/stanley_reynolds/picticii/Picticboard001.JPG - Original Message From: Stanley Reynolds stanley_reyno...@yahoo.com To: time-nuts@febo.com Sent: Tue, July 20, 2010 5:08:22 PM Subject: [time-nuts] Pictic II boards are here ! Paypal to stanley_reyno...@yahoo.com . Yes I still have extra boards. Stanley ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there. ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there. ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
Re: [time-nuts] Pictic II boards are here !
Peter, Thank you for offering to help, don't send paypal yet, I will send you the boards then after we know your postal expense then we can do the paypal thing. Stanley - Original Message From: Peter Vince pvi...@theiet.org To: Discussion of precise time and frequency measurement time-nuts@febo.com Sent: Wed, July 21, 2010 3:39:54 AM Subject: Re: [time-nuts] Pictic II boards are here ! Morning Stanley, Good news! As I mentioned before, I am happy to act as a UK Post Office if youl'd like to send all the UK-bound boards to me. I am collaborating with Ian Muir in Wales (Time Nut member Gonzo) on this project, so between us we would like five boards please. If you can let me know the final cost, including postage over the big pond, I'll get PayPal to do their thing. Can you please tell me what size the boards are, then I can get some appropriate padded bags for onward despatch. TTFN, Peter Vince (England) On 20 July 2010 23:08, Stanley Reynolds stanley_reyno...@yahoo.com wrote: Paypal to stanley_reyno...@yahoo.com . Yes I still have extra boards. Stanley ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there. ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
[time-nuts] Please send your paypal for PicTic II PCBs
Just tried to invoice the ones not paid yet but paypal doesn't allow enough time for me to complete the invoice and thinks it is OK to dump my work up to that point, note to self sell ebay stock short and use money to hire someone to do paperwork. The people in the EU / UK I wanted to ship at the same time to save on shipping but not delay the ones who have paid. No hurry for other locations as they can be shipped one at a time. Stanley ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
Re: [time-nuts] Basic question regarding comparing two frequencies
My attempt to understand your diagram, not sure about how the quadrature hybrid is connected. Stanley - Original Message From: J. Forster j...@quik.com To: Discussion of precise time and frequency measurement time-nuts@febo.com Sent: Sun, July 25, 2010 10:29:23 AM Subject: Re: [time-nuts] Basic question regarding comparing two frequencies There is a cute way to use a scope. It requires a power splittere, a quadrature hybrid, and two mixers (all appropriate for the frequencies you are comparing), and an X-Y scope. Mini-Circuits sells appropriate parts. The stuff is hooked up like this: X Axis S | H P MIX Y REF 1--L B -- REF2 I MIX R T | I Y Axis D The 'scope display will be roughly a circle if the frequencies are a bit different and the spot will go around CW or CCW depending on which Ref is higher. -John snipattachment: Jfoster.jpg___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
Re: [time-nuts] Basic question regarding comparing two frequencies
Corrected Drawing.attachment: Jfoster.jpg___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
[time-nuts] Minor correction in Pictic II parts list
R25 a 10 K resistor only used with the TTL computer interface option, not used with the RS232 chip, is listed twice as 1% or 5% either will work but you don't need both. Stanley ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
[time-nuts] Pictic assembled pictures
Here: www.n4iqt.com/picticii/assembled I think it would be possible to use the side adjust square trimmers but not the rectangular ones as they are too big and the holes would be too far apart to mount them close to the board. The top adjust would be the first choice because they would be easier adjust especially if board is mounted in a case. Stanley ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
Re: [time-nuts] Updated Shera controller
Full circle back to the software, the number of units sold, the cost per hour and time to complete project would determine the software cost. Would not surprise me if the software would be the biggest expense till you break the 1000 unit mark unless the cost per hour was very low. As a hardware guy at heart it is hard for me to assign a cost/value to software ;-) Stanley - Original Message From: ewkeh...@aol.com ewkeh...@aol.com To: time-nuts@febo.com Sent: Wed, July 28, 2010 4:08:25 PM Subject: Re: [time-nuts] Updated Shera controller One more comment $ 40 would cover every thing including PC board, May go up to 50 depending what D/A you use. Bert In a message dated 7/28/2010 4:47:46 P.M. Eastern Daylight Time, p...@phk.freebsd.dk writes: In message 4c5092fa.2030...@xtra.co.nz, Bruce Griffiths writes: Instead of copying the Shera controller albeit with higher resolution its probably more cost effective to choose a microprocessor with built in time stamping capability. Uhm, isn't this exactly where you want to use the still-smelling-like-brand-new-car PICTIC II with a good DAC and a microcontroller ? -- Poul-Henning Kamp | UNIX since Zilog Zeus 3.20 p...@freebsd.org | TCP/IP since RFC 956 FreeBSD committer | BSD since 4.3-tahoe Never attribute to malice what can adequately be explained by incompetence. ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there. ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there. ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
Re: [time-nuts] Updated Shera controller
- Original Message From: Hal Murray hmur...@megapathdsl.net To: Discussion of precise time and frequency measurement time-nuts@febo.com Sent: Thu, July 29, 2010 12:48:55 AM Subject: Re: [time-nuts] Updated Shera controller stanley_reyno...@yahoo.com said: Full circle back to the software, the number of units sold, the cost per hour and time to complete project would determine the software cost. Would not surprise me if the software would be the biggest expense till you break the 1000 unit mark unless the cost per hour was very low. As a hardware guy at heart it is hard for me to assign a cost/value to software ;-) That line of thinking is probably appropriate for a commercial project. For a hobby/volunteer project, software can be free. Consider Lady Heather as an example. In this context, there are two types of software. There is the software you run on the board you build. There is also the software you use to develop the software you run. I'm assuming a volunteer would write the software just like volunteers have designed boards. snip Some with well stocked junk boxes could argue the hardware was below market cost as well. But my point was the software was much more of a factor than the hardware if we assign value to each part. Yes Lady Heather is free to many but not all, the author and others would be rich if paid a fair price for their work. Thank you time-nuts for your time. Stanley ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
Re: [time-nuts] Please send your paypal for PicTic II PCBs
My paypal account is stanley_reyno...@yahoo.com boards are 9.50 usd each which includes shipping Stanley - Original Message From: bell@comcast.net bell@comcast.net To: Discussion of precise time and frequency measurement time-nuts@febo.com Sent: Thu, July 29, 2010 12:24:39 PM Subject: Re: [time-nuts] Please send your paypal for PicTic II PCBs Hi Stan, Please tell me how to pay you through Paypal. What is your Paypal account name? As soon as I get it I would be happy to pay you. Sincere thanks, David - Original Message - From: Henk h...@deriesp.demon.nl To: Discussion of precise time and frequency measurement time-nuts@febo.com Sent: Thursday, July 29, 2010 8:11:46 AM Subject: Re: [time-nuts] Please send your paypal for PicTic II PCBs Op 22 jul 2010, om 16:37 heeft Stanley Reynolds het volgende geschreven: Just tried to invoice the ones not paid yet but paypal doesn't allow enough time for me to complete the invoice and thinks it is OK to dump my work up to that point, note to self sell ebay stock short and use money to hire someone to do paperwork. The people in the EU / UK I wanted to ship at the same time to save on shipping but not delay the ones who have paid. No hurry for other locations as they can be shipped one at a time. Stanley ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there. ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there. ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there. ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
Re: [time-nuts] 74AC175PC
I have had good luck with Quest they are showing stock. www.questcomp.com They do have a $25 min. Stanley - Original Message From: Bob Camp li...@rtty.us To: Discussion of precise time and frequency measurement time-nuts@febo.com Sent: Sun, August 1, 2010 4:20:44 PM Subject: Re: [time-nuts] 74AC175PC Hi At least at this point the surplus dealer has been checked out by others buying the parts from him. You might find there's enough interest to make another buy worthwhile. Bob On Aug 1, 2010, at 4:59 PM, Heathkid wrote: Hello. Does anyone have any of these left? I've checked with a couple of the guys that did a group buy but they are out of them. I'd prefer not to do SMT and don't really want to buy 50+ from an unknown surplus seller. I need six (6) - or at least one or whatever someone has to get me started. Thanks! 73 Brice KA8MAV ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there. ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there. ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
Re: [time-nuts] 74AC175PC
Yes, I can but it will be toward the end of the week before I can ship them as they are in a different location. I'm still shipping boards as they are with me. If anyone wants the chips please email me off list or paypal me at stanley_reyno...@yahoo.com . I also have all the other parts but will keep shipping boards as my first priority. I have some 10Mhz 20PPM osc and a 80Mhz 100PPM osc. The 80Mhz I think they would be good for calibration of interlopers but not measuring. I can program the Pic chips and test them in my board. Do not expect parts orders to be filled fast till I see what demand is like. I would like to remind everyone that this design was a free gift to time nuts by Richard McCorkle. My only connection is to provide the boards at low cost, some emails to me indicate some confusion that I'm more connected than I am. Others on the list have provided help with the boards and advice to me on my projects so I will try to help all complete this project. Stanley From: Heathkid heath...@heathkid.com To: Discussion of precise time and frequency measurement time-nuts@febo.com Sent: Mon, August 2, 2010 1:03:19 AM Subject: Re: [time-nuts] 74AC175PC Stanley, Would you be willing to do another group buy? I'll send you enough $ for 10 of them via PayPal before you buy and I know others are already willing to buy more. I just can't logistically do a group buy myself right now but would be willing to help pay for your time and efforts. I know what they are in quantities of 50. I'll pay $2 each. That should make it worth while... with fees, etc... I'll send you $25 for 10 of them. Will you do this? 73 Brice KA8MAV - Original Message - From: Stanley Reynolds stanley_reyno...@yahoo.com To: Discussion of precise time and frequency measurement time-nuts@febo.com Sent: Sunday, August 01, 2010 8:13 PM Subject: Re: [time-nuts] 74AC175PC I have had good luck with Quest they are showing stock. www.questcomp.com They do have a $25 min. Stanley - Original Message From: Bob Camp li...@rtty.us To: Discussion of precise time and frequency measurement time-nuts@febo.com Sent: Sun, August 1, 2010 4:20:44 PM Subject: Re: [time-nuts] 74AC175PC Hi At least at this point the surplus dealer has been checked out by others buying the parts from him. You might find there's enough interest to make another buy worthwhile. Bob On Aug 1, 2010, at 4:59 PM, Heathkid wrote: Hello. Does anyone have any of these left? I've checked with a couple of the guys that did a group buy but they are out of them. I'd prefer not to do SMT and don't really want to buy 50+ from an unknown surplus seller. I need six (6) - or at least one or whatever someone has to get me started. Thanks! 73 Brice KA8MAV ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there. ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there. ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there. ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there. ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
[time-nuts] Remove Pictic boards from envelopes
Please remove Pictic boards from envelopes when you receive them. Received a report that the tinning on the bottom of the board was discolored perhaps due to some contamination in the envelope. Will wrap boards in plastic wrap in the future. Stanley Let me see first it was : Melamine in pet food Bad dry wall making people sick Now Bad envelopes ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
Re: [time-nuts] Remove Pictic boards from envelopes
The boards were PB free so the finish is a flat silver . My thinking is the envelopes are acidic and any moisture would cause a reaction. The boards were shipped to me vacuum sealed in plastic 25 boards per pack. They were not brown or discolored when I put them in the envelopes so what ever caused them to discolor happened while they were in transit. Stanley From: gandal...@aol.com gandal...@aol.com To: time-nuts@febo.com Sent: Fri, August 6, 2010 10:23:02 AM Subject: Re: [time-nuts] Remove Pictic boards from envelopes In a message dated 06/08/2010 16:15:40 GMT Daylight Time, ed_pal...@sasktel.net writes: You mean they are tinned? I received my two boards a couple of days ago. I thought that they missed the tinning solution. There's just an occasional splash of bright tin here and there, particularly on the back. The rest looks like oxidized copper. I haven't tried to solder them yet. Hope the rosin cuts through it. - That's what I first thought when mine arrived but found that rubbing with a soft pencil eraser removed the discolouration to leave them looking tinned again. I did notice that some of the non discoloured tinning had a matt finish rather than shiny as expected so not sure if this was envelope contamination or a processing issue. After buffing with the eraser I washed the boards in warm soapy water just to be sure and they continue to look ok. regards Nigel GM8PZR ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there. ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
Re: [time-nuts] Remove Pictic boards from envelopes
From: Alan Melia alan.me...@btinternet.com To: Discussion of precise time and frequency measurement time-nuts@febo.com Sent: Tue, August 10, 2010 6:01:59 AM Subject: Re: [time-nuts] Remove Pictic boards from envelopes Could there maybe be a thin flux coating over the pads which is cause the disquiet? Alan G3NYK snip The boards had a uniform silver finish except for the green solder mask. I'm sure I would have noticed any brown tint while packing them. The brown tint must have occured in shipment. Sorry the choice of packing was my mistake and will be glad to make good anyone who needs replacment please email me off list. Stanley Stanley snip ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
Re: [time-nuts] No Comment
Stanley time would have 10 seconds per minute, 10 minutes per hour, 10 hours per day ... No need for leap seconds if we remove all connections to celestial movements. To avoid any politics's in picking a starting point now would be zero and the past measured as negative time. From: Steve Rooke sar10...@gmail.com To: Discussion of precise time and frequency measurement time-nuts@febo.com Sent: Tue, August 10, 2010 8:25:37 PM Subject: Re: [time-nuts] No Comment No boss, I'm not late, I was going by Mecca Time :) Steve On 11/08/2010, Tom Holmes thol...@woh.rr.com wrote: Don... Some days, so do I :-). Tom N8ZM -Original Message- From: time-nuts-boun...@febo.com [mailto:time-nuts-boun...@febo.com] On Behalf Of Don Latham Sent: Tuesday, August 10, 2010 5:49 PM To: Discussion of precise time and frequency measurement Subject: Re: [time-nuts] No Comment Thing is, Islamic time stops 5 times a day... Don Tom Holmes The reality of this, hoping not to deteriorate the discussion into politics, is that outside of the scientific community, the greater mass of the population might be easily swayed to go along with the idea of moving to a different time standard. After all, most of the planet's populace has no clue about the need for standard time, or its history, and is likely to see the change as 'good'. And those who follow Islam will certainly not object, and they are a significant force on this planet. You have all seen instances where voters have defied logic and good sense to 'fix' a problem they could not be bothered to truly understand, so just voted on gut or heart or whatever their favorite talking head told them. So laugh or be skeptical, but be aware that there is enough power to make such a thing happen if properly sold. On the other hand, does it really matter? We have put up with the farce that is Daylight Saving Time for years. Tom, N8ZM -Original Message- From: time-nuts-boun...@febo.com [mailto:time-nuts-boun...@febo.com] On Behalf Of J. Forster Sent: Tuesday, August 10, 2010 4:42 PM To: Discussion of precise time and frequency measurement Subject: [time-nuts] No Comment http://www.google.com/hostednews/afp/article/ALeqM5hghTFlnZ0yYigLDaCnQT8 xowHaJA -John == ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there. ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there. -- Neither the voice of authority nor the weight of reason and argument are as significant as experiment, for thence comes quiet to the mind. R. Bacon Dr. Don Latham AJ7LL Six Mile Systems LLP 17850 Six Mile Road POB 134 Huson, MT, 59846 VOX 406-626-4304 www.lightningforensics.com www.sixmilesystems.com ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there. ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there. -- Steve Rooke - ZL3TUV G8KVD The only reason for time is so that everything doesn't happen at once. - Einstein ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there. ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
Re: [time-nuts] What's the latest correct PICTIC II Mouser project?- Heathkid
From: Bob Camp li...@rtty.us To: Discussion of precise time and frequency measurement time-nuts@febo.com Sent: Sat, August 14, 2010 7:05:35 AM Subject: Re: [time-nuts] What's the latest correct PICTIC II Mouser project?- Heathkid Hi This isn't my design originally. The 620 ohm resistor in question sources current into a diode stack. The initial current will vary more from the tolerance of the diodes than it will from the 1 ohm change ( or 6 ohm = 1%). snip Maybe we should buy lots of diodes to match them, they are relative cheap, also use extra care installing them. Using hemostats as heat sinks and just enough heat for a good connection do not want to damage/change them after the match. Stanley ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
Re: [time-nuts] What's the latest correct PICTIC II Mouserproject?- Heathkid
1) I have no previous experience building precision anything, I'm not an expert. 2) My guess is the design expects quality components and depends on the auto calibration to correct any component drift. Short term stability between calibrations is what we want. The absolute value of C16 and C17 is not as important as it's stability in leakage and value. Guess we could put the didoes in a constant temp oven but not sure all the components are more stable at higher temps. Good ideas about didoes here : http://www.sciencebuddies.org/science-fair-projects/project_ideas/Elec_p033.shtml (note Figure 3 and how the didoes voltage drop is more linear at higher temps vs room temp.) Figure 3. Stanley From: Heathkid heath...@heathkid.com To: Discussion of precise time and frequency measurement time-nuts@febo.com Sent: Sat, August 14, 2010 10:43:15 AM Subject: Re: [time-nuts] What's the latest correct PICTIC II Mouserproject?- Heathkid Okay Stanley... I've got a Tektronix 370A curve tracer at work. So the diodes need to be matched? No problem. So I match the diodes and the resistors to within 0.001%. Are there any other components that need matched? Also, you mentioned using hemostats as heatsinks on the diodes while installing them. I know that diodes make very good temperature sensors as well. Are there any suggestions on keeping them stable after they are on the board? What is the recommended operating temperature of the PICTIC II? Thanks. 73 Brice KA8MAV - Original Message - From: Stanley Reynolds stanley_reyno...@yahoo.com To: Discussion of precise time and frequency measurement time-nuts@febo.com Sent: Saturday, August 14, 2010 10:43 AM Subject: Re: [time-nuts] What's the latest correct PICTIC II Mouserproject?- Heathkid snip Maybe we should buy lots of diodes to match them, they are relative cheap, also use extra care installing them. Using hemostats as heat sinks and just enough heat for a good connection do not want to damage/change them after the match. Stanley ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there. attachment: Capture.JPG___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
[time-nuts] Fw: What's the latest correct PICTIC II Mouserproject?- Heathkid
Duplicate message without in-line picture. - Forwarded Message From: Stanley Reynolds stanley_reyno...@yahoo.com To: Discussion of precise time and frequency measurement time-nuts@febo.com Sent: Sat, August 14, 2010 11:41:36 AM Subject: Re: [time-nuts] What's the latest correct PICTIC II Mouserproject?- Heathkid 1) I have no previous experience building precision anything, I'm not an expert. 2) My guess is the design expects quality components and depends on the auto calibration to correct any component drift. Short term stability between calibrations is what we want. The absolute value of C16 and C17 is not as important as it's stability in leakage and value. Guess we could put the didoes in a constant temp oven but not sure all the components are more stable at higher temps. Good ideas about didoes here : http://www.sciencebuddies.org/science-fair-projects/project_ideas/Elec_p033.shtml (note Figure 3 and how the didoes voltage drop is more linear at higher temps vs room temp.) Stanley From: Heathkid heath...@heathkid.com To: Discussion of precise time and frequency measurement time-nuts@febo.com Sent: Sat, August 14, 2010 10:43:15 AM Subject: Re: [time-nuts] What's the latest correct PICTIC II Mouserproject?- Heathkid Okay Stanley... I've got a Tektronix 370A curve tracer at work. So the diodes need to be matched? No problem. So I match the diodes and the resistors to within 0.001%. Are there any other components that need matched? Also, you mentioned using hemostats as heatsinks on the diodes while installing them. I know that diodes make very good temperature sensors as well. Are there any suggestions on keeping them stable after they are on the board? What is the recommended operating temperature of the PICTIC II? Thanks. 73 Brice KA8MAV - Original Message - From: Stanley Reynolds stanley_reyno...@yahoo.com To: Discussion of precise time and frequency measurement time-nuts@febo.com Sent: Saturday, August 14, 2010 10:43 AM Subject: Re: [time-nuts] What's the latest correct PICTIC II Mouserproject?- Heathkid snip Maybe we should buy lots of diodes to match them, they are relative cheap, also use extra care installing them. Using hemostats as heat sinks and just enough heat for a good connection do not want to damage/change them after the match. Stanley ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there. attachment: Capture.JPG___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
[time-nuts] lost posts
My last two posts made it to the Archives at febo.com and I guess other members mail boxes, but not my in box or spam folder. Just wonder why as this doesn't seem to happen with time-nuts posts by others ? Is this a yahoo mail problem ? Stanley ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
