Re: [time-nuts] FSA3011 Frequency Stability Analyzer
Hello TOM,, I have one underway via Aliexpress. In a research project at a university ,a side line is stability of some sources. Apart from more classical measurements, the setup of the FSA3011 and measurements of several sources can be done by one ore more students as project work. This however means that work will be progressing at student rate.. That only SMALL changes/enhancements can be made. No redesign/no writing new soft. However simple things are possible. Keeping in mind the student will be new to these subjects and the main aim is NOT designing a new FSA3011. At first instance we will be happy with a good (stable) running set up and understanding the pros and cons of the FSA3011 with respect to the more usual set ups. Jan ON4MMW -Original Message- From: time-nuts On Behalf Of Tom Van Baak Sent: 02 August 2019 02:01 To: time-nuts@lists.febo.com Subject: Re: [time-nuts] FSA3011 Frequency Stability Analyzer If anyone else has a FSA3011 please contact me, off-list. It seems to function on split-signal noise floor tests, but has real trouble with tracking and comparing actual oscillators. More details soon, but in case it's just my unit, I'd like to talk with anyone else who's got one. Only a few seem to have been sold; I'm hoping one or two of them were to time nuts reading this. Thanks, /tvb On 7/26/2019 12:02 PM, Tom Van Baak wrote: > Yes, I'm evaluating a FSA3011 at the moment. It's a cute little unit. > > Documentation is sparse, the jpg plots are fuzzy, "customer" support > is nil, but it works. My initial tests show it's ~4x worse than the > data sheet claims but it turns out the unit is quite dependent on the > rise time and power of the input signals so YMMV. > ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@lists.febo.com To unsubscribe, go to http://lists.febo.com/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts_lists.febo.com and follow the instructions there. ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@lists.febo.com To unsubscribe, go to http://lists.febo.com/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts_lists.febo.com and follow the instructions there.
Re: [time-nuts] FSA3011 Frequency Stability Analyzer
If anyone else has a FSA3011 please contact me, off-list. It seems to function on split-signal noise floor tests, but has real trouble with tracking and comparing actual oscillators. More details soon, but in case it's just my unit, I'd like to talk with anyone else who's got one. Only a few seem to have been sold; I'm hoping one or two of them were to time nuts reading this. Thanks, /tvb On 7/26/2019 12:02 PM, Tom Van Baak wrote: Yes, I'm evaluating a FSA3011 at the moment. It's a cute little unit. > Documentation is sparse, the jpg plots are fuzzy, "customer" support > is nil, but it works. My initial tests show it's ~4x worse than the > data sheet claims but it turns out the unit is quite dependent on the > rise time and power of the input signals so YMMV. > ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@lists.febo.com To unsubscribe, go to http://lists.febo.com/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts_lists.febo.com and follow the instructions there.
Re: [time-nuts] FSA3011 Frequency Stability Analyzer, HP 8405A or TAPR TIC
Hi, If you sample continously and decimate the data properly you avoid the dead-time issues and get results which is translates well into ADEV measures. Cheers, Magnus On 2019-07-30 14:30, Bob kb8tq wrote: > Hi > > The 8405 is a fine device and with working probes can be very useful to have > around. Without the > probes .. not so much. Since they have been around since the 1960’s, the > probes may have seen > quite a bit of wear and tear. > > For comparing standards, an RPD-1 and a DVM will kind of / sort of do the > same thing. A pair > of RPD-1’s and a quadrature hybrid into a pair of DVM’s (or ADC’s) will very > much do the same thing. > > Bob > >> On Jul 30, 2019, at 2:04 AM, Perry Sandeen via time-nuts >> wrote: >> >> Yo Bubba Dudes!, >> I've been following the discussion of the FSA3011 with great interest. >> Now I'm not in the upper levels of TN esoteric knowledge or have a burning >> desire to ever get there. After seeing some small reference somewhere I >> looked at the HP 8405A on ebay and the price range seemed comparable to the >> FSA3011. Now the HP 8405 is a huge beast but i was thinking that it might be >> easier for me to use. I'm interested in just 5 and 10 MHz oscillator >> comparison. I know nothing about computer programs or writing any code. >> I also looked at the TAPR TIC. >> So my conclusion are: >> The FSA3011 may be technically the best BUT it seems to be having some >> teething problems and I don't really know about what programs it runs or >> needs. >> The HP 8405A is a big beast, but it maybe simpler for me to run and get the >> results I want which is stopping around 10 to ^12th. But I may have to watch >> it for a long time. >> The TAPR TIC is small (needed) cheaper (also a plus) and seems to run >> available software. but needs a dedicated laptop, which is not a real >> problem. I also have several extra HP 18011's available. >> >> Your opinions are gratefully solicited, >> Regards, >> Perrier >> >> Perrier >> >> If I can just download programs AFAIK I could use the TAPR TIC as I have a >> spare laptop that I could dedicate for its use. The two advantaages >> ___ >> time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@lists.febo.com >> To unsubscribe, go to >> http://lists.febo.com/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts_lists.febo.com >> and follow the instructions there. > > ___ > time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@lists.febo.com > To unsubscribe, go to > http://lists.febo.com/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts_lists.febo.com > and follow the instructions there. ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@lists.febo.com To unsubscribe, go to http://lists.febo.com/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts_lists.febo.com and follow the instructions there.
Re: [time-nuts] FSA3011 Frequency Stability Analyzer, HP 8405A or TAPR TIC
I have an 8405, fortunately in excellent condition, along with the BNC adapters, the resistive splitter and the 50-ohm line samplers. The probe tips are very delicate and are probably unobtainium these days. The electronics in the probes can be repaired. I've been careful with mine and had no failures, but I did repair another one many years ago. (See: http://www.peakbagging.com/Electronic/HP8405A%20repair.pdf) One can digitize the analog outputs which I did for some test or another about 40 years ago. Wes N7WS On 7/30/2019 5:30 AM, Bob kb8tq wrote: Hi The 8405 is a fine device and with working probes can be very useful to have around. Without the probes .. not so much. Since they have been around since the 1960’s, the probes may have seen quite a bit of wear and tear. For comparing standards, an RPD-1 and a DVM will kind of / sort of do the same thing. A pair of RPD-1’s and a quadrature hybrid into a pair of DVM’s (or ADC’s) will very much do the same thing. Bob On Jul 30, 2019, at 2:04 AM, Perry Sandeen via time-nuts wrote: Yo Bubba Dudes!, I've been following the discussion of the FSA3011 with great interest. Now I'm not in the upper levels of TN esoteric knowledge or have a burning desire to ever get there. After seeing some small reference somewhere I looked at the HP 8405A on ebay and the price range seemed comparable to the FSA3011. Now the HP 8405 is a huge beast but i was thinking that it might be easier for me to use. I'm interested in just 5 and 10 MHz oscillator comparison. I know nothing about computer programs or writing any code. I also looked at the TAPR TIC. So my conclusion are: The FSA3011 may be technically the best BUT it seems to be having some teething problems and I don't really know about what programs it runs or needs. The HP 8405A is a big beast, but it maybe simpler for me to run and get the results I want which is stopping around 10 to ^12th. But I may have to watch it for a long time. The TAPR TIC is small (needed) cheaper (also a plus) and seems to run available software. but needs a dedicated laptop, which is not a real problem. I also have several extra HP 18011's available. Your opinions are gratefully solicited, Regards, Perrier Perrier If I can just download programs AFAIK I could use the TAPR TIC as I have a spare laptop that I could dedicate for its use. The two advantaages ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@lists.febo.com To unsubscribe, go to http://lists.febo.com/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts_lists.febo.com and follow the instructions there. ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@lists.febo.com To unsubscribe, go to http://lists.febo.com/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts_lists.febo.com and follow the instructions there. ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@lists.febo.com To unsubscribe, go to http://lists.febo.com/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts_lists.febo.com and follow the instructions there.
Re: [time-nuts] FSA3011 Frequency Stability Analyzer, HP 8405A or TAPR TIC
Hi The 8405 is a fine device and with working probes can be very useful to have around. Without the probes .. not so much. Since they have been around since the 1960’s, the probes may have seen quite a bit of wear and tear. For comparing standards, an RPD-1 and a DVM will kind of / sort of do the same thing. A pair of RPD-1’s and a quadrature hybrid into a pair of DVM’s (or ADC’s) will very much do the same thing. Bob > On Jul 30, 2019, at 2:04 AM, Perry Sandeen via time-nuts > wrote: > > Yo Bubba Dudes!, > I've been following the discussion of the FSA3011 with great interest. > Now I'm not in the upper levels of TN esoteric knowledge or have a burning > desire to ever get there. After seeing some small reference somewhere I > looked at the HP 8405A on ebay and the price range seemed comparable to the > FSA3011. Now the HP 8405 is a huge beast but i was thinking that it might be > easier for me to use. I'm interested in just 5 and 10 MHz oscillator > comparison. I know nothing about computer programs or writing any code. > I also looked at the TAPR TIC. > So my conclusion are: > The FSA3011 may be technically the best BUT it seems to be having some > teething problems and I don't really know about what programs it runs or > needs. > The HP 8405A is a big beast, but it maybe simpler for me to run and get the > results I want which is stopping around 10 to ^12th. But I may have to watch > it for a long time. > The TAPR TIC is small (needed) cheaper (also a plus) and seems to run > available software. but needs a dedicated laptop, which is not a real > problem. I also have several extra HP 18011's available. > > Your opinions are gratefully solicited, > Regards, > Perrier > > Perrier > > If I can just download programs AFAIK I could use the TAPR TIC as I have a > spare laptop that I could dedicate for its use. The two advantaages > ___ > time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@lists.febo.com > To unsubscribe, go to > http://lists.febo.com/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts_lists.febo.com > and follow the instructions there. ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@lists.febo.com To unsubscribe, go to http://lists.febo.com/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts_lists.febo.com and follow the instructions there.
Re: [time-nuts] FSA3011 Frequency Stability Analyzer, HP 8405A or TAPR TIC
Hi Perrier, The HP8405A is an analog vector analyzer that allows you to make phase measurements like the oscilloscope with Lissajous shapes. This method is the simplest one but allows quite approximate measurements and does not give you a complete view of stability (Allan Deviation). The TICC and the FSA3011 are more advanced systems that both require a laptop and a TIMELAB sw (free) but give you a complete view of the stability parameters both in the short and long term. To use TICC you need an additional 10/5 MHz to 1PPS divider like the TADD-2, mini PPS divider. https://tapr.org/kits_t2-mini.html The TICC is in the order of 205 $ the FSA3011 is around 470 $. The performance difference seem to be the Test Set noise floor. The FSA3011 seem to be ten time better but I am not sure, for this reason I am asking more info about this new unit. Luciano www.timeok.it Da "time-nuts" time-nuts-boun...@lists.febo.com A time-nuts@lists.febo.com Cc "Perry Sandeen" sandee...@yahoo.com Data Tue, 30 Jul 2019 06:04:34 +0000 (UTC) Oggetto [time-nuts] FSA3011 Frequency Stability Analyzer, HP 8405A or TAPR TIC Yo Bubba Dudes!, I've been following the discussion of the FSA3011 with great interest. Now I'm not in the upper levels of TN esoteric knowledge or have a burning desire to ever get there. After seeing some small reference somewhere I looked at the HP 8405A on ebay and the price range seemed comparable to the FSA3011. Now the HP 8405 is a huge beast but i was thinking that it might be easier for me to use. I'm interested in just 5 and 10 MHz oscillator comparison. I know nothing about computer programs or writing any code. I also looked at the TAPR TIC. So my conclusion are: The FSA3011 may be technically the best BUT it seems to be having some teething problems and I don't really know about what programs it runs or needs. The HP 8405A is a big beast, but it maybe simpler for me to run and get the results I want which is stopping around 10 to ^12th. But I may have to watch it for a long time. The TAPR TIC is small (needed) cheaper (also a plus) and seems to run available software. but needs a dedicated laptop, which is not a real problem. I also have several extra HP 18011's available. Your opinions are gratefully solicited, Regards, Perrier Perrier If I can just download programs AFAIK I could use the TAPR TIC as I have a spare laptop that I could dedicate for its use. The two advantaages ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@lists.febo.com To unsubscribe, go to http://lists.febo.com/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts_lists.febo.com and follow the instructions there. ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@lists.febo.com To unsubscribe, go to http://lists.febo.com/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts_lists.febo.com and follow the instructions there.
[time-nuts] FSA3011 Frequency Stability Analyzer, HP 8405A or TAPR TIC
Yo Bubba Dudes!, I've been following the discussion of the FSA3011 with great interest. Now I'm not in the upper levels of TN esoteric knowledge or have a burning desire to ever get there. After seeing some small reference somewhere I looked at the HP 8405A on ebay and the price range seemed comparable to the FSA3011. Now the HP 8405 is a huge beast but i was thinking that it might be easier for me to use. I'm interested in just 5 and 10 MHz oscillator comparison. I know nothing about computer programs or writing any code. I also looked at the TAPR TIC. So my conclusion are: The FSA3011 may be technically the best BUT it seems to be having some teething problems and I don't really know about what programs it runs or needs. The HP 8405A is a big beast, but it maybe simpler for me to run and get the results I want which is stopping around 10 to ^12th. But I may have to watch it for a long time. The TAPR TIC is small (needed) cheaper (also a plus) and seems to run available software. but needs a dedicated laptop, which is not a real problem. I also have several extra HP 18011's available. Your opinions are gratefully solicited, Regards, Perrier Perrier If I can just download programs AFAIK I could use the TAPR TIC as I have a spare laptop that I could dedicate for its use. The two advantaages ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@lists.febo.com To unsubscribe, go to http://lists.febo.com/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts_lists.febo.com and follow the instructions there.
Re: [time-nuts] FSA3011 Frequency Stability Analyzer
Hi There are a lot of “stock” programs out there that will handle this sort of “wrap” process. The obvious gotcah is porting them to accept the output of the device. Bob > On Jul 29, 2019, at 5:35 AM, tim...@timeok.it wrote: > > > Hal, > > I thank you for the answer, but I'm not a scientist like many of you > but just an amateur so I'm not able to do what you suggest. > > Unfortunately I need a plug and play tool without post processing. > > Luciano > > www.timeok.it > > > Da "Hal Murray" hmur...@megapathdsl.net > A tim...@timeok.it,"Discussion of precise time and frequency measurement" > time-nuts@lists.febo.com > Cc hmur...@megapathdsl.net > Data Sat, 27 Jul 2019 01:26:39 -0700 > Oggetto Re: [time-nuts] FSA3011 Frequency Stability Analyzer > > tim...@timeok.it said: >> Another question is whether in the case of the FSA3011 there is the >> problem of the timewrap that would not allow >> the long acquisitions. > > Wha's the problem? If it's just running out of high order bits in a counting > register, I can fix that with a post-collecting pass. > > You could hack the collecting software to do it. In one sense, it's nice to > keep the collecting software clean and simple and log exactly what goes in > to > it, but if you collect enough data, then the extra pass gets annoying enough > that I would take the time to fix the collection step and double check > things > so I'm pretty sure it won't turn into a source of problems. > > > > -- > These are my opinions. I hate spam. > ___ > time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@lists.febo.com > To unsubscribe, go to > http://lists.febo.com/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts_lists.febo.com > and follow the instructions there. ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@lists.febo.com To unsubscribe, go to http://lists.febo.com/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts_lists.febo.com and follow the instructions there.
Re: [time-nuts] FSA3011 Frequency Stability Analyzer
Hal, I thank you for the answer, but I'm not a scientist like many of you but just an amateur so I'm not able to do what you suggest. Unfortunately I need a plug and play tool without post processing. Luciano www.timeok.it Da "Hal Murray" hmur...@megapathdsl.net A tim...@timeok.it,"Discussion of precise time and frequency measurement" time-nuts@lists.febo.com Cc hmur...@megapathdsl.net Data Sat, 27 Jul 2019 01:26:39 -0700 Oggetto Re: [time-nuts] FSA3011 Frequency Stability Analyzer tim...@timeok.it said: > Another question is whether in the case of the FSA3011 there is the > problem of the timewrap that would not allow > the long acquisitions. Wha's the problem? If it's just running out of high order bits in a counting register, I can fix that with a post-collecting pass. You could hack the collecting software to do it. In one sense, it's nice to keep the collecting software clean and simple and log exactly what goes in to it, but if you collect enough data, then the extra pass gets annoying enough that I would take the time to fix the collection step and double check things so I'm pretty sure it won't turn into a source of problems. -- These are my opinions. I hate spam. ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@lists.febo.com To unsubscribe, go to http://lists.febo.com/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts_lists.febo.com and follow the instructions there.
Re: [time-nuts] FSA3011 Frequency Stability Analyzer
tim...@timeok.it said: >Another question is whether in the case of the FSA3011 there is the > problem of the timewrap that would not allow > the long acquisitions. Wha's the problem? If it's just running out of high order bits in a counting register, I can fix that with a post-collecting pass. You could hack the collecting software to do it. In one sense, it's nice to keep the collecting software clean and simple and log exactly what goes in to it, but if you collect enough data, then the extra pass gets annoying enough that I would take the time to fix the collection step and double check things so I'm pretty sure it won't turn into a source of problems. -- These are my opinions. I hate spam. ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@lists.febo.com To unsubscribe, go to http://lists.febo.com/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts_lists.febo.com and follow the instructions there.
Re: [time-nuts] FSA3011 Frequency Stability Analyzer
Tom, A good test, even if not too numerical, could be ADEV between a good Rubidium like the HP5065A and another equal or better reference made both with the TICC and with the FSA3011. The comparison of the two graphs would give us a first visual answer about the differences. Another question is whether in the case of the FSA3011 there is the problem of the timewrap that would not allow the long acquisitions. Can you post a similar chart? Luciano Da "time-nuts" time-nuts-boun...@lists.febo.com A time-nuts@lists.febo.com Cc Data Fri, 26 Jul 2019 12:02:24 -0700 Oggetto Re: [time-nuts] FSA3011 Frequency Stability Analyzer Yes, I'm evaluating a FSA3011 at the moment. It's a cute little unit. Documentation is sparse, the jpg plots are fuzzy, "customer" support is nil, but it works. My initial tests show it's ~4x worse than the data sheet claims but it turns out the unit is quite dependent on the rise time and power of the input signals so YMMV. With 10 MHz sine inputs from a tee the noise is about 3 ps @1 s. I'm checking different frequency and waveform combinations in an attempt to obtain the "<1 ps" value implied by the specs. The output is phase difference, about a second. Readings look like "0.0591884\n". Note that last digit is 1 fs, which is ridiculous. It's like marketing said, "let's make this go to 15". In fact 11 or 12 digits contain actual information. Then again the TAPR/TICC has a similar problem with excessive digits so who am I to talk. For the most part, fake digits don't hurt, but realize that spitting out 15 decimal places does not in any way imply the device can measure to that level. The block diagram says it's a dual-mixer. It follows a very minimalist design. Just two SMA inputs and a 115.2 kbaud serial-over-USB output. No switches, no modes, no input commands, no GUI; a couple of labeled LED's -- my kind of "do thing, do it well, and do it quietly" device. Startup time (power-up to first reading) is ~1 minute. Since it first appeared eBay there are now dozen(s) of clone [re]sellers, which often happens these days, especially from far east sellers. My current feeling is if it were half the price and if the documentation were better and if they added clean ZCD the inputs, they'd sell a lot of them. Right now, I think they're just reaching for a top price to see if it will sell. From the eBay history there have been a couple of sales in several months so that's their answer. I'll have more info as the evaluation tests continue. The sad thing to me is that for ten+ years I kept hoping someone time-nuts would make a similar turn-key phase comparator. A number of members have mentioned their dual-mixer prototypes but I've never seen anyone take it to the level where it's integrated into a working-out-of-the-box board or black box like this FSA. A ps-level 1-100 MHz RF phase comparator would be (would have been) a perfect TAPR product. With TAPR, you get open source, good documentation, reliable and peer reviewed circuits, and superb support. /tvb 7/26/2019 8:11 AM, tim...@timeok.it wrote: > > Hi, > > for some time now on ebay they have been selling the FSA3011 > Frequency Stability Analyzer which would seem interesting as a fair > compromise between resolution and price. Some have been sold and I > would like to know if any of you have had the chance to try it and > therefore have an opinion on this instrument. > > Thanks, > > Luciano > > timeok ___ time-nuts > mailing list -- time-nuts@lists.febo.com To unsubscribe, go to > http://lists.febo.com/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts_lists.febo.com and > follow the instructions there. > ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@lists.febo.com To unsubscribe, go to http://lists.febo.com/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts_lists.febo.com and follow the instructions there. ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@lists.febo.com To unsubscribe, go to http://lists.febo.com/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts_lists.febo.com and follow the instructions there.
Re: [time-nuts] FSA3011 Frequency Stability Analyzer
Hi One of the questions earlier was about the “offset oscillator” in the device and if it was tuned in any way. If it is not tuned *and* it has modest stability, the exact frequencies you put in may impact the performance you get. Since there seems to be zip for command set, I’d bet there is no tuning ability. Bob > On Jul 26, 2019, at 3:02 PM, Tom Van Baak wrote: > > Yes, I'm evaluating a FSA3011 at the moment. It's a cute little unit. > Documentation is sparse, the jpg plots are fuzzy, "customer" support is nil, > but it works. My initial tests show it's ~4x worse than the data sheet claims > but it turns out the unit is quite dependent on the rise time and power of > the input signals so YMMV. > > With 10 MHz sine inputs from a tee the noise is about 3 ps @1 s. I'm checking > different frequency and waveform combinations in an attempt to obtain the "<1 > ps" value implied by the specs. > > The output is phase difference, about once a second. Readings look like > "0.0591884\n". Note that last digit is 1 fs, which is ridiculous. > It's like marketing said, "let's make this go to 15". In fact only 11 or 12 > digits contain actual information. Then again the TAPR/TICC has a similar > problem with excessive digits so who am I to talk. For the most part, fake > digits don't hurt, but realize that spitting out 15 decimal places does not > in any way imply the device can measure to that level. > > The block diagram says it's a dual-mixer. It follows a very minimalist > design. Just two SMA inputs and a 115.2 kbaud serial-over-USB output. No > switches, no modes, no input commands, no GUI; a couple of labeled LED's -- > my kind of "do one thing, do it well, and do it quietly" device. Startup time > (power-up to first reading) is ~1 minute. > > Since it first appeared on eBay there are now dozen(s) of clone [re]sellers, > which often happens these days, especially from far east sellers. > > My current feeling is if it were half the price and if the documentation were > better and if they added clean ZCD on the inputs, they'd sell a lot of them. > Right now, I think they're just reaching for a top price to see if it will > sell. From the eBay history there have been only a couple of sales in several > months so that's their answer. > > I'll have more info as the evaluation tests continue. > > The sad thing to me is that for ten+ years I kept hoping someone on time-nuts > would make a similar turn-key phase comparator. A number of members have > mentioned their dual-mixer prototypes but I've never seen anyone take it to > the level where it's integrated into a working-out-of-the-box board or black > box like this FSA. A ps-level 1-100 MHz RF phase comparator would be (would > have been) a perfect TAPR product. With TAPR, you get open source, good > documentation, reliable and peer reviewed circuits, and superb support. > > /tvb > > > On 7/26/2019 8:11 AM, tim...@timeok.it wrote: >> > Hi, > > for some time now on ebay they have been selling the FSA3011 > > Frequency Stability Analyzer which would seem interesting as a fair > > > compromise between resolution and price. Some have been sold and I > would > > like to know if any of you have had the chance to try it and > therefore > > have an opinion on this instrument. > > Thanks, > > Luciano > > timeok > > ___ time-nuts > mailing list -- > > time-nuts@lists.febo.com To unsubscribe, go to > > > http://lists.febo.com/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts_lists.febo.com and > > > follow the instructions there. > > > ___ > time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@lists.febo.com > To unsubscribe, go to > http://lists.febo.com/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts_lists.febo.com > and follow the instructions there. ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@lists.febo.com To unsubscribe, go to http://lists.febo.com/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts_lists.febo.com and follow the instructions there.
Re: [time-nuts] FSA3011 Frequency Stability Analyzer
Yes, I'm evaluating a FSA3011 at the moment. It's a cute little unit. Documentation is sparse, the jpg plots are fuzzy, "customer" support is nil, but it works. My initial tests show it's ~4x worse than the data sheet claims but it turns out the unit is quite dependent on the rise time and power of the input signals so YMMV. With 10 MHz sine inputs from a tee the noise is about 3 ps @1 s. I'm checking different frequency and waveform combinations in an attempt to obtain the "<1 ps" value implied by the specs. The output is phase difference, about once a second. Readings look like "0.0591884\n". Note that last digit is 1 fs, which is ridiculous. It's like marketing said, "let's make this go to 15". In fact only 11 or 12 digits contain actual information. Then again the TAPR/TICC has a similar problem with excessive digits so who am I to talk. For the most part, fake digits don't hurt, but realize that spitting out 15 decimal places does not in any way imply the device can measure to that level. The block diagram says it's a dual-mixer. It follows a very minimalist design. Just two SMA inputs and a 115.2 kbaud serial-over-USB output. No switches, no modes, no input commands, no GUI; a couple of labeled LED's -- my kind of "do one thing, do it well, and do it quietly" device. Startup time (power-up to first reading) is ~1 minute. Since it first appeared on eBay there are now dozen(s) of clone [re]sellers, which often happens these days, especially from far east sellers. My current feeling is if it were half the price and if the documentation were better and if they added clean ZCD on the inputs, they'd sell a lot of them. Right now, I think they're just reaching for a top price to see if it will sell. From the eBay history there have been only a couple of sales in several months so that's their answer. I'll have more info as the evaluation tests continue. The sad thing to me is that for ten+ years I kept hoping someone on time-nuts would make a similar turn-key phase comparator. A number of members have mentioned their dual-mixer prototypes but I've never seen anyone take it to the level where it's integrated into a working-out-of-the-box board or black box like this FSA. A ps-level 1-100 MHz RF phase comparator would be (would have been) a perfect TAPR product. With TAPR, you get open source, good documentation, reliable and peer reviewed circuits, and superb support. /tvb On 7/26/2019 8:11 AM, tim...@timeok.it wrote: > Hi, > > for some time now on ebay they have been selling the FSA3011 > Frequency Stability Analyzer which would seem interesting as a fair > compromise between resolution and price. Some have been sold and I > would like to know if any of you have had the chance to try it and > therefore have an opinion on this instrument. > > Thanks, > > Luciano > > timeok ___ time-nuts > mailing list -- time-nuts@lists.febo.com To unsubscribe, go to > http://lists.febo.com/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts_lists.febo.com and > follow the instructions there. > ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@lists.febo.com To unsubscribe, go to http://lists.febo.com/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts_lists.febo.com and follow the instructions there.
Re: [time-nuts] FSA3011 Frequency Stability Analyzer
Hi There was some chat a few weeks back about them and several questions came up about some of the features of the unit. I believe there was an inquiry into the people making the device to get some further information. If that *did* come back and get posted, I missed it. Bob > On Jul 26, 2019, at 11:11 AM, tim...@timeok.it wrote: > > > Hi, > > for some time now on ebay they have been selling the FSA3011 Frequency > Stability Analyzer which would seem interesting as a fair compromise between > resolution and price. > Some have been sold and I would like to know if any of you have had the > chance to try it and therefore have an opinion on this instrument. > > Thanks, > > Luciano > > timeok > ___ > time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@lists.febo.com > To unsubscribe, go to > http://lists.febo.com/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts_lists.febo.com > and follow the instructions there. ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@lists.febo.com To unsubscribe, go to http://lists.febo.com/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts_lists.febo.com and follow the instructions there.
