Re: Topband: Beverage Antennas on Sloping Ground

[Jeremy Maris]

Same here, 570’ W/E  with 80ft drop and ~8ft high in a hedge works well in both 
directions.

Jeremy G3XDK


> On 2 Aug 2023, at 21:37, Tree  wrote:
> 
> My E/W Beverate (bi directional - brute force - transformers on each end
> and two feedlines) has probably a 75 foot drop from one end to the other.
> Works fine uphill.
> 
> Tree N6TR
> 
> On Wed, Aug 2, 2023 at 11:51 AM Jim Brown  wrote:
> 
>> On 8/2/2023 11:11 AM, Chuck Dietz wrote:
>>> Am I correct in assuming that Beverage wires sloping downward from the
>> feed
>>> point to the termination will work better than ones that slope upward?
>> 
>> My Beverages are over terrain that starts high, slopes down nearly 100
>> ft to a creek, then back up to the elevation where they started. They
>> roughly follow that terrain, but one is about 15 ft high where it goes
>> over the creek.  They both work fine, only issue is noise from solar
>> systems in neighbor homes.
>> 
>> 73, Jim K9YC
>> 
>> _
>> Searchable Archives: http://www.contesting.com/_topband - Topband
>> Reflector
>> 
> _
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Re: Topband: Personal decision

[Jeremy Maris]

There are many public demonstrations in Russia against Putin’s action, 
courageous given the political climate - see the thread  below on Twitter.

I go with Tree -  never assume  that the people support  the propaganda of 
their leader.

I was sending VY GL to UR stations,  maybe I’ll send  55 VY GL to UR to those 
in the Russian Federation.

https://twitter.com/AVindman/status/1496900368344797184 


73, Jeremy G3XDK

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Re: Topband: BCB Filter Recommendation?

[Jeremy Maris]

Hi Rick,

Thanks for that - good point about Inverse chebyshev. and the toroids were dust 
iron…
We’re fortunate in not having mega strong signals near the top of the MW band 
here.

Jeremy



> On 17 Apr 2020, at 05:24, Richard (Rick) Karlquist  
> wrote:
> 
> 
> 
> On 4/16/2020 2:45 PM, Jeremy Maris wrote:
>> Make your own!
>> Use this site to design your filter.
>> http://www.iowahills.com/9RFFiltersPage.html
>> Attached are the values I used back in 2016 when the G4AQG FT-1000MP had 
>> intermod problems with a new Beverage.
>> I built a 9 pole Chebyshev high pass filter, designed with the excellent RF 
>> filter design package from Iowa Software, and used an LC meter to get the 
>> capacitor and inductor values correct. Caps were made from polystyrene and 
>> inductors wound on small ferrite torroids..
>> Difficult to see from the (ancient!) spectrum analyzer picture but the 
>> filter response was almost exactly as the design showed.
>> No labels for stop-band but it was 10dB down at 1579kHz, 50dB down at 
>> 1000kHz and at 693kHz was in the noise, at least 70dB down, almost 
>> undetectable compared to 60dB over S9 or more without the filter, and the  
>> intermod was gone.
> 
> The good filters use INVERSE Chebyshev designs,
> made with mica or C0G capacitors, and powdered iron cores.
> 10 dB down at 1579 kHz is not good enough for many QTH's.
> I have a very strong local station at 1700 kHz,
> for example, and another at 1530 kHz.
> 
> Rick N6RK

Jeremy Maris
140 Edward Street, Brighton BN2 0JL
jer...@maris.plus.com





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Re: Topband: BCB Filter Recommendation?

[Jeremy Maris]

Here’s a link to the values I used, seeing as it doesn’t get through the 
reflector.

http://www.g4aqg.sussex.ac.uk/9-pole-chebyshev-1500-exactvalues.tiff

Built in an evening in a diecast box with BNC sockets,  dead bug construction 
on single sided PCB and copper foil screening between sections.

Jeremy

> On 16 Apr 2020, at 22:45, Jeremy Maris  wrote:
> 
> Make your own!

Jeremy Maris G3XDK / G4AQG




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Re: Topband: BCB Filter Recommendation?

[Jeremy Maris]

Make your own!

Use this site to design your filter.

http://www.iowahills.com/9RFFiltersPage.html

Attached are the values I used back in 2016 when the G4AQG FT-1000MP had 
intermod problems with a new Beverage.

I built a 9 pole Chebyshev high pass filter, designed with the excellent RF 
filter design package from Iowa Software, and used an LC meter to get the 
capacitor and inductor values correct. Caps were made from polystyrene and 
inductors wound on small ferrite torroids..

Difficult to see from the (ancient!) spectrum analyzer picture but the filter 
response was almost exactly as the design showed.
No labels for stop-band but it was 10dB down at 1579kHz, 50dB down at 1000kHz 
and at 693kHz was in the noise, at least 70dB down, almost undetectable 
compared to 60dB over S9 or more without the filter, and the  intermod was gone.


> On 16 Apr 2020, at 19:34, Edward via Topband  wrote:
> 
> Greetings, 
> 
> I am getting clobbered by a local BCB transmitter, making 160M unusable, even 
> with a dedicated RX antenna. 
> 
> As for filters, I have narrowed it down to the ICE and the Kiwa. Kiwa seems 
> to be the more serious filter, as they publish their specs in great detail. 
> ICE does not. 
> 
> Any other filter I should consider besides these two?
> 
> 
> Thanks,
> Ed 7Z1ES
> _
> Searchable Archives: http://www.contesting.com/_topband - Topband Reflector

73,


Jeremy Maris
G3XDK / G4AQG










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Re: Topband: Source for durable ladder line?

[Jeremy Maris]

> On 13 Jan 2020, at 02:05, Mike Waters  wrote:
> 
> Exactly how much is "a *lot* of loss", Jeremy? Too many knowledgeable
> Topbanders have used it over the years --with great success-- for it to
> have enough loss to matter.


There’s a good thread on this here:

https://topband.contesting.narkive.com/GKD4HWdS/topband-wd-1a-2-way-beverage

We have some remote beverages  fed via about  700m/2400ft of low loss coax - 
around 6dB loss on 1.8MHz  We have a bi-directional  E/W beverage of about 
600ft. I’ve not measured the transmission line loss  in the WD-1A  in the 
reverse direction but forward/reverse comparison indicates about 10dB loss   on 
1.8MHz.  The total loss to the shack in the reverse direction is around 16dB 
and weaker USA signals are lost in noise. Worse still of course on 80m.
I now use that E-W Beverage as an  unterminated bi-directional.

From the link above, N1BUG and KV4FZ  have good results with WD1-A . In our 
environment the attenuation of WD-1A as transmission line doesn’t play well.

I’m hoping to use a length of coax as the E-W Beverage but haven’t had the time 
to do it!

73,

Jeremy Maris G3XDK/G4AQG





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Re: Topband: Source for durable ladder line?

[Jeremy Maris]

*Don’t*  use the two conductors of a single run of  twisted pair WD-1A as the 
transmission line - you’ll get a *lot* of loss in the transmission line. 
Instead  parallel the two wires and run two lengths WD-1A (as Jim Garland says).
2 inches / 50mm spacing between them will give a line impedance of around 450 
ohms, and much less loss.

Jeremy G3XDK / G4AQG





> On 12 Jan 2020, at 23:24, Herbert Schoenbohm  
> wrote:
> 
> Probably the most durable two conductor is Military WD-1A telephone cable.
> available on eBay for $50 for about a half-mile.  Special lower
> impedance transformers are required to match the line's impedance.  It is
> also a great source for very durable single wire Beverages with both ends
> connected together.
> 
> Herb, KV4FZ
> 
> On Sun, Jan 12, 2020 at 11:26 AM John Kaufmann via Topband <
> topband@contesting.com> wrote:
> 
>> I'm looking for a source for durable ladder line for making two-wire
>> reversible Beverages for use at the KC1XX contest station.  In the past
>> we've used the line sold by DX Engineering but over the years we've found
>> that the plastic spacers between the wires become brittle and break off.
>> It
>> may be UV exposure that causes this.  We also get some pretty severe
>> weather
>> at KC1XX hilltop location, with ice in the winter and frequent strong
>> winds.
>> The spacer breakage sometimes exposes the wires, which then become twisted,
>> and the ladder line generally becomes weakened and prone to wire breakage.
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> What else is available commercially?
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 73, John W1FV
>> 
>> _
>> Searchable Archives: http://www.contesting.com/_topband - Topband
>> Reflector
>> 
> _
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Jeremy Maris
140 Edward Street, Brighton BN2 0JL
jer...@maris.plus.com





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Re: Topband: Coax for Top-band beverage antenna

[Jeremy Maris]

That depends upon the length of the feedline: cheap copper plated satellite RG6 
has a *lot* of attenuation at 2MHz, as much as 3.6dB per 100m

We have a 750m coax feed to our beverages and attenuation DOES matter on long 
feed lines. We had ~ 25dB !

http://lists.contesting.com/archives//html/Topband/2011-05/msg00027.html

Caveat emptor.

Jeremy G3XDK/G4AQG


> On 19 Sep 2019, at 17:57, K4SAV  wrote:
> 
> Don't worry about feedline loss for a Beverage.  A few dB loss isn't going to 
> make any difference at all.  You can worry about feedline loss for transmit 
> antennas, not for receiving antennas.
> 
> Jerry, K4SAV
> 
> 
> On 9/19/2019 10:17 AM, Kevin Shea via Topband wrote:
>> I have read that the skin effect at 2 MHz may be deeper than the copper 
>> coating on a copper covered steel inner conductor of most RG6 cables.  Thus, 
>> as I plan for long cable runs back from my (to be installed) Beverages I am 
>> thinking I need either solid copper, solid aluminum,. or copper covered 
>> aluminum for my RG6 coax.  So the question is am I wrong in this 
>> understanding?
>> Also, does the shield matter?  It's not very thick so does a foil and 60% 
>> aluminum shield do the job?  Or should I be looking at a foil and 95 percent 
>> copper shield like the Belden 1694.
>> I know it may not be too material but I want to make an informed decision.
>> Thanks! and
>> 73,
>> Kevin, N9JKP
>> _
>> Searchable Archives: http://www.contesting.com/_topband - Topband Reflector
> 
> _
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Re: Topband: Supporting Ladder line

[jeremy maris]

Hi Vic,

I’ve done something similar to Jim with two paralleled runs of WD1A for a 
bi-directional Beverage and it worked very well.

According to the specifications, WD1A is made up of two 0.85mm diameter 
conductors separated by 0.85mm between the inner surface of the conductors.
I took the effective diameter of two paralleled strands of WD1A to be 2mm. Two 
lines spaced apart by 50mm gives about 450 ohms impedance.

Paralleled strands of WD1A at 450/600 ohms are OK for RX but you want to use 
the line for feeding QRO to a transmit  antenna, so loss matters.

I’ve considered using RG6U spaced apart by 150mm for 450 ohm TX transmission 
line but think that I’d need too many poles to support it with acceptable sag.
Aluminium wire or copperweld would be much better - it would be lighter and 
hold more tension so less sag, fewer supports needed and more consistent 
impedance.

Re horizontal versus vertical spacing, don’t think it will make much difference 
on taught lines raised above head height.

73 Jeremy G3XDK / G4AQG

> On 6 Jan 2018, at 21:05, Vic <g4...@lindgren1.karoo.co.uk> wrote:
> 
> Thanks for that Jim,
> 
> Well we plan on using some on site "Shot Gun" coax (about 8 gauge diam) as 
> the ladder line conductors with a 6 inch spacing. Which on a test length gave 
> us around the 450 ohm impedance we require.
> 
> I dont know the diameter of that WD1a wire but suspect it is quite small 
> which would make home made 450 ohm line spacing very small indeed.
> 
> Your method of supporting using the wood clamps sounds a good idea as we were 
> concerned about the plastic clamps breaking due to flexing and UV 
> deterioration.
> 
> If our conductors fail through the flexing then we may bite the bullet and 
> buy some Aluminium wire as Rik N6RK uses.
> 
> All useful info though and thanks again Jim.
> 
> 73
> 
> 
> On 06-Jan-18 20:38, Jim Garland wrote:
>> Vic, I've had nothing but bad luck in trying to support long horizontal 
>> lengths of ladder line. In my case, I have two 720 ft bidirectional 
>> beverages, which I initially made of heavy duty commercial ladder line. I 
>> supported the line with wood 4"x4" posts, spaced sixty feet apart, using the 
>> little plastic ladder line clamps, sold in the US by DX Engineering.
>> 
>> After only a month or so, the plastic clamps broke apart because of the 
>> repetitive flexing of the ladder line in breezes. I replaced the clamps with 
>> wood clamps, screwed into the top of the posts. These survived with no 
>> problem, but the ladder didn't. After six months or so, I started having 
>> breaks in the line from the flexing, and after spending two years repeatedly 
>> repairing the line, I gave up and threw away all 1500 feet of the stuff.
>> 
>> Finally, I settled on WD1a military surplus field telephone wire, available 
>> from many sources for about $50 USD in half mile lengths. I use two parallel 
>> lengths of the wire, threaded through twin ceramic insulators screwed into 
>> each 4x4 wood support (available from a farm supply store), with a pulley at 
>> the far end to equalize tension in the two lengths. In three years, it has 
>> worked perfectly, with no problems at all.
>> 
>> I'm not disparaging ladder line (or the plastic clamps) at all. The 
>> commercial stuff just isn't designed for long horizontal lengths.
>> 
>> 73,
>> Jim W8ZR
>> 
>>> -Original Message-
>>> From: Topband [mailto:topband-boun...@contesting.com] On Behalf Of Vic
>>> Sent: Saturday, January 06, 2018 01:17 PM
>>> To: topband@contesting.com
>>> Subject: Topband: Supporting Ladder line
>>> 
>>> Has anyone idea's of how to support a long (750 ft) length of home made
>>> 450 ohm ladder line ?
>>> 
>>> Is it possible to use it supported from posts in a vertical orientation or 
>>> will that introduce
>>> imbalance.
>>> 
>>> I would prefer not to have it supported  horizontally due to added cross 
>>> arms being
>>> required.
>>> 
>>> Have scoured internet sources but their appears little information 
>>> available on the subject.
>>> 
>>> I plan to feed a Marconi Tee Vertical (Hairpin Matching) with 9:1 
>>> transformers at each end
>>> of the ladder line enabling use of 50 ohm coax at each end for convenience.
>>> 
>>> 73
>>> 
>>> Vic
>>> 
>>> G4BYG  (G6M)
>>> 
>>> _
>>> Topband Reflector Archives - http://www.contesting.com/_topband
>> 
> 
> _
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—
Jeremy Maris 






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Re: Topband: DHDL matching Transformer

[jeremy maris]

Hi Trevor,

Luis IV3PRK has good info on DHDL, based on the original by George Wallner, 
AA7JV
See http://www.iv3prk.it/TX3A-DHDL.htm

I use a 1200 ohm terminating resistor;  source resistance is about 900 ohms.  
900/75 = 12 so turns ratio to match is 3.5:1I use a 2 turn primary and 7 
turn secondary on a BN73-202 core.

Make sure that you have a feedline choke near the feed to the DHDL so you don’t 
get common mode noise.

They work well!


> On 28 Nov 2017, at 15:07, MR TREVOR DUNNE <ei2...@eircom.net> wrote:
> 
> Hi All
> 
> My quest to better my station continues I want to try a DHDL can someone 
> recommend a matching Transformer and what size termination resistor should I 
> use,
> 
> I have some bn73-202 cores and I wish to use 75ohm feed line,
> _
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—
Jeremy Maris G3XDK / G4AQG






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Re: Topband: small garden 160m

[jeremy maris]

W0UCE (SK) pages on the FCP can be found via the wayback machine

https://web.archive.org/web/20160306094957/http://www.w0uce.net/k2avantennas.html



> On 20 Aug 2017, at 22:50, ma...@ka5m.net wrote:
> 
> Information on the K2AV elevated Folded CounterPoise can be found at:
> 
> https://www.okdxf.eu/files/Olinger_FCP_article_as_published_in_NCJ.pdf
> 
> 73,
> Marsh, KA5M
> 
> -Original Message-
> From: Topband [mailto:topband-boun...@contesting.com] On Behalf Of Mike
> Waters
> Sent: Sunday, August 20, 2017 2:20 PM
> To: topband <topband@contesting.com>
> Subject: Re: Topband: small garden 160m
> 
> Hi John,
> 
> For your ground system, more of the same wouldn't hurt.
> 
> You may want to look into the K2AV elevated folded counterpoise. I don't
> know where to find that information anymore, but I suggest searching the the
> Topband archives.
> 
> 73, Mike
> www.w0btu.com
> 
> 

—
Jeremy Maris G3XDK





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Re: Topband: BCB High Pass Filter

[jeremy maris]

I noticed a bit of BC inter-mod so built a 9 pole Chebyshev high pass filter 
dead bug style in a small diecast box with some internal screening made from 
double sided pcb stock.   I designed it with the excellent RF filter design 
package from Iowa Software, and used an LC meter to get the capacitor and 
inductor values correct. Only took  a couple of hours to make out pf the junk 
box using polystyrene caps and small toroids  - designed for 50 ohms with 
corner frequency 1.5MHz and 0.2dB passband ripple.

http://iowahills.com/9RFFiltersPage.html

The filter response was almost exactly as the design showed, as measured on the 
G4AQG spectrum analyzer - at least 50dB down at 1 MHz  and a local broadcast 
station on 693kHz station is  now almost undetectable compared to 70dB over S9 
or more without the filter.   
Inter-mod has gone.


Jeremy G3XDK/G4AQG

> On 3 Mar 2016, at 15:59, Roger White  wrote:
> 
> Anyone have a BCB High Pass Filter that they would recommend? Seems like 
> there were a number of sources for these a number of years ago, but Google 
> only came up with a few now. 
> 
> Roger White W5RDW
> Murphy, TX
> _
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Re: Topband: WD-1A wire

[jeremy maris]

Yes WD1A works very well with the conductors strapped. I've built  a 300m long 
reversible beverage up at about 2.4m with two parallel runs of  strapped WD1A 
about 50mm apart.

Impedance of this line is around 450 ohms at that spacing so transformer design 
is simpler than  one twisted WD1A and losses considerably less.

Jeremy G3XDK


On 7 Jun 2015, at 16:55, Roger Parsons via Topband wrote:

 I know that WD-1 and WD-1A wires are not very good for two wire transmission 
 lines due to their high attenuation. I wonder however whether they are OK 
 with the conductors strapped as Beverage wires? WD-1A has quite a few 
 advantages for the bush where I run my antennas - it is strong, it is quite 
 light, it is very nice and easy to run out, and it fits through electric 
 fence insulators.
 
 
 I presume that its poor performance as a balanced line is related to the 
 copper wires twisting with the steel ones meaning that for some of the time 
 current is passing through the steel wires due to skin effect. On the other 
 hand I can't see how it can be worse than galvanised steel wire or electric 
 fence wire.
 
 73 Roger
 VE3ZI
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Re: Topband: Modeling Ground and losses

[jeremy maris]

On 26 Feb 2015, at 06:31, Richard Fry wrote:

 
 Quote from page 757 of the BLE paper:

For those who'd like to read the whole paper, you can access it here 
http://bit.ly/1LLdtCI 

Jeremy

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Re: Topband: Beverage Question

[jeremy maris]

I've just finished putting up a ~300m NE/SW reversible beverage at G4AQG using 
two pairs of paralleled WD1/TT wire for the feeder, spaced 50mm apart.

I used nine 2.7m 3x3 posts with electric fence insulators on top.  The posts 
are held in the ground with  a metal fence post spike.
The wire is secured to insulators at the far end and tensioned with two fencing 
wire tensioners at the feed end, using egg insulators just before the 
tensioners.

One end post is guyed with fencing wire to a 4ft 5/8  earth stake via a wire 
tensioner and the other guyed to a convenient tree.
There are two 4ft earth rods at each end.

I've put about 25lb tension in each line (measured with a travel scale) and 
there's hardly any sag in the line and apparently no need for spacers to keep 
the lines apart.
Hopefully wind and any ice loading will be within the 200lb breaking strain of 
the paralleled wire!

The impedance of the line is about 470 ohms and common mode is around 390 ohms. 
Allowing for earth losses in the termination, I reckoned that  a 1:1 reflection 
transformer was about right.
For 75 ohm coax, I used transformers with 6+6:5 , 7:3 and 3+3 :6 turns ratio  
wound on  fair-rite binocular cores and direction  switched by relay.

I checked line impedance and matching impedance  with an Antscope analyser, all 
seems OK. The beverage works well up to 30m. There's good f/b from a nearby AM 
station on 1485kHz ( at least 15dB)  but not had time to measure 160m 
performance yet.

Jeremy G3XDK/G4AQG

On 20 Sep 2014, at 15:06, Jim Garland wrote:

 I want to replace the 450 ohm ladder line for my two DXE 720 ft long
 bi-directional beverages with two lengths of WD-1/TT field telephone wire.
 The wires will be secured only at the ends, but will be supported along their
 length by ceramic insulators mounted on 4x4 posts spaced every 60 ft.  The
 spacing between the parallel wires will be about six inches. Here are my
 quesetions: First, does anybody know what the likely impedance is of this
 configuration, or if not, how to measure it?  Second, if I keep the DxE
 matching trnsformers used with the 450 ohm ladder line, will beverage
 performance be degraded noticeably with the new wures if, say, the impedance
 of the new line turns out to be 600 ohms or so? In other words, as a
 practical matter how important to performance (e.g., F/B ratio and
 low-noise) is it to make sure impedances are matched.
 
 
 
 Finally, a mechanical question. I want to have a pulley at one end of the
 parallel wires to equalize the tension in the wires. I've not been able to
 find a good pulley with a five or six inch diameter, except for nylon
 pulleys used for clotheslines. Do you think one of these could be used.
 There will be no motion of the pulley, since it is only used to equalize
 tension. The field telephone wire is rated at 200 lbs maximum tension, and
 I'm guessing the actual tension will be about half that.
 
 
 
 Thanks!
 
 Jim W8ZR
 
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Re: Topband: Beverage Question

[jeremy maris]

The way I looked at it was that the equivalent diameter would be a bit less 
than  twice the diameter of the wires plus the spacing. According to the Mil 
Spec for WD-1A/TT is  0.84mm diameter per conductor spaced 0.84mm (or perhaps 
0.72mm if just twice sheath diameter.

That gives around 2.5mm. The effective diameter will be less than this but it 
helps that the two conductors are twisted together. Can't do the maths for that 
but I reckon around 2mm diameter or 12 AWG.

The standard formula (see eg  http://www.w0btu.com) gives around 470 ohms with 
50mm spacing. My quick tests with a 40ft sample of line (changing termination 
resistance and measuring SWR using an antscope via a 75/450 ohm transformer) 
show that to be about right for 450 ohm line.

Jeremy G3XDK/G4AQG

On 20 Sep 2014, at 16:14, Carl wrote:

 The way I understand is that you will be using the WD-1A as individual lines 
 with each  having its wires connected in parallel.
 
 Id start by calculating the resultant wire gauge such as say two #24 in 
 parallel = a #21; I dont know what the fudge factor would be due to wire and 
 jacket insulations in determinining the 6 spaced line impedance. From what 
 Ive read that is too much spacing for best performance due to imbalancing 
 plus not being a bit twisted to cancel the imbalance as with ladderline and 
 conventional WD-1A useage.
 
 If the reason for change is poor strength and reliability then why not go 
 with parallel galvanized or aluminum fence wire and create some twisting 
 arrangement every 100' so.
 
 In the more conventional installation I calculated about 93 Ohms for the 
 WD-1A and use a 1:1 ratio for 75 Ohm coax; cant notice any deterioation 
 between that and using 50 Ohm coax with its own transformer. Both work fine 
 to 30M.
 
 Carl
 KM1H
 
 
 
 
 I want to replace the 450 ohm ladder line for my two DXE 720 ft long
 bi-directional beverages with two lengths of WD-1/TT field telephone wire.
 The wires will be secured only at the ends, but will be suported along their
 length by ceramic insulators mounted on 4x4 posts spaced every 60 ft.  The
 spacing between the parallel wires will be about six inches. Here are my
 quesetions: First, does anybody know what the likely impedance is of this
 configuration, or if not, how to measure it?  Second, if I keep the DxE
 matching trnsformers used with the 450 ohm ladder line, will beverage
 performance be degraded noticeably with the new wures if, say, the impedance
 of the new line turns out to be 600 ohms or so? In other words, as a
 practical matter how important to performance (e.g., F/B ratio and
 low-noise) is it to make sure impedances are matched.
 
 
 
 Finally, a mechanical question. I want to have a pulley at one end of the
 parallel wires to equalize the tension in the wires. I've not been able to
 find a good pulley with a five or six inch diameter, except for nylon
 pulleys used for clotheslines. Do you think one of these could be used.
 There will be no motion of the pulley, since it is only used to equalize
 tension. The field telephone wire is rated at 200 lbs maximum tension, and
 I'm guessing the actual tension will be about half that.
 
 
 
 Thanks!
 
 Jim W8ZR
 
 _
 Topband Reflector Archives - http://www.contesting.com/_topband
 
 
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Topband: Dull and Boring

[jeremy maris]

The BBC had a news article today about Dull twinning with Boring - hope Tree is 
amused!

Will see about planning a DXpedition to Dull so that I can work K7RAT :)

 http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-tayside-central-28691197

Jeremy G3XDK/G4AGC


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Re: Topband: 160M Contest

[jeremy maris]

Conditions not brilliant from the UK for me, but worked OK into AZ and NM. 
Didn't hear anything from North West  or coast, CA,  NV UT etc. Polar paths not 
good, I guess.

Still need HI and ND for my (QRO) WAS on 160 ...

Jeremy (G3XDK/G4AQG)

On 7 Dec 2013, at 17:12, Jim Brown wrote:

 On 12/6/2013 5:11 PM, Jim Brown wrote:
 I'm going to run QRP hoping to complete QRP WAS (I need 6 eastern states), 
 except that I'll go QRO on the outside chance that a new country shows up. 
 
 Working east this morning was a complete bust -- only a few signals heard 
 around east coast sunrise, and they were all weak. WJ9B/7 couldn't even hear 
 me (and he couldn't hear K9AY or K9CT, on whose run frequency he was calling 
 CQ for a long time. Maybe fell asleep. I''l try again Sunday morning. Did 
 manage to work KL7RA, KH6/KU1CW, and T32RC, all on the first call, with some 
 repeats needed.
 
 73, Jim K9YC
 
 
 
 
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Re: Topband: Measured RG-6 Loss: Solid Copper vs. Copper Clad center conductor

[jeremy maris]

I posted earlier  on the list  (31 January 2011 ) problems we had with  some 
cheap  ebay satellite cable  CCS RG6 that I was using on a long run to 160m 
Beverages. The 250m reels came from different suppliers, though both of Chinese 
origin.

The measured loss in the first 250m segment was ~ 6dB and about ~9dB  in the 
second segment, 15dB total over 500m. This is way higher than published figures 
(eg at http://www.timesmicrowave.com/cgi-bin/calculate.pl)  which suggest about 
3dB per 250m.

This is in line with your  attenuation measurments of CCS  (0.6 dB loss per 100 
ft at 1.8MHz) , but shows that cheap cable can be even worse! 

I assumed  that this  cable was particularly bad at lower frequencies because 
of value engineering re the thickness of the copper coating.

Rudy N6LF gives the skin depth at 2MHz as 40uM (Conductors for HF  Antennas, 
Rudy Severns, QEX November/December 2000) and I guess that some  CCS cable has 
copper  covering much thinner than that!

No doubt  quality Comscope or Belden is better, but we stripped out the RG6 and 
used solid copper CX167 instead, more expensive but very useable over a 1km 
feed run.

Jeremy G3XDK/G4AQG


On 24 Jan 2013, at 02:28, donov...@starpower.net donov...@starpower.net 
wrote:

 Hi Mike,
 
 Obviously I had computers on my mind...
 
 Yes, of course I meant to say quad-shield RG-6 CATV cable.   I'll provide the 
 manufacturers and part numbers in a subsequent e-mail, but its just typical 
 inexpensive ebay RG-6 CATV cable.
 
 Inexpensive RG-6 with a copper clad steel (CCS) center conductor is much more 
 widely available than solid copper, especially in desirable options such as a 
 tough polyethylene (PE) jacket and flooded RG-6.  CCS looks like a reasonable 
 choice except for very long cable runs on 160 and 80 meters.  A copper clad 
 center conductor may be a problem if a device (e.g. a preamp or relay) is 
 remotely powered through the coaxial cable.
 
 73
 Frank
 W3LPL
 
  Original message 
 Date: Wed, 23 Jan 2013 19:56:40 -0600
 From: Mike Waters mikew...@gmail.com  
 Subject: Re: Topband: Measured RG-6 Loss: Solid Copper vs. Copper Clad 
 center conductor  
 To: topband topband@contesting.com
 
  Hello Frank,
 
  Thank you for this, but you meant quad-shield instead of
  quad-core, didn't you? I've never heard of coax with 4
  cores, unless you mean the quad-coax stuff where the jackets
  are all joined together.
 
  Data on the coax companies and part numbers might be useful,
  if you have it handy.
 
  73, Mike
  www.w0btu.com
 
  On Wed, Jan 23, 2013 at 4:58 PM, donov...@starpower.net
  wrote:
 
copper clad steel (CCS) Quad-Core RG-6 coaxial cable.
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 Topband Reflector

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Re: Topband: Last news for 3C6A

[jeremy maris]

Agreed. And speaking as someone in the UK with a nice South Beverage I'd be 
pleased to work them. As would many others in Europe and Asia, no doubt. There' 
a whole world outside of the USA!

As to contests, I heard many stations in the ARRL DX CW that I wanted to work 
(Belize, British Honduras etc)  but  they were of course working USA only and 
far too busy to want  Eu QSO.  So I'll listen at other times.

Let's just use our ears  and see what we can work.

Jeremy G3XDK/G4AQG


On 24 Feb 2012, at 19:58, Herb Schoenbohm wrote:

 You guys are a bunch of whinersas an even an hour on 160 at 2300 
 would have been good for openers with a another shot after the contest.  
 Now you have forced by public pressure a possible new country to remain 
 off the band for a later date and wow...isn't that wonderful after a 
 weekend of non-stop contesting many of us will be in excellent shape to 
 spend another night after the contest ends to try and break the EU wall 
 of callers!  Would it not be better to try a least for an hour at our 
 local sunset?  Tropical static and poor conditions could spoil 
 everything after March 5th and you will never know what might have been.
 
 Thank you so much!...The big guns rule on TB in more ways then just 
 having just big signals and huge stations. they can keep a new one 
 off the air because it may not be convenient to their schedule.  I would 
 rather have the big guns up in the phone bands working the contest and 
 the those who know 160 would have avoided the 3C0E frequency or choose 
 to work some CW.
 
 
 Herb Schoenbohm, KV4FZ
 
 On 2/24/2012 3:35 PM, Josep Torres wrote:
 OK, talked to Elmo later to let him know about the ARRL DX SSB Contest and 
 he agreed that operation from 3C0E on 160m will start after the contest, say 
 on march 5th. But let's see how things are..
 No 160 operation expected from 3C6A...
 As TX antenna they have 18m vertical, and beverages for RX..
 
 73,
 
 Josep
 EA6BF
 
 
 
 
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Re: Topband: Propagation on CQWW CW 160M

[jeremy maris]

Propagation was very bad on the Friday/Saturday to the South coast of England - 
only managed 4 W/VE states compared to many more in previous years but 
Saturday/Sunday was much better - and yes we had a great run of NA QSO like you 
did with very strong signals.

The Reverse Beacon Network showed G4AQG at 30dB S/N at a couple of East coast 
skimmers, much stronger than I'm accustomed to!

Keep meaning to download and process the RBN data for the contest to get more 
detailed comparison and trends  re other EU signals 

Jeremy G3XDK/G4AGG


On 3 Feb 2012, at 15:02, F3WT wrote:

 Hello Gents,
 
 As I was still reading comments on that event, let me add that I was hooked 
 that last Sunday morning Jan 29 around SR here in France ( between UTC 6:40 
 to as late as 7:14 when it was full day).
 I live in city house within town, with a small lot.  My ant is a vertical inv 
 U shaped wire of abt 30M, apex up 20M down on the street-side  of my house ,  
 fed against an other wire of my 2nd antenna (a  delta-loop left open with 
 circumference 
 of another 30M, upper corner up 18M, base at abt 10M), situated on the other 
 side of my house ( south). The vertical part radiates towards a large  open 
 street oriented North, NW, fine for North America.
 
 I probably got up too late  that Sunday not assuming good propagation as was 
 the case 24h b4 (Saturday  28, same time to work NA).
 
 Summit showing lots NA stations that morning so I had just time to  rushed 
 up staircase to my shack ...
 .. in time to work in a row ( half an hour):
   KT3Y, NO3M,VE3EJ ( 10dB over if not more), K1LT, K1DG and K3ZM last 
 station heard after falloff  - 
 
 Gee! ...  It made my day and even my participating in that contest.
 
 Was it that spot light propagation?  I never experienced this before!
 
 Glad to still  share this with you.
 
 73.
 Pierre, F3WT
 
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