Re: Topband: [Bulk] Re: Phased short vertical receive antenna system
Appreciate those comments/thought, Tom I was merely stating/replying that I appreciated his concise, "K.I.S.S. sort of encapsulation" of what he did ad works for him. I am totally aware of the "one size doesn't fit all" heuristic and appreciate your "reminder." Tnx, 72 de Jim R. K9JWV > From: w...@w8ji.com > To: topband@contesting.com > Date: Wed, 19 Nov 2014 12:53:53 -0500 > Subject: Re: Topband: [Bulk] Re: Phased short vertical receive antenna system > > > Good info, Grant - the sort of concise "here's what I did that works" info > > needed. > > > > 72, Jim R. K9JWV > > > Jim (and all), > > Almost always, the warnings and guidelines for various systems depend on how > conservative the designer or manual writer is. Things should never be taken > as being "cast in concrete". > > Part of this occurs because "works" is always subjective, what one person is > happy with and thinks he set the world on fire with is never the same as > what someone else is happy with. > > Part of this is because installations have different things in and around > the antenna that might bothering the antenna system. No two systems, unless > they are out in the open over similar earth, act exactly the same. > > This is why some companies sell 1/4 wave verticals, or worse 43 ft > verticals, and promise the world with no radials or minimal radials, and why > other companies might tell customers them need more radials. It isn't that > one antenna system of a similar style is necessarily less critical. The real > reason is often that whoever wrote the instructions or advertising was more > liberal or more conservative in claims or warnings. > > There was a remark a week ago about an antenna system not being supposed to > work with a house in the middle of the array. Whether a house bothered the > array or not actually depended far more on the particular house and what is > inside the house than it does on the array. > > Unless a system is over open clear flat soil of a given type, bad things > might sometimes happen. Since no one ever knows how a location or things in > the location affect an installation, guidelines might wind up too > conservative. Some guidelines can be far too loose. > > I can say this, the DXE stuff is absolutely better...installation being > equal. That doesn't mean it is always noticeable, or that something else > won't work. Being better doesn't mean something else won't work almost the > same, and it doesn't mean it will work the same. It just means better. > > My K3 is far better than my Yaesu stuff for what I do. Doesn't mean I always > notice it, or that someone else might ever notice it, and it doesn't mean > someone else just hates Elecraft and loves the same Yaesu's I have. :) > > 73 Tom > > _ > Topband Reflector Archives - http://www.contesting.com/_topband _ Topband Reflector Archives - http://www.contesting.com/_topband
Re: Topband: [Bulk] Re: Phased short vertical receive antenna system
Good info, Grant - the sort of concise "here's what I did that works" info needed. 72, Jim R. K9JWV Jim (and all), Almost always, the warnings and guidelines for various systems depend on how conservative the designer or manual writer is. Things should never be taken as being "cast in concrete". Part of this occurs because "works" is always subjective, what one person is happy with and thinks he set the world on fire with is never the same as what someone else is happy with. Part of this is because installations have different things in and around the antenna that might bothering the antenna system. No two systems, unless they are out in the open over similar earth, act exactly the same. This is why some companies sell 1/4 wave verticals, or worse 43 ft verticals, and promise the world with no radials or minimal radials, and why other companies might tell customers them need more radials. It isn't that one antenna system of a similar style is necessarily less critical. The real reason is often that whoever wrote the instructions or advertising was more liberal or more conservative in claims or warnings. There was a remark a week ago about an antenna system not being supposed to work with a house in the middle of the array. Whether a house bothered the array or not actually depended far more on the particular house and what is inside the house than it does on the array. Unless a system is over open clear flat soil of a given type, bad things might sometimes happen. Since no one ever knows how a location or things in the location affect an installation, guidelines might wind up too conservative. Some guidelines can be far too loose. I can say this, the DXE stuff is absolutely better...installation being equal. That doesn't mean it is always noticeable, or that something else won't work. Being better doesn't mean something else won't work almost the same, and it doesn't mean it will work the same. It just means better. My K3 is far better than my Yaesu stuff for what I do. Doesn't mean I always notice it, or that someone else might ever notice it, and it doesn't mean someone else just hates Elecraft and loves the same Yaesu's I have. :) 73 Tom _ Topband Reflector Archives - http://www.contesting.com/_topband
Re: Topband: [Bulk] Re: Phased short vertical receive antenna system
Good info, Grant - the sort of concise "here's what I did that works" info needed. 72, Jim R. K9JWV > Date: Wed, 19 Nov 2014 06:18:31 -0800 > From: gran...@pacbell.net > To: rodenkirch_...@msn.com; topband@contesting.com > Subject: Re: Topband: [Bulk] Re: Phased short vertical receive antenna system > > I have the DX Eng 4 sq rcv and am amazed at how directive it is, 70' on > a side, works well for 160 & 80, my Moxon beam is usually better on > 40m. I bought 6' long (5/8, 1/2, 3/8 od) telescopic tubing from DXE > instead of SS whips, cheaper and slightly more gain. I made holders for > the tubing and receive electronics from 3/8 acrylic REMS from TAP > Plastics, attached to the ground rods with u-bolts. I added 3 15' > radials at each ground rod, a little insurance, not sure they are really > needed. > > Grant KZ1W > > > On 11/19/2014 4:08 AM, James Rodenkirch wrote: > > Ok OKthis is what I was remembering (courtesy of a reply from Larry): > > > > Check out http://www.dxengineering.com/parts/dxe-aaps3-1p or page 77 of > > their Autumn/Winter 2014 paper catalog. These receive antennas use 102" > > whips. > > > > I think I'll go for a two element Hi-Z version - I can put up two 17' > > verticals and some 17' radials, spaced 40 to 50 feetwill work better > > than my top-loaded verticalhi hi > > > > Tnx to all for the rapid replies!! m72, Jim R. K9JWV > > > > > > > > From: rodenkirch_...@msn.com > > To: topband@contesting.com > > Subject: Phased short vertical receive antenna system > > Date: Wed, 19 Nov 2014 04:14:12 -0700 > > > > > > > > > > I recall seeing a phased antenna system for the low bands that employed > > short vertical antennasshorter than what is used in the system for sale > > at DX Engineering these days. I am envisioning an advertisement where the > > antennas - 4 to 8 of them depending on how narrow of a pattern you desired > > - looked like whipsperhaps 8 to 10 feet tall > > > > Anyone know about what I have stuck up in my cranium or am I simply "losing > > it"? > > > > 72, Jim Rodenkirch K9JWV > > > > > > _ > > Topband Reflector Archives - http://www.contesting.com/_topband > > > > _ > Topband Reflector Archives - http://www.contesting.com/_topband _ Topband Reflector Archives - http://www.contesting.com/_topband
Re: Topband: [Bulk] Re: Phased short vertical receive antenna system
I have the DX Eng 4 sq rcv and am amazed at how directive it is, 70' on a side, works well for 160 & 80, my Moxon beam is usually better on 40m. I bought 6' long (5/8, 1/2, 3/8 od) telescopic tubing from DXE instead of SS whips, cheaper and slightly more gain. I made holders for the tubing and receive electronics from 3/8 acrylic REMS from TAP Plastics, attached to the ground rods with u-bolts. I added 3 15' radials at each ground rod, a little insurance, not sure they are really needed. Grant KZ1W On 11/19/2014 4:08 AM, James Rodenkirch wrote: Ok OKthis is what I was remembering (courtesy of a reply from Larry): Check out http://www.dxengineering.com/parts/dxe-aaps3-1p or page 77 of their Autumn/Winter 2014 paper catalog. These receive antennas use 102" whips. I think I'll go for a two element Hi-Z version - I can put up two 17' verticals and some 17' radials, spaced 40 to 50 feetwill work better than my top-loaded verticalhi hi Tnx to all for the rapid replies!! m72, Jim R. K9JWV From: rodenkirch_...@msn.com To: topband@contesting.com Subject: Phased short vertical receive antenna system Date: Wed, 19 Nov 2014 04:14:12 -0700 I recall seeing a phased antenna system for the low bands that employed short vertical antennasshorter than what is used in the system for sale at DX Engineering these days. I am envisioning an advertisement where the antennas - 4 to 8 of them depending on how narrow of a pattern you desired - looked like whipsperhaps 8 to 10 feet tall Anyone know about what I have stuck up in my cranium or am I simply "losing it"? 72, Jim Rodenkirch K9JWV _ Topband Reflector Archives - http://www.contesting.com/_topband _ Topband Reflector Archives - http://www.contesting.com/_topband
