[Touch-packages] [Bug 1960727] Re: When apt holds back updates, it fails to inform the user of the reason
For over a decade now, at least, users have continually been puzzled by this silent refusal. Again, in most contexts, that indicates a failure of the interface. Viewed 1.1M times https://askubuntu.com/questions/601/the-following-packages-have-been-kept-back-why-and-how-do-i-solve-it Viewed 62k times https://unix.stackexchange.com/questions/38837/what-does-the-following-packages-have-been-kept-back-mean Viewed 87k times https://superuser.com/questions/1107334/apt-says-packages-have-been-kept-back-what-to-do/1108268 etc. -- You received this bug notification because you are a member of Ubuntu Touch seeded packages, which is subscribed to apt in Ubuntu. https://bugs.launchpad.net/bugs/1960727 Title: When apt holds back updates, it fails to inform the user of the reason Status in apt package in Ubuntu: Opinion Bug description: In the case where apt refuses to install and holds back certain packages, only the following output is produced: root@system:/home/admin# apt upgrade Reading package lists... Done Building dependency tree Reading state information... Done Calculating upgrade... Done The following packages have been kept back: [ List of packages ] 0 upgraded, 0 newly installed, 0 to remove and 24 not upgraded. Missing is any explanation about which package is responsible for apt refusing to perform its job, or even what is the reason for that package being uninstallable. This bug leads users to believe that official Ubuntu packages are routinely misconstructed, corrupt, or otherwise junk. Fix: Instead of apt simply responding "No Dave, I'm Afraid I Can't Do that", correct the output to include the specific package that has a missing or unresolved dependency, so the user a) has confidence that the process works correctly and b) can proceed with fixing the problem. This bug is longstanding, so I don't think version details are required, but they follow anyway: 1) Distributor ID: Ubuntu Description:Ubuntu 20.04.3 LTS Release:20.04 Codename: focal 2) # apt --version apt 2.0.6 (amd64) To manage notifications about this bug go to: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/apt/+bug/1960727/+subscriptions -- Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~touch-packages Post to : touch-packages@lists.launchpad.net Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~touch-packages More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp
[Touch-packages] [Bug 1960727] Re: When apt holds back updates, it fails to inform the user of the reason
Nearly anything would be better than the current state of silent failure. At present, probably many thousands of Ubuntu systems are reporting the following: root@system:/home# apt-get upgrade Reading package lists... Done Building dependency tree Reading state information... Done Calculating upgrade... Done The following packages have been kept back: libnvidia-cfg1-470 libnvidia-compute-470 libnvidia-compute-470:i386 libnvidia-decode-470 libnvidia-decode-470:i386 libnvidia-encode-470 libnvidia-encode-470:i386 libnvidia-extra-470 libnvidia-fbc1-470 libnvidia-fbc1-470:i386 libnvidia-gl-470 libnvidia-gl-470:i386 libnvidia-ifr1-470 libnvidia-ifr1-470:i386 linux-modules-nvidia-470-5.13.0-28-generic linux-modules-nvidia-470-generic-hwe-20.04 linux-objects-nvidia-470-5.13.0-28-generic linux-signatures-nvidia-5.13.0-28-generic nvidia-compute-utils-470 nvidia-driver-470 nvidia-kernel-common-470 nvidia-kernel-source-470 nvidia-utils-470 xserver-xorg-video-nvidia-470 0 upgraded, 0 newly installed, 0 to remove and 24 not upgraded. Providing not even a hint as to which of those packages is uninstallable, or why, would be unacceptable in most development contexts. In this case, with preceding versions of most or all of those packages already installed, it is far from clear to end-users why their system refuses to install official upgrades. Not many software tools respond to user instructions with a simple "No", and that's generally considered bad practice. -- You received this bug notification because you are a member of Ubuntu Touch seeded packages, which is subscribed to apt in Ubuntu. https://bugs.launchpad.net/bugs/1960727 Title: When apt holds back updates, it fails to inform the user of the reason Status in apt package in Ubuntu: Opinion Bug description: In the case where apt refuses to install and holds back certain packages, only the following output is produced: root@system:/home/admin# apt upgrade Reading package lists... Done Building dependency tree Reading state information... Done Calculating upgrade... Done The following packages have been kept back: [ List of packages ] 0 upgraded, 0 newly installed, 0 to remove and 24 not upgraded. Missing is any explanation about which package is responsible for apt refusing to perform its job, or even what is the reason for that package being uninstallable. This bug leads users to believe that official Ubuntu packages are routinely misconstructed, corrupt, or otherwise junk. Fix: Instead of apt simply responding "No Dave, I'm Afraid I Can't Do that", correct the output to include the specific package that has a missing or unresolved dependency, so the user a) has confidence that the process works correctly and b) can proceed with fixing the problem. This bug is longstanding, so I don't think version details are required, but they follow anyway: 1) Distributor ID: Ubuntu Description:Ubuntu 20.04.3 LTS Release:20.04 Codename: focal 2) # apt --version apt 2.0.6 (amd64) To manage notifications about this bug go to: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/apt/+bug/1960727/+subscriptions -- Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~touch-packages Post to : touch-packages@lists.launchpad.net Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~touch-packages More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp
[Touch-packages] [Bug 1960727] Re: When apt holds back updates, it fails to inform the user of the reason
Marking as Opinion as David explained why that is not a thing we can reasonably determine. ** Changed in: apt (Ubuntu) Status: New => Opinion -- You received this bug notification because you are a member of Ubuntu Touch seeded packages, which is subscribed to apt in Ubuntu. https://bugs.launchpad.net/bugs/1960727 Title: When apt holds back updates, it fails to inform the user of the reason Status in apt package in Ubuntu: Opinion Bug description: In the case where apt refuses to install and holds back certain packages, only the following output is produced: root@system:/home/admin# apt upgrade Reading package lists... Done Building dependency tree Reading state information... Done Calculating upgrade... Done The following packages have been kept back: [ List of packages ] 0 upgraded, 0 newly installed, 0 to remove and 24 not upgraded. Missing is any explanation about which package is responsible for apt refusing to perform its job, or even what is the reason for that package being uninstallable. This bug leads users to believe that official Ubuntu packages are routinely misconstructed, corrupt, or otherwise junk. Fix: Instead of apt simply responding "No Dave, I'm Afraid I Can't Do that", correct the output to include the specific package that has a missing or unresolved dependency, so the user a) has confidence that the process works correctly and b) can proceed with fixing the problem. This bug is longstanding, so I don't think version details are required, but they follow anyway: 1) Distributor ID: Ubuntu Description:Ubuntu 20.04.3 LTS Release:20.04 Codename: focal 2) # apt --version apt 2.0.6 (amd64) To manage notifications about this bug go to: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/apt/+bug/1960727/+subscriptions -- Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~touch-packages Post to : touch-packages@lists.launchpad.net Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~touch-packages More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp
[Touch-packages] [Bug 1960727] Re: When apt holds back updates, it fails to inform the user of the reason
Can you provide a complete (preferably real) example of what output you would expect? Honestly, I don't see this working as in the general case the reason is not simple – its at least my experience from staring at debug output for hours to figure such things out in the development branches of a distribution. That is because a package is seldomly held back because it is itself "misconstructed" (and never because its "corrupt, or otherwise junk"), it is usually the state of the universe at large (so to speak) who is at 'fault'. Happy to be proven wrong through. Ideally with a tool who can deduce these things which could be used in apt & elsewhere. Also, but that comes down to user attitude I guess, is that as a user I am trusting the tools I am using. So it justifying all its decisions in detail for me to review feels way too micro-managing to me. -- You received this bug notification because you are a member of Ubuntu Touch seeded packages, which is subscribed to apt in Ubuntu. https://bugs.launchpad.net/bugs/1960727 Title: When apt holds back updates, it fails to inform the user of the reason Status in apt package in Ubuntu: New Bug description: In the case where apt refuses to install and holds back certain packages, only the following output is produced: root@system:/home/admin# apt upgrade Reading package lists... Done Building dependency tree Reading state information... Done Calculating upgrade... Done The following packages have been kept back: [ List of packages ] 0 upgraded, 0 newly installed, 0 to remove and 24 not upgraded. Missing is any explanation about which package is responsible for apt refusing to perform its job, or even what is the reason for that package being uninstallable. This bug leads users to believe that official Ubuntu packages are routinely misconstructed, corrupt, or otherwise junk. Fix: Instead of apt simply responding "No Dave, I'm Afraid I Can't Do that", correct the output to include the specific package that has a missing or unresolved dependency, so the user a) has confidence that the process works correctly and b) can proceed with fixing the problem. This bug is longstanding, so I don't think version details are required, but they follow anyway: 1) Distributor ID: Ubuntu Description:Ubuntu 20.04.3 LTS Release:20.04 Codename: focal 2) # apt --version apt 2.0.6 (amd64) To manage notifications about this bug go to: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/apt/+bug/1960727/+subscriptions -- Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~touch-packages Post to : touch-packages@lists.launchpad.net Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~touch-packages More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp
[Touch-packages] [Bug 1960727] Re: When apt holds back updates, it fails to inform the user of the reason
** Package changed: aptitude (Ubuntu) => apt (Ubuntu) -- You received this bug notification because you are a member of Ubuntu Touch seeded packages, which is subscribed to apt in Ubuntu. https://bugs.launchpad.net/bugs/1960727 Title: When apt holds back updates, it fails to inform the user of the reason Status in apt package in Ubuntu: New Bug description: In the case where apt refuses to install and holds back certain packages, only the following output is produced: root@system:/home/admin# apt upgrade Reading package lists... Done Building dependency tree Reading state information... Done Calculating upgrade... Done The following packages have been kept back: [ List of packages ] 0 upgraded, 0 newly installed, 0 to remove and 24 not upgraded. Missing is any explanation about which package is responsible for apt refusing to perform its job, or even what is the reason for that package being uninstallable. This bug leads users to believe that official Ubuntu packages are routinely misconstructed, corrupt, or otherwise junk. Fix: Instead of apt simply responding "No Dave, I'm Afraid I Can't Do that", correct the output to include the specific package that has a missing or unresolved dependency, so the user a) has confidence that the process works correctly and b) can proceed with fixing the problem. This bug is longstanding, so I don't think version details are required, but they follow anyway: 1) Distributor ID: Ubuntu Description:Ubuntu 20.04.3 LTS Release:20.04 Codename: focal 2) # apt --version apt 2.0.6 (amd64) To manage notifications about this bug go to: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/apt/+bug/1960727/+subscriptions -- Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~touch-packages Post to : touch-packages@lists.launchpad.net Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~touch-packages More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp
