Re: [Trisquel-users] Why does Trisquel take to much time to release a new version?
hallo calher, it is the non-human technocratic newspeak of yours, the expells enthusiatic new GNU/Linux users. You seem not be able to sense the real message of a human being user's concern. Instead you come as a "Naseweis" reciting the old mantra "proprietay " ad aeternum.
Re: [Trisquel-users] Why does Trisquel take to much time to release a new version?
Given that updates take time to process, isn't it possible that important security updates aren't passed through immediately because their code needs to be reviewed? Could this be regarded as a security trade-off for the freedom that Trisquel provides? If so wouldn't a default Debian install using only free sources for apt be more secure? I know these are provocative questions but I'd imagine they would receive provocative answers :)
Re: [Trisquel-users] Why does Trisquel take to much time to release a new version?
> apt install apertium I did not know you can install apertium and assumed apertium sends your text to a server.
Re: [Trisquel-users] Why does Trisquel take to much time to release a new version?
Apertium is cool but is running very low on languages and translation capabilities
Re: [Trisquel-users] Why does Trisquel take to much time to release a new version?
On 12/19/2019 12:03 PM, svh...@gmail.com wrote: > DO you know a free software translator to install > on your computer? One which does not send your > text to a server for translation? apt install apertium <>
Re: [Trisquel-users] Why does Trisquel take to much time to release a new version?
DO you know a free software translator to install on your computer? One which does not send your text to a server for translation?
Re: [Trisquel-users] Why does Trisquel take to much time to release a new version?
> It is unacceptable that updates, especially of important programs like LibreOffice, take endless time and that you can only get the latest versions "by crooked means". OH NO. I have to download the LibreOffice deb files and perform "dpkg -i *.deb". How CROOKED. How ENDLESS.
Re: [Trisquel-users] Why does Trisquel take to much time to release a new version?
Just a (very)quick side note, For Trisquel 9 you'll be able to enable the backports repository to get LibreOffice on the Fresh edition, rather the default Ubuntu's frozen release. Chhers!
Re: [Trisquel-users] Why does Trisquel take to much time to release a new version?
> We have debated this before. How trisquel gets provided has to mean > somewhere in the chain a waste of resources takes place. The adding > and removing of non free software. Yes we have, and I have already explained that Ubuntu does *not* add non-free software to Debian, so there is no "adding and removing" of non-free software, only removing. Ubuntu does some annoying things that inconvenience us, but their modifications to Debian are under free licenses. > What are your comments on this suggestion? Getting a liaison officer > in debian. A person who makes sure that during programming > documentation and scrips are made at the earliest possible stage which > optimizes how to turn debian into free software. Maybe debian wants > money for that work, but if it made the turning debian into free > software part more efficient then it could still payoff. This would be great, but Debian and the FSF would have to be decide to do this. It's not up to me. signature.asc Description: PGP signature
Re: [Trisquel-users] Why does Trisquel take to much time to release a new version?
We have debated this before. How trisquel gets provided has to mean somewhere in the chain a waste of resources takes place. The adding and removing of non free software. What are your comments on this suggestion? Getting a liaison officer in debian. A person who makes sure that during programming documentation and scrips are made at the earliest possible stage which optimizes how to turn debian into free software. Maybe debian wants money for that work, but if it made the turning debian into free software part more efficient then it could still payoff.
Re: [Trisquel-users] Why does Trisquel take to much time to release a new version?
Detlef: > What use is free software to me if I don't get updates for the important main programs? I hear you, and this is a complaint I've made as well. One solution is for Trisquel users to upskill ourselves on how to do backporting of newer versions so we can help, as discussed in the comment thread starting here: https://trisquel.info/en/forum/jami-version-trisquel-8-repos-still-called-ring#comment-144251
Re: [Trisquel-users] Why does Trisquel take to much time to release a new version?
Partly Debian's DFSG is not strict enough and further works are needed to meet FSF's guidelines (as an endorsed distribution). Partly Ubuntu has been actively incorporating non-free software to its distribution, so it's increasingly hard to purify it (to be used as the basis of Trisquel).
Re: [Trisquel-users] Why does Trisquel take to much time to release a new version?
Scripts help tremendously, but removing all proprietary bits requires manual human intervention. It is similar to deblobbing the kernel. <>
Re: [Trisquel-users] Why does Trisquel take to much time to release a new version?
> As far as I know, Trisquel just strips down proprietary software from > an Ubuntu release. > > We should be able to identify and delete all proprietary software just > by running a script. > > Then a new Trisquel version should be published within hours of an > Ubuntu release. > > What am I missing here? Read this,[1] and you will see that FSDG-compliance is not something that can be done with one script. In particular, note this paragraph: "A free system distribution must not steer users towards obtaining any nonfree information for practical use, or encourage them to do so. The system should have no repositories for nonfree software and no specific recipes for installation of particular nonfree programs. Nor should the distribution refer to third-party repositories that are not committed to only including free software; even if they only have free software today, that may not be true tomorrow. Programs in the system should not suggest installing nonfree plugins, documentation, and so on." Ubuntu contains many packages which are free software, but which violate the FSDG in one or more of the ways described in that paragraph. In order to fix this, we need to actually modify the source code of those packages. There can be no one-size-fits all script to fix these packages. Each package needs its own script.[2] We try to write the scripts in such a way that they will often work for future versions of the packages without needing to be modified, but which each Ubuntu release there are inevitably many scripts which need to be updated for the new package versions. If you would like to see the kinds of changes we have had to make for Trisquel 9, browse through the git history here.[3] [1] https://www.gnu.org/distros/free-system-distribution-guidelines.html [2] https://devel.trisquel.info/trisquel/package-helpers/tree/etiona/helpers [3] https://devel.trisquel.info/trisquel/package-helpers/commits/etiona signature.asc Description: PGP signature
Re: [Trisquel-users] Why does Trisquel take to much time to release a new version?
There is now a new column with delay information with respect to base OS in Wikipedia page of Trisquel. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Trisquel
Re: [Trisquel-users] Why does Trisquel take to much time to release a new version?
Disclaimer: I'm not a Trisquel dev but have looked into it somewhat and am planning to contribute soon. First of all, stripping away the proprietary stuff isn't as easy as it may seem. One could, for example, think that Trisquel could just be based on Debian without offering Debian's nonfree and contrib repos. But there are some differences in what the Debian project considers free software and what the FSF considers free, and Trisquel tries to adhere to the FSF. This means there needs to be careful consideration as to which packages are truly free and which aren't (a popular example of this debate is chromium). But Trisquel doesn't just strip away everything proprietary. Some packages may be modified to take specific non-free parts away, instead of having to remove the entire package. Then, Trisquel also has to do rebranding: It has its own icon theme, its logo and name that should replace any occurance of the Ubuntu logo or name, etc. Firefox is also rebranded to Abrowser and some changes are made to it. All this is done with helper scripts (see here: https://devel.trisquel.info/trisquel/package-helpers), which need maintanence since a software package update may break a helper script so it may need to be changed. Finally, Trisquel uses completely different defaults than Ubuntu. Ubuntu 16.04 came with the Unity desktop, Trisquel comes with MATE, but it's still set up very differently than Ubuntu MATE 16.04. I think Trisquel has made very sensible design choices here and this kind of stuff takes some time. And finally, Trisquel has a very small number of contributors, who are doing this for free in their spare time.
[Trisquel-users] Why does Trisquel take to much time to release a new version?
As far as I know, Trisquel just strips down proprietary software from an Ubuntu release. We should be able to identify and delete all proprietary software just by running a script. Then a new Trisquel version should be published within hours of an Ubuntu release. What am I missing here?
