Re: [TV orNotTV] Carol Burnett at damned-near 90

[PGage]

I liked her on Better Call Saul, but if she wins an Emmy and they overlook
Odenkirk and Seehorn again I’m gonna cut somebody.

On Thu, 13 Apr 2023 at 6:50 AM 'Bob Jersey' via TVorNotTV <
tvornottv@googlegroups.com> wrote:

> And she's busy as f***... read all the way to the end...
>
> https://www.hollywoodreporter.com/tv/tv-features/carol-burnett-career-women-comedy-1235371171/
>  (link)
>
>
> B
>
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Re: [TV orNotTV] Max greenlights "Potter" series

[PGage]

I will concede the point that for WBD, JKR is the source of the Franchise
they have, rather than necessarily the Franchise they want. If the future
of these entertainment companies really is tied to IP, I guess you go with
what you can. And Adam is no doubt right that Potter is still popular, it’s
just, I am sure it is only about half as popular as it might otherwise have
been. The first Potter generation are now parents of young children, and a
third to half of them would rather read those kids Mein Kampf than The
Sorcerer’s Stone.

I was initially more moderate on JKR’s anti-Trans rants, and labored with
my daughters to be more tolerant. I don’t think she has gender identity
issues herself, rather, I think she feels herself to have been deeply
traumatized by men, and is terrified that trans women are somehow a kind of
Trojan Horse via which toxic men will intrude into the safe and sacred
spaces women create for themselves. I still think that is what is going on,
but as the cliche goes in my field, hurt people hurt people, and JKR has
doubled down repeatedly on the vitriol, and now is quite as toxic to trans
people, themselves the most vulnerable and abused group in the world, as
men have been to women. I hope she can heal and then repair some of the
damage she has done, but I’m not holding my breath.

I was one who read the first Galbraith book before the code was cracked on
who the author was. I like Cormoran Strike and his associate Robin, and am
halfway through the most recent book on my Kindle. I have also starred, but
not yet watched the streaming versions (I guess that is HBO, or Max, or
whatever, too).

On Thu, 13 Apr 2023 at 9:38 AM M-D November  wrote:

> I'm actually not that shocked that WB-D would go long on JKR, even with
> everything that's come out about her - put bluntly, Warners doesn't have
> the plethora of tentpole properties that Disney or University have.
>
> Or maybe a better way to say that is that they SHOULD, what with the
> entirety of DC comics available to them, but they've mismanaged the IP so
> badly that it's going to take James Gunn years to rebuild it into a
> cohesive brand approaching anything like the MCU. The Matrix has run its
> course. For whatever reason, they seem disinterested in rebuilding the
> animation studio into something that even resembles its former glory, which
> means Bugs, Daffy and their ilk, not to mention the Hanna-Barbara IP, sit
> unused. And LEGO took their ball and went to Universal.  That just leaves
> the back catalog of WB classics, and the Wizarding World. So yeah, they
> don't have much choice but to go all in on Potter.
>
> On Thursday, April 13, 2023 at 10:13:43 AM UTC-4 PGage wrote:
>
>> I don’t know that we have seen someone tank such a valuable brand. It
>> would be as if Tolkien were alive today, and just after the films based on
>> his books made hundreds of millions he started tweeting about how the
>> Holocaust was not really that bad.
>>
>> I’m shocked Warner-Discovery is going long on her. My kids grew up on
>> Potter (like, we had to be at the bookstore at Midnight to buy each book,
>> and they had them finished by the next day), but they will not be reading
>> the books to their kids, and will not be streaming new Potter content.
>>
>> On Thu, 13 Apr 2023 at 6:40 AM 'Bob Jersey' via TVorNotTV <
>> tvor...@googlegroups.com> wrote:
>>
>>> It'll take ten years to tell all the stories from Rowling's books, and
>>> stuff that was in the books but left out of the movies will likely be
>>> included... the budget will be on par with *GoT* and *...Dragon*, WBD
>>> said...
>>>
>>> https://www.hollywoodreporter.com/tv/tv-news/harry-potter-tv-series-officially-happening-at-max-1235371717/
>>>  (link)
>>> Bt there's still the belief that with ten years of *Potter* on
>>> telly, comes more anti-trans b*tchin' from JKR...
>>>
>>> https://www.hollywoodreporter.com/tv/tv-news/harry-potter-tv-series-controversy-jk-rowling-1235372796/
>>>  (link)
>>>
>>> B
>>>
>>>
>>> --
>>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google
>>> Groups "TVorNotTV" group.
>>> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send
>>> an email to tvornottv+...@googlegroups.com.
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>>> https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/tvornottv/10def35f-70ea-4f7e-a50f-718d2e18a562n%40googlegroups.com
>>> 
>>> .
>>>
>> --
>> Sent from Gmail Mobile
>>
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> 

Re: [TV orNotTV] Carol Burnett at damned-near 90

[Tom Wolper]

I read all the way to the end and I have no idea why you said to.

On Thu, Apr 13, 2023 at 9:50 AM 'Bob Jersey' via TVorNotTV <
tvornottv@googlegroups.com> wrote:

> And she's busy as f***... read all the way to the end...
>
> https://www.hollywoodreporter.com/tv/tv-features/carol-burnett-career-women-comedy-1235371171/
>  (link)
>
>
> B
>
> --
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> 
> .
>

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Re: [TV orNotTV] Max greenlights "Potter" series

[M-D November]

I'm actually not that shocked that WB-D would go long on JKR, even with 
everything that's come out about her - put bluntly, Warners doesn't have 
the plethora of tentpole properties that Disney or University have.  

Or maybe a better way to say that is that they SHOULD, what with the 
entirety of DC comics available to them, but they've mismanaged the IP so 
badly that it's going to take James Gunn years to rebuild it into a 
cohesive brand approaching anything like the MCU. The Matrix has run its 
course. For whatever reason, they seem disinterested in rebuilding the 
animation studio into something that even resembles its former glory, which 
means Bugs, Daffy and their ilk, not to mention the Hanna-Barbara IP, sit 
unused. And LEGO took their ball and went to Universal.  That just leaves 
the back catalog of WB classics, and the Wizarding World. So yeah, they 
don't have much choice but to go all in on Potter.

On Thursday, April 13, 2023 at 10:13:43 AM UTC-4 PGage wrote:

> I don’t know that we have seen someone tank such a valuable brand. It 
> would be as if Tolkien were alive today, and just after the films based on 
> his books made hundreds of millions he started tweeting about how the 
> Holocaust was not really that bad.
>
> I’m shocked Warner-Discovery is going long on her. My kids grew up on 
> Potter (like, we had to be at the bookstore at Midnight to buy each book, 
> and they had them finished by the next day), but they will not be reading 
> the books to their kids, and will not be streaming new Potter content.
>
> On Thu, 13 Apr 2023 at 6:40 AM 'Bob Jersey' via TVorNotTV <
> tvor...@googlegroups.com> wrote:
>
>> It'll take ten years to tell all the stories from Rowling's books, and 
>> stuff that was in the books but left out of the movies will likely be 
>> included... the budget will be on par with *GoT* and *...Dragon*, WBD 
>> said... 
>>
>> https://www.hollywoodreporter.com/tv/tv-news/harry-potter-tv-series-officially-happening-at-max-1235371717/
>>  (link)
>> Bt there's still the belief that with ten years of *Potter* on 
>> telly, comes more anti-trans b*tchin' from JKR...
>>
>> https://www.hollywoodreporter.com/tv/tv-news/harry-potter-tv-series-controversy-jk-rowling-1235372796/
>>  (link)
>>
>> B
>>
>>
>> -- 
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>> "TVorNotTV" group.
>> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an 
>> email to tvornottv+...@googlegroups.com.
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>> https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/tvornottv/10def35f-70ea-4f7e-a50f-718d2e18a562n%40googlegroups.com
>>  
>> 
>> .
>>
> -- 
> Sent from Gmail Mobile
>

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Re: [TV orNotTV] Max greenlights "Potter" series

[Adam Bowie]

On Thu, Apr 13, 2023 at 4:53 PM Kevin M.  wrote:

>
>
> On Thu, Apr 13, 2023 at 8:08 AM Adam Bowie  wrote:
>
>> I'm pretty sure that JK Rowling used "JK" rather than "Joanne" simply
>> because her publisher thought it was expedient for sales. Boys aren't (or
>> weren't) as likely to buy a fantasy book written by a female as written by
>> a male. I'm sure that as a largely unpublished author, she relied heavily
>> on her publisher's advice on this.
>>
>> As for Robert Galbraith - I think that was simply a nomme de plume
>> allowing her to write something different. At the time, she would have
>> probably earned a much bigger advance and initial sales if she had
>> published under her own name. She did originally try to keep her
>> identity secret, so this was almost certainly to throw others off the case.
>>
>
> Both very plausible scenarios, but the fact remains she’s had two
> professional opportunities to present herself as a woman and for whatever
> reason(s) chose instead to be thought of as a man. And now she is perhaps
> the most outspoken critic of others who present themselves with genders
> different from the ones they were born with. She decries allowing
> transgendered people the right to do what they want as she believes they
> aren’t who they claim to be, yet her entire career is based on doing
> exactly that. Even granting the misogyny of the publishing industry, there
> is an obvious double-standard to her criticism. I cannot help but suggest
> that Rowling is not comfortable in her own skin, and just as so many
> outwardly homophobic conservatives turn out to be masking their own gay
> feelings, Rowling might be overcompensating.
>

I'm not sure that "JK Rowling" was ever presented as a male author simply
by virtue of the book using initials rather than a gendered first name. If
a reader made that deduction on their own part, I think it says more about
them than the author. But if an author chooses to use initials rather than
their given firstname, then that's entirely up to them. I'd also note that
early reviews of the first title clearly referenced that the author was
female. It wasn't exactly a secret.

Authors choose to use different names for lots of reasons. I don't suppose
Stephen King was suffering from some kind of multiple personality disorder
when he chose to publish some books under the name Richard Bachman. And I'm
not sure that either CS Lewis or JRR Tolkien were trying to hide their
genders when they were published. But horses for courses.

Look - any mention of Rowling and her views, or indeed discussions of
gender identities on the internet tends to end up degenerating into
unpleasantness, and I'm not going to follow that path. I'm also not going
to either defend or attack someone I don't know on the basis of a lot of
internet vitriol (Honestly, the gender "debate" is actually probably worse
on this side of the Atlantic than in the US).



Adam

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Re: [TV orNotTV] Max greenlights "Potter" series

[Kevin M.]

On Thu, Apr 13, 2023 at 8:08 AM Adam Bowie  wrote:

> I'm pretty sure that JK Rowling used "JK" rather than "Joanne" simply
> because her publisher thought it was expedient for sales. Boys aren't (or
> weren't) as likely to buy a fantasy book written by a female as written by
> a male. I'm sure that as a largely unpublished author, she relied heavily
> on her publisher's advice on this.
>
> As for Robert Galbraith - I think that was simply a nomme de plume
> allowing her to write something different. At the time, she would have
> probably earned a much bigger advance and initial sales if she had
> published under her own name. She did originally try to keep her
> identity secret, so this was almost certainly to throw others off the case.
>

Both very plausible scenarios, but the fact remains she’s had two
professional opportunities to present herself as a woman and for whatever
reason(s) chose instead to be thought of as a man. And now she is perhaps
the most outspoken critic of others who present themselves with genders
different from the ones they were born with. She decries allowing
transgendered people the right to do what they want as she believes they
aren’t who they claim to be, yet her entire career is based on doing
exactly that. Even granting the misogyny of the publishing industry, there
is an obvious double-standard to her criticism. I cannot help but suggest
that Rowling is not comfortable in her own skin, and just as so many
outwardly homophobic conservatives turn out to be masking their own gay
feelings, Rowling might be overcompensating.

For the record, I genuinely don’t care what people call themselves or how
they dress or what sports they want to participate in (especially that last
one, because games don’t matter). I neither celebrate it nor condemn it; I
genuinely don’t care. I worked in retail for years, so I long ago got out
of the habit of using pronouns when addressing people I don’t know (yep,
made that mistake one too many times). As a middle school teacher I have
pointed out to my classes that our founding fathers wore wigs, high heels,
tights, and makeup and they carried purses, and yet we as a nation still
celebrate their achievements. Societal norms change, and they’ll keep
changing until either society breaks down or the planet explodes.

As for Harry Potter being remade, this week I was reading a book of essays,
and one of the essays warned the motion picture studios that they needed to
stop trying to remake films or it will hasten the end of cinema as we know
it. The essay was written over 50 years ago by Harlan Ellison, so what I am
forced to conclude  is that remakes and reboots are the norm… original
concepts are now the aberration. Remakes have been ingrained into the
industry longer than I’ve been alive and will continue until either society
breaks down or the planet explodes.



> (As a crime novel fan, I notice a significant number of female writers
> "disguise" their gender despite the fact that more crime fiction *readers*
> are female than male).
>
> I have no real view on the sensibility of Warner Bros Discovery investing
> a lot in a reboot of Harry Potter. As someone who read the first book, and
> saw the first film, but never went beyond them, I have no skin in this
> game. But I wouldn't underestimate the continued popularity of the
> characters regardless of what Rowling has said and done since. From what I
> can tell, the studio tour just outside London continues to sell well, the
> musical in London is pretty solidly sold out, the queues at King's Cross
> Station for photos of platform 13.5 are always busy and Universal seems to
> be continuing to roll out Potter-related theme park experiences.
>
> I suspect that the books still sell pretty strongly too.
>
> While it feels a bit soon to reboot a series entirely in this way, how
> many Batman or Spiderman reboots have there been in the last 20 or so
> years? (See also Dracula, Tarzan and any number of other fictional
> characters over the history of film and television)
>
> I'd guess that WBD is taking all of that into account before greenlighting
> a new series. And I'm sure they'll bail if it doesn't work.
>
>
>
> Adam.
>
> On Thu, Apr 13, 2023 at 3:27 PM Kevin M.  wrote:
>
>> Amidst all the discussion about Rowling and her opposition to people
>> claiming different genders, rarely has it been brought up that using the
>> initials JK is a traditional author technique of misleading potential
>> readers into believing the female author is a male, and that when she
>> penned a mystery novel under a pseudonym about a decade ago, she chose to
>> call herself Robert. I know that gender is an inflammatory issue for many
>> and Rowling has been a fuse that ignites that flame, but in all Rowling’s
>> rhetoric, I cannot help but think she might have some identity issues of
>> her own to sort out… that her issues related to gender have more to do with
>> who she is than who others are.
>>
>> Regardless, the last th

Re: [TV orNotTV] Max greenlights "Potter" series

[Adam Bowie]

I'm pretty sure that JK Rowling used "JK" rather than "Joanne" simply
because her publisher thought it was expedient for sales. Boys aren't (or
weren't) as likely to buy a fantasy book written by a female as written by
a male. I'm sure that as a largely unpublished author, she relied heavily
on her publisher's advice on this.

As for Robert Galbraith - I think that was simply a nomme de plume allowing
her to write something different. At the time, she would have probably
earned a much bigger advance and initial sales if she had published under
her own name. She did originally try to keep her identity secret, so this
was almost certainly to throw others off the case.

(As a crime novel fan, I notice a significant number of female writers
"disguise" their gender despite the fact that more crime fiction *readers*
are female than male).

I have no real view on the sensibility of Warner Bros Discovery investing a
lot in a reboot of Harry Potter. As someone who read the first book, and
saw the first film, but never went beyond them, I have no skin in this
game. But I wouldn't underestimate the continued popularity of the
characters regardless of what Rowling has said and done since. From what I
can tell, the studio tour just outside London continues to sell well, the
musical in London is pretty solidly sold out, the queues at King's Cross
Station for photos of platform 13.5 are always busy and Universal seems to
be continuing to roll out Potter-related theme park experiences.

I suspect that the books still sell pretty strongly too.

While it feels a bit soon to reboot a series entirely in this way, how many
Batman or Spiderman reboots have there been in the last 20 or so years?
(See also Dracula, Tarzan and any number of other fictional characters over
the history of film and television)

I'd guess that WBD is taking all of that into account before greenlighting
a new series. And I'm sure they'll bail if it doesn't work.



Adam.

On Thu, Apr 13, 2023 at 3:27 PM Kevin M.  wrote:

> Amidst all the discussion about Rowling and her opposition to people
> claiming different genders, rarely has it been brought up that using the
> initials JK is a traditional author technique of misleading potential
> readers into believing the female author is a male, and that when she
> penned a mystery novel under a pseudonym about a decade ago, she chose to
> call herself Robert. I know that gender is an inflammatory issue for many
> and Rowling has been a fuse that ignites that flame, but in all Rowling’s
> rhetoric, I cannot help but think she might have some identity issues of
> her own to sort out… that her issues related to gender have more to do with
> who she is than who others are.
>
> Regardless, the last thing Harry Potter needed was MORE details from the
> books. The movies were already too long. The secret to making me watch more
> Harry Potter is to cut out the ephemera and tell a clear, interesting,
> concise story. Preferably a story that doesn’t involve either children or
> wizards.
>
> On Thu, Apr 13, 2023 at 6:40 AM 'Bob Jersey' via TVorNotTV <
> tvornottv@googlegroups.com> wrote:
>
>> It'll take ten years to tell all the stories from Rowling's books, and
>> stuff that was in the books but left out of the movies will likely be
>> included... the budget will be on par with *GoT* and *...Dragon*, WBD
>> said...
>>
>> https://www.hollywoodreporter.com/tv/tv-news/harry-potter-tv-series-officially-happening-at-max-1235371717/
>>  (link)
>> Bt there's still the belief that with ten years of *Potter* on
>> telly, comes more anti-trans b*tchin' from JKR...
>>
>> https://www.hollywoodreporter.com/tv/tv-news/harry-potter-tv-series-controversy-jk-rowling-1235372796/
>>  (link)
>>
>> B
>>
>>
>> --
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>> email to tvornottv+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com.
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>> https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/tvornottv/10def35f-70ea-4f7e-a50f-718d2e18a562n%40googlegroups.com
>> 
>> .
>>
> --
> Kevin M. (RPCV)
>
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> 
> .
>

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Re: [TV orNotTV] Max greenlights "Potter" series

[Kevin M.]

Amidst all the discussion about Rowling and her opposition to people
claiming different genders, rarely has it been brought up that using the
initials JK is a traditional author technique of misleading potential
readers into believing the female author is a male, and that when she
penned a mystery novel under a pseudonym about a decade ago, she chose to
call herself Robert. I know that gender is an inflammatory issue for many
and Rowling has been a fuse that ignites that flame, but in all Rowling’s
rhetoric, I cannot help but think she might have some identity issues of
her own to sort out… that her issues related to gender have more to do with
who she is than who others are.

Regardless, the last thing Harry Potter needed was MORE details from the
books. The movies were already too long. The secret to making me watch more
Harry Potter is to cut out the ephemera and tell a clear, interesting,
concise story. Preferably a story that doesn’t involve either children or
wizards.

On Thu, Apr 13, 2023 at 6:40 AM 'Bob Jersey' via TVorNotTV <
tvornottv@googlegroups.com> wrote:

> It'll take ten years to tell all the stories from Rowling's books, and
> stuff that was in the books but left out of the movies will likely be
> included... the budget will be on par with *GoT* and *...Dragon*, WBD
> said...
>
> https://www.hollywoodreporter.com/tv/tv-news/harry-potter-tv-series-officially-happening-at-max-1235371717/
>  (link)
> Bt there's still the belief that with ten years of *Potter* on telly,
> comes more anti-trans b*tchin' from JKR...
>
> https://www.hollywoodreporter.com/tv/tv-news/harry-potter-tv-series-controversy-jk-rowling-1235372796/
>  (link)
>
> B
>
>
> --
> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups
> "TVorNotTV" group.
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> 
> .
>
-- 
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Re: [TV orNotTV] Max greenlights "Potter" series

[PGage]

I don’t know that we have seen someone tank such a valuable brand. It would
be as if Tolkien were alive today, and just after the films based on his
books made hundreds of millions he started tweeting about how the Holocaust
was not really that bad.

I’m shocked Warner-Discovery is going long on her. My kids grew up on
Potter (like, we had to be at the bookstore at Midnight to buy each book,
and they had them finished by the next day), but they will not be reading
the books to their kids, and will not be streaming new Potter content.

On Thu, 13 Apr 2023 at 6:40 AM 'Bob Jersey' via TVorNotTV <
tvornottv@googlegroups.com> wrote:

> It'll take ten years to tell all the stories from Rowling's books, and
> stuff that was in the books but left out of the movies will likely be
> included... the budget will be on par with *GoT* and *...Dragon*, WBD
> said...
>
> https://www.hollywoodreporter.com/tv/tv-news/harry-potter-tv-series-officially-happening-at-max-1235371717/
>  (link)
> Bt there's still the belief that with ten years of *Potter* on telly,
> comes more anti-trans b*tchin' from JKR...
>
> https://www.hollywoodreporter.com/tv/tv-news/harry-potter-tv-series-controversy-jk-rowling-1235372796/
>  (link)
>
> B
>
>
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> "TVorNotTV" group.
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> 
> .
>
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[TV orNotTV] New "Big Bang" to Max

['Bob Jersey' via TVorNotTV]

https://www.hollywoodreporter.com/tv/tv-news/new-big-bang-theory-series-in-the-works-at-max-1235372259/
 (link)

B

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[TV orNotTV] Bill Shatner to feature in "Stars on Mars"

['Bob Jersey' via TVorNotTV]

Headed for Fox from a Fremantle division, the celebrity competition plays 
out in a space-station environment designed to resemble conditions on the 
Red Planet... the "Trek" legend will be at "Mission Control," outside said 
environment apparently... débuts June 5th.
https://www.hollywoodreporter.com/tv/tv-news/william-shatner-fox-stars-on-mars-celebrity-reality-show-1235373067/
 (link)

B

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[TV orNotTV] Carol Burnett at damned-near 90

['Bob Jersey' via TVorNotTV]

And she's busy as f***... read all the way to the end...
https://www.hollywoodreporter.com/tv/tv-features/carol-burnett-career-women-comedy-1235371171/
 (link)

B

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[TV orNotTV] Max greenlights "Potter" series

['Bob Jersey' via TVorNotTV]

It'll take ten years to tell all the stories from Rowling's books, and 
stuff that was in the books but left out of the movies will likely be 
included... the budget will be on par with *GoT* and *...Dragon*, WBD 
said... 
https://www.hollywoodreporter.com/tv/tv-news/harry-potter-tv-series-officially-happening-at-max-1235371717/
 (link)
Bt there's still the belief that with ten years of *Potter* on telly, 
comes more anti-trans b*tchin' from JKR...
https://www.hollywoodreporter.com/tv/tv-news/harry-potter-tv-series-controversy-jk-rowling-1235372796/
 (link)

B


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