[Bug 318625] Re: Rhythmbox shouldn't set illegal / special characters on filenames (i.e. ?; question mark) when ripping to NTFS volumes
*** This bug is a duplicate of bug 230906 *** https://bugs.launchpad.net/bugs/230906 As a hint to others who stumble across this bug: this same problem comes up on CIFS shares. The work around there is to mount the share with the mapchars,iocharset=utf8 options. -- You received this bug notification because you are a member of Ubuntu Bugs, which is subscribed to Ubuntu. https://bugs.launchpad.net/bugs/318625 Title: Rhythmbox shouldn't set illegal / special characters on filenames (i.e. ?; question mark) when ripping to NTFS volumes To manage notifications about this bug go to: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/rhythmbox/+bug/318625/+subscriptions -- ubuntu-bugs mailing list ubuntu-bugs@lists.ubuntu.com https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-bugs
[Bug 318625] Re: Rhythmbox shouldn't set illegal / special characters on filenames (i.e. ?; question mark) when ripping to NTFS volumes
Some good news on this bug. I put up a comment on the NTFS-3G forums and got a very positive reply from Jean-Pierre, one of the lead programmers for NTFS-3G; I asked... - Could you please include a switch in NTFS-3G to allow a workaround for this Windows limitation? (i.e. to turn off use of special characters in order to allow compatibility with Windows for the many users who wouldn't have a clue how to re-mount/export their NTFS filesystems using Samba) - And Jean-Pierre replied... - This is available in the release candidate advanced ntfs-3g-2010.5.16AR.1, see http://pagesperso-orange.fr/b.andre/advanced-ntfs-3g.html The option to use is windows_names, documented in the manual of the said version. - Hopefully this will help a lot in this area, but it would need to be integrated into Ubuntu by someone cleverer than me... This can be found on the Tuxera site - http://tuxera.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=2t=763p=14549sid=053f5d02fb19e22aeda1019f6225c76d#p14549 -- Rhythmbox shouldn't set illegal / special characters on filenames (i.e. ?; question mark) when ripping to NTFS volumes https://bugs.launchpad.net/bugs/318625 You received this bug notification because you are a member of Ubuntu Bugs, which is subscribed to Ubuntu. -- ubuntu-bugs mailing list ubuntu-bugs@lists.ubuntu.com https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-bugs
[Bug 318625] Re: Rhythmbox shouldn't set illegal / special characters on filenames (i.e. ?; question mark) when ripping to NTFS volumes
BTW, this issue is possibly a duplicate of another Ubuntu bug. I have also commented about this development there. https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+bug/230906 And also in the Ubuntu forums here; http://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?p=9424314 -- Rhythmbox shouldn't set illegal / special characters on filenames (i.e. ?; question mark) when ripping to NTFS volumes https://bugs.launchpad.net/bugs/318625 You received this bug notification because you are a member of Ubuntu Bugs, which is subscribed to Ubuntu. -- ubuntu-bugs mailing list ubuntu-bugs@lists.ubuntu.com https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-bugs
[Bug 318625] Re: Rhythmbox shouldn't set illegal / special characters on filenames (i.e. ?; question mark) when ripping to NTFS volumes
*** This bug is a duplicate of bug 230906 *** https://bugs.launchpad.net/bugs/230906 I'll make it a duplicate as the other bug is more precise to the point of the overall NTFS-3G problem, whereas this is too specifically about Rhythmbox and the problem clearly lies outside of Rhythmbox. ** This bug has been marked a duplicate of bug 230906 Using special characters in filenames prevents Windows from opening -- Rhythmbox shouldn't set illegal / special characters on filenames (i.e. ?; question mark) when ripping to NTFS volumes https://bugs.launchpad.net/bugs/318625 You received this bug notification because you are a member of Ubuntu Bugs, which is subscribed to Ubuntu. -- ubuntu-bugs mailing list ubuntu-bugs@lists.ubuntu.com https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-bugs
[Bug 318625] Re: Rhythmbox shouldn't set illegal / special characters on filenames (i.e. ?; question mark) when ripping to NTFS volumes
A follow-up on my last comment. Please note that Wine has a bug-for-bug policy when it comes to working with the windows API. See http://wiki.winehq.org/WineFeatures In other words, if the actual implementation disagrees with the documentation, then the implementation wins. There is a lot of sense to this policy, as the end goal is full interoperability, or Binary Compatibility as mentioned on the page I have referenced. This should be the same with the NTFS-3G driver. If the NTFS documentation says full POSIX namespace support, but the NTFS implementation differs, the implementation should win. In our case, there are characters that are legal in the documentation, even if it is not Microsoft's documentation, but every known official implementation of NTFS does not allow full POSIX namespace support. For the sake of full interoperability, this bug should not be fixed in individual apps, but in the NTFS-3G code, just like similar issues are dealt with on a bug-for-bug basis in the Wine code. -- Rhythmbox shouldn't set illegal / special characters on filenames (i.e. ?; question mark) when ripping to NTFS volumes https://bugs.launchpad.net/bugs/318625 You received this bug notification because you are a member of Ubuntu Bugs, which is subscribed to Ubuntu. -- ubuntu-bugs mailing list ubuntu-bugs@lists.ubuntu.com https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-bugs
[Bug 318625] Re: Rhythmbox shouldn't set illegal / special characters on filenames (i.e. ?; question mark) when ripping to NTFS volumes
Isn't the whole idea of NTFS-3G to allow proper and full compatibility with the *Windows* implementation of NTFS? Isn't it to allow true interoperability? Thus, given that Windows considers certain characters to be illegal should mean that they are treated as illegal for NTFS drivers on other platforms, purely based on the premise that it is about full interoperability. Yes, the fact that Windows doesn't like certain characters in its implementation of NTFS is likely an aberration from the POSIX namespace guidelines, but then it is the *reference implementation*. Additionally, consider that there are many exceptions to rules within the Win32 API. The WINE project is constantly working around exceptions that are undocumented and/or that go against existing documentation on aspects of the API. Making workarounds in every little app is redundant and counter productive when it could and, in my view, should be solved by making this simple change in NTFS-3G. -- Rhythmbox shouldn't set illegal / special characters on filenames (i.e. ?; question mark) when ripping to NTFS volumes https://bugs.launchpad.net/bugs/318625 You received this bug notification because you are a member of Ubuntu Bugs, which is subscribed to Ubuntu. -- ubuntu-bugs mailing list ubuntu-bugs@lists.ubuntu.com https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-bugs
[Bug 318625] Re: Rhythmbox shouldn't set illegal / special characters on filenames (i.e. ?; question mark) when ripping to NTFS volumes
I'm tempted to email this bug report to the NTFS-3G developer and possibly see some action on it. It's obviously not a major bug but it's been like this about 2 years now (probably longer) and when it comes to dealing with it inside a Windows OS it's a serious problem. The files are essentially dead. No deletion, renaming, copying or moving is possible. -- Rhythmbox shouldn't set illegal / special characters on filenames (i.e. ?; question mark) when ripping to NTFS volumes https://bugs.launchpad.net/bugs/318625 You received this bug notification because you are a member of Ubuntu Bugs, which is subscribed to Ubuntu. -- ubuntu-bugs mailing list ubuntu-bugs@lists.ubuntu.com https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-bugs
[Bug 318625] Re: Rhythmbox shouldn't set illegal / special characters on filenames (i.e. ?; question mark) when ripping to NTFS volumes
I can still confirm this bug. I have installed Karmic 9.10 64-bit, updated fully (Rhythmbox is 0.12.5) and it still creates ? in a song name. Another test was just to create files on the NTFS partition with ? question marks and : colon's in the name using Nautilus and nano on the terminal. I can do this without problem, even though a Window's system would not be able to manipulate them in an any way. -- Rhythmbox shouldn't set illegal / special characters on filenames (i.e. ?; question mark) when ripping to NTFS volumes https://bugs.launchpad.net/bugs/318625 You received this bug notification because you are a member of Ubuntu Bugs, which is subscribed to Ubuntu. -- ubuntu-bugs mailing list ubuntu-bugs@lists.ubuntu.com https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-bugs
[Bug 318625] Re: Rhythmbox shouldn't set illegal / special characters on filenames (i.e. ?; question mark) when ripping to NTFS volumes
Obviously this is only a big deal if you're dual booting with another Windows system, but at the same time you wouldn't necessarily create an NTFS filesystem on a Linux only box (you would more than likely do a /home of ext3 or 4, or just a large ext3 or 4 partition). So the fact is that this problem will occur mainly with people who are also sharing there NTFS partition with a Windows system. -- Rhythmbox shouldn't set illegal / special characters on filenames (i.e. ?; question mark) when ripping to NTFS volumes https://bugs.launchpad.net/bugs/318625 You received this bug notification because you are a member of Ubuntu Bugs, which is subscribed to Ubuntu. -- ubuntu-bugs mailing list ubuntu-bugs@lists.ubuntu.com https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-bugs
[Bug 318625] Re: Rhythmbox shouldn't set illegal / special characters on filenames (i.e. ?; question mark) when ripping to NTFS volumes
I'm not convinced that Rhythmbox should be special-casing certain filesystems here. It seems like the wrong place to do it. Shall we also add special cases for FAT/NTFS filesystems in Totem, gedit, nautilus, f-spot, GIMP, banshee, pitivi, openoffice etc? -- Rhythmbox shouldn't set illegal / special characters on filenames (i.e. ?; question mark) when ripping to NTFS volumes https://bugs.launchpad.net/bugs/318625 You received this bug notification because you are a member of Ubuntu Bugs, which is subscribed to Ubuntu. -- ubuntu-bugs mailing list ubuntu-bugs@lists.ubuntu.com https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-bugs
[Bug 318625] Re: Rhythmbox shouldn't set illegal / special characters on filenames (i.e. ?; question mark) when ripping to NTFS volumes
I'm not confident enough to propose elaborate solutions to these problems, especially at the technical end of things. I do agree that Rhythmbox isn't the problem here, although one of the simplest solutions would be to make it simple to enable special character stripping. The problem is in the NTFS-3G driver, I think. It shouldn't impose full POSIX compatibility on a filesystem that is associated with an OS that isn't POSIX compliant. The developer suggests it's needed for full flexibility and interoperability: From: http://www.tuxera.com/community/ntfs-3g-faq/#posixfilenames2 NTFS supports several filename namespaces at the same time: DOS, Win32 and POSIX. While the NTFS-3G driver handles all of them, it always creates new files in the POSIX namespace for maximum portability and interoperability reasons. This means that filenames are case sensitive and all characters are allowed except ‘/’ and ”. This is perfectly legal on Windows, though some application may get confused. If you find so then please report it to the developer of the relevant Windows software. His first suggestion that it's for maximum portability and interoperability reasons is instantly quashed by the fact that the files are unusable and completely incompatible within Windows. You'll notice he says towards the end This is perfectly legal on Windows, though some applications may get confused... please report it to the developer Windows Explorer is the first thing that get's confused and the command prompt can't manipulate it either, not just some Windows application, the Windows system. I have not tested compatibility right through Vista and 7, but it's definitely apparent in XP and I assume those two as well. The NTFS-3G driver has got to prevent the use of special characters in the same way that Nautilus prevents forward slashes being used on ext4 partitions. The way I see it is, preventing the characters is a much safer option than allowing. -- Rhythmbox shouldn't set illegal / special characters on filenames (i.e. ?; question mark) when ripping to NTFS volumes https://bugs.launchpad.net/bugs/318625 You received this bug notification because you are a member of Ubuntu Bugs, which is subscribed to Ubuntu. -- ubuntu-bugs mailing list ubuntu-bugs@lists.ubuntu.com https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-bugs
[Bug 318625] Re: Rhythmbox shouldn't set illegal / special characters on filenames (i.e. ?; question mark) when ripping to NTFS volumes
Sorry about the delay on this, I've been having a few other issues with Karmic and have been mostly using Windows 7 for the time being, but I'm going for a fresh install of Karmic 9.10 64-bit tonight and I'll add a large NTFS partition to the drive as well, test out this problem. -- Rhythmbox shouldn't set illegal / special characters on filenames (i.e. ?; question mark) when ripping to NTFS volumes https://bugs.launchpad.net/bugs/318625 You received this bug notification because you are a member of Ubuntu Bugs, which is subscribed to Ubuntu. -- ubuntu-bugs mailing list ubuntu-bugs@lists.ubuntu.com https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-bugs
[Bug 318625] Re: Rhythmbox shouldn't set illegal / special characters on filenames (i.e. ?; question mark) when ripping to NTFS volumes
No problem, I'll try and replicate on Ubuntu 9.10 64-bit soon. -- Rhythmbox shouldn't set illegal / special characters on filenames (i.e. ?; question mark) when ripping to NTFS volumes https://bugs.launchpad.net/bugs/318625 You received this bug notification because you are a member of Ubuntu Bugs, which is subscribed to Ubuntu. -- ubuntu-bugs mailing list ubuntu-bugs@lists.ubuntu.com https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-bugs
[Bug 318625] Re: Rhythmbox shouldn't set illegal / special characters on filenames (i.e. ?; question mark) when ripping to NTFS volumes
Thank you for taking the time to report this bug and helping to make Ubuntu better. We are sorry that we do not always have the capacity to look at all reported bugs in a timely manner. There have been many changes in Ubuntu since that time you reported the bug and your problem may have been fixed with some of the updates. If you could test the current Ubuntu development version, this would help us a lot. If you can test it, and it is still an issue, we would appreciate if you could upload updated logs by running apport-collect 318625, and any other logs that are relevant for this particular issue. ** Changed in: rhythmbox (Ubuntu) Status: New = Incomplete -- Rhythmbox shouldn't set illegal / special characters on filenames (i.e. ?; question mark) when ripping to NTFS volumes https://bugs.launchpad.net/bugs/318625 You received this bug notification because you are a member of Ubuntu Bugs, which is subscribed to Ubuntu. -- ubuntu-bugs mailing list ubuntu-bugs@lists.ubuntu.com https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-bugs
[Bug 318625] Re: Rhythmbox shouldn't set illegal / special characters on filenames (i.e. ?; question mark) when ripping to NTFS volumes
Thanks for your report, that's something to send directly upstream at http://bugzilla.gnome.org , for forwarding instructions please read http://wiki.ubuntu.com/Bugs/Upstream/GNOME, Thanks in advance. ** Changed in: rhythmbox (Ubuntu) Importance: Undecided = Low ** Changed in: rhythmbox (Ubuntu) Assignee: (unassigned) = Ubuntu Desktop Bugs (desktop-bugs) -- Rhythmbox shouldn't set illegal / special characters on filenames (i.e. ?; question mark) when ripping to NTFS volumes https://bugs.launchpad.net/bugs/318625 You received this bug notification because you are a member of Ubuntu Bugs, which is subscribed to Ubuntu. -- ubuntu-bugs mailing list ubuntu-bugs@lists.ubuntu.com https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-bugs
[Bug 318625] Re: Rhythmbox shouldn't set illegal / special characters on filenames (i.e. ?; question mark) when ripping to NTFS volumes
The fact is ? shouldn't be a legal character as it can't be used within Explorer or Command Prompt in Windows (XP anyway). The following characters are illegal in Windows (under XP at least), see the screenshot too: \ / : * ?| -- Rhythmbox shouldn't set illegal / special characters on filenames (i.e. ?; question mark) when ripping to NTFS volumes https://bugs.launchpad.net/bugs/318625 You received this bug notification because you are a member of Ubuntu Bugs, which is subscribed to Ubuntu. -- ubuntu-bugs mailing list ubuntu-bugs@lists.ubuntu.com https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-bugs
[Bug 318625] Re: Rhythmbox shouldn't set illegal / special characters on filenames (i.e. ?; question mark) when ripping to NTFS volumes
** Attachment added: Screenshot of a information bubble / pop up letting a user know about illegal characters that can't be used http://launchpadlibrarian.net/30458715/XP-illegal-characters.png -- Rhythmbox shouldn't set illegal / special characters on filenames (i.e. ?; question mark) when ripping to NTFS volumes https://bugs.launchpad.net/bugs/318625 You received this bug notification because you are a member of Ubuntu Bugs, which is subscribed to Ubuntu. -- ubuntu-bugs mailing list ubuntu-bugs@lists.ubuntu.com https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-bugs
[Bug 318625] Re: Rhythmbox shouldn't set illegal / special characters on filenames (i.e. ?; question mark) when ripping to NTFS volumes
** Package changed: ntfs-3g (Ubuntu) = rhythmbox (Ubuntu) -- Rhythmbox shouldn't set illegal / special characters on filenames (i.e. ?; question mark) when ripping to NTFS volumes https://bugs.launchpad.net/bugs/318625 You received this bug notification because you are a member of Ubuntu Bugs, which is subscribed to Ubuntu. -- ubuntu-bugs mailing list ubuntu-bugs@lists.ubuntu.com https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-bugs
[Bug 318625] Re: Rhythmbox shouldn't set illegal / special characters on filenames (i.e. ?; question mark) when ripping to NTFS volumes
This is definitely not an NTFS-3G problem. The '?' is a perfectly legal NTFS character in the POSIX namesspace NTFS-3G uses: http://ntfs- 3g.org/support.html#posixfilenames2 -- Rhythmbox shouldn't set illegal / special characters on filenames (i.e. ?; question mark) when ripping to NTFS volumes https://bugs.launchpad.net/bugs/318625 You received this bug notification because you are a member of Ubuntu Bugs, which is subscribed to Ubuntu. -- ubuntu-bugs mailing list ubuntu-bugs@lists.ubuntu.com https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-bugs
[Bug 318625] Re: Rhythmbox shouldn't set illegal / special characters on filenames (i.e. ?; question mark) when ripping to NTFS volumes
Can you set these illegal filenames in Nautilus? ** Changed in: rhythmbox (Ubuntu) Status: New = Incomplete ** Tags removed: characters convention extracting filenames illegal incompatible mark naming ntfs question rhythmbox ripping special windows -- Rhythmbox shouldn't set illegal / special characters on filenames (i.e. ?; question mark) when ripping to NTFS volumes https://bugs.launchpad.net/bugs/318625 You received this bug notification because you are a member of Ubuntu Bugs, which is subscribed to Ubuntu. -- ubuntu-bugs mailing list ubuntu-bugs@lists.ubuntu.com https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-bugs
[Bug 318625] Re: Rhythmbox shouldn't set illegal / special characters on filenames (i.e. ?; question mark) when ripping to NTFS volumes
Actually, you don't need to answer that. I'm going to assign to ntfs-3g now as this almost certainly isn't a problem in Rhythmbox itself. ** Changed in: ntfs-3g (Ubuntu) Sourcepackagename: rhythmbox = ntfs-3g Status: Incomplete = New -- Rhythmbox shouldn't set illegal / special characters on filenames (i.e. ?; question mark) when ripping to NTFS volumes https://bugs.launchpad.net/bugs/318625 You received this bug notification because you are a member of Ubuntu Bugs, which is subscribed to Ubuntu. -- ubuntu-bugs mailing list ubuntu-bugs@lists.ubuntu.com https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-bugs
[Bug 318625] Re: Rhythmbox shouldn't set illegal / special characters on filenames (i.e. ?; question mark) when ripping to NTFS volumes
Although I don't need to answer, it's true, I have no problem with creating files using Nautilius and putting in illegal characters, so this is a broader problem with the NTFS driver or kernel control over NTFS volumes. -- Rhythmbox shouldn't set illegal / special characters on filenames (i.e. ?; question mark) when ripping to NTFS volumes https://bugs.launchpad.net/bugs/318625 You received this bug notification because you are a member of Ubuntu Bugs, which is subscribed to Ubuntu. -- ubuntu-bugs mailing list ubuntu-bugs@lists.ubuntu.com https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-bugs
