Re: Curly Lips Code Point Proposal

[Leonardo Boiko]

Undoubtedly so.  That's why U+1F481 INFORMATION DESK PERSON  is listed
with the keyword "sassy" in the Unicode emoji table (besides "tipping
hand").  Which helps a lot, because the keywords are used by input methods
to search characters; if no one bothered to keep track of how people are
using emoji, then people would try looking for the "sassy" gesture and find
nothing, and they'd have to learn that it's called "information desk
person", even though no one uses it with this meaning.

Precisely because language (and symbolic systems like emoji) are in flux,
it's a good idea trying to document how it's used.


2017-01-25 2:35 GMT-02:00 Fritz Gheen :

> "There are indeed already many emoji misused here and there..."
>
> I'd venture to say most emoji are divorced from their original intent.
> Help Desk Lady is one of the most popular emoji...and I can't recall ever
> seeing someone use it for that reason.  I personally use Rocket emoji
> mostly to mean, "I'm taking-off from home."  And then there's aubergine =)
>
> I'd like to think no emoji is "misused."  People employ emoji outside of
> their original or intended meaning, and that's beautiful: language is
> fluid; it evolves.
>
>
>
>
>
> On Wed, Jan 25, 2017 at 12:39 AM, Andrea Giammarchi <
> andrea.giammar...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>> I wouldn't stereotype "this community" already, as it's a single person
>> request and maybe a single person common use case.
>>
>> However, I have seen mostly on Twitter the usage of :3 to indicate
>> "engagement" in the sense of "interest", or "I'm digging it" but if there's
>> a meaning widely recognised already internationally, I guess there's no
>> point in using the proposed name, yet there's no code point to represent :3
>>
>> isn't it?
>>
>> Whatever it means, do we have a code point for it already?
>>
>> If we do, maybe that'd be already enough.
>>
>> There are indeed already many emoji misused here and there due different
>> visual meaning in different cultures (the triumph face, as example, the one
>> with steam from nose which is used as "furious face" in some culture)
>>
>> If there's no code point, being apparently this popular, should Unicode
>> consider one?
>>
>> Regards
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> On Tue, Jan 24, 2017 at 5:12 PM, Leonardo Boiko 
>> wrote:
>>
>>> I find it curious that this community defines the ":3" emoji as ""
>>> or "om nom nom".  In my circles it's quite the frequent emoticon/emoji, but
>>> I've never seen it used this way.  Instead, they usually employ it as "cat
>>> mouth" or "cat face", implying  the mood of cuteness, perkiness or
>>> mischievousness. (This is distinct from U+1F431 CAT FACE in that it
>>> represents a human making a cat-like mouth, not an actual cat.) Here are a
>>> few images found through a web search for "cat face":
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> ​
>>> ​
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> ​
>>> ​
>>> Here's the relevant TVTropes article:
>>> http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/CatSmile
>>>
>>> (TVTropes, incidentally, is one of the many web forums which has a :3
>>> textual emoji.)
>>>
>>> And the KnowYourMeme page:
>>> http://knowyourmeme.com/memes/3-cat-face
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> 2017-01-24 14:39 GMT-02:00 Andrea Giammarchi <
>>> andrea.giammar...@gmail.com>:
>>>
 I'd like to bring to your attention a request, about a common emoticon,
 that has apparently no equivalent yet in the Emoji standard.

 This was a PR to the Twemoji project:
 https://github.com/twitter/twemoji/issues/199

 The author also created a proper PDF explaining all the reasons:
 Proposal for CURLY LIPS Emoji.pdf
 

 I hope this can be considered in the near future as possible extra face.

 Thanks in advance for any sort of outcome.

 Best Regards

>>>
>>>
>>
>

Re: Curly Lips Code Point Proposal

[Andrea Giammarchi]

I wouldn't stereotype "this community" already, as it's a single person
request and maybe a single person common use case.

However, I have seen mostly on Twitter the usage of :3 to indicate
"engagement" in the sense of "interest", or "I'm digging it" but if there's
a meaning widely recognised already internationally, I guess there's no
point in using the proposed name, yet there's no code point to represent :3

isn't it?

Whatever it means, do we have a code point for it already?

If we do, maybe that'd be already enough.

There are indeed already many emoji misused here and there due different
visual meaning in different cultures (the triumph face, as example, the one
with steam from nose which is used as "furious face" in some culture)

If there's no code point, being apparently this popular, should Unicode
consider one?

Regards







On Tue, Jan 24, 2017 at 5:12 PM, Leonardo Boiko 
wrote:

> I find it curious that this community defines the ":3" emoji as "" or
> "om nom nom".  In my circles it's quite the frequent emoticon/emoji, but
> I've never seen it used this way.  Instead, they usually employ it as "cat
> mouth" or "cat face", implying  the mood of cuteness, perkiness or
> mischievousness. (This is distinct from U+1F431 CAT FACE in that it
> represents a human making a cat-like mouth, not an actual cat.) Here are a
> few images found through a web search for "cat face":
>
>
>
> ​
> ​
>
>
>
> ​
> ​
> Here's the relevant TVTropes article:
> http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/CatSmile
>
> (TVTropes, incidentally, is one of the many web forums which has a :3
> textual emoji.)
>
> And the KnowYourMeme page:
> http://knowyourmeme.com/memes/3-cat-face
>
>
>
>
>
>
> 2017-01-24 14:39 GMT-02:00 Andrea Giammarchi 
> :
>
>> I'd like to bring to your attention a request, about a common emoticon,
>> that has apparently no equivalent yet in the Emoji standard.
>>
>> This was a PR to the Twemoji project:
>> https://github.com/twitter/twemoji/issues/199
>>
>> The author also created a proper PDF explaining all the reasons:
>> Proposal for CURLY LIPS Emoji.pdf
>> 
>>
>> I hope this can be considered in the near future as possible extra face.
>>
>> Thanks in advance for any sort of outcome.
>>
>> Best Regards
>>
>
>

Re: Curly Lips Code Point Proposal

[Garth Wallace]

On Tue, Jan 24, 2017 at 9:12 AM, Leonardo Boiko 
wrote:

> I find it curious that this community defines the ":3" emoji as "" or
> "om nom nom".  In my circles it's quite the frequent emoticon/emoji, but
> I've never seen it used this way.
>

I can kind of see how someone might get that impression. For example,
someone writing "om nom nom :3", and somebody who is unfamiliar with the
smiley's usage interpreting the meanings as linked, when the intent was
originally to express "I'm being silly".


>   Instead, they usually employ it as "cat mouth" or "cat face", implying
> the mood of cuteness, perkiness or mischievousness. (This is distinct from
> U+1F431 CAT FACE in that it represents a human making a cat-like mouth, not
> an actual cat.) Here are a few images found through a web search for "cat
> face":
>
> ​
>
>
>
I think the expression from manga and anime is probably the origin of the
smiley. That's consistent with the communities and contexts where it's
found most often. And the "catlike expression" I think is meant to be more
metaphorical, rather than a depiction of an actual facial expression. Like
how  is not meant to be an actual throbbing vein in the forehead.

Re: Curly Lips Code Point Proposal

[Leonardo Boiko]

I find it curious that this community defines the ":3" emoji as "" or
"om nom nom".  In my circles it's quite the frequent emoticon/emoji, but
I've never seen it used this way.  Instead, they usually employ it as "cat
mouth" or "cat face", implying  the mood of cuteness, perkiness or
mischievousness. (This is distinct from U+1F431 CAT FACE in that it
represents a human making a cat-like mouth, not an actual cat.) Here are a
few images found through a web search for "cat face":



​
​



​
​
Here's the relevant TVTropes article:
http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/CatSmile

(TVTropes, incidentally, is one of the many web forums which has a :3
textual emoji.)

And the KnowYourMeme page:
http://knowyourmeme.com/memes/3-cat-face






2017-01-24 14:39 GMT-02:00 Andrea Giammarchi :

> I'd like to bring to your attention a request, about a common emoticon,
> that has apparently no equivalent yet in the Emoji standard.
>
> This was a PR to the Twemoji project:
> https://github.com/twitter/twemoji/issues/199
>
> The author also created a proper PDF explaining all the reasons:
> Proposal for CURLY LIPS Emoji.pdf
> 
>
> I hope this can be considered in the near future as possible extra face.
>
> Thanks in advance for any sort of outcome.
>
> Best Regards
>

Re: Curly Lips Code Point Proposal

[Garth Wallace]

AIUI that's a "catlike face" smiley. "Homer eating a donut" is not what I
would associate with it at all, IME it's usually used to express something
on the order of "mischievous", "playful", or "acting cute". The closest
kaomoji equivalent, I think, is (°ω°) or (✧ω✧).

On Tue, Jan 24, 2017 at 8:39 AM, Andrea Giammarchi <
andrea.giammar...@gmail.com> wrote:

> I'd like to bring to your attention a request, about a common emoticon,
> that has apparently no equivalent yet in the Emoji standard.
>
> This was a PR to the Twemoji project:
> https://github.com/twitter/twemoji/issues/199
>
> The author also created a proper PDF explaining all the reasons:
> Proposal for CURLY LIPS Emoji.pdf
> 
>
> I hope this can be considered in the near future as possible extra face.
>
> Thanks in advance for any sort of outcome.
>
> Best Regards
>

Curly Lips Code Point Proposal

[Andrea Giammarchi]

I'd like to bring to your attention a request, about a common emoticon,
that has apparently no equivalent yet in the Emoji standard.

This was a PR to the Twemoji project:
https://github.com/twitter/twemoji/issues/199

The author also created a proper PDF explaining all the reasons:
Proposal for CURLY LIPS Emoji.pdf


I hope this can be considered in the near future as possible extra face.

Thanks in advance for any sort of outcome.

Best Regards

Re: how would you state requirements involving sorting?

[Mark Davis ☕️]

Perhaps suggest something along the following lines.

Sorting. Unicode-conformant collation (http://unicode.org/reports/tr10/)
must be used when sorting titles. The collation must follow the user's
locale, such as using ICU APIs (http://site.icu-project.org/).

Mark

On Tue, Jan 24, 2017 at 7:43 AM, Eric Muller  wrote:

> Suppose you help somebody write requirements for a piece of software and
> you see an item:
>
> Sorting. Diacritic marks need to be stripped when sorting titles
>
>
> You know that sorting is a lot more complicated than removing diacritics,
> and that giving the directive above to a naive developer is going to lead
> to trouble. You know you want to end up with an implementation involving
> the UCA with a tailoring based on the locale. How would you suggest to
> reword the requirement?
>
> Thanks,
> Eric.
>
>

RE: how would you state requirements involving sorting?

[Shawn Steele]

That requirement will probably really annoy speakers of some languages.

-Shawn

From: Unicode [mailto:unicode-boun...@unicode.org] On Behalf Of Eric Muller
Sent: Monday, January 23, 2017 10:44 PM
To: unicode@unicode.org
Subject: how would you state requirements involving sorting?

Suppose you help somebody write requirements for a piece of software and you 
see an item:
Sorting. Diacritic marks need to be stripped when sorting titles

You know that sorting is a lot more complicated than removing diacritics, and 
that giving the directive above to a naive developer is going to lead to 
trouble. You know you want to end up with an implementation involving the UCA 
with a tailoring based on the locale. How would you suggest to reword the 
requirement?

Thanks,
Eric.