Re: Apps to fight COVID-19

[dsc--- via use-livecode]

My volunteer stint at Covid Watch (anonymous exposure notification) is ending. 
The project is moving into a phase that needs other skillsets. 

I never got a chance to use LiveCode, though it was 2nd on my shortlist for a 
simulation that was never created. The 1st was Colab. 

Dar


---
Dar Scott

  darzLab
  8637 Horacio Place NE
  Albuquerque, NM 87111
  USA

web:http://www.darzLab.com
email:  darsc...@darzlab.com
Phone:  +1 505 433-1024

musing  designing   drawing
coding  tinkering   making
planninginventing   ...
---

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Re: Apps to fight COVID-19

[dsc--- via use-livecode]

Is something still happening tomorrow?

> On Apr 18, 2020, at 1:46 PM, dsc--- via use-livecode 
>  wrote:
> 
> I will attend.
> 
>> On Apr 18, 2020, at 7:45 AM, David Bovill via use-livecode 
>>  wrote:
>> 
>> The app looks a good start, but basic. I took a closer look at the cartoon 
>> images, they are quite specific, but a good base for a discussion about 
>> privacy issues. Not so good for an app.
>> 
>> My suggestion regarding taking this forwards is that we have a creative 
>> workshop on Earth Day this coming Weds, as part of an in-line in conference 
>> that we are organising with a few folk. There will be plenty of other thing 
>> to drop into. I’ll send some info to this list on Sunday.
>> 
>> It’s pretty informal, so we can organise our own breakout open space meeting 
>> when we like - so it should be no issue organising a Livecode workshop on 
>> making a CORVID-19 app.
>> 
>> My focus is on doing an interactive sound piece and helping convene some if 
>> the breakout discussions, but doing a workshop on Livecode would be a fun 
>> part of that.
>> 
>> I could do with some help though :)
>> On 17 Apr 2020, 17:09 +0100, dsc--- via use-livecode 
>> , wrote:
>>> Here is a cool app from Kreativzirkel Design Studio. It is a contact diary 
>>> as mentioned here.
>>> 
>>> https://www.coronika.app/en <https://www.coronika.app/en>
>>> 
>>> I say "cool", but I haven't tried it. it looks good. Should it be done 
>>> better?
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>>> On Apr 15, 2020, at 4:57 PM, dsc--- via use-livecode 
>>>>  wrote:
>>>> 
>>>> Meanwhile at Covid Watch there is talk of moving the provider-facing at to 
>>>> a web app of some sort.
>>>> 
>>>>> On Apr 14, 2020, at 1:37 PM, dsc--- via use-livecode 
>>>>>  wrote:
>>>>> 
>>>>> Jonathan Rothberg is looking for brilliant people who can code whatever 
>>>>> your domain.
>>>>> 
>>>>> 
>>>>>> On Apr 13, 2020, at 6:52 PM, Dar Scott Consulting via use-livecode 
>>>>>>  wrote:
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> Thanks!
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> On Apr 13, 2020, at 11:42 AM, Mark Wieder via use-livecode 
>>>>>>>  wrote:
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> On 4/13/20 10:14 AM, dsc--- via use-livecode wrote:
>>>>>>>> 1. Covid Watch needs expertise in making HIPAA compliant apps. (We 
>>>>>>>> have changed COVID Watch to Covid Watch.)
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> This any help?
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> https://www.healthcareblocks.com/hipaa/developer_guidelines
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> --
>>>>>>> Mark Wieder
>>>>>>> ahsoftw...@gmail.com
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> ___
>>>>>>> use-livecode mailing list
>>>>>>> use-livecode@lists.runrev.com
>>>>>>> Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your 
>>>>>>> subscription preferences:
>>>>>>> http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-livecode
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> ___
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>>>>>> Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your 
>>>>>> subscription preferences:
>>>>>> http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-livecode
>>>>> 
>>>>> 
>>>>> ___
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>>>>> subscription preferences:
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Re: Apps to fight COVID-19

[dsc--- via use-livecode]

I will attend.

> On Apr 18, 2020, at 7:45 AM, David Bovill via use-livecode 
>  wrote:
> 
> The app looks a good start, but basic. I took a closer look at the cartoon 
> images, they are quite specific, but a good base for a discussion about 
> privacy issues. Not so good for an app.
> 
> My suggestion regarding taking this forwards is that we have a creative 
> workshop on Earth Day this coming Weds, as part of an in-line in conference 
> that we are organising with a few folk. There will be plenty of other thing 
> to drop into. I’ll send some info to this list on Sunday.
> 
> It’s pretty informal, so we can organise our own breakout open space meeting 
> when we like - so it should be no issue organising a Livecode workshop on 
> making a CORVID-19 app.
> 
> My focus is on doing an interactive sound piece and helping convene some if 
> the breakout discussions, but doing a workshop on Livecode would be a fun 
> part of that.
> 
> I could do with some help though :)
> On 17 Apr 2020, 17:09 +0100, dsc--- via use-livecode 
> , wrote:
>> Here is a cool app from Kreativzirkel Design Studio. It is a contact diary 
>> as mentioned here.
>> 
>> https://www.coronika.app/en <https://www.coronika.app/en>
>> 
>> I say "cool", but I haven't tried it. it looks good. Should it be done 
>> better?
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>>> On Apr 15, 2020, at 4:57 PM, dsc--- via use-livecode 
>>>  wrote:
>>> 
>>> Meanwhile at Covid Watch there is talk of moving the provider-facing at to 
>>> a web app of some sort.
>>> 
>>>> On Apr 14, 2020, at 1:37 PM, dsc--- via use-livecode 
>>>>  wrote:
>>>> 
>>>> Jonathan Rothberg is looking for brilliant people who can code whatever 
>>>> your domain.
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>>> On Apr 13, 2020, at 6:52 PM, Dar Scott Consulting via use-livecode 
>>>>>  wrote:
>>>>> 
>>>>> Thanks!
>>>>> 
>>>>> 
>>>>>> On Apr 13, 2020, at 11:42 AM, Mark Wieder via use-livecode 
>>>>>>  wrote:
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> On 4/13/20 10:14 AM, dsc--- via use-livecode wrote:
>>>>>>> 1. Covid Watch needs expertise in making HIPAA compliant apps. (We have 
>>>>>>> changed COVID Watch to Covid Watch.)
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> This any help?
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> https://www.healthcareblocks.com/hipaa/developer_guidelines
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> --
>>>>>> Mark Wieder
>>>>>> ahsoftw...@gmail.com
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> ___
>>>>>> use-livecode mailing list
>>>>>> use-livecode@lists.runrev.com
>>>>>> Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your 
>>>>>> subscription preferences:
>>>>>> http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-livecode
>>>>> 
>>>>> 
>>>>> ___
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>>>>> subscription preferences:
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>>>> 
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Re: Apps to fight COVID-19

[dsc--- via use-livecode]

Here is a cool app from Kreativzirkel Design Studio. It is a contact diary as 
mentioned here. 

https://www.coronika.app/en <https://www.coronika.app/en>

I say "cool", but I haven't tried it. it looks good. Should it be done better?




> On Apr 15, 2020, at 4:57 PM, dsc--- via use-livecode 
>  wrote:
> 
> Meanwhile at Covid Watch there is talk of moving the provider-facing at to a 
> web app of some sort.
> 
>> On Apr 14, 2020, at 1:37 PM, dsc--- via use-livecode 
>>  wrote:
>> 
>> Jonathan Rothberg is looking for brilliant people who can code whatever your 
>> domain. 
>> 
>> 
>>> On Apr 13, 2020, at 6:52 PM, Dar Scott Consulting via use-livecode 
>>>  wrote:
>>> 
>>> Thanks!
>>> 
>>> 
>>>> On Apr 13, 2020, at 11:42 AM, Mark Wieder via use-livecode 
>>>>  wrote:
>>>> 
>>>> On 4/13/20 10:14 AM, dsc--- via use-livecode wrote:
>>>>> 1. Covid Watch needs expertise in making HIPAA compliant apps. (We have 
>>>>> changed COVID Watch to Covid Watch.)
>>>> 
>>>> This any help?
>>>> 
>>>> https://www.healthcareblocks.com/hipaa/developer_guidelines
>>>> 
>>>> -- 
>>>> Mark Wieder
>>>> ahsoftw...@gmail.com
>>>> 
>>>> ___
>>>> use-livecode mailing list
>>>> use-livecode@lists.runrev.com
>>>> Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your 
>>>> subscription preferences:
>>>> http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-livecode
>>> 
>>> 
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Re: Apps to fight COVID-19

[dsc--- via use-livecode]

Meanwhile at Covid Watch there is talk of moving the provider-facing at to a 
web app of some sort.

> On Apr 14, 2020, at 1:37 PM, dsc--- via use-livecode 
>  wrote:
> 
> Jonathan Rothberg is looking for brilliant people who can code whatever your 
> domain. 
> 
> 
>> On Apr 13, 2020, at 6:52 PM, Dar Scott Consulting via use-livecode 
>>  wrote:
>> 
>> Thanks!
>> 
>> 
>>> On Apr 13, 2020, at 11:42 AM, Mark Wieder via use-livecode 
>>>  wrote:
>>> 
>>> On 4/13/20 10:14 AM, dsc--- via use-livecode wrote:
>>>> 1. Covid Watch needs expertise in making HIPAA compliant apps. (We have 
>>>> changed COVID Watch to Covid Watch.)
>>> 
>>> This any help?
>>> 
>>> https://www.healthcareblocks.com/hipaa/developer_guidelines
>>> 
>>> -- 
>>> Mark Wieder
>>> ahsoftw...@gmail.com
>>> 
>>> ___
>>> use-livecode mailing list
>>> use-livecode@lists.runrev.com
>>> Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your 
>>> subscription preferences:
>>> http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-livecode
>> 
>> 
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Re: Apps to fight COVID-19

[dsc--- via use-livecode]

Jonathan Rothberg is looking for brilliant people who can code whatever your 
domain. 


> On Apr 13, 2020, at 6:52 PM, Dar Scott Consulting via use-livecode 
>  wrote:
> 
> Thanks!
> 
> 
>> On Apr 13, 2020, at 11:42 AM, Mark Wieder via use-livecode 
>>  wrote:
>> 
>> On 4/13/20 10:14 AM, dsc--- via use-livecode wrote:
>>> 1. Covid Watch needs expertise in making HIPAA compliant apps. (We have 
>>> changed COVID Watch to Covid Watch.)
>> 
>> This any help?
>> 
>> https://www.healthcareblocks.com/hipaa/developer_guidelines
>> 
>> -- 
>> Mark Wieder
>> ahsoftw...@gmail.com
>> 
>> ___
>> use-livecode mailing list
>> use-livecode@lists.runrev.com
>> Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription 
>> preferences:
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> 
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Re: Apps to fight COVID-19

[dsc--- via use-livecode]

1. Covid Watch needs expertise in making HIPAA compliant apps. (We have changed 
COVID Watch to Covid Watch.)

2. I looks like there is a need for a 14-day self quarantine app. In addition 
to what we have discussed already, it should have a place to put daily symptoms 
and checkboxes or reminders to notify doctor and whether one has been tested.


> On Apr 12, 2020, at 5:04 PM, dsc--- via use-livecode 
>  wrote:
> 
> Anybody with experience in MyChart or HIPPA or the like?
> 
>> On Apr 11, 2020, at 2:40 PM, dsc--- via use-livecode 
>>  wrote:
>> 
>> I don't know why they allow hippos to run free in a hospital, but I hear 
>> there can be a hippo concern. 
>> 
>> 
>>> On Apr 11, 2020, at 2:05 PM, dsc--- via use-livecode 
>>>  wrote:
>>> 
>>> Ah, like NANORIMO, but 14 days!
>>> 
>>> I think it would be a good promo for businesses to give a 14-day gift to 
>>> those in self quarantine. Book a day. A 14-day subscription to their news 
>>> magazine. Movie a day. Maybe not even quarantine, just anybody who wants to 
>>> be by themselves for 14 day. 
>>> 
>>>> On Apr 11, 2020, at 1:57 PM, Mark Smith via use-livecode 
>>>>  wrote:
>>>> 
>>>> I like that, jokes, puzzles, movies, any form of entertainment to help 
>>>> pass the time. I think if I were quarantined for 14 days, I’d start 
>>>> writing a best seller :)
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>>> On Apr 11, 2020, at 8:43 PM, Dar Scott Consulting via use-livecode 
>>>>>  wrote:
>>>>> 
>>>>> 14 day devotional? Daily quarantine tips? Daily jokes? ...
>>>>> 
>>>>> 
>>>>>> On Apr 11, 2020, at 12:34 PM, Dev via use-livecode 
>>>>>>  wrote:
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> Countdown of the hours left in purgatory?
>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> On Apr 11, 2020, at 12:32 PM, Mark Smith via use-livecode 
>>>>>>>  wrote:
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> What would it be designed to help you with?
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>> On Apr 11, 2020, at 4:51 PM, dsc--- via use-livecode 
>>>>>>>>  wrote:
>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>> App idea: 14 days of self-quarantine
>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>>> On Apr 11, 2020, at 8:35 AM, dsc--- via use-livecode 
>>>>>>>>>>  wrote:
>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>> Maybe a diary app can be enhanced to include "Talked with this person 
>>>>>>>>> in person for a few minutes" and "Lingered at this location for a few 
>>>>>>>>> minutes" checkboxes that might be an aid when interviewed in 
>>>>>>>>> traditional contact tracing. Those might be used for filtering.
>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>> This does not add to anything lost when Big Brother steals your 
>>>>>>>>> phone; it only helps you or daughter-spouse-caregiver to answer 
>>>>>>>>> contact tracing questions. 
>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>>> On Apr 11, 2020, at 7:34 AM, dsc--- via use-livecode 
>>>>>>>>>>  wrote:
>>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>>> I like it. And it can give kids a chance to show grandma how to 
>>>>>>>>>> download apps.
>>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>>> And this can be added to the COVID-19 button of current apps, too.
>>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>>>> On Apr 11, 2020, at 1:03 AM, David Bovill via use-livecode 
>>>>>>>>>>>  wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>>>> Personally - especially after reading the links below on Apple + 
>>>>>>>>>>> Googles initiative - I’d go for story telling based around the 
>>>>>>>>>>> comic in an app that we could add contact tracing functionality 
>>>>>>>>>>> too. I think emphasising in the story telling privacy issues would 
>>>>>>>>>>>

Re: Apps to fight COVID-19

[dsc--- via use-livecode]

Anybody with experience in MyChart or HIPPA or the like?

> On Apr 11, 2020, at 2:40 PM, dsc--- via use-livecode 
>  wrote:
> 
> I don't know why they allow hippos to run free in a hospital, but I hear 
> there can be a hippo concern. 
> 
> 
>> On Apr 11, 2020, at 2:05 PM, dsc--- via use-livecode 
>>  wrote:
>> 
>> Ah, like NANORIMO, but 14 days!
>> 
>> I think it would be a good promo for businesses to give a 14-day gift to 
>> those in self quarantine. Book a day. A 14-day subscription to their news 
>> magazine. Movie a day. Maybe not even quarantine, just anybody who wants to 
>> be by themselves for 14 day. 
>> 
>>> On Apr 11, 2020, at 1:57 PM, Mark Smith via use-livecode 
>>>  wrote:
>>> 
>>> I like that, jokes, puzzles, movies, any form of entertainment to help pass 
>>> the time. I think if I were quarantined for 14 days, I’d start writing a 
>>> best seller :)
>>> 
>>> 
>>>> On Apr 11, 2020, at 8:43 PM, Dar Scott Consulting via use-livecode 
>>>>  wrote:
>>>> 
>>>> 14 day devotional? Daily quarantine tips? Daily jokes? ...
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>>> On Apr 11, 2020, at 12:34 PM, Dev via use-livecode 
>>>>>  wrote:
>>>>> 
>>>>> Countdown of the hours left in purgatory?
>>>>> 
>>>>>> On Apr 11, 2020, at 12:32 PM, Mark Smith via use-livecode 
>>>>>>  wrote:
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> What would it be designed to help you with?
>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> On Apr 11, 2020, at 4:51 PM, dsc--- via use-livecode 
>>>>>>>  wrote:
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> App idea: 14 days of self-quarantine
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>> On Apr 11, 2020, at 8:35 AM, dsc--- via use-livecode 
>>>>>>>>>  wrote:
>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>> Maybe a diary app can be enhanced to include "Talked with this person 
>>>>>>>> in person for a few minutes" and "Lingered at this location for a few 
>>>>>>>> minutes" checkboxes that might be an aid when interviewed in 
>>>>>>>> traditional contact tracing. Those might be used for filtering.
>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>> This does not add to anything lost when Big Brother steals your phone; 
>>>>>>>> it only helps you or daughter-spouse-caregiver to answer contact 
>>>>>>>> tracing questions. 
>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>> On Apr 11, 2020, at 7:34 AM, dsc--- via use-livecode 
>>>>>>>>>  wrote:
>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>> I like it. And it can give kids a chance to show grandma how to 
>>>>>>>>> download apps.
>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>> And this can be added to the COVID-19 button of current apps, too.
>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>>> On Apr 11, 2020, at 1:03 AM, David Bovill via use-livecode 
>>>>>>>>>>  wrote:
>>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>>> Personally - especially after reading the links below on Apple + 
>>>>>>>>>> Googles initiative - I’d go for story telling based around the comic 
>>>>>>>>>> in an app that we could add contact tracing functionality too. I 
>>>>>>>>>> think emphasising in the story telling privacy issues would be 
>>>>>>>>>> something that would be an important aspect and a strong point with 
>>>>>>>>>> regard to adding to the mix - rather than duplicating efforts by 
>>>>>>>>>> other groups?
>>>>>>>>>> On 10 Apr 2020, 18:05 +0100, dsc--- via use-livecode 
>>>>>>>>>> , wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>> And it doesn't have to be just contact tracing related.
>>>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>>>> Jonathan Rothberg's team is working on a simple test at home that 
>>>>>>>>>>> needs an app.
>>>>>>>>>>> co...@4catalyzer.com <mailto:co...@4catalyzer.com>
>>>>>&

Re: Apps to fight COVID-19

[dsc--- via use-livecode]

I don't know why they allow hippos to run free in a hospital, but I hear there 
can be a hippo concern. 


> On Apr 11, 2020, at 2:05 PM, dsc--- via use-livecode 
>  wrote:
> 
> Ah, like NANORIMO, but 14 days!
> 
> I think it would be a good promo for businesses to give a 14-day gift to 
> those in self quarantine. Book a day. A 14-day subscription to their news 
> magazine. Movie a day. Maybe not even quarantine, just anybody who wants to 
> be by themselves for 14 day. 
> 
>> On Apr 11, 2020, at 1:57 PM, Mark Smith via use-livecode 
>>  wrote:
>> 
>> I like that, jokes, puzzles, movies, any form of entertainment to help pass 
>> the time. I think if I were quarantined for 14 days, I’d start writing a 
>> best seller :)
>> 
>> 
>>> On Apr 11, 2020, at 8:43 PM, Dar Scott Consulting via use-livecode 
>>>  wrote:
>>> 
>>> 14 day devotional? Daily quarantine tips? Daily jokes? ...
>>> 
>>> 
>>>> On Apr 11, 2020, at 12:34 PM, Dev via use-livecode 
>>>>  wrote:
>>>> 
>>>> Countdown of the hours left in purgatory?
>>>> 
>>>>> On Apr 11, 2020, at 12:32 PM, Mark Smith via use-livecode 
>>>>>  wrote:
>>>>> 
>>>>> What would it be designed to help you with?
>>>>> 
>>>>>> On Apr 11, 2020, at 4:51 PM, dsc--- via use-livecode 
>>>>>>  wrote:
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> App idea: 14 days of self-quarantine
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>> On Apr 11, 2020, at 8:35 AM, dsc--- via use-livecode 
>>>>>>>>  wrote:
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> Maybe a diary app can be enhanced to include "Talked with this person 
>>>>>>> in person for a few minutes" and "Lingered at this location for a few 
>>>>>>> minutes" checkboxes that might be an aid when interviewed in 
>>>>>>> traditional contact tracing. Those might be used for filtering.
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> This does not add to anything lost when Big Brother steals your phone; 
>>>>>>> it only helps you or daughter-spouse-caregiver to answer contact 
>>>>>>> tracing questions. 
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>> On Apr 11, 2020, at 7:34 AM, dsc--- via use-livecode 
>>>>>>>>  wrote:
>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>> I like it. And it can give kids a chance to show grandma how to 
>>>>>>>> download apps.
>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>> And this can be added to the COVID-19 button of current apps, too.
>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>> On Apr 11, 2020, at 1:03 AM, David Bovill via use-livecode 
>>>>>>>>>  wrote:
>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>> Personally - especially after reading the links below on Apple + 
>>>>>>>>> Googles initiative - I’d go for story telling based around the comic 
>>>>>>>>> in an app that we could add contact tracing functionality too. I 
>>>>>>>>> think emphasising in the story telling privacy issues would be 
>>>>>>>>> something that would be an important aspect and a strong point with 
>>>>>>>>> regard to adding to the mix - rather than duplicating efforts by 
>>>>>>>>> other groups?
>>>>>>>>> On 10 Apr 2020, 18:05 +0100, dsc--- via use-livecode 
>>>>>>>>> , wrote:
>>>>>>>>>> And it doesn't have to be just contact tracing related.
>>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>>> Jonathan Rothberg's team is working on a simple test at home that 
>>>>>>>>>> needs an app.
>>>>>>>>>> co...@4catalyzer.com <mailto:co...@4catalyzer.com>
>>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>>> Anybody want to talk about a containment game? Or take the concept 
>>>>>>>>>> and go in one's own direction?
>>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>>> Nicky Case's phone size comic is now available in several languages, 
>>>>>>>>>> so if you include that in _anything_ you do, can localize a little.
>>>&g

Re: Apps to fight COVID-19

[dsc--- via use-livecode]

Ah, like NANORIMO, but 14 days!

I think it would be a good promo for businesses to give a 14-day gift to those 
in self quarantine. Book a day. A 14-day subscription to their news magazine. 
Movie a day. Maybe not even quarantine, just anybody who wants to be by 
themselves for 14 day. 

> On Apr 11, 2020, at 1:57 PM, Mark Smith via use-livecode 
>  wrote:
> 
> I like that, jokes, puzzles, movies, any form of entertainment to help pass 
> the time. I think if I were quarantined for 14 days, I’d start writing a best 
> seller :)
> 
> 
>> On Apr 11, 2020, at 8:43 PM, Dar Scott Consulting via use-livecode 
>>  wrote:
>> 
>> 14 day devotional? Daily quarantine tips? Daily jokes? ...
>> 
>> 
>>> On Apr 11, 2020, at 12:34 PM, Dev via use-livecode 
>>>  wrote:
>>> 
>>> Countdown of the hours left in purgatory?
>>> 
>>>> On Apr 11, 2020, at 12:32 PM, Mark Smith via use-livecode 
>>>>  wrote:
>>>> 
>>>> What would it be designed to help you with?
>>>> 
>>>>> On Apr 11, 2020, at 4:51 PM, dsc--- via use-livecode 
>>>>>  wrote:
>>>>> 
>>>>> App idea: 14 days of self-quarantine
>>>>> 
>>>>> 
>>>>>>> On Apr 11, 2020, at 8:35 AM, dsc--- via use-livecode 
>>>>>>>  wrote:
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> Maybe a diary app can be enhanced to include "Talked with this person in 
>>>>>> person for a few minutes" and "Lingered at this location for a few 
>>>>>> minutes" checkboxes that might be an aid when interviewed in traditional 
>>>>>> contact tracing. Those might be used for filtering.
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> This does not add to anything lost when Big Brother steals your phone; 
>>>>>> it only helps you or daughter-spouse-caregiver to answer contact tracing 
>>>>>> questions. 
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> On Apr 11, 2020, at 7:34 AM, dsc--- via use-livecode 
>>>>>>>  wrote:
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> I like it. And it can give kids a chance to show grandma how to 
>>>>>>> download apps.
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> And this can be added to the COVID-19 button of current apps, too.
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>> On Apr 11, 2020, at 1:03 AM, David Bovill via use-livecode 
>>>>>>>>  wrote:
>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>> Personally - especially after reading the links below on Apple + 
>>>>>>>> Googles initiative - I’d go for story telling based around the comic 
>>>>>>>> in an app that we could add contact tracing functionality too. I think 
>>>>>>>> emphasising in the story telling privacy issues would be something 
>>>>>>>> that would be an important aspect and a strong point with regard to 
>>>>>>>> adding to the mix - rather than duplicating efforts by other groups?
>>>>>>>> On 10 Apr 2020, 18:05 +0100, dsc--- via use-livecode 
>>>>>>>> , wrote:
>>>>>>>>> And it doesn't have to be just contact tracing related.
>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>> Jonathan Rothberg's team is working on a simple test at home that 
>>>>>>>>> needs an app.
>>>>>>>>> co...@4catalyzer.com <mailto:co...@4catalyzer.com>
>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>> Anybody want to talk about a containment game? Or take the concept 
>>>>>>>>> and go in one's own direction?
>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>> Nicky Case's phone size comic is now available in several languages, 
>>>>>>>>> so if you include that in _anything_ you do, can localize a little.
>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>> Dar
>>>>>>>>> team COVID Watch
>>>>>>>> ___
>>>>>>>> use-livecode mailing list
>>>>>>>> use-livecode@lists.runrev.com
>>>>>>>> Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your 
>>>>>>>> subscription preferences:
>>>>>>>> http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-live

Re: Apps to fight COVID-19

[dsc--- via use-livecode]

App idea: 14 days of self-quarantine


> On Apr 11, 2020, at 8:35 AM, dsc--- via use-livecode 
>  wrote:
> 
> Maybe a diary app can be enhanced to include "Talked with this person in 
> person for a few minutes" and "Lingered at this location for a few minutes" 
> checkboxes that might be an aid when interviewed in traditional contact 
> tracing. Those might be used for filtering.
> 
> This does not add to anything lost when Big Brother steals your phone; it 
> only helps you or daughter-spouse-caregiver to answer contact tracing 
> questions. 
> 
> 
>> On Apr 11, 2020, at 7:34 AM, dsc--- via use-livecode 
>>  wrote:
>> 
>> I like it. And it can give kids a chance to show grandma how to download 
>> apps.
>> 
>> And this can be added to the COVID-19 button of current apps, too.
>> 
>> 
>>> On Apr 11, 2020, at 1:03 AM, David Bovill via use-livecode 
>>>  wrote:
>>> 
>>> Personally - especially after reading the links below on Apple + Googles 
>>> initiative - I’d go for story telling based around the comic in an app that 
>>> we could add contact tracing functionality too. I think emphasising in the 
>>> story telling privacy issues would be something that would be an important 
>>> aspect and a strong point with regard to adding to the mix - rather than 
>>> duplicating efforts by other groups?
>>> On 10 Apr 2020, 18:05 +0100, dsc--- via use-livecode 
>>> , wrote:
>>>> And it doesn't have to be just contact tracing related.
>>>> 
>>>> Jonathan Rothberg's team is working on a simple test at home that needs an 
>>>> app.
>>>> co...@4catalyzer.com <mailto:co...@4catalyzer.com>
>>>> 
>>>> Anybody want to talk about a containment game? Or take the concept and go 
>>>> in one's own direction?
>>>> 
>>>> Nicky Case's phone size comic is now available in several languages, so if 
>>>> you include that in _anything_ you do, can localize a little.
>>>> 
>>>> Dar
>>>> team COVID Watch
>>> ___
>>> use-livecode mailing list
>>> use-livecode@lists.runrev.com
>>> Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your 
>>> subscription preferences:
>>> http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-livecode
>>> 
>> 
>> 
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>> preferences:
>> http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-livecode
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> 
> 
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Re: Apps to fight COVID-19

[dsc--- via use-livecode]

Maybe a diary app can be enhanced to include "Talked with this person in person 
for a few minutes" and "Lingered at this location for a few minutes" checkboxes 
that might be an aid when interviewed in traditional contact tracing. Those 
might be used for filtering.

This does not add to anything lost when Big Brother steals your phone; it only 
helps you or daughter-spouse-caregiver to answer contact tracing questions. 


> On Apr 11, 2020, at 7:34 AM, dsc--- via use-livecode 
>  wrote:
> 
> I like it. And it can give kids a chance to show grandma how to download apps.
> 
> And this can be added to the COVID-19 button of current apps, too.
> 
> 
>> On Apr 11, 2020, at 1:03 AM, David Bovill via use-livecode 
>>  wrote:
>> 
>> Personally - especially after reading the links below on Apple + Googles 
>> initiative - I’d go for story telling based around the comic in an app that 
>> we could add contact tracing functionality too. I think emphasising in the 
>> story telling privacy issues would be something that would be an important 
>> aspect and a strong point with regard to adding to the mix - rather than 
>> duplicating efforts by other groups?
>> On 10 Apr 2020, 18:05 +0100, dsc--- via use-livecode 
>> , wrote:
>>> And it doesn't have to be just contact tracing related.
>>> 
>>> Jonathan Rothberg's team is working on a simple test at home that needs an 
>>> app.
>>> co...@4catalyzer.com <mailto:co...@4catalyzer.com>
>>> 
>>> Anybody want to talk about a containment game? Or take the concept and go 
>>> in one's own direction?
>>> 
>>> Nicky Case's phone size comic is now available in several languages, so if 
>>> you include that in _anything_ you do, can localize a little.
>>> 
>>> Dar
>>> team COVID Watch
>> ___
>> use-livecode mailing list
>> use-livecode@lists.runrev.com
>> Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription 
>> preferences:
>> http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-livecode
>> 
> 
> 
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> preferences:
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Re: Apps to fight COVID-19

[dsc--- via use-livecode]

I like it. And it can give kids a chance to show grandma how to download apps.

And this can be added to the COVID-19 button of current apps, too.


> On Apr 11, 2020, at 1:03 AM, David Bovill via use-livecode 
>  wrote:
> 
> Personally - especially after reading the links below on Apple + Googles 
> initiative - I’d go for story telling based around the comic in an app that 
> we could add contact tracing functionality too. I think emphasising in the 
> story telling privacy issues would be something that would be an important 
> aspect and a strong point with regard to adding to the mix - rather than 
> duplicating efforts by other groups?
> On 10 Apr 2020, 18:05 +0100, dsc--- via use-livecode 
> , wrote:
>> And it doesn't have to be just contact tracing related.
>> 
>> Jonathan Rothberg's team is working on a simple test at home that needs an 
>> app.
>> co...@4catalyzer.com <mailto:co...@4catalyzer.com>
>> 
>> Anybody want to talk about a containment game? Or take the concept and go in 
>> one's own direction?
>> 
>> Nicky Case's phone size comic is now available in several languages, so if 
>> you include that in _anything_ you do, can localize a little.
>> 
>> Dar
>> team COVID Watch
> ___
> use-livecode mailing list
> use-livecode@lists.runrev.com
> Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription 
> preferences:
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Re: Apps to fight COVID-19

[dsc--- via use-livecode]

Short rant; skip if busy.

What really gets me is that Carmela Troncoso, with help from an asteroid belt 
of others, has worked hard on DP-3T, and Apple/Google adopts it with some 
changes and then is all Apple/Google! Apple/Google! in the news. I know that a 
big name can save lives. And I expect Dr. Troncoso is not in it for the glory. 
But, still...

I want to recognize my heroes. 

And I'm sure there are some heroes out there that are only known to be heroes 
by a few, and those might be the cats.


> On Apr 10, 2020, at 5:18 PM, Dar Scott Consulting via use-livecode 
>  wrote:
> 
> The illustrations from Google in that article are goofed up. I don't know 
> whether Google did it or TechCrunch.
> 
> The gray background confuses things. The "few days later" goes left to right 
> not top to bottom.
> 
> The order should be...
> 
> Alice and Bob meet...
> Their phones exchange...
>   A few days later...
> Bob is positively...
> With Bob's consent...
> Alice continues...
> Alice's phone...
>   Sometime later...
> Alice sees a notification...
> Alice's phone...
> 
> I'm not saying that is the best way, only that the description of the 
> procedure outlined by Google is confusing.
> 
> 
> 
> 
>> On Apr 10, 2020, at 4:58 PM, Trevor DeVore via use-livecode 
>>  wrote:
>> 
>> On Fri, Apr 10, 2020 at 5:07 PM Mark Wieder via use-livecode <
>> use-livecode@lists.runrev.com> wrote:
>> 
>>> On 4/10/20 11:56 AM, Mike Doub via use-livecode wrote:
 Apple and Google adding contact tracking to their OSs
 
 
>>> https://www.nytimes.com/2020/04/10/business/stock-market-today-coronavirus.html#link-418ae121
>>> 
>>> From my limited understanding of this, Apple and Google are creating an
>>> API which will be part of the OS. And then it's up to developers to
>>> create apps and convince users to download them (Apple gets their 30%
>>> off the top, no?). So at best we have reporting from the set of users
>>> who have decided to opt in, download an app, and accept the app's
>>> permissions.
>> 
>> 
>> Here are some additional details. Seems like a good thing they are doing.
>> 
>> https://techcrunch.com/2020/04/10/apple-and-google-are-launching-a-joint-covid-19-tracing-tool/
>> 
>> -- 
>> Trevor DeVore
>> ScreenSteps
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> 
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Re: Apps to fight COVID-19

[dsc--- via use-livecode]

This is good news. 

I am very proud of folks at the COVID Watch team that have been pushing and 
collaborating for a a better mobile APIs that don't hide BLE capabilities. 

And a shout-out to the individuals and groups who developed DP-3T, which seems 
to be the basis for the Apple/Google APIs.

(Concerns: The PR releases putting governments first does not feel like privacy 
preserving. Also, DP-3T and other groups everywhere were not given even a 
mention. On the technical side, if the full API is used, there is no way to 
facilitate reporting being down with COVID-19. So, my "This is good news." has 
some caveats.)

The API is not ready, yet.  

Onward!

> On Apr 10, 2020, at 12:56 PM, Mike Doub via use-livecode 
>  wrote:
> 
> Apple and Google adding contact tracking to their OSs
> 
> https://www.nytimes.com/2020/04/10/business/stock-market-today-coronavirus.html#link-418ae121
> On Apr 10, 2020, 2:41 PM -0400, dsc--- via use-livecode 
> , wrote:
>> And for those of you who want to volunteer for the COVID Watch team, here is 
>> the volunteer form:
>> https://docs.google.com/forms/d/e/1FAIpQLSdD1TGKOvd4gtikW_jXdU1HlF4jMP2XnXvIzL2sd6HLHPJ25g/viewform
>>  
>> <https://docs.google.com/forms/d/e/1FAIpQLSdD1TGKOvd4gtikW_jXdU1HlF4jMP2XnXvIzL2sd6HLHPJ25g/viewform>
>> 
>> 
>>> On Apr 10, 2020, at 11:04 AM, dsc--- via use-livecode 
>>>  wrote:
>>> 
>>> And it doesn't have to be just contact tracing related.
>>> 
>>> Jonathan Rothberg's team is working on a simple test at home that needs an 
>>> app.
>>> co...@4catalyzer.com <mailto:co...@4catalyzer.com>
>>> 
>>> Anybody want to talk about a containment game? Or take the concept and go 
>>> in one's own direction?
>>> 
>>> Nicky Case's phone size comic is now available in several languages, so if 
>>> you include that in _anything_ you do, can localize a little.
>>> 
>>> Dar
>>> team COVID Watch
>>> 
>>> 
>>>> On Apr 10, 2020, at 9:12 AM, dsc--- via use-livecode 
>>>>  wrote:
>>>> 
>>>> It is good to see some leadership here. Thanks, David.
>>>> 
>>>> Jeff Schwaber on COVID Watch leadership team welcomes LiveCode 
>>>> programmers. His initial interest is in making the Bluetooth and TCN 
>>>> libraries available within the LiveCode environment. He suggests joining a 
>>>> couple channels at COVID Watch Slack.
>>>> 
>>>> Those libraries are moving to the TCN Coalition and so are applicable to a 
>>>> wide range of contact tracing apps. This enables LiveCoders to create test 
>>>> apps, explore ideas and even make "competing" apps.
>>>> 
>>>> COVID Watch does not have any desktop apps. One approach might be to 
>>>> convert Android Kotlin to Native Kotlin. Another is to move to LiveCode.
>>>> 
>>>> I'm a Slack noob and I am not sure of the process of onboarding here. I 
>>>> will try to find out. Anybody here know typical Slack etiquette?
>>>> 
>>>> Dar
>>>> team COVID Watch
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>>> On Apr 10, 2020, at 2:58 AM, David Bovill via use-livecode 
>>>>>  wrote:
>>>>> 
>>>>> Thanks for all the info Dar - that’s a great start.
>>>>> 
>>>>> I think creating a hospital / care-worker privacy respecting contact 
>>>>> tracing app would be a great Livecode project.
>>>>> 
>>>>> This is what I’m thinking:
>>>>> 
>>>>> • Some of gather some material / research - maybe a few Livecode 
>>>>> experiments not he topic
>>>>> • We prepare a video conference call - like the Livecode Zoom one I missed
>>>>> • We invite a few people
>>>>> • We follow up the video conference with a week long online sprint - some 
>>>>> coding, some writing, some design / cartoons
>>>>> • We showcase the results at a wrap up event
>>>>> 
>>>>> I’m working with a handful of volunteers - mainly on the video / media / 
>>>>> Zoom / research / facilitation end of things, but we’re getting pretty 
>>>>> good at organising small and larger scale interactive video conferences 
>>>>> and editing together the footage for feedback documentation. Mostly 
>>>>> Livecode novices but interested to learn. So we could set up the event - 
>>>>> most probably in Zoom - but could be Jitsi.
>>>>> 
>

Re: Apps to fight COVID-19

[dsc--- via use-livecode]

And for those of you who want to volunteer for the COVID Watch team, here is 
the volunteer form:
https://docs.google.com/forms/d/e/1FAIpQLSdD1TGKOvd4gtikW_jXdU1HlF4jMP2XnXvIzL2sd6HLHPJ25g/viewform
 
<https://docs.google.com/forms/d/e/1FAIpQLSdD1TGKOvd4gtikW_jXdU1HlF4jMP2XnXvIzL2sd6HLHPJ25g/viewform>


> On Apr 10, 2020, at 11:04 AM, dsc--- via use-livecode 
>  wrote:
> 
> And it doesn't have to be just contact tracing related.
> 
> Jonathan Rothberg's team is working on a simple test at home that needs an 
> app.
> co...@4catalyzer.com <mailto:co...@4catalyzer.com>
> 
> Anybody want to talk about a containment game? Or take the concept and go in 
> one's own direction?
> 
> Nicky Case's phone size comic is now available in several languages, so if 
> you include that in _anything_ you do, can localize a little. 
> 
> Dar
> team COVID Watch
> 
> 
>> On Apr 10, 2020, at 9:12 AM, dsc--- via use-livecode 
>>  wrote:
>> 
>> It is good to see some leadership here. Thanks, David.
>> 
>> Jeff Schwaber on COVID Watch leadership team welcomes LiveCode programmers. 
>> His initial interest is in making the Bluetooth and TCN libraries available 
>> within the LiveCode environment. He suggests joining a couple channels at 
>> COVID Watch Slack.
>> 
>> Those libraries are moving to the TCN Coalition and so are applicable to a 
>> wide range of contact tracing apps. This enables LiveCoders to create test 
>> apps, explore ideas and even make "competing" apps. 
>> 
>> COVID Watch does not have any desktop apps. One approach might be to convert 
>> Android Kotlin to Native Kotlin. Another is to move to LiveCode.
>> 
>> I'm a Slack noob and I am not sure of the process of onboarding here. I will 
>> try to find out. Anybody here know typical Slack etiquette?
>> 
>> Dar
>> team COVID Watch
>> 
>> 
>>> On Apr 10, 2020, at 2:58 AM, David Bovill via use-livecode 
>>>  wrote:
>>> 
>>> Thanks for all the info Dar - that’s a great start.
>>> 
>>> I think creating a hospital / care-worker privacy respecting contact 
>>> tracing app would be a great Livecode project.
>>> 
>>> This is what I’m thinking:
>>> 
>>> • Some of gather some material / research - maybe a few Livecode 
>>> experiments not he topic
>>> • We prepare a video conference call - like the Livecode Zoom one I missed
>>> • We invite a few people
>>> • We follow up the video conference with a week long online sprint - some 
>>> coding, some writing, some design / cartoons
>>> • We showcase the results at a wrap up event
>>> 
>>> I’m working with a handful of volunteers - mainly on the video / media / 
>>> Zoom / research / facilitation end of things, but we’re getting pretty good 
>>> at organising small and larger scale interactive video conferences and 
>>> editing together the footage for feedback documentation. Mostly Livecode 
>>> novices but interested to learn. So we could set up the event - most 
>>> probably in Zoom - but could be Jitsi.
>>> 
>>> To make it work, I think we’d need a few Livecode tutors, and interest from 
>>> the community - in the end it should be something that the folks on this 
>>> list would like to take part in, so when we onboard other people the party 
>>> is not empty.
>>> 
>>> I’d propose we do this on Earth Day - Wednesday 22nd April - in the evening 
>>> Europe time, after midday US time.
>>> 
>>> Any thoughts / takers?
>>> 
>>> On 10 Apr 2020, 04:04 +0100, Dar Scott Consulting via use-livecode 
>>> , wrote:
>>>> 
>>>> Hi, David! Hi, Mark! Hi, Everybody!
>>>> 
>>>> There are several teams that need help in a variety of ways.
>>>> 
>>>> Several teams are in the TCN Coalition <https://tcn-coalition.org/>. These 
>>>> teams respect privacy and use the TCN Protocol. COVID Watch is there with 
>>>> help from around the world, but with a USA focus. You can see a list with 
>>>> links on that very simple page. Volunteers might want to seek out those 
>>>> whose location, philosophy or neediness seem to be appealing.
>>>> 
>>>> Other organizations include Private Kit: Safe Paths (GPS) and "Eastcoast" 
>>>> PACT out of MIT. You can probably find more. If you have a direction or 
>>>> need you want to focus on, I can try to help.
>>>> 
>>>> A group in Europe is forming around DT-3T, trig

Re: Apps to fight COVID-19

[dsc--- via use-livecode]

And it doesn't have to be just contact tracing related.

Jonathan Rothberg's team is working on a simple test at home that needs an app.
co...@4catalyzer.com <mailto:co...@4catalyzer.com>

Anybody want to talk about a containment game? Or take the concept and go in 
one's own direction?

Nicky Case's phone size comic is now available in several languages, so if you 
include that in _anything_ you do, can localize a little. 

Dar
team COVID Watch


> On Apr 10, 2020, at 9:12 AM, dsc--- via use-livecode 
>  wrote:
> 
> It is good to see some leadership here. Thanks, David.
> 
> Jeff Schwaber on COVID Watch leadership team welcomes LiveCode programmers. 
> His initial interest is in making the Bluetooth and TCN libraries available 
> within the LiveCode environment. He suggests joining a couple channels at 
> COVID Watch Slack.
> 
> Those libraries are moving to the TCN Coalition and so are applicable to a 
> wide range of contact tracing apps. This enables LiveCoders to create test 
> apps, explore ideas and even make "competing" apps. 
> 
> COVID Watch does not have any desktop apps. One approach might be to convert 
> Android Kotlin to Native Kotlin. Another is to move to LiveCode.
> 
> I'm a Slack noob and I am not sure of the process of onboarding here. I will 
> try to find out. Anybody here know typical Slack etiquette?
> 
> Dar
> team COVID Watch
> 
> 
>> On Apr 10, 2020, at 2:58 AM, David Bovill via use-livecode 
>>  wrote:
>> 
>> Thanks for all the info Dar - that’s a great start.
>> 
>> I think creating a hospital / care-worker privacy respecting contact tracing 
>> app would be a great Livecode project.
>> 
>> This is what I’m thinking:
>> 
>> • Some of gather some material / research - maybe a few Livecode experiments 
>> not he topic
>> • We prepare a video conference call - like the Livecode Zoom one I missed
>> • We invite a few people
>> • We follow up the video conference with a week long online sprint - some 
>> coding, some writing, some design / cartoons
>> • We showcase the results at a wrap up event
>> 
>> I’m working with a handful of volunteers - mainly on the video / media / 
>> Zoom / research / facilitation end of things, but we’re getting pretty good 
>> at organising small and larger scale interactive video conferences and 
>> editing together the footage for feedback documentation. Mostly Livecode 
>> novices but interested to learn. So we could set up the event - most 
>> probably in Zoom - but could be Jitsi.
>> 
>> To make it work, I think we’d need a few Livecode tutors, and interest from 
>> the community - in the end it should be something that the folks on this 
>> list would like to take part in, so when we onboard other people the party 
>> is not empty.
>> 
>> I’d propose we do this on Earth Day - Wednesday 22nd April - in the evening 
>> Europe time, after midday US time.
>> 
>> Any thoughts / takers?
>> 
>> On 10 Apr 2020, 04:04 +0100, Dar Scott Consulting via use-livecode 
>> , wrote:
>>> 
>>> Hi, David! Hi, Mark! Hi, Everybody!
>>> 
>>> There are several teams that need help in a variety of ways.
>>> 
>>> Several teams are in the TCN Coalition <https://tcn-coalition.org/>. These 
>>> teams respect privacy and use the TCN Protocol. COVID Watch is there with 
>>> help from around the world, but with a USA focus. You can see a list with 
>>> links on that very simple page. Volunteers might want to seek out those 
>>> whose location, philosophy or neediness seem to be appealing.
>>> 
>>> Other organizations include Private Kit: Safe Paths (GPS) and "Eastcoast" 
>>> PACT out of MIT. You can probably find more. If you have a direction or 
>>> need you want to focus on, I can try to help.
>>> 
>>> A group in Europe is forming around DT-3T, triggered by work by Carmela 
>>> Troncoso of EPFL and folks at ETHZ. (Even though DT-3T is considered to be 
>>> under the umbrella of PEPPPT, the later group includes teams whose methods 
>>> that require trusted servers. DT-3T does not.) This project has some nice 
>>> features.
>>> https://github.com/DP-3T <https://github.com/DP-3T>
>>> 
>>> Artist/explainer Nicky Case has created a comic in a phone format that 
>>> explains contact tracing. The details look a little more like DT-3T than 
>>> what COVID Watch is doing, but one tweaked for COVID Watch is in the works. 
>>> You can incorporate this into your current apps or make a new education 
>>> app. The education 

Re: Apps to fight COVID-19

[dsc--- via use-livecode]

It is good to see some leadership here. Thanks, David.

Jeff Schwaber on COVID Watch leadership team welcomes LiveCode programmers. His 
initial interest is in making the Bluetooth and TCN libraries available within 
the LiveCode environment. He suggests joining a couple channels at COVID Watch 
Slack.

Those libraries are moving to the TCN Coalition and so are applicable to a wide 
range of contact tracing apps. This enables LiveCoders to create test apps, 
explore ideas and even make "competing" apps. 

COVID Watch does not have any desktop apps. One approach might be to convert 
Android Kotlin to Native Kotlin. Another is to move to LiveCode.

I'm a Slack noob and I am not sure of the process of onboarding here. I will 
try to find out. Anybody here know typical Slack etiquette?

Dar
team COVID Watch


> On Apr 10, 2020, at 2:58 AM, David Bovill via use-livecode 
>  wrote:
> 
> Thanks for all the info Dar - that’s a great start.
> 
> I think creating a hospital / care-worker privacy respecting contact tracing 
> app would be a great Livecode project.
> 
> This is what I’m thinking:
> 
> • Some of gather some material / research - maybe a few Livecode experiments 
> not he topic
> • We prepare a video conference call - like the Livecode Zoom one I missed
> • We invite a few people
> • We follow up the video conference with a week long online sprint - some 
> coding, some writing, some design / cartoons
> • We showcase the results at a wrap up event
> 
> I’m working with a handful of volunteers - mainly on the video / media / Zoom 
> / research / facilitation end of things, but we’re getting pretty good at 
> organising small and larger scale interactive video conferences and editing 
> together the footage for feedback documentation. Mostly Livecode novices but 
> interested to learn. So we could set up the event - most probably in Zoom - 
> but could be Jitsi.
> 
> To make it work, I think we’d need a few Livecode tutors, and interest from 
> the community - in the end it should be something that the folks on this list 
> would like to take part in, so when we onboard other people the party is not 
> empty.
> 
> I’d propose we do this on Earth Day - Wednesday 22nd April - in the evening 
> Europe time, after midday US time.
> 
> Any thoughts / takers?
> 
> On 10 Apr 2020, 04:04 +0100, Dar Scott Consulting via use-livecode 
> , wrote:
>> 
>> Hi, David! Hi, Mark! Hi, Everybody!
>> 
>> There are several teams that need help in a variety of ways.
>> 
>> Several teams are in the TCN Coalition . These 
>> teams respect privacy and use the TCN Protocol. COVID Watch is there with 
>> help from around the world, but with a USA focus. You can see a list with 
>> links on that very simple page. Volunteers might want to seek out those 
>> whose location, philosophy or neediness seem to be appealing.
>> 
>> Other organizations include Private Kit: Safe Paths (GPS) and "Eastcoast" 
>> PACT out of MIT. You can probably find more. If you have a direction or need 
>> you want to focus on, I can try to help.
>> 
>> A group in Europe is forming around DT-3T, triggered by work by Carmela 
>> Troncoso of EPFL and folks at ETHZ. (Even though DT-3T is considered to be 
>> under the umbrella of PEPPPT, the later group includes teams whose methods 
>> that require trusted servers. DT-3T does not.) This project has some nice 
>> features.
>> https://github.com/DP-3T 
>> 
>> Artist/explainer Nicky Case has created a comic in a phone format that 
>> explains contact tracing. The details look a little more like DT-3T than 
>> what COVID Watch is doing, but one tweaked for COVID Watch is in the works. 
>> You can incorporate this into your current apps or make a new education app. 
>> The education app might remind people how they downloaded that app and how 
>> to download the kind of app described in the comic. You can run with this on 
>> your own.
>> https://ncase.me/contact-tracing/ 
>> 
>> Everybody should look at that comic anyway. It explains a lot in just a few 
>> minutes.
>> 
>> There is a need for both phone and desktop apps used by healthcare providers 
>> to validate "I'm sick" reports. Many organizations need some means of making 
>> sure there are few false reports. Maybe some sort of cryptographic signature 
>> or something. While groups are focusing on the user app, the hospital apps 
>> are seeing less work.
>> 
>> And then there are the servers. Maybe Firebase will work but I suspect that 
>> there might have to be more, depending on the team. Server? Look at the 
>> Nicky Case comic.
>> 
>> I have some for a containment game that includes contact tracing. I can give 
>> it to somebody and even (in my copious spare time) provide some handwaving.
>> 
>> One problem is that auntie does not know how to download apps. Encouraging 
>> friends showing friends how to download is a good thing. Rapid adoption will 
>> become 

Re: Recommended specs for Windows Development computer.

[dsc--- via use-livecode]

I tend to use a lot of whitespace in layout and keep label fields and text 
buttons long.

And, since I am often the LiveCode programmer's programmer, building libraries 
& LCB extensions and such, I sometimes just throw controls onto the card. 
(Which might contribute to the notion that Dar can't GUI.)

Platform, window size, display size, and font availability are all in the 
environment. Perhaps these can be handled in a uniform manner as one might do a 
stack resize.

If I need to, I use raw primitive controls and use appropriate graphics.

So, to address the question, for simple stacks, I design for Mac and adjust for 
Windows.

> On Oct 4, 2019, at 11:50 AM, Jjs via use-livecode 
>  wrote:
> 
> How do you people cope with the differences on fields and knobs having text 
> in it on the different OS-es? If i only build on windows even for Linux and 
> Macos, text and such never fits in the fields.And i have to adjust it and 
> maintain a stack for each OS.
> 
> Dar Scott Consulting via use-livecode  schreef 
> op 4 oktober 2019 19:40:16 CEST:
>> The original question mentioned testing and debugging. 
>> 
>> I tend to develop on the Mac and test on Windows. At times I need to
>> develop on Windows because there are unknowns in the environment or I'm
>> using some Windows specific hardware. Especially internal hardware.
>> 
>> It is a big pain to have multiple programming stations, so I set up
>> Windows workstations with monitors, keyboards and mice as needed. I
>> prefer to have my big wide monitor on my Mac and then remote in. I
>> currently use no-machine to access Windows machines.
>> 
>> The focus in the discussion has been on processor, RAM and disk. For me
>> however, other hardware is important. That is, that which makes it hard
>> to test with virtualization needs to be in the real hardware. And often
>> one needs real hardware. Virtual Box has been good to me as far as
>> emulating hardware, but I need to test on real stuff.
>> 
>> So, for me, the most important part is not so much processor-RAM-disk,
>> but I/O. I want lots of USB and a variety of such, front and back. I
>> want board slots. I want multiple NICs. RS-232 is a big plus. A
>> powerful GPU is a plus, but I hope to build a computation server
>> someday. Multiple kinds of video is good as well as handling multiple
>> monitors. I want Bluetooth and Wifi. I want WoL. Though I use
>> no-machine, I want to be able to remote desktop in, so W8.1 needs to be
>> Pro. As soon as I get a computer, a customer will come up with
>> something I neglected, so those slots are important. I get Pro for
>> everything if I can.) For a different machine, I might want something
>> with a touch screen that I can carry around.
>> 
>> In my last buy, I compromised. I did not get high performance or slots.
>> 
>> And speaking of Pro, Windows 10 Pro is, out of the box, friendly to us
>> old guys.
>> 
>> As far as development on the Mac, Bootcamp does not work well for me, I
>> want to see all of my screens on all of my computers. Parallels is
>> good, but I have found that when Parallels and VMWare say no, Virtual
>> Box says yes. What good is higher RPM when you can't get it into
>> reverse? In general, virtualization allows me to swap out hardware or
>> display sizes quickly, bing, bing, bing. Network configuration testing?
>> No searching for switches, routers and cables. 
>> 
>> Just going by my memory (I recommend against trusting it), I do not see
>> a big performance hit. I think LiveCode on Windows 10 Pro on Virtual
>> Box 6 on Mac Mini runs slightly faster than LiveCode on macOS on
>> MacMini. That could be my imagination. Disk I/O might be a lot slower,
>> but it did not affect me. I typically use a LAN drive for such testing,
>> anyway, unless the tests directly involve a local drive.
>> 
>> I have used MSDN Operating Systems to build a variety of virtual
>> machines and to load on real machines. However, things seem to be
>> different. Now the best way seems to be Visual Studio Pro, $1200 for
>> the first year, $800 for subsequent. 
>> 
>> Dar
>> Mad Scientist
>> 
>> 
>>> On Oct 4, 2019, at 2:34 AM, Curry Kenworthy via use-livecode
>>  wrote:
>>> 
>>> 
>>> For anyone truly interested in the original question of "Recommended
>> specs for Windows Development computer"
>>> 
>>> (... as opposed to any OS-partisan virtue signaling, or avoiding
>> Windows hardware, or maintaining a single computer as the rule, etc
>> ...)
>>> 
>>> here's my take, from many years of often "Windows first, but not
>> Windows only" experience:
>>> 
>>> - Biggest OS difference/biggest factor: anti-virus. I've literally
>> seen a Mac running with software techniques similar to today's PC
>> antivirus, and similar results.
>>> 
>>> - I don't trust my PC to run Mac, nor my Mac to run PC. I get my
>> hands dirty on both, with dedicated hardware for each. You notice
>> more
>>> 
>>> - PC doesn't require a huge investment. I use a budget (but not
>> bottom) laptop with as 

Re: Guess encoding for text file...

[dsc--- via use-livecode]

I thought of a quick way to do a first pass and it can almost fit in the margin.

> On Sep 19, 2019, at 10:25 AM, Dar Scott Consulting via use-livecode 
>  wrote:
> 
> UTF-16 and UTF-32 are not needed in your list. Those are BE unless indicated 
> otherwise by a leading BOM. That is, the BE and LE versions are sufficient. 
> 
> ASCII encoding is a subset of CP1252, MacRoman and UTF-8, so that can be 
> classified as UTF-8 if there is no advantage to knowing that it is ASCII. 
> (Printable ASCII is a subset of ISO-8859-1). 
> 
> A couple thoughts in creating a custom function. Your special codes in ASCII 
> files of 1, 2, 3 and 4 can be considered in a custom function. You might have 
> a good idea in just 128 bytes or maybe a few iterations of 32 bytes. You can 
> consider an a priori ordering of likelihood, related to the question of which 
> tests provide the most information in the least time. And if you can't tell 
> the difference, then maybe it doesn't matter. 
> 
> I considered some methods of adjusting probabilities but the overhead means 
> the test chunks should not be trivial. Also, the probability might be 
> simplified to "maybe" and "nope". (However, if there might be errors in the 
> text or discernment needs to rely on text probabilities, the numbers might be 
> best.)  Tests move probabilities from maybe to nope.
> 
> One method might do a batch of unsigned 32-bit int decodes and do logic 
> operations on each of those. That can only do partial elimination tests on 
> UTF-8, but detailed tests can be done afterward. I am not sure about 
> performance, it might be that byteToNum() would be much faster.
> 
> I'm guessing that one can get some good probabilities from the first four 
> bytes.
> 
> So, I agree with Curry. He might not use anything I mentioned, but he can 
> optimize your code for longer files, if you need full checking.
> 
>> On Sep 17, 2019, at 2:05 PM, Paul Dupuis via use-livecode 
>>  wrote:
>> 
>> I started this post of the DEV-LIST. Mark Waddingham kindly responded and 
>> smartly suggested I should move it to the USE-LIST, so that is what I am 
>> doing. I have also pasted Lark's reply below my original post.
>> 
>> -- ORIGINAL POST 
>> 
>> I have a LiveCode Script (LCS) routine that attempts to follow industry 
>> common algorithms for guessing the encoding of a text file.
>> 
>> It's performance can be slower than I would like.
>> 
>> This has led me to wonder in a LiveCode Builder (LCB) library may be the 
>> route to go. Does anyone know the OSX and/or Windows APIs for guessing a 
>> text file's encoding?
>> 
>> I have done a number of google searches, but I am not a C programmer (not in 
>> many decades) and wading through the huge doc sets at MSDN or Apple is 
>> daunting.
>> 
>> I found reference to a windows API:
>> 
>> BOOL IsTextUnicode( const VOID *lpv, int iSize, LPINT lpiResult );
>> 
>> Which suggests to me that such APIs may exists. Does anyone who is better at 
>> finding OS APIs know where to find such APIs? Can you point me to the right 
>> online documentation?
>> 
>> I also found this: 
>> https://stackoverflow.com/questions/3825390/effective-way-to-find-any-files-encoding
>> 
>> Of course, it would be wonderful if the mothership delivered this. At one 
>> point Frasier said he would back around LC7 something.
>> 
>> https://quality.livecode.com/show_bug.cgi?id=14474
>> 
>> It seems an LCB library that uses OS APIs to return best guess for file 
>> encoding that match up with the textEncode/Decode functions would be a great 
>> addition to LC
>> 
>> * "ASCII"
>> * "UTF-16"
>> * "UTF-16BE"
>> * "UTF-16LE"
>> * "UTF-32"
>> * "UTF-32BE"
>> * "UTF-32LE"
>> * "UTF-8"
>> * "CP1252"
>> * "ISO-8859-1"
>> * "MacRoman"
>> 
>> and I suppose "Binary" as the default if none of the above can be detected
>> 
>> - MARK'S REPLY 
>> On 2019-09-13 16:44, Paul Dupuis wrote:
>>> I have a LiveCode Script (LCS) routine that attempts to follow
>>> industry common algorithms for guessing the encoding of a text file.
>>> 
>>> It's performance can be slower than I would like.
>> 
>> If you share your code perhaps we can help speed it up...
>> 
>>> This has led me to wonder in a LiveCode Builder (LCB) library may be
>>> the route to go. Does anyone know the OSX and/or Windows APIs for
>>> guessing a text file's encoding?
>>> 
>>> I have done a number of google searches, but I am not a C programmer
>>> (not in many decades) and wading through the huge doc sets at MSDN or
>>> Apple is daunting.
>>> 
>>> I found reference to a windows API:
>>> 
>>> BOOL IsTextUnicode(
>>>  const VOID *lpv,
>>>  intiSize,
>>>  LPINT  lpiResult
>>> );
>>> 
>>> Which suggests to me that such APIs may exists. Does anyone who is
>>> better at finding OS APIs know where to find such APIs? Can you point
>>> me to the right online documentation?
>> 
>> Libraries certainly exist: 

Re: Merge and unicode

[dsc--- via use-livecode]

Jacque, these are my latest thoughts as far as possible problems.

1. Dar is very confused and off in the wrong direction. Use big stick.
2. Binary data is in an 8-bit char set encoding causing problems with UTF-8 
decode. Check encoding.
3. Field, line and character metadata are interfering. Clear all, then set and 
get consistently.
4. Merge is not handling binary data as text. Use textDecode first.

Dar Scott
Mad Scientist


> On Sep 10, 2019, at 11:04 AM, Dar Scott Consulting via use-livecode 
>  wrote:
> 
> Trusting...
> 
> Also, interpreting Latin-1 as UTF-8 can generate some weird characters and 
> lots of ?-diamond symbols.
> 
>> On Sep 10, 2019, at 8:36 AM, Bob Sneidar via use-livecode 
>>  wrote:
>> 
>> Trust me it's better than a feral gander persuit. 
>> 
>> Bob S
>> 
>> 
>>> On Sep 9, 2019, at 17:23 , Dar Scott Consulting via use-livecode 
>>>  wrote:
>>> 
>>> Sorry, if I am off on a bunny trail...
>>> 
>>> Dar
>> 
>> 
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>> preferences:
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> 
> 
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> preferences:
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Re: Merge and unicode

[dsc--- via use-livecode]

I think I'm doing this wrong. This seems to work, too.

on mouseup
   put empty into field 1
   put numToCodepoint(0x2200) into x 
   put numToCodepoint(0x1040F) & "V-" into y
   put merge(" é{ [[x]] }é [[y]]") into field 1
end mouseup


> On Sep 9, 2019, at 10:25 PM, dsc--- via use-livecode 
>  wrote:
> 
> And this, too, looks OK to me.
> 
> on mouseup
>   put empty into field 1
>   put "A" into field 1
>   get numToCodepoint(0x2200) & numToCodepoint(0x1040F) & "V-"
>   set the metadata of char 1 of field 1 to it
>   put the metadata of char 1 of field 1 after field 1
> end mouseup
> 
> I guess the problem is in the merge as you thought.
> 
> I did notice in the dictionary that setting the metadata of a line is not the 
> same as setting the metadata of all of the characters of the line.
> 
> Dar Scott
> 
> 
>> On Sep 9, 2019, at 8:58 PM, Dar Scott Consulting via use-livecode 
>>  wrote:
>> 
>> This quick check seems to work for me.
>> 
>> on mouseup
>> 
>> put "A" into field 1
>> 
>> set the metadata of char 1 of field 1 to "é"
>> 
>> put the metadata of char 1 of field 1 after field 1
>> 
>> end mouseup
>> 
>> 
>>> On Sep 9, 2019, at 8:32 PM, J. Landman Gay via use-livecode 
>>>  wrote:
>>> 
>>> Well, I've made some changes to the code since I started urlEncoding the 
>>> text before merging so I'll check that again. Paul is right that unicode in 
>>> htmltext needs to be in hex, but the numbers I'm getting back are very high 
>>> (8,000+) and render in the field as strange pictographs. Elsewhere where 
>>> there is no merge, curly quotes translate to the named quote or apostrophe 
>>> entities and are correct.
>>> 
>>> By metadata I mean the LC term (see the dictionary) that allows you to 
>>> attach some text to a field text chunk. The metadata isn't displayed in the 
>>> field but you can use it for anything you want. In my case the field is a 
>>> list of clickable entries in a table of contents, each with its own 
>>> metadata attached that provides a path to the stack and card the entry 
>>> needs to open.
>>> 
>>> When I use normal LC text as metadata, diacriticals aren't rendered 
>>> correctly (curly quotes become question marks,) the path is therefore 
>>> incorrect and the click goes nowhere.
>>> 
>>> Since LC is supposed to be unicode throughout, I'd expect metadata to be 
>>> compatible. The same text appears correctly when not used as metadata.
>>> --
>>> Jacqueline Landman Gay | jac...@hyperactivesw.com
>>> HyperActive Software | http://www.hyperactivesw.com
>>> On September 9, 2019 7:25:28 PM Dar Scott Consulting via use-livecode 
>>>  wrote:
>>> 
>>>> I think you are trying to think too much about the LC implementation of 
>>>> text. Maybe.
>>>> 
>>>> Text in LC is an abstraction of a sequence of code points. Whether it is 
>>>> UTF16 or not is hidden to me. (mostly)
>>>> 
>>>> So,
>>>> 
>>>> get textDecode( binaryFromServer, "UTF-8" )
>>>> 
>>>> should put that into the correct form, if it is really UTF-8.
>>>> 
>>>> A data (binary bytes) is interpreted as native encoding if one tries to 
>>>> use it as text. I recommend against this. I try to always textDecode() 
>>>> everything coming in, but I make exceptions at times for ASCII.
>>>> 
>>>> I'm not sure what you mean by metadata. Are you referring to HTTP 
>>>> content-type?
>>>> 
>>>> Sorry, if I am off on a bunny trail...
>>>> 
>>>> Dar
>>>> 
>>>>> On Sep 9, 2019, at 4:38 PM, J. Landman Gay via use-livecode 
>>>>>  wrote:
>>>>> 
>>>>> It's UTF8 text from a server, which I textDecode to UTF16. When I use the 
>>>>> UTF16 text in a merge, diacriticals and/or curly quotes get mangled. 
>>>>> (Same with setting metadata on field text too.)
>>>>> 
>>>>> On 9/9/19 4:16 PM, Dar Scott Consulting via use-livecode wrote:
>>>>>> I'm not sure I understand.
>>>>>> Do you mean "encoded to UTF-16"? In that case you should decode that to 
>>>>>> convert it to internal text. And then try merge. (Which still might have 
>>>>>> problems, I suppose.)
>>>>>>> On Sep 9

Re: Merge and unicode

[dsc--- via use-livecode]

And this, too, looks OK to me.

on mouseup
   put empty into field 1
   put "A" into field 1
   get numToCodepoint(0x2200) & numToCodepoint(0x1040F) & "V-"
   set the metadata of char 1 of field 1 to it
   put the metadata of char 1 of field 1 after field 1
end mouseup

I guess the problem is in the merge as you thought.

I did notice in the dictionary that setting the metadata of a line is not the 
same as setting the metadata of all of the characters of the line.

Dar Scott


> On Sep 9, 2019, at 8:58 PM, Dar Scott Consulting via use-livecode 
>  wrote:
> 
> This quick check seems to work for me.
> 
> on mouseup
> 
> put "A" into field 1
> 
> set the metadata of char 1 of field 1 to "é"
> 
> put the metadata of char 1 of field 1 after field 1
> 
> end mouseup
> 
> 
>> On Sep 9, 2019, at 8:32 PM, J. Landman Gay via use-livecode 
>>  wrote:
>> 
>> Well, I've made some changes to the code since I started urlEncoding the 
>> text before merging so I'll check that again. Paul is right that unicode in 
>> htmltext needs to be in hex, but the numbers I'm getting back are very high 
>> (8,000+) and render in the field as strange pictographs. Elsewhere where 
>> there is no merge, curly quotes translate to the named quote or apostrophe 
>> entities and are correct.
>> 
>> By metadata I mean the LC term (see the dictionary) that allows you to 
>> attach some text to a field text chunk. The metadata isn't displayed in the 
>> field but you can use it for anything you want. In my case the field is a 
>> list of clickable entries in a table of contents, each with its own metadata 
>> attached that provides a path to the stack and card the entry needs to open.
>> 
>> When I use normal LC text as metadata, diacriticals aren't rendered 
>> correctly (curly quotes become question marks,) the path is therefore 
>> incorrect and the click goes nowhere.
>> 
>> Since LC is supposed to be unicode throughout, I'd expect metadata to be 
>> compatible. The same text appears correctly when not used as metadata.
>> --
>> Jacqueline Landman Gay | jac...@hyperactivesw.com
>> HyperActive Software | http://www.hyperactivesw.com
>> On September 9, 2019 7:25:28 PM Dar Scott Consulting via use-livecode 
>>  wrote:
>> 
>>> I think you are trying to think too much about the LC implementation of 
>>> text. Maybe.
>>> 
>>> Text in LC is an abstraction of a sequence of code points. Whether it is 
>>> UTF16 or not is hidden to me. (mostly)
>>> 
>>> So,
>>> 
>>> get textDecode( binaryFromServer, "UTF-8" )
>>> 
>>> should put that into the correct form, if it is really UTF-8.
>>> 
>>> A data (binary bytes) is interpreted as native encoding if one tries to use 
>>> it as text. I recommend against this. I try to always textDecode() 
>>> everything coming in, but I make exceptions at times for ASCII.
>>> 
>>> I'm not sure what you mean by metadata. Are you referring to HTTP 
>>> content-type?
>>> 
>>> Sorry, if I am off on a bunny trail...
>>> 
>>> Dar
>>> 
 On Sep 9, 2019, at 4:38 PM, J. Landman Gay via use-livecode 
  wrote:
 
 It's UTF8 text from a server, which I textDecode to UTF16. When I use the 
 UTF16 text in a merge, diacriticals and/or curly quotes get mangled. (Same 
 with setting metadata on field text too.)
 
 On 9/9/19 4:16 PM, Dar Scott Consulting via use-livecode wrote:
> I'm not sure I understand.
> Do you mean "encoded to UTF-16"? In that case you should decode that to 
> convert it to internal text. And then try merge. (Which still might have 
> problems, I suppose.)
>> On Sep 9, 2019, at 12:08 PM, J. Landman Gay via use-livecode 
>>  wrote:
>> 
>> 
>> It seems that the merge command doesn't respect unicode. Does anyone 
>> have a workaround? The text I'm inserting is already decoded to UTF16.
>> 
>> 
>> --
>> Jacqueline Landman Gay | jac...@hyperactivesw.com
>> HyperActive Software   | http://www.hyperactivesw.com
>> 
>> 
>> ___
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>> subscription preferences:
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 --
 Jacqueline Landman Gay | jac...@hyperactivesw.com
 HyperActive Software   | http://www.hyperactivesw.com
 
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Re: Unicode is not "everywhere"...

[dsc--- via use-livecode]

Paul, does this solve the problem with shell() on Windows?

> On Aug 22, 2019, at 10:27 PM, dsc--- via use-livecode 
>  wrote:
> 
> I tried it.
> 
> on mouseUp
>   set the shellCommand to "cmd.exe /u"
>   put textDecode( shell("dir"), "UTF-16" )
> end mouseUp
> 
> That does seem to double up the newlines. It looks like it works otherwise.
> 
> Dar
> 
> 
>> On Aug 22, 2019, at 12:15 PM, dsc--- via use-livecode 
>>  wrote:
>> 
>> The shellCommand property for Windows is "cmd.exe", not "command.com 
>> <http://command.com/>" as described in the dictionary.
>> 
>> I wonder how setting that to "cmd.exe /u" would affect this behavior.
>> 
>>> On Aug 22, 2019, at 10:19 AM, Dar Scott Consulting via use-livecode 
>>>  wrote:
>>> 
>>> Concerning 22335...
>>> 
>>> 1. I wonder if anyone uses shell() to return binary values.
>>> 
>>> 2. I wonder about whether using the shellCommand property would help.
>>> 
>>>> On Aug 22, 2019, at 9:37 AM, Paul Dupuis via use-livecode 
>>>>  wrote:
>>>> 
>>>> I have filed two bug reports that are in LC905rc1 and go back to 7.0 where 
>>>> LC functions that should deal with Unicode properly do not.
>>>> 
>>>> These are:
>>>> https://quality.livecode.com/show_bug.cgi?id=22213 -- The "detailed files" 
>>>> function fails for any files with Unicode in the name, returning the 
>>>> filename with %3F (?) instead of the Unicode characters properly URL 
>>>> encoded (they should be UFT8 encoded and then URL encoded)
>>>> and
>>>> https://quality.livecode.com/show_bug.cgi?id=22334 -- the shell command is 
>>>> not Unicode aware in returning it's results. On OSX, the results are UTF8 
>>>> encoded (discovered by accident) and so an extra step is needed to text 
>>>> decode them, but on Windows it is a complete failure and any Unicode 
>>>> results of the command line - SHOWN 100% correctly is executed in the 
>>>> command line - are returned NATIVE encoded, causing all Unicode characters 
>>>> to become question marks.
>>>> 
>>>> I have written work-around for both of these bugs that can be found in the 
>>>> bug reports. My work-around for the "details files" is slow, due to 
>>>> repeated calls to shell to fetch file properties one at a time.
>>>> 
>>>> If anyone else out there has run into these bugs in your own code and 
>>>> developed a faster work-around for the "detailed files" and would care to 
>>>> share, I would welcome a faster fix.
>>>> 
>>>> Of course, I'd welcome a fix from LiveCode, Ltd. to these bugs even more!
>>>> 
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>>> 
>>> 
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Re: Unicode is not "everywhere"...

[dsc--- via use-livecode]

I tried it.

on mouseUp
   set the shellCommand to "cmd.exe /u"
   put textDecode( shell("dir"), "UTF-16" )
end mouseUp

That does seem to double up the newlines. It looks like it works otherwise.

Dar


> On Aug 22, 2019, at 12:15 PM, dsc--- via use-livecode 
>  wrote:
> 
> The shellCommand property for Windows is "cmd.exe", not "command.com 
> <http://command.com/>" as described in the dictionary.
> 
> I wonder how setting that to "cmd.exe /u" would affect this behavior.
> 
>> On Aug 22, 2019, at 10:19 AM, Dar Scott Consulting via use-livecode 
>>  wrote:
>> 
>> Concerning 22335...
>> 
>> 1. I wonder if anyone uses shell() to return binary values.
>> 
>> 2. I wonder about whether using the shellCommand property would help.
>> 
>>> On Aug 22, 2019, at 9:37 AM, Paul Dupuis via use-livecode 
>>>  wrote:
>>> 
>>> I have filed two bug reports that are in LC905rc1 and go back to 7.0 where 
>>> LC functions that should deal with Unicode properly do not.
>>> 
>>> These are:
>>> https://quality.livecode.com/show_bug.cgi?id=22213 -- The "detailed files" 
>>> function fails for any files with Unicode in the name, returning the 
>>> filename with %3F (?) instead of the Unicode characters properly URL 
>>> encoded (they should be UFT8 encoded and then URL encoded)
>>> and
>>> https://quality.livecode.com/show_bug.cgi?id=22334 -- the shell command is 
>>> not Unicode aware in returning it's results. On OSX, the results are UTF8 
>>> encoded (discovered by accident) and so an extra step is needed to text 
>>> decode them, but on Windows it is a complete failure and any Unicode 
>>> results of the command line - SHOWN 100% correctly is executed in the 
>>> command line - are returned NATIVE encoded, causing all Unicode characters 
>>> to become question marks.
>>> 
>>> I have written work-around for both of these bugs that can be found in the 
>>> bug reports. My work-around for the "details files" is slow, due to 
>>> repeated calls to shell to fetch file properties one at a time.
>>> 
>>> If anyone else out there has run into these bugs in your own code and 
>>> developed a faster work-around for the "detailed files" and would care to 
>>> share, I would welcome a faster fix.
>>> 
>>> Of course, I'd welcome a fix from LiveCode, Ltd. to these bugs even more!
>>> 
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Re: Unicode is not "everywhere"...

[dsc--- via use-livecode]

The shellCommand property for Windows is "cmd.exe", not "command.com 
" as described in the dictionary.

I wonder how setting that to "cmd.exe /u" would affect this behavior.

> On Aug 22, 2019, at 10:19 AM, Dar Scott Consulting via use-livecode 
>  wrote:
> 
> Concerning 22335...
> 
> 1. I wonder if anyone uses shell() to return binary values.
> 
> 2. I wonder about whether using the shellCommand property would help.
> 
>> On Aug 22, 2019, at 9:37 AM, Paul Dupuis via use-livecode 
>>  wrote:
>> 
>> I have filed two bug reports that are in LC905rc1 and go back to 7.0 where 
>> LC functions that should deal with Unicode properly do not.
>> 
>> These are:
>> https://quality.livecode.com/show_bug.cgi?id=22213 -- The "detailed files" 
>> function fails for any files with Unicode in the name, returning the 
>> filename with %3F (?) instead of the Unicode characters properly URL encoded 
>> (they should be UFT8 encoded and then URL encoded)
>> and
>> https://quality.livecode.com/show_bug.cgi?id=22334 -- the shell command is 
>> not Unicode aware in returning it's results. On OSX, the results are UTF8 
>> encoded (discovered by accident) and so an extra step is needed to text 
>> decode them, but on Windows it is a complete failure and any Unicode results 
>> of the command line - SHOWN 100% correctly is executed in the command line - 
>> are returned NATIVE encoded, causing all Unicode characters to become 
>> question marks.
>> 
>> I have written work-around for both of these bugs that can be found in the 
>> bug reports. My work-around for the "details files" is slow, due to repeated 
>> calls to shell to fetch file properties one at a time.
>> 
>> If anyone else out there has run into these bugs in your own code and 
>> developed a faster work-around for the "detailed files" and would care to 
>> share, I would welcome a faster fix.
>> 
>> Of course, I'd welcome a fix from LiveCode, Ltd. to these bugs even more!
>> 
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Re: Rocky islands

[dsc--- via use-livecode]

I wonder if my Brother MFC-9840CDW multifunction laser printer will make the 
leap to 64-bit-only Catalina. I will probably be able to find generic print 
drivers. I think it would be able to scan by email or USB, but maybe generic 
TWAIN will work. Sending a fax might take some looking about. I'm thinking 
maybe it will make the leap, but with a little work, not "it just works". 

I feel like I just got it. I got it when doing some barcode and "scantron" work 
with LiveCode. I stopped printing out big notebooks long ago, so it is lasting 
longer than Brother probably thought it would. Even so, Brother and Apple seem 
to have put that model to pasture. 

Rambling... At 85 lbs, it violates my 30 lb lab limit. (Getting older, you 
know.) But, I just filled it with toner... (Oh, if someone is thinking of 
surprising me with a Mac Pro, that weight limit goes up to 50 pounds.)

So...  Catalina.

> On Jul 22, 2019, at 9:21 AM, Dar Scott Consulting via use-livecode 
>  wrote:
> 
> In trying to take a positive view on this...
> 
> Voice command and Sidecar might make it easier to step aside in a demo or 
> presentation.  
> 
> Sidecar might be handy as a sketch input. Maybe. You know, like an 
> alternative mouse.
> 
> Sidecar might be a handy place to put the Message Box or a debug window.
> 
> Screen Time might be handy for those of us who feel we goof off too much. (I 
> use Qbserve for time management.)
> 
> Color filter options can help those with color vision deficiencies and help 
> others see problem colors on a broader context. 
> 
> The Notes enhancements look interesting. (I am readying for an electronic lab 
> notebook, but Notes might delay that; I'll try it.)
> 
> Being able to run some iOS apps on the Mac is cool, but I wish it could run 
> all, transparently. It is frustrating to find just the right app and, oh, it 
> is iOS only.
> 
> Isolating the system from stuff I try is cool. 
> 
> Metal!
> 
> 
> However, crowd-sourced Bluetooth locating is scary. 
> 
> And the first time to run an app can take a while, it seems, but maybe that 
> is really a good thing.
> 
> 
> 
>> On Jul 22, 2019, at 8:43 AM, Bob Sneidar via use-livecode 
>>  wrote:
>> 
>> Sounds like you are inferring a lot more into that PR fluff piece than is 
>> warranted. I didn't see anywhere in the statement the word, "only". Are you 
>> saying that Catalina will ONLY do those things listed in the statement, and 
>> nothing else? That seems extreme to me. 
>> 
>> Bob S
>> 
>> 
>>> On Jul 21, 2019, at 14:31 , Richmond via use-livecode 
>>>  wrote:
>>> 
>>> "macOS Catalina gives you more of everything you love about Mac. Experience 
>>> music, TV, and podcasts in three all-new Mac apps. Enjoy your favorite iPad 
>>> apps now on your Mac. Extend your workspace and expand your creativity with 
>>> iPad and Apple Pencil. And discover smart new features in the apps you use 
>>> every day. Now you can take everything you do above and beyond."
>>> 
>>> Wow: I can translate that into far, far easier language:
>>> 
>>> macOS Catalina gives you more of a plastic bathtoy; an extended gramophone 
>>> player, TV, fancy telephone and pornogram, and less of what I was brought 
>>> up to believe a computer really should be.
>>> 
>>> Mind you, the "mene, mene, tekel, up-yours!" was there for all to see when 
>>> Steve Jobs killed off Hypercard.
>>> 
>>> "Enjoy" . . . Cor! John Calvin was right.
>>> 
>>> Love, Richmond.
>> 
>> 
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Re: Help with an algorithm...

[dsc--- via use-livecode]

I fixed this to use lists... Maybe.

put parentArray( LISTNEW ) into aNew
put parentArray( LISTOLD )  into aOld
intersect aNew with aOld  -- Remove from aOld that which is not in aNew
union aOld with aNew recursively -- Leaves aNew unchanged except that children 
in aOld are brought in. I think.
put parentList(  aNew ) into LISTNEW

Parents and children are keys in the arrays built. Children are sub-arrays of 
parents.

> On Aug 5, 2019, at 12:31 PM, Dar Scott Consulting via use-livecode 
>  wrote:
> 
> I'm pretty sure I goofed somewhere, but maybe something like this?
> 
> intersect ARRAYNEW with ARRAYOLD into temp
> union temp with ARRAYNEW recursively
> 
> 
>> On Aug 5, 2019, at 9:53 AM, Paul Dupuis via use-livecode 
>>  wrote:
>> 
>> Today is not my coding day. I have a problem I should be able to design a 
>> solution for an am struggling. Clearly I am missing "something"
>> 
>> I have 2 lists (LISTNEW and LISTOLD) of the following format:
>> 
>> ParentA
>> Child 1
>> Child 2
>> etc.
>> ParentB
>> Child 1
>> etc.
>> etc.
>> 
>> The parents are in alphabetical sorted order, the children may not be in 
>> sorted order
>> 
>> I need to hunt through LISTOLD comparing the LISTOLD Parents to the LISTNEW 
>> Parents
>>  FOR any LISTOLD Parent present in LISTNEW, check the Children of the 
>> matching Parents and add any Child for the LISTOLD Parent that is not 
>> already under its matching LISTNEW Parent
>>  FOR any LISTOLD Parent NOT in LISTNEW, I can ignore the Parent and its 
>> Children
>> 
>> I can not seem to write an approach to solve this today. Does any body have 
>> some code so solve this they may be willing to share?
>> 
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Re: [OT] Weighted distribution of Numbers

[dsc--- via use-livecode]

I'm unsure how often 800 or so changes. I'll call it 800, it is just a name. 
Values can range from 0 through 800.

You can map a number in that range to 0-1 by dividing by 800. That is, 
scaled1(n) is n/800.

I guess you want to map each number n in that into one of 101 bins, 0 through 
100. 
Perhaps something like this: trunc( 100.9 * scaled(n) ) 

However you want to tweak at the top, so this might become trunc( 100.9 * 
tweak( scaled(n) ) )

The function tweak takes a number from 0 to 1 and returns a number from 0 to 1 
where
tweak(0) = 0
tweak(1) = 1
if x >= y then tweak(x) >= tweak(y)

A straight line fits that but that isn't what you want.

Here are some definitions for tweak() you might try:
x [that straight line]
2*x/(1+x)
sin(x * pi/2)
some other sine thing that is symmetrical
piecewise linear
1- sqrt( 1-x )
min( 1, 1.03*x) [special case of piecewise]

However, if you want tweaking to depend on the entire dataset, then there is 
more work.



> On Aug 4, 2019, at 3:09 PM, Dar Scott Consulting via use-livecode 
>  wrote:
> 
> Oh, good. I was worrying that you might have a bad customer. 
> 
>> On Aug 4, 2019, at 3:05 PM, Ralph DiMola via use-livecode 
>>  wrote:
>> 
>> 
>> I'm not plotting this but using it for searching.
>> 
>> I'm not really lying. I'm trying to come up with the raw numbers from many
>> individual components. It's like "Gone with the Wind" and "Apocalypse Now"
>> both getting 100 on Rotten Tomatoes. But if you looked under the hood and
>> added up components such as sound, costumes, artwork, casting... and applied
>> a weight to each then "Apocalypse Now" might get a raw rating of 800 and
>> "Gone with the Wind" get a 790. But they are both so close to the top I
>> would want them to both get 100. I can do this via the "human factor" by
>> manually adjusting some of the results(mostly at the top) but I would like
>> to somewhat automate it so when the components change I will do a
>> re-calculation run and say the top number goes up by 25 all the manual
>> adjustments go out the window. I want this to be somewhat automated.
>> 
>> Ralph DiMola
>> IT Director
>> Evergreen Information Services
>> rdim...@evergreeninfo.net
>> 
>> 
>> -Original Message-
>> From: use-livecode [mailto:use-livecode-boun...@lists.runrev.com] On Behalf
>> Of Dar Scott Consulting via use-livecode
>> Sent: Sunday, August 04, 2019 4:33 PM
>> To: How to use LiveCode
>> Cc: Dar Scott Consulting
>> Subject: Re: [OT] Weighted distribution of Numbers
>> 
>> I was thinking the same, but was to afraid to say it. Yes, the actual name
>> is "lying".
>> 
>> However, there might be an honest attempt to display crowded dots or icons.
>> 
>>> On Aug 4, 2019, at 2:19 PM, hh via use-livecode
>>  wrote:
>>> 
 Ralph D. wrote:
 I'm sure there's an actual name for doing this in the statistician's 
 world but I don't know what it is.
>>> 
>>> This has nothing to do with "statistics".
>>> This is simply "try to lie by data cheating".
>>> 
>>> 
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Re: Making "read from file" less blocky.

[dsc--- via use-livecode]

Even more "really out there" of the "really out there".

Don't read in the file.  

Access portions JIT, that is, lazily.

Create a function that pulls in segments of the file. Kinda like this:

function segmentOfFile pStartIndex, pEndIndex, pThisFile 

Or this:

function segmentOfCurrentFile pStartIndex, pEndIndex

Dar

> On Aug 4, 2019, at 1:22 PM, dsc--- via use-livecode 
>  wrote:
> 
> More "really out there".
> 
> I like the idea of trying to speed up an upfront foreground load. Something 
> simple like this:
> 
> put blah-plah into IntoThisVariable.
> 
> where blah-blah is nana-nana or decompress( nana-nana ) 
> where nana-nana is one of these:
>   URL ("binfile:" & ThisFile)
>   shell("cat " & ThisFile)
> 
> Function decompress() makes two RAM hits and requires control over the loaded 
> files. 
> 
> 
>> On Aug 4, 2019, at 12:47 PM, Dar Scott Consulting via use-livecode 
>>  wrote:
>> 
>> I love "really out there".  I wanna play.
>> 
>> At the start of any solution, try this. It might speed up any method but 
>> would take some time at the start.
>> 
>> get shell( "cat " & ThisFile & " > dev/null" )
>> 
>> I think that is likely to pre-load the system file buffers for you. 
>> 
>> If one is feeling adventurous, one can try open process (cat) to avoid the 
>> wait; it will probably move through the file faster than the script and 
>> sectors will already be loaded when you ask for them.
>> 
>> Dar
>> 
>>> On Aug 4, 2019, at 7:59 AM, Alex Tweedly via use-livecode 
>>>  wrote:
>>> 
>>> OK, here's a "really out there" suggestion 
>>> 
>>> 1. Run a local web server  to serve files (locally only).
>>> 
>>>Can be done various ways, including (easily) via LC and the httpd 
>>> library,
>>> 
>>>   (build that server as a standalone and have it running - started from 
>>> your app if need be...)
>>> 
>>> 2. in your stack, just do
>>> 
>>> load url ("http://localhost:8080/myfilename;) with message "mycallback"
>>> 
>>> and handle the file once it has been read in the "mycallback" handler
>>> 
>>> -- Alex.
>>> 
>>> 
>>> On 04/08/2019 01:56, Tom Glod via use-livecode wrote:
>>>> Hey folks,
>>>> 
>>>> I'm having trouble finding a combination of settings that allows my file
>>>> loading  to seem to happen in the background.
>>>> 
>>>> repeat while read_result is not "eof"
>>>>read from file ThisFile for (1024 * 1000) bytes
>>>>put the result into read_result
>>>>put it after IntoThisVariable
>>>>add length(it) to amount_read
>>>>TSTProgress amount_read,ExpectedSize,"%","Loading File ..."
>>>> (Progress Indicator Handler)
>>>>wait 10 milliseconds with messages
>>>> end repeat
>>>> 
>>>> no matter what I try, its still sluggish, and it seems like messages are
>>>> still accumilating instead of being processed by the engine.
>>>> 
>>>> Am I missing something?  Normally waiting with messages sufficiently frees
>>>> the engine to allow the UI to remain responsive.
>>>> 
>>>> Thanks,
>>>> 
>>>> Tom
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Re: Making "read from file" less blocky.

[dsc--- via use-livecode]

More "really out there".

I like the idea of trying to speed up an upfront foreground load. Something 
simple like this:

put blah-plah into IntoThisVariable.

where blah-blah is nana-nana or decompress( nana-nana ) 
where nana-nana is one of these:
URL ("binfile:" & ThisFile)
shell("cat " & ThisFile)

Function decompress() makes two RAM hits and requires control over the loaded 
files. 


> On Aug 4, 2019, at 12:47 PM, Dar Scott Consulting via use-livecode 
>  wrote:
> 
> I love "really out there".  I wanna play.
> 
> At the start of any solution, try this. It might speed up any method but 
> would take some time at the start.
> 
> get shell( "cat " & ThisFile & " > dev/null" )
> 
> I think that is likely to pre-load the system file buffers for you. 
> 
> If one is feeling adventurous, one can try open process (cat) to avoid the 
> wait; it will probably move through the file faster than the script and 
> sectors will already be loaded when you ask for them.
> 
> Dar
> 
>> On Aug 4, 2019, at 7:59 AM, Alex Tweedly via use-livecode 
>>  wrote:
>> 
>> OK, here's a "really out there" suggestion 
>> 
>> 1. Run a local web server  to serve files (locally only).
>> 
>> Can be done various ways, including (easily) via LC and the httpd 
>> library,
>> 
>>(build that server as a standalone and have it running - started from 
>> your app if need be...)
>> 
>> 2. in your stack, just do
>> 
>>  load url ("http://localhost:8080/myfilename;) with message "mycallback"
>> 
>> and handle the file once it has been read in the "mycallback" handler
>> 
>> -- Alex.
>> 
>> 
>> On 04/08/2019 01:56, Tom Glod via use-livecode wrote:
>>> Hey folks,
>>> 
>>> I'm having trouble finding a combination of settings that allows my file
>>> loading  to seem to happen in the background.
>>> 
>>>  repeat while read_result is not "eof"
>>> read from file ThisFile for (1024 * 1000) bytes
>>> put the result into read_result
>>> put it after IntoThisVariable
>>> add length(it) to amount_read
>>> TSTProgress amount_read,ExpectedSize,"%","Loading File ..."
>>> (Progress Indicator Handler)
>>> wait 10 milliseconds with messages
>>>  end repeat
>>> 
>>> no matter what I try, its still sluggish, and it seems like messages are
>>> still accumilating instead of being processed by the engine.
>>> 
>>> Am I missing something?  Normally waiting with messages sufficiently frees
>>> the engine to allow the UI to remain responsive.
>>> 
>>> Thanks,
>>> 
>>> Tom
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Re: Challenge: who can background this shell command?

[dsc--- via use-livecode]

I feel foolish. From the dictionary:


Note: On OS X systems, you can use the open process command to start up an 
application, but not a Unix process. To work with a Unix process, use the shell 
func instead.

When I saw this in the Dictionary, I thought, "Oh, when did this break?"

I should have thought, "Oh, yeah?"


> On Aug 1, 2019, at 10:03 AM, Dar Scott Consulting via use-livecode 
>  wrote:
> 
> So, this is a documentation problem?
> 
>> On Aug 1, 2019, at 9:27 AM, Mark Waddingham via use-livecode 
>>  wrote:
>> 
>> On 2019-08-01 17:12, David Bovill via use-livecode wrote:
>>> OK - so I have it working by writing to a temporary file.
>>> Trying to redirect the output to stdout - so that shell() return the
>>> information of the background process - but this freezes:
>> 
>> Okay so given you want to read/write to the process you launched it seems...
>> 
>> What's wrong with open process? The *only* difference between open process
>> on macOS compared to Linux (and Windows) is that if you try and open process
>> an app-bundle (i.e. something ending with '.app') it will do the same as
>> launch (as .app bundles aren't executables).
>> 
>> The installer uses open (elevated) process to communicate with an instance
>> of itself with elevated permissions. You can see the code for that here:
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> The key routines are installerRun and installerMonitor (the latter is used
>> to poll every 20 milliseconds to check if the child process has anything to
>> say).
>> 
>> Warmest Regards,
>> 
>> Mark.
>> 
>> -- 
>> Mark Waddingham ~ m...@livecode.com ~ http://www.livecode.com/
>> LiveCode: Everyone can create apps
>> 
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Re: source of a socket error message

[dsc--- via use-livecode]

Also...

If you have control of these sites and even if you use an ISP DNS service, you 
can add a secondary DNS IP address, perhaps a public recursive name server such 
as the Google Public DNS (8.8.8.8).  This will add a robustness without 
upgrading the software.

If you don't manage those, you can you can upgrade the software to access a 
public name server directly with TLS, or use DNS over HTTPS. DNS over HTTPS is 
not as easy as it sounds, but should be doable. It is available without 
filtering from Google, Quad9 (use 9.9.9.10 for no filtering), or (if you don't 
use Cisco) Cloudflare 1.1.1.1.

You might want to add some network diagnostics, where you can log or otherwise 
report the results. This will help solidify your analysis.

If you have control over the server and know the IP address will never change, 
you can skip the name lookup and just use the IP address. 

> On Jul 17, 2019, at 7:51 PM, Dar Scott via use-livecode 
>  wrote:
> 
> This is very likely a loss of network availability and of that a loss of 
> Internet availability.
> 
> The library will first look up the URI to get an IP address. The IP address 
> is used to make a connection to the server.  The computer has (or can get) an 
> IP address to use for making that look up.  Since that this the first 
> operation, a loss of Internet will show up with that error.
> 
> If you are sure there is access to the Internet, then it might be that the 
> DNS server is down. That seems unlikely, but possible. If the server IP is 
> fixed, then use a cached version of the IP. Use hostNameToAddress() to get 
> the IP address, save that on success, use the saved address on failure.
> 
> 
>> On Jul 17, 2019, at 6:27 PM, Douglas Ruisaard via use-livecode 
>>  wrote:
>> 
>> Let me start this off by stating that the information I am seeking IS NOT 
>> due to an *issue* with LC.  Hopefully, I can make it clear why I am asking 
>> for assistance from this group in regard to the situation I am trying to 
>> deal with and why I need the LC expertise of this group as a resource.
>> 
>> In a portion of a large application, which has been distributed to a large 
>> number (5,000+) of remote/external sites, I have a call to a TCP socket:
>> 
>> on OpenCard 
>> ...
>>put ftp_server & ":" & tcp_port into temp1
>>open socket to temp1 with message "NewConnection"
>>wait for messages  
>> end OpenCard
>> 
>> Then there are a variety of "call-backs" based on when happens after I open 
>> the socket.  One of these call-backs is "socketError":
>> 
>> on socketError theID, theError
>>close socket theID
>>do_log " " & sftp_account && "file: " & "There is a problem with the TCP 
>> connection: " & theError, "connect", 3
>>  ...
>> end socketError
>> 
>> This works PERFECTLY 99.999% of the time.  However, occasionally I get a 
>> "mass" of errors (50 or 60) within a 1 hour period of time from a large 
>> variety of different external sites (I get all of the remote site's logs) 
>> ... i.e. many different sites connecting in from many different locations 
>> around the province of Ontario ... a very large place!
>> 
>> The error returned is: "can't resolve hostname"... returned in the 
>> "theError" parameter of the socketError function.
>> 
>> Here's where I need help.  I need to find out, with as great a level of 
>> detail as possible, EXACTLY what (from LC's "point-of-view") triggers this 
>> error, what part(s) of the LC engine are involved with generating this error 
>> and if there is more than the obvious cause of the remote site's DNS server 
>> (via their ISP or internal server(s)) not being able to "see" the hostname 
>> that could produce this error.
>> 
>> Although this "error" appears to be "common" from a variety of sources (none 
>> of which are written in LC, as far as I can tell)... I cannot find any 
>> "standard" by  which a DNS generates this specific message.  NSLOOKUP would 
>> be the closest candidate but even it doesn't produce this specific error of 
>> being "unable to resolve the hostname"... so that leaves LC with the 
>> responsibility of the content of the error.
>> 
>> I REALLY want to emphasize that, as far as I am concerned, this is not a 
>> problem with LC, in any manner... but I need to find out where and why LC 
>> generates this message.
>> 
>> I am not sure what or where to search for this error or what generates it 
>> from with the LC components but if someone could help me "find" a starting 
>> point, I should be able to reverse-engineer the logic.
>> 
>> The overall situation is fairly complex but I'd be very open to providing 
>> more details if anyone feels it is warranted.
>> 
>> Whatever help could be provided will be very, very appreciated!
>> 
>> Douglas Ruisaard
>> Trilogy Software
>> (250) 573-3935
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
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Re: CTD meaning?

[dsc--- via use-livecode]

Ah. I looked it up. (Should have done that first.) A CTD is a crash without a 
dialog box explaining the crash or even indicating a crash. 

I have gotten that. 

Recently in 9.5.0 DP1, the IDE got a memory error, then the crash reporter got 
the same error, and then something else deeper got the error. So, I didn't get 
a crash log for LiveCode.

> On Jun 28, 2019, at 7:50 AM, Dar Scott Consulting via use-livecode 
>  wrote:
> 
> Is that different from a just plain crash?
> 
> 
>> On Jun 28, 2019, at 5:52 AM, Paul Dupuis via use-livecode 
>>  wrote:
>> 
>> On 6/28/2019 5:02 AM, Lagi Pittas via use-livecode wrote:
>>> Crash To Desktop?
>> Yes.
>> 
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Re: $1,000 Bounty For LiveCode Bug 20240

[dsc--- via use-livecode]

Whoops. That is a couple years old. I need to get my coffee.


> On Jun 18, 2019, at 9:41 AM, Dar Scott Consulting via use-livecode 
>  wrote:
> 
> A hint for bounty hunters:
> It seems to me I have seen this outside of LiveCode. Perhaps the bug is a 
> common one.
> I'm on a Mac.
> 
> I don't trust my memory; YMMD.
> 
> 
> 
>> On Aug 14, 2017, at 5:38 PM, RunRevPlanet via use-livecode 
>>  wrote:
>> 
>> Hi,
>> 
>> Over at LiveCode Quality Control Centre (QCC) there is a Bug 20240 has been a
>> problem for me lately. 
>> 
>> I understand that a significant effort has been put into finding a fix over 
>> the
>> past years, but without success. The problem behaviour has been reported 
>> before,
>> my report is simply the latest one. And since it cannot be reproduced on 
>> demand
>> it is a tough one to solve.
>> 
>> There is a video of it at QCC at that shows what happens, if you have not 
>> come
>> across it yourself.
>> 
>> To encourage more eyes to look at the code, I have put up a bounty of 
>> $1,000AUD
>> to the individual who resolves the problem with a fix.
>> 
>> More details are in the bug report here:
>> 
>> http://quality.livecode.com/show_bug.cgi?id=20240
>> 
>> If you have any questions about the bug, or the bounty, I can answer them 
>> here.
>> 
>> Note it is only Australian dollars, but depending on the exchange rate, or 
>> where
>> you live that might be a bonus?
>> 
>> Good luck! And I really hope to be able to reward someone with this money!
>> --
>> Scott McDonald
>> http://thelivecodelab.com/
>> 
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Re: math on widths doesn't add up

[dsc--- via use-livecode]

For some reason the message below was delayed a while and thus is out of order.

Looking back, I see hh has been mentioning things like first pixel and counting 
pixels. This might be where there is confusion. I was referring to pixels by 
the LiveCode reference. 

> On Jun 14, 2019, at 4:13 PM, Dar Scott Consulting via use-livecode 
>  wrote:
> 
> When we apply math, we must map what we see to our mathematical models.  What 
> we see is LiveCode.  The application of math is thus an interpretation. (The 
> interpretation of calendar year or how-old-are-you might not apply.)
> 
> I do agree with you, except for the part that one has to redefine width and 
> height. A delta does not depend on the offset.
> 
> If I create a line from 0,0 to 100,0; I get a line visible on the card, not a 
> line just off the card. The LiveCode line is between the coordinates we are 
> talking about, that is, a half pixel moved in from those, creating pixel 
> coordinates off from what we are saying.
> 
> I can get the same thing with a rectangle of rect 0, 0, 101, 1. Well, if the 
> border width is zero and the fill color is set.  This uses the coordinates we 
> are talking about. The rectangle is filled.  
> 
> The one-pixel width of the line causes it to fill that space. If there is a 
> 1-pixel square as a brush and it went from 0.5 to 100.5, it would sweep out 
> the same space as the rectangle
> 
> However, others might have a view, an interpretation, that also works. 
> 
> 
> 
>> On Jun 14, 2019, at 3:04 PM, hh via use-livecode 
>>  wrote:
>> 
>> This is interestingly the same problem that made a lot of people believe
>> two thousand years were full at the end of 1999/ beginning of 2000.
>> Two thousand years were full at the END of 2000/ beginning of 2001:
>> 
>> Full year 1 has the left 0, the right 1 and the width = right-left = 1 year, 
>> ...,
>> full years 1 to 2000 have the left 0, the right 2000 and the width = 
>> right-left = 2000 years.
>> 
>>> Dar S. wrote:
>>> I like this interpretation. I don't think it is a popular view, but it 
>>> makes sense to me.
>>> I would change the range wording, though, to something like this:
>>> Pixel 0 ranges from 0 to 1.
>>> For example, the rect of a card has zeros.
>>> Maybe it depends on whether one wants to draw pixels on the intersections 
>>> of the lines
>>> on the graph paper, or in between.
>> 
>> No, this is math, not an interpretation. If you agree that counting pixels 
>> is one-based
>> then there is no pixel 0.
>> 
>> Rect (0,0,0,0) has left 0, right 0, top 0, bottom 0, width 0 and height 0, 
>> contains 0 pixels.
>> In fact it is degenerated to the point (0,0).
>> 
>> Rect (0,0,1,1) is one pixel, the first pixel on your coordinate system.
>> It has left 0, right 1, top 0, bottom 1 and width 1, height 1.
>> 
>> The width of a rect is the number of its pixel columns,
>> the height of a rect is the number of its pixel rows,
>> width*height of a rect is the number of its enclosed pixels.
>> 
>> If you wisth to count zero-based the you have to redefine width and height.
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