Re: Is there a mapping table for all rawKeyUp Codes? No solution yet with LC 8
Fine, 'textchanged' solves your problem. But the bug revealed by this thread still remains. So just to 'round up' (also with regards to HTML5) this discussion with a working method for getting keyCodes and characterCodes. One could also use javascript for that, see here, also for a good explanation of the difference there and a *** try it yourself ***: http://www.w3schools.com/jsref/event_key_keycode.asp This is probably reliable on "all" systems that LC supports. ___ use-livecode mailing list use-livecode@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-livecode
AW: AW: Is there a mapping table for all rawKeyUp Codes? No solution yet with LC 8
Hello Hermann, Thank you, issues solved, see my replies to Mark from this morning Tiemo -Ursprüngliche Nachricht- Von: use-livecode [mailto:use-livecode-boun...@lists.runrev.com] Im Auftrag von hh Gesendet: Dienstag, 6. Dezember 2016 13:33 An: use-livecode@lists.runrev.com Betreff: Re: AW: Is there a mapping table for all rawKeyUp Codes? No solution yet with LC 8 Tiemo wrote: > Can I rely on this workaround to get the correct chars, which have > been entered on "all" systems? TMHO: No. As a workaround to get the "char input" this isn't reliable on _any_ system or hardware configuration. You only *guess* with that: IF the user uses a 'usual' keyboard layout, then he'll get from that key press a certain character. Currently I'm using a german keyboard on an english system (because my english keyboard was drunk from a cup of cappucino). But I use the english keyboard layout. So my "ö" yields ";". But it's always the keyCode 59. While the characterCode is what you get from charToNum(). Using "Ukelele" (good site for writing systems and character encoding) http://scripts.sil.org/cms/scripts/page.php?site_id=nrsi=ukelele I can use my "ö" for (nearly all) other keypresses. And the keyCode is always 59. ___ use-livecode mailing list use-livecode@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-livecode ___ use-livecode mailing list use-livecode@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-livecode
Re: AW: Is there a mapping table for all rawKeyUp Codes? No solution yet with LC 8
Tiemo wrote: > Can I rely on this workaround to get the correct chars, which > have been entered on "all" systems? TMHO: No. As a workaround to get the "char input" this isn't reliable on _any_ system or hardware configuration. You only *guess* with that: IF the user uses a 'usual' keyboard layout, then he'll get from that key press a certain character. Currently I'm using a german keyboard on an english system (because my english keyboard was drunk from a cup of cappucino). But I use the english keyboard layout. So my "ö" yields ";". But it's always the keyCode 59. While the characterCode is what you get from charToNum(). Using "Ukelele" (good site for writing systems and character encoding) http://scripts.sil.org/cms/scripts/page.php?site_id=nrsi=ukelele I can use my "ö" for (nearly all) other keypresses. And the keyCode is always 59. ___ use-livecode mailing list use-livecode@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-livecode
Re: AW: Is there a mapping table for all rawKeyUp Codes? No solution yet with LC 8
Tiemo wrote: > You say Apple changed the keyboard mapping. NO, I said, Apple changed his keyboard mapping _method_. That's why developers had to change the lookup method for the mapping. Anyway, 'the keysdown' and 'rawkeydown/up' should return the _hardware_ code [keydown/up may return, basically different, the character (or the character code).] Currently (MacOS 10.12, LC 8 and up) only 'the keysdown' is correct. ___ use-livecode mailing list use-livecode@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-livecode
AW: Is there a mapping table for all rawKeyUp Codes? No solution yet with LC 8
FYI, Mark Waddingham has just answered this issue in the QC: " Whilst Panos has observed a difference between the pre-Cocoa and Cocoa Mac engines, it was actually incorrect in the pre-Cocoa engines. The raw keycodes are the keycodes of the actual keyboard keys and not the characters they represent. The same key will give the same raw keycode regardless of keyboard layout and it will be unaffected by the modifier key state (alt, shift etc.)." Tiemo -Ursprüngliche Nachricht- Von: use-livecode [mailto:use-livecode-boun...@lists.runrev.com] Im Auftrag von Tiemo Hollmann TB Gesendet: Dienstag, 6. Dezember 2016 08:45 An: 'How to use LiveCode' <use-livecode@lists.runrev.com> Betreff: AW: Is there a mapping table for all rawKeyUp Codes? No solution yet with LC 8 Thanks Hermann and Paul for clarifying this to me. I didn't noticed the difference to *the keysdown* You say Apple changed the keyboard mapping. I have no idea, if and how this could affect now LC 8 concerning backward compatibility with older systems. Will the keysdown give me on "all" systems (from 10.8-10.12) the same codes, if Apple changed something in any system? Can I rely on this workaround to get the correct chars, which have been entered on "all" systems? Has anybody a best guest on how to handle this? Tiemo P.S. yes I filed it in the QC -Ursprüngliche Nachricht- Von: use-livecode [mailto:use-livecode-boun...@lists.runrev.com] Im Auftrag von hh Gesendet: Montag, 5. Dezember 2016 23:27 An: use-livecode@lists.runrev.com Betreff: Re: Is there a mapping table for all rawKeyUp Codes? No solution yet with LC 8 Hi all. Yes that's the point: *The keysDown* return the correct (hardware) keyCode. Tiemo is right, there is a bug introduced around LC 8. From the dictionary: "The keycodes returned by the keysDown function are the same as those passed as parameters with the rawKeyDown and rawKeyUp messages." That's not true (I tested with all latest versions of LC 8.1.1 and up and Paul confirmed for some). Thus we can possibly locate the bug: Apple changed his keyboard mapping method around the introduction of LC 8 (it is no longer in easy accessible files but in "layout bundles"). Was _the keysDown_ adjusted by the LC-team and _rawkeyDown/Up_ not? Tiemo, you should definitely report this!? ___ use-livecode mailing list use-livecode@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-livecode ___ use-livecode mailing list use-livecode@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-livecode ___ use-livecode mailing list use-livecode@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-livecode
AW: Is there a mapping table for all rawKeyUp Codes?
Hi Mark, thank you for jumping in. interesting to know your explanations. I was catching the user input to pass it to a SQL for selecting data. I will modify my script to *textChanged* and see what happens (probably it will be solved). Thanks Tiemo -Ursprüngliche Nachricht- Von: use-livecode [mailto:use-livecode-boun...@lists.runrev.com] Im Auftrag von Mark Waddingham Gesendet: Dienstag, 6. Dezember 2016 09:25 An: How to use LiveCode <use-livecode@lists.runrev.com> Betreff: Re: Is there a mapping table for all rawKeyUp Codes? Hi Tiemo, On 2016-11-24 17:31, Tiemo Hollmann TB wrote: > since keyUp doesn't works anymore as it should on windows in LC 7/8 > (see my previous post) I have to workaround with rawKeyUp. Can you explain what effect you are trying to achieve? There might be another way to do what you want. The keyUp message isn't quite what it appears to be - it is a synthetic message generated by the engine *after* passing a keyDown event through the message path. In particular, it has no direct relation to the user actually releasing a key. In theory, keyUp is equivalent to doing: on keyDown pKey send "keyUp pKey" to me in 0 millisecs end keyDown In general, there is no guaranteed one-to-one mapping between key strokes and keyDown/keyUp messages as it can sometimes take multiple key presses to generate a single character (e.g. alt-e e to get e-acute on Mac). This makes doing any wrangling from rawkey codes to characters quite hard - as it depends entirely on the specific keyboard layout a user has set, or which input method is in use. If you are doing entry into a field and want to be notified of a user editing action which has changed the content *after* the content has been changed you could try using the 'textChanged' message. This is sent after any user editing operation has completed, but before the screen is unlocked and the changes displayed. Warmest Regards, Mark. -- Mark Waddingham ~ m...@livecode.com ~ http://www.livecode.com/ LiveCode: Everyone can create apps ___ use-livecode mailing list use-livecode@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-livecode ___ use-livecode mailing list use-livecode@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-livecode
Re: Is there a mapping table for all rawKeyUp Codes?
Hi Tiemo, On 2016-11-24 17:31, Tiemo Hollmann TB wrote: since keyUp doesn't works anymore as it should on windows in LC 7/8 (see my previous post) I have to workaround with rawKeyUp. Can you explain what effect you are trying to achieve? There might be another way to do what you want. The keyUp message isn't quite what it appears to be - it is a synthetic message generated by the engine *after* passing a keyDown event through the message path. In particular, it has no direct relation to the user actually releasing a key. In theory, keyUp is equivalent to doing: on keyDown pKey send "keyUp pKey" to me in 0 millisecs end keyDown In general, there is no guaranteed one-to-one mapping between key strokes and keyDown/keyUp messages as it can sometimes take multiple key presses to generate a single character (e.g. alt-e e to get e-acute on Mac). This makes doing any wrangling from rawkey codes to characters quite hard - as it depends entirely on the specific keyboard layout a user has set, or which input method is in use. If you are doing entry into a field and want to be notified of a user editing action which has changed the content *after* the content has been changed you could try using the 'textChanged' message. This is sent after any user editing operation has completed, but before the screen is unlocked and the changes displayed. Warmest Regards, Mark. -- Mark Waddingham ~ m...@livecode.com ~ http://www.livecode.com/ LiveCode: Everyone can create apps ___ use-livecode mailing list use-livecode@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-livecode
AW: Is there a mapping table for all rawKeyUp Codes? No solution yet with LC 8
Thanks Hermann and Paul for clarifying this to me. I didn't noticed the difference to *the keysdown* You say Apple changed the keyboard mapping. I have no idea, if and how this could affect now LC 8 concerning backward compatibility with older systems. Will the keysdown give me on "all" systems (from 10.8-10.12) the same codes, if Apple changed something in any system? Can I rely on this workaround to get the correct chars, which have been entered on "all" systems? Has anybody a best guest on how to handle this? Tiemo P.S. yes I filed it in the QC -Ursprüngliche Nachricht- Von: use-livecode [mailto:use-livecode-boun...@lists.runrev.com] Im Auftrag von hh Gesendet: Montag, 5. Dezember 2016 23:27 An: use-livecode@lists.runrev.com Betreff: Re: Is there a mapping table for all rawKeyUp Codes? No solution yet with LC 8 Hi all. Yes that's the point: *The keysDown* return the correct (hardware) keyCode. Tiemo is right, there is a bug introduced around LC 8. From the dictionary: "The keycodes returned by the keysDown function are the same as those passed as parameters with the rawKeyDown and rawKeyUp messages." That's not true (I tested with all latest versions of LC 8.1.1 and up and Paul confirmed for some). Thus we can possibly locate the bug: Apple changed his keyboard mapping method around the introduction of LC 8 (it is no longer in easy accessible files but in "layout bundles"). Was _the keysDown_ adjusted by the LC-team and _rawkeyDown/Up_ not? Tiemo, you should definitely report this!? ___ use-livecode mailing list use-livecode@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-livecode ___ use-livecode mailing list use-livecode@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-livecode
Re: Is there a mapping table for all rawKeyUp Codes? No solution yet with LC 8
Hi all. Yes that's the point: *The keysDown* return the correct (hardware) keyCode. Tiemo is right, there is a bug introduced around LC 8. From the dictionary: "The keycodes returned by the keysDown function are the same as those passed as parameters with the rawKeyDown and rawKeyUp messages." That's not true (I tested with all latest versions of LC 8.1.1 and up and Paul confirmed for some). Thus we can possibly locate the bug: Apple changed his keyboard mapping method around the introduction of LC 8 (it is no longer in easy accessible files but in "layout bundles"). Was _the keysDown_ adjusted by the LC-team and _rawkeyDown/Up_ not? Tiemo, you should definitely report this!? ___ use-livecode mailing list use-livecode@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-livecode
Re: Is there a mapping table for all rawKeyUp Codes? No solution yet with LC 8
On Mac OS Sierra 10.12.1 with LC 8.1.2(rc2) and German Keyboard layout I see: Shift + dot (":") the keyname = 58 Shift + ö ("Ö") the keyname = 58 But if you add to these 'the keysDown' as Herman suggested I see: Shift + dot (":") the keyname = 58 and the keysDown = 46,65505 (46 is the : key and 65505 is the shift key) Shift + ö ("Ö") the keyname = 58 and the keysDown = 59,65505 (59 is the ö key and 65505 is the shift key) So you should be able to use the first item of the keysDown to differentiate which key was pressed. Maybe not ideal, but it should work. e.g. put keyname and item 1 of the keysDown Paul > On Dec 5, 2016, at 8:18 AM, Tiemo Hollmann TB <toolb...@kestner.de> wrote: > > Hallo Hermann, > > shift + ö and shift + dot both return 58, anyhow if I give the output tot he > message box or a field. I can't see a script error. For me it's an engine > error. > > Same with "-" and "ß", both return 45. > I don't see a chance on how I could differentiate between "-" and "ß", when > getting 45. > > Perhaps I didn't understood, what you meant to workaround this issue. > > Tiemo > > > -Ursprüngliche Nachricht- > Von: use-livecode [mailto:use-livecode-boun...@lists.runrev.com] Im Auftrag > von hh > Gesendet: Montag, 5. Dezember 2016 14:55 > An: use-livecode@lists.runrev.com > Betreff: Re: AW: Is there a mapping table for all rawKeyUp Codes? No solution > yet with LC 8 > > The '58-example' is obviously a script error: > the message box has always display bugs, you may better use a field for the > display. > > If I understand right, then you want now the keyCode (an event, depending on > _hardware_) and NOT the characterCode (a number representation of the char). > Some Mac apps show, with an abuse of the name, the characterCode and not the > hardware keycode. > > On a german keyboard from Apple the keycodes are on MacOS 10.12.1/LC > 9.0.0-dp2 (65505=shift) > > ö = 59 > Ö = 59,65505 > . = 46 > : = 46,65505 > > This is not contradicting your results if your hardware is different. > > You could think about using ___the keysdown___, for example this works for > me, using a locked field 1 and the following card script (just to see the > difference): > > on idle ; put the keysDown into fld 1 ; end idle > > p.s. For the LC table (Mark's link) you could use: > put baseConvert(hexValue,16,10) into decValue > >> Since the keyup handler is broken, I am still trying to build a table for >> mapping the rawkeyup key to a char. When testing a prototype it seemed to be >> easy, but now there are some pitfalls I don't get over. On Mac OS X 10.11, >> German system, German keyboard I get with some different char the same >> keyname. >> >> When putting the following code into a field: >> *On rawkeyup keyname* >> *put keyname* >> *end rawkeyup* >> >> e.g. >> Entering shift + dot (":") I get the keyname: 58 Entering shift + ö >> ("Ö") I also get the keyname: 58 >> >> ... and others... >> How can I map these keynames back to the char? >> >> Anttis kecode app shows for the first example the keycode 47 and for the >> second example 41. But that’s not what I get from rawkeyup. >> >> And with Marks link to the source code I couldn't find a solution either. >> Because there is only a hex value table included. >> >> Can anybody confirm these doubled codes from rawkeyup (with a German >> keyboard)? >> >> I am stuck with LiveCode 8 >> >> Thanks for any ideas > > ___ > use-livecode mailing list > use-livecode@lists.runrev.com > Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription > preferences: > http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-livecode > > > ___ > use-livecode mailing list > use-livecode@lists.runrev.com > Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription > preferences: > http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-livecode ___ use-livecode mailing list use-livecode@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-livecode
AW: AW: Is there a mapping table for all rawKeyUp Codes? No solution yet with LC 8
Hello Richmond, an essential feature of my main programs, which I just wanted to release in a new Quicktime free version is to enter text. As I have pointed out in my thread "LC 8: no keyUp at fast enter" you can't enter fast text in LC anymore, because the keyup handler (the engine?) swallows chars. Now I wanted to workaround with rawkeyup, catching the codes and mapping them back into the current chars. But now I find that there are duplicate codes in rawkeyup, which prevent me to map the codes back to the current chars. Perhaps my English is too bad, to explain this correct. And I am sure, that it is not an issue of indy, it's an issue of LC 8 (what I need because of working without QT) Tiemo -Ursprüngliche Nachricht- Von: use-livecode [mailto:use-livecode-boun...@lists.runrev.com] Im Auftrag von Richmond Mathewson Gesendet: Montag, 5. Dezember 2016 19:28 An: How to use LiveCode <use-livecode@lists.runrev.com> Betreff: Re: AW: Is there a mapping table for all rawKeyUp Codes? No solution yet with LC 8 Why are you stuck with LiveCode 8? 1. My Indy licence lets me go on downloading commercial versions until it expires (sometime in 2018). 2. If this is not possible, you can, at least, download the Community version of later builds and fiddle around to see what happens there. Richmond. On 12/5/16 1:58 pm, Tiemo Hollmann TB wrote: > Since the keyup handler is broken, I am still trying to build a table for > mapping the rawkeyup key to a char. When testing a prototype it seemed to be > easy, but now there are some pitfalls I don't get over. On Mac OS X 10.11, > German system, German keyboard I get with some different char the same > keyname. > > When putting the following code into a field: > *On rawkeyup keyname* > *put keyname* > *end rawkeyup* > > e.g. > Entering shift + dot (":") I get the keyname: 58 Entering shift + ö > ("Ö") I also get the keyname: 58 > > ... and others... > How can I map these keynames back to the char? > > Anttis kecode app shows for the first example the keycode 47 and for the > second example 41. But that’s not what I get from rawkeyup. > > And with Marks link to the source code I couldn't find a solution either. > Because there is only a hex value table included. > > Can anybody confirm these doubled codes from rawkeyup (with a German > keyboard)? > > I am stuck with LiveCode 8 > > Thanks for any ideas > > > > > -Ursprüngliche Nachricht- > Von: use-livecode [mailto:use-livecode-boun...@lists.runrev.com] Im > Auftrag von Antti Ilola > Gesendet: Sonntag, 27. November 2016 13:55 > An: How to use LiveCode <use-livecode@lists.runrev.com> > Betreff: Re: Is there a mapping table for all rawKeyUp Codes? > > I found this program, maybe useful. > > https://manytricks.com/keycodes/ > > > Antti > > -- Edelleenlähetetty viesti -- >> From: Richmond <richmondmathew...@gmail.com> >> To: How to use LiveCode <use-livecode@lists.runrev.com> >> Cc: >> Date: Sat, 26 Nov 2016 17:17:23 +0200 >> Subject: Re: Is there a mapping table for all rawKeyUp Codes? >> http://forums.livecode.com/viewtopic.php?f=7=28395 >> >> Better than nothing . . . but a long, long way from ideal. >> >> Richmond. >> >> On 24.11.2016 20:31, Mark Waddingham wrote: >> >>> Hi Tiemo, >>> >>> If you search for 'PlatformKeyCode' in this file: >>> >>> https://github.com/livecode/livecode/blob/develop/engine/src/platfor >>> m >>> .h >>> >>> It should give you what you need. >>> >>> Warmest Regards, >>> >>> Mark. >>> >>> Sent from my iPhone >>> >>> On 24 Nov 2016, at 16:31, Tiemo Hollmann TB <toolb...@kestner.de> wrote: >>>> Hello, >>>> >>>> since keyUp doesn't works anymore as it should on windows in LC >>>> 7/8 (see my previous post) I have to workaround with rawKeyUp. >>>> >>>> Does anybody has a togo mapping table of the rawkeyup codes to the >>>> real chars? If not I have to build it myself by testing each char. >>>> >>>> Thanks >>>> >>>> Tiemo >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> ___ >>>> use-livecode mailing list >>>> use-livecode@lists.runrev.com >>>> Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your >>>> subscription preferences: >>>> http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-livecode >>>> >>&
Re: AW: Is there a mapping table for all rawKeyUp Codes? No solution yet with LC 8
Um . . . On 12/5/16 1:58 pm, Tiemo Hollmann TB wrote: Since the keyup handler is broken, I am not entirely sure what you mean by this . . . I am currently running LiveCode 8.1.1 on Mac OS 10.7.5 and have a boring little stack with 2 fields, "ff" & "gg", and this in the cardScript: onrawKeyDown KN putKN intofld "ff" endrawKeyDown onkeyUp KD putKD intofld "gg" endkeyUp and that dumps the rawKey codes into field "ff" and the keycodes into field "gg" just exactly as I would expect it to. I wonder if this is something to do with Mac OS 10.11? I am still trying to build a table for mapping the rawkeyup key to a char. When testing a prototype it seemed to be easy, but now there are some pitfalls I don't get over. On Mac OS X 10.11, German system, German keyboard I get with some different char the same keyname. When putting the following code into a field: *On rawkeyup keyname* *put keyname* *end rawkeyup* e.g. Entering shift + dot (":") I get the keyname: 58 Entering shift + ö ("Ö") I also get the keyname: 58 I have just tried that, and, Yes, you are quite right. If you set up a stack with 2 fields, "ff" & "gg" and put this script in the card: onrawKeyUp KN putKN intofld "ff" endrawKeyUp onkeyDown KD putKD intofld "gg" endkeyDown and then enter shift + dot (":") [German keyboard layout, Mac OS 10.7.5], you do get 58 in fld "ff" and ":" in fld "gg". if you then enter shift + ö ("Ö") you do get 58 in fld "ff" and "Ö" in fld "gg" which does seem very odd indeed. I wonder how Macintosh tells the difference between whether I press key "58" or key "58"? ... and others... How can I map these keynames back to the char? Anttis kecode app shows for the first example the keycode 47 and for the second example 41. But that’s not what I get from rawkeyup. And with Marks link to the source code I couldn't find a solution either. Because there is only a hex value table included. Can anybody confirm these doubled codes from rawkeyup (with a German keyboard)? I am stuck with LiveCode 8 Thanks for any ideas Richmond. ___ use-livecode mailing list use-livecode@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-livecode
Re: AW: Is there a mapping table for all rawKeyUp Codes? No solution yet with LC 8
Why are you stuck with LiveCode 8? 1. My Indy licence lets me go on downloading commercial versions until it expires (sometime in 2018). 2. If this is not possible, you can, at least, download the Community version of later builds and fiddle around to see what happens there. Richmond. On 12/5/16 1:58 pm, Tiemo Hollmann TB wrote: Since the keyup handler is broken, I am still trying to build a table for mapping the rawkeyup key to a char. When testing a prototype it seemed to be easy, but now there are some pitfalls I don't get over. On Mac OS X 10.11, German system, German keyboard I get with some different char the same keyname. When putting the following code into a field: *On rawkeyup keyname* *put keyname* *end rawkeyup* e.g. Entering shift + dot (":") I get the keyname: 58 Entering shift + ö ("Ö") I also get the keyname: 58 ... and others... How can I map these keynames back to the char? Anttis kecode app shows for the first example the keycode 47 and for the second example 41. But that’s not what I get from rawkeyup. And with Marks link to the source code I couldn't find a solution either. Because there is only a hex value table included. Can anybody confirm these doubled codes from rawkeyup (with a German keyboard)? I am stuck with LiveCode 8 Thanks for any ideas -Ursprüngliche Nachricht- Von: use-livecode [mailto:use-livecode-boun...@lists.runrev.com] Im Auftrag von Antti Ilola Gesendet: Sonntag, 27. November 2016 13:55 An: How to use LiveCode <use-livecode@lists.runrev.com> Betreff: Re: Is there a mapping table for all rawKeyUp Codes? I found this program, maybe useful. https://manytricks.com/keycodes/ Antti -- Edelleenlähetetty viesti -- From: Richmond <richmondmathew...@gmail.com> To: How to use LiveCode <use-livecode@lists.runrev.com> Cc: Date: Sat, 26 Nov 2016 17:17:23 +0200 Subject: Re: Is there a mapping table for all rawKeyUp Codes? http://forums.livecode.com/viewtopic.php?f=7=28395 Better than nothing . . . but a long, long way from ideal. Richmond. On 24.11.2016 20:31, Mark Waddingham wrote: Hi Tiemo, If you search for 'PlatformKeyCode' in this file: https://github.com/livecode/livecode/blob/develop/engine/src/platform .h It should give you what you need. Warmest Regards, Mark. Sent from my iPhone On 24 Nov 2016, at 16:31, Tiemo Hollmann TB <toolb...@kestner.de> wrote: Hello, since keyUp doesn't works anymore as it should on windows in LC 7/8 (see my previous post) I have to workaround with rawKeyUp. Does anybody has a togo mapping table of the rawkeyup codes to the real chars? If not I have to build it myself by testing each char. Thanks Tiemo ___ use-livecode mailing list use-livecode@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-livecode ___ use-livecode mailing list use-livecode@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-livecode Am I missing something? Should I expect otherwise? Peter Bogdanoff ___ use-livecode mailing list use-livecode@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-livecode ___ use-livecode mailing list use-livecode@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-livecode ___ use-livecode mailing list use-livecode@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-livecode ___ use-livecode mailing list use-livecode@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-livecode
AW: AW: Is there a mapping table for all rawKeyUp Codes? No solution yet with LC 8
Hallo Hermann, shift + ö and shift + dot both return 58, anyhow if I give the output tot he message box or a field. I can't see a script error. For me it's an engine error. Same with "-" and "ß", both return 45. I don't see a chance on how I could differentiate between "-" and "ß", when getting 45. Perhaps I didn't understood, what you meant to workaround this issue. Tiemo -Ursprüngliche Nachricht- Von: use-livecode [mailto:use-livecode-boun...@lists.runrev.com] Im Auftrag von hh Gesendet: Montag, 5. Dezember 2016 14:55 An: use-livecode@lists.runrev.com Betreff: Re: AW: Is there a mapping table for all rawKeyUp Codes? No solution yet with LC 8 The '58-example' is obviously a script error: the message box has always display bugs, you may better use a field for the display. If I understand right, then you want now the keyCode (an event, depending on _hardware_) and NOT the characterCode (a number representation of the char). Some Mac apps show, with an abuse of the name, the characterCode and not the hardware keycode. On a german keyboard from Apple the keycodes are on MacOS 10.12.1/LC 9.0.0-dp2 (65505=shift) ö = 59 Ö = 59,65505 . = 46 : = 46,65505 This is not contradicting your results if your hardware is different. You could think about using ___the keysdown___, for example this works for me, using a locked field 1 and the following card script (just to see the difference): on idle ; put the keysDown into fld 1 ; end idle p.s. For the LC table (Mark's link) you could use: put baseConvert(hexValue,16,10) into decValue > Since the keyup handler is broken, I am still trying to build a table for > mapping the rawkeyup key to a char. When testing a prototype it seemed to be > easy, but now there are some pitfalls I don't get over. On Mac OS X 10.11, > German system, German keyboard I get with some different char the same > keyname. > > When putting the following code into a field: > *On rawkeyup keyname* > *put keyname* > *end rawkeyup* > > e.g. > Entering shift + dot (":") I get the keyname: 58 Entering shift + ö > ("Ö") I also get the keyname: 58 > > ... and others... > How can I map these keynames back to the char? > > Anttis kecode app shows for the first example the keycode 47 and for the > second example 41. But that’s not what I get from rawkeyup. > > And with Marks link to the source code I couldn't find a solution either. > Because there is only a hex value table included. > > Can anybody confirm these doubled codes from rawkeyup (with a German > keyboard)? > > I am stuck with LiveCode 8 > > Thanks for any ideas ___ use-livecode mailing list use-livecode@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-livecode ___ use-livecode mailing list use-livecode@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-livecode
Re: AW: Is there a mapping table for all rawKeyUp Codes? No solution yet with LC 8
The '58-example' is obviously a script error: the message box has always display bugs, you may better use a field for the display. If I understand right, then you want now the keyCode (an event, depending on _hardware_) and NOT the characterCode (a number representation of the char). Some Mac apps show, with an abuse of the name, the characterCode and not the hardware keycode. On a german keyboard from Apple the keycodes are on MacOS 10.12.1/LC 9.0.0-dp2 (65505=shift) ö = 59 Ö = 59,65505 . = 46 : = 46,65505 This is not contradicting your results if your hardware is different. You could think about using ___the keysdown___, for example this works for me, using a locked field 1 and the following card script (just to see the difference): on idle ; put the keysDown into fld 1 ; end idle p.s. For the LC table (Mark's link) you could use: put baseConvert(hexValue,16,10) into decValue > Since the keyup handler is broken, I am still trying to build a table for > mapping the rawkeyup key to a char. When testing a prototype it seemed to be > easy, but now there are some pitfalls I don't get over. On Mac OS X 10.11, > German system, German keyboard I get with some different char the same > keyname. > > When putting the following code into a field: > *On rawkeyup keyname* > *put keyname* > *end rawkeyup* > > e.g. > Entering shift + dot (":") I get the keyname: 58 > Entering shift + ö ("Ö") I also get the keyname: 58 > > ... and others... > How can I map these keynames back to the char? > > Anttis kecode app shows for the first example the keycode 47 and for the > second example 41. But that’s not what I get from rawkeyup. > > And with Marks link to the source code I couldn't find a solution either. > Because there is only a hex value table included. > > Can anybody confirm these doubled codes from rawkeyup (with a German > keyboard)? > > I am stuck with LiveCode 8 > > Thanks for any ideas ___ use-livecode mailing list use-livecode@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-livecode
AW: Is there a mapping table for all rawKeyUp Codes? No solution yet with LC 8
Since the keyup handler is broken, I am still trying to build a table for mapping the rawkeyup key to a char. When testing a prototype it seemed to be easy, but now there are some pitfalls I don't get over. On Mac OS X 10.11, German system, German keyboard I get with some different char the same keyname. When putting the following code into a field: *On rawkeyup keyname* *put keyname* *end rawkeyup* e.g. Entering shift + dot (":") I get the keyname: 58 Entering shift + ö ("Ö") I also get the keyname: 58 ... and others... How can I map these keynames back to the char? Anttis kecode app shows for the first example the keycode 47 and for the second example 41. But that’s not what I get from rawkeyup. And with Marks link to the source code I couldn't find a solution either. Because there is only a hex value table included. Can anybody confirm these doubled codes from rawkeyup (with a German keyboard)? I am stuck with LiveCode 8 Thanks for any ideas -Ursprüngliche Nachricht- Von: use-livecode [mailto:use-livecode-boun...@lists.runrev.com] Im Auftrag von Antti Ilola Gesendet: Sonntag, 27. November 2016 13:55 An: How to use LiveCode <use-livecode@lists.runrev.com> Betreff: Re: Is there a mapping table for all rawKeyUp Codes? I found this program, maybe useful. https://manytricks.com/keycodes/ Antti -- Edelleenlähetetty viesti -- > From: Richmond <richmondmathew...@gmail.com> > To: How to use LiveCode <use-livecode@lists.runrev.com> > Cc: > Date: Sat, 26 Nov 2016 17:17:23 +0200 > Subject: Re: Is there a mapping table for all rawKeyUp Codes? > http://forums.livecode.com/viewtopic.php?f=7=28395 > > Better than nothing . . . but a long, long way from ideal. > > Richmond. > > On 24.11.2016 20:31, Mark Waddingham wrote: > >> Hi Tiemo, >> >> If you search for 'PlatformKeyCode' in this file: >> >> https://github.com/livecode/livecode/blob/develop/engine/src/platform >> .h >> >> It should give you what you need. >> >> Warmest Regards, >> >> Mark. >> >> Sent from my iPhone >> >> On 24 Nov 2016, at 16:31, Tiemo Hollmann TB <toolb...@kestner.de> wrote: >>> >>> Hello, >>> >>> since keyUp doesn't works anymore as it should on windows in LC 7/8 >>> (see my previous post) I have to workaround with rawKeyUp. >>> >>> Does anybody has a togo mapping table of the rawkeyup codes to the >>> real chars? If not I have to build it myself by testing each char. >>> >>> Thanks >>> >>> Tiemo >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> ___ >>> use-livecode mailing list >>> use-livecode@lists.runrev.com >>> Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your >>> subscription preferences: >>> http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-livecode >>> >> ___ >> use-livecode mailing list >> use-livecode@lists.runrev.com >> Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your >> subscription preferences: >> http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-livecode >> > > Am I missing something? Should I expect otherwise? >> >> Peter Bogdanoff >> ___ >> use-livecode mailing list >> use-livecode@lists.runrev.com >> Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your >> subscription preferences: >> http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-livecode >> > > ___ use-livecode mailing list use-livecode@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-livecode ___ use-livecode mailing list use-livecode@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-livecode
AW: Is there a mapping table for all rawKeyUp Codes?
Thanks for the hint, I've made myself a table and was surprised to see, that the keys of rawkeyup are no "fantasy" livecode keys, but the good old dec codes to be find in every old school ASCII table. Ok Windows and Mac specifics I have to find out and differentiate myself manually. Tiemo -Ursprüngliche Nachricht- Von: use-livecode [mailto:use-livecode-boun...@lists.runrev.com] Im Auftrag von Richmond Mathewson Gesendet: Sonntag, 27. November 2016 18:13 An: How to use LiveCode <use-livecode@lists.runrev.com> Betreff: Re: Is there a mapping table for all rawKeyUp Codes? It is, indeed, useful . . . have just downloaded it and have it running. BUT: it is Macintosh only, AND, there is no way of telling from the app itself whether a particular code generated by a keyDown is Mac-specific or not. Richmond. On 11/27/16 2:54 PM, Antti Ilola wrote: > I found this program, maybe useful. > > https://manytricks.com/keycodes/ > > > Antti > > -- Edelleenlähetetty viesti -- >> From: Richmond <richmondmathew...@gmail.com> >> To: How to use LiveCode <use-livecode@lists.runrev.com> >> Cc: >> Date: Sat, 26 Nov 2016 17:17:23 +0200 >> Subject: Re: Is there a mapping table for all rawKeyUp Codes? >> http://forums.livecode.com/viewtopic.php?f=7=28395 >> >> Better than nothing . . . but a long, long way from ideal. >> >> Richmond. >> >> On 24.11.2016 20:31, Mark Waddingham wrote: >> >>> Hi Tiemo, >>> >>> If you search for 'PlatformKeyCode' in this file: >>> >>> https://github.com/livecode/livecode/blob/develop/engine/src/platfor >>> m.h >>> >>> It should give you what you need. >>> >>> Warmest Regards, >>> >>> Mark. >>> >>> Sent from my iPhone >>> >>> On 24 Nov 2016, at 16:31, Tiemo Hollmann TB <toolb...@kestner.de> wrote: >>>> Hello, >>>> >>>> since keyUp doesn't works anymore as it should on windows in LC >>>> 7/8 (see my previous post) I have to workaround with rawKeyUp. >>>> >>>> Does anybody has a togo mapping table of the rawkeyup codes to the >>>> real chars? If not I have to build it myself by testing each char. >>>> >>>> Thanks >>>> >>>> Tiemo >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> ___ >>>> use-livecode mailing list >>>> use-livecode@lists.runrev.com >>>> Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your >>>> subscription preferences: >>>> http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-livecode >>>> >>> ___ >>> use-livecode mailing list >>> use-livecode@lists.runrev.com >>> Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your >>> subscription preferences: >>> http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-livecode >>> >> Am I missing something? Should I expect otherwise? >>> Peter Bogdanoff >>> ___ >>> use-livecode mailing list >>> use-livecode@lists.runrev.com >>> Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your >>> subscription preferences: >>> http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-livecode >>> >> > ___ > use-livecode mailing list > use-livecode@lists.runrev.com > Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription > preferences: > http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-livecode ___ use-livecode mailing list use-livecode@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-livecode ___ use-livecode mailing list use-livecode@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-livecode
Re: Is there a mapping table for all rawKeyUp Codes?
It is, indeed, useful . . . have just downloaded it and have it running. BUT: it is Macintosh only, AND, there is no way of telling from the app itself whether a particular code generated by a keyDown is Mac-specific or not. Richmond. On 11/27/16 2:54 PM, Antti Ilola wrote: I found this program, maybe useful. https://manytricks.com/keycodes/ Antti -- Edelleenlähetetty viesti -- From: Richmond <richmondmathew...@gmail.com> To: How to use LiveCode <use-livecode@lists.runrev.com> Cc: Date: Sat, 26 Nov 2016 17:17:23 +0200 Subject: Re: Is there a mapping table for all rawKeyUp Codes? http://forums.livecode.com/viewtopic.php?f=7=28395 Better than nothing . . . but a long, long way from ideal. Richmond. On 24.11.2016 20:31, Mark Waddingham wrote: Hi Tiemo, If you search for 'PlatformKeyCode' in this file: https://github.com/livecode/livecode/blob/develop/engine/src/platform.h It should give you what you need. Warmest Regards, Mark. Sent from my iPhone On 24 Nov 2016, at 16:31, Tiemo Hollmann TB <toolb...@kestner.de> wrote: Hello, since keyUp doesn't works anymore as it should on windows in LC 7/8 (see my previous post) I have to workaround with rawKeyUp. Does anybody has a togo mapping table of the rawkeyup codes to the real chars? If not I have to build it myself by testing each char. Thanks Tiemo ___ use-livecode mailing list use-livecode@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-livecode ___ use-livecode mailing list use-livecode@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-livecode Am I missing something? Should I expect otherwise? Peter Bogdanoff ___ use-livecode mailing list use-livecode@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-livecode ___ use-livecode mailing list use-livecode@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-livecode ___ use-livecode mailing list use-livecode@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-livecode
Re: Is there a mapping table for all rawKeyUp Codes?
I found this program, maybe useful. https://manytricks.com/keycodes/ Antti -- Edelleenlähetetty viesti -- > From: Richmond <richmondmathew...@gmail.com> > To: How to use LiveCode <use-livecode@lists.runrev.com> > Cc: > Date: Sat, 26 Nov 2016 17:17:23 +0200 > Subject: Re: Is there a mapping table for all rawKeyUp Codes? > http://forums.livecode.com/viewtopic.php?f=7=28395 > > Better than nothing . . . but a long, long way from ideal. > > Richmond. > > On 24.11.2016 20:31, Mark Waddingham wrote: > >> Hi Tiemo, >> >> If you search for 'PlatformKeyCode' in this file: >> >> https://github.com/livecode/livecode/blob/develop/engine/src/platform.h >> >> It should give you what you need. >> >> Warmest Regards, >> >> Mark. >> >> Sent from my iPhone >> >> On 24 Nov 2016, at 16:31, Tiemo Hollmann TB <toolb...@kestner.de> wrote: >>> >>> Hello, >>> >>> since keyUp doesn't works anymore as it should on windows in LC 7/8 >>> (see my >>> previous post) I have to workaround with rawKeyUp. >>> >>> Does anybody has a togo mapping table of the rawkeyup codes to the real >>> chars? If not I have to build it myself by testing each char. >>> >>> Thanks >>> >>> Tiemo >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> ___ >>> use-livecode mailing list >>> use-livecode@lists.runrev.com >>> Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your >>> subscription preferences: >>> http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-livecode >>> >> ___ >> use-livecode mailing list >> use-livecode@lists.runrev.com >> Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your >> subscription preferences: >> http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-livecode >> > > Am I missing something? Should I expect otherwise? >> >> Peter Bogdanoff >> ___ >> use-livecode mailing list >> use-livecode@lists.runrev.com >> Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your >> subscription preferences: >> http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-livecode >> > > ___ use-livecode mailing list use-livecode@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-livecode
Re: Is there a mapping table for all rawKeyUp Codes?
http://forums.livecode.com/viewtopic.php?f=7=28395 Better than nothing . . . but a long, long way from ideal. Richmond. On 24.11.2016 20:31, Mark Waddingham wrote: Hi Tiemo, If you search for 'PlatformKeyCode' in this file: https://github.com/livecode/livecode/blob/develop/engine/src/platform.h It should give you what you need. Warmest Regards, Mark. Sent from my iPhone On 24 Nov 2016, at 16:31, Tiemo Hollmann TBwrote: Hello, since keyUp doesn't works anymore as it should on windows in LC 7/8 (see my previous post) I have to workaround with rawKeyUp. Does anybody has a togo mapping table of the rawkeyup codes to the real chars? If not I have to build it myself by testing each char. Thanks Tiemo ___ use-livecode mailing list use-livecode@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-livecode ___ use-livecode mailing list use-livecode@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-livecode ___ use-livecode mailing list use-livecode@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-livecode
Re: Is there a mapping table for all rawKeyUp Codes?
That's a nifty resource. I don't know what Tiemo means by "the real chars" as they are dependent on either one's keyboard driver or the language of one's operating system. I think what Tiemo needs (?) is something that when he enters a rawKey number it will tell him the key char . . . Something like this (pseudo code): on rawKeyDown RD get the keyDown of RD put it end rawKeyDown um? Richmond. On 24.11.2016 20:31, Mark Waddingham wrote: Hi Tiemo, If you search for 'PlatformKeyCode' in this file: https://github.com/livecode/livecode/blob/develop/engine/src/platform.h It should give you what you need. Warmest Regards, Mark. Sent from my iPhone On 24 Nov 2016, at 16:31, Tiemo Hollmann TBwrote: Hello, since keyUp doesn't works anymore as it should on windows in LC 7/8 (see my previous post) I have to workaround with rawKeyUp. Does anybody has a togo mapping table of the rawkeyup codes to the real chars? If not I have to build it myself by testing each char. Thanks Tiemo ___ use-livecode mailing list use-livecode@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-livecode ___ use-livecode mailing list use-livecode@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-livecode ___ use-livecode mailing list use-livecode@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-livecode
Re: Is there a mapping table for all rawKeyUp Codes?
Hi Tiemo, If you search for 'PlatformKeyCode' in this file: https://github.com/livecode/livecode/blob/develop/engine/src/platform.h It should give you what you need. Warmest Regards, Mark. Sent from my iPhone > On 24 Nov 2016, at 16:31, Tiemo Hollmann TBwrote: > > Hello, > > since keyUp doesn't works anymore as it should on windows in LC 7/8 (see my > previous post) I have to workaround with rawKeyUp. > > Does anybody has a togo mapping table of the rawkeyup codes to the real > chars? If not I have to build it myself by testing each char. > > Thanks > > Tiemo > > > > > > ___ > use-livecode mailing list > use-livecode@lists.runrev.com > Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription > preferences: > http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-livecode ___ use-livecode mailing list use-livecode@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-livecode
Is there a mapping table for all rawKeyUp Codes?
Hello, since keyUp doesn't works anymore as it should on windows in LC 7/8 (see my previous post) I have to workaround with rawKeyUp. Does anybody has a togo mapping table of the rawkeyup codes to the real chars? If not I have to build it myself by testing each char. Thanks Tiemo ___ use-livecode mailing list use-livecode@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-livecode