Re: mexican voices in OS X
Le vendredi, 27 juin 2003, à 02:28 Europe/Paris, TOM DIOLA a écrit : Saw your post and was wondering how to get those mexican voices working in OS X. So do I. My Son is taking Spanish in High School and it would be nice to have him emulate the accents Well, you'd better get some of those programs, DVDs, or AudioCassettes, out there. The male and female mexican voices were probably those of californian Apple employees. They pronounce the english words used in mexican spanish as no mexican would be able to. For instance the words beginning with S + consonant (a mexican would pronounce ES, not S). So it's likely to be US mexican rather than mexican spanish. Besides, the mexican spanish sounds a little special, not only to european but also to other latin american spanish speakers. Manuel ___ use-revolution mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
Re: mexican voices in OS X
Le samedi, 28 juin 2003, à 22:44 Europe/Paris, erik hansen a écrit : Mexico es unico. ¡Viva México! ___ use-revolution mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
Re: Voices
Le vendredi, 27 juin 2003, à 22:48 Europe/Paris, Stephen Messimer a écrit : I am building an object that requires the use of the revSetSpeechVoice command. This is no problem for the Mac Classic and OSX platforms However, the mexican voices are no longer here in Jaguar. Why? We have now only english, at least in the Jaguar released in Europe. but I am at a loss to find any reference to the existence of similiar functionality on the Windows. Does windows have voices as well and are there any voices with the same names as those found on apple systems. I would like to give my windows users the same functionality as I make available to those using Macs. I need to know too, since my programs are meant to be cross plaform. (I will be away from july,2 through july, 26.) Manuel ___ use-revolution mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
Re: Esperanto Revolution
Le mercredi, 25 juin 2003, à 21:26 Europe/Paris, Toma Tasovac a écrit : I was thinking of writing a little Unicode tutorial anyway... That's a pretty good idea! It would help us but I see no reason why Esperanto wouldn't work with UTF8 Neither do I: a) 6 special charact: 5 consonants with a circomflex accent and a U with the micro (breve) accent b) sorting problems Burt for b I don't know whow to handle the 2-byte characters. Manuel ___ use-revolution mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
Re: read/write Palm DBs
Le jeudi, 26 juin 2003, à 10:56 Europe/Paris, Lars Lewejohann a écrit : I came accross Revolution by searching a crossplatform development-tool for building a Win, Mac and Linux software to work with my Palm software Tiny Red Book (http://www.tiny-red-book.com ). What I would like to ask is whether there are any templates/experiences using revolution to read/write Palm databases on different platforms. I have already started to write a VisualBasic programm (sorry, didn't mean to offend...:-) -reading/writing PDBs is quite easy with VB and a certain DLL (PalmDB.dll), however a growing number of customers are asking for a Linux or Mac client. I am very interested on Palm, too; but the other way around.. I am finishing a program that would certainly be more useful in a Palm. By now, I call it Litteris (through letters, in latin) a multilingual utility (independent source, target and interface languages) with 4 cards: 1) #2letters: arabic or roman digits to letters ( 7 languages) or roman digits 2) Measures converter 3) currency converter 4) conversation guide to and from any of the languages, with phonetic transcription (and audio speech for English) But I am leaving next week and I will be away for one month or so. I am not carrying a computer to camp in Alaska! ;- ) If bears don't eat me, I will show up last week of July either from Houston or from Paris. I am interesed in: - how to make Palm software out of RR stacks. - Unicode problems in several languages, especially Esperanto - Problems connected with internationalization - Language learning programs (french didacticiels de langues) Manuel ___ use-revolution mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
Re: Unicode Text
Thanks for the hint Toma. Toma, I'll contact you later about the questions we talked about whenyou were in the States. Cheers Le jeudi, 19 juin 2003, à 19:50 Europe/Paris, Toma Tasovac a écrit : Dear Dan: I use this: on openStack set the textFont of this stack to Verdana,utf8 put uniencode (url file:text.txt,utf8) into fld text end openStack Of course, you should choose the font you like and the particular encoding you need. This really should work, but let me know if it doesn't. All best, Toma On Thursday, June 19, 2003, at 06:39 PM, Dan Friedman wrote: Has anyone figured out how to read and write unicode text? I opened the unicodeFldRoutines.rev stack and tried to save field jpTargetFld to a text file and read it back in... But I can't seem to get it to work. Has anyone been able to do this? Or have ya got any ideas? Thanks in advance! -Dan ___ use-revolution mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution ___ use-revolution mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution ___ use-revolution mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
Re: new website
Le samedi, 14 juin 2003, à 18:55 Europe/Paris, Klaus Major a écrit : Hi listers, after years i finally managed to launch my website last week :-) Althoiugh it is completely in german, but the X-Talk section is and will be kept bi-lingual Congratulations, Klaus. (reto-roman and kisuaheli :-D. I actually considered cantonese as the second choice, but my girl-friend insisted on kisuaheli, so what could i do...) Nothing because Ce que femme veut ... (What a woman wants...) Too bad you didn't obey her though. I'd loved to see how those languages loook like. But I can make an ever better suggestion; Dujtsk or any other of those hypothetical languages the linguists create for their students' exercices. Not only they are rare, THEY DON'T EXIST! :-)) ___ use-revolution mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
Re: new website
Anka mi. Mi e proponas esperantigi la programon, se Klaus bonvolas sendi al mi la string-ojn kaj li tage enmetus la frazojn en la programon (mi malatus fui in pro misagado en i) Me too! I evedn proppose to do the translation to esperanto if Klaus will accept to send the string for him to place where they belong in the program. (I'd hate to spoil your program by messing in it). Elkoran salutojn Cheers Manuel dimanche, 15 juin 2003, 12:35 Europe/Paris, Efthimios Mavrogeorgiadis a crit : Gratulojn, Wolfgang! Mi ankau subtenas tiun proponon! ;-) Efthimios Mavrogeorgiadis www.esperanto.gr - Original Message - From: Wolfgang M. Bereuter [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Sunday, June 15, 2003 1:13 PM Subject: Re: new website On Saturday, Jun 14, 2003, at 18:55 Europe/Vienna, Klaus Major wrote: Althoiugh it is completely in german, but the X-Talk section is and will be kept bi-lingual (reto-roman and kisuaheli :-D. I actually considered cantonese as the second choice, but my girl-friend insisted on kisuaheli, so what could i do...) Esperanto ;)) regards Wolfgang M. Bereuter Learn easy with trainingsmaps INTERNETTRAINER Wolfgang M. Bereuter Edelhofg. 17/11, A-1180 Wien, Austria ... http://www.internettrainer.com, [EMAIL PROTECTED] ... Tel: ++43/1/ 961 0418, Fax: ++43/1/ 479 2539 ___ use-revolution mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution ___ use-revolution mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution ___ use-revolution mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
Language relevance, was :Re: nuovo websitsko :-)
Le dimanche, 15 juin 2003, à 15:00 Europe/Paris, Klaus Major a écrit : @Manuel Actually i might support any language with a corresponding country which i might get in business with at some time... Which unfortunately is not the case with Esperanto ;-) What are you interested in: the countries, or the people who could get in business with you? Those aliens ares spread all over the world. I agree that they are quite few (more than some countries with a language quoted in Jaguar's system preferences/languages, though). But these people are very active, very fond of international web communication and computer use*, and they are so strange aliens, that some of them could buy an program just because it has an esperanto interface. And look: in a few minutes 3 of those intruders from outer space showed up right in the middle of our list! Something simlilar with Catalan. All of them can use Spanish fluently., but they would like their language to be in the program. And there are probably more computers in Barcelona than in the rest of Spain, or in in a buch of south american spanish speaking countries together, for that matter. Anyway, what my translation offer is good for french, spanish and catalan**, my three mother languages (dont be surprised: aliens are that way) ;-))) Excuse us for the noise. But discussing about the pertinence of languages for internationalizing programs may not be totallly irrelevant for at leat some of us. And again congratulations and thank you for your stacks and the nice way you help people. I hope you'll get the whisky bottle! Manuel * there are many esperanto fora and lists dealing with computers and web communication; The very active [EMAIL PROTECTED] is my most important source about what is going on. ** I would llike to exchange my translating into one of the languages I know, for some oher language, especially german. ___ use-revolution mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
Re: problem with popup menu buttons
Le Sunday, 26 Jan 2003, à 12:23 US/Central, Ken Ray a écrit : If you're using an option menu button (which will automatically display its label based on the selection you make), you can set the menuHistory of the button to a number indicating the line of text in the button's menu that you want. Great! This works also with my ComboBox menus! And it's more better than the work around I had found: adding to the handler; put word 2 of the selectedline of me into line n. Then I had just to execute set label of btn b to line (line n of btn b) of btn b. My problem was to be able to change the contents of a btn keeping the same line of it as the label, because at any change of the contents the selectedline was reset to 1. In my case, if btn currency was set to Libra and the user switched to English I wanted the btn to show Pound and not Euro, and trigger the corresponding conversion in the text shown in a field. The menuItem solution is better because it really commands the selection and not only the label, and also because you don't have to use a btn's line to store it, since you get it before the change. But infortunately I have found no way of solving the other problems which looks like a bug or a corrupted software, somewhere: The use of the btn is crazy: sometimes it works okay, sometimes it has no effect, sometimes it switches the textalign from right to left, sometimes it switches to the first line no matter which line is clicked, sometimes it wokrs, but partially: I put in the handler the line put the menuhistory of me: 3 things may happen a) everithing is okay b) no effect on the btn, the msg shows the number corresponding to the previous selection c) partial effect: the msg shows the number corresponding to the selection, but the label switches to the first line; then type put the menuhistory of btn n I get 1. I thought the handler does the selection OK and then forgets about it and goes back to the default 1, but it is not so: I've tryed put the line set label of me to... just before the put the menuhistory... and the behavior is the same! It is the same using the selectline, instead of the menuhistory, too. This annoying behavior began yesterday morning with no apparent reason. When a create another btn, it works OK. Anyway, you've been of great help by letting me know about the menuhistory and menupick. Thank you! Manuel ___ use-revolution mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
problem with popup menu buttons
My two popup menu 'combobo' btns don't work properlu this morning: - sometimes they ignore the new selection, sometimes they select the first line no matter the line of the mouseup, sometimes they do select the right line. - the label sometimes shows the right textalign although the textalign shown in the properties window and in the msg box is still 'left' as I fixed it. I created a new btn and it worked normally. Do you think my btns are corrupted? What should I do? I am using R-R I also would like to know if there is any way to change the selection of a popup menu btn by script. Finally I would be very gratefull to the R-R user who could me with the problems I listed in a previous post, which I copy here. Thank you for your help. Manuel ***PREVIOUS POST The 'Colors and Patterns' item of the Object doesn't work any more. I can't get the colors palette using the 'Color Property' button either. That not the only odd thing happening: - the border of one fld are black according to what answers the msg box, but I see it grey and with a top line thicker. - the border of another fld is black all right, and with the right thickness, but only the bottom and right lines show up. Both flds styles are 'rect'. The shadow style works fine but leaving the strange behavior of the border. Besides, when a quit Revolution, the labels of the cd flds disappear but those of the buttons stay there. I wonder wether there is something wrong with the stack or the program itself. Except this, my program is ready for a ß release and I would like to upload it int R-R web site. ***END ___ use-revolution mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
disapearing labels
When I quit Revolution the cd fld labels disapear This does not happens when I close the stack, neither with the buttons labels. I have tried to change properties, but nothing helps. I would like to use the labels to reset some preferencies such as the language of the dialogs. Thank you for your help. Manuel ___ use-revolution mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
Re: True round buttons
Le Friday, 17 Jan 2003, à 10:09 US/Central, thinkertoys a écrit : I recently needed some came up w/ a decent solution: use PNG images which can have transparent areas which do not trap mouse events - then, instead of icons, simply make calls to the imageData of the PNG for different mouse events Is there a web site where you can downloads such images from? ___ use-revolution mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
Re: Arabic, CE and ME versions...
Le Thursday, 9 Jan 2003, à 03:46 US/Central, [EMAIL PROTECTED] a écrit : - FileMaker takes use of Unicode fonts, but we have to use special CE-fonts for countries like Poland or Russia, because of the special chars. Normally you don't need Unicode for WE, CE or Cyrillic unless the language is not included in the correspondent ISO font map definition (latin 1 for WE for instance) you can also find fonts following other ISO definitions evenß though Apple doesn't use this possibility, preferring to switch to Unicode; I guess they are right: it would just be crazy, for instance, to take care of latin 3 (turkish, rumanian, esperanto, maltese) which has had few fonts developed, most of them featuring many SCII addresses not respecting the ISO guide lines!. I do not have a good experience about Windows but I would be surprised if there were not a bunch of fonts for lots of languages out there. Defining the keyboard map for an ergonomical input is certainly not so user friendly as with mac's resEdit, but it should be possible. [ .] I agree that Unicode is certainly the solution for the future, but now, I think one should consider that it might be other solutions; at least for some program types, concerning certain groups of languages, and for most users outside the United Stattes, that will have to use slow modems and old computers for many years. Manuel ___ use-revolution mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
Re: PEF and machO was Internationalization
Le Thursday, 9 Jan 2003, à 09:44 US/Central, Richard Gaskin a écrit : But with Mach-O bundles as the long-term solution, resource forks will eventually be phased out. I thought they were already so; I mean not used in macOS X. ___ use-revolution mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
PEF and machO was Internationalization
Thank you for your explanation, Jeanne. Mach-O looks more ... à la Unix to me. Am I right? Manuel For some reason this msg sent yesterday, bounced: DEBUT DE CITATION IOError: [Errno 28] No space left on device 554 |/home/mailman/mail/wrapper post use-revolution... unknown mailer error 1 Reporting-MTA: dns; www.runrev.com Received-From-MTA: DNS; mta4.rcsntx.swbell.net Arrival-Date: Tue, 7 Jan 2003 22:41:33 -0500 FIN DE CITATION ___ use-revolution mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
Re: Internationalisation II
Le Monday, 6 Jan 2003, à 23:17 US/Central, Jeanne A. E. DeVoto a écrit : 1.x Rev apps are also Carbon, but they are in PEF format. 2.0 produces Mach-O applications Excuse mi ignorqnce... I 'd like to understand what PEF and Mach-O means... Manuel ___ use-revolution mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
Languages Internationalisation, part I ( was Intern. II )
The following is more specially true for 'western european languages'
speakers using macOS, but can be usefull for other R-R users as well.
EASIEST TO LOCALIZE LANGUAGES:
**
No special fonts needed neither to create nor to use the software. Easy
to do since the 1984 mac 128. To type the translation easier you just
may need to select the keyboard, on the fly in the menu bar since
system 7. The fonts are called 'Western European Languages' (Latin1)
This group includes:
- Romanic languages: French, Italian, Occitanic (Provençal,
Lenguadocian, North-occitanic, Gascon), Catalan, Italian, Corsican,
Sardinian, Spanish, Portuguese [but NOT Rumanian]
- Germanic languages: English, Dutch, Platt Deutsch, German, Yiddish,
Dannish, Sweedish, Norwegian [but NOT Icelandish; I don't know about
Frisian and Feroese]
- Finno-Ougrian languages: Finnish [but NOT Hungarian; I don't know
about Estonian and other northern languages.
- Euskarian (Basque)
- many so called 'third world' languages not needing extra diacritics
(accents, cedillas, bars, etc.)
EASIER TO LOCALIZE LANGUAGES
Central European Language (Latin 2, I guess) use a font set very
similar but with some differences in diacritized letters. Of course
both the programmer and the user need Central European Fonts; but a
1984 mac could be used as far as the language is concerned.
This group includes;
--Germanic languages: English, Dutch, Platt Deutsch, German, Yiddish
--Finno-Ougrian: Finnish, Hungarian
--Slavic languages: Polish, Cheh, Slovak [but NOT Slovene nor
Serbo-Croatian; I don't know about other slavic languages using the
latin script]
EASY TO LOCALIZE LANGUAGES
**
A. LATIN EXTENDED LANGUAGES
You can
~~EITHER: 1) make a compatible font that will include all the wished
characters (with a unique ASCII adress for the most frequent characters
or by 0-offset of the diacritic). This font shall of course be given to
the user, 2) make the appropriate keyboard map configuration to make
the input easy to the translater. This solution may frighten some
people but it is easy to do since all the needed diacritcals are
already there in Western European and creating and testing the keyboard
KCHR resource with reseadit is a matter of hours, AND this solution
DOES NOT require a new brand powerful computer neither to create nor to
use the program: any mac can do that since 1984.
~~OR: you can simply use the Extended Latin Subset of Unicode. All the
fonts in macOS X have 360 ASCII adresses including all the chars
supposedly used in all the languages using the latin alphabet. If you
are an english board user, you are lucky: you have the 'Extended
english' keyboard mapping from the input language menu (not quite
ergonomic but reasonably easy to use); other wise, have an
ergonomicqlly designed keyboard mapping from apple (according to your
wishes) before the typing mistakes drive you crazy.
Using the two-byte Unicode system, many characters happen now to have
two ASCII codes since the first 256 one-byte adressable characters are
all still there. Besides, this Unicode stuff is not yet perfectly
finalized, most fonts still are uncomplete and/or have blurry or not
style-matching characters. AND MOST IMPORTANT: you need a fast
powerfull computer with lots of RAM and a disc with hundreds of
Megabytes.
Using Unicode in 2003 to write such languages as lituanian, esperanto,
slovene, croatian, albanese, romanian, maltese or turkish, amounts to
use a whole battery of bazookas to kill a mosquito.** You could even
miss the mosquito and get some unespected 'dommages collatéraux' as we
say in french.
B. OTHER ALPHABETIC SCRIPT 'SIMPLE' LANGUAGES
I mean a) really alphabetic, (not syllabic like japanese katakana); b)
only one shape for each letter no matter the litteral environment
(this excludes arabic); c) not needing to change our standard
horizontal left-to-right system (this also excludes hebrew).
The case is technically the same than for Latin extended languages. You
only need the appropriate font, Cyrillic, for instqnce. Of course if
the trqsnlator is used to a latin alphabet he may want to have an
ergonomically defined keyboard according to his habits.
This group includes, among other languages, greek and the cyrillic
alphabet group which is in a pretty similar situation as the latin one:
a central nucleous ('easier': russian, ukrainian, bulgarian) and the
'extended more or less 'easy': cyrillic serbo-croat (Serbia,
Montenegro) and most non-indoeuropean languages of the former Soviet
Union.,
C. SIMPLE SYLLABIC SCRIPT LANGUAGES
I mean a) close to one-to-one correspondance between characters and
phonemic syllables b) no (or very few) context sensitive shape changes
and c) not needing to change our horizontal left-to-right system. This
is exactly the case* of japanese Katakana; or Hiragana, for that matter.
Re: Internationalisation
Le Tuesday, 7 Jan 2003, à 10:40 US/Central, Rob Cozens a écrit : What happens if your app ships with nine languages loaded and the user wants to translate to a tenth language? I may build a new nine language base by replacing one of the loaded languages by the new one and then he has the choice: EITHER replacing the old base by the new one (loosing the discarted language, OR keep both bases available (with different names, of course). There is no special problem to extend the progrqm to more than nine bases. I choose 9 because I had to stop so the chart wouldn't be too long... and 9 takes only one digit. Manuel ___ use-revolution mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
Re: Internationalisation
Le Monday, 6 Jan 2003, à 09:54 US/Central, Rob Cozens a écrit : As for me I've being using in my HyperCard stacks three different ways of dealing with such a problem: Hi Manuel, My problem with these approaches (or the Profile Manager) is, AFAIK, they can only support languages that are preprogrammed in the application. OenoLog and future applications I produce with RunRev are designed to be end-user translatable into any single-byte character language. -- Rob Cozens CCW, Serendipity Software Company http://www.oenolog.com/who.htm The first of the described appoaches is perfectly suitable for your purpose. My Polylexis is intended to be user modifiable: this means that the user will be able to add a new bases of up to 9 languages of his choice. In my case the interface translation is not crucial since the program already comes with half a dozen widely spread languages, but changing/adding interface language is not a different problem. All you have to do is replace all the blablabla int the script by item x of dialogPhrases were dialogPhrases is a global containin the line corresponding to the chosen language. The present version of Polylexis permits user friendly changes, additions and suppressions in the existing contents base, easy suppression and creation of bases; but is not yet very fruser friendly for creating a new big bases, or dealing with the interfacial base. See my next mail for some information about the differences between the languages your program could support. Regards Manuel ___ use-revolution mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
Re: Internationalisation II
Le lundi, 6 jan 2003, à 18:47 US/Central, Igor de Oliveira Couto a écrit : I just had a quick look at Apple's Developer site, which has a special section on 'localisation on MacOS X': http://developer.apple.com/intl/localization.html Apple suggests the use of a FREE Apple-made software package called 'AppleGlot' - currently in version 3. It supposedly translates all string text in a certain application from one language to another, using provided glossaries. Of special interest to all developers, is the fact that these glossaries seem to be in PLAIN TEXT FORMAT - meaning that Apple is providing us with FREE, standardised translations between English and several other languages for most of the user interface items. Just out of curiosity, I downloaded the glossaries for Spanish. In total, there were 83 text files: a main one - with translations for almost ALL of the Finder's interface elements, dialogue boxes and warning messages - and many other files which seem to contain translations for strings related to specific programs/system preferences which are bundled with MacOS X, such as the 'Color Picker' or 'System Profiler'. Apple provides freely downloadable glossaries for the following languages: Spanish, French, German, Italian, Dutch, Danish, Finnish, Norwegian, Swedish, Korean, Japanese, as well as both Simplified and Traditional Chinese. AppleGlot 3 apparently helps translate not only Cocoa applications, but also Carbon ones. How it goes about doing that, I do not quite understand. I think it translates the .nib files in the Resources folder of Cocoa applications, and (my guess only) text/string resources in Carbon apps - I doubt it would look into the data fork... Thanks for this invaluable information, Igor! I do, therefore, have a couple of new questions: 1) Are the apps compiled by Revolution 2.0 Carbon or Cocoa? And most importantly: 2) Has anyone tried using AppleGlot to 'translate' a Revolution-made app? If so, what were the results? Was it a useful tool? I am interested in the answers too! Once again, many thanks We, thank you, Igor. And you deserve a bugless year for your info, ;-) Manuel ___ use-revolution mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
Internationalization II: localisation and internationalisation
The word localization, used in Europe, is problably better than internationalization if we are dealing with the adaptation of one program to another country which may imply translation and/or other changes: key short cut equivalents, time and mesure, postal adress system, text sorting, etc. In the other hand, internationalization seems more convenient when producing a program with several interface languages the user can choose just by fixing the preferences. But, in ;y opinion, internationalisation should also include the other changes when the program is concerned with them. Manuel ___ use-revolution mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
Re: Internationalisation
Le Sunday, 5 Jan 2003, à 17:44 US/Central, José L. Rodríguez Illera a
écrit :
I use another approach for getting the same results. All interface
language
translations are stored in a field, each row a message or a label,
and each
column a different language. This is easy to export or paste into a
spreadsheet, easy then for translators and easy to put back into the
field.
Language to be used for the interface (not for contents: this will
require a
different approach) is in a global, say lengua. The following
function
retreives the correct translated string:
As for me I've being using in my HyperCard stacks three different ways
of dealing with such a problem:
1.- What I used to call the 'matricial approach' * is basically the one
José describes: either a) one line per language and one item per topic,
or b) the other way around. Some times I find it easier to take the a)
way: the names of languages are listed in a button. Then you just have
to say:
global qlang
{put line (word 2 of the selectedline of button 'Language' of field
'buttonsLabels' into qlang} -- or fldLabels, or partLabels , for that
matter
and then
{set label of btn bt to item bt of qlang} ** -- or fl or pt
2.- The card approach is perhaps more specifically hyperCardian:
everithing common is in the background. When the interfacial difference
deals only with language strings, a bg fld does perfectly the job and
you can use all the fonts and styles you want, as you want; moreover,
you can even switch to the shared mode for common storage. When there
are behavioral differences from language to language cd btns permit
separate handlers. Also a large part of the code can be repeated in
each card with the dialog strings differences; this may be less elegant
from the programmer's point-de-vue, but it is certainly faster for an
old computer.
3.- The occasionnal do-as-you-can way is suitable when you need few
matching equivalents in few and different circumstances, example
repeat with i = 1 to n
if string = word i of père pare padre pai vater father otec -- this
string can also be a variable, of course
then return word 1 of mère mare madre mãe mutter mother matj -- or any
other variable
end repeat
Note that this ends up being a particular case of approach 1.
I guess this method could certainly be very improved using the R-R
facilites, which I am just beginning to learn. The custom property
feature of R-R is also a huge extension of the contents-button system
of HyperCard, but I must confess I still am not clever enough to use
them properly.
Manuel
_
I learnt from José that this is called an 'array'. José is been a
great help for me a few months ago, when I was stumbling my first steps
with R-R. He also deserved the single malt reward!
**this is much more conenient with R-R since you can still identify the
object by the name while you localize the label, whereas HC had me to
{set the name of object X to ...} and check {if the short name of}
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Re: Underlined characters in button label?
Le dimanche, 29 déc 2002, à 21:57 US/Central, Howard Bornstein a écrit : Is it possible to format button label text so that only a few letters of the label are underlined? It seems to be all or nothing, but I'd like to be able to have a standard button with a label like black with just the bl underlined. I don't think it's possible using the textStyle property of a button. You could create an image with the text the way you want it and then set the icon of the button to that image. It's more work but it'd give you what you were after. If this partial styling of labels is wished in several cases; another option is to create a font with the necessary stylized letters. I did this for the regular text of HyperCard back in the time when no styliwed text was available in the fields. But I never tried with system X. ___ use-revolution mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
Re: Tutorials
Le Wednesday, 25 Dec 2002, à 12:10 US/Central, Gernot Lorenz a écrit : Am Montag, 23.12.02 um 15:11 Uhr schrieb Andre Rombauts: Ive been learning Rev for several months but to really go inside I would need an in-depth-tutorial. This is quite different from all othe programing environment I used in the past (Basic, Visual Basic, Pascal Im just a 50 y old teacher who started with computer in the 80). How to organize stacks, to use externals and plugins (not really sure to understand the difference), etc. Revolution is so huge... Will we get a good tutorial book?... André Dear Andrè, I'm nearly in the same situation like You (I used in the past (Basic, Visual Basic, Pascal Im just a 50 y old teacher who started with computer in the 80) with the difference that I'am an experienced User of Hypercardt - the anchestor of MetaCard and Revolution - which only exists for MacOS. But now, with platform-independent MetaCard and/or Revolution (which are nearly the ssame) I have a tool which fits better to our school's situation (we have a MacOS computer lab and a Windows computer lab). My pupils are beginners in programming, about 16 years old, and there is absolutely no book about MetaCard or Revolution for them , even not an English one (I need one in German). For Hypercard, , there were enough good books (also in German language), but Hypercard is to much different. What to do ? During the last three months I began myself to make a suitable book (or booklet) for learning programming (rather than multimedia-authoring) with MetaCard and Revolution, which will be used as a book for beginners or pupils. Like You I would like to have additionally an in-depth-tutorial to avoid many experiments, but there is nothing on the market. But nevertheless I am interested in what You are doing with Your pupils ? What would You expect from school-book for beginners ? I would be glad to hear from You something about working with Metacard/Revolution in school. Gernot My case is more like Gernot's; except that I am much older and I used HyperCard not to teach how to program but to teach languages and linguistics., I have written a lot of HC "didacticiels" as we say in french: general phonetics; japaneese tons; german verbs; tamil scripts; russian text comprehension; spanish; french; quizz in general linguistics; language performance level ... and so on. This also means that I came accross special character and keyboard problems: fonts; accents, KCHR resources; etc. Now I am retired and struggling for trying to port some of theese HyperCard Stacks to R-R, I guess I am likely to get more benefits from your help than the other way around. But maybe some of the tricks I found out could be useful to you as well.
Re: inserting accented characters
Le mardi, 10 déc 2002, à 09:02 Europe/Paris, Signe Marie Sanne a écrit : Bernard, I just downloaded Revolution on my Windows 2000, made a standalone and tested the accented letters. Here on my (Norwegian) keyboard everything works fine. In development mode there's a problem with accent aigu (é), since AltGr + accent key opens the Properties window. Kevin, what can be done with this? Both French and Spanish make extensive use of this accent! The best bet would be to have an ergonomically designed keuboard definition. I did this for macOS: a KCHR ressource adapted to the national keyboard habits (I did this chiefly for the french azerty, but then I could adapt it very easily to other keyborards). This originated a new choise with an esperanto flag in the language menu. It made it possible to type all the accented characters for almost all the latin alphabet languages, using my 1 byute-per-char fonts. All the esperanto ĉapelitaj were true one ASCI chars (no use of 0-offset superposition for them); you could type them, both using the circumflex key, as in french, or the option-char. Now, you can have your custumized keyboard map made by Apple. But the process is much more boresome and error inducing, than when you could do it by yourself! Who will give us an equivalent of resEdit? Manuel ___ use-revolution mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
Re: inserting accented characters
Le 6/12/02 8:12, « Signe Marie Sanne » [EMAIL PROTECTED] a écrit : field should receive the character - I take it if the user has clicked in a field that this can direct the output of the palette button. Sure i have done this with hyperCard, for exemple On mouseUp -- a handler in the card Global whichfield if the target contains fld Then Put short name of the target into whichfield Else if whichfld -- is not empty then do put short name of the target after fld whichfield End mouseUp ___ use-revolution mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
Excuse me!
By mistake, my long reply to Malte has been sent to the whole list. Sorry :-( Manuel ___ use-revolution mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
Re: Just another player.
Le 29/11/02 15:25, « Malte Brill » [EMAIL PROTECTED] a écrit : Hi there, I just want to announce that runrev have put a stack of me, based on the German Workshop I wrote, on their users contribution site. If you want to take a quick look at it and have any comments I am happy to receive them. How can I down load it? Manuel ___ use-revolution mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
File maker and Japanese
jean-jacques [EMAIL PROTECTED] asks this in the macFR.net list. Could anybody help him? BEGIN I suppose there should be some add in for File Maker, so we can use this program in Japanese. Now we can write in japanese all right, but with a huge problem: a 5-chars word needs as much room as a 10 chars one. If we switch to the japanese version, then we cannot even open the files. END Thanks. Manuel ___ use-revolution mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
Re: Event in Italy
Le 2/07/02 15:30, « Kevin Miller » [EMAIL PROTECTED] a écrit : Had it been two days later Too bad! But I'll be at Paris Apple Expo, of course. Manuel On 2/7/02 11:09 am, mazzapaolo@liber [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Dear Revolutinaries, is there anybody coming to Padova (Italy) at webb-it from the 5th of July to the 7th of July? There will be people form Runrev talking about Revolution! Yes indeed, Rod is going to be there and will be giving a talk about Revolution! Kevin Kevin Miller [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.runrev.com/ Runtime Revolution Limited - The Solution for Software Development Tel: +44 (0) 870 747 1165. Fax: +44 (0)1639 830 707. ___ use-revolution mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution ___ use-revolution mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
Re: Event in Italy
Le 2/07/02 17:43, « Kevin Miller » [EMAIL PROTECTED] a écrit : On 2/7/02 3:02 pm, yves COPPE [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: The same question about the APLLE Expo in Paris from the 12th to the 14th of September ? Yes, we will be there. Kevin I'll be there too. Maybe at Stand du Doktor Kleanor a group with several beginner revolutionnaries. Manuel ___ use-revolution mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
Re: Sorting lines with diacriticals
Le 6/06/02 12:47, « David Vaughan » [EMAIL PROTECTED] a écrit : ResEdit runs under Classic, too. Practically all Apps do, really. I have a lot of 9 applications around still, but have not directly booted 9.2 in months and hardly expect to ever again. and Mark Mitchell [EMAIL PROTECTED] -- No, HC works wonderfully under OS9.2 and of course it doesn't work 'directly' in OSX, but I pop back and forth between Rev in OSX and HC in OS9 all day! Its absolutely no different than working under a single OS (except for occasional clipboard copying problems). Indeed, you need not even be aware of the multiple OS's for the most part. If HC is not working well for you under OS9, you must have some OS or hardware problems. p.s. after you see how good your Rev apps look under OSX, I doubt you will ever turn back... - You guys are beginning to convince me! Manuel ___ use-revolution mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
Mixing languages and macOS X was: Sorting lines withdiacriticals
Le 6/06/02 17:40, « Mark Mitchell » [EMAIL PROTECTED] a écrit : Manuel writes: But we have had this for near 15 years! I started with a mac 128; when the 'mac +' popped up, we could parameter the language in the control panel Not built in to the OS we haven't! (depending on your language.) Right! Of course I meant the alphabetical scripts, and more specially western european languages. All western european languages used to get exactly the same fonts, including all their characters, and the little flag menu allowed to change on the fly, fitting the national keyboard. For another simple-alphabetical language (cyrillic, greek) you had just to put the fonts, and the kchr resources (flag, keyboard mapping etc.). THIS facility, was not always shipped in the US: you had to ask for it Moreover these fonts also had all the diacriticals needed in almost all the other languages written with the latin alphabet (or in cyrillic, if we are speaking of cyrillic fonts). They were not always accesible from all national keyboards, and they printed as a separate letter. But you could use resEdit to set a 0 onset so that the diacritcal will print upon the letter, or even use a simple utility as (FontMonger) to create the diacritized chars, give them the ascii value of some unused char, and use resedit, very user-friendly, to make a new ressource (and little flag) for your keyboard. For Japanese and other 'difficult' languages cumbersome 'language kits' were required and they seldom worked very well. Under OSX you can run, for example, traditional Chinese, Hebrew and Japanese, (oh, and English of course, and have the main menus in any one of these languages...) switching between them with relative ease. I'd like to have seen you attempt that 15 years ago! Are you not confusing macOS X vs macOS and Unicode vs conventional system? With the conventional 1 byte coding you have 256 spots (only 128 in DOS and Windows) which leaves more than 200 hundred possible chars. UNICODE uses TWO bits per char which extends the possibility to over 4! If your script system is syllabic (katakana / hiragana, devanagari) OR needs a lot of contextual variants for each letter (arabic) OR mixes the two difficulties (tibetan), you need two bytes; and if you use some thousands of ideograms (chinese, kandji) the need is still worse. We are pretty happy that the Phenicians came up with the alphabet!* You can switch between ANY language with macOS using UNICODE. I repeat, OSX is a multi-lingual marvel. I agree! UNICODE certainly works much better with macOS X than with system 9, and, besides, switching between the menus was impossible. Although I still think that the real multi-lingual marvel was the early mac typing 12 mixable western european languages, with the system, the application and the files fitting in a single floppy: in a 400 bytes one! And with the technology available in 1984 for that matter! Manuel ___ * But Bill Gate's Entourage obliges us to use UNICODE for the Euro symbol (ASCII 219) which we have had in our macs for years and even since the beginning with the symbol currency it replaced. And this while HE accepts the $ (36), the ¥ (180) and even the £ (163) which is bound to disappear: we are MAD! ;-) ___ use-revolution mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
Re: Sorting lines with diacriticals
Le 6/06/02 4:12, « David Vaughan » [EMAIL PROTECTED] a écrit : I am using HC with no problems as a classic app under OS X 101.2 through to 10.1.5. What mac are you using. I use a G4 dual processor 450 KHz. ...would be hell to convert and retain the same level of seamless personally-tuned interaction. I think I will be better off taking the paradigm and starting again. Agree! The conversion is not always so simple. And besides I need some facilities still unavailable under system 10 because of unix (oh my dear ResEdit...) Manuel ___ use-revolution mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution ___ use-revolution mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
Re: Sorting lines with diacriticals
Le 4/06/02 12:23, « Mark Mitchell » [EMAIL PROTECTED] a écrit : Under Mac OSX, a truly universal, multi-lingual OS (wonderful!) there is a way to set, under system preferences, how different languages shold be 'treated' for the purposes of sorting, etc. I wonder what effect that would have on your rev app sorting? But we have had this for near 15 years! I started with a mac 128; when the 'mac +' popped up, we could parameter the language in the control panel (keyboard configuration and text processing) and use the keyCap control panel according to it. Later on, system 7 put the little flag beside the application menu and we have been allowed to change language on the fly. But, in the beginning, this was not normally included in the domestic US market; you had to apply for the international resources. And we have been allowed to customize this with resedit as well, quite user friendly, to make new keyboard mappings and flag icons to select them. I designed several of these resources for special purposes. But, so far, this customizing is not possible with Mac OS X. I am stuck with system 9 anyway: I am converting from HyperCard, going back and forth. HC doesn't work very well with Sys. 9 and not at all with sys X, as far as I know. Manuel ___ I am having lots of troubles with the provider. Excuse me if you already received this mail. :-( ___ use-revolution mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
Re: exit a repeat-handler
Le 3/06/02 6:13, « David Vaughan » [EMAIL PROTECTED] a écrit : If you have nested if...else... statements which are deep enough to need an exit, see if switch...case... works better for you. The break statement in there will do the trick. Switch ... case looks great. Thankyou. ___ use-revolution mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
Re: exit a repeat-handler
At 9:21 PM +0200 6/1/02, meili wrote: Why is it not possible to exit the following repeat-forever-handler by using the mouseclick-function? More genrally, what are the Transcript equivalents for HyperTalk exit repeat and exit if. I am an old HyperCard user but a brand new Rev user ... and the help is not always easy to use. [for instance I can't find the encyclopædia any more :-(( ] Thankyou for helping. ___ use-revolution mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-revolution
