OT: Multiple desktops in Windows (was: Re: [libreoffice-users] Libre Office being recommended on Microsoft Answers Forums!)

2011-08-13 Thread Nuno J. Silva
On 2011-08-12, Johnny Rosenberg wrote:

 2011/8/12 Gordon Burgess-Parker gbpli...@gmail.com:
 On 12/08/2011 00:24, upscope wrote:

 +5 that's what I did 12 years ago when my Win ME died.

 I can understand that! Win ME was worse than Vista (if that's possible!(.
 However, using both Linux and Windows 7 I can say that Win 7 is actually not
 bad.

 Does that mean that it has multiple desktops and that the drive
 letters are gone?

Multiple desktops is more of a window manager issue rather than a OS
issue, but anyway, people in Windows aren't as used to use different WMs
as people who use X in the UNIX world are.

There was a tool to add multiple desktops to Windows, part of the
Powertoys pack for Windows XP, but I don't know if it works with 7:

Direct link: http://go.microsoft.com/fwlink/?LinkId=211482
The powertoys page: 
http://windows.microsoft.com/en-US/windows/downloads/windows-xp?T1=PT

And for some context: http://enwp.org/Virtual_desktop#Windows --
according to this, there's another tool, Desktops.

From its description, it seems Desktops is better than the powertoy, but
I never tried it.

-- 
Nuno J. Silva (aka njsg)
gopher://sdf-eu.org/1/users/njsg

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Re: OT: Multiple desktops in Windows (was: Re: [libreoffice-users] Libre Office being recommended on Microsoft Answers Forums!)

2011-08-13 Thread Johnny Rosenberg
2011/8/13 Nuno J. Silva nunojsi...@ist.utl.pt:
 On 2011-08-12, Johnny Rosenberg wrote:

 2011/8/12 Gordon Burgess-Parker gbpli...@gmail.com:
 On 12/08/2011 00:24, upscope wrote:

 +5 that's what I did 12 years ago when my Win ME died.

 I can understand that! Win ME was worse than Vista (if that's possible!(.
 However, using both Linux and Windows 7 I can say that Win 7 is actually not
 bad.

 Does that mean that it has multiple desktops and that the drive
 letters are gone?

 Multiple desktops is more of a window manager issue rather than a OS
 issue,

And what window manager does Windows use by default?

 but anyway, people in Windows aren't as used to use different WMs
 as people who use X in the UNIX world are.

 There was a tool to add multiple desktops to Windows, part of the
 Powertoys pack for Windows XP, but I don't know if it works with 7:

 Direct link: http://go.microsoft.com/fwlink/?LinkId=211482
 The powertoys page: 
 http://windows.microsoft.com/en-US/windows/downloads/windows-xp?T1=PT

 And for some context: http://enwp.org/Virtual_desktop#Windows --
 according to this, there's another tool, Desktops.

 From its description, it seems Desktops is better than the powertoy, but
 I never tried it.

 --
 Nuno J. Silva (aka njsg)
 gopher://sdf-eu.org/1/users/njsg

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Re: [libreoffice-users] Libre Office being recommended on Microsoft Answers Forums!

2011-08-12 Thread Gordon Burgess-Parker

On 12/08/2011 00:24, upscope wrote:

+5 that's what I did 12 years ago when my Win ME died.
I can understand that! Win ME was worse than Vista (if that's 
possible!(. However, using both Linux and Windows 7 I can say that Win 7 
is actually not bad.
(All we need to do now is to get Windows 7 users to STOP running as 
Admin on a daily basis - it really ain't necessary on Win 7)


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Re: [libreoffice-users] Libre Office being recommended on Microsoft Answers Forums!

2011-08-12 Thread Tom Davies
Hi :)
What is an MVP??  Is it Microsoft Certified something Person?
Regards from
Tom :)




From: Gordon Burgess-Parker gbpli...@gmail.com
To: users@global.libreoffice.org
Sent: Thu, 11 August, 2011 20:59:05
Subject: Re: [libreoffice-users] Libre Office being recommended on Microsoft 
Answers Forums!

On 11/08/2011 20:43, planas wrote:
 Gordon

 On Thu, 2011-08-11 at 20:24 +0100, Gordon Burgess-Parker wrote:

 Yes it's true!
 I see this more and more - LO being recommended to people who've bought
 a computer with a Trial version of Office 2010 that's expired...

 +1

 Where is this happening?

here's one thread:
http://answers.microsoft.com/en-us/windows/forum/windows_7-windows_install/have-windows-7-on-computer-try-and-open-a-doc-and/166d698d-b3a0-4a56-9dee-1fb0aba2a3a9


By an MVP no less!

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Re: [libreoffice-users] Libre Office being recommended on Microsoft Answers Forums!

2011-08-12 Thread Gordon Burgess-Parker

On 12/08/2011 18:09, Tom Davies wrote:

Hi :)
What is an MVP??

http://mvp.support.microsoft.com/gp/aboutmvp

:P

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Re: [libreoffice-users] Libre Office being recommended on Microsoft Answers Forums!

2011-08-12 Thread Tom Davies
Hi :)
Thanks.  Most Valuable Person sounds like the equivalent of a fairly average 
member of the LibreOffice community.  Everyone here is a star.
Regards from
Tom :)





From: Gordon Burgess-Parker gbpli...@gmail.com
To: users@global.libreoffice.org
Sent: Fri, 12 August, 2011 18:14:23
Subject: Re: [libreoffice-users] Libre Office being recommended on Microsoft 
Answers Forums!

On 12/08/2011 18:09, Tom Davies wrote:
 Hi :)
 What is an MVP??
http://mvp.support.microsoft.com/gp/aboutmvp

:P

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RE: [libreoffice-users] Libre Office being recommended on Microsoft Answers Forums!

2011-08-12 Thread Dennis E. Hamilton
[The MVP page seems to have moved, so here's a text explanation]

MVP = Most Valued Player

It is an award (made annually) from Microsoft to non-Microsoft people who make 
significant contributions to the community of Microsoft product adopters.  The 
awards tend to be identified with a particular product group (e.g., Developer 
products, Office, Sharepoint, etc.)

The MVP receives free access to tools and products and early previews.  MVPs 
are also invited to periodic Microsoft MVP Summits where early releases are 
disclosed, advice is solicited from Microsoft, etc.

While MVPs tend to be expert in a Microsoft technology, that does not mean they 
are constrained in their breadth of knowledge or contribution in forums, etc.  
It is not unusual to see a recommendation about the use of non-Microsoft 
technology, or how to inter-op with non-Microsoft technology.  It is not 
commonplace either, mostly because of the focus of the forums and what forum 
users tend to have their attention on.

In the case at hand, two different MVPs responded and there were a variety of 
solutions offered, one of which was use of LibreOffice.

What I find odd is that an OEM Windows 7 computer, if recent, is more likely to 
come with Microsoft Office Starter edition.  It may well be that the user 
simply failed to register it, in that case.  I see, however, that some OEMs 
preload a trial edition (sometimes both), and this seems to confuse matters.

Most folks are probably unaware that the built-in Windows 7 WordPad application 
will open and produce ODF Text documents, and also rtf and docx, but not .doc.  
The functionality is rather limited though (more on the lines of the old 
Windows Write application).

Another way of handling the situation also mentioned on that forum is to use 
the free Web applications for Microsoft Office.  There are features that don't 
work there, but it can be handy in a pinch.

Some folks just want to help users without co-opting them into some sort of 
ideological warfare.

 - Dennis

-Original Message-
From: Gordon Burgess-Parker [mailto:gbpli...@gmail.com] 
Sent: Friday, August 12, 2011 10:14
To: users@global.libreoffice.org
Subject: Re: [libreoffice-users] Libre Office being recommended on Microsoft 
Answers Forums!

On 12/08/2011 18:09, Tom Davies wrote:
 Hi :)
 What is an MVP??
http://mvp.support.microsoft.com/gp/aboutmvp

:P

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Re: [libreoffice-users] Libre Office being recommended on Microsoft Answers Forums!

2011-08-12 Thread jebw...@gmail.com
Every OS Microsoft publishes tries to remove the User from the systems 
operation side of the equation.  Personally, I take offense by their 
attempts to lock me out of folders on my own computer.  Regardless of a 
the tonnage of lipstick slapped on a pig, it's still a pig.


Windows 7 is just another attempt to push Users further away from being 
able to control their own systems.


For this reason, most all applications being selected for use now and in 
the future have Linux compatibility so the transition curve isn't a 
series of switchbacks.


In time, 2-3 years, use of XP will become untenable and a version of 
Linux used from there on.


On 8/12/2011 2:19 AM, Gordon Burgess-Parker wrote:

On 12/08/2011 00:24, upscope wrote:

+5 that's what I did 12 years ago when my Win ME died.
I can understand that! Win ME was worse than Vista (if that's 
possible!(. However, using both Linux and Windows 7 I can say that Win 
7 is actually not bad.
(All we need to do now is to get Windows 7 users to STOP running as 
Admin on a daily basis - it really ain't necessary on Win 7)




--


Joe Baker   


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Re: [libreoffice-users] Libre Office being recommended on Microsoft Answers Forums!

2011-08-12 Thread Tom Davies
Hi :)
The link you gave in an earlier post led to another link where MS use the word 
Professional rather than Player even tho they obviously don't pay the MVPs. 
 


MS make a lot of money from their Office Suite so it's not a huge surprise that 
they don't mention that WordPad has a lot more functionality than most people 
are aware of.  What is a surprise is that WordPad has a lot more functionality 
than it had a decade or so ago (when i last looked at it).  


MS support for ODF is the older 1.1 or 1.0 standard rather than the newer 1.2 
(Extended) that is used by default in LibreOffice and other apps.

I have found this thread very interesting and a major boost to morale.  
Thanks everyone, especially Dennis  Gordon :)
Regards from
Tom :)





From: Dennis E. Hamilton dennis.hamil...@acm.org
To: users@global.libreoffice.org
Sent: Fri, 12 August, 2011 18:58:35
Subject: RE: [libreoffice-users] Libre Office being recommended on Microsoft 
Answers Forums!

[The MVP page seems to have moved, so here's a text explanation]

MVP = Most Valued Player

It is an award (made annually) from Microsoft to non-Microsoft people who make 
significant contributions to the community of Microsoft product adopters.  The 
awards tend to be identified with a particular product group (e.g., Developer 
products, Office, Sharepoint, etc.)

The MVP receives free access to tools and products and early previews.  MVPs 
are 
also invited to periodic Microsoft MVP Summits where early releases are 
disclosed, advice is solicited from Microsoft, etc.

While MVPs tend to be expert in a Microsoft technology, that does not mean they 
are constrained in their breadth of knowledge or contribution in forums, etc.  
It is not unusual to see a recommendation about the use of non-Microsoft 
technology, or how to inter-op with non-Microsoft technology.  It is not 
commonplace either, mostly because of the focus of the forums and what forum 
users tend to have their attention on.

In the case at hand, two different MVPs responded and there were a variety of 
solutions offered, one of which was use of LibreOffice.

What I find odd is that an OEM Windows 7 computer, if recent, is more likely to 
come with Microsoft Office Starter edition.  It may well be that the user 
simply 
failed to register it, in that case.  I see, however, that some OEMs preload a 
trial edition (sometimes both), and this seems to confuse matters.

Most folks are probably unaware that the built-in Windows 7 WordPad application 
will open and produce ODF Text documents, and also rtf and docx, but not .doc.  
The functionality is rather limited though (more on the lines of the old 
Windows 
Write application).

Another way of handling the situation also mentioned on that forum is to use 
the 
free Web applications for Microsoft Office.  There are features that don't work 
there, but it can be handy in a pinch.

Some folks just want to help users without co-opting them into some sort of 
ideological warfare.

- Dennis

-Original Message-
From: Gordon Burgess-Parker [mailto:gbpli...@gmail.com] 
Sent: Friday, August 12, 2011 10:14
To: users@global.libreoffice.org
Subject: Re: [libreoffice-users] Libre Office being recommended on Microsoft 
Answers Forums!

On 12/08/2011 18:09, Tom Davies wrote:
 Hi :)
 What is an MVP??
http://mvp.support.microsoft.com/gp/aboutmvp

:P

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RE: [libreoffice-users] Libre Office being recommended on Microsoft Answers Forums!

2011-08-12 Thread Dennis E. Hamilton
Oops.  It is Most Valued Professional.  

Microsoft seems to be re-arranging the deck chairs on microsoft.com.  Here's a 
different view into the program:  http://blogs.msdn.com/b/mvpawardprogram/.  
There's a Facebook page too [;).

-Original Message-
From: Dennis E. Hamilton [mailto:dennis.hamil...@acm.org] 
Sent: Friday, August 12, 2011 10:59
To: 'users@global.libreoffice.org'
Subject: RE: [libreoffice-users] Libre Office being recommended on Microsoft 
Answers Forums!

[The MVP page seems to have moved, so here's a text explanation]

MVP = Most Valued Player

It is an award (made annually) from Microsoft to non-Microsoft people who make 
significant contributions to the community of Microsoft product adopters.  The 
awards tend to be identified with a particular product group (e.g., Developer 
products, Office, Sharepoint, etc.)

The MVP receives free access to tools and products and early previews.  MVPs 
are also invited to periodic Microsoft MVP Summits where early releases are 
disclosed, advice is solicited from Microsoft, etc.

While MVPs tend to be expert in a Microsoft technology, that does not mean they 
are constrained in their breadth of knowledge or contribution in forums, etc.  
It is not unusual to see a recommendation about the use of non-Microsoft 
technology, or how to inter-op with non-Microsoft technology.  It is not 
commonplace either, mostly because of the focus of the forums and what forum 
users tend to have their attention on.

In the case at hand, two different MVPs responded and there were a variety of 
solutions offered, one of which was use of LibreOffice.

What I find odd is that an OEM Windows 7 computer, if recent, is more likely to 
come with Microsoft Office Starter edition.  It may well be that the user 
simply failed to register it, in that case.  I see, however, that some OEMs 
preload a trial edition (sometimes both), and this seems to confuse matters.

Most folks are probably unaware that the built-in Windows 7 WordPad application 
will open and produce ODF Text documents, and also rtf and docx, but not .doc.  
The functionality is rather limited though (more on the lines of the old 
Windows Write application).

Another way of handling the situation also mentioned on that forum is to use 
the free Web applications for Microsoft Office.  There are features that don't 
work there, but it can be handy in a pinch.

Some folks just want to help users without co-opting them into some sort of 
ideological warfare.

 - Dennis

-Original Message-
From: Gordon Burgess-Parker [mailto:gbpli...@gmail.com] 
Sent: Friday, August 12, 2011 10:14
To: users@global.libreoffice.org
Subject: Re: [libreoffice-users] Libre Office being recommended on Microsoft 
Answers Forums!

On 12/08/2011 18:09, Tom Davies wrote:
 Hi :)
 What is an MVP??
http://mvp.support.microsoft.com/gp/aboutmvp

:P

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Re: [libreoffice-users] Libre Office being recommended on Microsoft Answers Forums!

2011-08-12 Thread Tom Davies
Hi :)
Lol, oooh, that's not fair! It would be like asking if the OS was designed to 
be 
secure from the ground-up rather than slapping a tin roof on-top of a crumbling 
structure.  This list is not meant to be a fight between fanboys of different 
OSes.  LibreOffice works on all and all are welcome.  

Regards from
Tom :)





From: Johnny Rosenberg gurus.knu...@gmail.com
To: users@global.libreoffice.org
Sent: Fri, 12 August, 2011 18:40:11
Subject: Re: [libreoffice-users] Libre Office being recommended on Microsoft 
Answers Forums!

2011/8/12 Gordon Burgess-Parker gbpli...@gmail.com:
 On 12/08/2011 00:24, upscope wrote:

 +5 that's what I did 12 years ago when my Win ME died.

 I can understand that! Win ME was worse than Vista (if that's possible!(.
 However, using both Linux and Windows 7 I can say that Win 7 is actually not
 bad.

Does that mean that it has multiple desktops and that the drive
letters are gone?


Kind regards

Johnny Rosenberg
ジョニー・ローゼンバーグ

 (All we need to do now is to get Windows 7 users to STOP running as Admin on
 a daily basis - it really ain't necessary on Win 7)

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[libreoffice-users] Libre Office being recommended on Microsoft Answers Forums!

2011-08-11 Thread Gordon Burgess-Parker

Yes it's true!
I see this more and more - LO being recommended to people who've bought 
a computer with a Trial version of Office 2010 that's expired...


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Re: [libreoffice-users] Libre Office being recommended on Microsoft Answers Forums!

2011-08-11 Thread planas
Gordon

On Thu, 2011-08-11 at 20:24 +0100, Gordon Burgess-Parker wrote: 

 Yes it's true!
 I see this more and more - LO being recommended to people who've bought 
 a computer with a Trial version of Office 2010 that's expired...
 

+1

Where is this happening? 

-- 
Jay Lozier
jsloz...@gmail.com

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Re: [libreoffice-users] Libre Office being recommended on Microsoft Answers Forums!

2011-08-11 Thread Gordon Burgess-Parker

On 11/08/2011 20:43, planas wrote:

Gordon

On Thu, 2011-08-11 at 20:24 +0100, Gordon Burgess-Parker wrote:


Yes it's true!
I see this more and more - LO being recommended to people who've bought
a computer with a Trial version of Office 2010 that's expired...


+1

Where is this happening?


here's one thread:
http://answers.microsoft.com/en-us/windows/forum/windows_7-windows_install/have-windows-7-on-computer-try-and-open-a-doc-and/166d698d-b3a0-4a56-9dee-1fb0aba2a3a9

By an MVP no less!

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Re: [libreoffice-users] Libre Office being recommended on Microsoft Answers Forums!

2011-08-11 Thread Stan Goodman
On Friday 12 August 2011 00:22:12 planas wrote:
 On Thu, 2011-08-11 at 20:59 +0100, Gordon Burgess-Parker wrote:
  On 11/08/2011 20:43, planas wrote:
   Gordon
   
   On Thu, 2011-08-11 at 20:24 +0100, Gordon Burgess-Parker wrote:
   Yes it's true!
   I see this more and more - LO being recommended to people who've
   bought a computer with a Trial version of Office 2010 that's
   expired...
   
   +1
   
   Where is this happening?
  
  here's one thread:
  http://answers.microsoft.com/en-us/windows/forum/windows_7-windows_
  install/have-windows-7-on-computer-try-and-open-a-doc-and/166d698d-
  b3a0-4a56-9dee-1fb0aba2a3a9
  
  By an MVP no less!
 
 Priceless - getting a plug from the enemy's camp.

The logical next step is for somebody to reply to that helpful hint, and 
suggest that the fellow go the whole hog and dump his Win7 altogether.

-- 
Stan Goodman
Qiryat Tiv'on
Israel

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Re: [libreoffice-users] Libre Office being recommended on Microsoft Answers Forums!

2011-08-11 Thread planas
On Fri, 2011-08-12 at 01:07 +0300, Stan Goodman wrote: 

 On Friday 12 August 2011 00:22:12 planas wrote:
  On Thu, 2011-08-11 at 20:59 +0100, Gordon Burgess-Parker wrote:
   On 11/08/2011 20:43, planas wrote:
Gordon

On Thu, 2011-08-11 at 20:24 +0100, Gordon Burgess-Parker wrote:
Yes it's true!
I see this more and more - LO being recommended to people who've
bought a computer with a Trial version of Office 2010 that's
expired...

+1

Where is this happening?
   
   here's one thread:
   http://answers.microsoft.com/en-us/windows/forum/windows_7-windows_
   install/have-windows-7-on-computer-try-and-open-a-doc-and/166d698d-
   b3a0-4a56-9dee-1fb0aba2a3a9
   
   By an MVP no less!
  
  Priceless - getting a plug from the enemy's camp.
 
 The logical next step is for somebody to reply to that helpful hint, and 
 suggest that the fellow go the whole hog and dump his Win7 altogether.
 
 -- 
 Stan Goodman
 Qiryat Tiv'on
 Israel
 


+1
-- 
Jay Lozier
jsloz...@gmail.com

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Re: [libreoffice-users] Libre Office being recommended on Microsoft Answers Forums!

2011-08-11 Thread upscope
On Thursday, August 11, 2011 03:07:54 PM Stan Goodman wrote:
 On Friday 12 August 2011 00:22:12 planas wrote:
  On Thu, 2011-08-11 at 20:59 +0100, Gordon Burgess-Parker wrote:
   On 11/08/2011 20:43, planas wrote:
Gordon

On Thu, 2011-08-11 at 20:24 +0100, Gordon Burgess-Parker wrote:
Yes it's true!
I see this more and more - LO being recommended to people
who've bought a computer with a Trial version of Office 2010
that's expired...

+1

Where is this happening?
   
   here's one thread:
   http://answers.microsoft.com/en-us/windows/forum/windows_7-window
   s_
   install/have-windows-7-on-computer-try-and-open-a-doc-and/166d69
   8d- b3a0-4a56-9dee-1fb0aba2a3a9
   
   By an MVP no less!
  
  Priceless - getting a plug from the enemy's camp.
 
 The logical next step is for somebody to reply to that helpful hint,
 and suggest that the fellow go the whole hog and dump his Win7
 altogether.
+5 that's what I did 12 years ago when my Win ME died.
-- 
Russ

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