Re: [389-users] Secondary passwords - like Google's application specific passwords
Hello,
please, does anybyody any idea how to implement this with 389?
Thanks
Jan
On 11/04/2013 07:40 PM, Jan Tomasek wrote:
Hi,
my question about PAM, libscript... come from my idea: I would like to
implement secondary passwords in very similar way like Google's
application specific passwords works. [1]
We are using LDAP for centralized user management. Systems providing
services to users are verified against this LDAP. Users are saving those
passwords within mail clients, in workstation, in tablet, ... we would
like to provide option to users to not store their main password within
their clients. We would like to offer them alternative passwords working
for email, calendar client and so on on specific device. In case of
compromising one of devices - user will have only to revoke password for
that device.
In short. I want to users offer possibility to generate secondary
passwords working for email, and so on. I expect them to create multiple
passwords marked with some nickname, like:
phone-email
tablet-email
phone-calendar
and so on. Those passwords should work with standard LDAP bind but not
necessarily on the same suffix and/or where primary LDAP is. We would
like to split primary LDAP passwors used for financial and high trust
applications from those serving email and calendar.
How to do something like this with 389 DS?
My idea is this:
uid=semik,dc=neco
objectClass: inetOrgPerson
cn: Jan Tomasek
sn: Tomasek
uid: semik
userPassword: {SSHA}...
dc=12345,uid=semik,dc=neco
objectClass: appPassword
dc: 12345
password: some-generated-password1
passwordLabel: phone-email
dc=12395,uid=semik,dc=neco
objectClass: appPassword
dc: 12395
password: some-generated-password2
passwordLabel: tablet-email
dc=12399,uid=semik,dc=neco
objectClass: appPassword
dc: 12399
password: some-generated-password3
passwordLabel: phone-calendar
I tried to implement this as PAM Pass through authentication. It works
but it is very fragile.
I'm looking for more robust and faster way. I know it is possible to do
this with PreOperation Plugin but maybe there is some easier way. Or
maybe already someone implemented such plugin.
Any comments? Ideas?
Thanks
[1] https://support.google.com/accounts/answer/185833
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Re: [389-users] Secondary passwords - like Google's application specific passwords
On 6.11.2013 17:34, Jan Tomasek wrote:
Hello,
please, does anybyody any idea how to implement this with 389?
According to http://tools.ietf.org/html/rfc4519#section-2.41
the userPassword attribute is multi-valued.
Did you try to add multiple values to the attribute?
I never tried it, so no warranty :-)
Petr^2 Spacek
Thanks
Jan
On 11/04/2013 07:40 PM, Jan Tomasek wrote:
Hi,
my question about PAM, libscript... come from my idea: I would like to
implement secondary passwords in very similar way like Google's
application specific passwords works. [1]
We are using LDAP for centralized user management. Systems providing
services to users are verified against this LDAP. Users are saving those
passwords within mail clients, in workstation, in tablet, ... we would
like to provide option to users to not store their main password within
their clients. We would like to offer them alternative passwords working
for email, calendar client and so on on specific device. In case of
compromising one of devices - user will have only to revoke password for
that device.
In short. I want to users offer possibility to generate secondary
passwords working for email, and so on. I expect them to create multiple
passwords marked with some nickname, like:
phone-email
tablet-email
phone-calendar
and so on. Those passwords should work with standard LDAP bind but not
necessarily on the same suffix and/or where primary LDAP is. We would
like to split primary LDAP passwors used for financial and high trust
applications from those serving email and calendar.
How to do something like this with 389 DS?
My idea is this:
uid=semik,dc=neco
objectClass: inetOrgPerson
cn: Jan Tomasek
sn: Tomasek
uid: semik
userPassword: {SSHA}...
dc=12345,uid=semik,dc=neco
objectClass: appPassword
dc: 12345
password: some-generated-password1
passwordLabel: phone-email
dc=12395,uid=semik,dc=neco
objectClass: appPassword
dc: 12395
password: some-generated-password2
passwordLabel: tablet-email
dc=12399,uid=semik,dc=neco
objectClass: appPassword
dc: 12399
password: some-generated-password3
passwordLabel: phone-calendar
I tried to implement this as PAM Pass through authentication. It works
but it is very fragile.
I'm looking for more robust and faster way. I know it is possible to do
this with PreOperation Plugin but maybe there is some easier way. Or
maybe already someone implemented such plugin.
Any comments? Ideas?
Thanks
[1] https://support.google.com/accounts/answer/185833
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--
Petr^2 Spacek
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Frozen
Hello, Every time that I have an USB key plugged inside my computer, if it switches to screensaver mode, I lost the access to the graphics session. gnome3 on fedora18 The only way that I found to recover is to open a text session and to kill the graphic session. Thank for your help. === Patrick DUPRÉ | | email: pdu...@gmx.com Laboratoire de Physico-Chimie de l'Atmosphère | | Université du Littoral-Côte d'Opale | | Tel. (33)-(0)3 28 23 76 12 | | Fax: 03 28 65 82 44 189A, avenue Maurice Schumann | | 59140 Dunkerque, France === -- users mailing list users@lists.fedoraproject.org To unsubscribe or change subscription options: https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/users Fedora Code of Conduct: http://fedoraproject.org/code-of-conduct Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Mailing_list_guidelines Have a question? Ask away: http://ask.fedoraproject.org
Re: NVidia driver installation under UEFI+CSM mode
On Tue, 2013-11-05 at 22:51 +, Matthew Saltzman wrote: https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v1/url?u=http://bumblebee-project.org/k=dsHy%2FVymniCD0osh6tze%2Fw%3D%3D%0Ar=6lbkzZQmkGgL7ITxCWNsIJwNXCdRDnxsPepTVOzWl24%3D%0Am=3Qq%2B1AAJhQnjOt2h7xWd%2BDcnmbrne%2FqGqK2MjngD%2BG8%3D%0As=a2ea19ae2ab35b2036fd8b9ba407232d886e4779e44c3ac0edc884797b64bcb1. My apologies on behalf of the NSA wannabees in my employer's IT department. I think they've realized the error of their ways, so I will try again. The URL is http://bumblebee-project.org or if it gets hijacked again, http COLON SLASH SLASH bumblebee-project DOT org If the newest kernel is going to support Optimus, that will be excellent, although it looks like there is some work to be done yet. I hope we get a chance to try it in Fedora 19. -- users mailing list users@lists.fedoraproject.org To unsubscribe or change subscription options: https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/users Fedora Code of Conduct: http://fedoraproject.org/code-of-conduct Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Mailing_list_guidelines Have a question? Ask away: http://ask.fedoraproject.org
Service name conflict with system user name
Hi all, i named a username eirods, than it is already in passwd and group. And i try to install the eirods on this server with rpm -i, Then i get this information. Creating Service Group and Account: eirods at /var/lib/eirods ERROR :: Please delete the existing Service Group eirods before proceeding. is there any solution to fix this? Thanks -- MfG Cheng(誠) http://freakrobot.blogbus.com -- users mailing list users@lists.fedoraproject.org To unsubscribe or change subscription options: https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/users Fedora Code of Conduct: http://fedoraproject.org/code-of-conduct Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Mailing_list_guidelines Have a question? Ask away: http://ask.fedoraproject.org
Re: Service name conflict with system user name
HI Do you in fact have a user called eirods? If so, you can't have two users with the same name. If not, delete the user from the password, and group files. Or use the GUI to remove that user. HTH. Marvin On Wed, Nov 6, 2013 at 8:08 AM, cheng chen basaka.c...@gmail.com wrote: Hi all, i named a username eirods, than it is already in passwd and group. And i try to install the eirods on this server with rpm -i, Then i get this information. Creating Service Group and Account: eirods at /var/lib/eirods ERROR :: Please delete the existing Service Group eirods before proceeding. is there any solution to fix this? Thanks -- MfG Cheng(誠) http://freakrobot.blogbus.com -- users mailing list users@lists.fedoraproject.org To unsubscribe or change subscription options: https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/users Fedora Code of Conduct: http://fedoraproject.org/code-of-conduct Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Mailing_list_guidelines Have a question? Ask away: http://ask.fedoraproject.org -- users mailing list users@lists.fedoraproject.org To unsubscribe or change subscription options: https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/users Fedora Code of Conduct: http://fedoraproject.org/code-of-conduct Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Mailing_list_guidelines Have a question? Ask away: http://ask.fedoraproject.org
Re: Service name conflict with system user name
it is the user that i access the system. OK, it seems that i need talk to my chef Thanks 2013/11/6 Marvin Kosmal mkos...@gmail.com HI Do you in fact have a user called eirods? If so, you can't have two users with the same name. If not, delete the user from the password, and group files. Or use the GUI to remove that user. HTH. Marvin On Wed, Nov 6, 2013 at 8:08 AM, cheng chen basaka.c...@gmail.com wrote: Hi all, i named a username eirods, than it is already in passwd and group. And i try to install the eirods on this server with rpm -i, Then i get this information. Creating Service Group and Account: eirods at /var/lib/eirods ERROR :: Please delete the existing Service Group eirods before proceeding. is there any solution to fix this? Thanks -- MfG Cheng(誠) http://freakrobot.blogbus.com -- users mailing list users@lists.fedoraproject.org To unsubscribe or change subscription options: https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/users Fedora Code of Conduct: http://fedoraproject.org/code-of-conduct Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Mailing_list_guidelines Have a question? Ask away: http://ask.fedoraproject.org -- users mailing list users@lists.fedoraproject.org To unsubscribe or change subscription options: https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/users Fedora Code of Conduct: http://fedoraproject.org/code-of-conduct Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Mailing_list_guidelines Have a question? Ask away: http://ask.fedoraproject.org -- MfG Cheng(誠) http://freakrobot.blogbus.com -- users mailing list users@lists.fedoraproject.org To unsubscribe or change subscription options: https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/users Fedora Code of Conduct: http://fedoraproject.org/code-of-conduct Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Mailing_list_guidelines Have a question? Ask away: http://ask.fedoraproject.org
Re: good bye - Fwd: list-moderation - Re: KDE without gnome-shell?
On Mon, Nov 04, 2013 at 09:34:05PM +0100, Reindl Harald wrote: well, you even do not find it worth to answer and continue not release posts if you would act honest and practice what you preach you would have written an answer within the last two days and even a please unsubscribe now would have shown more respect than nothing at all since this bevavior not likely changes i quit *until midnight*, choose if you are fair enough to release at least this goodbye and/or reconsider how to act with people yourself within these few hours in a free community respect also means people are sometimes allowed to be hot-blooded and straight-ahead, given that my seek/give-help ratio is 1/1000 i do not need to creep in the sand in front of anybody because trying hard to not insult people over a long time is not fair enough goodbye and hopefully you find enough people with enough knowledge while 24 hours a day acting like a pure gentleman in any context - i did not meet much of them in the last 35 years, honestly not a single one I'm sorry for pushing the email through moderation. I was offline for a couple of days (traveling to Hong Kong), and I was without internet access. It looks like the other moderators on the list didn't do any moderation in my absence, so all I can do is apologize that it took so long for your message to go through. obviously there is a need to re-hash so explain *here and now* and in the public what do you you expect from me if you insist on this paragraph *UNSUBSCRIBE ME NOW* - period IIRC there was an apology from the moderator for pushing one of your messages thru moderation too quickly. That being said, I'm sorry to see him go. He was a good source of valuable information. BTW, the moderator(s) seem to confuse bluntness with rudeness and/or combatitiveness. For my part, I appreciate bluntness. In case Harald has already unsubscribed, I'm CCing this to him. -- users mailing list users@lists.fedoraproject.org To unsubscribe or change subscription options: https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/users Fedora Code of Conduct: http://fedoraproject.org/code-of-conduct Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Mailing_list_guidelines Have a question? Ask away: http://ask.fedoraproject.org -- Bob Holtzman Your mail is being read by tight lipped NSA agents who fail to see humor in Doctor Strangelove Key ID 8D549279 signature.asc Description: Digital signature -- users mailing list users@lists.fedoraproject.org To unsubscribe or change subscription options: https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/users Fedora Code of Conduct: http://fedoraproject.org/code-of-conduct Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Mailing_list_guidelines Have a question? Ask away: http://ask.fedoraproject.org
Re: good bye - Fwd: list-moderation - Re: KDE without gnome-shell?
On 06/11/13 13:20, Robert Holtzman wrote: He was a good source of valuable information. BTW, the moderator(s) seem to confuse bluntness with rudeness and/or combatitiveness. For my part, I appreciate bluntness. I agree and I think this has been handled poorly. People I find offensive I simply filter out and never see them. It would seem others would do the same ... Bob -- http://www.qrz.com/db/W2BOD box10 Fedora-19/64 bit Linux/XFCE -- users mailing list users@lists.fedoraproject.org To unsubscribe or change subscription options: https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/users Fedora Code of Conduct: http://fedoraproject.org/code-of-conduct Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Mailing_list_guidelines Have a question? Ask away: http://ask.fedoraproject.org
Re: good bye - Fwd: list-moderation - Re: KDE without gnome-shell?
11/06/2013 11:09 AM, Bob Goodwin ~ Zuni, Virginia, USA wrote: People I find offensive I simply filter out and never see them. It would seem others would do the same ... +1 I hope we haven't lost a diamond in the rough. -- users mailing list users@lists.fedoraproject.org To unsubscribe or change subscription options: https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/users Fedora Code of Conduct: http://fedoraproject.org/code-of-conduct Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Mailing_list_guidelines Have a question? Ask away: http://ask.fedoraproject.org
Re: good bye - Fwd: list-moderation - Re: KDE without gnome-shell?
On 06/11/13 02:17 PM, Mike Wright wrote: 11/06/2013 11:09 AM, Bob Goodwin ~ Zuni, Virginia, USA wrote: People I find offensive I simply filter out and never see them. It would seem others would do the same ... +1 I hope we haven't lost a diamond in the rough. +1 even though I sometimes have been the object of his bluntness -- users mailing list users@lists.fedoraproject.org To unsubscribe or change subscription options: https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/users Fedora Code of Conduct: http://fedoraproject.org/code-of-conduct Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Mailing_list_guidelines Have a question? Ask away: http://ask.fedoraproject.org
Re: memory stick not recognized
On Mon, Nov 4, 2013 at 6:19 PM, Richard Vickery richard.vicker...@gmail.com wrote: On Sun, Nov 3, 2013 at 8:20 PM, Geoffrey Leach ge...@hughes.net wrote: I have a Sony 128MB memory stick. When inserted, Fedora 19 does not recognize it -- lsblk does not show it, dmesg reports nothing. It's writable by Windows 7, which reports the device as JMCR MS SCSI Disk Device Any thoughts on how to access the stick under Fedora? Thanks. -- I would try the mount command. He can't mount it if the system hasn't assigned a device name. poc -- users mailing list users@lists.fedoraproject.org To unsubscribe or change subscription options: https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/users Fedora Code of Conduct: http://fedoraproject.org/code-of-conduct Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Mailing_list_guidelines Have a question? Ask away: http://ask.fedoraproject.org
Re: good bye - Fwd: list-moderation - Re: KDE without gnome-shell?
Hold On! Is this situation kind of like a Frankenstein Movie? Where at the end of this episode the monster appears dead? But of wait, Not to worry (Or maybe you should)?, He will come back in the next episode? Thomas Dineen On 11/6/2013 11:23 AM, Frank wrote: On 06/11/13 02:17 PM, Mike Wright wrote: 11/06/2013 11:09 AM, Bob Goodwin ~ Zuni, Virginia, USA wrote: People I find offensive I simply filter out and never see them. It would seem others would do the same ... +1 I hope we haven't lost a diamond in the rough. +1 even though I sometimes have been the object of his bluntness -- users mailing list users@lists.fedoraproject.org To unsubscribe or change subscription options: https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/users Fedora Code of Conduct: http://fedoraproject.org/code-of-conduct Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Mailing_list_guidelines Have a question? Ask away: http://ask.fedoraproject.org
Re: good bye - Fwd: list-moderation - Re: KDE without gnome-shell?
There is also geographical irony here! Keeping in mine the place where Frankenstein was born! See: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Villa_Diodati Thomas Dineen On 11/6/2013 11:44 AM, Thomas Dineen wrote: Hold On! Is this situation kind of like a Frankenstein Movie? Where at the end of this episode the monster appears dead? But of wait, Not to worry (Or maybe you should)?, He will come back in the next episode? Thomas Dineen On 11/6/2013 11:23 AM, Frank wrote: On 06/11/13 02:17 PM, Mike Wright wrote: 11/06/2013 11:09 AM, Bob Goodwin ~ Zuni, Virginia, USA wrote: People I find offensive I simply filter out and never see them. It would seem others would do the same ... +1 I hope we haven't lost a diamond in the rough. +1 even though I sometimes have been the object of his bluntness -- users mailing list users@lists.fedoraproject.org To unsubscribe or change subscription options: https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/users Fedora Code of Conduct: http://fedoraproject.org/code-of-conduct Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Mailing_list_guidelines Have a question? Ask away: http://ask.fedoraproject.org
Re: memory stick not recognized
On 11/04/2013 11:28 AM, Geoffrey Leach wrote: There is no output to /var/log/messages when I plug it in. On 11/04/2013 07:50:57 AM, Mikkel L. Ellertson wrote: On 11/03/2013 10:20 PM, Geoffrey Leach wrote: I have a Sony 128MB memory stick. When inserted, Fedora 19 does not recognize it -- lsblk does not show it, dmesg reports nothing. It's writable by Windows 7, which reports the device as JMCR MS SCSI Disk Device Any thoughts on how to access the stick under Fedora? Thanks. What shows up in /var/log/messages when you plug it in? If you can, try it in another USB port. You can also run lsusb and see if it shows the memory stick, or an unidentified USB device. I don't expect lsusb to produce if /var/log/messages does not show anything. Normall there will be a message when you plug in a USB device, even if the system does not reconize what the device is. Something like: Nov 6 14:11:59 x86 kernel: [31349.337850] usb 2-4: new high-speed USB device number 3 using ehci-pci Mikkel -- A: Because it messes up the order in which people normally read text. Q: Why is top-posting a bad thing? -- users mailing list users@lists.fedoraproject.org To unsubscribe or change subscription options: https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/users Fedora Code of Conduct: http://fedoraproject.org/code-of-conduct Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Mailing_list_guidelines Have a question? Ask away: http://ask.fedoraproject.org
Re: good bye - Fwd: list-moderation - Re: KDE without gnome-shell?
On 06.11.2013, Bob Goodwin ~ Zuni, Virginia, USA wrote: People I find offensive I simply filter out and never see them. It would seem others would do the same I have never understood this problem here on the list. You don't like to read somebodies email? Write a killfile, put him/her in it, and you're done. FWIW: I guess it had a good reason that he was/is moderated. Don't want to argue on that one.. -- users mailing list users@lists.fedoraproject.org To unsubscribe or change subscription options: https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/users Fedora Code of Conduct: http://fedoraproject.org/code-of-conduct Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Mailing_list_guidelines Have a question? Ask away: http://ask.fedoraproject.org
Re: good bye - Fwd: list-moderation - Re: KDE without gnome-shell?
On 11/06/2013 12:38 PM, Heinz Diehl wrote: FWIW: I guess it had a good reason that he was/is moderated. Don't want to argue on that one.. I'm beginning to think that the problem was started by complaints from one or more offense thieves. (That's a person who takes offense when none was offered.) This was followed up by heavy-handed moderation by one or more moderators who not only didn't have the time to do the job correctly, but were too eager to reject posts that didn't meet their unreasonable standards. And, I can remember posts from other members on this list that used far more offensive language against him than he ever used, and almost nobody objected. People, if you'd take offense if somebody on this list called you something, or used certain terms to refer to you, don't use them yourself, because if you do, you have no valid grounds for complaint if you find them coming back. I'm not naming names, I'm not pointing fingers, I'm just reminding all of you of one of the easiest forms of the Golden Rule to follow: Don't call anybody anything that you'd find offensive if they used it to refer to you. -- users mailing list users@lists.fedoraproject.org To unsubscribe or change subscription options: https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/users Fedora Code of Conduct: http://fedoraproject.org/code-of-conduct Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Mailing_list_guidelines Have a question? Ask away: http://ask.fedoraproject.org
Re: good bye - Fwd: list-moderation - Re: KDE without gnome-shell?
Hi On Wed, Nov 6, 2013 at 1:20 PM, Robert Holtzman wrote: BTW, the moderator(s) seem to confuse bluntness with rudeness and/or combatitiveness. For my part, I appreciate bluntness. Bluntness is often used as a excuse by people who are rude. It is easy enough to see the difference. You are wrong is blunt but is helpful to suggest how it can be improved. You are an idiot is rude and not really justified in this list even if you good technical expertise and it is against Fedora's code of conduct. I will leave it as an exercise to reader to figure out which side they stand on. Rahul -- users mailing list users@lists.fedoraproject.org To unsubscribe or change subscription options: https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/users Fedora Code of Conduct: http://fedoraproject.org/code-of-conduct Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Mailing_list_guidelines Have a question? Ask away: http://ask.fedoraproject.org
Re: good bye - Fwd: list-moderation - Re: KDE without gnome-shell?
On 06.11.2013 20:44, Thomas Dineen wrote: Hold On! Is this situation kind of like a Frankenstein Movie? Where at the end of this episode the monster appears dead? But of wait, Not to worry (Or maybe you should)?, He will come back in the next episode? Or next mailing list :-) AFAIK the monster is alive and good. You can speak to him at devel list. Mateusz -- users mailing list users@lists.fedoraproject.org To unsubscribe or change subscription options: https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/users Fedora Code of Conduct: http://fedoraproject.org/code-of-conduct Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Mailing_list_guidelines Have a question? Ask away: http://ask.fedoraproject.org
Re: Service name conflict with system user name
On 11/06/2013 11:08 AM, cheng chen wrote: Hi all, i named a username eirods, than it is already in passwd and group. And i try to install the eirods on this server with rpm -i, Then i get this information. Creating Service Group and Account: eirods at /var/lib/eirods ERROR :: Please delete the existing Service Group eirods before proceeding. is there any solution to fix this? Thanks You must develop a plan to deal with duplicate user names. I've seen this done in several ways. You could add a number to the user name: I.E. eirods01 If you use the person's initials you can build a user name like this: John Alfred Johns = JAJ00 James Albert Jones = JAJ01 If the user has no middle name use the first initial and the first two letters of the last name: Mark LaPierre = MLA03 It's a good plan to make all your user names the same length. It makes managing your system with scripts much easier. Say you adopt a length of six characters. John Alfred Johns = JAJOHN James Albert Jones = JAJONS Mark LaPierre = MLAPIE Se Ta = SETA00 Maybe you might have some direct hires and some contractors on your system. You may want to add an indicator in the user name: John Alfred Johns = JAJC00 Contractor James Albert Jones = JAJC01 Contractor John Alfred Johns = JAJD00 Direct Hire James Albert Jones = JAJD01 Direct Hire It's always good to build in some intelligence into you user names. -- _ °v° /(_)\ ^ ^ Mark LaPierre Registered Linux user No #267004 https://linuxcounter.net/ -- users mailing list users@lists.fedoraproject.org To unsubscribe or change subscription options: https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/users Fedora Code of Conduct: http://fedoraproject.org/code-of-conduct Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Mailing_list_guidelines Have a question? Ask away: http://ask.fedoraproject.org
Re: good bye - Fwd: list-moderation - Re: KDE without gnome-shell?
On Wed, Nov 06, 2013 at 04:22:03PM -0500, Rahul Sundaram wrote: Hi On Wed, Nov 6, 2013 at 1:20 PM, Robert Holtzman wrote: BTW, the moderator(s) seem to confuse bluntness with rudeness and/or combatitiveness. For my part, I appreciate bluntness. Bluntness is often used as a excuse by people who are rude. It is easy enough to see the difference. You are wrong is blunt but is helpful to suggest how it can be improved. You are an idiot is rude and not really justified in this list even if you good technical expertise and it is against Fedora's code of conduct. I will leave it as an exercise to reader to figure out which side they stand on. The problem, of course, being that idiots seldom appreciate their idiocy unless it's pointed out to them...bluntly. I contend that, as has been previously stated in another post, this matter was poorly, clumsily handled. -- Bob Holtzman Your mail is being read by tight lipped NSA agents who fail to see humor in Doctor Strangelove Key ID 8D549279 signature.asc Description: Digital signature -- users mailing list users@lists.fedoraproject.org To unsubscribe or change subscription options: https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/users Fedora Code of Conduct: http://fedoraproject.org/code-of-conduct Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Mailing_list_guidelines Have a question? Ask away: http://ask.fedoraproject.org
Re: good bye - Fwd: list-moderation - Re: KDE without gnome-shell?
HI On Thu, Nov 7, 2013 at 12:15 AM, Robert Holtzman wrote: The problem, of course, being that idiots seldom appreciate their idiocy unless it's pointed out to them...bluntly. That is a really weak excuse for being rude. The expectation in Fedora is that everyone should read and follow https://fedoraproject.org/code-of-conduct Rahul -- users mailing list users@lists.fedoraproject.org To unsubscribe or change subscription options: https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/users Fedora Code of Conduct: http://fedoraproject.org/code-of-conduct Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Mailing_list_guidelines Have a question? Ask away: http://ask.fedoraproject.org
Re: good bye - Fwd: list-moderation - Re: KDE without gnome-shell?
On 11/07/2013 10:45 AM, Robert Holtzman wrote: On Wed, Nov 06, 2013 at 04:22:03PM -0500, Rahul Sundaram wrote: Hi On Wed, Nov 6, 2013 at 1:20 PM, Robert Holtzman wrote: BTW, the moderator(s) seem to confuse bluntness with rudeness and/or combatitiveness. For my part, I appreciate bluntness. Bluntness is often used as a excuse by people who are rude. It is easy enough to see the difference. You are wrong is blunt but is helpful to suggest how it can be improved. You are an idiot is rude and not really justified in this list even if you good technical expertise and it is against Fedora's code of conduct. I will leave it as an exercise to reader to figure out which side they stand on. The problem, of course, being that idiots seldom appreciate their idiocy unless it's pointed out to them...bluntly. Who is an idiot ? This is more often than not, very subjective. A novice user may seem like an idiot to an insensitive expert user. Being rude, and using expletives in the reply, does not help the Fedora User community in any way, and on the other hand it may even alienate novice users. If an expert does not have the patience to deal with a novice user, it is better not to reply, and to leave it for others with more patience to help. I contend that, as has been previously stated in another post, this matter was poorly, clumsily handled. The person was given advice multiple times, over an extended period of time, to change the tone of replies to the user community. I believe that the moderators were very patient with the person, and allowed more time than usual, on account of his contributions to the Fedora community. - rejy (rmc) -- users mailing list users@lists.fedoraproject.org To unsubscribe or change subscription options: https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/users Fedora Code of Conduct: http://fedoraproject.org/code-of-conduct Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Mailing_list_guidelines Have a question? Ask away: http://ask.fedoraproject.org
Re: good bye - Fwd: list-moderation - Re: KDE without gnome-shell?
On 5 November 2013 00:34, Reindl Harald h.rei...@thelounge.net wrote: rant snipped Thanks for replying my threads! Bye! -- Hiisi. Registered Linux User #487982. Be counted at: https://linuxcounter.net/ -- Spandex is a privilege, not a right -- users mailing list users@lists.fedoraproject.org To unsubscribe or change subscription options: https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/users Fedora Code of Conduct: http://fedoraproject.org/code-of-conduct Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Mailing_list_guidelines Have a question? Ask away: http://ask.fedoraproject.org
Re: good bye - Fwd: list-moderation - Re: KDE without gnome-shell?
On 11/07/2013 07:21 AM, Rejy M Cyriac wrote: On 11/07/2013 10:45 AM, Robert Holtzman wrote: On Wed, Nov 06, 2013 at 04:22:03PM -0500, Rahul Sundaram wrote: Hi On Wed, Nov 6, 2013 at 1:20 PM, Robert Holtzman wrote: BTW, the moderator(s) seem to confuse bluntness with rudeness and/or combatitiveness. For my part, I appreciate bluntness. Bluntness is often used as a excuse by people who are rude. It is easy enough to see the difference. You are wrong is blunt but is helpful to suggest how it can be improved. You are an idiot is rude and not really justified in this list even if you good technical expertise and it is against Fedora's code of conduct. I will leave it as an exercise to reader to figure out which side they stand on. The problem, of course, being that idiots seldom appreciate their idiocy unless it's pointed out to them...bluntly. Who is an idiot ? This is more often than not, very subjective. A novice user may seem like an idiot to an insensitive expert user. Being rude, and using expletives in the reply, does not help the Fedora User community in any way, and on the other hand it may even alienate novice users. What to consider rude also is subjective and largely dependent on a person's personal background. I for instance, consider ad-hominem attacks disguised in politically correct wordings (There have been some in this thread) to be more disgusting than people who are using blunt or vulgar wordings to describe their positions on technical matters. I contend that, as has been previously stated in another post, this matter was poorly, clumsily handled. The person was given advice multiple times, over an extended period of time, to change the tone of replies to the user community. I believe that the moderators were very patient with the person, and allowed more time than usual, on account of his contributions to the Fedora community. Well, I respectfully disagree. The moderators did not handle the situation appropriately, escalated the situation and have managed to drive away a Fedora user who provided valuable contributions. Ralf -- users mailing list users@lists.fedoraproject.org To unsubscribe or change subscription options: https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/users Fedora Code of Conduct: http://fedoraproject.org/code-of-conduct Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Mailing_list_guidelines Have a question? Ask away: http://ask.fedoraproject.org
