Re: [Veritas-bu] RMAN crosscheck - SOLVED
I was on vacation last week. Our DBA solved the problem she was having here. It was the incorrect values for variable NB_ORA_CLIENT in the crosscheck script which used the real hostname instead of the backup LAN hostname which the backup/restore scripts use. For most of our hosts we have a separate backup LAN. To distinguish path over the backup LAN as opposed to the primary LAN we typically suffix the hostname with a b. So if we had a server named tiger (used for primary LAN) we would do backups/restores using tigerb (backup LAN). In her issue the crosscheck script had tiger and when she changed it to tigerb which is what was in the backup/restore scripts then it worked properly. From: veritas-bu-boun...@mailman.eng.auburn.edu [mailto:veritas-bu-boun...@mailman.eng.auburn.edu] On Behalf Of Jared Still Sent: Tuesday, May 25, 2010 8:32 PM To: Dean Cc: veritas-bu@mailman.eng.auburn.edu Subject: Re: [Veritas-bu] RMAN crosscheck On Tue, May 25, 2010 at 4:54 PM, Dean dean.de...@gmail.com wrote: Are you sure RMAN actually knows about the tape an image is on? If it does, that is just silly. It should just ask for a backupid, then NBU will give it the correct tape, regardless of whether it's a duped or vault copy or whatever. I've always been sure that that's the way it worked (Although, I'm not a DBA and don't know that much about RMAN). I think you're right, it just keeps the Media ID. It's been a few months since I have looked closely at it. Regarding vaulted tapes: RMAN will not know that a tape has been vaulted, so it will have the wrong media ID for requesting the tape. If the tapes are restored into the NBU catalog, RMAN will then ask for the correct backup pieces by name. This not an issue with RMAN, as the API has that capability, at least according to the docs. It just has not been implemented by Veritas. This would bear further investigation, as that situation may have changed since I last looked into it. Does RMAN also track disk STUs? I know in our environment, we write all our Oracle archive log backups to a DSSU, then they get moved out to tape and deleted from the DSSU within a day or so. We restore regularly (to development), and it always works fine, regardless of whether the archive log backups are still on disk or have been moved to tape. Does that mean RMAN is aware of the destage process? I highly doubt it. There is a way for RMAN in later version to track backups that are staged to disk and then backed up on to tape. I have never used it, and don't know any details about it. Jared Still Certifiable Oracle DBA and Part Time Perl Evangelist Oracle Blog: http://jkstill.blogspot.com Home Page: http://jaredstill.com Proud partner. Susan G. Komen for the Cure. Please consider our environment before printing this e-mail or attachments. -- CONFIDENTIALITY NOTICE: This e-mail may contain privileged or confidential information and is for the sole use of the intended recipient(s). If you are not the intended recipient, any disclosure, copying, distribution, or use of the contents of this information is prohibited and may be unlawful. If you have received this electronic transmission in error, please reply immediately to the sender that you have received the message in error, and delete it. Thank you. -- ___ Veritas-bu maillist - Veritas-bu@mailman.eng.auburn.edu http://mailman.eng.auburn.edu/mailman/listinfo/veritas-bu
Re: [Veritas-bu] RMAN crosscheck
On Wed, May 19, 2010 at 1:16 PM, David McMullin david.mcmul...@cbc-companies.com wrote: NOTE THIS PART! but this list is incomplete if an image spans several media. I haven't experienced that myself. If that were true, RMAN would be unable to restore. Having used RMAN/NetBackup to do many restores, that statement seems incorrect to me. One thing that I have seen is that if the tape has been vaulted, the media ID changes and RMAN no longer knows the correct media to ask for. When that happen, I have to supply a date range to our Backup Admin, and he requests the right tapes to restore to the time period. As re-cataloging NetBackup tapes back into the RMAN repository is nearly impossible, I never expire anything from RMAN. That way when an old tape is put back into NBU, RMAN still has the correct names to request. I guess it is possible to re-catalog NBU tapes back into RMAN, it just isn't documented by Oracle. Here's an undocumented CATALOG command you may find interesting: http://erpondb.blogspot.com/2008/09/catalog-rman-backuppieces.html Jared Still Certifiable Oracle DBA and Part Time Perl Evangelist Oracle Blog: http://jkstill.blogspot.com Home Page: http://jaredstill.com ___ Veritas-bu maillist - Veritas-bu@mailman.eng.auburn.edu http://mailman.eng.auburn.edu/mailman/listinfo/veritas-bu
Re: [Veritas-bu] RMAN crosscheck
On Mon, May 17, 2010 at 9:38 AM, Lightner, Jeff jlight...@water.com wrote: That’s unfortunate. It seems that there ought to be a way to have RMAN rebuild its catalog from NBU much the same the way that NBU can recover images into its catalog from NBU expired but not yet overwritten tapes. It apparently can be done, though it requires some manual intervention: http://erpondb.blogspot.com/2008/09/catalog-rman-backuppieces.html Jared Still Certifiable Oracle DBA and Part Time Perl Evangelist Oracle Blog: http://jkstill.blogspot.com Home Page: http://jaredstill.com ___ Veritas-bu maillist - Veritas-bu@mailman.eng.auburn.edu http://mailman.eng.auburn.edu/mailman/listinfo/veritas-bu
Re: [Veritas-bu] RMAN crosscheck
Are you sure RMAN actually knows about the tape an image is on? If it does, that is just silly. It should just ask for a backupid, then NBU will give it the correct tape, regardless of whether it's a duped or vault copy or whatever. I've always been sure that that's the way it worked (Although, I'm not a DBA and don't know that much about RMAN). Why would RMAN, if it's using the sbt_tape pipe to talk to NBU, need to know media details? It doesn't make any sense. I can understand it if you're using RMAN without NBU to write straight to tape, but if RMAN is just piping data to NBU, why would it need to double up on NBUs media management? Does RMAN also track disk STUs? I know in our environment, we write all our Oracle archive log backups to a DSSU, then they get moved out to tape and deleted from the DSSU within a day or so. We restore regularly (to development), and it always works fine, regardless of whether the archive log backups are still on disk or have been moved to tape. Does that mean RMAN is aware of the destage process? I highly doubt it. On Wed, May 26, 2010 at 7:38 AM, Jared Still jkst...@gmail.com wrote: On Wed, May 19, 2010 at 1:16 PM, David McMullin david.mcmul...@cbc-companies.com wrote: NOTE THIS PART! but this list is incomplete if an image spans several media. I haven't experienced that myself. If that were true, RMAN would be unable to restore. Having used RMAN/NetBackup to do many restores, that statement seems incorrect to me. One thing that I have seen is that if the tape has been vaulted, the media ID changes and RMAN no longer knows the correct media to ask for. When that happen, I have to supply a date range to our Backup Admin, and he requests the right tapes to restore to the time period. As re-cataloging NetBackup tapes back into the RMAN repository is nearly impossible, I never expire anything from RMAN. That way when an old tape is put back into NBU, RMAN still has the correct names to request. I guess it is possible to re-catalog NBU tapes back into RMAN, it just isn't documented by Oracle. Here's an undocumented CATALOG command you may find interesting: http://erpondb.blogspot.com/2008/09/catalog-rman-backuppieces.html Jared Still Certifiable Oracle DBA and Part Time Perl Evangelist Oracle Blog: http://jkstill.blogspot.com Home Page: http://jaredstill.com ___ Veritas-bu maillist - Veritas-bu@mailman.eng.auburn.edu http://mailman.eng.auburn.edu/mailman/listinfo/veritas-bu ___ Veritas-bu maillist - Veritas-bu@mailman.eng.auburn.edu http://mailman.eng.auburn.edu/mailman/listinfo/veritas-bu
Re: [Veritas-bu] RMAN crosscheck
On Tue, May 25, 2010 at 4:54 PM, Dean dean.de...@gmail.com wrote: Are you sure RMAN actually knows about the tape an image is on? If it does, that is just silly. It should just ask for a backupid, then NBU will give it the correct tape, regardless of whether it's a duped or vault copy or whatever. I've always been sure that that's the way it worked (Although, I'm not a DBA and don't know that much about RMAN). I think you're right, it just keeps the Media ID. It's been a few months since I have looked closely at it. Regarding vaulted tapes: RMAN will not know that a tape has been vaulted, so it will have the wrong media ID for requesting the tape. If the tapes are restored into the NBU catalog, RMAN will then ask for the correct backup pieces by name. This not an issue with RMAN, as the API has that capability, at least according to the docs. It just has not been implemented by Veritas. This would bear further investigation, as that situation may have changed since I last looked into it. Does RMAN also track disk STUs? I know in our environment, we write all our Oracle archive log backups to a DSSU, then they get moved out to tape and deleted from the DSSU within a day or so. We restore regularly (to development), and it always works fine, regardless of whether the archive log backups are still on disk or have been moved to tape. Does that mean RMAN is aware of the destage process? I highly doubt it. There is a way for RMAN in later version to track backups that are staged to disk and then backed up on to tape. I have never used it, and don't know any details about it. Jared Still Certifiable Oracle DBA and Part Time Perl Evangelist Oracle Blog: http://jkstill.blogspot.com Home Page: http://jaredstill.com ___ Veritas-bu maillist - Veritas-bu@mailman.eng.auburn.edu http://mailman.eng.auburn.edu/mailman/listinfo/veritas-bu
Re: [Veritas-bu] RMAN crosscheck
Jeff - I am pretty sure that there should be synchronizing of the expiration date within RMAN and NetBackup - although the expiration of images within RMAN is handled here by our DBA group. Our process is to backup the control file right after the RMAN backup and our restore process starts with restoring that control file. I know how to un-expire or extend the expiration date of NetBackup images, but I do not know how we would accomplish that within the RMAN control file. We use an 8 week retention period here and have never had issues recovering data, beyond the frustrating part of sometimes being unable to determine what tapes are needed until we try to restore and it asks for an unexpected tape... -Original Message- From: Lightner, Jeff [mailto:jlight...@water.com] Sent: Wednesday, May 19, 2010 4:27 PM To: David McMullin; veritas-bu@mailman.eng.auburn.edu Subject: RE: [Veritas-bu] RMAN crosscheck Thanks. As noted in my original question though, I already do see the images using NBU utilities. The question is how can we restore those images if RMAN doesn't know they exist? The first reply to my original indicated that one has to use RMAN to recover and RMAN doesn't know they're there. The mail you quoted below had a link that seemed to suggest you could make RMAN know by using crosscheck to talk to media manager which I assumed meant NBU in this case. It seems you're now saying that isn't reliable so I'm back to the original question above. Symantec's response you quoted seems to indicate there is some value knowing where the NBU images are but doesn't answer the question. Perhaps there's a flawed assumption? Does a restore from NBU have to be done via RMAN if it was backed up via RMAN? Does it not matter that it isn't in the RMAN catalog so long as it is in the NBU catalog? -Original Message- From: veritas-bu-boun...@mailman.eng.auburn.edu [mailto:veritas-bu-boun...@mailman.eng.auburn.edu] On Behalf Of David McMullin Sent: Wednesday, May 19, 2010 4:17 PM To: veritas-bu@mailman.eng.auburn.edu Subject: [Veritas-bu] RMAN crosscheck I am working with my DBA and Symantec, opened a ticket and found this issue from the RMAN side: Here is my note to them: Please review case # 291-053-107. Our Oracle DBA are extremely upset that the tools available to them to troubleshoot in a DR situation are so poor. They have no reliable way to determine something as simple as which media to request. * The Oracle RMAN utility, referencing the control files or RMAN catalog database, knows what backupsets are needed for a restore. * Only RMAN knows what backup pieces are needed for a restore. * While there is an RMAN command that will list the images that a particular backupset resides on, but this list is incomplete if an image spans several media. NOTE THIS PART! but this list is incomplete if an image spans several media. Here is Symantec response: I consulted with my seniors and my peers who work with NOM, and unfortunately we do not have a report that can show us the backupset mapping with the media id. So we'll have to follow the same procedure to know the media-ids: Oracle DBA tells you the data range information, client name from the backupset query. You can run bpimagelist and bpimmedia commands to know the medias required for recovery of that backupset. Message: 7 Date: Wed, 19 May 2010 15:04:54 +0200 From: Michael Graff Andersen mia...@gmail.com Subject: Re: [Veritas-bu] RMAN crosscheck To: Lightner, Jeff jlight...@water.com Cc: veritas-bu@mailman.eng.auburn.edu, Kevin Corley kevin.cor...@apollogrp.edu Message-ID: aanlktikyylbqqbqakuc6433zt-ltm6hwqixc8bwvh...@mail.gmail.com Content-Type: text/plain; charset=windows-1252 Think there is, at least according to this page http://ss64.com/ora/rman_crosscheck.html Regards Michael ___ Veritas-bu maillist - Veritas-bu@mailman.eng.auburn.edu http://mailman.eng.auburn.edu/mailman/listinfo/veritas-bu Proud partner. Susan G. Komen for the Cure. Please consider our environment before printing this e-mail or attachments. -- CONFIDENTIALITY NOTICE: This e-mail may contain privileged or confidential information and is for the sole use of the intended recipient(s). If you are not the intended recipient, any disclosure, copying, distribution, or use of the contents of this information is prohibited and may be unlawful. If you have received this electronic transmission in error, please reply immediately to the sender that you have received the message in error, and delete it. Thank you. -- ___ Veritas-bu maillist - Veritas-bu@mailman.eng.auburn.edu http://mailman.eng.auburn.edu/mailman/listinfo/veritas-bu
Re: [Veritas-bu] RMAN crosscheck
Think there is, at least according to this page http://ss64.com/ora/rman_crosscheck.html Regards Michael 2010/5/17 Lightner, Jeff jlight...@water.com That’s unfortunate. It seems that there ought to be a way to have RMAN rebuild its catalog from NBU much the same the way that NBU can recover images into its catalog from NBU expired but not yet overwritten tapes. -- *From:* Mark Glazerman [mailto:mark.glazer...@spartech.com] *Sent:* Monday, May 17, 2010 12:30 PM *To:* Lightner, Jeff; Kevin Corley *Cc:* veritas-bu@mailman.eng.auburn.edu *Subject:* RE: [Veritas-bu] RMAN crosscheck Autobackup is an RMAN setting. We use autobackup and had recovered the controlfile for the attempted restore I talked about earlier. However, because RMAN had already expired the required images from its own catalog, we were unable to recover the data, even with backup images still residing in the Netbackup catalog. *Mark Glazerman* Desk: 314-889-8282 Cell: 618-520-3401 P please don't print this e-mail unless you really need to *From:* Lightner, Jeff [mailto:jlight...@water.com] *Sent:* Monday, May 17, 2010 11:27 AM *To:* Kevin Corley; Mark Glazerman *Cc:* veritas-bu@mailman.eng.auburn.edu *Subject:* RE: [Veritas-bu] RMAN crosscheck Thanks guys. Is autobackup a setting in RMAN or in NBU? -- *From:* veritas-bu-boun...@mailman.eng.auburn.edu [mailto: veritas-bu-boun...@mailman.eng.auburn.edu] *On Behalf Of *Kevin Corley *Sent:* Monday, May 17, 2010 12:23 PM *To:* Mark Glazerman; Lightner, Jeff *Cc:* veritas-bu@mailman.eng.auburn.edu *Subject:* Re: [Veritas-bu] RMAN crosscheck As long as you have autobackup enabled, you shouldn’t need the rman repository. If netbackup has the images in the catalog, restore the control file from autobackup, which has the rman pieces info and will poll netbackup for the images associated with them. *From:* veritas-bu-boun...@mailman.eng.auburn.edu [mailto: veritas-bu-boun...@mailman.eng.auburn.edu] *On Behalf Of *Mark Glazerman *Sent:* Monday, May 17, 2010 8:58 AM *To:* Lightner, Jeff *Cc:* veritas-bu@mailman.eng.auburn.edu *Subject:* Re: [Veritas-bu] RMAN crosscheck Jeff, I can only really comment on your last question about using expired RMAN images for restores if they are not expired in NetBackup. We had a similar issue a few weeks back where Netbackup could still see images in its catalog of oracle backups (which initiate a RMAN backup via the oracle_backup.sh script) but RMAN had already expired them inside its own catalog. These files were not recoverable by RMAN. We had the DBA’s set their retention inside RMAN to match the retention specified inside NBU so that we don’t see this mis-match again. Ultimately, RMAN controls the expiration of the images inside its catalog meaning that regardless of the expiration you set for oracle backups inside NBU, RMAN will keep or expire those images, regardless of what Netbackup is trying to tell it. I don’t know how you’d configure RMAN to handle your vaulting needs. Would setting the expiration of these images in RMAN to the longest required length of time (4 months for example) mean that the vaulted images would still be good for the max time they’d need to be held on either the Data Domain or tape ? The Netbackup catalog doesn’t need to know about the RMAN images for them to still be recoverable by RMAN so you could set a different, shorter expiration inside NBU although this would still leave you with different retentions in the two different catalogs FYI The solaris client we were trying to restore these RMAN images to is running 6.5.4 with a 7.0 master and media server. *Mark Glazerman* Desk: 314-889-8282 Cell: 618-520-3401 P please don't print this e-mail unless you really need to *From:* veritas-bu-boun...@mailman.eng.auburn.edu [mailto: veritas-bu-boun...@mailman.eng.auburn.edu] *On Behalf Of *Lightner, Jeff *Sent:* Friday, May 14, 2010 7:12 AM *To:* veritas-bu@mailman.eng.auburn.edu *Subject:* [Veritas-bu] RMAN crosscheck My DBAs are starting to question me about an RMAN crosscheck they are running. Essentially I gather that when they ran it the crosscheck seemed to report even backups run in the last 2 days as expired. On checking the Data Domain unit I can see the images are still there and on running NetBackup commands I see these are NOT expired from NBU’s perspective. On doing a search I did find a document at Symantec that talked about RMAN expirations but it only went up through 6.0 so I’m not sure if it is still valid for 6.5. It says essentially that on the NBU side we should set very long retentions (e.g. INFINITY) for all RMAN backup policies then let RMAN keep track of retentions itself. The downside I see to this is we do vaulting of the images on data domain to tape – we set retention on data domain to 1 month
Re: [Veritas-bu] RMAN crosscheck
That looks promising. Have you used it successfully? Mark - did you try this when you had your issue? From: Michael Graff Andersen [mailto:mia...@gmail.com] Sent: Wednesday, May 19, 2010 9:05 AM To: Lightner, Jeff Cc: Mark Glazerman; Kevin Corley; veritas-bu@mailman.eng.auburn.edu Subject: Re: [Veritas-bu] RMAN crosscheck Think there is, at least according to this page http://ss64.com/ora/rman_crosscheck.html Regards Michael 2010/5/17 Lightner, Jeff jlight...@water.com That's unfortunate. It seems that there ought to be a way to have RMAN rebuild its catalog from NBU much the same the way that NBU can recover images into its catalog from NBU expired but not yet overwritten tapes. From: Mark Glazerman [mailto:mark.glazer...@spartech.com] Sent: Monday, May 17, 2010 12:30 PM To: Lightner, Jeff; Kevin Corley Cc: veritas-bu@mailman.eng.auburn.edu Subject: RE: [Veritas-bu] RMAN crosscheck Autobackup is an RMAN setting. We use autobackup and had recovered the controlfile for the attempted restore I talked about earlier. However, because RMAN had already expired the required images from its own catalog, we were unable to recover the data, even with backup images still residing in the Netbackup catalog. Mark Glazerman Desk: 314-889-8282 Cell: 618-520-3401 P please don't print this e-mail unless you really need to From: Lightner, Jeff [mailto:jlight...@water.com] Sent: Monday, May 17, 2010 11:27 AM To: Kevin Corley; Mark Glazerman Cc: veritas-bu@mailman.eng.auburn.edu Subject: RE: [Veritas-bu] RMAN crosscheck Thanks guys. Is autobackup a setting in RMAN or in NBU? From: veritas-bu-boun...@mailman.eng.auburn.edu [mailto:veritas-bu-boun...@mailman.eng.auburn.edu] On Behalf Of Kevin Corley Sent: Monday, May 17, 2010 12:23 PM To: Mark Glazerman; Lightner, Jeff Cc: veritas-bu@mailman.eng.auburn.edu Subject: Re: [Veritas-bu] RMAN crosscheck As long as you have autobackup enabled, you shouldn't need the rman repository. If netbackup has the images in the catalog, restore the control file from autobackup, which has the rman pieces info and will poll netbackup for the images associated with them. From: veritas-bu-boun...@mailman.eng.auburn.edu [mailto:veritas-bu-boun...@mailman.eng.auburn.edu] On Behalf Of Mark Glazerman Sent: Monday, May 17, 2010 8:58 AM To: Lightner, Jeff Cc: veritas-bu@mailman.eng.auburn.edu Subject: Re: [Veritas-bu] RMAN crosscheck Jeff, I can only really comment on your last question about using expired RMAN images for restores if they are not expired in NetBackup. We had a similar issue a few weeks back where Netbackup could still see images in its catalog of oracle backups (which initiate a RMAN backup via the oracle_backup.sh script) but RMAN had already expired them inside its own catalog. These files were not recoverable by RMAN. We had the DBA's set their retention inside RMAN to match the retention specified inside NBU so that we don't see this mis-match again. Ultimately, RMAN controls the expiration of the images inside its catalog meaning that regardless of the expiration you set for oracle backups inside NBU, RMAN will keep or expire those images, regardless of what Netbackup is trying to tell it. I don't know how you'd configure RMAN to handle your vaulting needs. Would setting the expiration of these images in RMAN to the longest required length of time (4 months for example) mean that the vaulted images would still be good for the max time they'd need to be held on either the Data Domain or tape ? The Netbackup catalog doesn't need to know about the RMAN images for them to still be recoverable by RMAN so you could set a different, shorter expiration inside NBU although this would still leave you with different retentions in the two different catalogs FYI The solaris client we were trying to restore these RMAN images to is running 6.5.4 with a 7.0 master and media server. Mark Glazerman Desk: 314-889-8282 Cell: 618-520-3401 P please don't print this e-mail unless you really need to From: veritas-bu-boun...@mailman.eng.auburn.edu [mailto:veritas-bu-boun...@mailman.eng.auburn.edu] On Behalf Of Lightner, Jeff Sent: Friday, May 14, 2010 7:12 AM To: veritas-bu@mailman.eng.auburn.edu Subject: [Veritas-bu] RMAN crosscheck My DBAs are starting to question me about an RMAN crosscheck they are running. Essentially I gather that when they ran it the crosscheck seemed to report even backups run in the last 2 days as expired. On checking the Data Domain unit I can see the images are still there and on running NetBackup commands I see these are NOT expired from NBU's perspective. On doing a search I did find a document at Symantec that talked about RMAN expirations but it only went up through 6.0 so I'm not sure if it is still valid for 6.5. It says essentially that on the NBU side we
Re: [Veritas-bu] RMAN crosscheck
I'm not sure if our DBA's tried this exact method but in our environment, where we back up only to Data Domain, we don't have another repository (eg. Vaulted Tape) to look for any RMAN backup pieces. Once RMAN had expired the images we needed and they had been cleared off the data domain, there was nowhere else where we could look for components to put together a successful restore via RMAN. Mark Glazerman Desk: 314-889-8282 Cell: 618-520-3401 P please don't print this e-mail unless you really need to From: Lightner, Jeff [mailto:jlight...@water.com] Sent: Wednesday, May 19, 2010 8:43 AM To: Michael Graff Andersen Cc: Mark Glazerman; Kevin Corley; veritas-bu@mailman.eng.auburn.edu Subject: RE: [Veritas-bu] RMAN crosscheck That looks promising. Have you used it successfully? Mark - did you try this when you had your issue? From: Michael Graff Andersen [mailto:mia...@gmail.com] Sent: Wednesday, May 19, 2010 9:05 AM To: Lightner, Jeff Cc: Mark Glazerman; Kevin Corley; veritas-bu@mailman.eng.auburn.edu Subject: Re: [Veritas-bu] RMAN crosscheck Think there is, at least according to this page http://ss64.com/ora/rman_crosscheck.html Regards Michael 2010/5/17 Lightner, Jeff jlight...@water.com That's unfortunate. It seems that there ought to be a way to have RMAN rebuild its catalog from NBU much the same the way that NBU can recover images into its catalog from NBU expired but not yet overwritten tapes. From: Mark Glazerman [mailto:mark.glazer...@spartech.com] Sent: Monday, May 17, 2010 12:30 PM To: Lightner, Jeff; Kevin Corley Cc: veritas-bu@mailman.eng.auburn.edu Subject: RE: [Veritas-bu] RMAN crosscheck Autobackup is an RMAN setting. We use autobackup and had recovered the controlfile for the attempted restore I talked about earlier. However, because RMAN had already expired the required images from its own catalog, we were unable to recover the data, even with backup images still residing in the Netbackup catalog. Mark Glazerman Desk: 314-889-8282 Cell: 618-520-3401 P please don't print this e-mail unless you really need to From: Lightner, Jeff [mailto:jlight...@water.com] Sent: Monday, May 17, 2010 11:27 AM To: Kevin Corley; Mark Glazerman Cc: veritas-bu@mailman.eng.auburn.edu Subject: RE: [Veritas-bu] RMAN crosscheck Thanks guys. Is autobackup a setting in RMAN or in NBU? From: veritas-bu-boun...@mailman.eng.auburn.edu [mailto:veritas-bu-boun...@mailman.eng.auburn.edu] On Behalf Of Kevin Corley Sent: Monday, May 17, 2010 12:23 PM To: Mark Glazerman; Lightner, Jeff Cc: veritas-bu@mailman.eng.auburn.edu Subject: Re: [Veritas-bu] RMAN crosscheck As long as you have autobackup enabled, you shouldn't need the rman repository. If netbackup has the images in the catalog, restore the control file from autobackup, which has the rman pieces info and will poll netbackup for the images associated with them. From: veritas-bu-boun...@mailman.eng.auburn.edu [mailto:veritas-bu-boun...@mailman.eng.auburn.edu] On Behalf Of Mark Glazerman Sent: Monday, May 17, 2010 8:58 AM To: Lightner, Jeff Cc: veritas-bu@mailman.eng.auburn.edu Subject: Re: [Veritas-bu] RMAN crosscheck Jeff, I can only really comment on your last question about using expired RMAN images for restores if they are not expired in NetBackup. We had a similar issue a few weeks back where Netbackup could still see images in its catalog of oracle backups (which initiate a RMAN backup via the oracle_backup.sh script) but RMAN had already expired them inside its own catalog. These files were not recoverable by RMAN. We had the DBA's set their retention inside RMAN to match the retention specified inside NBU so that we don't see this mis-match again. Ultimately, RMAN controls the expiration of the images inside its catalog meaning that regardless of the expiration you set for oracle backups inside NBU, RMAN will keep or expire those images, regardless of what Netbackup is trying to tell it. I don't know how you'd configure RMAN to handle your vaulting needs. Would setting the expiration of these images in RMAN to the longest required length of time (4 months for example) mean that the vaulted images would still be good for the max time they'd need to be held on either the Data Domain or tape ? The Netbackup catalog doesn't need to know about the RMAN images for them to still be recoverable by RMAN so you could set a different, shorter expiration inside NBU although this would still leave you with different retentions in the two different catalogs FYI The solaris client we were trying to restore these RMAN images to is running 6.5.4 with a 7.0 master and media server. Mark Glazerman Desk: 314-889-8282 Cell: 618-520-3401 P please don't print this e-mail unless you really need to From: veritas-bu-boun...@mailman.eng.auburn.edu [mailto:veritas-bu-boun
Re: [Veritas-bu] RMAN crosscheck
We did still have NBU images of the backups that initiated the RMAN backups but once RMAN had expired its own images, these were essentially useless. I don't believe that RMAN is able to query NBU's catalog as part of the crosscheck anyway. Mark Glazerman Desk: 314-889-8282 Cell: 618-520-3401 P please don't print this e-mail unless you really need to From: Lightner, Jeff [mailto:jlight...@water.com] Sent: Wednesday, May 19, 2010 8:55 AM To: Mark Glazerman; Michael Graff Andersen Cc: Kevin Corley; veritas-bu@mailman.eng.auburn.edu Subject: RE: [Veritas-bu] RMAN crosscheck Thanks. I thought I'd understood you earlier to say you had extant NBU images that you couldn't restore because RMAN said they were expired. If you have no backup images anywhere then nothing's going to recover them even if they aren't marked expired even if it's a standard backup. From: Mark Glazerman [mailto:mark.glazer...@spartech.com] Sent: Wednesday, May 19, 2010 9:50 AM To: Lightner, Jeff; Michael Graff Andersen Cc: Kevin Corley; veritas-bu@mailman.eng.auburn.edu Subject: RE: [Veritas-bu] RMAN crosscheck I'm not sure if our DBA's tried this exact method but in our environment, where we back up only to Data Domain, we don't have another repository (eg. Vaulted Tape) to look for any RMAN backup pieces. Once RMAN had expired the images we needed and they had been cleared off the data domain, there was nowhere else where we could look for components to put together a successful restore via RMAN. Mark Glazerman Desk: 314-889-8282 Cell: 618-520-3401 P please don't print this e-mail unless you really need to From: Lightner, Jeff [mailto:jlight...@water.com] Sent: Wednesday, May 19, 2010 8:43 AM To: Michael Graff Andersen Cc: Mark Glazerman; Kevin Corley; veritas-bu@mailman.eng.auburn.edu Subject: RE: [Veritas-bu] RMAN crosscheck That looks promising. Have you used it successfully? Mark - did you try this when you had your issue? From: Michael Graff Andersen [mailto:mia...@gmail.com] Sent: Wednesday, May 19, 2010 9:05 AM To: Lightner, Jeff Cc: Mark Glazerman; Kevin Corley; veritas-bu@mailman.eng.auburn.edu Subject: Re: [Veritas-bu] RMAN crosscheck Think there is, at least according to this page http://ss64.com/ora/rman_crosscheck.html Regards Michael 2010/5/17 Lightner, Jeff jlight...@water.com That's unfortunate. It seems that there ought to be a way to have RMAN rebuild its catalog from NBU much the same the way that NBU can recover images into its catalog from NBU expired but not yet overwritten tapes. From: Mark Glazerman [mailto:mark.glazer...@spartech.com] Sent: Monday, May 17, 2010 12:30 PM To: Lightner, Jeff; Kevin Corley Cc: veritas-bu@mailman.eng.auburn.edu Subject: RE: [Veritas-bu] RMAN crosscheck Autobackup is an RMAN setting. We use autobackup and had recovered the controlfile for the attempted restore I talked about earlier. However, because RMAN had already expired the required images from its own catalog, we were unable to recover the data, even with backup images still residing in the Netbackup catalog. Mark Glazerman Desk: 314-889-8282 Cell: 618-520-3401 P please don't print this e-mail unless you really need to From: Lightner, Jeff [mailto:jlight...@water.com] Sent: Monday, May 17, 2010 11:27 AM To: Kevin Corley; Mark Glazerman Cc: veritas-bu@mailman.eng.auburn.edu Subject: RE: [Veritas-bu] RMAN crosscheck Thanks guys. Is autobackup a setting in RMAN or in NBU? From: veritas-bu-boun...@mailman.eng.auburn.edu [mailto:veritas-bu-boun...@mailman.eng.auburn.edu] On Behalf Of Kevin Corley Sent: Monday, May 17, 2010 12:23 PM To: Mark Glazerman; Lightner, Jeff Cc: veritas-bu@mailman.eng.auburn.edu Subject: Re: [Veritas-bu] RMAN crosscheck As long as you have autobackup enabled, you shouldn't need the rman repository. If netbackup has the images in the catalog, restore the control file from autobackup, which has the rman pieces info and will poll netbackup for the images associated with them. From: veritas-bu-boun...@mailman.eng.auburn.edu [mailto:veritas-bu-boun...@mailman.eng.auburn.edu] On Behalf Of Mark Glazerman Sent: Monday, May 17, 2010 8:58 AM To: Lightner, Jeff Cc: veritas-bu@mailman.eng.auburn.edu Subject: Re: [Veritas-bu] RMAN crosscheck Jeff, I can only really comment on your last question about using expired RMAN images for restores if they are not expired in NetBackup. We had a similar issue a few weeks back where Netbackup could still see images in its catalog of oracle backups (which initiate a RMAN backup via the oracle_backup.sh script) but RMAN had already expired them inside its own catalog. These files were not recoverable by RMAN. We had the DBA's set their retention inside RMAN to match the retention specified inside NBU so that we don't see
[Veritas-bu] RMAN crosscheck
I am working with my DBA and Symantec, opened a ticket and found this issue from the RMAN side: Here is my note to them: Please review case # 291-053-107. Our Oracle DBA are extremely upset that the tools available to them to troubleshoot in a DR situation are so poor. They have no reliable way to determine something as simple as which media to request. * The Oracle RMAN utility, referencing the control files or RMAN catalog database, knows what backupsets are needed for a restore. * Only RMAN knows what backup pieces are needed for a restore. * While there is an RMAN command that will list the images that a particular backupset resides on, but this list is incomplete if an image spans several media. NOTE THIS PART! but this list is incomplete if an image spans several media. Here is Symantec response: I consulted with my seniors and my peers who work with NOM, and unfortunately we do not have a report that can show us the backupset mapping with the media id. So we'll have to follow the same procedure to know the media-ids: Oracle DBA tells you the data range information, client name from the backupset query. You can run bpimagelist and bpimmedia commands to know the medias required for recovery of that backupset. Message: 7 Date: Wed, 19 May 2010 15:04:54 +0200 From: Michael Graff Andersen mia...@gmail.com Subject: Re: [Veritas-bu] RMAN crosscheck To: Lightner, Jeff jlight...@water.com Cc: veritas-bu@mailman.eng.auburn.edu, Kevin Corley kevin.cor...@apollogrp.edu Message-ID: aanlktikyylbqqbqakuc6433zt-ltm6hwqixc8bwvh...@mail.gmail.com Content-Type: text/plain; charset=windows-1252 Think there is, at least according to this page http://ss64.com/ora/rman_crosscheck.html Regards Michael ___ Veritas-bu maillist - Veritas-bu@mailman.eng.auburn.edu http://mailman.eng.auburn.edu/mailman/listinfo/veritas-bu
Re: [Veritas-bu] RMAN crosscheck
Thanks. As noted in my original question though, I already do see the images using NBU utilities. The question is how can we restore those images if RMAN doesn't know they exist? The first reply to my original indicated that one has to use RMAN to recover and RMAN doesn't know they're there. The mail you quoted below had a link that seemed to suggest you could make RMAN know by using crosscheck to talk to media manager which I assumed meant NBU in this case. It seems you're now saying that isn't reliable so I'm back to the original question above. Symantec's response you quoted seems to indicate there is some value knowing where the NBU images are but doesn't answer the question. Perhaps there's a flawed assumption? Does a restore from NBU have to be done via RMAN if it was backed up via RMAN? Does it not matter that it isn't in the RMAN catalog so long as it is in the NBU catalog? -Original Message- From: veritas-bu-boun...@mailman.eng.auburn.edu [mailto:veritas-bu-boun...@mailman.eng.auburn.edu] On Behalf Of David McMullin Sent: Wednesday, May 19, 2010 4:17 PM To: veritas-bu@mailman.eng.auburn.edu Subject: [Veritas-bu] RMAN crosscheck I am working with my DBA and Symantec, opened a ticket and found this issue from the RMAN side: Here is my note to them: Please review case # 291-053-107. Our Oracle DBA are extremely upset that the tools available to them to troubleshoot in a DR situation are so poor. They have no reliable way to determine something as simple as which media to request. * The Oracle RMAN utility, referencing the control files or RMAN catalog database, knows what backupsets are needed for a restore. * Only RMAN knows what backup pieces are needed for a restore. * While there is an RMAN command that will list the images that a particular backupset resides on, but this list is incomplete if an image spans several media. NOTE THIS PART! but this list is incomplete if an image spans several media. Here is Symantec response: I consulted with my seniors and my peers who work with NOM, and unfortunately we do not have a report that can show us the backupset mapping with the media id. So we'll have to follow the same procedure to know the media-ids: Oracle DBA tells you the data range information, client name from the backupset query. You can run bpimagelist and bpimmedia commands to know the medias required for recovery of that backupset. Message: 7 Date: Wed, 19 May 2010 15:04:54 +0200 From: Michael Graff Andersen mia...@gmail.com Subject: Re: [Veritas-bu] RMAN crosscheck To: Lightner, Jeff jlight...@water.com Cc: veritas-bu@mailman.eng.auburn.edu, Kevin Corley kevin.cor...@apollogrp.edu Message-ID: aanlktikyylbqqbqakuc6433zt-ltm6hwqixc8bwvh...@mail.gmail.com Content-Type: text/plain; charset=windows-1252 Think there is, at least according to this page http://ss64.com/ora/rman_crosscheck.html Regards Michael ___ Veritas-bu maillist - Veritas-bu@mailman.eng.auburn.edu http://mailman.eng.auburn.edu/mailman/listinfo/veritas-bu Proud partner. Susan G. Komen for the Cure. Please consider our environment before printing this e-mail or attachments. -- CONFIDENTIALITY NOTICE: This e-mail may contain privileged or confidential information and is for the sole use of the intended recipient(s). If you are not the intended recipient, any disclosure, copying, distribution, or use of the contents of this information is prohibited and may be unlawful. If you have received this electronic transmission in error, please reply immediately to the sender that you have received the message in error, and delete it. Thank you. -- ___ Veritas-bu maillist - Veritas-bu@mailman.eng.auburn.edu http://mailman.eng.auburn.edu/mailman/listinfo/veritas-bu
Re: [Veritas-bu] RMAN crosscheck
Jeff, I can only really comment on your last question about using expired RMAN images for restores if they are not expired in NetBackup. We had a similar issue a few weeks back where Netbackup could still see images in its catalog of oracle backups (which initiate a RMAN backup via the oracle_backup.sh script) but RMAN had already expired them inside its own catalog. These files were not recoverable by RMAN. We had the DBA's set their retention inside RMAN to match the retention specified inside NBU so that we don't see this mis-match again. Ultimately, RMAN controls the expiration of the images inside its catalog meaning that regardless of the expiration you set for oracle backups inside NBU, RMAN will keep or expire those images, regardless of what Netbackup is trying to tell it. I don't know how you'd configure RMAN to handle your vaulting needs. Would setting the expiration of these images in RMAN to the longest required length of time (4 months for example) mean that the vaulted images would still be good for the max time they'd need to be held on either the Data Domain or tape ? The Netbackup catalog doesn't need to know about the RMAN images for them to still be recoverable by RMAN so you could set a different, shorter expiration inside NBU although this would still leave you with different retentions in the two different catalogs FYI The solaris client we were trying to restore these RMAN images to is running 6.5.4 with a 7.0 master and media server. Mark Glazerman Desk: 314-889-8282 Cell: 618-520-3401 P please don't print this e-mail unless you really need to From: veritas-bu-boun...@mailman.eng.auburn.edu [mailto:veritas-bu-boun...@mailman.eng.auburn.edu] On Behalf Of Lightner, Jeff Sent: Friday, May 14, 2010 7:12 AM To: veritas-bu@mailman.eng.auburn.edu Subject: [Veritas-bu] RMAN crosscheck My DBAs are starting to question me about an RMAN crosscheck they are running. Essentially I gather that when they ran it the crosscheck seemed to report even backups run in the last 2 days as expired. On checking the Data Domain unit I can see the images are still there and on running NetBackup commands I see these are NOT expired from NBU's perspective. On doing a search I did find a document at Symantec that talked about RMAN expirations but it only went up through 6.0 so I'm not sure if it is still valid for 6.5. It says essentially that on the NBU side we should set very long retentions (e.g. INFINITY) for all RMAN backup policies then let RMAN keep track of retentions itself. The downside I see to this is we do vaulting of the images on data domain to tape - we set retention on data domain to 1 month then the vault copies get longer retentions (e.g. 3 months for a daily backup). How would we get RMAN to set and keep track of such retention differences? The DBAs have opened a TAR with Oracle to see why the crosscheck is reporting the images as expired but I suspect from the NBU document that the answer will be something like it is expired so far as RMAN is concerned. This also begs the question as to whether RMAN could be used to restore the backups even if they aren't expired so far as NBU is concerned. Does anyone know the answer to that? Proud partner. Susan G. Komen for the Cure. Please consider our environment before printing this e-mail or attachments. -- CONFIDENTIALITY NOTICE: This e-mail may contain privileged or confidential information and is for the sole use of the intended recipient(s). If you are not the intended recipient, any disclosure, copying, distribution, or use of the contents of this information is prohibited and may be unlawful. If you have received this electronic transmission in error, please reply immediately to the sender that you have received the message in error, and delete it. Thank you. -- ___ Veritas-bu maillist - Veritas-bu@mailman.eng.auburn.edu http://mailman.eng.auburn.edu/mailman/listinfo/veritas-bu
Re: [Veritas-bu] RMAN crosscheck
As long as you have autobackup enabled, you shouldn't need the rman repository. If netbackup has the images in the catalog, restore the control file from autobackup, which has the rman pieces info and will poll netbackup for the images associated with them. From: veritas-bu-boun...@mailman.eng.auburn.edu [mailto:veritas-bu-boun...@mailman.eng.auburn.edu] On Behalf Of Mark Glazerman Sent: Monday, May 17, 2010 8:58 AM To: Lightner, Jeff Cc: veritas-bu@mailman.eng.auburn.edu Subject: Re: [Veritas-bu] RMAN crosscheck Jeff, I can only really comment on your last question about using expired RMAN images for restores if they are not expired in NetBackup. We had a similar issue a few weeks back where Netbackup could still see images in its catalog of oracle backups (which initiate a RMAN backup via the oracle_backup.sh script) but RMAN had already expired them inside its own catalog. These files were not recoverable by RMAN. We had the DBA's set their retention inside RMAN to match the retention specified inside NBU so that we don't see this mis-match again. Ultimately, RMAN controls the expiration of the images inside its catalog meaning that regardless of the expiration you set for oracle backups inside NBU, RMAN will keep or expire those images, regardless of what Netbackup is trying to tell it. I don't know how you'd configure RMAN to handle your vaulting needs. Would setting the expiration of these images in RMAN to the longest required length of time (4 months for example) mean that the vaulted images would still be good for the max time they'd need to be held on either the Data Domain or tape ? The Netbackup catalog doesn't need to know about the RMAN images for them to still be recoverable by RMAN so you could set a different, shorter expiration inside NBU although this would still leave you with different retentions in the two different catalogs FYI The solaris client we were trying to restore these RMAN images to is running 6.5.4 with a 7.0 master and media server. Mark Glazerman Desk: 314-889-8282 Cell: 618-520-3401 P please don't print this e-mail unless you really need to From: veritas-bu-boun...@mailman.eng.auburn.edu [mailto:veritas-bu-boun...@mailman.eng.auburn.edu] On Behalf Of Lightner, Jeff Sent: Friday, May 14, 2010 7:12 AM To: veritas-bu@mailman.eng.auburn.edu Subject: [Veritas-bu] RMAN crosscheck My DBAs are starting to question me about an RMAN crosscheck they are running. Essentially I gather that when they ran it the crosscheck seemed to report even backups run in the last 2 days as expired. On checking the Data Domain unit I can see the images are still there and on running NetBackup commands I see these are NOT expired from NBU's perspective. On doing a search I did find a document at Symantec that talked about RMAN expirations but it only went up through 6.0 so I'm not sure if it is still valid for 6.5. It says essentially that on the NBU side we should set very long retentions (e.g. INFINITY) for all RMAN backup policies then let RMAN keep track of retentions itself. The downside I see to this is we do vaulting of the images on data domain to tape - we set retention on data domain to 1 month then the vault copies get longer retentions (e.g. 3 months for a daily backup). How would we get RMAN to set and keep track of such retention differences? The DBAs have opened a TAR with Oracle to see why the crosscheck is reporting the images as expired but I suspect from the NBU document that the answer will be something like it is expired so far as RMAN is concerned. This also begs the question as to whether RMAN could be used to restore the backups even if they aren't expired so far as NBU is concerned. Does anyone know the answer to that? Proud partner. Susan G. Komen for the Cure. Please consider our environment before printing this e-mail or attachments. -- CONFIDENTIALITY NOTICE: This e-mail may contain privileged or confidential information and is for the sole use of the intended recipient(s). If you are not the intended recipient, any disclosure, copying, distribution, or use of the contents of this information is prohibited and may be unlawful. If you have received this electronic transmission in error, please reply immediately to the sender that you have received the message in error, and delete it. Thank you. -- This message is private and confidential. If you have received it in error, please notify the sender and remove it from your system. ___ Veritas-bu maillist - Veritas-bu@mailman.eng.auburn.edu http://mailman.eng.auburn.edu/mailman/listinfo/veritas-bu
Re: [Veritas-bu] RMAN crosscheck
RMAN would still need non-expired images in its own catalog to be able to fulfill the requests of the autobackup though right ? Correct me if I'm wrong but whether the images are still in NBU or not, unless they are still in the RMAN catalog the recovery request by RMAN will fail. Mark Glazerman Desk: 314-889-8282 Cell: 618-520-3401 P please don't print this e-mail unless you really need to From: Kevin Corley [mailto:kevin.cor...@apollogrp.edu] Sent: Monday, May 17, 2010 11:23 AM To: Mark Glazerman; Lightner, Jeff Cc: veritas-bu@mailman.eng.auburn.edu Subject: RE: [Veritas-bu] RMAN crosscheck As long as you have autobackup enabled, you shouldn't need the rman repository. If netbackup has the images in the catalog, restore the control file from autobackup, which has the rman pieces info and will poll netbackup for the images associated with them. From: veritas-bu-boun...@mailman.eng.auburn.edu [mailto:veritas-bu-boun...@mailman.eng.auburn.edu] On Behalf Of Mark Glazerman Sent: Monday, May 17, 2010 8:58 AM To: Lightner, Jeff Cc: veritas-bu@mailman.eng.auburn.edu Subject: Re: [Veritas-bu] RMAN crosscheck Jeff, I can only really comment on your last question about using expired RMAN images for restores if they are not expired in NetBackup. We had a similar issue a few weeks back where Netbackup could still see images in its catalog of oracle backups (which initiate a RMAN backup via the oracle_backup.sh script) but RMAN had already expired them inside its own catalog. These files were not recoverable by RMAN. We had the DBA's set their retention inside RMAN to match the retention specified inside NBU so that we don't see this mis-match again. Ultimately, RMAN controls the expiration of the images inside its catalog meaning that regardless of the expiration you set for oracle backups inside NBU, RMAN will keep or expire those images, regardless of what Netbackup is trying to tell it. I don't know how you'd configure RMAN to handle your vaulting needs. Would setting the expiration of these images in RMAN to the longest required length of time (4 months for example) mean that the vaulted images would still be good for the max time they'd need to be held on either the Data Domain or tape ? The Netbackup catalog doesn't need to know about the RMAN images for them to still be recoverable by RMAN so you could set a different, shorter expiration inside NBU although this would still leave you with different retentions in the two different catalogs FYI The solaris client we were trying to restore these RMAN images to is running 6.5.4 with a 7.0 master and media server. Mark Glazerman Desk: 314-889-8282 Cell: 618-520-3401 P please don't print this e-mail unless you really need to From: veritas-bu-boun...@mailman.eng.auburn.edu [mailto:veritas-bu-boun...@mailman.eng.auburn.edu] On Behalf Of Lightner, Jeff Sent: Friday, May 14, 2010 7:12 AM To: veritas-bu@mailman.eng.auburn.edu Subject: [Veritas-bu] RMAN crosscheck My DBAs are starting to question me about an RMAN crosscheck they are running. Essentially I gather that when they ran it the crosscheck seemed to report even backups run in the last 2 days as expired. On checking the Data Domain unit I can see the images are still there and on running NetBackup commands I see these are NOT expired from NBU's perspective. On doing a search I did find a document at Symantec that talked about RMAN expirations but it only went up through 6.0 so I'm not sure if it is still valid for 6.5. It says essentially that on the NBU side we should set very long retentions (e.g. INFINITY) for all RMAN backup policies then let RMAN keep track of retentions itself. The downside I see to this is we do vaulting of the images on data domain to tape - we set retention on data domain to 1 month then the vault copies get longer retentions (e.g. 3 months for a daily backup). How would we get RMAN to set and keep track of such retention differences? The DBAs have opened a TAR with Oracle to see why the crosscheck is reporting the images as expired but I suspect from the NBU document that the answer will be something like it is expired so far as RMAN is concerned. This also begs the question as to whether RMAN could be used to restore the backups even if they aren't expired so far as NBU is concerned. Does anyone know the answer to that? Proud partner. Susan G. Komen for the Cure. Please consider our environment before printing this e-mail or attachments. -- CONFIDENTIALITY NOTICE: This e-mail may contain privileged or confidential information and is for the sole use of the intended recipient(s). If you are not the intended recipient, any disclosure, copying, distribution, or use of the contents of this information is prohibited and may be unlawful. If you have received this electronic transmission in error, please reply immediately to the sender that you have received the message
Re: [Veritas-bu] RMAN crosscheck
Thanks guys. Is autobackup a setting in RMAN or in NBU? From: veritas-bu-boun...@mailman.eng.auburn.edu [mailto:veritas-bu-boun...@mailman.eng.auburn.edu] On Behalf Of Kevin Corley Sent: Monday, May 17, 2010 12:23 PM To: Mark Glazerman; Lightner, Jeff Cc: veritas-bu@mailman.eng.auburn.edu Subject: Re: [Veritas-bu] RMAN crosscheck As long as you have autobackup enabled, you shouldn't need the rman repository. If netbackup has the images in the catalog, restore the control file from autobackup, which has the rman pieces info and will poll netbackup for the images associated with them. From: veritas-bu-boun...@mailman.eng.auburn.edu [mailto:veritas-bu-boun...@mailman.eng.auburn.edu] On Behalf Of Mark Glazerman Sent: Monday, May 17, 2010 8:58 AM To: Lightner, Jeff Cc: veritas-bu@mailman.eng.auburn.edu Subject: Re: [Veritas-bu] RMAN crosscheck Jeff, I can only really comment on your last question about using expired RMAN images for restores if they are not expired in NetBackup. We had a similar issue a few weeks back where Netbackup could still see images in its catalog of oracle backups (which initiate a RMAN backup via the oracle_backup.sh script) but RMAN had already expired them inside its own catalog. These files were not recoverable by RMAN. We had the DBA's set their retention inside RMAN to match the retention specified inside NBU so that we don't see this mis-match again. Ultimately, RMAN controls the expiration of the images inside its catalog meaning that regardless of the expiration you set for oracle backups inside NBU, RMAN will keep or expire those images, regardless of what Netbackup is trying to tell it. I don't know how you'd configure RMAN to handle your vaulting needs. Would setting the expiration of these images in RMAN to the longest required length of time (4 months for example) mean that the vaulted images would still be good for the max time they'd need to be held on either the Data Domain or tape ? The Netbackup catalog doesn't need to know about the RMAN images for them to still be recoverable by RMAN so you could set a different, shorter expiration inside NBU although this would still leave you with different retentions in the two different catalogs FYI The solaris client we were trying to restore these RMAN images to is running 6.5.4 with a 7.0 master and media server. Mark Glazerman Desk: 314-889-8282 Cell: 618-520-3401 P please don't print this e-mail unless you really need to From: veritas-bu-boun...@mailman.eng.auburn.edu [mailto:veritas-bu-boun...@mailman.eng.auburn.edu] On Behalf Of Lightner, Jeff Sent: Friday, May 14, 2010 7:12 AM To: veritas-bu@mailman.eng.auburn.edu Subject: [Veritas-bu] RMAN crosscheck My DBAs are starting to question me about an RMAN crosscheck they are running. Essentially I gather that when they ran it the crosscheck seemed to report even backups run in the last 2 days as expired. On checking the Data Domain unit I can see the images are still there and on running NetBackup commands I see these are NOT expired from NBU's perspective. On doing a search I did find a document at Symantec that talked about RMAN expirations but it only went up through 6.0 so I'm not sure if it is still valid for 6.5. It says essentially that on the NBU side we should set very long retentions (e.g. INFINITY) for all RMAN backup policies then let RMAN keep track of retentions itself. The downside I see to this is we do vaulting of the images on data domain to tape - we set retention on data domain to 1 month then the vault copies get longer retentions (e.g. 3 months for a daily backup). How would we get RMAN to set and keep track of such retention differences? The DBAs have opened a TAR with Oracle to see why the crosscheck is reporting the images as expired but I suspect from the NBU document that the answer will be something like it is expired so far as RMAN is concerned. This also begs the question as to whether RMAN could be used to restore the backups even if they aren't expired so far as NBU is concerned. Does anyone know the answer to that? Proud partner. Susan G. Komen for the Cure. Please consider our environment before printing this e-mail or attachments. -- CONFIDENTIALITY NOTICE: This e-mail may contain privileged or confidential information and is for the sole use of the intended recipient(s). If you are not the intended recipient, any disclosure, copying, distribution, or use of the contents of this information is prohibited and may be unlawful. If you have received this electronic transmission in error, please reply immediately to the sender that you have received the message in error, and delete it. Thank you. -- This message is private and confidential. If you have received it in error, please notify the sender and remove it from your system
Re: [Veritas-bu] RMAN crosscheck
Autobackup is an RMAN setting. We use autobackup and had recovered the controlfile for the attempted restore I talked about earlier. However, because RMAN had already expired the required images from its own catalog, we were unable to recover the data, even with backup images still residing in the Netbackup catalog. Mark Glazerman Desk: 314-889-8282 Cell: 618-520-3401 P please don't print this e-mail unless you really need to From: Lightner, Jeff [mailto:jlight...@water.com] Sent: Monday, May 17, 2010 11:27 AM To: Kevin Corley; Mark Glazerman Cc: veritas-bu@mailman.eng.auburn.edu Subject: RE: [Veritas-bu] RMAN crosscheck Thanks guys. Is autobackup a setting in RMAN or in NBU? From: veritas-bu-boun...@mailman.eng.auburn.edu [mailto:veritas-bu-boun...@mailman.eng.auburn.edu] On Behalf Of Kevin Corley Sent: Monday, May 17, 2010 12:23 PM To: Mark Glazerman; Lightner, Jeff Cc: veritas-bu@mailman.eng.auburn.edu Subject: Re: [Veritas-bu] RMAN crosscheck As long as you have autobackup enabled, you shouldn't need the rman repository. If netbackup has the images in the catalog, restore the control file from autobackup, which has the rman pieces info and will poll netbackup for the images associated with them. From: veritas-bu-boun...@mailman.eng.auburn.edu [mailto:veritas-bu-boun...@mailman.eng.auburn.edu] On Behalf Of Mark Glazerman Sent: Monday, May 17, 2010 8:58 AM To: Lightner, Jeff Cc: veritas-bu@mailman.eng.auburn.edu Subject: Re: [Veritas-bu] RMAN crosscheck Jeff, I can only really comment on your last question about using expired RMAN images for restores if they are not expired in NetBackup. We had a similar issue a few weeks back where Netbackup could still see images in its catalog of oracle backups (which initiate a RMAN backup via the oracle_backup.sh script) but RMAN had already expired them inside its own catalog. These files were not recoverable by RMAN. We had the DBA's set their retention inside RMAN to match the retention specified inside NBU so that we don't see this mis-match again. Ultimately, RMAN controls the expiration of the images inside its catalog meaning that regardless of the expiration you set for oracle backups inside NBU, RMAN will keep or expire those images, regardless of what Netbackup is trying to tell it. I don't know how you'd configure RMAN to handle your vaulting needs. Would setting the expiration of these images in RMAN to the longest required length of time (4 months for example) mean that the vaulted images would still be good for the max time they'd need to be held on either the Data Domain or tape ? The Netbackup catalog doesn't need to know about the RMAN images for them to still be recoverable by RMAN so you could set a different, shorter expiration inside NBU although this would still leave you with different retentions in the two different catalogs FYI The solaris client we were trying to restore these RMAN images to is running 6.5.4 with a 7.0 master and media server. Mark Glazerman Desk: 314-889-8282 Cell: 618-520-3401 P please don't print this e-mail unless you really need to From: veritas-bu-boun...@mailman.eng.auburn.edu [mailto:veritas-bu-boun...@mailman.eng.auburn.edu] On Behalf Of Lightner, Jeff Sent: Friday, May 14, 2010 7:12 AM To: veritas-bu@mailman.eng.auburn.edu Subject: [Veritas-bu] RMAN crosscheck My DBAs are starting to question me about an RMAN crosscheck they are running. Essentially I gather that when they ran it the crosscheck seemed to report even backups run in the last 2 days as expired. On checking the Data Domain unit I can see the images are still there and on running NetBackup commands I see these are NOT expired from NBU's perspective. On doing a search I did find a document at Symantec that talked about RMAN expirations but it only went up through 6.0 so I'm not sure if it is still valid for 6.5. It says essentially that on the NBU side we should set very long retentions (e.g. INFINITY) for all RMAN backup policies then let RMAN keep track of retentions itself. The downside I see to this is we do vaulting of the images on data domain to tape - we set retention on data domain to 1 month then the vault copies get longer retentions (e.g. 3 months for a daily backup). How would we get RMAN to set and keep track of such retention differences? The DBAs have opened a TAR with Oracle to see why the crosscheck is reporting the images as expired but I suspect from the NBU document that the answer will be something like it is expired so far as RMAN is concerned. This also begs the question as to whether RMAN could be used to restore the backups even if they aren't expired so far as NBU is concerned. Does anyone know the answer to that? Proud partner. Susan G. Komen for the Cure. Please consider our environment before printing this e-mail or attachments. -- CONFIDENTIALITY NOTICE
Re: [Veritas-bu] RMAN crosscheck
That's unfortunate. It seems that there ought to be a way to have RMAN rebuild its catalog from NBU much the same the way that NBU can recover images into its catalog from NBU expired but not yet overwritten tapes. From: Mark Glazerman [mailto:mark.glazer...@spartech.com] Sent: Monday, May 17, 2010 12:30 PM To: Lightner, Jeff; Kevin Corley Cc: veritas-bu@mailman.eng.auburn.edu Subject: RE: [Veritas-bu] RMAN crosscheck Autobackup is an RMAN setting. We use autobackup and had recovered the controlfile for the attempted restore I talked about earlier. However, because RMAN had already expired the required images from its own catalog, we were unable to recover the data, even with backup images still residing in the Netbackup catalog. Mark Glazerman Desk: 314-889-8282 Cell: 618-520-3401 P please don't print this e-mail unless you really need to From: Lightner, Jeff [mailto:jlight...@water.com] Sent: Monday, May 17, 2010 11:27 AM To: Kevin Corley; Mark Glazerman Cc: veritas-bu@mailman.eng.auburn.edu Subject: RE: [Veritas-bu] RMAN crosscheck Thanks guys. Is autobackup a setting in RMAN or in NBU? From: veritas-bu-boun...@mailman.eng.auburn.edu [mailto:veritas-bu-boun...@mailman.eng.auburn.edu] On Behalf Of Kevin Corley Sent: Monday, May 17, 2010 12:23 PM To: Mark Glazerman; Lightner, Jeff Cc: veritas-bu@mailman.eng.auburn.edu Subject: Re: [Veritas-bu] RMAN crosscheck As long as you have autobackup enabled, you shouldn't need the rman repository. If netbackup has the images in the catalog, restore the control file from autobackup, which has the rman pieces info and will poll netbackup for the images associated with them. From: veritas-bu-boun...@mailman.eng.auburn.edu [mailto:veritas-bu-boun...@mailman.eng.auburn.edu] On Behalf Of Mark Glazerman Sent: Monday, May 17, 2010 8:58 AM To: Lightner, Jeff Cc: veritas-bu@mailman.eng.auburn.edu Subject: Re: [Veritas-bu] RMAN crosscheck Jeff, I can only really comment on your last question about using expired RMAN images for restores if they are not expired in NetBackup. We had a similar issue a few weeks back where Netbackup could still see images in its catalog of oracle backups (which initiate a RMAN backup via the oracle_backup.sh script) but RMAN had already expired them inside its own catalog. These files were not recoverable by RMAN. We had the DBA's set their retention inside RMAN to match the retention specified inside NBU so that we don't see this mis-match again. Ultimately, RMAN controls the expiration of the images inside its catalog meaning that regardless of the expiration you set for oracle backups inside NBU, RMAN will keep or expire those images, regardless of what Netbackup is trying to tell it. I don't know how you'd configure RMAN to handle your vaulting needs. Would setting the expiration of these images in RMAN to the longest required length of time (4 months for example) mean that the vaulted images would still be good for the max time they'd need to be held on either the Data Domain or tape ? The Netbackup catalog doesn't need to know about the RMAN images for them to still be recoverable by RMAN so you could set a different, shorter expiration inside NBU although this would still leave you with different retentions in the two different catalogs FYI The solaris client we were trying to restore these RMAN images to is running 6.5.4 with a 7.0 master and media server. Mark Glazerman Desk: 314-889-8282 Cell: 618-520-3401 P please don't print this e-mail unless you really need to From: veritas-bu-boun...@mailman.eng.auburn.edu [mailto:veritas-bu-boun...@mailman.eng.auburn.edu] On Behalf Of Lightner, Jeff Sent: Friday, May 14, 2010 7:12 AM To: veritas-bu@mailman.eng.auburn.edu Subject: [Veritas-bu] RMAN crosscheck My DBAs are starting to question me about an RMAN crosscheck they are running. Essentially I gather that when they ran it the crosscheck seemed to report even backups run in the last 2 days as expired. On checking the Data Domain unit I can see the images are still there and on running NetBackup commands I see these are NOT expired from NBU's perspective. On doing a search I did find a document at Symantec that talked about RMAN expirations but it only went up through 6.0 so I'm not sure if it is still valid for 6.5. It says essentially that on the NBU side we should set very long retentions (e.g. INFINITY) for all RMAN backup policies then let RMAN keep track of retentions itself. The downside I see to this is we do vaulting of the images on data domain to tape - we set retention on data domain to 1 month then the vault copies get longer retentions (e.g. 3 months for a daily backup). How would we get RMAN to set and keep track of such retention differences? The DBAs have opened a TAR with Oracle to see why the crosscheck is reporting the images as expired but I suspect from
[Veritas-bu] RMAN crosscheck
My DBAs are starting to question me about an RMAN crosscheck they are running. Essentially I gather that when they ran it the crosscheck seemed to report even backups run in the last 2 days as expired. On checking the Data Domain unit I can see the images are still there and on running NetBackup commands I see these are NOT expired from NBU's perspective. On doing a search I did find a document at Symantec that talked about RMAN expirations but it only went up through 6.0 so I'm not sure if it is still valid for 6.5. It says essentially that on the NBU side we should set very long retentions (e.g. INFINITY) for all RMAN backup policies then let RMAN keep track of retentions itself. The downside I see to this is we do vaulting of the images on data domain to tape - we set retention on data domain to 1 month then the vault copies get longer retentions (e.g. 3 months for a daily backup). How would we get RMAN to set and keep track of such retention differences? The DBAs have opened a TAR with Oracle to see why the crosscheck is reporting the images as expired but I suspect from the NBU document that the answer will be something like it is expired so far as RMAN is concerned. This also begs the question as to whether RMAN could be used to restore the backups even if they aren't expired so far as NBU is concerned. Does anyone know the answer to that? Proud partner. Susan G. Komen for the Cure. Please consider our environment before printing this e-mail or attachments. -- CONFIDENTIALITY NOTICE: This e-mail may contain privileged or confidential information and is for the sole use of the intended recipient(s). If you are not the intended recipient, any disclosure, copying, distribution, or use of the contents of this information is prohibited and may be unlawful. If you have received this electronic transmission in error, please reply immediately to the sender that you have received the message in error, and delete it. Thank you. -- ___ Veritas-bu maillist - Veritas-bu@mailman.eng.auburn.edu http://mailman.eng.auburn.edu/mailman/listinfo/veritas-bu
