Re: [vfio-users] Looking for recommendations for screen-switching

[Patrick O'Callaghan]

On Wed, 2017-03-22 at 08:35 +, buildacct wrote:
> That will be because I wasn't very clear so my apologies. It's part of 
> qemu, and a very useful way of passing kb+m to and from your host and a 
> passthrough context. You can search this list for input-linux but the 
> scripty bit I use to pass it through looks as follows. Got some script 
> that digs through /sys/class/input to find my keyboard as I have a 
> corsair keyboard with lights, but you can probably just find your in 
> /dev/input and replace the ${ev} below. I need the virtio devices (there 
> are win drivers in the Fedora driver iso) to prevent problems with key 
> ups during games.
> 
> OPTS="$OPTS -object input-linux,id=kbd,evdev=${ev},grab_all=yes,repeat=off"
> OPTS="$OPTS -object 
> input-linux,id=mse,evdev=/dev/input/by-id/usb-Areson_USB_Device-event-mouse 
> "
> 
> OPTS="$OPTS -device 
> virtio-keyboard-pci,addr=1d.0,multifunction=on,serial=SN "
> OPTS="$OPTS -device 
> virtio-mouse-pci,addr=1d.1,multifunction=on,serial=SN15471500079 "
> 
> I think it's criminally underappreciated and underdocumented in qemu but 
> maybe that's just me.  It's been in qemu since 2.7 I think so won't work 
> with older versions. Switch contexts by pressing both ctrl keys so 
> easily worked into however you change the screen too.

Thanks for that. I've ordered a new HDMI switch (same model recommended
by Nick S) which may solve the problem directly. Otherwise, I'll try
and follow your suggestion. I see that input-linux is not mentioned in
the man page for qemu. Is there any documentation (other than searching
this list)? Google doesn't seem to find much.

poc

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Re: [vfio-users] Looking for recommendations for screen-switching

[buildacct]

On 20/03/17 10:38, Patrick O'Callaghan wrote:



On 20 March 2017 at 07:36, Rokas Kupstys > wrote:

You might try installing ddccontrol and trying. Maybe they simply
did not bother enough to list it in docs. Maybe monitor is based on
same hardware as other more high-end monitors are and functionality
is in there even if vendor does not say its supported.


I did try that but it tells me my monitor is not in the database. I also
note that the most recent version of ddccontrol is from 2006, which
doesn't inspire much confidence.

poc


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Try ddcutil

http://www.ddcutil.com/

Much more comprehensive. Using something like:

sudo modprobe i2c-dev
sudo ddcutil capabilities

To list any standard recognised capabilities for your monitor (it is up
to date). You may have it but vpd may not be standardised and ddcutil
gives you the tools to work that out if you have the patience.

I bought a KVM in the end ... and it's so awful I only use it as an HDMI
switch and use the input-linux framework in qemu to switch the
keyboard/mouse. USB switches do work, but only good ones will work with
every device and udev can make a mess of rapidly switching devices in
and out, especially if they have some sort of custom software as the
device won't come back to the same location as it left. In Windows a
mess is normal but it will probably get worse. HDMI switches may have
limitations on max resolution, bandwidth and types of data so be careful
when buying.

The input-linux framework can have the odd problem with missed key ups
but they are all easily surmountable by attaching a USB or virtio
keyboard device to the VM so are far preferable to hardware related
limitations or problems of the switch and constant device plugging in
the VMs. After all, that is one of the major motivations for using a VM.


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Re: [vfio-users] Looking for recommendations for screen-switching

[Patrick O'Callaghan]

On 20 March 2017 at 15:48, Nick S  wrote:

> My switch is indeed better behaving - it emulates some weird monitor on
> inactive ports. Before that I was using display dummies to avoid resolution
> resets but I never had an issue with keyboard focus getting lost. May be it
> is because of Windows 7 where the QXL window just stays on "Starting
> Window" screen and is not used by the OS in any way. I never used a Widnows
> 10 VM and can't compare. Does it display anything in the QXL window?
>

Focus returns to the QXL window right enough, but I can't persuade Windows
to regard the 2nd screen as the main one, i.e. if I switch to the 2nd HDMI
output I can drag the mouse over from the QXL window, but any new windows
open on the QXL screen, and of course switching back turns the 2nd screen
off from Windows' point of view.

I might invest in a switch like yours. Emulating something on the inactive
ports rather than just turning them off sounds like what I need.

poc
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Re: [vfio-users] Looking for recommendations for screen-switching

[Patrick O'Callaghan]

On 20 March 2017 at 12:36, Daniel Oram  wrote:

> Try ddcutil
>
> http://www.ddcutil.com/
>
> Much more comprehensive. Using something like:
>
> sudo modprobe i2c-dev
> sudo ddcutil capabilities
>
> To list any standard recognised capabilities for your monitor (it is up to
> date). You may have it but vpd may not be standardised and ddcutil gives
> you the tools to work that out if you have the patience.
>
> I bought a KVM in the end ... and it's so awful I only use it as an HDMI
> switch and use the input-linux framework in qemu to switch the
> keyboard/mouse. USB switches do work, but only good ones will work with
> every device and udev can make a mess of rapidly switching devices in and
> out, especially if they have some sort of custom software as the device
> won't come back to the same location as it left. In Windows a mess is
> normal but it will probably get worse. HDMI switches may have limitations
> on max resolution, bandwidth and types of data so be careful when buying.
>
> The input-linux framework can have the odd problem with missed key ups but
> they are all easily surmountable by attaching a USB or virtio keyboard
> device to the VM so are far preferable to hardware related limitations or
> problems of the switch and constant device plugging in the VMs. After all,
> that is one of the major motivations for using a VM.
>

Thanks, I'll look at that.

What do you mean exactly by "the input-linux framework"? I'm an old Linux
hand but some of this stuff is new to me. Maybe it's just a question of
terminology.

poc
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Re: [vfio-users] Looking for recommendations for screen-switching

[Patrick O'Callaghan]

On 20 March 2017 at 07:36, Rokas Kupstys  wrote:

> You might try installing ddccontrol and trying. Maybe they simply did not
> bother enough to list it in docs. Maybe monitor is based on same hardware
> as other more high-end monitors are and functionality is in there even if
> vendor does not say its supported.
>

I did try that but it tells me my monitor is not in the database. I also
note that the most recent version of ddccontrol is from 2006, which doesn't
inspire much confidence.

poc
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Re: [vfio-users] Looking for recommendations for screen-switching

[Rokas Kupstys]

You might try installing ddccontrol and trying. Maybe they simply did 
not bother enough to list it in docs. Maybe monitor is based on same 
hardware as other more high-end monitors are and functionality is in 
there even if vendor does not say its supported.


Rokas Kupstys

On 19/03/17 21:29, Patrick O'Callaghan wrote:


On 19 March 2017 at 18:57, Rokas Kupstys > wrote:


Check monitor documentation. i2c is a protocol for software to
control monitor in this case. Monitors usually support it but
might not work on all input ports.


The HP manual doesn't mention it so it's probably not going to work, 
thanks all the same.


poc


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Re: [vfio-users] Looking for recommendations for screen-switching

[Patrick O'Callaghan]

On 19 March 2017 at 20:32, Nick S  wrote:

> Monitor source selection menu is the cheapest option and also the least
> convenient. The most convenient option is a KVM switch but then you would
> have to deal with passing one of its USB ports to the VM while keeping the
> other one on host and a good KVM will cost you several hundred bucks. The
> way I am using it:
> 1) Cheap HDMI switcher (i.e. something like this: https://www.amazon.com/
> TBS%C2%AE2083-Intelligent-Switcher-Adapter-Splitter/
> product-reviews/B00M6I8K2E). It allows me to switch the cards without
> fumbling with the monitor menu.
>

This is the one I have:
https://www.amazon.co.uk/gp/product/B019MJM2ZU/ref=oh_aui_detailpage_o02_s00?ie=UTF8=1

Very cheap and really designed for TVs.

2) I keep the emulated VGA as a second adapter on my virtual machines. For
> Windows 7 it keeps a window on the desktop that I can use to grab or
> release focus for keyboard and mouse. This way I don't have to deal with
> any USB passthrough - only the GPU is passed to the VM.
>

That's more or less what I do as well. However when I toggle the HDMI
switch from the 2nd GPU (Windows) to the 1st (Linux), Windows rings a
notification saying it has lost the screen, I presume because the switch
powered down that port. (This doesn't happen if I just connect both GPUs
directly to the monitor via HDMI and DVI inputs). Note that toggling the
switch back pings again and the screen is restored, but now the mouse and
KB are trapped in the Linux desktop window and can't be moved across.
Possibly your switch is better behaved and doesn't power down the port, in
which case that would solve the problem for me.

poc
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Re: [vfio-users] Looking for recommendations for screen-switching

[Nick S]

Monitor source selection menu is the cheapest option and also the least
convenient. The most convenient option is a KVM switch but then you would
have to deal with passing one of its USB ports to the VM while keeping the
other one on host and a good KVM will cost you several hundred bucks. The
way I am using it:
1) Cheap HDMI switcher (i.e. something like this:
https://www.amazon.com/TBS%C2%AE2083-Intelligent-Switcher-Adapter-Splitter/product-reviews/B00M6I8K2E).
It allows me to switch the cards without fumbling with the monitor menu.
2) I keep the emulated VGA as a second adapter on my virtual machines. For
Windows 7 it keeps a window on the desktop that I can use to grab or
release focus for keyboard and mouse. This way I don't have to deal with
any USB passthrough - only the GPU is passed to the VM.

On Sun, Mar 19, 2017 at 7:14 AM, Patrick O'Callaghan  wrote:

> I have VFIO passthrough working with a Windows 10 VM, running on Fedora
> 25. Currently I have two cables running to my single monitor (one HDMI
> and one DVI), so switching back and forth means toggling a monitor
> setting. This does work, but is a bit clunky.
>
> BTW the mouse and keyboard also switch back and forth (this slightly
> surprised me but I'm not going to question it :-)
>
> I thought I could make this simpler by exchanging the DVI cable for
> another HDMI cable, both cables going into an HDMI switch and hence to
> the HDMI port on the monitor, with the idea of toggling back and forth.
> However this doesn't entirely work. I suspect that the switch powers
> off the input it's not using and this confuses Windows.
>
> Most of the discussion I've seen recommends Synergy, a software
> KB/mouse switcher, however this explicitly does not support video
> switching, i.e. it assumes you have a separate monitor for each machine
> (real or virtual), which is not the case here.
>
> The other option seems to be a physical KVM switch, but before shelling
> out more money I'd like to hear people's thoughts on this. What do you
> do to support a single monitor?
>
> poc
>
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Re: [vfio-users] Looking for recommendations for screen-switching

[Rokas Kupstys]

Check monitor documentation. i2c is a protocol for software to control 
monitor in this case. Monitors usually support it but might not work on all 
input ports.



On March 19, 2017 19:50:38 "Patrick O'Callaghan"  wrote:


On 19 March 2017 at 16:49, Rokas Kupstys  wrote:


https://rokups.github.io/blog/#!pages/full-software-kvm-switch.md



OK, thanks, that's a lot to digest. Before I get into it, can you say what
you mean by "i2c-capable monitor". My monitor is an HP Pavilion 23xi if it
matters.

poc
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Re: [vfio-users] Looking for recommendations for screen-switching

[Rokas Kupstys]

https://rokups.github.io/blog/#!pages/full-software-kvm-switch.md

Rokas Kupstys

On 19/03/17 16:55, Patrick O'Callaghan wrote:

On Sun, 2017-03-19 at 09:24 -0500, Jayme Howard wrote:
I do exactly what you described as your original solution, though 
I've got

a USB switch inline as well, because my monitor doesn't have USB
passthrough.


I don't have a USB switch but I do use a wireless KB and mouse (with a 
USB dongle).
I don't see why that should make a difference but apparently it does. 
Possibly there's
some magic in Windows that makes this work, I've no idea. Currently I 
have Windows
configured with "extended display", i.e. the internal KVM/QEMU display 
counts as
screen 1 and the Nvidia card output as screen 2, with screen 2 being 
used as the

default display.

poc


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Re: [vfio-users] Looking for recommendations for screen-switching

[Patrick O'Callaghan]

On Sun, 2017-03-19 at 09:24 -0500, Jayme Howard wrote:
> I do exactly what you described as your original solution, though I've got
> 
> a USB switch inline as well, because my monitor doesn't have USB
> 
> passthrough.

I don't have a USB switch but I do use a wireless KB and mouse (with a USB 
dongle).
I don't see why that should make a difference but apparently it does. Possibly 
there's
some magic in Windows that makes this work, I've no idea. Currently I have 
Windows
configured with "extended display", i.e. the internal KVM/QEMU display counts as
screen 1 and the Nvidia card output as screen 2, with screen 2 being used as the
default display.

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Re: [vfio-users] Looking for recommendations for screen-switching

[Jayme Howard]

I do exactly what you described as your original solution, though I've got
a USB switch inline as well, because my monitor doesn't have USB
passthrough.

On Sun, Mar 19, 2017 at 9:14 AM, Patrick O'Callaghan  wrote:

> I have VFIO passthrough working with a Windows 10 VM, running on Fedora
> 25. Currently I have two cables running to my single monitor (one HDMI
> and one DVI), so switching back and forth means toggling a monitor
> setting. This does work, but is a bit clunky.
>
> BTW the mouse and keyboard also switch back and forth (this slightly
> surprised me but I'm not going to question it :-)
>
> I thought I could make this simpler by exchanging the DVI cable for
> another HDMI cable, both cables going into an HDMI switch and hence to
> the HDMI port on the monitor, with the idea of toggling back and forth.
> However this doesn't entirely work. I suspect that the switch powers
> off the input it's not using and this confuses Windows.
>
> Most of the discussion I've seen recommends Synergy, a software
> KB/mouse switcher, however this explicitly does not support video
> switching, i.e. it assumes you have a separate monitor for each machine
> (real or virtual), which is not the case here.
>
> The other option seems to be a physical KVM switch, but before shelling
> out more money I'd like to hear people's thoughts on this. What do you
> do to support a single monitor?
>
> poc
>
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[vfio-users] Looking for recommendations for screen-switching

[Patrick O'Callaghan]

I have VFIO passthrough working with a Windows 10 VM, running on Fedora
25. Currently I have two cables running to my single monitor (one HDMI
and one DVI), so switching back and forth means toggling a monitor
setting. This does work, but is a bit clunky.

BTW the mouse and keyboard also switch back and forth (this slightly
surprised me but I'm not going to question it :-)

I thought I could make this simpler by exchanging the DVI cable for
another HDMI cable, both cables going into an HDMI switch and hence to
the HDMI port on the monitor, with the idea of toggling back and forth.
However this doesn't entirely work. I suspect that the switch powers
off the input it's not using and this confuses Windows.

Most of the discussion I've seen recommends Synergy, a software
KB/mouse switcher, however this explicitly does not support video
switching, i.e. it assumes you have a separate monitor for each machine
(real or virtual), which is not the case here.

The other option seems to be a physical KVM switch, but before shelling
out more money I'd like to hear people's thoughts on this. What do you
do to support a single monitor?

poc

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