Re: [VoiceOps] Misrouting 911 Calls?

[Aaron C. de Bruyn via VoiceOps]

In my case, I doubt it.  I'm not a phone company or VoIP provider.
I was simply called in to help them with their existing VoIP server (among
other things).

-A


On Sun, Jan 9, 2022 at 7:47 AM Mike Hammett  wrote:

> Are you potentially underestimating what you're required to do for 911?
>
>
>
> -
> Mike Hammett
> Intelligent Computing Solutions
> http://www.ics-il.com
>
>
>
> Midwest Internet Exchange
> http://www.midwest-ix.com
>
>
>
> --
> *From: *"Aaron C. de Bruyn via VoiceOps" 
> *To: *"Mary Lou Carey" 
> *Cc: *voiceops@voiceops.org
> *Sent: *Saturday, January 8, 2022 5:11:36 PM
> *Subject: *Re: [VoiceOps] Misrouting 911 Calls?
>
> I filed a complaint with the FCC about a year ago.
> The FCC reached out to Comcast and Comcast reached back out to me.
> Their response was that we would basically have to purchase ~200 numbers
> (one for each extension on our system), set our outbound 911 caller ID to
> those numbers, and then provide Comcast with a list of mappings between
> phone numbers and addresses.
> It would have added a huge tracking burden for IT as well as increased our
> bill by about $2,500 over the contract term.
>
> It's all moot now as BulkVS cost less than $50 to set up, we've already
> had one successful 911 call from an office that was continually misrouted
> by Comcast, and the contract is up "soon".
>
> -A
>
> On Sat, Jan 8, 2022 at 2:37 PM Mary Lou Carey 
> wrote:
>
>> I was just going to say the same thing. If you give Comcast or any
>> carrier a chance to fix it and they can't/won't/don't, then you have to
>> escalate it above their heads.
>>
>> The 911 network has always operated separately from the PSTN world for a
>> reason. That's because misroutes can result in people dying! Carriers
>> can get in HUGE trouble if they don't address routing issues immediately
>> and VOIP carriers can also get in trouble if they don't allow the
>> customer a method of updating their location themselves.
>>
>>
>> MARY LOU CAREY
>> BackUP Telecom Consulting
>> Office: 615-791-9969
>> Cell: 615-796-
>>
>> On 2022-01-05 09:08 AM, Mike Hammett wrote:
>> > Escalate to the PUC and ETSBs.
>> >
>> > Unfortunately, with companies like that, honey doesn't work. You need
>> > vinegar.
>> >
>> > -
>> > Mike Hammett
>> > Intelligent Computing Solutions
>> > http://www.ics-il.com
>> >
>> > Midwest Internet Exchange
>> > http://www.midwest-ix.com
>> >
>> > -
>> >
>> > From: "Aaron C. de Bruyn via VoiceOps" 
>> > To: "Paul Timmins" 
>> > Cc: voiceops@voiceops.org
>> > Sent: Tuesday, January 4, 2022 6:07:52 PM
>> > Subject: Re: [VoiceOps] Misrouting 911 Calls?
>> >
>> > When I handed Comcast a list of phone numbers years ago, they said
>> > there would be no problem porting them over or using them.
>> > That was it.
>> >
>> > Then after the service was installed, someone mentioned "a few of the
>> > numbers will be RCF'd", but we wouldn't have a problem using them.
>> >
>> > Then 3 months into using the service (after our cancellation period
>> > expired and we were locked-in), we suddenly started having problems
>> > with the RCF'd numbers being re-written.
>> >
>> > No less than 30 calls to Comcast over the years has resulted in widely
>> > different responses including:
>> > * Ok, we just changed an option in the AdTran to allow you to specify
>> > your own caller ID, everything should work now (it doesn't)
>> > * Give us a list of phone numbers and associated addresses so we can
>> > update our e911 information (they respond with "done!", not "we can't
>> > set e911 for phone number xxx-yyy-)
>> > * I'm going to escalate this (followed by nothing happening and the
>> > case gets magically closed)
>> >
>> > After talking with Comcast this morning, I had a rep send me what they
>> > had listed for addresses associated with phone numbers...and
>> > unsurprisingly found that they had reset everything to the address of
>> > our SIP trunk service.  None of our offices have valid 911 contact
>> > info.
>> >
>> > They're allegedly in the middle of updating the list again, but I'm
>> > not holding my breath.
>> >
>> > It's Comcast's job to provide phone service and 911 routing for t

Re: [VoiceOps] Misrouting 911 Calls?

[Aaron C. de Bruyn via VoiceOps]

On Sat, Jan 8, 2022 at 5:21 PM Mary Lou Carey 
wrote:

> You shouldn't have needed a number for each extension. You can just
> associate each extension with a dedicated TN for that particular
> building. Any call that comes from that building would be routed to the
> same PSAP. You'd just want to provide the main desk in each building
> with the physical location of each TN within the building so when help
> arrives they know where to go.
>

Yup.  That was Comcast's response to the FCC though.


> What you're describing is actually 2 different issues. The contract
> being up may fix the problem of getting the call to the correct PSAP,
> but it may not fix your address problem. If the location is routed to
> the right PSAP but identifies the wrong building in that PSAP area it's
> still an issue. My guess would be that Comcast had problems getting your
> addresses to validate in the ALI database so they listed the address
> associated with your SIP trunks instead because the system took that.
> What clients may not be aware of is that the address in the ALI database
> (used to identify locations for 911) doesn't always match the address
> that the customer was given by USPS.
>

I have a portal that I use for tracking my clients addresses.  It has a
'street number' field, 'street name', and 'additional address info' field
(along with city, state, zip).
They basically get concatenated together to come up with the address.
Those fields also generate my e911 list that I hand to Comcast.  I used the
same fields to programatically create the BulkVS 911 list.  BulkVS had zero
problems validating every single address I threw at it. ;)

-A
___
VoiceOps mailing list
VoiceOps@voiceops.org
https://puck.nether.net/mailman/listinfo/voiceops

Re: [VoiceOps] Misrouting 911 Calls?

[Mike Hammett]

Are you potentially underestimating what you're required to do for 911? 




- 
Mike Hammett 
Intelligent Computing Solutions 
http://www.ics-il.com 



Midwest Internet Exchange 
http://www.midwest-ix.com 



- Original Message -

From: "Aaron C. de Bruyn via VoiceOps"  
To: "Mary Lou Carey"  
Cc: voiceops@voiceops.org 
Sent: Saturday, January 8, 2022 5:11:36 PM 
Subject: Re: [VoiceOps] Misrouting 911 Calls? 



I filed a complaint with the FCC about a year ago. 
The FCC reached out to Comcast and Comcast reached back out to me. 
Their response was that we would basically have to purchase ~200 numbers (one 
for each extension on our system), set our outbound 911 caller ID to those 
numbers, and then provide Comcast with a list of mappings between phone numbers 
and addresses. 
It would have added a huge tracking burden for IT as well as increased our bill 
by about $2,500 over the contract term. 


It's all moot now as BulkVS cost less than $50 to set up, we've already had one 
successful 911 call from an office that was continually misrouted by Comcast, 
and the contract is up "soon". 


-A 


On Sat, Jan 8, 2022 at 2:37 PM Mary Lou Carey < mary...@backuptelecom.com > 
wrote: 


I was just going to say the same thing. If you give Comcast or any 
carrier a chance to fix it and they can't/won't/don't, then you have to 
escalate it above their heads. 

The 911 network has always operated separately from the PSTN world for a 
reason. That's because misroutes can result in people dying! Carriers 
can get in HUGE trouble if they don't address routing issues immediately 
and VOIP carriers can also get in trouble if they don't allow the 
customer a method of updating their location themselves. 


MARY LOU CAREY 
BackUP Telecom Consulting 
Office: 615-791-9969 
Cell: 615-796- 

On 2022-01-05 09:08 AM, Mike Hammett wrote: 
> Escalate to the PUC and ETSBs. 
> 
> Unfortunately, with companies like that, honey doesn't work. You need 
> vinegar. 
> 
> - 
> Mike Hammett 
> Intelligent Computing Solutions 
> http://www.ics-il.com 
> 
> Midwest Internet Exchange 
> http://www.midwest-ix.com 
> 
> - 
> 
> From: "Aaron C. de Bruyn via VoiceOps" < voiceops@voiceops.org > 
> To: "Paul Timmins" < p...@timmins.net > 
> Cc: voiceops@voiceops.org 
> Sent: Tuesday, January 4, 2022 6:07:52 PM 
> Subject: Re: [VoiceOps] Misrouting 911 Calls? 
> 
> When I handed Comcast a list of phone numbers years ago, they said 
> there would be no problem porting them over or using them. 
> That was it. 
> 
> Then after the service was installed, someone mentioned "a few of the 
> numbers will be RCF'd", but we wouldn't have a problem using them. 
> 
> Then 3 months into using the service (after our cancellation period 
> expired and we were locked-in), we suddenly started having problems 
> with the RCF'd numbers being re-written. 
> 
> No less than 30 calls to Comcast over the years has resulted in widely 
> different responses including: 
> * Ok, we just changed an option in the AdTran to allow you to specify 
> your own caller ID, everything should work now (it doesn't) 
> * Give us a list of phone numbers and associated addresses so we can 
> update our e911 information (they respond with "done!", not "we can't 
> set e911 for phone number xxx-yyy-) 
> * I'm going to escalate this (followed by nothing happening and the 
> case gets magically closed) 
> 
> After talking with Comcast this morning, I had a rep send me what they 
> had listed for addresses associated with phone numbers...and 
> unsurprisingly found that they had reset everything to the address of 
> our SIP trunk service. None of our offices have valid 911 contact 
> info. 
> 
> They're allegedly in the middle of updating the list again, but I'm 
> not holding my breath. 
> 
> It's Comcast's job to provide phone service and 911 routing for this 
> client. They shouldn't be re-writing anything. They weren't in the 
> beginning, but I'm guessing it has to do with STIR/SHAKEN. I'm 
> vaguely familiar with it, but I'm not a telco or a phone service 
> provider. Just someone they hired to clean up their FreePBX phone 
> mess. ;) 
> 
> -A 
> 
> On Tue, Jan 4, 2022 at 3:01 PM Paul Timmins < p...@timmins.net > wrote: 
> 
>> I'm going to be the unpopular one here, and point out that Comcast 
>> is not really responsible to route 911 calls for you when you use 
>> numbers that they don't provide. For the cost of an hour of an 
>> attorney's time, you could just set up trunking to basically anyone 
>> else to handle those offnet/off circuit numbers and the 911 routing 
>> for those numbers. 
>> 
>> On 1/4/22 1:3

Re: [VoiceOps] Misrouting 911 Calls?

[Mary Lou Carey]

You shouldn't have needed a number for each extension. You can just 
associate each extension with a dedicated TN for that particular 
building. Any call that comes from that building would be routed to the 
same PSAP. You'd just want to provide the main desk in each building 
with the physical location of each TN within the building so when help 
arrives they know where to go.


What you're describing is actually 2 different issues. The contract 
being up may fix the problem of getting the call to the correct PSAP, 
but it may not fix your address problem. If the location is routed to 
the right PSAP but identifies the wrong building in that PSAP area it's 
still an issue. My guess would be that Comcast had problems getting your 
addresses to validate in the ALI database so they listed the address 
associated with your SIP trunks instead because the system took that. 
What clients may not be aware of is that the address in the ALI database 
(used to identify locations for 911) doesn't always match the address 
that the customer was given by USPS.


The ALI database gets its address options from the MSAG database. The 
MSAG uses whatever the original carrier assigned. If the customer writes 
their address as 123 Main Street, but the MSAG lists it as 123 Main St, 
the address won't validate. It has to match EXACTLY! There are also many 
instances where the street name or abbreviation for the city may be 
different. For example, in my area you can take 50 mile stretch of road 
that goes from Columbia TN all the way up to Nashville. In Columbia they 
call it Nashville Highway. In Spring Hill they call it Main Street. In 
Franklin they call it Columbia Ave, and in Nashville they call it 
Highway 31. Just because the Post Office assigned someone's address as 
Nashville Highway doesn't mean the phone company used the same address. 
They may have listed it as Nashville Highway /Columbia Ave and if you 
don't type it exactly that way, your address won't validate. If your 
address doesn't validate, then you get fined! So even though carriers 
are supposed to give their customers a way to update their address, they 
don't want to give them direct access because the address the customer 
thinks they have may not be the address in the ALI database.


Its crazy that anyone gets the service they need when something as 
simple as an address is SO messed up!



MARY LOU CAREY
BackUP Telecom Consulting
Office: 615-791-9969
Cell: 615-796-

On 2022-01-08 05:11 PM, Aaron C. de Bruyn wrote:

I filed a complaint with the FCC about a year ago.
The FCC reached out to Comcast and Comcast reached back out to me.
Their response was that we would basically have to purchase ~200
numbers (one for each extension on our system), set our outbound 911
caller ID to those numbers, and then provide Comcast with a list of
mappings between phone numbers and addresses.
It would have added a huge tracking burden for IT as well as increased
our bill by about $2,500 over the contract term.

It's all moot now as BulkVS cost less than $50 to set up, we've
already had one successful 911 call from an office that was
continually misrouted by Comcast, and the contract is up "soon".

-A

On Sat, Jan 8, 2022 at 2:37 PM Mary Lou Carey
 wrote:


I was just going to say the same thing. If you give Comcast or any
carrier a chance to fix it and they can't/won't/don't, then you have
to
escalate it above their heads.

The 911 network has always operated separately from the PSTN world
for a
reason. That's because misroutes can result in people dying!
Carriers
can get in HUGE trouble if they don't address routing issues
immediately
and VOIP carriers can also get in trouble if they don't allow the
customer a method of updating their location themselves.

MARY LOU CAREY
BackUP Telecom Consulting
Office: 615-791-9969
Cell: 615-796-

On 2022-01-05 09:08 AM, Mike Hammett wrote:

Escalate to the PUC and ETSBs.

Unfortunately, with companies like that, honey doesn't work. You

need

vinegar.

-
Mike Hammett
Intelligent Computing Solutions
http://www.ics-il.com

Midwest Internet Exchange
http://www.midwest-ix.com

-

From: "Aaron C. de Bruyn via VoiceOps" 
To: "Paul Timmins" 
Cc: voiceops@voiceops.org
Sent: Tuesday, January 4, 2022 6:07:52 PM
Subject: Re: [VoiceOps] Misrouting 911 Calls?

When I handed Comcast a list of phone numbers years ago, they said
there would be no problem porting them over or using them.
That was it.

Then after the service was installed, someone mentioned "a few of

the

numbers will be RCF'd", but we wouldn't have a problem using them.

Then 3 months into using the service (after our cancellation

period

expired and we were locked-in), we suddenly started having

problems

with the RCF'd numbers being re-written.

No less than 30 calls to Comcast over the years has resulted in

widely

different responses including:
* Ok, we just changed an option in the AdTran to a

Re: [VoiceOps] Misrouting 911 Calls?

[Aaron C. de Bruyn via VoiceOps]

I filed a complaint with the FCC about a year ago.
The FCC reached out to Comcast and Comcast reached back out to me.
Their response was that we would basically have to purchase ~200 numbers
(one for each extension on our system), set our outbound 911 caller ID to
those numbers, and then provide Comcast with a list of mappings between
phone numbers and addresses.
It would have added a huge tracking burden for IT as well as increased our
bill by about $2,500 over the contract term.

It's all moot now as BulkVS cost less than $50 to set up, we've already had
one successful 911 call from an office that was continually misrouted by
Comcast, and the contract is up "soon".

-A

On Sat, Jan 8, 2022 at 2:37 PM Mary Lou Carey 
wrote:

> I was just going to say the same thing. If you give Comcast or any
> carrier a chance to fix it and they can't/won't/don't, then you have to
> escalate it above their heads.
>
> The 911 network has always operated separately from the PSTN world for a
> reason. That's because misroutes can result in people dying! Carriers
> can get in HUGE trouble if they don't address routing issues immediately
> and VOIP carriers can also get in trouble if they don't allow the
> customer a method of updating their location themselves.
>
>
> MARY LOU CAREY
> BackUP Telecom Consulting
> Office: 615-791-9969
> Cell: 615-796-
>
> On 2022-01-05 09:08 AM, Mike Hammett wrote:
> > Escalate to the PUC and ETSBs.
> >
> > Unfortunately, with companies like that, honey doesn't work. You need
> > vinegar.
> >
> > -
> > Mike Hammett
> > Intelligent Computing Solutions
> > http://www.ics-il.com
> >
> > Midwest Internet Exchange
> > http://www.midwest-ix.com
> >
> > -
> >
> > From: "Aaron C. de Bruyn via VoiceOps" 
> > To: "Paul Timmins" 
> > Cc: voiceops@voiceops.org
> > Sent: Tuesday, January 4, 2022 6:07:52 PM
> > Subject: Re: [VoiceOps] Misrouting 911 Calls?
> >
> > When I handed Comcast a list of phone numbers years ago, they said
> > there would be no problem porting them over or using them.
> > That was it.
> >
> > Then after the service was installed, someone mentioned "a few of the
> > numbers will be RCF'd", but we wouldn't have a problem using them.
> >
> > Then 3 months into using the service (after our cancellation period
> > expired and we were locked-in), we suddenly started having problems
> > with the RCF'd numbers being re-written.
> >
> > No less than 30 calls to Comcast over the years has resulted in widely
> > different responses including:
> > * Ok, we just changed an option in the AdTran to allow you to specify
> > your own caller ID, everything should work now (it doesn't)
> > * Give us a list of phone numbers and associated addresses so we can
> > update our e911 information (they respond with "done!", not "we can't
> > set e911 for phone number xxx-yyy-)
> > * I'm going to escalate this (followed by nothing happening and the
> > case gets magically closed)
> >
> > After talking with Comcast this morning, I had a rep send me what they
> > had listed for addresses associated with phone numbers...and
> > unsurprisingly found that they had reset everything to the address of
> > our SIP trunk service.  None of our offices have valid 911 contact
> > info.
> >
> > They're allegedly in the middle of updating the list again, but I'm
> > not holding my breath.
> >
> > It's Comcast's job to provide phone service and 911 routing for this
> > client.  They shouldn't be re-writing anything.  They weren't in the
> > beginning, but I'm guessing it has to do with STIR/SHAKEN.  I'm
> > vaguely familiar with it, but I'm not a telco or a phone service
> > provider.  Just someone they hired to clean up their FreePBX phone
> > mess. ;)
> >
> > -A
> >
> > On Tue, Jan 4, 2022 at 3:01 PM Paul Timmins  wrote:
> >
> >> I'm going to be the unpopular one here, and point out that Comcast
> >> is not really responsible to route 911 calls for you when you use
> >> numbers that they don't provide. For the cost of an hour of an
> >> attorney's time, you could just set up trunking to basically anyone
> >> else to handle those offnet/off circuit numbers and the 911 routing
> >> for those numbers.
> >>
> >> On 1/4/22 1:30 PM, Aaron C. de Bruyn via VoiceOps wrote:
> >>
> >>> One of my clients has a large SIP trunk with Comcast based out of
> >>> Washington State.
> >>>
> >>> They have all their

Re: [VoiceOps] Misrouting 911 Calls?

[Mary Lou Carey]

I was just going to say the same thing. If you give Comcast or any 
carrier a chance to fix it and they can't/won't/don't, then you have to 
escalate it above their heads.


The 911 network has always operated separately from the PSTN world for a 
reason. That's because misroutes can result in people dying! Carriers 
can get in HUGE trouble if they don't address routing issues immediately 
and VOIP carriers can also get in trouble if they don't allow the 
customer a method of updating their location themselves.



MARY LOU CAREY
BackUP Telecom Consulting
Office: 615-791-9969
Cell: 615-796-

On 2022-01-05 09:08 AM, Mike Hammett wrote:

Escalate to the PUC and ETSBs.

Unfortunately, with companies like that, honey doesn't work. You need
vinegar.

-
Mike Hammett
Intelligent Computing Solutions
http://www.ics-il.com

Midwest Internet Exchange
http://www.midwest-ix.com

-

From: "Aaron C. de Bruyn via VoiceOps" 
To: "Paul Timmins" 
Cc: voiceops@voiceops.org
Sent: Tuesday, January 4, 2022 6:07:52 PM
Subject: Re: [VoiceOps] Misrouting 911 Calls?

When I handed Comcast a list of phone numbers years ago, they said
there would be no problem porting them over or using them.
That was it.

Then after the service was installed, someone mentioned "a few of the
numbers will be RCF'd", but we wouldn't have a problem using them.

Then 3 months into using the service (after our cancellation period
expired and we were locked-in), we suddenly started having problems
with the RCF'd numbers being re-written.

No less than 30 calls to Comcast over the years has resulted in widely
different responses including:
* Ok, we just changed an option in the AdTran to allow you to specify
your own caller ID, everything should work now (it doesn't)
* Give us a list of phone numbers and associated addresses so we can
update our e911 information (they respond with "done!", not "we can't
set e911 for phone number xxx-yyy-)
* I'm going to escalate this (followed by nothing happening and the
case gets magically closed)

After talking with Comcast this morning, I had a rep send me what they
had listed for addresses associated with phone numbers...and
unsurprisingly found that they had reset everything to the address of
our SIP trunk service.  None of our offices have valid 911 contact
info.

They're allegedly in the middle of updating the list again, but I'm
not holding my breath.

It's Comcast's job to provide phone service and 911 routing for this
client.  They shouldn't be re-writing anything.  They weren't in the
beginning, but I'm guessing it has to do with STIR/SHAKEN.  I'm
vaguely familiar with it, but I'm not a telco or a phone service
provider.  Just someone they hired to clean up their FreePBX phone
mess. ;)

-A

On Tue, Jan 4, 2022 at 3:01 PM Paul Timmins  wrote:


I'm going to be the unpopular one here, and point out that Comcast
is not really responsible to route 911 calls for you when you use
numbers that they don't provide. For the cost of an hour of an
attorney's time, you could just set up trunking to basically anyone
else to handle those offnet/off circuit numbers and the 911 routing
for those numbers.

On 1/4/22 1:30 PM, Aaron C. de Bruyn via VoiceOps wrote:


One of my clients has a large SIP trunk with Comcast based out of
Washington State.

They have all their offices across Oregon and Washington hooked
into a FreePBX phone server that is attached to the Comcast SIP
trunk.

911 calls *constantly* get misrouted to the local PSAP where the
SIP trunk lives.

I must have called Comcast 30 times over the last few years to try
and get this addressed, but Comcast flat-out refuses to fix the
issue.

The short answer is that Comcast refuses to fix it.  In some (but
not all) cases, our phone numbers are RCF'd numbers, so they don't
actually exist on the trunk...and Comcast forcibly re-writes them
to our 'main' number...and then routes the 911 call incorrectly.
In other cases, we have provided Comcast with the e911
information, they say it's updated, and then we find out months
later (when an office dials 911 during an emergency) that it's
still not correct.

Not only does this affect 911 calls, but also customers who get
the re-written caller ID and have no idea which office called
them.

The "easy" solution is to ditch Comcast and move to a provider
that doesn't play the RCF and caller-ID-rewrite games.
Unfortunately my client is locked into their Comcast contract for
another ~18 months.  Early termination would incur a ~$35,000
bill.

Is there a list of PSAP numbers somewhere so I can set up an
internal redirect to the PSAP 10-digit number?  I know those
10-digit numbers are guarded like Fort Knox, so I'm betting this
option isn't very realistic.

Maybe a separate service provider that can just handle 911 calls
without "owning" my client's phone numbers?

Any other thoughts on how I can route around Comcast brain damage?

Than

Re: [VoiceOps] Misrouting 911 Calls?

[Aaron C. de Bruyn via VoiceOps]

Thanks again everyone.

I ended up going with bulkvs.com.
They answered the phone when I called, didn't have voicemail saying they
were out for Christmas and would be back 2 days ago, their API made it
pretty simple to load ~270 phone numbers in a matter of minutes, and the
'922' test number allowed offices to run around and verify their address
info was correct.

Comcast finally responded to the issue and corrected our info for the 900th
time.  The snippet of their response I found annoying was: "if any changes
are made to the account it will automatically revert back to the original
name of --redacted--, which is the name the SIP account was set up under".

In my experience, any change to the account doesn't just affect the "name",
it also resets all the PSAP information back to the location of their
SIP/EDI install.  Anyways, that won't be a problem in ~18 months when we
ditch their incompetent service.

-A

On Tue, Jan 4, 2022 at 3:58 PM Aaron C. de Bruyn  wrote:

> Thanks to everyone who responded both on and off-list.
> I think I'm going to go with a 3rd-party provider for routing 911 calls
> and just count down the months until they can ditch Comcast.
>
> -A
>
> On Tue, Jan 4, 2022 at 10:30 AM Aaron C. de Bruyn 
> wrote:
>
>> One of my clients has a large SIP trunk with Comcast based out of
>> Washington State.
>>
>> They have all their offices across Oregon and Washington hooked into a
>> FreePBX phone server that is attached to the Comcast SIP trunk.
>>
>> 911 calls *constantly* get misrouted to the local PSAP where the SIP
>> trunk lives.
>>
>> I must have called Comcast 30 times over the last few years to try and
>> get this addressed, but Comcast flat-out refuses to fix the issue.
>>
>> The short answer is that Comcast refuses to fix it.  In some (but not
>> all) cases, our phone numbers are RCF'd numbers, so they don't
>> actually exist on the trunk...and Comcast forcibly re-writes them to our
>> 'main' number...and then routes the 911 call incorrectly.  In other cases,
>> we have provided Comcast with the e911 information, they say it's updated,
>> and then we find out months later (when an office dials 911 during an
>> emergency) that it's still not correct.
>>
>> Not only does this affect 911 calls, but also customers who get the
>> re-written caller ID and have no idea which office called them.
>>
>> The "easy" solution is to ditch Comcast and move to a provider that
>> doesn't play the RCF and caller-ID-rewrite games.  Unfortunately my client
>> is locked into their Comcast contract for another ~18 months.  Early
>> termination would incur a ~$35,000 bill.
>>
>> Is there a list of PSAP numbers somewhere so I can set up an internal
>> redirect to the PSAP 10-digit number?  I know those 10-digit numbers are
>> guarded like Fort Knox, so I'm betting this option isn't very realistic.
>>
>> Maybe a separate service provider that can just handle 911 calls without
>> "owning" my client's phone numbers?
>>
>> Any other thoughts on how I can route around Comcast brain damage?
>>
>> Thanks,
>>
>> -A
>>
>
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Re: [VoiceOps] Misrouting 911 Calls?

[Mike Hammett]

Escalate to the PUC and ETSBs. 




Unfortunately, with companies like that, honey doesn't work. You need vinegar. 




- 
Mike Hammett 
Intelligent Computing Solutions 
http://www.ics-il.com 



Midwest Internet Exchange 
http://www.midwest-ix.com 



- Original Message -

From: "Aaron C. de Bruyn via VoiceOps"  
To: "Paul Timmins"  
Cc: voiceops@voiceops.org 
Sent: Tuesday, January 4, 2022 6:07:52 PM 
Subject: Re: [VoiceOps] Misrouting 911 Calls? 


When I handed Comcast a list of phone numbers years ago, they said there would 
be no problem porting them over or using them. 
That was it. 


Then after the service was installed, someone mentioned "a few of the numbers 
will be RCF'd", but we wouldn't have a problem using them. 


Then 3 months into using the service (after our cancellation period expired and 
we were locked-in), we suddenly started having problems with the RCF'd numbers 
being re-written. 


No less than 30 calls to Comcast over the years has resulted in widely 
different responses including: 
* Ok, we just changed an option in the AdTran to allow you to specify your own 
caller ID, everything should work now (it doesn't) 
* Give us a list of phone numbers and associated addresses so we can update our 
e911 information (they respond with "done!", not "we can't set e911 for phone 
number xxx-yyy-) 
* I'm going to escalate this (followed by nothing happening and the case gets 
magically closed) 


After talking with Comcast this morning, I had a rep send me what they had 
listed for addresses associated with phone numbers...and unsurprisingly found 
that they had reset everything to the address of our SIP trunk service. None of 
our offices have valid 911 contact info. 


They're allegedly in the middle of updating the list again, but I'm not holding 
my breath. 


It's Comcast's job to provide phone service and 911 routing for this client. 
They shouldn't be re-writing anything. They weren't in the beginning, but I'm 
guessing it has to do with STIR/SHAKEN. I'm vaguely familiar with it, but I'm 
not a telco or a phone service provider. Just someone they hired to clean up 
their FreePBX phone mess. ;) 


-A 


On Tue, Jan 4, 2022 at 3:01 PM Paul Timmins < p...@timmins.net > wrote: 




I'm going to be the unpopular one here, and point out that Comcast is not 
really responsible to route 911 calls for you when you use numbers that they 
don't provide. For the cost of an hour of an attorney's time, you could just 
set up trunking to basically anyone else to handle those offnet/off circuit 
numbers and the 911 routing for those numbers. 



On 1/4/22 1:30 PM, Aaron C. de Bruyn via VoiceOps wrote: 



One of my clients has a large SIP trunk with Comcast based out of Washington 
State. 


They have all their offices across Oregon and Washington hooked into a FreePBX 
phone server that is attached to the Comcast SIP trunk. 


911 calls *constantly* get misrouted to the local PSAP where the SIP trunk 
lives. 


I must have called Comcast 30 times over the last few years to try and get this 
addressed, but Comcast flat-out refuses to fix the issue. 


The short answer is that Comcast refuses to fix it. In some (but not all) 
cases, our phone numbers are RCF'd numbers, so they don't actually exist on the 
trunk...and Comcast forcibly re-writes them to our 'main' number...and then 
routes the 911 call incorrectly. In other cases, we have provided Comcast with 
the e911 information, they say it's updated, and then we find out months later 
(when an office dials 911 during an emergency) that it's still not correct. 


Not only does this affect 911 calls, but also customers who get the re-written 
caller ID and have no idea which office called them. 


The "easy" solution is to ditch Comcast and move to a provider that doesn't 
play the RCF and caller-ID-rewrite games. Unfortunately my client is locked 
into their Comcast contract for another ~18 months. Early termination would 
incur a ~$35,000 bill. 


Is there a list of PSAP numbers somewhere so I can set up an internal redirect 
to the PSAP 10-digit number? I know those 10-digit numbers are guarded like 
Fort Knox, so I'm betting this option isn't very realistic. 


Maybe a separate service provider that can just handle 911 calls without 
"owning" my client's phone numbers? 



Any other thoughts on how I can route around Comcast brain damage? 



Thanks, 


-A 
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Re: [VoiceOps] Misrouting 911 Calls?

[Aaron C. de Bruyn via VoiceOps]

>From my first message:
> Early termination would incur a ~$35,000 bill.

They're paying just over $2k/mo for service and have ~18 months left on the
contract.  Apparently Comcast gives a slight discount from the normal
monthly cost if you terminate early, but it's not much.

-A


On Tue, Jan 4, 2022 at 7:38 PM Peter Rad  wrote:

> why not move that SIP trunk elsewhere? Like Intelepeer or Vonage or RNG or
> Sangoma or anyone who would handle the E911?
>
>
>
> On 1/4/2022 7:07 PM, Aaron C. de Bruyn via VoiceOps wrote:
>
> When I handed Comcast a list of phone numbers years ago, they said there
> would be no problem porting them over or using them.
> That was it.
>
> Then after the service was installed, someone mentioned "a few of the
> numbers will be RCF'd", but we wouldn't have a problem using them.
>
> Then 3 months into using the service (after our cancellation period
> expired and we were locked-in), we suddenly started having problems with
> the RCF'd numbers being re-written.
>
> No less than 30 calls to Comcast over the years has resulted in widely
> different responses including:
> * Ok, we just changed an option in the AdTran to allow you to specify your
> own caller ID, everything should work now (it doesn't)
> * Give us a list of phone numbers and associated addresses so we can
> update our e911 information (they respond with "done!", not "we can't set
> e911 for phone number xxx-yyy-)
> * I'm going to escalate this (followed by nothing happening and the case
> gets magically closed)
>
> After talking with Comcast this morning, I had a rep send me what they had
> listed for addresses associated with phone numbers...and unsurprisingly
> found that they had reset everything to the address of our SIP trunk
> service.  None of our offices have valid 911 contact info.
>
> They're allegedly in the middle of updating the list again, but I'm not
> holding my breath.
>
> It's Comcast's job to provide phone service and 911 routing for this
> client.  They shouldn't be re-writing anything.  They weren't in the
> beginning, but I'm guessing it has to do with STIR/SHAKEN.  I'm vaguely
> familiar with it, but I'm not a telco or a phone service provider.  Just
> someone they hired to clean up their FreePBX phone mess. ;)
>
> -A
>
> On Tue, Jan 4, 2022 at 3:01 PM Paul Timmins  wrote:
>
>> I'm going to be the unpopular one here, and point out that Comcast is not
>> really responsible to route 911 calls for you when you use numbers that
>> they don't provide. For the cost of an hour of an attorney's time, you
>> could just set up trunking to basically anyone else to handle those
>> offnet/off circuit numbers and the 911 routing for those numbers.
>>
>> On 1/4/22 1:30 PM, Aaron C. de Bruyn via VoiceOps wrote:
>>
>> One of my clients has a large SIP trunk with Comcast based out of
>> Washington State.
>>
>> They have all their offices across Oregon and Washington hooked into a
>> FreePBX phone server that is attached to the Comcast SIP trunk.
>>
>> 911 calls *constantly* get misrouted to the local PSAP where the SIP
>> trunk lives.
>>
>> I must have called Comcast 30 times over the last few years to try and
>> get this addressed, but Comcast flat-out refuses to fix the issue.
>>
>> The short answer is that Comcast refuses to fix it.  In some (but not
>> all) cases, our phone numbers are RCF'd numbers, so they don't
>> actually exist on the trunk...and Comcast forcibly re-writes them to our
>> 'main' number...and then routes the 911 call incorrectly.  In other cases,
>> we have provided Comcast with the e911 information, they say it's updated,
>> and then we find out months later (when an office dials 911 during an
>> emergency) that it's still not correct.
>>
>> Not only does this affect 911 calls, but also customers who get the
>> re-written caller ID and have no idea which office called them.
>>
>> The "easy" solution is to ditch Comcast and move to a provider that
>> doesn't play the RCF and caller-ID-rewrite games.  Unfortunately my client
>> is locked into their Comcast contract for another ~18 months.  Early
>> termination would incur a ~$35,000 bill.
>>
>> Is there a list of PSAP numbers somewhere so I can set up an internal
>> redirect to the PSAP 10-digit number?  I know those 10-digit numbers are
>> guarded like Fort Knox, so I'm betting this option isn't very realistic.
>>
>> Maybe a separate service provider that can just handle 911 calls without
>> "owning" my client's phone numbers?
>>
>> Any other thoughts on how I can route around Comcast brain damage?
>>
>> Thanks,
>>
>> -A
>>
>> ___
>> VoiceOps mailing 
>> listVoiceOps@voiceops.orghttps://puck.nether.net/mailman/listinfo/voiceops
>>
>>
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>>
>
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> 

Re: [VoiceOps] Misrouting 911 Calls?

[Peter Rad]

why not move that SIP trunk elsewhere? Like Intelepeer or Vonage or RNG 
or Sangoma or anyone who would handle the E911?




On 1/4/2022 7:07 PM, Aaron C. de Bruyn via VoiceOps wrote:
When I handed Comcast a list of phone numbers years ago, they said 
there would be no problem porting them over or using them.

That was it.

Then after the service was installed, someone mentioned "a few of the 
numbers will be RCF'd", but we wouldn't have a problem using them.


Then 3 months into using the service (after our cancellation period 
expired and we were locked-in), we suddenly started having problems 
with the RCF'd numbers being re-written.


No less than 30 calls to Comcast over the years has resulted in widely 
different responses including:
* Ok, we just changed an option in the AdTran to allow you to specify 
your own caller ID, everything should work now (it doesn't)
* Give us a list of phone numbers and associated addresses so we can 
update our e911 information (they respond with "done!", not "we can't 
set e911 for phone number xxx-yyy-)
* I'm going to escalate this (followed by nothing happening and the 
case gets magically closed)


After talking with Comcast this morning, I had a rep send me what they 
had listed for addresses associated with phone numbers...and 
unsurprisingly found that they had reset everything to the address of 
our SIP trunk service.  None of our offices have valid 911 contact info.


They're allegedly in the middle of updating the list again, but I'm 
not holding my breath.


It's Comcast's job to provide phone service and 911 routing for this 
client.  They shouldn't be re-writing anything.  They weren't in the 
beginning, but I'm guessing it has to do with STIR/SHAKEN.  I'm 
vaguely familiar with it, but I'm not a telco or a phone service 
provider.  Just someone they hired to clean up their FreePBX phone 
mess. ;)


-A

On Tue, Jan 4, 2022 at 3:01 PM Paul Timmins  wrote:

I'm going to be the unpopular one here, and point out that Comcast
is not really responsible to route 911 calls for you when you use
numbers that they don't provide. For the cost of an hour of an
attorney's time, you could just set up trunking to basically
anyone else to handle those offnet/off circuit numbers and the 911
routing for those numbers.

On 1/4/22 1:30 PM, Aaron C. de Bruyn via VoiceOps wrote:

One of my clients has a large SIP trunk with Comcast based out of
Washington State.

They have all their offices across Oregon and Washington hooked
into a FreePBX phone server that is attached to the Comcast SIP
trunk.

911 calls *constantly* get misrouted to the local PSAP where the
SIP trunk lives.

I must have called Comcast 30 times over the last few years to
try and get this addressed, but Comcast flat-out refuses to fix
the issue.

The short answer is that Comcast refuses to fix it.  In some (but
not all) cases, our phone numbers are RCF'd numbers, so they
don't actually exist on the trunk...and Comcast forcibly
re-writes them to our 'main' number...and then routes the 911
call incorrectly.  In other cases, we have provided Comcast with
the e911 information, they say it's updated, and then we find out
months later (when an office dials 911 during an emergency) that
it's still not correct.

Not only does this affect 911 calls, but also customers who get
the re-written caller ID and have no idea which office called them.

The "easy" solution is to ditch Comcast and move to a provider
that doesn't play the RCF and caller-ID-rewrite games. 
Unfortunately my client is locked into their Comcast contract for
another ~18 months.  Early termination would incur a ~$35,000 bill.

Is there a list of PSAP numbers somewhere so I can set up an
internal redirect to the PSAP 10-digit number?  I know those
10-digit numbers are guarded like Fort Knox, so I'm betting this
option isn't very realistic.

Maybe a separate service provider that can just handle 911 calls
without "owning" my client's phone numbers?

Any other thoughts on how I can route around Comcast brain damage?

Thanks,

-A

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Re: [VoiceOps] Misrouting 911 Calls?

[Aaron C. de Bruyn via VoiceOps]

When I handed Comcast a list of phone numbers years ago, they said there
would be no problem porting them over or using them.
That was it.

Then after the service was installed, someone mentioned "a few of the
numbers will be RCF'd", but we wouldn't have a problem using them.

Then 3 months into using the service (after our cancellation period expired
and we were locked-in), we suddenly started having problems with the RCF'd
numbers being re-written.

No less than 30 calls to Comcast over the years has resulted in widely
different responses including:
* Ok, we just changed an option in the AdTran to allow you to specify your
own caller ID, everything should work now (it doesn't)
* Give us a list of phone numbers and associated addresses so we can update
our e911 information (they respond with "done!", not "we can't set e911 for
phone number xxx-yyy-)
* I'm going to escalate this (followed by nothing happening and the case
gets magically closed)

After talking with Comcast this morning, I had a rep send me what they had
listed for addresses associated with phone numbers...and unsurprisingly
found that they had reset everything to the address of our SIP trunk
service.  None of our offices have valid 911 contact info.

They're allegedly in the middle of updating the list again, but I'm not
holding my breath.

It's Comcast's job to provide phone service and 911 routing for this
client.  They shouldn't be re-writing anything.  They weren't in the
beginning, but I'm guessing it has to do with STIR/SHAKEN.  I'm vaguely
familiar with it, but I'm not a telco or a phone service provider.  Just
someone they hired to clean up their FreePBX phone mess. ;)

-A

On Tue, Jan 4, 2022 at 3:01 PM Paul Timmins  wrote:

> I'm going to be the unpopular one here, and point out that Comcast is not
> really responsible to route 911 calls for you when you use numbers that
> they don't provide. For the cost of an hour of an attorney's time, you
> could just set up trunking to basically anyone else to handle those
> offnet/off circuit numbers and the 911 routing for those numbers.
>
> On 1/4/22 1:30 PM, Aaron C. de Bruyn via VoiceOps wrote:
>
> One of my clients has a large SIP trunk with Comcast based out of
> Washington State.
>
> They have all their offices across Oregon and Washington hooked into a
> FreePBX phone server that is attached to the Comcast SIP trunk.
>
> 911 calls *constantly* get misrouted to the local PSAP where the SIP trunk
> lives.
>
> I must have called Comcast 30 times over the last few years to try and get
> this addressed, but Comcast flat-out refuses to fix the issue.
>
> The short answer is that Comcast refuses to fix it.  In some (but not all)
> cases, our phone numbers are RCF'd numbers, so they don't actually exist on
> the trunk...and Comcast forcibly re-writes them to our 'main' number...and
> then routes the 911 call incorrectly.  In other cases, we have provided
> Comcast with the e911 information, they say it's updated, and then we find
> out months later (when an office dials 911 during an emergency) that it's
> still not correct.
>
> Not only does this affect 911 calls, but also customers who get the
> re-written caller ID and have no idea which office called them.
>
> The "easy" solution is to ditch Comcast and move to a provider that
> doesn't play the RCF and caller-ID-rewrite games.  Unfortunately my client
> is locked into their Comcast contract for another ~18 months.  Early
> termination would incur a ~$35,000 bill.
>
> Is there a list of PSAP numbers somewhere so I can set up an internal
> redirect to the PSAP 10-digit number?  I know those 10-digit numbers are
> guarded like Fort Knox, so I'm betting this option isn't very realistic.
>
> Maybe a separate service provider that can just handle 911 calls without
> "owning" my client's phone numbers?
>
> Any other thoughts on how I can route around Comcast brain damage?
>
> Thanks,
>
> -A
>
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>
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Re: [VoiceOps] Misrouting 911 Calls?

[Aaron C. de Bruyn via VoiceOps]

Thanks to everyone who responded both on and off-list.
I think I'm going to go with a 3rd-party provider for routing 911 calls and
just count down the months until they can ditch Comcast.

-A

On Tue, Jan 4, 2022 at 10:30 AM Aaron C. de Bruyn 
wrote:

> One of my clients has a large SIP trunk with Comcast based out of
> Washington State.
>
> They have all their offices across Oregon and Washington hooked into a
> FreePBX phone server that is attached to the Comcast SIP trunk.
>
> 911 calls *constantly* get misrouted to the local PSAP where the SIP trunk
> lives.
>
> I must have called Comcast 30 times over the last few years to try and get
> this addressed, but Comcast flat-out refuses to fix the issue.
>
> The short answer is that Comcast refuses to fix it.  In some (but not all)
> cases, our phone numbers are RCF'd numbers, so they don't actually exist on
> the trunk...and Comcast forcibly re-writes them to our 'main' number...and
> then routes the 911 call incorrectly.  In other cases, we have provided
> Comcast with the e911 information, they say it's updated, and then we find
> out months later (when an office dials 911 during an emergency) that it's
> still not correct.
>
> Not only does this affect 911 calls, but also customers who get the
> re-written caller ID and have no idea which office called them.
>
> The "easy" solution is to ditch Comcast and move to a provider that
> doesn't play the RCF and caller-ID-rewrite games.  Unfortunately my client
> is locked into their Comcast contract for another ~18 months.  Early
> termination would incur a ~$35,000 bill.
>
> Is there a list of PSAP numbers somewhere so I can set up an internal
> redirect to the PSAP 10-digit number?  I know those 10-digit numbers are
> guarded like Fort Knox, so I'm betting this option isn't very realistic.
>
> Maybe a separate service provider that can just handle 911 calls without
> "owning" my client's phone numbers?
>
> Any other thoughts on how I can route around Comcast brain damage?
>
> Thanks,
>
> -A
>
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Re: [VoiceOps] Misrouting 911 Calls?

[Paul Timmins]

I'm going to be the unpopular one here, and point out that Comcast is 
not really responsible to route 911 calls for you when you use numbers 
that they don't provide. For the cost of an hour of an attorney's time, 
you could just set up trunking to basically anyone else to handle those 
offnet/off circuit numbers and the 911 routing for those numbers.


On 1/4/22 1:30 PM, Aaron C. de Bruyn via VoiceOps wrote:
One of my clients has a large SIP trunk with Comcast based out of 
Washington State.


They have all their offices across Oregon and Washington hooked into a 
FreePBX phone server that is attached to the Comcast SIP trunk.


911 calls *constantly* get misrouted to the local PSAP where the SIP 
trunk lives.


I must have called Comcast 30 times over the last few years to try and 
get this addressed, but Comcast flat-out refuses to fix the issue.


The short answer is that Comcast refuses to fix it.  In some (but not 
all) cases, our phone numbers are RCF'd numbers, so they don't 
actually exist on the trunk...and Comcast forcibly re-writes them to 
our 'main' number...and then routes the 911 call incorrectly.  In 
other cases, we have provided Comcast with the e911 information, they 
say it's updated, and then we find out months later (when an office 
dials 911 during an emergency) that it's still not correct.


Not only does this affect 911 calls, but also customers who get the 
re-written caller ID and have no idea which office called them.


The "easy" solution is to ditch Comcast and move to a provider that 
doesn't play the RCF and caller-ID-rewrite games.  Unfortunately my 
client is locked into their Comcast contract for another ~18 months.  
Early termination would incur a ~$35,000 bill.


Is there a list of PSAP numbers somewhere so I can set up an internal 
redirect to the PSAP 10-digit number?  I know those 10-digit numbers 
are guarded like Fort Knox, so I'm betting this option isn't very 
realistic.


Maybe a separate service provider that can just handle 911 calls 
without "owning" my client's phone numbers?


Any other thoughts on how I can route around Comcast brain damage?

Thanks,

-A

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Re: [VoiceOps] Misrouting 911 Calls?

[Jared Geiger]

BulkVS offers E911 service to numbers not native to them. So you can
register your E911 DIDs for each office address and just send your 911
traffic to them. They also support the text/email notification needed for
when someone in the office dials 911. I think they are supporting Z axis
geo data now too for coordinates. I'd go this route if you have less than
$100 of spend in 911 especially with no contract required PAYG. If you have
more, look at Intrado or Bandwidth for their solutions.

On Tue, Jan 4, 2022 at 11:04 AM Carlos Alvarez  wrote:

> Sounds like this client is large enough to have a legal person/team on
> call or on staff?  They should write a letter putting the carrier on notice
> that they are in violation of the law, and in violation of their contract,
> and they have X days to rectify or the contract is void.
>
> You have to give one point to Comcast; they will consistently prove that
> they are the worst telecom/ISP on the planet.
>
>
>
> On Tue, Jan 4, 2022 at 11:41 AM Aaron C. de Bruyn via VoiceOps <
> voiceops@voiceops.org> wrote:
>
>> One of my clients has a large SIP trunk with Comcast based out of
>> Washington State.
>>
>> They have all their offices across Oregon and Washington hooked into a
>> FreePBX phone server that is attached to the Comcast SIP trunk.
>>
>> 911 calls *constantly* get misrouted to the local PSAP where the SIP
>> trunk lives.
>>
>> I must have called Comcast 30 times over the last few years to try and
>> get this addressed, but Comcast flat-out refuses to fix the issue.
>>
>> The short answer is that Comcast refuses to fix it.  In some (but not
>> all) cases, our phone numbers are RCF'd numbers, so they don't
>> actually exist on the trunk...and Comcast forcibly re-writes them to our
>> 'main' number...and then routes the 911 call incorrectly.  In other cases,
>> we have provided Comcast with the e911 information, they say it's updated,
>> and then we find out months later (when an office dials 911 during an
>> emergency) that it's still not correct.
>>
>> Not only does this affect 911 calls, but also customers who get the
>> re-written caller ID and have no idea which office called them.
>>
>> The "easy" solution is to ditch Comcast and move to a provider that
>> doesn't play the RCF and caller-ID-rewrite games.  Unfortunately my client
>> is locked into their Comcast contract for another ~18 months.  Early
>> termination would incur a ~$35,000 bill.
>>
>> Is there a list of PSAP numbers somewhere so I can set up an internal
>> redirect to the PSAP 10-digit number?  I know those 10-digit numbers are
>> guarded like Fort Knox, so I'm betting this option isn't very realistic.
>>
>> Maybe a separate service provider that can just handle 911 calls without
>> "owning" my client's phone numbers?
>>
>> Any other thoughts on how I can route around Comcast brain damage?
>>
>> Thanks,
>>
>> -A
>> ___
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Re: [VoiceOps] Misrouting 911 Calls?

[Carlos Alvarez]

Sounds like this client is large enough to have a legal person/team on call
or on staff?  They should write a letter putting the carrier on notice that
they are in violation of the law, and in violation of their contract, and
they have X days to rectify or the contract is void.

You have to give one point to Comcast; they will consistently prove that
they are the worst telecom/ISP on the planet.



On Tue, Jan 4, 2022 at 11:41 AM Aaron C. de Bruyn via VoiceOps <
voiceops@voiceops.org> wrote:

> One of my clients has a large SIP trunk with Comcast based out of
> Washington State.
>
> They have all their offices across Oregon and Washington hooked into a
> FreePBX phone server that is attached to the Comcast SIP trunk.
>
> 911 calls *constantly* get misrouted to the local PSAP where the SIP trunk
> lives.
>
> I must have called Comcast 30 times over the last few years to try and get
> this addressed, but Comcast flat-out refuses to fix the issue.
>
> The short answer is that Comcast refuses to fix it.  In some (but not all)
> cases, our phone numbers are RCF'd numbers, so they don't actually exist on
> the trunk...and Comcast forcibly re-writes them to our 'main' number...and
> then routes the 911 call incorrectly.  In other cases, we have provided
> Comcast with the e911 information, they say it's updated, and then we find
> out months later (when an office dials 911 during an emergency) that it's
> still not correct.
>
> Not only does this affect 911 calls, but also customers who get the
> re-written caller ID and have no idea which office called them.
>
> The "easy" solution is to ditch Comcast and move to a provider that
> doesn't play the RCF and caller-ID-rewrite games.  Unfortunately my client
> is locked into their Comcast contract for another ~18 months.  Early
> termination would incur a ~$35,000 bill.
>
> Is there a list of PSAP numbers somewhere so I can set up an internal
> redirect to the PSAP 10-digit number?  I know those 10-digit numbers are
> guarded like Fort Knox, so I'm betting this option isn't very realistic.
>
> Maybe a separate service provider that can just handle 911 calls without
> "owning" my client's phone numbers?
>
> Any other thoughts on how I can route around Comcast brain damage?
>
> Thanks,
>
> -A
> ___
> VoiceOps mailing list
> VoiceOps@voiceops.org
> https://puck.nether.net/mailman/listinfo/voiceops
>
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Re: [VoiceOps] Misrouting 911 Calls?

[Jeff Shultz]

Since this involves 911 service, I think it is past time to get the lawyers
involved.

On Tue, Jan 4, 2022 at 10:41 AM Aaron C. de Bruyn via VoiceOps <
voiceops@voiceops.org> wrote:

> One of my clients has a large SIP trunk with Comcast based out of
> Washington State.
>
> They have all their offices across Oregon and Washington hooked into a
> FreePBX phone server that is attached to the Comcast SIP trunk.
>
> 911 calls *constantly* get misrouted to the local PSAP where the SIP trunk
> lives.
>
> I must have called Comcast 30 times over the last few years to try and get
> this addressed, but Comcast flat-out refuses to fix the issue.
>
> The short answer is that Comcast refuses to fix it.  In some (but not all)
> cases, our phone numbers are RCF'd numbers, so they don't actually exist on
> the trunk...and Comcast forcibly re-writes them to our 'main' number...and
> then routes the 911 call incorrectly.  In other cases, we have provided
> Comcast with the e911 information, they say it's updated, and then we find
> out months later (when an office dials 911 during an emergency) that it's
> still not correct.
>
> Not only does this affect 911 calls, but also customers who get the
> re-written caller ID and have no idea which office called them.
>
> The "easy" solution is to ditch Comcast and move to a provider that
> doesn't play the RCF and caller-ID-rewrite games.  Unfortunately my client
> is locked into their Comcast contract for another ~18 months.  Early
> termination would incur a ~$35,000 bill.
>
> Is there a list of PSAP numbers somewhere so I can set up an internal
> redirect to the PSAP 10-digit number?  I know those 10-digit numbers are
> guarded like Fort Knox, so I'm betting this option isn't very realistic.
>
> Maybe a separate service provider that can just handle 911 calls without
> "owning" my client's phone numbers?
>
> Any other thoughts on how I can route around Comcast brain damage?
>
> Thanks,
>
> -A
> ___
> VoiceOps mailing list
> VoiceOps@voiceops.org
> https://puck.nether.net/mailman/listinfo/voiceops
>


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Re: [VoiceOps] Misrouting 911 Calls?

[Ivan Kovacevic]

This:


Maybe a separate service provider that can just handle 911 calls without
"owning" my client's phone numbers?

There are a number of VoIP 911 providers who handle and route calls to the
correct PSAP based either on the registered address or based on information
collected from the called on the phone. We use Northern911 but there are
many others.

We have this relationship as a TSP, but also have several clients (roadside
assistance, security companies, utilities) who have a direct relationship
with N911.

Dialplan to route 911 calls to the provider and bypass Comcast will fix
your headache. For not much $.

Good luck

Ivan





On Tue., Jan. 4, 2022, 1:36 p.m. Aaron C. de Bruyn via VoiceOps, <
voiceops@voiceops.org> wrote:

> One of my clients has a large SIP trunk with Comcast based out of
> Washington State.
>
> They have all their offices across Oregon and Washington hooked into a
> FreePBX phone server that is attached to the Comcast SIP trunk.
>
> 911 calls *constantly* get misrouted to the local PSAP where the SIP trunk
> lives.
>
> I must have called Comcast 30 times over the last few years to try and get
> this addressed, but Comcast flat-out refuses to fix the issue.
>
> The short answer is that Comcast refuses to fix it.  In some (but not all)
> cases, our phone numbers are RCF'd numbers, so they don't actually exist on
> the trunk...and Comcast forcibly re-writes them to our 'main' number...and
> then routes the 911 call incorrectly.  In other cases, we have provided
> Comcast with the e911 information, they say it's updated, and then we find
> out months later (when an office dials 911 during an emergency) that it's
> still not correct.
>
> Not only does this affect 911 calls, but also customers who get the
> re-written caller ID and have no idea which office called them.
>
> The "easy" solution is to ditch Comcast and move to a provider that
> doesn't play the RCF and caller-ID-rewrite games.  Unfortunately my client
> is locked into their Comcast contract for another ~18 months.  Early
> termination would incur a ~$35,000 bill.
>
> Is there a list of PSAP numbers somewhere so I can set up an internal
> redirect to the PSAP 10-digit number?  I know those 10-digit numbers are
> guarded like Fort Knox, so I'm betting this option isn't very realistic.
>
> Maybe a separate service provider that can just handle 911 calls without
> "owning" my client's phone numbers?
>
> Any other thoughts on how I can route around Comcast brain damage?
>
> Thanks,
>
> -A
> ___
> VoiceOps mailing list
> VoiceOps@voiceops.org
> https://puck.nether.net/mailman/listinfo/voiceops
>

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Re: [VoiceOps] Misrouting 911 Calls?

[Matthew Crocker]

Get a small SIP trunk from another provider.  Order 1 DID from that provider 
for each physical office location.  Register appropriate 911 information for 
the DID.  Configure FreePBX to rewrite the CallerID to the appropriate DID for 
outbound 911 calls.  You may be able to get new DIDs from Comcast for the sole 
purpose of 911 and configure outbound 911 calls to those DIDs.



From: VoiceOps  on behalf of Aaron C. de Bruyn 
via VoiceOps 
Date: Tuesday, January 4, 2022 at 1:41 PM
To: voiceops@voiceops.org 
Subject: [VoiceOps] Misrouting 911 Calls?
CAUTION: This email originated from outside of Crocker. Do not click links or 
open attachments unless you recognize the sender and know the content is safe.

One of my clients has a large SIP trunk with Comcast based out of Washington 
State.

They have all their offices across Oregon and Washington hooked into a FreePBX 
phone server that is attached to the Comcast SIP trunk.

911 calls *constantly* get misrouted to the local PSAP where the SIP trunk 
lives.

I must have called Comcast 30 times over the last few years to try and get this 
addressed, but Comcast flat-out refuses to fix the issue.

The short answer is that Comcast refuses to fix it.  In some (but not all) 
cases, our phone numbers are RCF'd numbers, so they don't actually exist on the 
trunk...and Comcast forcibly re-writes them to our 'main' number...and then 
routes the 911 call incorrectly.  In other cases, we have provided Comcast with 
the e911 information, they say it's updated, and then we find out months later 
(when an office dials 911 during an emergency) that it's still not correct.

Not only does this affect 911 calls, but also customers who get the re-written 
caller ID and have no idea which office called them.

The "easy" solution is to ditch Comcast and move to a provider that doesn't 
play the RCF and caller-ID-rewrite games.  Unfortunately my client is locked 
into their Comcast contract for another ~18 months.  Early termination would 
incur a ~$35,000 bill.

Is there a list of PSAP numbers somewhere so I can set up an internal redirect 
to the PSAP 10-digit number?  I know those 10-digit numbers are guarded like 
Fort Knox, so I'm betting this option isn't very realistic.

Maybe a separate service provider that can just handle 911 calls without 
"owning" my client's phone numbers?

Any other thoughts on how I can route around Comcast brain damage?

Thanks,

-A
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