Re: [Vo]:Climate change 'significantly worse' than feared: Al Gore
thats basically it. it depends on if the death and disease and destruction that will be caused is worth it. (if you ask me, i get less people in the world, and beach front property here in az. WIN WIN. ) On 1/28/08, Harry Veeder [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On 28/1/2008 8:28 AM, Jeff Fink wrote: Edmund Storms wrote: It's the attempt to solve a problem that is important. An ill conceived solution will make matters. Let us not waste resources on crazy solutions, but use them to adapt if necessary. We cannot save civilization by dismantling civilization. I saw a science show on Saturday that said global warming will cause the sahara to get green again, and then they called that a bad thing! How can that be bad if it was once green? Change happens. Change is continuous. Something somewhere gets better, something somewhere else gets worse. Animals adapt. But, we humans don't want to adapt. We want to stop change, no matter what the cause of the change, rather than adapt. We want the sea shore to stay right where it is now, everywhere, and we will commit unlimited resources to make it so. At sometime in the past, evidence shows levels higher and lower on this planet. It changes continuously. Let it go. Adapt! Adapt or die! ;-) Harry -- That which yields isn't always weak.
Re: [Vo]:OT: Bigfoot on Mars??
As previously mentioned I attended an informal pot luck in the Milwaukee area last Sunday where one of the official topics of gossip, er... discussion, revolved around the recent UFO sightings down in Stephenville, Texas. According to Donald Schmitt, who has seen some of the transcripts, the following tidbits have come out. The object was witnessed by numerous individuals, probably hundreds or more. Witnesses interviewed (at least those who were willing to be interviewed, so far) have allowed the investigators to compile a decent approximation of the object's size, shape and altitude. It was hovering extremely low to the ground, perhaps only a hundred feet or so. It was circular in shape with a very bright light emanating from its center. Apparently, and I'm not sure I got this correct, it would appear that each witness saw the same circular shape, where a bright light emanated from its center, even when triangulation was used. The exterior dimension-diameter was determined where starlight was occluded. Based on these visual accounts it was determined that the object's exterior diameter was approximately three football fields in length - 900 feet. This case is far from closed despite the air force's recent attempt to explain it all away as another military exercise approximately ten days after the incident occurred. No doubt additional witnesses will be interviewed when they come forward or are located. The UFO was witnessed hovering stationary for approximately five minutes before it began to move - slowly at fist. But then suddenly, within a blink of an eye, it zipped towards the horizon and appeared to disappear (as if its lights went out?) before it passed across the horizon. The acceleration and unbelievable speed appeared to have been instantaneous. After thoughts: Typical official skeptical responses for public consumption were performed, for example, by skeptics such as the one invited on Larry King Live, James Mcgaha, astronomer and founder of Tucson Skeptics Incorporated, who is a retired United States Air Force pilot. For a transcript of that show see: http://ufotruth.wordpress.com/2008/01/21/transcript-of-stephenville-ufo-discussed-on-larry-king-live/ http://preview.tinyurl.com/2azwd8 ...where the final McGaha conclusion appears to be that all UFO witnesses are not qualified to determine what it was that they saw. Typical comment from McGaha: MCGAHA: Are you qualified to look at the sky at night? Move along... move along... Nothing to see here. Regards, Steven Vincent Johnson www.OrionWorks.com www.zazzle.com/orionworks
Re: [Vo]:Climate change 'significantly worse' than feared: Al Gore
On 28/1/2008 8:28 AM, Jeff Fink wrote: Edmund Storms wrote: It's the attempt to solve a problem that is important. An ill conceived solution will make matters. Let us not waste resources on crazy solutions, but use them to adapt if necessary. We cannot save civilization by dismantling civilization. The borg collective comes to mind when I think of dismantling. ;-) Harry I saw a science show on Saturday that said global warming will cause the sahara to get green again, and then they called that a bad thing! How can that be bad if it was once green? Change happens. Change is continuous. Something somewhere gets better, something somewhere else gets worse. Animals adapt. But, we humans don't want to adapt. We want to stop change, no matter what the cause of the change, rather than adapt. We want the sea shore to stay right where it is now, everywhere, and we will commit unlimited resources to make it so. At sometime in the past, evidence shows levels higher and lower on this planet. It changes continuously. Let it go. Adapt! No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.5.516 / Virus Database: 269.19.13/1246 - Release Date: 1/27/2008 6:39 PM
Re: [Vo]:Climate change 'significantly worse' than feared: Al Gore
On 28/1/2008 8:28 AM, Jeff Fink wrote: Edmund Storms wrote: It's the attempt to solve a problem that is important. An ill conceived solution will make matters. Let us not waste resources on crazy solutions, but use them to adapt if necessary. We cannot save civilization by dismantling civilization. I saw a science show on Saturday that said global warming will cause the sahara to get green again, and then they called that a bad thing! How can that be bad if it was once green? Change happens. Change is continuous. Something somewhere gets better, something somewhere else gets worse. Animals adapt. But, we humans don't want to adapt. We want to stop change, no matter what the cause of the change, rather than adapt. We want the sea shore to stay right where it is now, everywhere, and we will commit unlimited resources to make it so. At sometime in the past, evidence shows levels higher and lower on this planet. It changes continuously. Let it go. Adapt! Adapt or die! ;-) Harry
Re: [Vo]:OT: Bigfoot on Mars??
On 28/1/2008 2:30 PM, OrionWorks wrote: Oh, yes, I forgot to mention another bit of trivia certain vorts might appreciate knowing. The Day The Earth Stood Still is being remade, to be released this summer. Klatu will be played by Keanu Reeves. When Klatu comes down the gangplank will he present the inhabitants of Earth with the red pill or the blue pill? Greetings my excellent Earthlings! (followed by an electric guitar riff) Harry It's my understanding that in the original 1951 movie Spencer Tracy had been seriously considered for the role of Klatu. However, the produces decided against him in favor of Michael Rennie (The Third Man), as it was felt that Spencer's face was too recognizable and would distract from the need to project a proper mystique of aloof alien-ness. And now, back to your regularly scheduled programming. Regards, Steven Vincent Johnson www.OrionWorks.com www.Zazzle.com/orionworks
Re: [Vo]:OT: Bigfoot on Mars??
On Mon, 28 Jan 2008 09:18:13 -0600 OrionWorks [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: The UFO was witnessed hovering stationary for approximately five minutes before it began to move - slowly at fist. But then suddenly, within a blink of an eye, it zipped towards the horizon and appeared to disappear (as if its lights went out?) before it passed across the horizon. The acceleration and unbelievable speed appeared to have been instantaneous. Interesting report. If it accelerated so rapidly, and was so large, wouldn't there have been an enormous blast of wind? Maybe a humongous sonic boom? Maybe the Air Force was testing some sort of projection technology. Sounds like it could be useful on a battlefield to confuse the enemy.
Re: [Vo]:OT: Bigfoot on Mars??
Oh, yes, I forgot to mention another bit of trivia certain vorts might appreciate knowing. The Day The Earth Stood Still is being remade, to be released this summer. Klatu will be played by Keanu Reeves. When Klatu comes down the gangplank will he present the inhabitants of Earth with the red pill or the blue pill? It's my understanding that in the original 1951 movie Spencer Tracy had been seriously considered for the role of Klatu. However, the produces decided against him in favor of Michael Rennie (The Third Man), as it was felt that Spencer's face was too recognizable and would distract from the need to project a proper mystique of aloof alien-ness. And now, back to your regularly scheduled programming. Regards, Steven Vincent Johnson www.OrionWorks.com www.Zazzle.com/orionworks
[Vo]:Stiffler Technology
Vortexians; I corresponded with Ronald Stiffler. I pointed out that cold electricity, the light bulb glows and gets cold, flies in the face of conventional electrodynamic theory. This matter0 has been like an itch to me, ever since I read the physicist, Roger Hastings' report of the Newman Motor cooling off the room. Have any of you attempted to replicate his results? --- http://USFamily.Net/dialup.html - $8.25/mo! -- http://www.usfamily.net/dsl.html - $19.99/mo! ---
Re: [Vo]:Climate change 'significantly worse' than feared: Al Gore
Ed Storms wrote on 1-28-08: Some problems have no solution. That is not the issue. It's the attempt to solve a problem that is important. Finding a substitute for oil, for example, may not impact the climate much but it will have many other benefits ... Jack Smith writes: It is critical that we get off oil no matter where it comes from. For Americans, this is the issue of highest national security. As the world oil glut tips the price of oil into a precipitous drop, the chance is better than 50% that Bush will attack the Iranian oil fields before November, 2008, to reduce supply, even at the risk of closing the Straits of Hormuz, which shouldn't bother Dubai that ?doesn't have oil? Jones Beene wrote on 1-28-08: BTW - to the word-phreak, Dubai is this strange little oil-poor, but asset-rich, emirate on the Gulf (both Persian and Texan, by abstraction) which is pronounced the same as its essential mandate: Do-Buy ... [Jerome] Kerviel is the so-called rogue trader (or scapegoat) who is taking the heat for the recent French banking scandal ... which is becoming a story with many far-reaching tentacles- there are whispers of Halliburton, a secret CIA-Clique (reminiscent of the Star Chamber), the Bin-Laden optiontrades, secret infiltration of the European banking system by ArAms, and it all may eventually get back to our beloved (and aptly-named) Vice President. Keep you eye on this site for upcoming salacious details: http://www.halliburtonwatch.org/ BTW an ArAm is short for ArabAmerican, which is more an earned distinction, based on avarice ... more than anything racial or ethnic. It comes from the former 'suits' of this outfit, which is now the largest corporation in the World, Exxon notwithstanding: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Aramco They (ArAms in general and Aramco in particular) actually have far more net wealth than the entire United States of America ... which recently, under the watchful anti-terrorist-eyes of the Bush Administration, has sunk to become a net-debtor nation. (no exaggeration) Jack writes: The Oil Gang is insatiable. They are like vampires who, when gorged on blood, want it more than ever. They will certainly get what they can before their boy leaves office. Jones wrote: ... Don't know if all of the above was necessary to get a grip on this- but here is an understated story from Reuters which may illustrate some of this problem of trying to determine what is real and what is abstraction, in the News of the day. HONG KONG - Incredulous equity traders said on Monday they wanted a better explanation from Societe Generale for how a single rogue trader managed to build up a $73 billion position and cause the French bank to lose $7 billion. I think most people are just astonished that someone could get away with that kind of trade for so long without being noticed, said Matt McKeith, head of equity dealing at First State Investments in Hong Kong. I'd always be slightly suspicious of the company line in these circumstances. Societe Generale said the trader, 31-year-old Jerome Kerviel, created fictitious accounts to make it look as though his positions had been covered, when in fact they remained unhedged, and falsified documents to justify his actions. Jack writes: Hi Jones. Would you please give me the url for the above Reuters story? Jones wrote: [SocGen almost immediately called for an equity infusion. Translation- a shift in ownership. No problem there, right Do-Buy?] Equity traders were foxed by the explanation, especially since the relatively lowly Kerviel appeared to make no personal profit from his gamble, and were flummoxed as to his motives. [Personal profits can be sown in Paree, and harvested in Do-Buy] BTW Kerviel, at the time of this incident, was making about one-tenth the salary of a Wall Street trader with the same responsibility; and French Banks are notorious for low bonuses. No wonder he was so easy to recruit. Bottom line for Jerry? Even after a short stint (for his health) in La Santé, Kerviel if he is not Vinced as they say, will probably have some nice 'digs' waiting for him in the world's tallest hotel ... Jack writes: The construction (?tallest hotel?) going on in Do-Buy is almost beyond belief -- talk about the Tower of Babel. Where is all this money coming from? Didn't they offer to buy out the U. S. port operations? Didn't they just pump billions into Citibank? Is there a list of this stuff somewhere? How many trillions has the Bush family (extended) made since 9-11-01? As a side note, I recently saw The Good Shepherd which, along with a lot of Skull and Bones footage, says that a founder of the CIA was blackmailed by the Russians into telling them where and when the Bay of Pigs invasion was to take place. So JFK was hit by the Mafia by mistake? (A Mafia hit is just one theory -- there is a JFK plan to tell the public about contact with aliens, a JFK withdrawal from Viet Nam, JFK issuing Treasury bills like Lincoln issued
RE: [Vo]:Climate change 'significantly worse' than feared: Al Gore
Agreed, Jed. We are, as a species, entering an age of globalized systems, and I think tackling them will require a new set of linguistic skills. The language we use in politics and policy today is still based on national models of human organization -- one might almost say, tribal. My guess is that our language has led us into the present pickle, and that only linguistic improvements -- and radial ones at that -- will enable us to resolve the problems we have created for ourselves. Cheers, Lawrence -Original Message- From: Jed Rothwell [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Monday, January 28, 2008 5:53 PM To: vortex-L@eskimo.com Subject: Re: [Vo]:Climate change 'significantly worse' than feared: Al Gore R.C.Macaulay wrote: At some point in time it becomes necessary to recognize some problems have no solution tasks and simply turn your head in a stance of inevitiability. Al Gore has profited by profiling global warming and Bono the same with Africa but neither have a solution. Africa is imploding in on itself, with any attempt to help being frustrated. Climate changes occur but any attempt to modify climate is futile. All the feeding of guilt will not solve insoluable problems. As I expect everyone here knows, telling me things like that are like waving red meat at a hungry lion. Frankly, such attitudes are anathema to the spirit of science, technology, and America -- three things I hold dear. Of course I acknowledge that people are capable of screwing things up. Of course I know that we might destroy ourselves and the ecology. Heck, we may destroy the world in an hour with thermonuclear bombs. And it goes without saying that there are some potential natural disasters we cannot cope with no matter what, such as the Sun going nova, and there may be irredeemable man-made disasters such as CO2 released from permafrost -- but there isn't yet, as far as I know. As things now stand, global warming and especially the situation in Africa are entirely our fault, and our problem, and I am certain -- beyond any doubt -- that we have the power to fix these problems. As John F. Kennedy said: Our problems are manmade - therefore, they can be solved by man. And man can be as big as he wants. No problem of human destiny is beyond human beings. Man's reason and spirit have often solved the seemingly unsolvable - and we believe they can do it again. Anyone who doubts that is betting against the tide of history. You are betting against human resilience which has survived incredible trials for millions of years as we came through the evolutionary furnace as Florman called it. And you are forgetting that we have transformed the whole face of the earth and we can do it again, and again; we have untold energy at our fingertips; the bounty of the whole solar system just outside our reach; and we are surrounded with everyday technology that people even 150 years ago would have found indistinguishable from magic. How can anyone doubt that we have the power to forestall global warming, or bring properity to the millions of people in Africa?!? Strictly in terms of material resources and physical energy, we could easily create as much wealth for all 6 billion people as only a first-world millionaire enjoys today. The only thing stopping us from doing this is widespread ignorance and the will to act. Are there food shortages? We could grow enough food for everyone on earth in an area the size of Atlanta. Is there not enough meat? In the last few years, my friends at NewHarvest.com have brought the cost of cultivated meat (meat grown in vitro) down from $100,000 to a few thousand dollars per kilogram. It is just a matter of time before meat will be as cheap as tofu, and as clean and easy to make. Do people in Africa lack capital? Look at what the Grameen Bank has accomplished. No technically educated person should claim these problems cannot be solved! There are only two difficulties: 1. Deciding which of the many solutions is most likely to work, at the lowest cost. 2. Pushing aside the ignorant naysayers and greedy fools who say we can't solve the problems and we should just give up. Here is what we must believe and act upon, right up until the last member of our species goes extinct. In October 1941, after 10 months of war, Winston Churchill said: . . . surely from this period of ten months this is the lesson: never give in, never give in, never, never, never, never -- in nothing, great or small, large or petty -- never give in except to convictions of honour and good sense. Never yield to force; never yield to the apparently overwhelming might of the enemy. Regarding our special predicament: I don't care if Albert Gore and 100 million scientists world-wide refuse to look at cold fusion, or ridicule it, or promote crazy ideas such as ethanol instead. I don't care about the apparently overwhelming might of Nature or the DoE. If we try hard enough, and we are
[Vo]:Shaugherger Vortices
Vortexians; After several hours of searching, I found this and forwarded it to my neighbor. It's pretty if nothing else, eh? What I want you to look at is on http://www.implosion-ev.de/ , it is written in German, this website, so you will have to go to http://babelfish.altavista.com/ and enter the URL in it. You will have to ignore some of the odd word combinations in the translation. On the left side of the webpage there is a link to Anwendungen click on it and you will see what looks like a copper funnel, the caption reads water activation. Click on it and you will see a structure which is set up in a lake. Water is pumped into it, the water flows through it and is activated. This activated water improves the water quality of the entire lake. Minneapolis had to close a beach last summer because of contamination. I would like to set up some of these and have the water quality tested before and after. As you can see there are lots of applications for this technology. This page has links to all of the Schauberger family's patents, again you will need Bablefish. http://implosion-ev.de/html/online-patente.html http://implosion-ev.de/html/online-patente.html You will also notice that there are many applications for this technology on the aforementioned page. http://implosion-ev.de/html/online-patente.html --- http://USFamily.Net/dialup.html - $8.25/mo! -- http://www.usfamily.net/dsl.html - $19.99/mo! ---
Re: [Vo]:Climate change 'significantly worse' than feared: Al Gore
R.C.Macaulay wrote: At some point in time it becomes necessary to recognize some problems have no solution tasks and simply turn your head in a stance of inevitiability. Al Gore has profited by profiling global warming and Bono the same with Africa but neither have a solution. Africa is imploding in on itself, with any attempt to help being frustrated. Climate changes occur but any attempt to modify climate is futile. All the feeding of guilt will not solve insoluable problems. As I expect everyone here knows, telling me things like that are like waving red meat at a hungry lion. Frankly, such attitudes are anathema to the spirit of science, technology, and America -- three things I hold dear. Of course I acknowledge that people are capable of screwing things up. Of course I know that we might destroy ourselves and the ecology. Heck, we may destroy the world in an hour with thermonuclear bombs. And it goes without saying that there are some potential natural disasters we cannot cope with no matter what, such as the Sun going nova, and there may be irredeemable man-made disasters such as CO2 released from permafrost -- but there isn't yet, as far as I know. As things now stand, global warming and especially the situation in Africa are entirely our fault, and our problem, and I am certain -- beyond any doubt -- that we have the power to fix these problems. As John F. Kennedy said: Our problems are manmade - therefore, they can be solved by man. And man can be as big as he wants. No problem of human destiny is beyond human beings. Man's reason and spirit have often solved the seemingly unsolvable - and we believe they can do it again. Anyone who doubts that is betting against the tide of history. You are betting against human resilience which has survived incredible trials for millions of years as we came through the evolutionary furnace as Florman called it. And you are forgetting that we have transformed the whole face of the earth and we can do it again, and again; we have untold energy at our fingertips; the bounty of the whole solar system just outside our reach; and we are surrounded with everyday technology that people even 150 years ago would have found indistinguishable from magic. How can anyone doubt that we have the power to forestall global warming, or bring properity to the millions of people in Africa?!? Strictly in terms of material resources and physical energy, we could easily create as much wealth for all 6 billion people as only a first-world millionaire enjoys today. The only thing stopping us from doing this is widespread ignorance and the will to act. Are there food shortages? We could grow enough food for everyone on earth in an area the size of Atlanta. Is there not enough meat? In the last few years, my friends at NewHarvest.com have brought the cost of cultivated meat (meat grown in vitro) down from $100,000 to a few thousand dollars per kilogram. It is just a matter of time before meat will be as cheap as tofu, and as clean and easy to make. Do people in Africa lack capital? Look at what the Grameen Bank has accomplished. No technically educated person should claim these problems cannot be solved! There are only two difficulties: 1. Deciding which of the many solutions is most likely to work, at the lowest cost. 2. Pushing aside the ignorant naysayers and greedy fools who say we can't solve the problems and we should just give up. Here is what we must believe and act upon, right up until the last member of our species goes extinct. In October 1941, after 10 months of war, Winston Churchill said: . . . surely from this period of ten months this is the lesson: never give in, never give in, never, never, never, never -- in nothing, great or small, large or petty -- never give in except to convictions of honour and good sense. Never yield to force; never yield to the apparently overwhelming might of the enemy. Regarding our special predicament: I don't care if Albert Gore and 100 million scientists world-wide refuse to look at cold fusion, or ridicule it, or promote crazy ideas such as ethanol instead. I don't care about the apparently overwhelming might of Nature or the DoE. If we try hard enough, and we are lucky, we WILL push this vast crowd of idiots aside. It isn't a sure thing. But I am not finished yet, and frankly I wouldn't recommend you bet against me. - Jed
[Vo]:OT: Financial Terrorism?
Apparently, even though the Bin Laden option trades went flat 6 months ago, that huge (paper) loss did not deter a planned second-chance effort to recoup the initial loss, and create havoc in the Western economies. From a Blogger: http://11amdesign.com/wordpress/?p=285 The Federal Reserve's biggest emergency interest rate cut in more than two decades is sparking debate as to why they slashed interest rates... the first cut between regularly scheduled meetings since September 2001. Possible Rationale (still trying to verify the details below): Well, following hot on the footsteps of the SocGen announcement is the newly discovered warning -- from other sources than SocGen -- that a massive level of put option contracts had been placed recently. This time it was done differently than last Fall, so as to avoid early detection, as happened 6 months ago. These options are betting that the US stock markets will crash by March 21st. Reportedly, these are not NYSE but instead NASDAQ-100 index options placed through () contracts. However, crashing the smaller exchange would likely have a domino effect on the NYSE. This seems to be, for all purposes, somewhat of a renewed continuation of the so-called 'Bin Laden' trades of last Fall. Iran may be involved this time. There are SocGen links to Iran. However, apparently the Fed/SEC is wise to this scheme, and will step in again if necessary. (we hope) This is being called attempted financial terrorism. How they got a well-known bank involved in the first place, is anyone's guess. It will be interesting to find out if Kerviel has Arab (or Iranian) contacts, or has recently converted to Islam. Currently, the March (out of the money) put contacts (100 shares each) is 645,250 and outweigh the March (in the money) call contacts by 559,343 contacts, well over half a million contract or 56 billion shares worth ... signaling a huge imbalance, which was estimated to be able to crash the NASDAQ market by 30% to 40% from it current level, unless a deep-pocket rescue effort steps-in fist. How many of these came through SocGen is not known. This may very well represent (possibly) part of an expected profit that the Kerviel conspiracy would have reaped, had not they not been caught ahead of time. The havoc that followed would be difficult to estimate. This story is far from over, and until March 21 when these put options expire, the economies of the USA and Europe are still at great risk. The good news is that if the US SEC decides to meet the risk head-on, that kind of intervention will finally bankrupt the Bin Laden family empire, and that of participating Arab enemies, who must have been partners in this kind of massively coordinated financial terrorism. Jones
RE: [Vo]:OT: Financial Terrorism?
It would be quite a mistake to assume that terrorists are likely to be Muslim, or that Muslims are likely to be terrorists. It is true that this is what many Americans believe, and that they have been urged on in this misimpression by some who wish Muslims poorly, so let us be doubly vigilant to avoid these cognitive traps. The Internet is a purveyor of much information -- and much misinformation and disinformation. Cheers, Lawrence -Original Message- From: Jones Beene [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Monday, January 28, 2008 5:32 PM To: vortex-l@eskimo.com Subject: [Vo]:OT: Financial Terrorism? Apparently, even though the Bin Laden option trades went flat 6 months ago, that huge (paper) loss did not deter a planned second-chance effort to recoup the initial loss, and create havoc in the Western economies. From a Blogger: http://11amdesign.com/wordpress/?p=285 The Federal Reserve's biggest emergency interest rate cut in more than two decades is sparking debate as to why they slashed interest rates... the first cut between regularly scheduled meetings since September 2001. Possible Rationale (still trying to verify the details below): Well, following hot on the footsteps of the SocGen announcement is the newly discovered warning -- from other sources than SocGen -- that a massive level of put option contracts had been placed recently. This time it was done differently than last Fall, so as to avoid early detection, as happened 6 months ago. These options are betting that the US stock markets will crash by March 21st. Reportedly, these are not NYSE but instead NASDAQ-100 index options placed through () contracts. However, crashing the smaller exchange would likely have a domino effect on the NYSE. This seems to be, for all purposes, somewhat of a renewed continuation of the so-called 'Bin Laden' trades of last Fall. Iran may be involved this time. There are SocGen links to Iran. However, apparently the Fed/SEC is wise to this scheme, and will step in again if necessary. (we hope) This is being called attempted financial terrorism. How they got a well-known bank involved in the first place, is anyone's guess. It will be interesting to find out if Kerviel has Arab (or Iranian) contacts, or has recently converted to Islam. Currently, the March (out of the money) put contacts (100 shares each) is 645,250 and outweigh the March (in the money) call contacts by 559,343 contacts, well over half a million contract or 56 billion shares worth ... signaling a huge imbalance, which was estimated to be able to crash the NASDAQ market by 30% to 40% from it current level, unless a deep-pocket rescue effort steps-in fist. How many of these came through SocGen is not known. This may very well represent (possibly) part of an expected profit that the Kerviel conspiracy would have reaped, had not they not been caught ahead of time. The havoc that followed would be difficult to estimate. This story is far from over, and until March 21 when these put options expire, the economies of the USA and Europe are still at great risk. The good news is that if the US SEC decides to meet the risk head-on, that kind of intervention will finally bankrupt the Bin Laden family empire, and that of participating Arab enemies, who must have been partners in this kind of massively coordinated financial terrorism. Jones
Re: [Vo]:OT: Financial Terrorism?
It will be interesting to find out if Kerviel has Arab (or Iranian) contacts, or has recently converted to Islam. Surely it is far more likely that Kerviel has Israeli contacts or has recently converted to Judaism. After all, it is to the advantage of Israel and its devoted Jewish supporters around the world, that the USA be hurt by what appears to be Arab and Iranian terrorists, thus sucking Bush into yet another war, this one against Iran. It is to the great disadvantage of Iran that it should provoke in this way an already-provoked giant. The only moral question for the Jews who are, presumably, behind this, is whether or not it is good for Israel and the Jewish people. The answer in the case of this 'economic terrorism' is obvious: it is good for them, as long as it can be blamed, however vaguely, on the Arabs and Iranians. Looking for last minute shopping deals? Find them fast with Yahoo! Search. http://tools.search.yahoo.com/newsearch/category.php?category=shopping
[Vo]:Strictly (Sickly?) OT: anti-crusading
Yes, the curse of the word-phreak has struck the International News desk, and with philosophical and numenous [sic] if not religious, intensity. Making sense of it all, as always, goes back-and-forth like a see-saw, ending (or beginning) with true identity of the enigmatic Jerome Kerviel. BTW - to the word-phreak, Dubai is this strange little oil-poor, but asset-rich, emirate on the Gulf (both Persian and Texan, by abstraction) which is pronounced the same as its essential mandate: Do-Buy. The Emir is one Sheikh Mohammed bin Rashid Al Maktoum (pronounced Mock Tomb). You can probably guess where he was educated. Kerviel is the so-called rogue trader (or scapegoat) who is taking the heat for the recent French banking scandal ... which is becoming a story with many far-reaching tentacles- there are whispers of Halliburton, a secret CIA-Clique (reminiscent of the Star Chamber), the Bin-Laden optiontrades, secret infiltration of the European banking system by ArAms, and it all may eventually get back to our beloved (and aptly-named) Vice President. Keep you eye on this site for upcoming salacious details: http://www.halliburtonwatch.org/ BTW an ArAm is short for ArabAmerican, which is more an earned distinction, based on avarice ... more than anything racial or ethnic. It comes from the former 'suits' of this outfit, which is now the largest corporation in the World, Exxon notwithstanding: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Aramco They (ArAms in general and Aramco in particular) actually have far more net wealth than the entire United States of America ... which recnetly, under the watchful anti-terrorist-eyes of the Bush Admin, has sunk to become a net-debtor nation. (no exaggeration) To continue into the numenous. Cur refers to a dog, usually of mixed ancestry shall we say. In common usage, even in the USA, the term is derogatory, but to a Muslim, for whatever reason, it is almost a worse than the common ghetto insult (which involves misdeeds performed with one's mother). We all know what a veil is. It has Islamic overtones as well. Now nomen est numen to one Brutal degree or another, and this particular pundit has always been fascinated by names that work (in the tradition of one of the great unsung American journalists - Herb Caen) http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Herb_Caen ... but more to point, is Kerviel ... hmmm... a long stretch for being fingered as the Veiled-Cur, operating for the benefit of a sinister Clique, which exists within, but apart, from elected office? A hipster lyricist named Stuart Davis, with no (obvious) mention of Halliburton (or Cheney), wrote a Dylanesque song called Asshole World Renown which expresses the growing sentiment towards the last horrific 8-years of Treason, and Corporate over-indulgent coddling... over which some warped persona (or tightly knit group) with strong Dubai ArAm connections, has been orchestrating events, for their own financial benefit. Stuart describes his musical style as 'Post-Apocalyptic Folk Punk Rock' or 'Dharma Pop'. He has not sold very many records, but there is a certain amount of warped poetry in his lyrics. FWIW he is also a member of Ken Wilber's Integral Institute. Here is a sordid sampling, which is dedicated to a certain newly relocated Do-Buy-Company Bored stiff with my wallet fat, I ordained myself a diplomat, bought a plane and some aerosol, sprayed my name on China's Wall Then I pissed all over the Kremlin steps, punched a monk in Tibet, got drunk and disordered in the ol' big Apple, passed gas in the Sistine Chapel CHORUS: Asshole World Renown Went to Rome to spread V.D., robbed the homeless in Haiti, was slapped by a woman on the great Euphrates, kidnapped kids in the slums of Haiti, Poisoned livestock in Korea, tainted food shelves in Tanzania torched Saigon like a Buddhist pyro, slashed tires in the streets of Cairo CHORUS: Asshole World Renown ...et cetera... you get the point: Poets (for one) are fed-up with this prevelanet rape-the-world M.O. of greedy crime families, like Halliburton. Kant's transcendentalism may be at work here. It searches the hidden abscesses ...err.. make that the hidden recesses, of the human mind for the a priori conditions (primal abstractions) as our best crutch for understanding bewildering daily experience (the human condition, now morphed by corporations into the inhuman condition). Old Ed Husserl (the father of phenomenology) talks about inquiry back; i.e. inquiry back into the subjective sources of meaning. Things that are called objective (for example a mathematical calculation) nevertheless ONLY have meaning because they are abstractions. These abstractions can stay unquestioned for a long time, yet they are often far from unquestionable, and often (if not most often) false, even in the case of numbers (statistics). Phenomenology is a counterpoint to numenology - the essence of things. Phenomenology, has to do with the with
Re: [Vo]:OT: Financial Terrorism?
Rhong Dhong wrote: After all, it is to the advantage of Israel and its devoted Jewish supporters around the world, that the USA be hurt by what appears to be Arab and Iranian terrorists, thus sucking Bush into yet another war, this one against Iran. Comments like this are senseless anti-Semetic garbage, and they should not be allowed here. But, anyway, for the record: No, it is DEFINITELY not to the advantage of Israel. Nothing about 9/11 or the wars in Afghanistan or Iraqi war have benefited Israel. On the contrary, they have vastly increased the danger to Israel, and made long-term peace and the survival of Israel even more in doubt than they were before. They have also increased the danger and misery faced by the Palestinians. - Jed
Re: [Vo]:OT: Financial Terrorism?
Rhong Dhong wrote: After all, it is to the advantage of Israel and its devoted Jewish supporters around the world, that the USA be hurt by what appears to be Arab and Iranian terrorists, thus sucking Bush into yet another war, this one against Iran. Comments like this are senseless anti-Semetic garbage, and they should not be allowed here. But, anyway, for the record: To me it's common sense. If it is also anti-semitic, well, that's tough, but that's how the cookie crumbles. I don't like political garbage like this, but if my comments are not allowed, then the ones I responded to should not be allowed either. No, it is DEFINITELY not to the advantage of Israel. It's hard to see how you can say that, since the US has been busy fighting wars for Israel's benefit, and has destroyed her enemy Saddam Hussein and his army. Next on the list, if the Israelis and their devoted Jewish supporters have their way, is, of course, Iran. Then, probably, it will be Syria's turn. Never miss a thing. Make Yahoo your home page. http://www.yahoo.com/r/hs
Re: [Vo]:OT: Financial Terrorism?
Lawrence, What you say is quite true. If one is Sunni, then the USA is the terrorist. It is easy to get carried away, and to waver out of precise focus on the details and semantics of this situation. That is, we must accept that 'guilt by association' is wrong, wrong, wrong ... and should never be tolerated. We cannot let ourselves associate terrorism and Islam as the general rule. In many of their eyes, we are the international terrorists. However, even though most Muslims are peace-loving, decent people, there is a most vocal and politically active segment, which vehemently hates the USA, Israel, and the West, and - let's also admit to this - they hate us for very good reason! We are the originators of this huge mess - no doubt about that. Even so, and even if our own recent actions were wrong, and historically going back in time 800 years: terribly wrong, and even if most of the injustice starts with us, we cannot simply overlook the backlash, nor fail to be prepared for the current degree of justifiable hatred coming from that part of the world, just because we generated the initial problems. There is no good solution to this problem. Worst of all -- We created the problem to start with, aggravated it with support for the State of Israel, and probably deserve some degree of punishment for that; but will never allow compensation or even an admission of guilt. Consequently the best that we can hope to do is to back-away from this region altogether, let Israel go her own way, turn our foreign policy into limited isolationisms for this region, and be vigilant. Most of all... let's not make the situation any worse than it already is (by bombing Iran); and yet to keep our own military from over-reacting as they WILL DO, we need to avoid the kind of massive payback, economic or otherwise, WHICH WE DESERVE. Did I mention: there is no good solution to this problem !?! Jones Lawrence de Bivort wrote: It would be quite a mistake to assume that terrorists are likely to be Muslim, or that Muslims are likely to be terrorists. It is true that this is what many Americans believe, and that they have been urged on in this misimpression by some who wish Muslims poorly, so let us be doubly vigilant to avoid these cognitive traps. The Internet is a purveyor of much information -- and much misinformation and disinformation. Cheers, Lawrence -Original Message- From: Jones Beene [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Monday, January 28, 2008 5:32 PM To: vortex-l@eskimo.com Subject: [Vo]:OT: Financial Terrorism? Apparently, even though the Bin Laden option trades went flat 6 months ago, that huge (paper) loss did not deter a planned second-chance effort to recoup the initial loss, and create havoc in the Western economies. From a Blogger: http://11amdesign.com/wordpress/?p=285 The Federal Reserve's biggest emergency interest rate cut in more than two decades is sparking debate as to why they slashed interest rates... the first cut between regularly scheduled meetings since September 2001. Possible Rationale (still trying to verify the details below): Well, following hot on the footsteps of the SocGen announcement is the newly discovered warning -- from other sources than SocGen -- that a massive level of put option contracts had been placed recently. This time it was done differently than last Fall, so as to avoid early detection, as happened 6 months ago. These options are betting that the US stock markets will crash by March 21st. Reportedly, these are not NYSE but instead NASDAQ-100 index options placed through () contracts. However, crashing the smaller exchange would likely have a domino effect on the NYSE. This seems to be, for all purposes, somewhat of a renewed continuation of the so-called 'Bin Laden' trades of last Fall. Iran may be involved this time. There are SocGen links to Iran. However, apparently the Fed/SEC is wise to this scheme, and will step in again if necessary. (we hope) This is being called attempted financial terrorism. How they got a well-known bank involved in the first place, is anyone's guess. It will be interesting to find out if Kerviel has Arab (or Iranian) contacts, or has recently converted to Islam. Currently, the March (out of the money) put contacts (100 shares each) is 645,250 and outweigh the March (in the money) call contacts by 559,343 contacts, well over half a million contract or 56 billion shares worth ... signaling a huge imbalance, which was estimated to be able to crash the NASDAQ market by 30% to 40% from it current level, unless a deep-pocket rescue effort steps-in fist. How many of these came through SocGen is not known. This may very well represent (possibly) part of an expected profit that the Kerviel conspiracy would have reaped, had not they not been caught ahead of time. The havoc that followed would be difficult to estimate. This story
Re: [Vo]:Climate change 'significantly worse' than feared: Al Gore
The UN security council needs to be reformed for starters. Harry On 28/1/2008 6:06 PM, Lawrence de Bivort wrote: Agreed, Jed. We are, as a species, entering an age of globalized systems, and I think tackling them will require a new set of linguistic skills. The language we use in politics and policy today is still based on national models of human organization -- one might almost say, tribal. My guess is that our language has led us into the present pickle, and that only linguistic improvements -- and radial ones at that -- will enable us to resolve the problems we have created for ourselves. Cheers, Lawrence -Original Message- From: Jed Rothwell [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Monday, January 28, 2008 5:53 PM To: vortex-L@eskimo.com Subject: Re: [Vo]:Climate change 'significantly worse' than feared: Al Gore R.C.Macaulay wrote: At some point in time it becomes necessary to recognize some problems have no solution tasks and simply turn your head in a stance of inevitiability. Al Gore has profited by profiling global warming and Bono the same with Africa but neither have a solution. Africa is imploding in on itself, with any attempt to help being frustrated. Climate changes occur but any attempt to modify climate is futile. All the feeding of guilt will not solve insoluable problems. As I expect everyone here knows, telling me things like that are like waving red meat at a hungry lion. Frankly, such attitudes are anathema to the spirit of science, technology, and America -- three things I hold dear. Of course I acknowledge that people are capable of screwing things up. Of course I know that we might destroy ourselves and the ecology. Heck, we may destroy the world in an hour with thermonuclear bombs. And it goes without saying that there are some potential natural disasters we cannot cope with no matter what, such as the Sun going nova, and there may be irredeemable man-made disasters such as CO2 released from permafrost -- but there isn't yet, as far as I know. As things now stand, global warming and especially the situation in Africa are entirely our fault, and our problem, and I am certain -- beyond any doubt -- that we have the power to fix these problems. As John F. Kennedy said: Our problems are manmade - therefore, they can be solved by man. And man can be as big as he wants. No problem of human destiny is beyond human beings. Man's reason and spirit have often solved the seemingly unsolvable - and we believe they can do it again. Anyone who doubts that is betting against the tide of history. You are betting against human resilience which has survived incredible trials for millions of years as we came through the evolutionary furnace as Florman called it. And you are forgetting that we have transformed the whole face of the earth and we can do it again, and again; we have untold energy at our fingertips; the bounty of the whole solar system just outside our reach; and we are surrounded with everyday technology that people even 150 years ago would have found indistinguishable from magic. How can anyone doubt that we have the power to forestall global warming, or bring properity to the millions of people in Africa?!? Strictly in terms of material resources and physical energy, we could easily create as much wealth for all 6 billion people as only a first-world millionaire enjoys today. The only thing stopping us from doing this is widespread ignorance and the will to act. Are there food shortages? We could grow enough food for everyone on earth in an area the size of Atlanta. Is there not enough meat? In the last few years, my friends at NewHarvest.com have brought the cost of cultivated meat (meat grown in vitro) down from $100,000 to a few thousand dollars per kilogram. It is just a matter of time before meat will be as cheap as tofu, and as clean and easy to make. Do people in Africa lack capital? Look at what the Grameen Bank has accomplished. No technically educated person should claim these problems cannot be solved! There are only two difficulties: 1. Deciding which of the many solutions is most likely to work, at the lowest cost. 2. Pushing aside the ignorant naysayers and greedy fools who say we can't solve the problems and we should just give up. Here is what we must believe and act upon, right up until the last member of our species goes extinct. In October 1941, after 10 months of war, Winston Churchill said: . . . surely from this period of ten months this is the lesson: never give in, never give in, never, never, never, never -- in nothing, great or small, large or petty -- never give in except to convictions of honour and good sense. Never yield to force; never yield to the apparently overwhelming might of the enemy. Regarding our special predicament: I don't care if Albert Gore and 100 million scientists world-wide refuse to look at cold fusion, or ridicule it, or
Re: [Vo]:Climate change 'significantly worse' than feared: Al Gore
In reply to Harry Veeder's message of Mon, 28 Jan 2008 21:31:10 -0500: Hi, [snip] The UN security council needs to be reformed for starters. Harry [snip] I agree - the right of veto should be removed altogether. Regards, Robin van Spaandonk The shrub is a plant.
RE: [Vo]:Climate change 'significantly worse' than feared: Al Gore
Interesting. How is it inadequate now? How do you think it should be reformed? Lawrence -Original Message- From: Harry Veeder [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Monday, January 28, 2008 9:31 PM To: vortex-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: [Vo]:Climate change 'significantly worse' than feared: Al Gore The UN security council needs to be reformed for starters. Harry On 28/1/2008 6:06 PM, Lawrence de Bivort wrote: Agreed, Jed. We are, as a species, entering an age of globalized systems, and I think tackling them will require a new set of linguistic skills. The language we use in politics and policy today is still based on national models of human organization -- one might almost say, tribal. My guess is that our language has led us into the present pickle, and that only linguistic improvements -- and radial ones at that -- will enable us to resolve the problems we have created for ourselves. Cheers, Lawrence -Original Message- From: Jed Rothwell [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Monday, January 28, 2008 5:53 PM To: vortex-L@eskimo.com Subject: Re: [Vo]:Climate change 'significantly worse' than feared: Al Gore R.C.Macaulay wrote: At some point in time it becomes necessary to recognize some problems have no solution tasks and simply turn your head in a stance of inevitiability. Al Gore has profited by profiling global warming and Bono the same with Africa but neither have a solution. Africa is imploding in on itself, with any attempt to help being frustrated. Climate changes occur but any attempt to modify climate is futile. All the feeding of guilt will not solve insoluable problems. As I expect everyone here knows, telling me things like that are like waving red meat at a hungry lion. Frankly, such attitudes are anathema to the spirit of science, technology, and America -- three things I hold dear. Of course I acknowledge that people are capable of screwing things up. Of course I know that we might destroy ourselves and the ecology. Heck, we may destroy the world in an hour with thermonuclear bombs. And it goes without saying that there are some potential natural disasters we cannot cope with no matter what, such as the Sun going nova, and there may be irredeemable man-made disasters such as CO2 released from permafrost -- but there isn't yet, as far as I know. As things now stand, global warming and especially the situation in Africa are entirely our fault, and our problem, and I am certain -- beyond any doubt -- that we have the power to fix these problems. As John F. Kennedy said: Our problems are manmade - therefore, they can be solved by man. And man can be as big as he wants. No problem of human destiny is beyond human beings. Man's reason and spirit have often solved the seemingly unsolvable - and we believe they can do it again. Anyone who doubts that is betting against the tide of history. You are betting against human resilience which has survived incredible trials for millions of years as we came through the evolutionary furnace as Florman called it. And you are forgetting that we have transformed the whole face of the earth and we can do it again, and again; we have untold energy at our fingertips; the bounty of the whole solar system just outside our reach; and we are surrounded with everyday technology that people even 150 years ago would have found indistinguishable from magic. How can anyone doubt that we have the power to forestall global warming, or bring properity to the millions of people in Africa?!? Strictly in terms of material resources and physical energy, we could easily create as much wealth for all 6 billion people as only a first-world millionaire enjoys today. The only thing stopping us from doing this is widespread ignorance and the will to act. Are there food shortages? We could grow enough food for everyone on earth in an area the size of Atlanta. Is there not enough meat? In the last few years, my friends at NewHarvest.com have brought the cost of cultivated meat (meat grown in vitro) down from $100,000 to a few thousand dollars per kilogram. It is just a matter of time before meat will be as cheap as tofu, and as clean and easy to make. Do people in Africa lack capital? Look at what the Grameen Bank has accomplished. No technically educated person should claim these problems cannot be solved! There are only two difficulties: 1. Deciding which of the many solutions is most likely to work, at the lowest cost. 2. Pushing aside the ignorant naysayers and greedy fools who say we can't solve the problems and we should just give up. Here is what we must believe and act upon, right up until the last member of our species goes extinct. In October 1941, after 10 months of war, Winston Churchill said: . . . surely from this period of ten months this is the lesson: never give in, never give in, never, never, never, never -- in nothing, great or small, large or petty --
Re: [Vo]:Strictly (Sickly?) OT: anti-crusading
Jones Beene wrote: with true identity of the enigmatic Jerome Kerviel. BTW Kerviel, at the time of this incident, was making about one-tenth the salary of a Wall Street trader with the same responsibility; and French Banks are notorious for low bonuses. No wonder he was so easy to recruit. Bottom line for Jerry? I guess they got the value they paid for, eh? --- http://USFamily.Net/dialup.html - $8.25/mo! -- http://www.usfamily.net/dsl.html - $19.99/mo! ---
Re: [Vo]:Climate change 'significantly worse' than feared: Al Gore
On 1/28/08, *Harry Veeder* [EMAIL PROTECTED] mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On 28/1/2008 8:28 AM, Jeff Fink wrote: I saw a science show on Saturday that said global warming will cause the sahara to get green again, and then they called that a bad thing! How can that be bad if it was once green? Let it go. Adapt! Adapt or die! ;-) Turning the Sahara into farm land sounds great to me! Now if I can just find a plan for a desalinator that is powered by the ZPE. --- http://USFamily.Net/dialup.html - $8.25/mo! -- http://www.usfamily.net/dsl.html - $19.99/mo! ---
RE: [Vo]:Climate change 'significantly worse' than feared: Al Gore
I understand there are considerable sweet water aquifers under large portions of the Sahara. Lawrence -Original Message- From: thomas malloy [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Tuesday, January 29, 2008 1:55 AM To: vortex-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: [Vo]:Climate change 'significantly worse' than feared: Al Gore On 1/28/08, *Harry Veeder* [EMAIL PROTECTED] mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On 28/1/2008 8:28 AM, Jeff Fink wrote: I saw a science show on Saturday that said global warming will cause the sahara to get green again, and then they called that a bad thing! How can that be bad if it was once green? Let it go. Adapt! Adapt or die! ;-) Turning the Sahara into farm land sounds great to me! Now if I can just find a plan for a desalinator that is powered by the ZPE. --- http://USFamily.Net/dialup.html - $8.25/mo! -- http://www.usfamily.net/dsl.html - $19.99/mo! ---
