Re: [Wicket-user] Wicket-CMS Templates

2006-10-26 Thread glanzel
Hi



I would strongly recommend a version with wicket templates.

Wouldn't it be the most important reasons for using a Wicket CMS   that you 
don't have to deal

with any scripting language but plain html ?

So I would prefer Number 2 (use Wicket templates, but create additional, CMS 
specific tags for 

'auto-include' of components.)



Greeting grischan



Perhaps we need to define the problem better...


A typical article has an author, date written, date last modified,
tags, content, summary, keywords, title, subtitle, etc.

Some people like to show everything on their blogs, so you get in a
Wicket template:

div wicket:id=article
h1 wicket:id=title[title]/h1
div wicket:id=header
span wicket:id=author/span
span wicket:id=lastModified/span
span wicket:id=published/span
/div
div wicket:id=content/div
/div

Now if someone doesn't like the author, then they would in a PHP world
just remove the declaration...

In Wicket, we have a component hierarchy where the components need to
line up. Remove a component definition form the markup, then you have
to modify the Java code as well...

How do we solve this?

1. use Wicket templates, but use blocks, which are panels. In an admin
interface you get to modify the visibility flag of the blocks on the
template. The template's hierarchy remains fixed, but you can modify
it to some extent.

2. use Wicket templates, but create additional, CMS specific tags for
'auto-include' of components.

3. drop Wicket type templates but rely on a specific templating
solution altogether, and use Wicket for the maintenance screens

Martijn


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Re: [Wicket-user] Wicket-CMS Templates

2006-10-17 Thread Martijn Dashorst
Perhaps we need to define the problem better...


A typical article has an author, date written, date last modified,
tags, content, summary, keywords, title, subtitle, etc.

Some people like to show everything on their blogs, so you get in a
Wicket template:

div wicket:id=article
h1 wicket:id=title[title]/h1
div wicket:id=header
span wicket:id=author/span
span wicket:id=lastModified/span
span wicket:id=published/span
/div
div wicket:id=content/div
/div

Now if someone doesn't like the author, then they would in a PHP world
just remove the declaration...

In Wicket, we have a component hierarchy where the components need to
line up. Remove a component definition form the markup, then you have
to modify the Java code as well...

How do we solve this?

1. use Wicket templates, but use blocks, which are panels. In an admin
interface you get to modify the visibility flag of the blocks on the
template. The template's hierarchy remains fixed, but you can modify
it to some extent.

2. use Wicket templates, but create additional, CMS specific tags for
'auto-include' of components.

3. drop Wicket type templates but rely on a specific templating
solution altogether, and use Wicket for the maintenance screens

Martijn

On 10/11/06, middledot [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

 I don't know but if you want a powerful scripting language then you should
 look at JRuby.
 If however you are concerned about users, then you could do it entiry using
 JavaScript. In fact that might open the door for a numer of widgets already
 in the public domain, yui being one of them.
 Les


 Matej Knopp wrote:
 
  The part where wicket would really shine is the part of application
  where you manage content, etc. For the part where you show the content,
  I'd consider multiple approaches.
 
  You definitely need different templating engine (like freemarker), or
  maybe some scripting language. I'm not sure that using just wicket to do
  this part would be best approach, since it would limit the usability for
  users not familiar with wicket.
 
  -Matej
 
  Ted Roeloffzen wrote:
  The reason that Joomla and Drupal are so popular is that it is
  relatively easy to make custom templates and modules. But when we use
  Wicket and Velocity, it becomes a little too difficult for a normal
  user. Someone who has little or no programming experience.
 
  Then there is another problem. Wicket is very strickt about what it
  shows on the page. If something is in the HTML and not in the Code, and
  vice versa, it doesn't work. How could we solve this problem?
 
  greets
 
  Ted
 
  On 10/11/06, *Eelco Hillenius* [EMAIL PROTECTED]
  mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
 
  Yep. Look at the wicket-velocity-contrib and wicket-contrib-examples
  in wicket-stuff.
 
  Eelco
 
 
  On 10/10/06, Ted Roeloffzen [EMAIL PROTECTED]
  mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
We've never used that. Are there any examples available when
  using it with
Wicket?
   
   
   
On 10/10/06, Nick Heudecker [EMAIL PROTECTED]
  mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
 What about using Velocity templates for markup?



 On 10/10/06, Gwyn Evans [EMAIL PROTECTED]
  mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]  wrote:
  My inclination would be to do as much as you can via CSS, but
  if you
  need to add scripting, I'd (a) go with Jython  (b) make a
  major
  effort on examples  documentation!
 
  /Gwyn
 
  On 10/10/06, Ted Roeloffzen [EMAIL PROTECTED]
  mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]  wrote:
   hello all,
  
   Some of you may know that we're working on a Wicket-CMS as
  our grad
project.
   We've been thinking about the use of templates. About how
  we are going
to
   let people create their own templates. As we saw in Drupal
  and Joomla,
there
   templates are full of PHP-code. If we're going to do the
  same with
Java
   code, that means that we force the users the learn Java and
  perhaps
even
   Wicket. This is not very user friendly. We could use only
  CSS-files
and
   generate the HTML-page and put all the data in DIV's and
  SPANs. Do any
of
   you have ideas on how to make the templates as user-friendly
  as
possible?
  
   greets,
  
   Ted
 
 
  --
  Download Wicket 1.2.2 now! - http://wicketframework.org
 
 
   
 
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Re: [Wicket-user] Wicket-CMS Templates

2006-10-11 Thread Ted Roeloffzen
The reason that Joomla and Drupal are so popular is that it is relatively easy to make custom templates and modules. But when we use Wicket and Velocity, it becomes a little too difficult for a normal user. Someone who has little or no programming experience. 
Then there is another problem. Wicket is very strickt about what it shows on the page. If something is in the HTML and not in the Code, and vice versa, it doesn't work. How could we solve this problem?greets
TedOn 10/11/06, Eelco Hillenius [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
Yep. Look at the wicket-velocity-contrib and wicket-contrib-examplesin wicket-stuff.EelcoOn 10/10/06, Ted Roeloffzen [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
 We've never used that. Are there any examples available when using it with Wicket? On 10/10/06, Nick Heudecker [EMAIL PROTECTED]
 wrote:  What about using Velocity templates for markup? On 10/10/06, Gwyn Evans [EMAIL PROTECTED]  wrote:
   My inclination would be to do as much as you can via CSS, but if you   need to add scripting, I'd (a) go with Jython  (b) make a major   effort on examples  documentation!
 /Gwyn On 10/10/06, Ted Roeloffzen [EMAIL PROTECTED]  wrote:hello all,
   Some of you may know that we're working on a Wicket-CMS as our grad project.We've been thinking about the use of templates. About how we are going
 tolet people create their own templates. As we saw in Drupal and Joomla, theretemplates are full of PHP-code. If we're going to do the same with Java
code, that means that we force the users the learn Java and perhaps evenWicket. This is not very user friendly. We could use only CSS-files andgenerate the HTML-page and put all the data in DIV's and SPANs. Do any
 ofyou have ideas on how to make the templates as user-friendly as possible?   greets,   Ted
   --   Download Wicket 1.2.2 now! - http://wicketframework.org -
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Re: [Wicket-user] Wicket-CMS Templates

2006-10-11 Thread Matej Knopp
The part where wicket would really shine is the part of application 
where you manage content, etc. For the part where you show the content, 
I'd consider multiple approaches.

You definitely need different templating engine (like freemarker), or 
maybe some scripting language. I'm not sure that using just wicket to do 
this part would be best approach, since it would limit the usability for 
users not familiar with wicket.

-Matej

Ted Roeloffzen wrote:
 The reason that Joomla and Drupal are so popular is that it is 
 relatively easy to make custom templates and modules. But when we use 
 Wicket and Velocity, it becomes a little too difficult for a normal 
 user. Someone who has little or no programming experience.
 
 Then there is another problem. Wicket is very strickt about what it 
 shows on the page. If something is in the HTML and not in the Code, and 
 vice versa, it doesn't work. How could we solve this problem?
 
 greets
 
 Ted
 
 On 10/11/06, *Eelco Hillenius* [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
 mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
 
 Yep. Look at the wicket-velocity-contrib and wicket-contrib-examples
 in wicket-stuff.
 
 Eelco
 
 
 On 10/10/06, Ted Roeloffzen [EMAIL PROTECTED]
 mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
   We've never used that. Are there any examples available when
 using it with
   Wicket?
  
  
  
   On 10/10/06, Nick Heudecker [EMAIL PROTECTED]
 mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
What about using Velocity templates for markup?
   
   
   
On 10/10/06, Gwyn Evans [EMAIL PROTECTED]
 mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]  wrote:
 My inclination would be to do as much as you can via CSS, but
 if you
 need to add scripting, I'd (a) go with Jython  (b) make a major
 effort on examples  documentation!

 /Gwyn

 On 10/10/06, Ted Roeloffzen [EMAIL PROTECTED]
 mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]  wrote:
  hello all,
 
  Some of you may know that we're working on a Wicket-CMS as
 our grad
   project.
  We've been thinking about the use of templates. About how
 we are going
   to
  let people create their own templates. As we saw in Drupal
 and Joomla,
   there
  templates are full of PHP-code. If we're going to do the
 same with
   Java
  code, that means that we force the users the learn Java and
 perhaps
   even
  Wicket. This is not very user friendly. We could use only
 CSS-files
   and
  generate the HTML-page and put all the data in DIV's and
 SPANs. Do any
   of
  you have ideas on how to make the templates as user-friendly as
   possible?
 
  greets,
 
  Ted


 --
 Download Wicket 1.2.2 now! - http://wicketframework.org


  
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Re: [Wicket-user] Wicket-CMS Templates

2006-10-11 Thread middledot

I don't know but if you want a powerful scripting language then you should
look at JRuby.
If however you are concerned about users, then you could do it entiry using
JavaScript. In fact that might open the door for a numer of widgets already
in the public domain, yui being one of them.
Les


Matej Knopp wrote:
 
 The part where wicket would really shine is the part of application 
 where you manage content, etc. For the part where you show the content, 
 I'd consider multiple approaches.
 
 You definitely need different templating engine (like freemarker), or 
 maybe some scripting language. I'm not sure that using just wicket to do 
 this part would be best approach, since it would limit the usability for 
 users not familiar with wicket.
 
 -Matej
 
 Ted Roeloffzen wrote:
 The reason that Joomla and Drupal are so popular is that it is 
 relatively easy to make custom templates and modules. But when we use 
 Wicket and Velocity, it becomes a little too difficult for a normal 
 user. Someone who has little or no programming experience.
 
 Then there is another problem. Wicket is very strickt about what it 
 shows on the page. If something is in the HTML and not in the Code, and 
 vice versa, it doesn't work. How could we solve this problem?
 
 greets
 
 Ted
 
 On 10/11/06, *Eelco Hillenius* [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
 mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
 
 Yep. Look at the wicket-velocity-contrib and wicket-contrib-examples
 in wicket-stuff.
 
 Eelco
 
 
 On 10/10/06, Ted Roeloffzen [EMAIL PROTECTED]
 mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
   We've never used that. Are there any examples available when
 using it with
   Wicket?
  
  
  
   On 10/10/06, Nick Heudecker [EMAIL PROTECTED]
 mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
What about using Velocity templates for markup?
   
   
   
On 10/10/06, Gwyn Evans [EMAIL PROTECTED]
 mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]  wrote:
 My inclination would be to do as much as you can via CSS, but
 if you
 need to add scripting, I'd (a) go with Jython  (b) make a
 major
 effort on examples  documentation!

 /Gwyn

 On 10/10/06, Ted Roeloffzen [EMAIL PROTECTED]
 mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]  wrote:
  hello all,
 
  Some of you may know that we're working on a Wicket-CMS as
 our grad
   project.
  We've been thinking about the use of templates. About how
 we are going
   to
  let people create their own templates. As we saw in Drupal
 and Joomla,
   there
  templates are full of PHP-code. If we're going to do the
 same with
   Java
  code, that means that we force the users the learn Java and
 perhaps
   even
  Wicket. This is not very user friendly. We could use only
 CSS-files
   and
  generate the HTML-page and put all the data in DIV's and
 SPANs. Do any
   of
  you have ideas on how to make the templates as user-friendly
 as
   possible?
 
  greets,
 
  Ted


 --
 Download Wicket 1.2.2 now! - http://wicketframework.org


  

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Re: [Wicket-user] Wicket-CMS Templates

2006-10-11 Thread Ted Roeloffzen
But how could you establish a connection between the _javascript_ and the java code from the CMS?On 10/11/06, middledot 
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:I don't know but if you want a powerful scripting language then you should
look at JRuby.If however you are concerned about users, then you could do it entiry using_javascript_. In fact that might open the door for a numer of widgets alreadyin the public domain, yui being one of them.
LesMatej Knopp wrote: The part where wicket would really shine is the part of application where you manage content, etc. For the part where you show the content, I'd consider multiple approaches.
 You definitely need different templating engine (like freemarker), or maybe some scripting language. I'm not sure that using just wicket to do this part would be best approach, since it would limit the usability for
 users not familiar with wicket. -Matej Ted Roeloffzen wrote: The reason that Joomla and Drupal are so popular is that it is relatively easy to make custom templates and modules. But when we use
 Wicket and Velocity, it becomes a little too difficult for a normal user. Someone who has little or no programming experience. Then there is another problem. Wicket is very strickt about what it
 shows on the page. If something is in the HTML and not in the Code, and vice versa, it doesn't work. How could we solve this problem? greets Ted
 On 10/11/06, *Eelco Hillenius* [EMAIL PROTECTED] mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
 wrote: Yep. Look at the wicket-velocity-contrib and wicket-contrib-examples in wicket-stuff. Eelco On 10/10/06, Ted Roeloffzen 
[EMAIL PROTECTED] mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: We've never used that. Are there any examples available when
 using it with Wicket? On 10/10/06, Nick Heudecker [EMAIL PROTECTED]
 mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:  What about using Velocity templates for markup?  
   On 10/10/06, Gwyn Evans [EMAIL PROTECTED] mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
  wrote:   My inclination would be to do as much as you can via CSS, but if you   need to add scripting, I'd (a) go with Jython  (b) make a
 major   effort on examples  documentation! /Gwyn On 10/10/06, Ted Roeloffzen 
[EMAIL PROTECTED] mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]  wrote:hello all,
   Some of you may know that we're working on a Wicket-CMS as our grad project.We've been thinking about the use of templates. About how
 we are going tolet people create their own templates. As we saw in Drupal and Joomla, theretemplates are full of PHP-code. If we're going to do the
 same with Javacode, that means that we force the users the learn Java and perhaps evenWicket. This is not very user friendly. We could use only
 CSS-files andgenerate the HTML-page and put all the data in DIV's and SPANs. Do any ofyou have ideas on how to make the templates as user-friendly
 as possible?   greets,   Ted  
 --   Download Wicket 1.2.2 now! - http://wicketframework.org  
   -   Take Surveys. Earn Cash. Influence the Future of IT
   Join SourceForge.net's Techsay panel and you'll get the chance to share your   opinions on IT  business topics through brief surveys -- and
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Re: [Wicket-user] Wicket-CMS Templates

2006-10-11 Thread Eelco Hillenius
On 10/11/06, Ted Roeloffzen [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
 But how could you establish a connection between the javascript and the java
 code from the CMS?

That's the stuff you'll be learning! :)

Rhino, JRuby, Jython, etc, all have excellent Java integration. By the
time you get there, you'll figure it out. The thing I like about
Velocity or Freemarker, as that those give you a very limited - and
limited is good here - language for doing some basic text manipulation
as accessing variables. If you use e.g. JRuby, things can get pretty
wild, and you might open up too much of your machine for possible
misuse. Btw, of the Java script languages I know, PNuts
(https://pnuts.dev.java.net/) is by far my favorite. Not a whole lot
of documentation etc, but I thought the code was set up nice and clear
so armed with a debugger etc, you can get pretty far.

Eelco

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[Wicket-user] Wicket-CMS Templates

2006-10-10 Thread Ted Roeloffzen
hello all,Some of you may know that we're working on a Wicket-CMS as our grad project. We've been thinking about the use of templates. About how we are going to let people create their own templates. As we saw in Drupal and Joomla, there templates are full of PHP-code. If we're going to do the same with Java code, that means that we force the users the learn Java and perhaps even Wicket. This is not very user friendly. We could use only CSS-files and generate the HTML-page and put all the data in DIV's and SPANs. Do any of you have ideas on how to make the templates as user-friendly as possible? 
greets,Ted
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Re: [Wicket-user] Wicket-CMS Templates

2006-10-10 Thread Gwyn Evans
My inclination would be to do as much as you can via CSS, but if you
need to add scripting, I'd (a) go with Jython  (b) make a major
effort on examples  documentation!

/Gwyn

On 10/10/06, Ted Roeloffzen [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
 hello all,

 Some of you may know that we're working on a Wicket-CMS as our grad project.
 We've been thinking about the use of templates. About how we are going to
 let people create their own templates. As we saw in Drupal and Joomla, there
 templates are full of PHP-code. If we're going to do the same with Java
 code, that means that we force the users the learn Java and perhaps even
 Wicket. This is not very user friendly. We could use only CSS-files and
 generate the HTML-page and put all the data in DIV's and SPANs. Do any of
 you have ideas on how to make the templates as user-friendly as possible?

 greets,

 Ted


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Re: [Wicket-user] Wicket-CMS Templates

2006-10-10 Thread Nick Heudecker
What about using Velocity templates for markup?On 10/10/06, Gwyn Evans [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
My inclination would be to do as much as you can via CSS, but if youneed to add scripting, I'd (a) go with Jython  (b) make a major
effort on examples  documentation!/GwynOn 10/10/06, Ted Roeloffzen [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: hello all, Some of you may know that we're working on a Wicket-CMS as our grad project.
 We've been thinking about the use of templates. About how we are going to let people create their own templates. As we saw in Drupal and Joomla, there templates are full of PHP-code. If we're going to do the same with Java
 code, that means that we force the users the learn Java and perhaps even Wicket. This is not very user friendly. We could use only CSS-files and generate the HTML-page and put all the data in DIV's and SPANs. Do any of
 you have ideas on how to make the templates as user-friendly as possible? greets, Ted--Download Wicket 1.2.2 now! - http://wicketframework.org
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Re: [Wicket-user] Wicket-CMS Templates

2006-10-10 Thread Ted Roeloffzen
We've never used that. Are there any examples available when using it with Wicket?
On 10/10/06, Nick Heudecker [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
What about using Velocity templates for markup? 

On 10/10/06, Gwyn Evans [EMAIL PROTECTED]
 wrote: 
My inclination would be to do as much as you can via CSS, but if youneed to add scripting, I'd (a) go with Jython  (b) make a major 
effort on examples  documentation!/GwynOn 10/10/06, Ted Roeloffzen [EMAIL PROTECTED]
 wrote: hello all, Some of you may know that we're working on a Wicket-CMS as our grad project.  We've been thinking about the use of templates. About how we are going to let people create their own templates. As we saw in Drupal and Joomla, there
 templates are full of PHP-code. If we're going to do the same with Java  code, that means that we force the users the learn Java and perhaps even Wicket. This is not very user friendly. We could use only CSS-files and
 generate the HTML-page and put all the data in DIV's and SPANs. Do any of  you have ideas on how to make the templates as user-friendly as possible? greets, Ted
--Download Wicket 1.2.2 now! - http://wicketframework.org -
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Re: [Wicket-user] Wicket-CMS Templates

2006-10-10 Thread Eelco Hillenius
Yep. Look at the wicket-velocity-contrib and wicket-contrib-examples
in wicket-stuff.

Eelco


On 10/10/06, Ted Roeloffzen [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
 We've never used that. Are there any examples available when using it with
 Wicket?



 On 10/10/06, Nick Heudecker [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
  What about using Velocity templates for markup?
 
 
 
  On 10/10/06, Gwyn Evans [EMAIL PROTECTED]  wrote:
   My inclination would be to do as much as you can via CSS, but if you
   need to add scripting, I'd (a) go with Jython  (b) make a major
   effort on examples  documentation!
  
   /Gwyn
  
   On 10/10/06, Ted Roeloffzen [EMAIL PROTECTED]  wrote:
hello all,
   
Some of you may know that we're working on a Wicket-CMS as our grad
 project.
We've been thinking about the use of templates. About how we are going
 to
let people create their own templates. As we saw in Drupal and Joomla,
 there
templates are full of PHP-code. If we're going to do the same with
 Java
code, that means that we force the users the learn Java and perhaps
 even
Wicket. This is not very user friendly. We could use only CSS-files
 and
generate the HTML-page and put all the data in DIV's and SPANs. Do any
 of
you have ideas on how to make the templates as user-friendly as
 possible?
   
greets,
   
Ted
  
  
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