[Wikidata-bugs] [Maniphest] [Commented On] T112987: Separating infoboxes and navboxes from article content

[Aklapper]

Aklapper added a comment.
There was some discussion at the DevSummit in Jan 2016 (see above). Afterwards this task went dormant.

T112987#1915536 offered potential action items; T112987#1915536 are the DevSummit Etherpad notes and also lists potential action items.

@cscott: Is there general consensus on those action items? (T112987#1661396 implied that scope is unclear.  T112987#1795019 stated this needs more research.) Who could break them down into subtasks? (I don't see any "blocked by"/subtasks in this task.)TASK DETAILhttps://phabricator.wikimedia.org/T112987EMAIL PREFERENCEShttps://phabricator.wikimedia.org/settings/panel/emailpreferences/To: cscott, AklapperCc: Trizek-WMF, Edgars2007, JEumerus, jmadler, Lokal_Profil, Bianjiang, Jdlrobson, GWicke, Liuxinyu970226, tarlocesilion, Candalua, Izno, Susannaanas, StudiesWorld, Jdforrester-WMF, Isarra, Qgil, MrStradivarius, hoo, daniel, JanZerebecki, Tgr, Jay8g, ssastry, RobLa, violetto, Amire80, Deskana, Wwes, Lydia_Pintscher, RobLa-WMF, brion, cscott, Aklapper, D3r1ck01, Wikidata-bugs, aude, Ricordisamoa, Mbch331, Krenair___
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[Wikidata-bugs] [Maniphest] [Commented On] T112987: Separating infoboxes and navboxes from article content

[Aklapper]

Aklapper added a comment.

IMPORTANT: **If you are a community developer interested in working on this 
task:** The Wikimedia Hackathon 2016 
 (Jerusalem, March 31 
- April 3) focuses on 
https://phabricator.wikimedia.org/tag/community-wishlist-survey/ projects. 
There is some budget for sponsoring volunteer developers. THE DEADLINE TO 
REQUEST TRAVEL SPONSORSHIP IS TODAY, JANUARY 21. Exceptions can be made for 
developers focusing on Community Wishlist projects until the end of Sunday 24, 
but not beyond. If you or someone you know is interested, please REGISTER NOW 
.


TASK DETAIL
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To: cscott, Aklapper
Cc: JEumerus, jmadler, Lokal_Profil, Bianjiang, Jdlrobson, GWicke, 
Liuxinyu970226, tarlocesilion, Candalua, Izno, Susannaanas, StudiesWorld, 
Jdforrester-WMF, Isarra, Qgil, MrStradivarius, hoo, daniel, JanZerebecki, Tgr, 
Jay8g, ssastry, RobLa, violetto, Amire80, Deskana, Wwes, Lydia_Pintscher, 
RobLa-WMF, brion, cscott, Aklapper, Wikidata-bugs, aude, Ricordisamoa, Mbch331, 
Krenair



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[Wikidata-bugs] [Maniphest] [Commented On] T112987: Separating infoboxes and navboxes from article content

[cscott]

cscott added a comment.

@hoo's slides: F3203393: Magic Infoboxes.pdf 



TASK DETAIL
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To: cscott
Cc: jmadler, Lokal_Profil, Bianjiang, Jdlrobson, GWicke, Liuxinyu970226, 
tarlocesilion, Candalua, Izno, Susannaanas, StudiesWorld, Jdforrester-WMF, 
Isarra, Qgil, MrStradivarius, hoo, daniel, JanZerebecki, Tgr, Jay8g, ssastry, 
RobLa, violetto, Amire80, Deskana, Wwes, Lydia_Pintscher, RobLa-WMF, brion, 
cscott, Aklapper, Wikidata-bugs, aude, Ricordisamoa, Mbch331, Krenair



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[Wikidata-bugs] [Maniphest] [Commented On] T112987: Separating infoboxes and navboxes from article content

[Amire80]

Amire80 added a comment.

Etherpad of the discussion at MWDS 2016: 
https://etherpad.wikimedia.org/p/WikiDev16-T112987

Copy:

  Session name: Separating infoboxes and navboxes from article content
  Meeting goal: "unified plan for the future of infoboxes and navboxes (overly 
optimistic)"
  Meeting style: Scope Narrowing
  Phabricator task link: https://phabricator.wikimedia.org/T112987
  
  Topics for discussion:
  * Should infoboxes be stored inline, or separately from the wikitext? 
(See also Multi-Content revisions RFC)
  * Daniel: migrating already existing infoboxes problematic
  * Implementation other's than hoo's
  
  General notes
  Everybody knows navboxes and infoboxes. Used and abused.
  There are several technical solutions, e.g. Wikia and WMF's Mobile apps. Hoo 
has another plan.
  
  Wikia: New markup, xml-based.
  Mobile: They turned it off because it was too easy to edit them.
  Gabriel: "content widgets", syntax for direc queries from Wikidata
  
  
  C. Scott's suggestion: 
  
  
  Marius (hoo) - "Magic infoboxes" implemention:
  
  capiunto - small extension for Scribunto that helps make creating / 
formatting infoboxes easier (as they exist now)
  decouple infoboxes from page content:
  
  * separate schema definition
  
  * separate data defintion (can be local and/or from wikidata)
  
  * lua modules for formatting (e.g. capiunto)
  
  CScott: this (consistent formatting) makes scraping easier
  
  Daniel: parameters still would be wikitext
  
  Trevor: note templates containing subtemplates or runs of multiple templates 
which open/continue/close a single transclusion
  JamesF: E.g. 
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Template:Infobox_ship_begin#Special_capabilities 
(contains 4 subtemplates including the flags)
  marktraceur (EPL comment): I think ^ would present more problems than just 
the subtemplates, based on it being a "begin" template, and therefore probably 
an unbalanced DOM fragment
  quiddity (EPL comment): or 
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Template:Infobox_currency which uses {{native 
name}}, {{flag}}, and {{url}}.
  
  DJ: how to handle converting units (e.g.)?
  
  Daniel: there would be formatter for dates, units, etc. and lua can be used 
to help deal with specific types of information (e.g. timezones)
  
  CScott: have toolbox in lua for most stuff
  
  Trevor: Why even use DOM?
  
  CScott: Because I haven't finished [..?..] yet.
  
  Jiang (etherpad): many infobox are not as simple as key-value, e.g.:
  https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Michael_Jordan
  https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Carl_Lewis
  
  
  TheDJ: infoboxes don't just contain simple key-value pairs. E.g.
  
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Monterrey_Institute_of_Technology_and_Higher_Education
 
  https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/McKail,_Western_Australia (a list of suburbs 
around a town)
  
  Tim: Module:Infobox is used on 2.5 million pages in en.wikipedia
  
  CScott - topics to discuss:
  
  * any implementation other than hoo's?
  
  * migration issue
  
  
  not all data / properties are represneted on wikidata, but there still is 
option of having local data for such cases
  
  Use the ~100 colors in WikiData? 
http://tools.wmflabs.org/wikidata-todo/tree.html?q=1075&rp=279&method=list
  
  CScott: One goal is to make data easier to read for machines, but another 
important goal is to make the data more accessible to humans, in particular in 
"small" wikis.
  
  TheDJ: Could we do it similarly to Commons metadata migration?
  
  Potential action items
  
  * "Dumb" migration, like commons metadata
  
  * Migration toolkit
  
  * Survey/classification of existing templates (survey quality and 
distribution)
  
  2.5 million + infoboxes, but how many *types* of infoboxes
  
  * https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:List_of_infoboxes 


TASK DETAIL
  https://phabricator.wikimedia.org/T112987

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To: cscott, Amire80
Cc: jmadler, Lokal_Profil, Bianjiang, Jdlrobson, GWicke, Liuxinyu970226, 
tarlocesilion, Candalua, Izno, Susannaanas, StudiesWorld, Jdforrester-WMF, 
Isarra, Qgil, MrStradivarius, hoo, daniel, JanZerebecki, Tgr, Jay8g, ssastry, 
RobLa, violetto, Amire80, Deskana, Wwes, Lydia_Pintscher, RobLa-WMF, brion, 
cscott, Aklapper, Wikidata-bugs, aude, Ricordisamoa, Mbch331, Krenair



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[Wikidata-bugs] [Maniphest] [Commented On] T112987: Separating infoboxes and navboxes from article content

[cscott]

cscott added a comment.

I put together a few slides for an overview at the start of the session: 
https://docs.google.com/presentation/d/1pFUIoC0rQioUBYEs5DQPVJvi9WdCXFEUebUdlo1v0RE/edit?usp=sharing
Hopefully @hoo can describe his stuff at the end, and maybe if @daniel is 
present he can say a few words about how T107595: [RFC] Multi-Content Revisions 
 might be relevant.


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To: cscott
Cc: Jdlrobson, GWicke, Liuxinyu970226, tarlocesilion, Candalua, Izno, 
Susannaanas, StudiesWorld, Jdforrester-WMF, Isarra, Qgil, MrStradivarius, hoo, 
daniel, JanZerebecki, Tgr, Jay8g, ssastry, RobLa, violetto, Amire80, Deskana, 
Wwes, Lydia_Pintscher, RobLa-WMF, brion, cscott, Aklapper, Wikidata-bugs, aude, 
Ricordisamoa, Mbch331, Krenair



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[Wikidata-bugs] [Maniphest] [Commented On] T112987: Separating infoboxes and navboxes from article content

[hoo]

hoo added a comment.

In https://phabricator.wikimedia.org/T112987#1911789, @cscott wrote:

> @hoo do you think you could pull together 2-5 slides for a "lightning talk" 
> on your work?  Maybe pull from your [Wikimedia talk 
> https://wikimania2015.wikimedia.org/wiki/Submissions/Making_Infoboxes_easier_to_edit_and_maintain_with_the_help_of_Wikidata]
>  and from T114251: [RFC] Magic Infobox implementation 
> .  Not a whole wikimania-length 
> talk, just enough to outline your basic approach and get the conversation 
> started.


Will do.


TASK DETAIL
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To: cscott, hoo
Cc: Jdlrobson, GWicke, Liuxinyu970226, tarlocesilion, Candalua, Izno, 
Susannaanas, StudiesWorld, Jdforrester-WMF, Isarra, Qgil, MrStradivarius, hoo, 
daniel, JanZerebecki, Tgr, Jay8g, ssastry, RobLa, violetto, Amire80, Deskana, 
Wwes, Lydia_Pintscher, RobLa-WMF, brion, cscott, Aklapper, Wikidata-bugs, aude, 
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[Wikidata-bugs] [Maniphest] [Commented On] T112987: Separating infoboxes and navboxes from article content

[cscott]

cscott added a comment.

So one of my goals here is cross-fertilization.  We've got a bunch of folks who 
have worked on various flavors of "better infobox".  I'd like to make sure we 
get a chance to talk shop and say what we liked/didn't liked about our various 
approaches, and see if we can't come up with a better mousetrap (or agree that 
someone's particular mousetrap is already the best).

@RobLa-WMF suggests that this is important from the perspective of the "Next 
Generation Content Loading and Routing" track as well, since we're proposing to 
decouple infoboxes from article content in various ways.


TASK DETAIL
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To: cscott
Cc: GWicke, Liuxinyu970226, tarlocesilion, Candalua, Izno, Susannaanas, 
StudiesWorld, Jdforrester-WMF, Isarra, Qgil, MrStradivarius, hoo, daniel, 
JanZerebecki, Tgr, Jay8g, ssastry, RobLa, violetto, Amire80, Deskana, Wwes, 
Lydia_Pintscher, RobLa-WMF, brion, cscott, Aklapper, Wikidata-bugs, aude, 
Ricordisamoa, Mbch331, Krenair



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[Wikidata-bugs] [Maniphest] [Commented On] T112987: Separating infoboxes and navboxes from article content

[hoo]

hoo added a comment.

In https://phabricator.wikimedia.org/T112987#1911739, @cscott wrote:

> @hoo Are you attending the summit?  Can you talk a little bit about 
> https://phabricator.wikimedia.org/T114251?


I planned to, but due to various communication problems that never went 
anywhere, so I pulled it out of the summit at some point.

I guess the RfC is going to go through the normal process then or maybe at the 
Hackathon or during Wikimania or something like that. Although I don't really 
know how much I will be able to work on that next year (from WMDE), I still 
hope to be able to work on that within 2016.


TASK DETAIL
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To: cscott, hoo
Cc: GWicke, Liuxinyu970226, tarlocesilion, Candalua, Izno, Susannaanas, 
StudiesWorld, Jdforrester-WMF, Isarra, Qgil, MrStradivarius, hoo, daniel, 
JanZerebecki, Tgr, Jay8g, ssastry, RobLa, violetto, Amire80, Deskana, Wwes, 
Lydia_Pintscher, RobLa-WMF, brion, cscott, Aklapper, Wikidata-bugs, aude, 
Ricordisamoa, Mbch331, Krenair



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[Wikidata-bugs] [Maniphest] [Commented On] T112987: Separating infoboxes and navboxes from article content

[RobLa-WMF]

RobLa-WMF added a comment.

@cscott, thanks for pinging me, and yes, your proposal to introduce and then 
open it up sounds perfect, thanks!  Think "lightning talk" for your intro.  5 
minutes is ideal, 10 minutes for something more complicated, everyone has a 
right to be annoyed if you take 15 minutes, and we cut off your microphone at 
20 minutes.  :-)  That make sense?


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To: cscott, RobLa-WMF
Cc: Liuxinyu970226, tarlocesilion, Candalua, Izno, Susannaanas, StudiesWorld, 
Jdforrester-WMF, Isarra, Qgil, MrStradivarius, hoo, daniel, JanZerebecki, Tgr, 
Jay8g, ssastry, RobLa, violetto, Amire80, Deskana, Wwes, Lydia_Pintscher, 
RobLa-WMF, brion, cscott, Aklapper, Wikidata-bugs, aude, Ricordisamoa, Mbch331, 
Krenair



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[Wikidata-bugs] [Maniphest] [Commented On] T112987: Separating infoboxes and navboxes from article content

[cscott]

cscott added a comment.

Hey, @RobLa-WMF -- I noticed this is scheduled for an 80 minute slot starting 
11:30AM on the first day of the summit -- opposite an open slot in the larger 
Robertson 1.  What's the expected format of this session?  Should I start by 
presenting an overview of the various options to set the stage?


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To: cscott
Cc: Liuxinyu970226, tarlocesilion, Candalua, Izno, Susannaanas, StudiesWorld, 
Jdforrester-WMF, Isarra, Qgil, MrStradivarius, hoo, daniel, JanZerebecki, Tgr, 
Jay8g, ssastry, RobLa, violetto, Amire80, Deskana, Wwes, Lydia_Pintscher, 
RobLa-WMF, brion, cscott, Aklapper, Wikidata-bugs, aude, Ricordisamoa, Mbch331, 
Krenair



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