Re: [WikiEN-l] Microsoft kills Encarta
Britannica in its various incarnations and Encarta were excellent and useful reference works. Britannica remains useful. Encarta I think could have remained useful also. I really regret that we had a role in killing it. Why should we be pleased? The commercial organizations need to compete. We do not. The more encyclopedias the better. David Goodman, Ph.D, M.L.S. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User_talk:DGG On Mon, Mar 30, 2009 at 11:51 PM, Jussi-Ville Heiskanen wrote: > David Gerard wrote: >> [spotted by Mathias Schindler] >> >> >> http://encarta.msn.com/guide_page_FAQ/FAQ.html >> >> Important Notice: MSN Encarta to be Discontinued >> On October 31, 2009, MSN® Encarta® Web sites worldwide will be >> discontinued, with the exception of Encarta Japan, which will be >> discontinued on December 31, 2009. Additionally, Microsoft will cease >> to sell Microsoft Student and Encarta Premium software products >> worldwide by June 2009. We understand that Encarta users may have >> questions regarding this announcement so we have prepared this list of >> questions and answers below. Please keep reading if you would like >> more information about these changes to Encarta. >> >> >> - d. >> > > I think this casts a new interesting perspective on > the decision by Microsoft to buy out powerset.com. > > I will be watching with interest, how they will develop > that product, and whether they intend to incorporate > it more extensively into their other product offerings. > > I have to admit I was skeptical initially when I heard > powerset.com would be "gobbled up". But should it > turn out that Microsoft were to really seriously put > effort into powerset.com, any relief Encyclopaedia > Britannica may have gained from the reduction of > competition for number two spot, may prove a little > short lived. That is unless of course Microsoft/Powerset > make some kind of deal with EB that they can use > powersets semantic search engine on also EB > product. > > Of course it is possible that MS have made the > judgment that the whole sector is not good for > them, but actually I would prefer to be hopeful > that this means they would give more impetus > to powerset now. I personally think powerset is > currently the best interface for wikipedia, bar > none. > > On the gripping hand, if developing powerset is > not on the cards for Microsoft, perhaps now that > they have decided to not hold onto encarta, they > might be persuadable to sell powerset off, since > holding on to it is not fending off a competitor to > encarta. The question of course then would be, > who would be willing to buy powerset off their > hands? > > > Yours, > > Jussi-Ville Heiskanen > > > ___ > WikiEN-l mailing list > WikiEN-l@lists.wikimedia.org > To unsubscribe from this mailing list, visit: > https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikien-l > ___ WikiEN-l mailing list WikiEN-l@lists.wikimedia.org To unsubscribe from this mailing list, visit: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikien-l
Re: [WikiEN-l] Microsoft kills Encarta
David Gerard wrote: > [spotted by Mathias Schindler] > > > http://encarta.msn.com/guide_page_FAQ/FAQ.html > > Important Notice: MSN Encarta to be Discontinued > On October 31, 2009, MSN® Encarta® Web sites worldwide will be > discontinued, with the exception of Encarta Japan, which will be > discontinued on December 31, 2009. Additionally, Microsoft will cease > to sell Microsoft Student and Encarta Premium software products > worldwide by June 2009. We understand that Encarta users may have > questions regarding this announcement so we have prepared this list of > questions and answers below. Please keep reading if you would like > more information about these changes to Encarta. > > > - d. > I think this casts a new interesting perspective on the decision by Microsoft to buy out powerset.com. I will be watching with interest, how they will develop that product, and whether they intend to incorporate it more extensively into their other product offerings. I have to admit I was skeptical initially when I heard powerset.com would be "gobbled up". But should it turn out that Microsoft were to really seriously put effort into powerset.com, any relief Encyclopaedia Britannica may have gained from the reduction of competition for number two spot, may prove a little short lived. That is unless of course Microsoft/Powerset make some kind of deal with EB that they can use powersets semantic search engine on also EB product. Of course it is possible that MS have made the judgment that the whole sector is not good for them, but actually I would prefer to be hopeful that this means they would give more impetus to powerset now. I personally think powerset is currently the best interface for wikipedia, bar none. On the gripping hand, if developing powerset is not on the cards for Microsoft, perhaps now that they have decided to not hold onto encarta, they might be persuadable to sell powerset off, since holding on to it is not fending off a competitor to encarta. The question of course then would be, who would be willing to buy powerset off their hands? Yours, Jussi-Ville Heiskanen ___ WikiEN-l mailing list WikiEN-l@lists.wikimedia.org To unsubscribe from this mailing list, visit: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikien-l
Re: [WikiEN-l] Microsoft kills Encarta
Depends on what it's about. bibliomaniac15 --- On Mon, 3/30/09, Soxred93 wrote: From: Soxred93 Subject: Re: [WikiEN-l] Microsoft kills Encarta To: "English Wikipedia" Date: Monday, March 30, 2009, 6:37 PM I just took one of those quizzes. I think a 1/5 is bad, right? X! On Mar 30, 2009, at 6:36 PM [Mar 30, 2009 ], Scientia Potentia est wrote: > Same here. This and the World Book Encyclopedia 2001 CD that I > still have. I did like taking the quizzes Encarta had on their site. > > bibliomaniac15 > > --- On Mon, 3/30/09, Carcharoth wrote: > From: Carcharoth > Subject: Re: [WikiEN-l] Microsoft kills Encarta > To: "English Wikipedia" > Date: Monday, March 30, 2009, 3:34 PM > > On Mon, Mar 30, 2009 at 8:39 PM, David Gerard > wrote: >> [spotted by Mathias Schindler] >> >> >> http://encarta.msn.com/guide_page_FAQ/FAQ.html >> >> Important Notice: MSN Encarta to be Discontinued >> On October 31, 2009, MSN® Encarta® Web sites worldwide will be >> discontinued, with the exception of Encarta Japan, which will be >> discontinued on December 31, 2009. Additionally, Microsoft will cease >> to sell Microsoft Student and Encarta Premium software products >> worldwide by June 2009. We understand that Encarta users may have >> questions regarding this announcement so we have prepared this >> list of >> questions and answers below. Please keep reading if you would like >> more information about these changes to Encarta. > > "Encarta has been a popular product around the world for many years. > However, the category of traditional encyclopedias and reference > material has changed. People today seek and consume information in > considerably different ways than in years past." > > I wonder what different ways they could be talking about? :-) > > "we believe that we can use what we’ve learned and assets we’ve > accrued with offerings like Encarta to develop future technology > solutions" > > So they might try making a comeback in another form? > > I liked Encarta - it was the first real encyclopedia I used. So I feel > a bit torn here. > > Carcharoth > > ___ > WikiEN-l mailing list > WikiEN-l@lists.wikimedia.org > To unsubscribe from this mailing list, visit: > https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikien-l > > > > > ___ > WikiEN-l mailing list > WikiEN-l@lists.wikimedia.org > To unsubscribe from this mailing list, visit: > https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikien-l ___ WikiEN-l mailing list WikiEN-l@lists.wikimedia.org To unsubscribe from this mailing list, visit: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikien-l ___ WikiEN-l mailing list WikiEN-l@lists.wikimedia.org To unsubscribe from this mailing list, visit: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikien-l
Re: [WikiEN-l] Microsoft kills Encarta
Fear the power of freedom On Mon, Mar 30, 2009 at 12:39 PM, David Gerard wrote: > [spotted by Mathias Schindler] > > > http://encarta.msn.com/guide_page_FAQ/FAQ.html > > Important Notice: MSN Encarta to be Discontinued > On October 31, 2009, MSN® Encarta® Web sites worldwide will be > discontinued, with the exception of Encarta Japan, which will be > discontinued on December 31, 2009. Additionally, Microsoft will cease > to sell Microsoft Student and Encarta Premium software products > worldwide by June 2009. We understand that Encarta users may have > questions regarding this announcement so we have prepared this list of > questions and answers below. Please keep reading if you would like > more information about these changes to Encarta. > > > - d. > > ___ > WikiEN-l mailing list > WikiEN-l@lists.wikimedia.org > To unsubscribe from this mailing list, visit: > https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikien-l > -- Whether you can or can't, any way you are correct. - Henry Ford ___ WikiEN-l mailing list WikiEN-l@lists.wikimedia.org To unsubscribe from this mailing list, visit: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikien-l
Re: [WikiEN-l] English Wikipedia brief outage today
!blame on http://toolserver.org/%7Eamidaniel/botbrain.html... "Whatever happened, it's Domas' fault." X! On Mar 30, 2009, at 7:50 PM [Mar 30, 2009 ], wjhon...@aol.com wrote: > Kill the messenger! > Does anyone have a mob of peasants with torches standing around handy? > > > -Original Message- > From: Brion Vibber > To: Wikimedia developers ; English > Wikipedia > Sent: Mon, 30 Mar 2009 4:45 pm > Subject: [WikiEN-l] English Wikipedia brief outage today > > An out-of-memory condition crashed the database master for English > Wikipedia; we were down for about 25 minutes. All is restarted and > recovered now (thanks Domas!); our other sites were not affected. > > http://techblog.wikimedia.org/2009/03/english-wikipedia-database- > temporarily-down/ > > -- brion vibber (brion @ wikimedia.org) > CTO, Wikimedia Foundation > San Francisco > > ___ > WikiEN-l mailing list > WikiEN-l@lists.wikimedia.org > To unsubscribe from this mailing list, visit: > https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikien-l > > > > ___ > WikiEN-l mailing list > WikiEN-l@lists.wikimedia.org > To unsubscribe from this mailing list, visit: > https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikien-l ___ WikiEN-l mailing list WikiEN-l@lists.wikimedia.org To unsubscribe from this mailing list, visit: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikien-l
Re: [WikiEN-l] Microsoft kills Encarta
I just took one of those quizzes. I think a 1/5 is bad, right? X! On Mar 30, 2009, at 6:36 PM [Mar 30, 2009 ], Scientia Potentia est wrote: > Same here. This and the World Book Encyclopedia 2001 CD that I > still have. I did like taking the quizzes Encarta had on their site. > > bibliomaniac15 > > --- On Mon, 3/30/09, Carcharoth wrote: > From: Carcharoth > Subject: Re: [WikiEN-l] Microsoft kills Encarta > To: "English Wikipedia" > Date: Monday, March 30, 2009, 3:34 PM > > On Mon, Mar 30, 2009 at 8:39 PM, David Gerard > wrote: >> [spotted by Mathias Schindler] >> >> >> http://encarta.msn.com/guide_page_FAQ/FAQ.html >> >> Important Notice: MSN Encarta to be Discontinued >> On October 31, 2009, MSN® Encarta® Web sites worldwide will be >> discontinued, with the exception of Encarta Japan, which will be >> discontinued on December 31, 2009. Additionally, Microsoft will cease >> to sell Microsoft Student and Encarta Premium software products >> worldwide by June 2009. We understand that Encarta users may have >> questions regarding this announcement so we have prepared this >> list of >> questions and answers below. Please keep reading if you would like >> more information about these changes to Encarta. > > "Encarta has been a popular product around the world for many years. > However, the category of traditional encyclopedias and reference > material has changed. People today seek and consume information in > considerably different ways than in years past." > > I wonder what different ways they could be talking about? :-) > > "we believe that we can use what we’ve learned and assets we’ve > accrued with offerings like Encarta to develop future technology > solutions" > > So they might try making a comeback in another form? > > I liked Encarta - it was the first real encyclopedia I used. So I feel > a bit torn here. > > Carcharoth > > ___ > WikiEN-l mailing list > WikiEN-l@lists.wikimedia.org > To unsubscribe from this mailing list, visit: > https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikien-l > > > > > ___ > WikiEN-l mailing list > WikiEN-l@lists.wikimedia.org > To unsubscribe from this mailing list, visit: > https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikien-l ___ WikiEN-l mailing list WikiEN-l@lists.wikimedia.org To unsubscribe from this mailing list, visit: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikien-l
Re: [WikiEN-l] English Wikipedia brief outage today
2009/3/31 Carcharoth : > On Tue, Mar 31, 2009 at 1:01 AM, Carcharoth > wrote: >> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User:Slakr/TPE > http://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/Category:Riots Quite right - where's the donation notice? Downtime is our most profitable product! - d. ___ WikiEN-l mailing list WikiEN-l@lists.wikimedia.org To unsubscribe from this mailing list, visit: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikien-l
Re: [WikiEN-l] English Wikipedia brief outage today
http://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/Category:Riots On Tue, Mar 31, 2009 at 1:01 AM, Carcharoth wrote: > http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User:Slakr/TPE > > On Tue, Mar 31, 2009 at 12:50 AM, wrote: >> Kill the messenger! >> Does anyone have a mob of peasants with torches standing around handy? >> >> >> -Original Message- >> From: Brion Vibber >> To: Wikimedia developers ; English >> Wikipedia >> Sent: Mon, 30 Mar 2009 4:45 pm >> Subject: [WikiEN-l] English Wikipedia brief outage today >> >> An out-of-memory condition crashed the database master for English >> Wikipedia; we were down for about 25 minutes. All is restarted and >> recovered now (thanks Domas!); our other sites were not affected. >> >> http://techblog.wikimedia.org/2009/03/english-wikipedia-database-temporarily-down/ >> >> -- brion vibber (brion @ wikimedia.org) >> CTO, Wikimedia Foundation >> San Francisco >> >> ___ >> WikiEN-l mailing list >> WikiEN-l@lists.wikimedia.org >> To unsubscribe from this mailing list, visit: >> https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikien-l >> >> >> >> ___ >> WikiEN-l mailing list >> WikiEN-l@lists.wikimedia.org >> To unsubscribe from this mailing list, visit: >> https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikien-l >> > ___ WikiEN-l mailing list WikiEN-l@lists.wikimedia.org To unsubscribe from this mailing list, visit: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikien-l
Re: [WikiEN-l] English Wikipedia brief outage today
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User:Slakr/TPE On Tue, Mar 31, 2009 at 12:50 AM, wrote: > Kill the messenger! > Does anyone have a mob of peasants with torches standing around handy? > > > -Original Message- > From: Brion Vibber > To: Wikimedia developers ; English > Wikipedia > Sent: Mon, 30 Mar 2009 4:45 pm > Subject: [WikiEN-l] English Wikipedia brief outage today > > An out-of-memory condition crashed the database master for English > Wikipedia; we were down for about 25 minutes. All is restarted and > recovered now (thanks Domas!); our other sites were not affected. > > http://techblog.wikimedia.org/2009/03/english-wikipedia-database-temporarily-down/ > > -- brion vibber (brion @ wikimedia.org) > CTO, Wikimedia Foundation > San Francisco > > ___ > WikiEN-l mailing list > WikiEN-l@lists.wikimedia.org > To unsubscribe from this mailing list, visit: > https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikien-l > > > > ___ > WikiEN-l mailing list > WikiEN-l@lists.wikimedia.org > To unsubscribe from this mailing list, visit: > https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikien-l > ___ WikiEN-l mailing list WikiEN-l@lists.wikimedia.org To unsubscribe from this mailing list, visit: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikien-l
Re: [WikiEN-l] Microsoft kills Encarta
2009/3/31 Carcharoth : > Hmm. Can you get $$$ from that? > > The technology isn't there yet and when it is you will likely hit the problem that rather a lot of other people will also be able to do it. > Some Wikipedia mirrors seem to be trying to do this already. Not in the way I meant. -- geni ___ WikiEN-l mailing list WikiEN-l@lists.wikimedia.org To unsubscribe from this mailing list, visit: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikien-l
Re: [WikiEN-l] English Wikipedia brief outage today
Kill the messenger! Does anyone have a mob of peasants with torches standing around handy? -Original Message- From: Brion Vibber To: Wikimedia developers ; English Wikipedia Sent: Mon, 30 Mar 2009 4:45 pm Subject: [WikiEN-l] English Wikipedia brief outage today An out-of-memory condition crashed the database master for English Wikipedia; we were down for about 25 minutes. All is restarted and recovered now (thanks Domas!); our other sites were not affected. http://techblog.wikimedia.org/2009/03/english-wikipedia-database-temporarily-down/ -- brion vibber (brion @ wikimedia.org) CTO, Wikimedia Foundation San Francisco ___ WikiEN-l mailing list WikiEN-l@lists.wikimedia.org To unsubscribe from this mailing list, visit: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikien-l ___ WikiEN-l mailing list WikiEN-l@lists.wikimedia.org To unsubscribe from this mailing list, visit: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikien-l
Re: [WikiEN-l] Microsoft kills Encarta
I think you hit the nail on one $$$-making venture. "Child-safe" Wikipedia. Parents or schools pay for a child-safe version (G rated) for elementary school, and maybe PG-rated for secondary school. Who knows maybe even religious colleges would pay for an R-rated version ? Will "I thought of it first" Johnson ___ WikiEN-l mailing list WikiEN-l@lists.wikimedia.org To unsubscribe from this mailing list, visit: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikien-l
Re: [WikiEN-l] Microsoft kills Encarta
> On 30/03/2009, doc wrote: >> And then someone will come up with a better way of delivering >> information than a wiki... > > Probably, but I think people, if they still live, will still be > talking about the wikipedia in a thousand years, like they still talk > about the Library of Alexandria. > > -- > -Ian Woollard I've always compared it to the Platonic Academy as a milestone in intellectual history. Quite a revolution from Lexus-Nexus... Fred Bauder ___ WikiEN-l mailing list WikiEN-l@lists.wikimedia.org To unsubscribe from this mailing list, visit: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikien-l
[WikiEN-l] English Wikipedia brief outage today
An out-of-memory condition crashed the database master for English Wikipedia; we were down for about 25 minutes. All is restarted and recovered now (thanks Domas!); our other sites were not affected. http://techblog.wikimedia.org/2009/03/english-wikipedia-database-temporarily-down/ -- brion vibber (brion @ wikimedia.org) CTO, Wikimedia Foundation San Francisco ___ WikiEN-l mailing list WikiEN-l@lists.wikimedia.org To unsubscribe from this mailing list, visit: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikien-l
Re: [WikiEN-l] Microsoft kills Encarta
My money is on a Hitchhiker's Guide. Has the advantage of being extremely wide in coverage, handheld, and pretty damn funny. Nathan ___ WikiEN-l mailing list WikiEN-l@lists.wikimedia.org To unsubscribe from this mailing list, visit: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikien-l
Re: [WikiEN-l] Microsoft kills Encarta
On Tue, Mar 31, 2009 at 12:22 AM, Carcharoth wrote: > On Tue, Mar 31, 2009 at 12:15 AM, geni wrote: >> In fact if I had to put a guess on what will replace wikipedia is will >> be made to order articles generated on the fly from a wide range of >> sources by software. > > Hmm. Can you get $$$ from that? > > > > Some Wikipedia mirrors seem to be trying to do this already. To clarify: I mean those sites that offer a range of articles on a topic. Content aggregators, including Wikipedia articles and others (often better). Answers.com is an example. http://www.answers.com/Pope%20John%20Paul%20II Carcharoth ___ WikiEN-l mailing list WikiEN-l@lists.wikimedia.org To unsubscribe from this mailing list, visit: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikien-l
Re: [WikiEN-l] Wikipedia isn't just a good idea - it's compulsory
On Mar 27, 2009, at 11:25 AM, doc wrote: > You'll get more articles in Encarta or Britanicca - and they WILL have > all the core ones, rather than a selection of what's been OK on > wikipedia. Why would anyone want to use the schools' wikipedia? Because they want their 9-year-old to use a free Encyclopedia (and perhaps indoctrinate them to the Wikipedia "brand") but they don't want them stumbling over the "adult oriented" content. --Noah-- ___ WikiEN-l mailing list WikiEN-l@lists.wikimedia.org To unsubscribe from this mailing list, visit: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikien-l
Re: [WikiEN-l] Microsoft kills Encarta
On Tue, Mar 31, 2009 at 12:15 AM, geni wrote: > 2009/3/30 doc : >> You realise, someday the announcement will read: >> >> "Wikipedia has been a popular product around the world for many years. >> However, the category of traditional wiki encyclopedias and reference >> material has changed. People today seek and consume information in >> considerably different ways than in years past." >> >> Civilisation proceeds obsolescence by obsolescence > > That would require whatever the replacement is to turn up before the > cost of hosting wikipedia becomes trivial and software agents that can > write the thing without human involvement have become widespread. > > In fact if I had to put a guess on what will replace wikipedia is will > be made to order articles generated on the fly from a wide range of > sources by software. Hmm. Can you get $$$ from that? Some Wikipedia mirrors seem to be trying to do this already. Carcharoth ___ WikiEN-l mailing list WikiEN-l@lists.wikimedia.org To unsubscribe from this mailing list, visit: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikien-l
Re: [WikiEN-l] Microsoft kills Encarta
On 30/03/2009, doc wrote: > And then someone will come up with a better way of delivering > information than a wiki... Probably, but I think people, if they still live, will still be talking about the wikipedia in a thousand years, like they still talk about the Library of Alexandria. -- -Ian Woollard We live in an imperfectly imperfect world. Life in a perfectly imperfect world would be *much* better. Life in an imperfectly perfect world would be pretty ghastly though. ___ WikiEN-l mailing list WikiEN-l@lists.wikimedia.org To unsubscribe from this mailing list, visit: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikien-l
Re: [WikiEN-l] Microsoft kills Encarta
2009/3/30 doc : > You realise, someday the announcement will read: > > "Wikipedia has been a popular product around the world for many years. > However, the category of traditional wiki encyclopedias and reference > material has changed. People today seek and consume information in > considerably different ways than in years past." > > Civilisation proceeds obsolescence by obsolescence That would require whatever the replacement is to turn up before the cost of hosting wikipedia becomes trivial and software agents that can write the thing without human involvement have become widespread. In fact if I had to put a guess on what will replace wikipedia is will be made to order articles generated on the fly from a wide range of sources by software. -- geni ___ WikiEN-l mailing list WikiEN-l@lists.wikimedia.org To unsubscribe from this mailing list, visit: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikien-l
Re: [WikiEN-l] Microsoft kills Encarta
Turtles all the way up (or is that down?) On Tue, Mar 31, 2009 at 12:04 AM, Scientia Potentia est wrote: > Ad infinitum...you have to love it. > > bibliomaniac15 > > --- On Mon, 3/30/09, doc wrote: > From: doc > Subject: Re: [WikiEN-l] Microsoft kills Encarta > To: "English Wikipedia" > Date: Monday, March 30, 2009, 3:58 PM > > And then someone will come up with a better way of delivering > information than a wiki... > > Scientia Potentia est wrote: >> Indeed it will, and hopefully that wiki will have worked out the kinks we > haven't managed to fix. >> >> bibliomaniac15 >> >> --- On Mon, 3/30/09, doc wrote: >> From: doc >> Subject: Re: [WikiEN-l] Microsoft kills Encarta >> To: "English Wikipedia" >> Date: Monday, March 30, 2009, 3:45 PM >> >> You realise, someday the announcement will read: >> >> "Wikipedia has been a popular product around the world for many > years. >> However, the category of traditional wiki encyclopedias and reference >> material has changed. People today seek and consume information in >> considerably different ways than in years past." >> >> Civilisation proceeds obsolescence by obsolescence >> >> ___ >> WikiEN-l mailing list >> WikiEN-l@lists.wikimedia.org >> To unsubscribe from this mailing list, visit: >> https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikien-l >> >> >> >> >> ___ >> WikiEN-l mailing list >> WikiEN-l@lists.wikimedia.org >> To unsubscribe from this mailing list, visit: >> https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikien-l >> > > > ___ > WikiEN-l mailing list > WikiEN-l@lists.wikimedia.org > To unsubscribe from this mailing list, visit: > https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikien-l > > > > > ___ > WikiEN-l mailing list > WikiEN-l@lists.wikimedia.org > To unsubscribe from this mailing list, visit: > https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikien-l > ___ WikiEN-l mailing list WikiEN-l@lists.wikimedia.org To unsubscribe from this mailing list, visit: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikien-l
Re: [WikiEN-l] Microsoft kills Encarta
Ad infinitum...you have to love it. bibliomaniac15 --- On Mon, 3/30/09, doc wrote: From: doc Subject: Re: [WikiEN-l] Microsoft kills Encarta To: "English Wikipedia" Date: Monday, March 30, 2009, 3:58 PM And then someone will come up with a better way of delivering information than a wiki... Scientia Potentia est wrote: > Indeed it will, and hopefully that wiki will have worked out the kinks we haven't managed to fix. > > bibliomaniac15 > > --- On Mon, 3/30/09, doc wrote: > From: doc > Subject: Re: [WikiEN-l] Microsoft kills Encarta > To: "English Wikipedia" > Date: Monday, March 30, 2009, 3:45 PM > > You realise, someday the announcement will read: > > "Wikipedia has been a popular product around the world for many years. > However, the category of traditional wiki encyclopedias and reference > material has changed. People today seek and consume information in > considerably different ways than in years past." > > Civilisation proceeds obsolescence by obsolescence > > ___ > WikiEN-l mailing list > WikiEN-l@lists.wikimedia.org > To unsubscribe from this mailing list, visit: > https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikien-l > > > > > ___ > WikiEN-l mailing list > WikiEN-l@lists.wikimedia.org > To unsubscribe from this mailing list, visit: > https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikien-l > ___ WikiEN-l mailing list WikiEN-l@lists.wikimedia.org To unsubscribe from this mailing list, visit: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikien-l ___ WikiEN-l mailing list WikiEN-l@lists.wikimedia.org To unsubscribe from this mailing list, visit: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikien-l
Re: [WikiEN-l] Microsoft kills Encarta
And then someone will come up with a better way of delivering information than a wiki... Scientia Potentia est wrote: > Indeed it will, and hopefully that wiki will have worked out the kinks we > haven't managed to fix. > > bibliomaniac15 > > --- On Mon, 3/30/09, doc wrote: > From: doc > Subject: Re: [WikiEN-l] Microsoft kills Encarta > To: "English Wikipedia" > Date: Monday, March 30, 2009, 3:45 PM > > You realise, someday the announcement will read: > > "Wikipedia has been a popular product around the world for many years. > However, the category of traditional wiki encyclopedias and reference > material has changed. People today seek and consume information in > considerably different ways than in years past." > > Civilisation proceeds obsolescence by obsolescence > > ___ > WikiEN-l mailing list > WikiEN-l@lists.wikimedia.org > To unsubscribe from this mailing list, visit: > https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikien-l > > > > > ___ > WikiEN-l mailing list > WikiEN-l@lists.wikimedia.org > To unsubscribe from this mailing list, visit: > https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikien-l > ___ WikiEN-l mailing list WikiEN-l@lists.wikimedia.org To unsubscribe from this mailing list, visit: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikien-l
Re: [WikiEN-l] Microsoft kills Encarta
Absolutely. And the model that replaces Wikipedia will also needs critics as well. On Mon, Mar 30, 2009 at 11:45 PM, doc wrote: > You realise, someday the announcement will read: > > "Wikipedia has been a popular product around the world for many years. > However, the category of traditional wiki encyclopedias and reference > material has changed. People today seek and consume information in > considerably different ways than in years past." > > Civilisation proceeds obsolescence by obsolescence > > ___ > WikiEN-l mailing list > WikiEN-l@lists.wikimedia.org > To unsubscribe from this mailing list, visit: > https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikien-l > ___ WikiEN-l mailing list WikiEN-l@lists.wikimedia.org To unsubscribe from this mailing list, visit: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikien-l
Re: [WikiEN-l] Microsoft kills Encarta
Indeed it will, and hopefully that wiki will have worked out the kinks we haven't managed to fix. bibliomaniac15 --- On Mon, 3/30/09, doc wrote: From: doc Subject: Re: [WikiEN-l] Microsoft kills Encarta To: "English Wikipedia" Date: Monday, March 30, 2009, 3:45 PM You realise, someday the announcement will read: "Wikipedia has been a popular product around the world for many years. However, the category of traditional wiki encyclopedias and reference material has changed. People today seek and consume information in considerably different ways than in years past." Civilisation proceeds obsolescence by obsolescence ___ WikiEN-l mailing list WikiEN-l@lists.wikimedia.org To unsubscribe from this mailing list, visit: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikien-l ___ WikiEN-l mailing list WikiEN-l@lists.wikimedia.org To unsubscribe from this mailing list, visit: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikien-l
Re: [WikiEN-l] Microsoft kills Encarta
You realise, someday the announcement will read: "Wikipedia has been a popular product around the world for many years. However, the category of traditional wiki encyclopedias and reference material has changed. People today seek and consume information in considerably different ways than in years past." Civilisation proceeds obsolescence by obsolescence ___ WikiEN-l mailing list WikiEN-l@lists.wikimedia.org To unsubscribe from this mailing list, visit: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikien-l
Re: [WikiEN-l] Flagged revs poll take 2
I didn't see any lazylinks in this thread, so appearently *this* is the poll being discussed here. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia_talk:Flagged_protection_and_patrolled_revisions/Poll Will Johnson ___ WikiEN-l mailing list WikiEN-l@lists.wikimedia.org To unsubscribe from this mailing list, visit: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikien-l
Re: [WikiEN-l] Microsoft kills Encarta
Same here. This and the World Book Encyclopedia 2001 CD that I still have. I did like taking the quizzes Encarta had on their site. bibliomaniac15 --- On Mon, 3/30/09, Carcharoth wrote: From: Carcharoth Subject: Re: [WikiEN-l] Microsoft kills Encarta To: "English Wikipedia" Date: Monday, March 30, 2009, 3:34 PM On Mon, Mar 30, 2009 at 8:39 PM, David Gerard wrote: > [spotted by Mathias Schindler] > > > http://encarta.msn.com/guide_page_FAQ/FAQ.html > > Important Notice: MSN Encarta to be Discontinued > On October 31, 2009, MSN® Encarta® Web sites worldwide will be > discontinued, with the exception of Encarta Japan, which will be > discontinued on December 31, 2009. Additionally, Microsoft will cease > to sell Microsoft Student and Encarta Premium software products > worldwide by June 2009. We understand that Encarta users may have > questions regarding this announcement so we have prepared this list of > questions and answers below. Please keep reading if you would like > more information about these changes to Encarta. "Encarta has been a popular product around the world for many years. However, the category of traditional encyclopedias and reference material has changed. People today seek and consume information in considerably different ways than in years past." I wonder what different ways they could be talking about? :-) "we believe that we can use what we’ve learned and assets we’ve accrued with offerings like Encarta to develop future technology solutions" So they might try making a comeback in another form? I liked Encarta - it was the first real encyclopedia I used. So I feel a bit torn here. Carcharoth ___ WikiEN-l mailing list WikiEN-l@lists.wikimedia.org To unsubscribe from this mailing list, visit: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikien-l ___ WikiEN-l mailing list WikiEN-l@lists.wikimedia.org To unsubscribe from this mailing list, visit: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikien-l
Re: [WikiEN-l] Microsoft kills Encarta
On Mon, Mar 30, 2009 at 8:39 PM, David Gerard wrote: > [spotted by Mathias Schindler] > > > http://encarta.msn.com/guide_page_FAQ/FAQ.html > > Important Notice: MSN Encarta to be Discontinued > On October 31, 2009, MSN® Encarta® Web sites worldwide will be > discontinued, with the exception of Encarta Japan, which will be > discontinued on December 31, 2009. Additionally, Microsoft will cease > to sell Microsoft Student and Encarta Premium software products > worldwide by June 2009. We understand that Encarta users may have > questions regarding this announcement so we have prepared this list of > questions and answers below. Please keep reading if you would like > more information about these changes to Encarta. "Encarta has been a popular product around the world for many years. However, the category of traditional encyclopedias and reference material has changed. People today seek and consume information in considerably different ways than in years past." I wonder what different ways they could be talking about? :-) "we believe that we can use what we’ve learned and assets we’ve accrued with offerings like Encarta to develop future technology solutions" So they might try making a comeback in another form? I liked Encarta - it was the first real encyclopedia I used. So I feel a bit torn here. Carcharoth ___ WikiEN-l mailing list WikiEN-l@lists.wikimedia.org To unsubscribe from this mailing list, visit: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikien-l
Re: [WikiEN-l] Microsoft kills Encarta
Another one bites the dust. bibliomaniac15 --- On Mon, 3/30/09, David Gerard wrote: From: David Gerard Subject: [WikiEN-l] Microsoft kills Encarta To: "English Wikipedia" Date: Monday, March 30, 2009, 12:39 PM [spotted by Mathias Schindler] http://encarta.msn.com/guide_page_FAQ/FAQ.html Important Notice: MSN Encarta to be Discontinued On October 31, 2009, MSN® Encarta® Web sites worldwide will be discontinued, with the exception of Encarta Japan, which will be discontinued on December 31, 2009. Additionally, Microsoft will cease to sell Microsoft Student and Encarta Premium software products worldwide by June 2009. We understand that Encarta users may have questions regarding this announcement so we have prepared this list of questions and answers below. Please keep reading if you would like more information about these changes to Encarta. - d. ___ WikiEN-l mailing list WikiEN-l@lists.wikimedia.org To unsubscribe from this mailing list, visit: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikien-l ___ WikiEN-l mailing list WikiEN-l@lists.wikimedia.org To unsubscribe from this mailing list, visit: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikien-l
Re: [WikiEN-l] Flagged revs poll take 2
Nathan wrote: > Two more problems: > > 1) This just barely made it on the watchlist notice, with a whopping one day > for further participation. > > 2) None of the details on how the trial will actually work have been > determined. Questions and opposition along these lines have been primarily > met with "We'll work that out when the poll closes." > > Nice. > > Nathan > > (expanded opinion at > http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User:Avruch/FlaggedRevs_vs._NPP) > ___ > WikiEN-l mailing list > WikiEN-l@lists.wikimedia.org > To unsubscribe from this mailing list, visit: > https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikien-l > First sensible response I've seen to this. I thought I was on my own as being a determined BLP warrior (or worrier) who opposed this ridiculous thing. It seems to be a victory of "something must be done - and this is something" over common sense. This does nothing at all for BLP subjects, screws flagged revisions, and introduces a nightmare, all at once. Nice indeed. Scott ___ WikiEN-l mailing list WikiEN-l@lists.wikimedia.org To unsubscribe from this mailing list, visit: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikien-l
Re: [WikiEN-l] Flagged revs poll take 2
Two more problems: 1) This just barely made it on the watchlist notice, with a whopping one day for further participation. 2) None of the details on how the trial will actually work have been determined. Questions and opposition along these lines have been primarily met with "We'll work that out when the poll closes." Nice. Nathan (expanded opinion at http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User:Avruch/FlaggedRevs_vs._NPP) ___ WikiEN-l mailing list WikiEN-l@lists.wikimedia.org To unsubscribe from this mailing list, visit: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikien-l
Re: [WikiEN-l] Flagged revs poll take 2
On Mon, Mar 30, 2009 at 5:49 PM, Sage Ross > wrote: > No, the current proposal is a conservative starting point. It is a > proposal to a) get Flagged Revisions turned on and b) give the > community a chance to see what it's like to use flagging in live > content situation. > > The proposal is designed so that the scope of flagging can be adjusted > easily through policy, rather than software, changes. If the > community agrees, after testing out flagged protection for the trial > period, that more articles should be protected (say, all BLPs), then > all it requires is consensus to change the scope of protection policy. > Support probably exists to use flagging more aggressively in the > future, but most editors want to take it one step at a time (or are > willing to go slowly for the sake of others who want to take it one > step at a time). > I think this is an overly optimistic view of the post-poll future. First, your (b) benefit falls down because what the community will see is a process that takes a lot of work and provides no true improvement. Second, your assumption that future adjustments will be made "easily through policy" is extraordinarily optimistic - since when are policy alterations requiring significant changes to an extension easily made? What happens when the 2 month trial expires? Another big poll on whether it should be extended, modified, or left in the dustbin of Wikipedia history? You should be able to predict all the oppose arguments on that next poll - its bureaucratic, it doesn't fit in with "anyone can edit", etc. Add one more - no obvious benefit to justify the big backlog of unpatrolled revisions, which *will happen* if for no other reason than patrolling revisions seems to achieve very little. The first two reasons for opposition torpedoed the first poll, and this poll offers little improvement against those largely ideological positions. Add in the third, and the chances of a superior and further implementation of FR someday down the line drop dramatically. Nathan ___ WikiEN-l mailing list WikiEN-l@lists.wikimedia.org To unsubscribe from this mailing list, visit: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikien-l
Re: [WikiEN-l] Flagged revs poll take 2
On Mon, Mar 30, 2009 at 5:34 PM, Nathan wrote: > What I would like to see, and what I have been hoping to see, is either > implementation of the prior proposal (taking a form similar to that used by > de.wp) or actual proposal of a true compromise version. The current poll > asks us to just give up. > No, the current proposal is a conservative starting point. It is a proposal to a) get Flagged Revisions turned on and b) give the community a chance to see what it's like to use flagging in live content situation. The proposal is designed so that the scope of flagging can be adjusted easily through policy, rather than software, changes. If the community agrees, after testing out flagged protection for the trial period, that more articles should be protected (say, all BLPs), then all it requires is consensus to change the scope of protection policy. Support probably exists to use flagging more aggressively in the future, but most editors want to take it one step at a time (or are willing to go slowly for the sake of others who want to take it one step at a time). -Sage (User:Ragesoss) ___ WikiEN-l mailing list WikiEN-l@lists.wikimedia.org To unsubscribe from this mailing list, visit: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikien-l
Re: [WikiEN-l] Flagged revs poll take 2
CC'd this to Foundation-l. There is a poll currently on the English Wikipedia to implement a version of FlaggedRevisions. The poll was introduced left into the vacuum which remained after the first poll failed to result in concrete action. At the close of poll #1, Jimmy indicated that he thought it had passed and should result in an FR implementation. When he received some protest, he announced that he would shortly unveil a new compromise proposal. While I'm sure he had the best of intentions, this proposal hasn't materialized and the result has been limbo. Into the limbo rides another proposal, this one masquerading as the hoped for compromise. Unfortunately, it isn't - at least, not in the sense that it is a middle ground between those who want FR implemented and those who oppose it. What it does do is compromise, as in fundamentally weaken, the concept of FR and the effort to improve our handling of BLPs. The proposed implementation introduces all the bureaucracy and effort of FlaggedRevisions, with few of the benefits. FlaggedProtection, similar to semi-protection, can be placed on any article. In some instances, FlaggedProtection is identical to normal full protection - only, it still allows edit wars on unsighted versions (woohoo). Patrolled revisions are passive - you can patrol them, but doing so won't impact what the general reader will see. It gives us the huge and useless backlog which is exactly what we should not want, and exactly what the opposition has predicted. The only likely result is that inertia will prevent any further FR implementation, and we'll be stuck with a substitute that grants no real benefit. What I would like to see, and what I have been hoping to see, is either implementation of the prior proposal (taking a form similar to that used by de.wp) or actual proposal of a true compromise version. The current poll asks us to just give up. Nathan ___ WikiEN-l mailing list WikiEN-l@lists.wikimedia.org To unsubscribe from this mailing list, visit: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikien-l
[WikiEN-l] Microsoft kills Encarta
[spotted by Mathias Schindler] http://encarta.msn.com/guide_page_FAQ/FAQ.html Important Notice: MSN Encarta to be Discontinued On October 31, 2009, MSN® Encarta® Web sites worldwide will be discontinued, with the exception of Encarta Japan, which will be discontinued on December 31, 2009. Additionally, Microsoft will cease to sell Microsoft Student and Encarta Premium software products worldwide by June 2009. We understand that Encarta users may have questions regarding this announcement so we have prepared this list of questions and answers below. Please keep reading if you would like more information about these changes to Encarta. - d. ___ WikiEN-l mailing list WikiEN-l@lists.wikimedia.org To unsubscribe from this mailing list, visit: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikien-l
Re: [WikiEN-l] Firefox extension: Smarter Wikipedia
On Sun, Mar 29, 2009 at 6:18 PM, Jack Park wrote: > Really quite amazing. I just moused over "Anyone" below and used right > click to go to that topic in wikipedia. Amazing. > Thanks > Jack Firefox can already (sorta) do that, you know. If you have Wikipedia selected as the search engine in the top right search bar, you just select a word (easy to do with a double-click) and select "Search Wikipedia for "whatever"". --Oskar ___ WikiEN-l mailing list WikiEN-l@lists.wikimedia.org To unsubscribe from this mailing list, visit: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikien-l
Re: [WikiEN-l] Firefox extension: Smarter Wikipedia
I've just added it - it works on some pages but not on others (e..g not on the Main Page). It integrates really well into the left hand sidebar so you can easily miss it! On Sun, Mar 29, 2009 at 5:13 PM, Fred Bauder wrote: > > https://addons.mozilla.org/en-US/firefox/addon/9825 > > > > Anyone used this? > > > > > > - d. > > It seems to do absolutely nothing. > > Fred ___ WikiEN-l mailing list WikiEN-l@lists.wikimedia.org To unsubscribe from this mailing list, visit: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikien-l
Re: [WikiEN-l] Firefox extension: Smarter Wikipedia
Really quite amazing. I just moused over "Anyone" below and used right click to go to that topic in wikipedia. Amazing. Thanks Jack On Sun, Mar 29, 2009 at 8:28 AM, David Gerard wrote: > https://addons.mozilla.org/en-US/firefox/addon/9825 > > Anyone used this? > ___ WikiEN-l mailing list WikiEN-l@lists.wikimedia.org To unsubscribe from this mailing list, visit: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikien-l
