Re: [WikiEN-l] JSTOR Early Journal Content access
On Mon, Sep 12, 2011 at 7:34 PM, Sarah slimvir...@gmail.com wrote: snip But really, this is extortionate, and it's in no-one else's interests, because the chances of someone paying $34 for an old article on such an obscure issue are slim to vanishing, so the only consequence of the high price is that no one gets to see it. I was under the impression that universities and such organisation have institutional subscriptions where their members can access the articles, but not at a per-article rate but some other negotiated rate, or flat rate. I'm sure there are details on the JSTOR website. So people probably are reading the article in question, but not at the per-article rate. Carcharoth ___ WikiEN-l mailing list WikiEN-l@lists.wikimedia.org To unsubscribe from this mailing list, visit: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikien-l
Re: [WikiEN-l] JSTOR Early Journal Content access
On 13 September 2011 11:27, Carcharoth carcharot...@googlemail.com wrote: On Mon, Sep 12, 2011 at 7:34 PM, Sarah slimvir...@gmail.com wrote: snip But really, this is extortionate, and it's in no-one else's interests, because the chances of someone paying $34 for an old article on such an obscure issue are slim to vanishing, so the only consequence of the high price is that no one gets to see it. I was under the impression that universities and such organisation have institutional subscriptions where their members can access the articles, but not at a per-article rate but some other negotiated rate, or flat rate. I'm sure there are details on the JSTOR website. So people probably are reading the article in question, but not at the per-article rate. Institutional access is at a flat rate, or rather a bundled flat rate. ($3000 for all content in these collections, another $2000 for those ones, etc). In this particular example, the article is in the Arts Sciences III collection of ~150 journals, which would cost a US public university from $1,300 to $10,000 per year, depending on size, as an ongoing expense. This is not to say that institutions don't sometimes pay for individual articles - I know of some which do, basically treating JSTOR as an expensive but fast on-demand ILL service - but that most access is via their subscribed collections. Discounting these users, Sarah's suggestion that it's never likely to get used is pretty likely. JSTOR don't make very clear numbers on pay-per-view articles available, but their published accounts do confirm that they don't make very much money from it. We have specific usage figures for one year only, which suggest that less than *0.005%* of available articles got purchased in that period - and that those were mostly at the cheapest end of the spectrum (averaging ~$6). -- - Andrew Gray andrew.g...@dunelm.org.uk ___ WikiEN-l mailing list WikiEN-l@lists.wikimedia.org To unsubscribe from this mailing list, visit: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikien-l
Re: [WikiEN-l] JSTOR Early Journal Content access
On 13/09/2011 16:25, Carcharoth wrote: I have bought expensive academic books in the past, but never actual published PhD theses. I would expect someone to rewrite, extend and expand on their PhD thesis to make it suitable for a wider readership before publishing it and expecting people to buy it. In the UK PhD theses, as submitted, are theoretically free to download from EThOS (Electronic Theses Online Service) of the British Museum - as I discovered really not very long ago. But I'd like to know more. If the PhD is not already digitised, or from an institution that pays for that to happen, you may have to pay. Anyone know more? Charles ___ WikiEN-l mailing list WikiEN-l@lists.wikimedia.org To unsubscribe from this mailing list, visit: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikien-l
Re: [WikiEN-l] Fwd: [Wikitech-l] Fwd: Autoconfirmed article creation trial
On Tue, Sep 13, 2011 at 12:24 PM, David Gerard dger...@gmail.com wrote: It may seem a big goal, but perhaps en:wp can emulate the success of en:wn. Will we achieve the best-practice level of seven layers of review? We can but hope. And in turn, I look forward to the study of the effects of this change, which will never happen despite all promises before. -- gwern http://www.gwern.net ___ WikiEN-l mailing list WikiEN-l@lists.wikimedia.org To unsubscribe from this mailing list, visit: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikien-l
Re: [WikiEN-l] JSTOR Early Journal Content access
I have bought expensive academic books in the past, but never actual published PhD theses. I would expect someone to rewrite, extend and expand on their PhD thesis to make it suitable for a wider readership before publishing it and expecting people to buy it. Many of the books I've bought that have been expensive academic ones state that they are based on, or are an extension of the author(s) PhD work or other thesis work. I was also under the impression that PhD theses are printed and bound to go into a library, not really for sale, so I'm not sure what point is being made here. A PhD thesis and a book are different things. Carcharoth I've registered for this service and am downloading a thesis: Queen Victoria : the monarch and the media 1837-1867 I have agreed to terms and conditions which provide that my copy is only for personal or educational use. The PDF download, 50megs, is free, but I could have had a hardbound copy for 30 pounds. Fred ___ WikiEN-l mailing list WikiEN-l@lists.wikimedia.org To unsubscribe from this mailing list, visit: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikien-l
Re: [WikiEN-l] JSTOR Early Journal Content access
On Tue, Sep 13, 2011 at 09:25, Carcharoth carcharot...@googlemail.com wrote: On Tue, Sep 13, 2011 at 2:18 PM, Sarah slimvir...@gmail.com wrote: I've never understood how academic publishers view these issues. I have friends who had their PhDs published by their university presses -- at universities financed by taxpayers -- and the prices seemed self-defeating -- £70 sterling for a relatively short book on a minority issue. The publishers' argument is that it's a short print run, so the price per unit has to be high, but the reason they can only print a small number is they've determined in advance that no one can afford to buy it. So it turns into almost vanity publishing, where the only people who buy the books are extended family and friends, and the occasional library if you're lucky. In the meantime, the rest of the world is effectively locked out of this knowledge. It's an odd mindset for educators to have. I have bought expensive academic books in the past, but never actual published PhD theses. I would expect someone to rewrite, extend and expand on their PhD thesis to make it suitable for a wider readership before publishing it and expecting people to buy it. Many of the books I've bought that have been expensive academic ones state that they are based on, or are an extension of the author(s) PhD work or other thesis work. I was also under the impression that PhD theses are printed and bound to go into a library, not really for sale, so I'm not sure what point is being made here. A PhD thesis and a book are different things. Hi, sorry, I meant they had turned the PhD thesis into a book, not that they simply published the thesis itself. Sarah ___ WikiEN-l mailing list WikiEN-l@lists.wikimedia.org To unsubscribe from this mailing list, visit: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikien-l
Re: [WikiEN-l] JSTOR Early Journal Content access
On Tue, Sep 13, 2011 at 6:03 PM, Fred Bauder fredb...@fairpoint.net wrote: I've registered for this service and am downloading a thesis: Queen Victoria : the monarch and the media 1837-1867 I have agreed to terms and conditions which provide that my copy is only for personal or educational use. The PDF download, 50megs, is free, but I could have had a hardbound copy for 30 pounds. Is that print-on-demand? Talking of Queen Victoria, I've just finished reading: Darby, Elizabeth; Smith, Nicola (1983). The Cult of the Prince Consort. New Haven and London: Yale University Press. ISBN 0-300-03015-0 A nice book, replete with footnotes detailing the sources used. Despite the Yale University Press imprint, it is not really academic. More a survey of the various memorial schemes and so on. I picked it up for less than £1 at a second-hand book stall. Carcharoth ___ WikiEN-l mailing list WikiEN-l@lists.wikimedia.org To unsubscribe from this mailing list, visit: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikien-l
Re: [WikiEN-l] JSTOR Early Journal Content access
On Tue, Sep 13, 2011 at 6:03 PM, Fred Bauder fredb...@fairpoint.net wrote: I've registered for this service and am downloading a thesis: Queen Victoria : the monarch and the media 1837-1867 I have agreed to terms and conditions which provide that my copy is only for personal or educational use. The PDF download, 50megs, is free, but I could have had a hardbound copy for 30 pounds. Is that print-on-demand? Yes, it would have to be, loose-leaf and softbound options were also available. It is possible to copy the text from the PDF file and work with it on your own computer. Fred ___ WikiEN-l mailing list WikiEN-l@lists.wikimedia.org To unsubscribe from this mailing list, visit: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikien-l
