[Wikimania-l] Arrival date + Wikimania Takes Lake Como

[Rehman Abubakr]

Hi,

Can someone shed light on the preferred arrival date for Wikimania? The 
Programme page has dates listed from June 21 to June 28, but 21st, 27th, and 
28th are left blank.

Also, Wikimania Takes Lake Como (WTLC) is planned four days prior to 23rd 
(20th-23rd?). Does that mean folks who would like to attend this, needs to 
arrive on the 19th?

I've posted this on the wiki as well, but I did not get a clear response. So 
I'm posting here to reach a wider audience.

P.s. You might also be interested in this thread: 
https://wikimania2016.wikimedia.org/wiki/Talk:Programme#Pre_and_post-conference

Thanks,
User:Rehman
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Re: [Wikimania-l] Comitato Wikimania Esino Lario 2016

[Florence Devouard]

My own grain of salt as well

A few months ago, Wikimedia France was looking for an african wikipedian 
to facilitate an edit-a-thon in Africa as part of one of WM FR projects. 
Wikimedia France was supporting his travelling costs to the edit-a-thon 
place. A volunteer showed up, willing to do it. He lived in a nearby 
country.


When it came to reimburse his travel costs, Wikimedia France asked him 
to become a member of Wikimedia France to do so. The wikipedian was 
perplex about this request and asked me what I thought. I was perplex 
about this request as well and asked explanation. I got it and it really 
made sense to me.


The main argument is insurance. If an association "pays" (hire) a 
consultant/freelancer to facilitate an edit-a-thon, the person - as a 
professional - normally is covered by his own professionnal insurance. 
So if anything happens during the edit-a-thon, his insurance will cover 
this. But if the person providing the training is a volunteer, it is 
VERY likely that he has no insurance to cover anything that might 
happen. A personal insurance would probably not cover the situation. 
Only a professional insurance could. If the trainer is not covered and 
something happen, since the event is organized by Wikimedia France, the 
"victim" would turn toward Wikimedia France.


Of course Wikimedia France has an insurance but the insurance needs to 
be bordered. It can not cover anything, anyone, in all situations. And 
one of the easiest border is... membership. A contract can be drawn that 
covers members whilst they are participating to an event organized by 
Wikimedia France. A contract that would cover what could happen to 
anyone showing up at an event organized by Wikimedia France is a 
different story.


So the best way recommanded by interested parties and councillors is 
that any person reimbursed for an action done as part of Wikimedia 
France activities should be a member of the association. As such, he is 
covered by Wikimedia France insurance.


Risker statement "The Wikimedia movement has openly embraced the lack of 
requirement to identify or create an account/membership to participate 
since day one of
its existence." is actually... not correct. A lot of the activity of the 
Wikimedia mouvement go through participation to a User Group or a 
Wikimedia Chapter or various Thematic Organisations. And identification 
and joining as member are actually required in those cases.
Also... identification is also required to join various online "tasks 
forces" such as steward or OTRS agent.


Flo


Le 18/03/16 09:48, Gabriel Thullen a écrit :

I will add my grain of salt to this discussion.
When I was young, and I was traveling a lot, I would stay in Youth 
Hostels. Membership was mandatory.
Things have changed a bit, Youth Hostels now call themselves 
"Hostelling International" and in most places membership is no longer 
mandatory. But members (of any national organization) get all sorts of 
discounts and other perks.


I do not understand what the problem is if a membership is required in 
order to attend Wikimania. Does anybody have a Real Life example where 
such a membership has posed a problem ? Or are we just kibitzing to 
pass the time until June ?


Gabe

On Fri, Mar 18, 2016 at 2:43 AM, Cristian Consonni 
> wrote:


Hi,

2016-03-17 23:55 GMT+01:00 Risker >:
> Nemo, it's not standard practice. I've been to four or five
wikimanias and
> never had to join an association to go there. I have never had
to join an
> association to attend any other Wikimedia-related conference,
session, or
> activity. The Wikimedia movement has openly embraced the lack of
requirement
> to identify or create an account/membership to participate since
day one of
> its existence.  The budget of Wikimania should be published
onwiki, it
> should be transparent (to use the current buzzword) to everyone,
and nobody
> should have to pay money in order to find out its budget.

Before we get dragged too much into the philosophical question of what
being Truly Wikimedian (TM) really means I would like to point out a
little more of the context, with the disclaimer that: (1) I am not a
lawyer and (2) I am not/was not part of the group that made the
specific decision of setting up the association (3) I hope that
Iolanda and the team can find a solution to accommodate any specific
need.

Here some context:

(a) When you arrive in Italy if you stay for more than 48 hours, the
person/organization hosting you (regardless of your citizenship, this
applies to Italian citizens as well if they are staying in some place
that is not their habitual residence) must communicate within 8 days
your presence and your data to the local Questura (basically, the
government branch managing the 

Re: [Wikimania-l] Bus from Airport to the Venue

[Michael Peel]

According to the page at:
https://wikimania2016.wikimedia.org/wiki/Journey/Airports
it's 12 + 6.45 + 2.40 = €19.85 - but the price of a taxi might be a better 
comparison, since it's direct travel, avoiding changes, travel uncertainties, 
etc., and I'm sure that would be a lot more than €25.

Going back to the original question: I have to arrive quite late on Thursday 
(at 20.10), so it would be very useful to know the latest times that the busses 
will be running. It would also be good to know what the latest feasible time to 
travel from the airports to Esino Lario by public transport is, and what the 
best options are for people that will be arriving later, e.g., are there any 
recommended places to stay overnight in Milan or near Varenna-Esino before 
traveling on to Esino Lario in the morning?

Thanks,
Mike

> On 20 Mar 2016, at 07:14, Federico Leva (Nemo)  wrote:
> 
> Deryck Chan, 19/03/2016 23:51:
>> I calculated about €12 each way between Malpensa and Esino Lario, for
>> example?
> 
> What sort of calculation did you make? Mine would be 12 + 1.5 + 6.7 + 2.2.
> 
> Nemo
> 
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Re: [Wikimania-l] Comitato Wikimania Esino Lario 2016

[Lodewijk]

Hi Iolanda,

As also indicated by others, I don't see the overlap with staying at the
Hilton. Joining an association involves also signing up with the bylaws,
which is a whole extra set of lines of text to agree to (there are already
3 or 4 other sets of disclaimers I have to agree with) - even in a language
I don't speak. It means I join a legal person, which may or may not make me
liable (I don't know Italian law), which may or may not mean I have to
declare it with an employer etc. It has real world implications. It makes
me somewhat jointly responsible for the Wikimania budget.

While I don't like it per se, I can live with it being the default. My
question was though, is it possible to make an exception when people have
reasons not to want to join the association. If they foresee problems in
their specific circumstance, can they email someone and get an exception?

I can see why you want to have an association. I can see why you may want
people to join it. I don't see why /everyone/ must join it.

Lodewijk

On Wed, Mar 16, 2016 at 9:43 AM, Iolanda Pensa  wrote:

> There are no other solutions.
>
> Just to understand the logic behind it:
> If you go to the hilton you pay the hilton and you receive a receipt from
> this company. It is your decision if you are ok in paying that company and
> to use its service.
> In the case of Esino Lario you join an association, since we are not the
> hilton, we are not a company and we are managing the event with volunteers
> and a completely different structure to make a 761 village capable of
> hosting a quite large event without being structured to do so (we are
> literally creating most of the things from scratches). The aim of the
> association is to manage events and specifically Wikimania. Once the event
> is over the association will have 0 budget (used to cover with the income
> received from the registrations the expenses related to the
> members-participants); the association and the membership – as the name of
> the association clearly communicates - is meant for Wikimania 2016. A
> committee would have been an easier structure (we initially registered it
> as a committee) but this December 2015, in Italy committee do not exist any
> longer as registered institutions (but we want an officially registered
> institution to make everything clear and correct even if of course - as
> many of you know - it is complex and longer than doing things informally).
>
> It would have been nice to have Wikimedia Italia managing all this, but in
> 2014 Wikimedia Italia decided that it was too complicated and they did not
> have enough staff to do it.
> So in Esino Lario we applied for fundings through Associazione Amici del
> Museo delle Grigne Onlus (an association of volunteers without staff)
> and we established this new association to make the management and the
> accountability of Wikimania possible, transparent and correct (also in this
> case an association of volunteers without staff).
>
> This choice was thought through and please do not hesitate to ask any
> further question.
> thanks
> iolanda
>
> Il giorno 15 mar 2016, alle ore 22:29, Lodewijk <
> lodew...@effeietsanders.org> ha scritto:
>
> If membership is required to be a participant under this structure, such a
> solution would require all participants to become a member of Wikimedia
> Italia. Which is maybe less ideal than becoming member of something that is
> meant to be temporary.
>
> Still it is an odd situation to be honest... Iolanda: are there solutions
> for people who don't want to become a member, or cannot become a member
> because of their job etc? Perhaps at a higher fee if necessary (not sure if
> this construction gives tax benefits etc)
>
> Lodewijk
>
> Lodewijk
>
> On Tue, Mar 15, 2016 at 9:31 PM, Michael Peel  wrote:
>
>> Couldn't Wikimedia Italia do this?
>>
>> Thanks,
>> Mike
>>
>> On 15 Mar 2016, at 11:44, Iolanda Pensa  wrote:
>>
>> Here is the explanation of why we created a Committee which is an
>> association managing Wikimania[1].
>>
>> I’ll add the answers also online:
>> 1. we needed an institution managing the income from the registration and
>> the expenses which involve a very large number of people (priviate, not
>> only companies); the institution we established is a non profit (it doesn’t
>> share the income among anyone), it is managed by volunteers with experience
>> in accounting and it is a specific institution with a separate bank account
>> from Associazione Amici del Museo delle Grigne Onlus (which as an onlus is
>> not the appropriate institution).
>> 2. we created an association according to the advice of experts in
>> associations and management. since we have a non profit nature, associating
>> the participants for the event is the solution which has been chosen as the
>> only suitable to allow us to collect the payments and to reimburse the
>> flats and to pay the other expenses linked to food, 

Re: [Wikimania-l] Community Village and Meetups at Wikimania 2016

[ZOKIDIN .]

   - Due to global vandalism Никита-Родин-2002
   
,
   my account User:ZOKIDIN@global
    locked globally
   wikipedia. It's not me. Global Vandalism The list below badboy user Nikita.
   For God's sake, help me please.

I good user. Be good, please.

2016-03-12 3:13 GMT+04:00 :

> Asaf directed that comment to Olaniyan but this is not about Olaniyan not
> receiving Wikimanian scholarship but the under-representation of
> established Wikimedia communities in Africa. Olaniyan is just one out of
> hundreds of contributors to Wikimedia projects from Africa. I remind you
> that no one is compromising the need to support and promote the creation
> and sharing of free knowledge in Africa.
>
> Best,
>
> Isaac.
> Sent from my BlackBerry® wireless handheld from Glo Mobile.
> --
> *From: * Nkansah Rexford 
> *Date: *Fri, 11 Mar 2016 23:02:16 +
> *To: *Gnangarra
> *Cc: *reachout2is...@gmail.com; Wikimania
> general list (open subscription)
> *Subject: *Re: [Wikimania-l] Community Village and Meetups at Wikimania
> 2016
>
> Your point is well noted.
>
> Quoting Asaf's message ( found at:
> https://lists.wikimedia.org/pipermail/african-wikimedians/2016-March/000614.html
> ):
>
> "I also invite you to think about what else might be done to support and
> promote the creation and sharing of free knowledge in Africa, beyond
> awarding a few more scholarships to Africans.  I remind you that the
> Wikimedia Foundation is eager to support mission-aligned work, including
> experimentation, through the various grants programs[1], and that there is
> a wealth of written materials about program design and best
> practices[2][3][4], for African volunteers motivated to do more
> programmatic work in Africa.
>
> If you would take me up on this invitation, I would love to hear your
> thoughts on work in Africa, beyond Wikimania scholarships.
>
>A.
>
> [1] https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Grants:Start
> [2] https://outreach.wikimedia.org/
> [3] https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Grants:Learning_patterns
> [4] https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Grants:Evaluation/Program_Toolkits
> "
> Perhaps we can come together to brainstorm of ways to improve the system?
>
> On Friday, March 11, 2016, Gnangarra  wrote:
>
>> Olatunde raises a significant issue in that call for communities to
>> participate in the community village is demoralising if communities dont
>> have the opportunity to attend the event which is suppose to be bringing
>> everyone together.   We have the underlying principle of sharing the sum
>>  of all knowledge, if we dont do it internally then we cant do it
>> successfully externally.
>>
>> As for the response the process for Wikimania has been changed, in Mexico
>> last year a decision was taken with many communities unaware and excluded
>> from the discussion because they didnt have anyone there. With Wikmania
>> being every 2 years its becomes more significant that all communities have
>> representatives attend every wikimania otherwise it ends up isolating
>> communities for 4 years from the whole of the movement.The scholarship
>> process is also broken and its needs to be discussed it needs to be
>> reconsidered to allow for the changes.
>>
>>
>>
>> On 11 March 2016 at 23:01,  wrote:
>>
>>> Nkansah Rexford, I have no idea of why you directed such a non-sequitur
>>> comment to me. Regrettably, your tone is condescending with lack of
>>> empathy. Everyone have the right to voice their concerns and you're not in
>>> the best position to criticize them. That being said, Nobody begged for
>>> Wikimania scholarship but we have the right as a community to raise concern
>>> on certain issues and that is none of your business. You're neither a chair
>>> of the scholarship committee nor the Wikimedia Foundation Events Manager.
>>> You are not in the best position to respond to this. It is always a good
>>> idea to learn to be reserved.
>>>
>>> I don't like to say you're crude and rude but kindly have the decency to
>>> be polite when addressing your fellow Wikipedians.
>>>
>>> Warmest regards,
>>>
>>> Olatunde Isaac.
>>>
>>> Sent from my BlackBerry® wireless handheld from Glo Mobile.
>>> --
>>> *From: * Nkansah Rexford 
>>> *Date: *Fri, 11 Mar 2016 14:30:07 +
>>> *To: *; Wikimania general list (open
>>> subscription)
>>> *Subject: *Re: [Wikimania-l] Community Village and Meetups at Wikimania
>>> 2016
>>>
>>> The scholarships are what they are: scholarships, not ticket to heaven.
>>>
>>> Many factors go into approving an application for scholarships. 

Re: [Wikimania-l] Return journey

[Ellie Young]

 For WMF Scholarship People only (others on this mailing list should not go
to this google document since it is not part of the regular registration
process):



On Tue, Mar 15, 2016 at 10:31 PM, Bodhisattwa Mandal <
bodhisattwa.rg...@gmail.com> wrote:

> Hi,
>
> I was filling up the travel details form (
> https://docs.google.com/forms/d/1M5iU2fn38sLxYOlb-PkVzneZiVHc9pwbgzVxeRFCfYo/viewform
> the travel details form) and got stuck in the return journey section. The
> following line is written in that section of the form
>
>  - *Return Journey; you will be departing from Milan on 27th June,
> Travelling to which city/airport?*
>
> Now, what if, someone want to travel for few days after conference or
> attend for the post-conference events and return from another airport other
> than Milan. It seems that there is no such option in the form to plan for
> the travel. Its a bit confusing. Can someone from the scholarship team help
> with this.
>

Please indicate what you requirements/changes/desires are for the return on
the box right underneath this:

Further comments regarding your travel requirements: *

The Travel agency can work with you on this.   Please get in touch with me
directly if you have any more questions about the scholarship registration
process.

Thanks, Ellie

wikimimaniascholarsh...@wikimedia.org




>
> --
> Bodhisattwa
>
>
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>


-- 
Ellie Young
Events Manager
Wikimedia Foundation
eyo...@wikimedia.org
c. 510 701 8649
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Re: [Wikimania-l] Bus from Airport to the Venue

[Federico Leva (Nemo)]

Deryck Chan, 19/03/2016 23:51:

I calculated about €12 each way between Malpensa and Esino Lario, for
example?


What sort of calculation did you make? Mine would be 12 + 1.5 + 6.7 + 2.2.

Nemo

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