Re: [Wikimedia-l] Relationship between Wikimedia and oDesk
I have not used it but would like to know more. If WMF employees/contractors are free to sell their services as paid Wikipedia editors on oDesk, I think that a how-to-sell-your-services guide would be helpful so that active unpaid volunteers who are not employees know how to go get some money from their hobby. To date, I have never be paid for my volunteer work, neither have I been an employee of the WMF or a Chapter, but my activities as an active batch uploader and bot-writer for Commons might be fungible and if so, I would like to sell my services ethically and openly. Fae On 8 January 2014 07:30, MZMcBride z...@mzmcbride.com wrote: Hi. Can anyone explain the relationship between Wikimedia and oDesk? https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/oDesk As I understand it, the Wikimedia Foundation uses oDesk with contractors to track their hours. (Right?) But it also appears to be a job board of some kind. It seems like a hybrid of LinkedIn and Craigslist, though I haven't looked carefully and I'm still lightly poking around. It seems like the kind of place where you can post Wikipedia paid editing services. If this is part of oDesk, does anyone know roughly how many people offer or buy these services? Regarding paid editing, Jimmy reiterated his stance on his talk page saying I very very strongly condemn such editing, and this is no exception and expressing his usual principled objections to such things in the strongest possible terms. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Special:Permalink/589723131 I think the underlying issue deserves a discussion, apart from particular examples. MZMcBride ___ Wikimedia-l mailing list Wikimedia-l@lists.wikimedia.org Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l, mailto:wikimedia-l-requ...@lists.wikimedia.org?subject=unsubscribe -- fae...@gmail.com http://j.mp/faewm Personal and confidential, please do not circulate or re-quote. ___ Wikimedia-l mailing list Wikimedia-l@lists.wikimedia.org Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l, mailto:wikimedia-l-requ...@lists.wikimedia.org?subject=unsubscribe
Re: [Wikimedia-l] Relationship between Wikimedia and oDesk
Hoi, Odesk is the way the WMF pays people who do not live in the USA. What is expected of a contractor or employee is to register the time worked for the WMF and the contractor is paid through Odesk. This has all kinds of legal reasons. When an employee / contractor wants to use Odesk in addition to work done for the WMF, they can as long as the contract with WMF does not require exclusivity. Typically people working through Odesk work in the area of software development. Thanks, Gerard On 8 January 2014 09:04, Fæ fae...@gmail.com wrote: I have not used it but would like to know more. If WMF employees/contractors are free to sell their services as paid Wikipedia editors on oDesk, I think that a how-to-sell-your-services guide would be helpful so that active unpaid volunteers who are not employees know how to go get some money from their hobby. To date, I have never be paid for my volunteer work, neither have I been an employee of the WMF or a Chapter, but my activities as an active batch uploader and bot-writer for Commons might be fungible and if so, I would like to sell my services ethically and openly. Fae On 8 January 2014 07:30, MZMcBride z...@mzmcbride.com wrote: Hi. Can anyone explain the relationship between Wikimedia and oDesk? https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/oDesk As I understand it, the Wikimedia Foundation uses oDesk with contractors to track their hours. (Right?) But it also appears to be a job board of some kind. It seems like a hybrid of LinkedIn and Craigslist, though I haven't looked carefully and I'm still lightly poking around. It seems like the kind of place where you can post Wikipedia paid editing services. If this is part of oDesk, does anyone know roughly how many people offer or buy these services? Regarding paid editing, Jimmy reiterated his stance on his talk page saying I very very strongly condemn such editing, and this is no exception and expressing his usual principled objections to such things in the strongest possible terms. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Special:Permalink/589723131 I think the underlying issue deserves a discussion, apart from particular examples. MZMcBride ___ Wikimedia-l mailing list Wikimedia-l@lists.wikimedia.org Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l, mailto:wikimedia-l-requ...@lists.wikimedia.org?subject=unsubscribe -- fae...@gmail.com http://j.mp/faewm Personal and confidential, please do not circulate or re-quote. ___ Wikimedia-l mailing list Wikimedia-l@lists.wikimedia.org Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l, mailto:wikimedia-l-requ...@lists.wikimedia.org?subject=unsubscribe ___ Wikimedia-l mailing list Wikimedia-l@lists.wikimedia.org Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l, mailto:wikimedia-l-requ...@lists.wikimedia.org?subject=unsubscribe
Re: [Wikimedia-l] Relationship between Wikimedia and oDesk
Thought paid editing is prohibited. It could be nice to find ways to enforce that. On Wed, 8 Jan 2014, at 21:50, Gerard Meijssen wrote: Hoi, Odesk is the way the WMF pays people who do not live in the USA. What is expected of a contractor or employee is to register the time worked for the WMF and the contractor is paid through Odesk. This has all kinds of legal reasons. When an employee / contractor wants to use Odesk in addition to work done for the WMF, they can as long as the contract with WMF does not require exclusivity. Typically people working through Odesk work in the area of software development. Thanks, Gerard On 8 January 2014 09:04, Fæ fae...@gmail.com wrote: I have not used it but would like to know more. If WMF employees/contractors are free to sell their services as paid Wikipedia editors on oDesk, I think that a how-to-sell-your-services guide would be helpful so that active unpaid volunteers who are not employees know how to go get some money from their hobby. To date, I have never be paid for my volunteer work, neither have I been an employee of the WMF or a Chapter, but my activities as an active batch uploader and bot-writer for Commons might be fungible and if so, I would like to sell my services ethically and openly. Fae On 8 January 2014 07:30, MZMcBride z...@mzmcbride.com wrote: Hi. Can anyone explain the relationship between Wikimedia and oDesk? https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/oDesk As I understand it, the Wikimedia Foundation uses oDesk with contractors to track their hours. (Right?) But it also appears to be a job board of some kind. It seems like a hybrid of LinkedIn and Craigslist, though I haven't looked carefully and I'm still lightly poking around. It seems like the kind of place where you can post Wikipedia paid editing services. If this is part of oDesk, does anyone know roughly how many people offer or buy these services? Regarding paid editing, Jimmy reiterated his stance on his talk page saying I very very strongly condemn such editing, and this is no exception and expressing his usual principled objections to such things in the strongest possible terms. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Special:Permalink/589723131 I think the underlying issue deserves a discussion, apart from particular examples. MZMcBride ___ Wikimedia-l mailing list Wikimedia-l@lists.wikimedia.org Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l, mailto:wikimedia-l-requ...@lists.wikimedia.org?subject=unsubscribe -- fae...@gmail.com http://j.mp/faewm Personal and confidential, please do not circulate or re-quote. ___ Wikimedia-l mailing list Wikimedia-l@lists.wikimedia.org Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l, mailto:wikimedia-l-requ...@lists.wikimedia.org?subject=unsubscribe ___ Wikimedia-l mailing list Wikimedia-l@lists.wikimedia.org Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l, mailto:wikimedia-l-requ...@lists.wikimedia.org?subject=unsubscribe ___ Wikimedia-l mailing list Wikimedia-l@lists.wikimedia.org Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l, mailto:wikimedia-l-requ...@lists.wikimedia.org?subject=unsubscribe
Re: [Wikimedia-l] Relationship between Wikimedia and oDesk
On Wed, Jan 8, 2014 at 12:43 PM, Gryllida gryll...@fastmail.fm wrote: Thought paid editing is prohibited. It could be nice to find ways to enforce that. I don't think it's expressly forbidden, 'frowned upon' would be the words I'd use. Apart from that, I have a feeling this whole thread is a storm in less than a glass of water. Odesk is a system where people can offer or take jobs. Wikimedia uses it (though in a somewhat different way). How on Earth do those two facts imply Odesk is probably used for paid editing? -- André Engels, andreeng...@gmail.com ___ Wikimedia-l mailing list Wikimedia-l@lists.wikimedia.org Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l, mailto:wikimedia-l-requ...@lists.wikimedia.org?subject=unsubscribe
Re: [Wikimedia-l] Relationship between Wikimedia and oDesk
On 8 January 2014 12:12, Andre Engels andreeng...@gmail.com wrote: I don't think it's expressly forbidden, 'frowned upon' would be the words I'd use. Apart from that, I have a feeling this whole thread is a storm in less than a glass of water. Odesk is a system where people can offer or take jobs. Wikimedia uses it (though in a somewhat different way). How on Earth do those two facts imply Odesk is probably used for paid editing? Because it's feed the trolls week, obviously. - d. ___ Wikimedia-l mailing list Wikimedia-l@lists.wikimedia.org Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l, mailto:wikimedia-l-requ...@lists.wikimedia.org?subject=unsubscribe
Re: [Wikimedia-l] Relationship between Wikimedia and oDesk
On 8 January 2014 12:14, David Gerard dger...@gmail.com wrote: Because it's feed the trolls week, obviously. Here David, have a cookie. ___ Wikimedia-l mailing list Wikimedia-l@lists.wikimedia.org Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l, mailto:wikimedia-l-requ...@lists.wikimedia.org?subject=unsubscribe
[Wikimedia-l] Thanking anonymous users
Hi, Is there any plan to allow using the Thanks feature to thank anonymous Wikimedia users? A Hebrew Wikipedia user asked me about this, saying that it may be even more useful to thank anons than logged-in users. -- Amir Elisha Aharoni · אָמִיר אֱלִישָׁע אַהֲרוֹנִי http://aharoni.wordpress.com “We're living in pieces, I want to live in peace.” – T. Moore ___ Wikimedia-l mailing list Wikimedia-l@lists.wikimedia.org Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l, mailto:wikimedia-l-requ...@lists.wikimedia.org?subject=unsubscribe
Re: [Wikimedia-l] Thanking anonymous users
On 08.01.2014 15:22, Amir E. Aharoni wrote: Hi, Is there any plan to allow using the Thanks feature to thank anonymous Wikimedia users? A Hebrew Wikipedia user asked me about this, saying that it may be even more useful to thank anons than logged-in users. How would they know someone thanked them? Cheers Yaroslav ___ Wikimedia-l mailing list Wikimedia-l@lists.wikimedia.org Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l, mailto:wikimedia-l-requ...@lists.wikimedia.org?subject=unsubscribe
Re: [Wikimedia-l] Thanking anonymous users
Something like the new message orange bar :) I guess that designers and Growth people may know an answer, but all thoughts are welcome. -- Amir Elisha Aharoni · אָמִיר אֱלִישָׁע אַהֲרוֹנִי http://aharoni.wordpress.com “We're living in pieces, I want to live in peace.” – T. Moore 2014/1/8 Yaroslav M. Blanter pute...@mccme.ru On 08.01.2014 15:22, Amir E. Aharoni wrote: Hi, Is there any plan to allow using the Thanks feature to thank anonymous Wikimedia users? A Hebrew Wikipedia user asked me about this, saying that it may be even more useful to thank anons than logged-in users. How would they know someone thanked them? Cheers Yaroslav ___ Wikimedia-l mailing list Wikimedia-l@lists.wikimedia.org Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l, mailto:wikimedia-l-requ...@lists.wikimedia.org?subject=unsubscribe ___ Wikimedia-l mailing list Wikimedia-l@lists.wikimedia.org Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l, mailto:wikimedia-l-requ...@lists.wikimedia.org?subject=unsubscribe
Re: [Wikimedia-l] Thanking anonymous users
We should thank them for editing using a major banner, a la the fundraiser. I don't know why we do huge fundraising drives but seem to neglect editing drives, even though editing is really the core way for people to donate to Wikimedia. ___ Wikimedia-l mailing list Wikimedia-l@lists.wikimedia.org Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l, mailto:wikimedia-l-requ...@lists.wikimedia.org?subject=unsubscribe
Re: [Wikimedia-l] Thanking anonymous users
Amir E. Aharoni, 08/01/2014 15:32:
Something like the new message orange bar :)
Yeah, orange bar be blessed.
I guess that designers and Growth people may know an answer, but all
thoughts are welcome.
As long as the orange bar works (it doesn't on mobile, beware), you can
just use a variant of the many {{thanks}} templates and post them on
their talk pages with some JavaScript mimicking the thanks button.
Nemo
___
Wikimedia-l mailing list
Wikimedia-l@lists.wikimedia.org
Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l,
mailto:wikimedia-l-requ...@lists.wikimedia.org?subject=unsubscribe
Re: [Wikimedia-l] Thanking anonymous users
* Nathan wrote: We should thank them for editing using a major banner, a la the fundraiser. I don't know why we do huge fundraising drives but seem to neglect editing drives, even though editing is really the core way for people to donate to Wikimedia. That would make many editors very annoyed and angry and drive them away. -- Björn Höhrmann · mailto:bjo...@hoehrmann.de · http://bjoern.hoehrmann.de Am Badedeich 7 · Telefon: +49(0)160/4415681 · http://www.bjoernsworld.de 25899 Dagebüll · PGP Pub. KeyID: 0xA4357E78 · http://www.websitedev.de/ ___ Wikimedia-l mailing list Wikimedia-l@lists.wikimedia.org Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l, mailto:wikimedia-l-requ...@lists.wikimedia.org?subject=unsubscribe
Re: [Wikimedia-l] Thanking anonymous users
On Wed, Jan 8, 2014 at 10:10 AM, Bjoern Hoehrmann derhoe...@gmx.net wrote: * Nathan wrote: We should thank them for editing using a major banner, a la the fundraiser. I don't know why we do huge fundraising drives but seem to neglect editing drives, even though editing is really the core way for people to donate to Wikimedia. That would make many editors very annoyed and angry and drive them away. I very seriously doubt that is the case, and if they object to efforts to publicly attract new editors to Wikimedia projects... Banners irritate people, but anyone with a sincere interest in contributing to Wikimedia should be able to accept the necessity of maintaining both the financial and human resources of the movement. ___ Wikimedia-l mailing list Wikimedia-l@lists.wikimedia.org Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l, mailto:wikimedia-l-requ...@lists.wikimedia.org?subject=unsubscribe
Re: [Wikimedia-l] Relationship between Wikimedia and oDesk
Hello dear all, I won't impose my standard to other people, I just want to tell you what is the standard I setup for myself, and I will also tell you why. I won't accept payment or gift exceeding a certain amount (means 20 Euro) or search for payment for my volunteer's work that is however related to Wikimedia. Especially when I was on my travel reject gift may be considered as unfriendly or even insulting, this is the ONLY reason why I do accept small gifts. And by larger gift, like a quite expansive looking image band I received in Kazakhstan I brought it to the office and left it there. There are a few reasons for this: At first a very personal one: I made the experience in my life again and again that I lost my fun and my interest on something as soon as I got paid for it. Get paid = in debt of = duty = no fun. Second is a philosophical one: I believe that getting paid do have a desruptive effect on the free and collaboratory character of our projects. The philosophical background is that I believe knowledge and education is something like air, it is the basics of human live and humanity and should not be charged. But well, I know, not all people, (maybe most people) don't share this view point. Third is a practical one: And this especially for people who occupy a position in the movement, be it an employee of one of the organizations, or be it a volunteer board member or a committee member: If you need to fend off an accusation (most probably conflict of interest, or misuse of power), you are in a bad position. It is in this case unimportant if the accusation is true or not, battling against rumors and emotions is a hard battle. And the limbo of being stained will always be with you. Sadly, I have seen this too often by people inside of the movement and outside of the movement (mainly in the politics) that I actually wonder why people still fall into these pitfalls again and again. So try to stay in a position in which you will not be confronted with such a battle. It is simply like in the medicine: prophylax is better than antibiotics. A few words to my view on paid edition: I think this is something that we cannot avoid happening. Prohibition just drives them into secrecy. As such, I prefer it to be done openly instead of in secrecy. My personal aversion against paid edition should be quite obvious from the above account, just I don't feel I can (or should) enforce it upon other people. Greetings Ting Am 1/8/2014 9:04 AM, schrieb Fæ: I have not used it but would like to know more. If WMF employees/contractors are free to sell their services as paid Wikipedia editors on oDesk, I think that a how-to-sell-your-services guide would be helpful so that active unpaid volunteers who are not employees know how to go get some money from their hobby. To date, I have never be paid for my volunteer work, neither have I been an employee of the WMF or a Chapter, but my activities as an active batch uploader and bot-writer for Commons might be fungible and if so, I would like to sell my services ethically and openly. Fae On 8 January 2014 07:30, MZMcBride z...@mzmcbride.com wrote: Hi. Can anyone explain the relationship between Wikimedia and oDesk? https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/oDesk As I understand it, the Wikimedia Foundation uses oDesk with contractors to track their hours. (Right?) But it also appears to be a job board of some kind. It seems like a hybrid of LinkedIn and Craigslist, though I haven't looked carefully and I'm still lightly poking around. It seems like the kind of place where you can post Wikipedia paid editing services. If this is part of oDesk, does anyone know roughly how many people offer or buy these services? Regarding paid editing, Jimmy reiterated his stance on his talk page saying I very very strongly condemn such editing, and this is no exception and expressing his usual principled objections to such things in the strongest possible terms. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Special:Permalink/589723131 I think the underlying issue deserves a discussion, apart from particular examples. MZMcBride ___ Wikimedia-l mailing list Wikimedia-l@lists.wikimedia.org Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l, mailto:wikimedia-l-requ...@lists.wikimedia.org?subject=unsubscribe ___ Wikimedia-l mailing list Wikimedia-l@lists.wikimedia.org Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l, mailto:wikimedia-l-requ...@lists.wikimedia.org?subject=unsubscribe
Re: [Wikimedia-l] Relationship between Wikimedia and oDesk
+1 to Ting's philosophy. Best WMF trustee ever. ;-) It may be worth illustrating how I might draw the line between my unpaid volunteer work and taking payment for some tasks. To date I have uploaded something like 160,000+ images to Commons and never been paid anything for my time. My work has been in fits and starts and my attention wanders from one project to the next, like most unpaid volunteers. :-D The sort of task that I would like to get some remuneration for, would be where an archive or GLAM wanted me to work closely with them to achieve their public access objectives, rather than leaving it to me just to upload the best bits in ways that I thought were most appropriate. Spending significant time helping paid staff to run public volunteer events, process their in-house metadata, choose what to scan, video or record, decide how to release it online (either on Commons or elsewhere), what licence to choose, and help with writing code for tools like pywikipediabot or reprocessing to open media formats, seems a perfectly reasonable thing to charge for, particularly if they would like me to do this to satisfy their schedule rather than leaving it to me to stick it on my ever lengthening back-burner of interesting stuff. Cheers, Fae -- fae...@gmail.com http://j.mp/faewm ___ Wikimedia-l mailing list Wikimedia-l@lists.wikimedia.org Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l, mailto:wikimedia-l-requ...@lists.wikimedia.org?subject=unsubscribe
Re: [Wikimedia-l] Relationship between Wikimedia and oDesk
On 01/08/2014 02:30 AM, MZMcBride wrote: Can anyone explain the relationship between Wikimedia and oDesk? The short of it: oDesk is indeed roughly the same kind of job board as freelancer.com and its ilk. The foundation is simply a client, and uses it only to pay its contractors and (most of)* their non-US workforce; and AFAIK never just contract out from postings. Contractors input work hours, WMF pays oDesk, oDesk sends monies to contractor. The system itself is a little shitty and quite a bit expensive, but considerably less so than it would be to set up legal entities able to directly pay people outside the US as local employees (including the horrible mess that it actually /is/ to have employees in other countries rather than contract out). -- Marc * some staffers instead work for a business entity that /itself/ contracts out to the WMF in which case it works a bit differently because then oDesk is no longer necessary as a middle man. ___ Wikimedia-l mailing list Wikimedia-l@lists.wikimedia.org Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l, mailto:wikimedia-l-requ...@lists.wikimedia.org?subject=unsubscribe
Re: [Wikimedia-l] Relationship between Wikimedia and oDesk
On Wed, Jan 8, 2014 at 8:07 AM, Marc A. Pelletier m...@uberbox.org wrote: On 01/08/2014 02:30 AM, MZMcBride wrote: Can anyone explain the relationship between Wikimedia and oDesk? The short of it: oDesk is indeed roughly the same kind of job board as freelancer.com and its ilk. The foundation is simply a client, and uses it only to pay its contractors and (most of)* their non-US workforce; and AFAIK never just contract out from postings. Contractors input work hours, WMF pays oDesk, oDesk sends monies to contractor. The system itself is a little shitty and quite a bit expensive, but considerably less so than it would be to set up legal entities able to directly pay people outside the US as local employees (including the horrible mess that it actually /is/ to have employees in other countries rather than contract out). -- Marc * some staffers instead work for a business entity that /itself/ contracts out to the WMF in which case it works a bit differently because then oDesk is no longer necessary as a middle man. Marc said everything I was going to say. This was my experience with oDesk as a US-based contractor as well. The contracting process was done like the normal hiring process and completely apart from oDesk. oDesk was simply used to input hours and receive payment. -Chad ___ Wikimedia-l mailing list Wikimedia-l@lists.wikimedia.org Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l, mailto:wikimedia-l-requ...@lists.wikimedia.org?subject=unsubscribe
Re: [Wikimedia-l] Relationship between Wikimedia and oDesk
On 01/08/2014 11:07 AM, Marc A. Pelletier wrote: The system itself is a little [suboptimal] It should go without saying (but may be worth clarifying) that this is my personal opinion from having suffered oDesk for a year and not that of the Foundation. :-) -- Marc ___ Wikimedia-l mailing list Wikimedia-l@lists.wikimedia.org Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l, mailto:wikimedia-l-requ...@lists.wikimedia.org?subject=unsubscribe
[Wikimedia-l] Wikimania 2014 scholarship now accepting application
Hi all, Scholarship applications for Wikimania 2014 in London are now being accepted. Applications are open until the end of the day UTC on 17 February. Wikimania 2014 scholarships is an award given to an individual to enable them to attend Wikimania in London from 6-10 August, 2014. Only a single type of scholarship will be available from the Wikimedia Foundation for Wikimania 2014. A Wikimedia Foundation scholarship will cover the cost of an individual's round-trip travel costs as arranged by the Wikimedia Foundation travel agency, shared accommodation as arranged by the Wikimedia Foundation, and registration for Wikimania. Applicants will be rated using a pre-determined selection process and selection criteria by the Scholarship Committee, who will determine which are successful. To learn more about Wikimania 2014 scholarships, please visit https://wikimania2014.wikimedia.org/wiki/Scholarships. To apply for a scholarship, fill out the application form on http://scholarships.wikimedia.org/apply. It is highly recommended that applicants review all of the material on the Scholarships page and the associated FAQ before submitting an application. If you have any question, please contact wikimania-scholarsh...@wikimedia.org or leave a message on https://wikimania2014.wikimedia.org/wiki/Talk:Scholarships. Katie Chan Chair, Scholarship Committee -- Katie Chan Any views or opinions presented in this e-mail are solely those of the author and do not necessarily represent the view of any organisation the author is associated with or employed by. Experience is a good school but the fees are high. - Heinrich Heine ___ Wikimedia-l mailing list Wikimedia-l@lists.wikimedia.org Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l, mailto:wikimedia-l-requ...@lists.wikimedia.org?subject=unsubscribe
Re: [Wikimedia-l] Wikimania 2014 scholarship now accepting application
On 01/08/2014 12:37 PM, Katie Chan wrote: Only a single type of scholarship will be available from the Wikimedia Foundation for Wikimania 2014. I rather liked the idea of partial scholarships in past years since it would allow more people to attend on the same budget when practical. Can I ask why this was decided against this year? -- Marc ___ Wikimedia-l mailing list Wikimedia-l@lists.wikimedia.org Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l, mailto:wikimedia-l-requ...@lists.wikimedia.org?subject=unsubscribe
Re: [Wikimedia-l] Wikimania 2014 scholarship now accepting application
On 08/01/2014 17:39, Marc A. Pelletier wrote: On 01/08/2014 12:37 PM, Katie Chan wrote: Only a single type of scholarship will be available from the Wikimedia Foundation for Wikimania 2014. I rather liked the idea of partial scholarships in past years since it would allow more people to attend on the same budget when practical. Can I ask why this was decided against this year? Per the FAQ[1]: The low acceptance rate of partial scholarships and overhead in reimbursing for partial scholarships for Wikimania 2013 https://wikimania2013.wikimedia.org/wiki/Main_page made it apparent that the funds would be better spent in offering more full scholarships. I hope that helps. KTC [1]: https://wikimania2014.wikimedia.org/wiki/Scholarships/FAQ -- Katie Chan Any views or opinions presented in this e-mail are solely those of the author and do not necessarily represent the view of any organisation the author is associated with or employed by. Experience is a good school but the fees are high. - Heinrich Heine ___ Wikimedia-l mailing list Wikimedia-l@lists.wikimedia.org Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l, mailto:wikimedia-l-requ...@lists.wikimedia.org?subject=unsubscribe
[Wikimedia-l] [Wikimedia Announcements] Fwd: [Wikimania-l] Wikimania 2014 scholarship now accepting application
Hi all, Scholarship applications for Wikimania 2014 in London are now being accepted. Applications are open until the end of the day UTC on 17 February. Wikimania 2014 scholarships is an award given to an individual to enable them to attend Wikimania in London from 6-10 August, 2014. Only a single type of scholarship will be available from the Wikimedia Foundation for Wikimania 2014. A Wikimedia Foundation scholarship will cover the cost of an individual's round-trip travel costs as arranged by the Wikimedia Foundation travel agency, shared accommodation as arranged by the Wikimedia Foundation, and registration for Wikimania. Applicants will be rated using a pre-determined selection process and selection criteria by the Scholarship Committee, who will determine which are successful. To learn more about Wikimania 2014 scholarships, please visit https://wikimania2014.wikimedia.org/wiki/Scholarships. To apply for a scholarship, fill out the application form on http://scholarships.wikimedia.org/apply. It is highly recommended that applicants review all of the material on the Scholarships page and the associated FAQ before submitting an application. If you have any question, please contact wikimania-scholarsh...@wikimedia.org or leave a message on https://wikimania2014.wikimedia.org/wiki/Talk:Scholarships. Katie Chan Chair, Scholarship Committee -- Katie Chan Any views or opinions presented in this e-mail are solely those of the author and do not necessarily represent the view of any organisation the author is associated with or employed by. Experience is a good school but the fees are high. - Heinrich Heine ___ Please note: all replies sent to this mailing list will be immediately directed to Wikimedia-l, the public mailing list of the Wikimedia community. For more information about Wikimedia-l: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l ___ WikimediaAnnounce-l mailing list wikimediaannounc...@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimediaannounce-l ___ Wikimedia-l mailing list Wikimedia-l@lists.wikimedia.org Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l, mailto:wikimedia-l-requ...@lists.wikimedia.org?subject=unsubscribe
Re: [Wikimedia-l] Proposed bylaws amendment
Thanks Alice. For those interested in this, you might like to note that James Hare has started a discussion about the method used to select these Board members, here; - it reflects the likelihood that thematic orgs will be part of the decision not just chapters. https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Chapter-selected_Board_seats/2014_resolution Regards, Chris On Tue, Jan 7, 2014 at 8:51 PM, Alice Wiegand awieg...@wikimedia.orgwrote: Hi all, In 2013 the WMF Board of Trustees started to publish proposed bylaw changes on Meta for consultation with the community. As we want to continue with this new tradition you find a proposed change at https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Wikimedia_Foundation_bylaws/January_2014_-_Amendment_for_Trustees_selected_by_Chapters_and_Thematic_Organizations The Board Governance Committee (BGC) was commissioned by the Board to prepare the resolution and the BGC present it to the Board at the same time we publish it on Meta. Now a 10 day discussion phase starts after which the Board starts voting. I'm happy to invite you to review and discuss the resolution draft. Please share your comments on the talk page. Regards, Alice. -- Alice Wiegand Board of Trustees Wikimedia Foundation Support Free Knowledge: https://wikimediafoundation.org/wiki/Donate ___ Wikimedia-l mailing list Wikimedia-l@lists.wikimedia.org Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l, mailto:wikimedia-l-requ...@lists.wikimedia.org?subject=unsubscribe ___ Wikimedia-l mailing list Wikimedia-l@lists.wikimedia.org Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l, mailto:wikimedia-l-requ...@lists.wikimedia.org?subject=unsubscribe
Re: [Wikimedia-l] Wikimania 2014 scholarship now accepting application
Note, though, that this is WMF, and presumably doesn't stop the individual chapters offering partial scholarships if they want to... Andrew. On 8 January 2014 17:50, Katie Chan k...@ktchan.info wrote: On 08/01/2014 17:39, Marc A. Pelletier wrote: On 01/08/2014 12:37 PM, Katie Chan wrote: Only a single type of scholarship will be available from the Wikimedia Foundation for Wikimania 2014. I rather liked the idea of partial scholarships in past years since it would allow more people to attend on the same budget when practical. Can I ask why this was decided against this year? Per the FAQ[1]: The low acceptance rate of partial scholarships and overhead in reimbursing for partial scholarships for Wikimania 2013 https://wikimania2013.wikimedia.org/wiki/Main_page made it apparent that the funds would be better spent in offering more full scholarships. I hope that helps. KTC [1]: https://wikimania2014.wikimedia.org/wiki/Scholarships/FAQ -- Katie Chan Any views or opinions presented in this e-mail are solely those of the author and do not necessarily represent the view of any organisation the author is associated with or employed by. Experience is a good school but the fees are high. - Heinrich Heine ___ Wikimedia-l mailing list Wikimedia-l@lists.wikimedia.org Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l, mailto:wikimedia-l-requ...@lists.wikimedia.org?subject=unsubscribe -- - Andrew Gray andrew.g...@dunelm.org.uk ___ Wikimedia-l mailing list Wikimedia-l@lists.wikimedia.org Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l, mailto:wikimedia-l-requ...@lists.wikimedia.org?subject=unsubscribe
Re: [Wikimedia-l] Wikimania 2014 scholarship now accepting application
On 8 January 2014 12:50, Katie Chan k...@ktchan.info wrote: On 08/01/2014 17:39, Marc A. Pelletier wrote: On 01/08/2014 12:37 PM, Katie Chan wrote: Only a single type of scholarship will be available from the Wikimedia Foundation for Wikimania 2014. I rather liked the idea of partial scholarships in past years since it would allow more people to attend on the same budget when practical. Can I ask why this was decided against this year? Per the FAQ[1]: The low acceptance rate of partial scholarships and overhead in reimbursing for partial scholarships for Wikimania 2013 https://wikimania2013.wikimedia.org/wiki/Main_page made it apparent that the funds would be better spent in offering more full scholarships. I hope that helps. KTC [1]: https://wikimania2014.wikimedia.org/wiki/Scholarships/FAQ I too am sorry to see that partial scholarships will not be entertained this year by the Wikimania Committee. They were a reasonable interim point for people who wanted to attend but didn't have the budget to handle both expensive flights and expensive rooms, but at the same time were unwilling or unable to handle staying in shared dormitory accommodation that is the expected standard for full scholarships. There should be only a marginally higher overhead in managing partial scholarships; both types required the same amount of effort to send reimbursement for airfare. Risker/Anne ___ Wikimedia-l mailing list Wikimedia-l@lists.wikimedia.org Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l, mailto:wikimedia-l-requ...@lists.wikimedia.org?subject=unsubscribe
[Wikimedia-l] [Wikimedia Announcements] Wikimedia Israel report for September – November 2013
Hey, Here is Wikimedia Israel report for September – November 2013: Wiki Loves Monuments – On October 15, WLM Israel has finally ended. - 7000 images of nearly 700 heritage sites and 100 artworks that are publicly accessible were uploaded to WikiCommons. - Over 400 people took part in more than 30 tours and photography workshops initiated by Wikimedia Israel in collaboration with the Society for Preservation of Israel Heritage Sites. - 40 articles were published on the Israeli media (TV, Radio, Newspappers and Internet). See summaryhttps://drive.google.com/file/d/0B9iobJg3Vpp0U1dVR2dzSnh6d0U/edit?usp=sharing(pdf) - Tens of thousands people viewed the tens’ winning photographs exhibit that were placed in one of the bussiest shopping centers in Israel. - Thanks to the Israeli public who participated in the competition, Israel has maintained the 15th position in the ranking of international competition number of uploaded images. - We published a blog post related at the Wikimedia Foundation Blog and you can watch it here.http://blog.wikimedia.org/2013/12/09/wiki-loves-monuments-israel/ http://blog.wikimedia.org/2013/12/09/wiki-loves-monuments-israel/ Program activities GLAM - November 13, part of the EVA MINERVA 2013 Jerusalem Conference on the Digitisation of Cultural Heritage, a panel discussing the subject: Fashion Heritage On-line: Europeana Fashion the GLAM-Wiki Community Worldwide - a Case Study. - As part of the Europeana Fashion Projecthttp://www.europeanafashion.eu/portal/home.htmlCollaborating with the GLAM-wikihttps://he.wikipedia.org/wiki/%D7%95%D7%A7:%D7%92%D7%9C%D7%90%D7%9D, a two part edit-a-thon were held at the Design Faculty, Holon Institute of Technology (November 14, 21). During the edit-a-thon a lecture held by Marco Rendina, Technical Coordinator at Europeana Fashion. GLAM: The National Library - September - October - Sixteen sound fileshttp://he.wikipedia.org/wiki/%D7%95%D7%99%D7%A7%D7%99%D7%A4%D7%93%D7%99%D7%94:%D7%9E%D7%99%D7%96%D7%9E%D7%99_%D7%95%D7%99%D7%A7%D7%99%D7%A4%D7%93%D7%99%D7%94/%D7%92%D7%9C%D7%90%D7%9D/%D7%94%D7%A1%D7%A4%D7%A8%D7%99%D7%99%D7%94_%D7%94%D7%9C%D7%90%D7%95%D7%9E%D7%99%D7%AA/%D7%95%D7%99%D7%A7%D7%99%D7%A4%D7%93_%D7%94%D7%91%D7%99%D7%AA#.D7.90.D7.95.D7.A7.D7.98.D7.95.D7.91.D7.A8_2013of Jewish prayers were released on the occasion of the Jewish New Year. - Also, the articles Notes on the Jewish Templehttps://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Notes_on_the_Jewish_Temple, De-Pierre Map https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/De-Pierre_Map, Nolin Map https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nolin_Map and more, was translated and the entire manuscripthttps://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/Category:Notes_on_the_Jewish_Templewas Uploaded on to WikiCommons. - November - About 150 texts was selected from a collection of Hebrew manuscripts of the digital library, and was uploaded to Wikipedia. - Hundreds of new files, including: books, photographs and audio files of jewish festival were released and uploaded to Wikicommons and Wikipedia and other wiki projects with the assistance of the National Library. Lectures and Editing Workshops - Middle-school teachers heard a lecture on Wikipedia as part of teacher training course dealing with the use of technology tools in the classroom. The lecture was filmed and can be seen herehttp://video.testing.cet.ac.il/VideoDisplay.html?url=http%3A%2F%2Fvideo.cet.ac.il%2FVideoPlayer.aspx%3FxmlConfigPath%3DMafilim%2F2013%2FHishtalmut%2Fvikipedia_mdi.xmlwidth=700pxheight=421px . - November 4 - A lecture on Wikipedia was given to the faculty members and lecturers at the Department of Conservation of sites and monuments at Western Galilee College. - November 5 – Following Wiki Loves Monuments contest, a special editing workshop was held for employees of the department of conservation of the Municipal Museum of History in Kiryat Atahttps://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kiryat_Ata, a city in north district of Israel. - November 11 - Two lectures about Wikipedia were conducted in the Department of Public Administration, The School of Government and Social Policy, at Beit Berl College. - November 12 - Another preface Lecture “What is Wikipedia?” was given at the The Hebrew University of Jerusalmen, to MA students at the Department of Archaeology and Ancient History. - November 21 – Even in the Faculty of Medicine in Zefathttps://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Safed- Bar Ilan University, they asked for a lecture a about Wikipedia. Educational and Academic Collaborations - October 24 - a lecture and an editing workshop was held for the Faculty and MA students at the NCJW Women and Gender Studies Program Tel Aviv University, as part of an ongoing cooperation. - October 28 – a Wiki lecture and an editing workshop, as a part of writing
Re: [Wikimedia-l] Thanking anonymous users
Agreed. It's nice to feel the community behind Wikipedia (well, when it doesn't bite you) and the feeling that somebody noticed you fixed a typo is even nicer. Aubrey On Wed, Jan 8, 2014 at 6:20 PM, Samuel Klein meta...@gmail.com wrote: On Wed, Jan 8, 2014 at 10:12 AM, Nathan nawr...@gmail.com wrote: On Wed, Jan 8, 2014 at 10:10 AM, Bjoern Hoehrmann derhoe...@gmx.net wrote: * Nathan wrote: We should thank them for editing using a major banner, a la the fundraiser. That would make many editors very annoyed and angry and drive them away. I very seriously doubt that is the case Banners irritate people, but anyone with a sincere interest in contributing to Wikimedia should be able to accept the necessity of maintaining both the financial and human resources of the movement. This is just what I was going to say. That would be charming; we could ensure that each IP only sees it once per year. SJ ___ Wikimedia-l mailing list Wikimedia-l@lists.wikimedia.org Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l, mailto:wikimedia-l-requ...@lists.wikimedia.org?subject=unsubscribe ___ Wikimedia-l mailing list Wikimedia-l@lists.wikimedia.org Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l, mailto:wikimedia-l-requ...@lists.wikimedia.org?subject=unsubscribe
Re: [Wikimedia-l] Relationship between Wikimedia and oDesk
Andre Engels wrote: oDesk is a system where people can offer or take jobs. Wikimedia uses it (though in a somewhat different way). How on Earth do those two facts imply oDesk is probably used for paid editing? I'm not sure probably is necessary. The evidence strongly suggests that it _is_ used for paid editing. Whether it's used for paid advocacy is another matter, of course. https://www.odesk.com/o/profiles/browse/?q=wikipedia I think oDesk serves multiple functions. The Wikimedia Foundation is apparently a client, but individual Wikimedians have also apparently been posting hire me to write an article for you entries. That said, either oDesk's search functionality is terrible or the practice doesn't seem to be particularly common. I've only found a few Wikipedia Expert or Wikipedia Writer listings off-hand. MZMcBride ___ Wikimedia-l mailing list Wikimedia-l@lists.wikimedia.org Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l, mailto:wikimedia-l-requ...@lists.wikimedia.org?subject=unsubscribe
Re: [Wikimedia-l] Announcement Sarah Stierch
You know what, I think this outcome is not just disappointing, it's positively astounding. I have a lot that I could say about it, but I can't imagine what the point of saying it could possibly be. Chalk one up for the trolls. ___ Wikimedia-l mailing list Wikimedia-l@lists.wikimedia.org Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l, mailto:wikimedia-l-requ...@lists.wikimedia.org?subject=unsubscribe
Re: [Wikimedia-l] Let's accept Bitcoin as a donation method
On Thu, Dec 12, 2013 at 2:54 PM, Steven Walling steven.wall...@gmail.com wrote: In general, I would personally like it if the WMF avoided accepting bitcoin. Today, bitcoin isn't really a functioning currency of exchange -- it's actually used more as an investment tool to create wealth that naturally appreciates in value, like playing the stock market or buying gold. Avoiding lots of risky investments is something our very competent financial managers already steer clear of, and I see no reason to start taking on more risk now. While this is true, a more pragmatic view is that, as long as BTC has value to some people, there's no harm in accepting it and transferring it to USD the moment we receive any, provided legal/financial issues can be addressed with reasonable effort. The strongest counter-argument is that we might not actually get a donation total that makes this worth our time. The Internet Archive has a single-use Bitcoin address that's received a total of $30K at current (insanely high) exchange rates. But for me, the main reason not do this sooner is that it would have significantly fueled the Bitcoin speculative bubble, and WMF should remain neutral on the utility of Bitcoin. At this point though, whatever WMF does or doesn't do is just a small drop in the bucket of the overall Bitcoin mania, so I'm personally fine with a decision being made on pragmatic grounds alone. My own view is that Bitcoin has significant design flaws (built-in economic inequality, most rational actors will hoard rather than spend, doubtful long-term scalability, questionable value as an actual currency due to crazy volatility, tendency to centralize power with miners, rampant security attacks against BTC holders, etc.), but as long as no more severe technical flaws are discovered/exploited, at least some value will likely attach to BTC for some time to come, even if it's dramatically less than the current exchange rate. With that said, I fully defer to our fundraising team on this since it's a decision that should be made purely on cost/benefit grounds, perhaps by also comparing with other currencies that see relatively little use. The one unambiguous positive that I see coming out of Bitcoin mania is a renewed interest in peer-to-peer networks; the last time that happened was about 12 years ago, and it resulted in technologies like BitTorrent, Tor, various file sharing networks and many others being developed. Experimenting is, overall, a good thing, and no matter how this one plays out (and how exhausting a topic it can be given the idiocy of coverage about it), I'm optimistic that we will see positive ripple effects for the free culture movement. Erik [1] https://blockchain.info/address/1Archive1n2C579dMsAu3iC6tWzuQJz8dN -- Erik Möller VP of Engineering and Product Development, Wikimedia Foundation ___ Wikimedia-l mailing list Wikimedia-l@lists.wikimedia.org Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l, mailto:wikimedia-l-requ...@lists.wikimedia.org?subject=unsubscribe
[Wikimedia-l] Paid editing v. paid advocacy (editing)
Frank Schulenburg wrote: [...] it is widely known that paid editing is frowned upon by many in the editing community and by the Wikimedia Foundation. No. Paid editing is not the same as paid advocacy (editing). This is a very important point. Suggested reading: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User:Dominic/FAQ https://blog.wikimedia.org/?p=25830 N.B. an example of paid editing that few would likely have an issue with in the first link and Sue's careful and correct wording in the second link. If we're going to have such a fine distinction, we should probably better document it to avoid misunderstandings. MZMcBride ___ Wikimedia-l mailing list Wikimedia-l@lists.wikimedia.org Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l, mailto:wikimedia-l-requ...@lists.wikimedia.org?subject=unsubscribe
Re: [Wikimedia-l] Relationship between Wikimedia and oDesk
Marc A. Pelletier wrote: On 01/08/2014 02:30 AM, MZMcBride wrote: Can anyone explain the relationship between Wikimedia and oDesk? The short of it: oDesk is indeed roughly the same kind of job board as freelancer.com and its ilk. The foundation is simply a client, and uses it only to pay its contractors and (most of)* their non-US workforce; and AFAIK never just contract out from postings. Contractors input work hours, WMF pays oDesk, oDesk sends monies to contractor. The system itself is a little shitty and quite a bit expensive, but considerably less so than it would be to set up legal entities able to directly pay people outside the US as local employees (including the horrible mess that it actually /is/ to have employees in other countries rather than contract out). Thank you for this. It helped me better understand the business relationship between the Wikimedia Foundation and oDesk. Clarifying whether it's appropriate for anyone, Wikimedia Foundation employee or otherwise, to engage with oDesk's... other services seems like a pretty high priority. And, in general, there needs to be clarification about the distinction between paid editing versus paid advocacy editing, especially if it's going to be treated as a bright line. MZMcBride ___ Wikimedia-l mailing list Wikimedia-l@lists.wikimedia.org Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l, mailto:wikimedia-l-requ...@lists.wikimedia.org?subject=unsubscribe
Re: [Wikimedia-l] Paid editing v. paid advocacy (editing)
Thank you very much for raising this distinction MZ. It's a very important one and, in the recriminations about this particular event, I would hate for the 'baby to get thrown out with the bathwater' by losing this distinction. -Liam / Wittylama wittylama.com Peace, love metadata On 9 January 2014 13:22, MZMcBride z...@mzmcbride.com wrote: Frank Schulenburg wrote: [...] it is widely known that paid editing is frowned upon by many in the editing community and by the Wikimedia Foundation. No. Paid editing is not the same as paid advocacy (editing). This is a very important point. Suggested reading: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User:Dominic/FAQ https://blog.wikimedia.org/?p=25830 N.B. an example of paid editing that few would likely have an issue with in the first link and Sue's careful and correct wording in the second link. If we're going to have such a fine distinction, we should probably better document it to avoid misunderstandings. MZMcBride ___ Wikimedia-l mailing list Wikimedia-l@lists.wikimedia.org Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l, mailto:wikimedia-l-requ...@lists.wikimedia.org?subject=unsubscribe ___ Wikimedia-l mailing list Wikimedia-l@lists.wikimedia.org Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l, mailto:wikimedia-l-requ...@lists.wikimedia.org?subject=unsubscribe
Re: [Wikimedia-l] Let's accept Bitcoin as a donation method
Thanks Erik for a well written overview. Would it be possible for the WMF to give an estimate on what it would cost to build and/or what the threshold of annual bitcoin donations would make it worthwhile building. Someone might be interested in donating specifically to have this built, or we could obtain pledges to donate to see if the threshold can be reached. On Jan 9, 2014 9:06 AM, Erik Moeller e...@wikimedia.org wrote: On Thu, Dec 12, 2013 at 2:54 PM, Steven Walling steven.wall...@gmail.com wrote: In general, I would personally like it if the WMF avoided accepting bitcoin. Today, bitcoin isn't really a functioning currency of exchange -- it's actually used more as an investment tool to create wealth that naturally appreciates in value, like playing the stock market or buying gold. Avoiding lots of risky investments is something our very competent financial managers already steer clear of, and I see no reason to start taking on more risk now. While this is true, a more pragmatic view is that, as long as BTC has value to some people, there's no harm in accepting it and transferring it to USD the moment we receive any, provided legal/financial issues can be addressed with reasonable effort. The strongest counter-argument is that we might not actually get a donation total that makes this worth our time. The Internet Archive has a single-use Bitcoin address that's received a total of $30K at current (insanely high) exchange rates. But for me, the main reason not do this sooner is that it would have significantly fueled the Bitcoin speculative bubble, and WMF should remain neutral on the utility of Bitcoin. At this point though, whatever WMF does or doesn't do is just a small drop in the bucket of the overall Bitcoin mania, so I'm personally fine with a decision being made on pragmatic grounds alone. My own view is that Bitcoin has significant design flaws (built-in economic inequality, most rational actors will hoard rather than spend, doubtful long-term scalability, questionable value as an actual currency due to crazy volatility, tendency to centralize power with miners, rampant security attacks against BTC holders, etc.), but as long as no more severe technical flaws are discovered/exploited, at least some value will likely attach to BTC for some time to come, even if it's dramatically less than the current exchange rate. With that said, I fully defer to our fundraising team on this since it's a decision that should be made purely on cost/benefit grounds, perhaps by also comparing with other currencies that see relatively little use. The one unambiguous positive that I see coming out of Bitcoin mania is a renewed interest in peer-to-peer networks; the last time that happened was about 12 years ago, and it resulted in technologies like BitTorrent, Tor, various file sharing networks and many others being developed. Experimenting is, overall, a good thing, and no matter how this one plays out (and how exhausting a topic it can be given the idiocy of coverage about it), I'm optimistic that we will see positive ripple effects for the free culture movement. Erik [1] https://blockchain.info/address/1Archive1n2C579dMsAu3iC6tWzuQJz8dN -- Erik Möller VP of Engineering and Product Development, Wikimedia Foundation ___ Wikimedia-l mailing list Wikimedia-l@lists.wikimedia.org Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l, mailto:wikimedia-l-requ...@lists.wikimedia.org?subject=unsubscribe ___ Wikimedia-l mailing list Wikimedia-l@lists.wikimedia.org Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l, mailto:wikimedia-l-requ...@lists.wikimedia.org?subject=unsubscribe
Re: [Wikimedia-l] Let's accept Bitcoin as a donation method
I will probably regret saying this[1] -- but the figure we like to throw around here in fundraising tech is that a new payments gateway [2] is not even worth considering unless it is likely to make us at least 500K USD a year[3]. Or, in the case that it is not an immediate payoff, if it is strategically relevant for the future of our income stream (think our recent forays into mobile). It's also worth stating that at this time we only use four gateways (we get the hundreds of currencies through gateways that serve multiple methods and countries.) It is a significant undertaking to integrate a new gateway with our current code (think several man months of time related to coding, code review, donor services preparation, and testing; not including contract negotiation and legal review.) In addition, every gateway incurs additional maintenance, auditing, and troubleshooting costs on an ongoing basis. Because of these costs, we have only four gateways (Adyen, Amazon, GlobalCollect, and PayPal); with active plans to add another (already determined) gateway this year for common methods and regions we don't already serve. Formally the dept has not conducted a cost/benefit analysis of accepting bitcoin or any other cryptocurrency. Nor have we asked the legal dept to look into it from a compliance point of view. I have been attempting to gather data for an informal blog post on the topic and I have found no indication that if we were to conduct such a study formally that it would come out positively. I will state again the contents of our FAQ: We do, however, strive to provide as many methods of donating as possible and continue to monitor Bitcoin with interest and may revisit this position should circumstances change. I would encourage those who are put off by the Wikimedia Foundation's non acceptance of cryptocurrency donations to consider alternative methods of donation and promoting of free knowledge; namely by becoming active editors. [1] personal hat The bitcoin community should be aware that their persistent and often times aggressive, rude, and vulgar messaging towards me and my fellow coworkers is not appreciated; nor does it help their cause. If the goals of the cryptocurrency movement include shedding the world of fiscal dictators, centralized control, and autocracy; then perhaps it is time for some introspection. From my standpoint the actions of the movement (or at least the actions of a significant number who are public on the internet that I have read) are scarily similar to those whom the moment stands to replace. /personal hat [2] A payments gateway can be simply thought of as a collection of APIs, coupled into DonationInterface, our backend CRM, and financial software, that can accept payments and remit them in an auditable way to the Wikimedia Foundation in one of our working currencies. [3] This number isn't set in stone and should not be considered a formal estimate, but consider that the Wikimedia Foundation's yearly budget is ~$50M. As fundraisers ideally we want to focus effort on things that can provide a significant portion of that. We also do not wish to spend money on things that would increase our useful spending to overhead spending ratio. ~Matt Walker Wikimedia Foundation Fundraising Technology Team On Wed, Jan 8, 2014 at 7:05 PM, John Vandenberg jay...@gmail.com wrote: Thanks Erik for a well written overview. Would it be possible for the WMF to give an estimate on what it would cost to build and/or what the threshold of annual bitcoin donations would make it worthwhile building. Someone might be interested in donating specifically to have this built, or we could obtain pledges to donate to see if the threshold can be reached. On Jan 9, 2014 9:06 AM, Erik Moeller e...@wikimedia.org wrote: On Thu, Dec 12, 2013 at 2:54 PM, Steven Walling steven.wall...@gmail.com wrote: In general, I would personally like it if the WMF avoided accepting bitcoin. Today, bitcoin isn't really a functioning currency of exchange -- it's actually used more as an investment tool to create wealth that naturally appreciates in value, like playing the stock market or buying gold. Avoiding lots of risky investments is something our very competent financial managers already steer clear of, and I see no reason to start taking on more risk now. While this is true, a more pragmatic view is that, as long as BTC has value to some people, there's no harm in accepting it and transferring it to USD the moment we receive any, provided legal/financial issues can be addressed with reasonable effort. The strongest counter-argument is that we might not actually get a donation total that makes this worth our time. The Internet Archive has a single-use Bitcoin address that's received a total of $30K at current (insanely high) exchange rates. But for me, the main reason not do this sooner is that it would have significantly fueled the Bitcoin speculative
Re: [Wikimedia-l] Let's accept Bitcoin as a donation method
On Wed, Jan 8, 2014 at 8:38 PM, Matthew Walker mwal...@wikimedia.org wrote: It is a significant undertaking to integrate a new gateway with our current code (think several man months of time related to coding, code review, donor services preparation, and testing; not including contract negotiation and legal review.) That makes perfect sense, Matt. It's easy to forget that because BTC is so novel, none of the existing payment gateways we have implemented support it, so comparing to existing currencies is really misleading. So you're left with either the DIY approach the Internet Archive is taking [1], or the technical effort of properly integrating something like Bitpay. The bitcoin community should be aware that their persistent and often times aggressive, rude, and vulgar messaging towards me and my fellow coworkers is not appreciated; Indeed. Unfortunately the incentive structure of Bitcoin's bubble economy turns ordinary people into obnoxious hucksters. Erik [1] Srsly! Just one example: http://blog.archive.org/2013/03/05/bitcoin-to-cash-converter-box/ -- Erik Möller VP of Engineering and Product Development, Wikimedia Foundation ___ Wikimedia-l mailing list Wikimedia-l@lists.wikimedia.org Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l, mailto:wikimedia-l-requ...@lists.wikimedia.org?subject=unsubscribe
