Re: [Wikimedia-l] The British Library releases 1 million images

2013-12-19 Thread Jane Darnell
I like the stray text around the images - it  shows that the picture
is from a book, rather than a separate unattached file like a photo or
engraving, and the captions are necessary in most cases. The
problematic images are the ones of letterheads and margin decorations,
which, though perhaps interesting for articles on publishing or
printing, are not really useful in the quantities available unless
Wikisource is able to ingest the books in such a way that they use
those too. As I understand it however, you cannot recycle a Commons
image in a djvu file (yet). I do think some of the more encyclopedic
books would be great to have in their entirety on Wikisource.

2013/12/18, geni geni...@gmail.com:
 On 17 December 2013 20:08, Matthew Flaschen
 matthew.flasc...@gatech.eduwrote:


 As Andrew said, the interesting question is whether the Commons community
 can effectively help curate/add metadata for this unidentified content.


 Even if we could a lot of the images could do with some preprocessing to
 remove things like stray text.

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Re: [Wikimedia-l] The British Library releases 1 million images

2013-12-19 Thread Andrew Gray
I did put a few of the books up in the past (as PDFs provided by the
BL, then manually converted to DjVu):

https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:Kennedy,_Robert_John_-_A_Journey_in_Khorassan_(1890).djvu
https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:Kennedy,_Robert_John_-_A_Journey_in_Khorassan_(1890).pdf
https://en.wikisource.org/wiki/A_Journey_in_Khorassan_and_Central_Asia

I kept running into size limits  wasn't quite sure how best to get
the right material to Wikisource, but if there's particular titles,
let me know  I'll see what can be done.

On 19 December 2013 09:07, Jane Darnell jane...@gmail.com wrote:
 I like the stray text around the images - it  shows that the picture
 is from a book, rather than a separate unattached file like a photo or
 engraving, and the captions are necessary in most cases. The
 problematic images are the ones of letterheads and margin decorations,
 which, though perhaps interesting for articles on publishing or
 printing, are not really useful in the quantities available unless
 Wikisource is able to ingest the books in such a way that they use
 those too. As I understand it however, you cannot recycle a Commons
 image in a djvu file (yet). I do think some of the more encyclopedic
 books would be great to have in their entirety on Wikisource.

 2013/12/18, geni geni...@gmail.com:
 On 17 December 2013 20:08, Matthew Flaschen
 matthew.flasc...@gatech.eduwrote:


 As Andrew said, the interesting question is whether the Commons community
 can effectively help curate/add metadata for this unidentified content.


 Even if we could a lot of the images could do with some preprocessing to
 remove things like stray text.

 --
 geni
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Re: [Wikimedia-l] The British Library releases 1 million images

2013-12-19 Thread geni
On 19 December 2013 09:07, Jane Darnell jane...@gmail.com wrote:

 I like the stray text around the images - it  shows that the picture
 is from a book, rather than a separate unattached file like a photo or
 engraving, and the captions are necessary in most cases.



Not for use in articles. For example:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Eaton_Socon_Castle


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Re: [Wikimedia-l] The British Library releases 1 million images

2013-12-18 Thread geni
On 17 December 2013 20:08, Matthew Flaschen matthew.flasc...@gatech.eduwrote:


 As Andrew said, the interesting question is whether the Commons community
 can effectively help curate/add metadata for this unidentified content.


Even if we could a lot of the images could do with some preprocessing to
remove things like stray text.

-- 
geni
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Re: [Wikimedia-l] The British Library releases 1 million images

2013-12-17 Thread Matthew Flaschen

On 12/15/2013 12:48 PM, Juergen Fenn wrote:

2013/12/15 Katie Chan k...@ktchan.info:


We plan to launch a
crowdsourcing application at the beginning of next year, to help describe
what the images portray.



The images release contained no image-level metadata == One million
uncategorised images == Commons community raise up in arms


It does not really make a difference whether you release a million
images without metadata to Flickr, or to Commons. It comes without any
metadata, so it cannot be searched (and images cannot be found) in
either case. :(


As Andrew said, the interesting question is whether the Commons 
community can effectively help curate/add metadata for this unidentified 
content.


I agree with Andy (see 
http://www.generalist.org.uk/blog/2013/mechanical-curator-on-commons/#comment-209343) 
that tools for easier curation will be quite helpful.


Matt Flaschen


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Re: [Wikimedia-l] The British Library releases 1 million images

2013-12-15 Thread Jens Best
Thanks for the news.

A question comes to my mind when I read this article: Why did the British
Library use Flickr instead of Wikimedia Commons? Maybe it has to do
something with a better usability of Flickr? -

The usability of Wikimedia Commons most be increased to make it more
attractive to individual and institutional users. Don't you think so?

The next steps mentioned in the article indicates good opportunities for us
to get involved and show the potential of an experienced platform for
crowdsourcing information and knowledge:

We are looking for new, inventive ways to navigate, find and display these
'unseen illustrations'. and furtheron in the blogpost, We plan to launch a
crowdsourcing application at the beginning of next year, to help describe
what the images portray. Our intention is to use this data to train
automated classifiers that will run against the whole of the content.

http://britishlibrary.typepad.co.uk/digital-scholarship/2013/12/a-million-first-steps.html

Best regards,

Jens






2013/12/15 Emilio J. Rodríguez-Posada emi...@gmail.com

 Quote from full announcement

 http://britishlibrary.typepad.co.uk/digital-scholarship/2013/12/a-million-first-steps.html

 We have released over a million
 imageshttp://www.flickr.com/photos/britishlibraryonto Flickr Commons
 for anyone to use, remix and repurpose. These images
  were taken from the pages of 17th, 18th and 19th century books digitised
  by Microsoft
 http://pressandpolicy.bl.uk/Press-Releases/The-British-Library-19th-Century-Book-Digitisation-Project-343.aspxwho
 then generously gifted the scanned images to us, allowing us to release
  them back into the Public Domain. The images themselves cover a startling
  mix of subjects: There are maps, geological diagrams, beautiful
  illustrations, comical satire, illuminated and decorative letters,
  colourful illustrations, landscapes, wall-paintings and so much more that
  even we are not aware of.


 Flickr account http://www.flickr.com/photos/britishlibrary
 Example of image http://www.flickr.com/photos/britishlibrary/11307195524/
 Example of all images from a book
 http://www.flickr.com/photos/britishlibrary/tags/sysnum002660292
 Stuff for coders https://github.com/BL-Labs/imagedirectory

 So... :-)
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Re: [Wikimedia-l] The British Library releases 1 million images

2013-12-15 Thread Jens Best
Just discovered a short note of Andrew Gray, why Flickr was preferred
instead of Commons.
http://www.generalist.org.uk/blog/2013/mechanical-curator-on-commons/


2013/12/15 Jens Best jens.b...@wikimedia.de

 Thanks for the news.

 A question comes to my mind when I read this article: Why did the British
 Library use Flickr instead of Wikimedia Commons? Maybe it has to do
 something with a better usability of Flickr? -

 The usability of Wikimedia Commons most be increased to make it more
 attractive to individual and institutional users. Don't you think so?

 The next steps mentioned in the article indicates good opportunities for
 us to get involved and show the potential of an experienced platform for
 crowdsourcing information and knowledge:

 We are looking for new, inventive ways to navigate, find and display
 these 'unseen illustrations'. and furtheron in the blogpost, We plan to
 launch a crowdsourcing application at the beginning of next year, to help
 describe what the images portray. Our intention is to use this data to
 train automated classifiers that will run against the whole of the content.


 http://britishlibrary.typepad.co.uk/digital-scholarship/2013/12/a-million-first-steps.html

 Best regards,

 Jens






 2013/12/15 Emilio J. Rodríguez-Posada emi...@gmail.com

 Quote from full announcement

 http://britishlibrary.typepad.co.uk/digital-scholarship/2013/12/a-million-first-steps.html

 We have released over a million
 imageshttp://www.flickr.com/photos/britishlibraryonto Flickr Commons
 for anyone to use, remix and repurpose. These images
  were taken from the pages of 17th, 18th and 19th century books digitised
  by Microsoft
 http://pressandpolicy.bl.uk/Press-Releases/The-British-Library-19th-Century-Book-Digitisation-Project-343.aspxwho
 then generously gifted the scanned images to us, allowing us to release
  them back into the Public Domain. The images themselves cover a
 startling
  mix of subjects: There are maps, geological diagrams, beautiful
  illustrations, comical satire, illuminated and decorative letters,
  colourful illustrations, landscapes, wall-paintings and so much more
 that
  even we are not aware of.


 Flickr account http://www.flickr.com/photos/britishlibrary
 Example of image http://www.flickr.com/photos/britishlibrary/11307195524/
 Example of all images from a book
 http://www.flickr.com/photos/britishlibrary/tags/sysnum002660292
 Stuff for coders https://github.com/BL-Labs/imagedirectory

 So... :-)
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 Jens Best
 Präsidium
 Wikimedia Deutschland e.V.
 web: http://www.wikimedia.de
 mail: jens.best http://goog_17221883@wikimedia.de

 Wikimedia Deutschland - Gesellschaft zur Förderung Freien Wissens e.V.
 Eingetragen im Vereinsregister des Amtsgerichts
 Berlin-Charlottenburg unter der Nummer 23855 B. Als gemeinnützig
 anerkannt durch das Finanzamt für Körperschaften I Berlin,
 Steuernummer 27/681/51985.




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Präsidium
Wikimedia Deutschland e.V.
web: http://www.wikimedia.de
mail: jens.best http://goog_17221883@wikimedia.de

Wikimedia Deutschland - Gesellschaft zur Förderung Freien Wissens e.V.
Eingetragen im Vereinsregister des Amtsgerichts
Berlin-Charlottenburg unter der Nummer 23855 B. Als gemeinnützig
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Steuernummer 27/681/51985.
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Re: [Wikimedia-l] The British Library releases 1 million images

2013-12-15 Thread Katie Chan

On 15/12/2013 17:05, Jens Best wrote:

Thanks for the news.

A question comes to my mind when I read this article: Why did the British
Library use Flickr instead of Wikimedia Commons?


This:


We plan to launch a
crowdsourcing application at the beginning of next year, to help describe
what the images portray.


The images release contained no image-level metadata == One million 
uncategorised images == Commons community raise up in arms



Katie

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Re: [Wikimedia-l] The British Library releases 1 million images

2013-12-15 Thread Michael Peel
There’s been quite a lot of discussion of this on the cultural-partners mailing 
list (https://intern.wikimedia.ch/lists/listinfo/cultural-partners). As a 
result of that, Tom Morris has set up a working page on Commons at:
https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/Commons:British_Library/Mechanical_Curator_collection

Thanks,
Mike

On 15 Dec 2013, at 17:37, Jens Best jens.b...@wikimedia.de wrote:

 Just discovered a short note of Andrew Gray, why Flickr was preferred
 instead of Commons.
 http://www.generalist.org.uk/blog/2013/mechanical-curator-on-commons/
 
 
 2013/12/15 Jens Best jens.b...@wikimedia.de
 
 Thanks for the news.
 
 A question comes to my mind when I read this article: Why did the British
 Library use Flickr instead of Wikimedia Commons? Maybe it has to do
 something with a better usability of Flickr? -
 
 The usability of Wikimedia Commons most be increased to make it more
 attractive to individual and institutional users. Don't you think so?
 
 The next steps mentioned in the article indicates good opportunities for
 us to get involved and show the potential of an experienced platform for
 crowdsourcing information and knowledge:
 
 We are looking for new, inventive ways to navigate, find and display
 these 'unseen illustrations'. and furtheron in the blogpost, We plan to
 launch a crowdsourcing application at the beginning of next year, to help
 describe what the images portray. Our intention is to use this data to
 train automated classifiers that will run against the whole of the content.
 
 
 http://britishlibrary.typepad.co.uk/digital-scholarship/2013/12/a-million-first-steps.html
 
 Best regards,
 
 Jens
 
 
 
 
 
 
 2013/12/15 Emilio J. Rodríguez-Posada emi...@gmail.com
 
 Quote from full announcement
 
 http://britishlibrary.typepad.co.uk/digital-scholarship/2013/12/a-million-first-steps.html
 
 We have released over a million
 imageshttp://www.flickr.com/photos/britishlibraryonto Flickr Commons
 for anyone to use, remix and repurpose. These images
 were taken from the pages of 17th, 18th and 19th century books digitised
 by Microsoft
 http://pressandpolicy.bl.uk/Press-Releases/The-British-Library-19th-Century-Book-Digitisation-Project-343.aspxwho
 then generously gifted the scanned images to us, allowing us to release
 them back into the Public Domain. The images themselves cover a
 startling
 mix of subjects: There are maps, geological diagrams, beautiful
 illustrations, comical satire, illuminated and decorative letters,
 colourful illustrations, landscapes, wall-paintings and so much more
 that
 even we are not aware of.
 
 
 Flickr account http://www.flickr.com/photos/britishlibrary
 Example of image http://www.flickr.com/photos/britishlibrary/11307195524/
 Example of all images from a book
 http://www.flickr.com/photos/britishlibrary/tags/sysnum002660292
 Stuff for coders https://github.com/BL-Labs/imagedirectory
 
 So... :-)
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 Präsidium
 Wikimedia Deutschland e.V.
 web: http://www.wikimedia.de
 mail: jens.best http://goog_17221883@wikimedia.de
 
 Wikimedia Deutschland - Gesellschaft zur Förderung Freien Wissens e.V.
 Eingetragen im Vereinsregister des Amtsgerichts
 Berlin-Charlottenburg unter der Nummer 23855 B. Als gemeinnützig
 anerkannt durch das Finanzamt für Körperschaften I Berlin,
 Steuernummer 27/681/51985.
 
 
 
 
 -- 
 --
 Jens Best
 Präsidium
 Wikimedia Deutschland e.V.
 web: http://www.wikimedia.de
 mail: jens.best http://goog_17221883@wikimedia.de
 
 Wikimedia Deutschland - Gesellschaft zur Förderung Freien Wissens e.V.
 Eingetragen im Vereinsregister des Amtsgerichts
 Berlin-Charlottenburg unter der Nummer 23855 B. Als gemeinnützig
 anerkannt durch das Finanzamt für Körperschaften I Berlin,
 Steuernummer 27/681/51985.
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Re: [Wikimedia-l] The British Library releases 1 million images

2013-12-15 Thread Juergen Fenn
2013/12/15 Katie Chan k...@ktchan.info:

 We plan to launch a
 crowdsourcing application at the beginning of next year, to help describe
 what the images portray.


 The images release contained no image-level metadata == One million
 uncategorised images == Commons community raise up in arms

It does not really make a difference whether you release a million
images without metadata to Flickr, or to Commons. It comes without any
metadata, so it cannot be searched (and images cannot be found) in
either case. :(

Regards,
Jürgen.

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Re: [Wikimedia-l] The British Library releases 1 million images

2013-12-15 Thread Jens Best
Just discovered the Commons project-site, too. Good to break down the
massive amount of unsorted material in countries first. Could help to
address interested editors quicker.

https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/Commons:British_Library/Mechanical_Curator_collection

Jens


2013/12/15 Michael Peel em...@mikepeel.net

 There’s been quite a lot of discussion of this on the cultural-partners
 mailing list (https://intern.wikimedia.ch/lists/listinfo/cultural-partners).
 As a result of that, Tom Morris has set up a working page on Commons at:

 https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/Commons:British_Library/Mechanical_Curator_collection

 Thanks,
 Mike

 On 15 Dec 2013, at 17:37, Jens Best jens.b...@wikimedia.de wrote:

  Just discovered a short note of Andrew Gray, why Flickr was preferred
  instead of Commons.
  http://www.generalist.org.uk/blog/2013/mechanical-curator-on-commons/
 
 
  2013/12/15 Jens Best jens.b...@wikimedia.de
 
  Thanks for the news.
 
  A question comes to my mind when I read this article: Why did the
 British
  Library use Flickr instead of Wikimedia Commons? Maybe it has to do
  something with a better usability of Flickr? -
 
  The usability of Wikimedia Commons most be increased to make it more
  attractive to individual and institutional users. Don't you think so?
 
  The next steps mentioned in the article indicates good opportunities for
  us to get involved and show the potential of an experienced platform for
  crowdsourcing information and knowledge:
 
  We are looking for new, inventive ways to navigate, find and display
  these 'unseen illustrations'. and furtheron in the blogpost, We plan to
  launch a crowdsourcing application at the beginning of next year, to
 help
  describe what the images portray. Our intention is to use this data to
  train automated classifiers that will run against the whole of the
 content.
 
 
 
 http://britishlibrary.typepad.co.uk/digital-scholarship/2013/12/a-million-first-steps.html
 
  Best regards,
 
  Jens
 
 
 
 
 
 
  2013/12/15 Emilio J. Rodríguez-Posada emi...@gmail.com
 
  Quote from full announcement
 
 
 http://britishlibrary.typepad.co.uk/digital-scholarship/2013/12/a-million-first-steps.html
 
  We have released over a million
  imageshttp://www.flickr.com/photos/britishlibraryonto Flickr Commons
  for anyone to use, remix and repurpose. These images
  were taken from the pages of 17th, 18th and 19th century books
 digitised
  by Microsoft
 
 http://pressandpolicy.bl.uk/Press-Releases/The-British-Library-19th-Century-Book-Digitisation-Project-343.aspx
 who
  then generously gifted the scanned images to us, allowing us to release
  them back into the Public Domain. The images themselves cover a
  startling
  mix of subjects: There are maps, geological diagrams, beautiful
  illustrations, comical satire, illuminated and decorative letters,
  colourful illustrations, landscapes, wall-paintings and so much more
  that
  even we are not aware of.
 
 
  Flickr account http://www.flickr.com/photos/britishlibrary
  Example of image
 http://www.flickr.com/photos/britishlibrary/11307195524/
  Example of all images from a book
  http://www.flickr.com/photos/britishlibrary/tags/sysnum002660292
  Stuff for coders https://github.com/BL-Labs/imagedirectory
 
  So... :-)
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  Wikimedia Deutschland - Gesellschaft zur Förderung Freien Wissens e.V.
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  Berlin-Charlottenburg unter der Nummer 23855 B. Als gemeinnützig
  anerkannt durch das Finanzamt für Körperschaften I Berlin,
  Steuernummer 27/681/51985.
 
 
 
 
  --
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  Präsidium
  Wikimedia Deutschland e.V.
  web: http://www.wikimedia.de
  mail: jens.best http://goog_17221883@wikimedia.de
 
  Wikimedia Deutschland - Gesellschaft zur Förderung Freien Wissens e.V.
  Eingetragen im Vereinsregister des Amtsgerichts
  Berlin-Charlottenburg unter der Nummer 23855 B. Als gemeinnützig
  anerkannt durch das Finanzamt für Körperschaften I Berlin,
  Steuernummer 27/681/51985.
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Re: [Wikimedia-l] The British Library releases 1 million images

2013-12-15 Thread Andy Mabbett
On 15 December 2013 16:08, Emilio J. Rodríguez-Posada emi...@gmail.com quoted:

 We have released over a million
 imageshttp://www.flickr.com/photos/britishlibraryonto Flickr Commons

Please note that we have a project page, for discussion of importing
these images to Commons in a sensible manner:

   
https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/Commons:British_Library/Mechanical_Curator_collection

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Re: [Wikimedia-l] The British Library releases 1 million images

2013-12-15 Thread Andy Mabbett
On 15 December 2013 17:39, Katie Chan k...@ktchan.info wrote:

 The images release contained no image-level metadata == One million
 uncategorised images == Commons community raise up in arms

The images contain metadata, which could be used for categorisation,at
the book level.

The whole point of the wiki model is that we make incremental steps
towards completion.

An analogy could be drawn with Wikipedia's stub articles.

It's not good for us to lobby institutions to release media, and then
decline to accept it.

I would have liked the release to have been direct to Commons; at
least, I would have liked the opportunity to debate whether to accept
it. I hope that the next tome such an release is being considered, we
will be in a better position to facilitate the former.

-- 
Andy Mabbett
@pigsonthewing
http://pigsonthewing.org.uk

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Re: [Wikimedia-l] The British Library releases 1 million images

2013-12-15 Thread geni
On 15 December 2013 19:36, Andy Mabbett a...@pigsonthewing.org.uk wrote:

 The images contain metadata, which could be used for categorisation,at
 the book level.


Not that useful.

If you look at the images a lot are simply decorations and there are a fair
number of duplications.




 The whole point of the wiki model is that we make incremental steps
 towards completion.

 An analogy could be drawn with Wikipedia's stub articles.


Commons already has 19 million images to make incremental steps on.
En.Wikipedia has 4.4 million articles total, even the stubs are a lot more
searchable and it has more people.



 It's not good for us to lobby institutions to release media, and then
 decline to accept it.


So we need to decide in advance what we are looking at. With 19 million
already we've reach the stage where we should probably be more selective.




 I would have liked the release to have been direct to Commons; at
 least, I would have liked the opportunity to debate whether to accept
 it. I hope that the next tome such an release is being considered, we
 will be in a better position to facilitate the former.


Having the images on flickr isn't too bad. They are still searchable and
fairly easy to import although my search results have been turning up less
than 1% that area really of interest an even then the quality isn't always
usable.



-- 
geni
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