[Wikitech-l] Facebook introducing PHP compiler?
http://www.sdtimes.com/blog/post/2010/01/30/Facebook-rewrites-PHP-runtime.aspx Facebook is written in PHP. Unlike Wikimedia, they have money to pay people to speed it up. Looks like they're introducing a PHP compiler. Open source. Might be of interest to WMF and third-party MediaWiki users ... - d. ___ Wikitech-l mailing list Wikitech-l@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikitech-l
Re: [Wikitech-l] secure.wikimedia 503s
On Fri, Jan 29, 2010 at 10:26 PM, Mike.lifeguard mike.lifegu...@gmail.com wrote: The whole site went down ~25 minutes ago, and seems to be back up as of ~5 minutes ago. Just a reminder that when the site's down, it's usually best to report issues/follow the status on IRC (if possible). Presumably more info will be available later. Tim said that he's researching a chain of events and writing something up at the moment. -- Casey Brown Cbrown1023 ___ Wikitech-l mailing list Wikitech-l@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikitech-l
Re: [Wikitech-l] Description of process flow available?
The best way to describe the process flow is a complete spaghetti bowl.
The first steps in a file-by-file sense are index.php -- {various setup
files} -- Wiki.php -- {Article.php/SpecialPage.php}. Somewhere along the
way a global OutputPage object is initialised as $wgOut and things can be
written to it at any point in the main code flow. Once things fall back out
to Wiki.php the unholy trinity of Skin, OutputPage, SkinTemplate collude to
produce page output, through a weird back-and-forth that I can never quite
get my head around. Once the output code stack has returned, a final stack
is run that does cleanup tasks.
If you're interested in writing a proper flow chart, that would be something
really useful.
--HM
Jean-Marc van Leerdam j.m.van.leer...@gmail.com wrote in message
news:4e4d410b1001302358l4b5e5923i4a96a6c2b883f...@mail.gmail.com...
Hi,
Does MW.org provide some relatively high level description of the
process flow / object interaction that is followed when rendering
mediawiki pages?
I've been searching mediawiki.org and the source tree from my mw
installation but so far I only found class-based 'local' information.
I am happy to contribute a more high level description, if that is not
yet available, but would much prefer to use (and if needed contribute
to) an existing description.
Do we have class models and process flow descriptions available somewhere?
I am most interested in the way Parser, ParserOutput, Skin and the
related classes interoperate, as well as how user extensions and hooks
are supposed to interact with the core mediawiki software.
--
Regards,
Jean-Marc
--
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Re: [Wikitech-l] Facebook introducing PHP compiler?
Hi David, We don't run on rumors! Domas ___ Wikitech-l mailing list Wikitech-l@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikitech-l
Re: [Wikitech-l] Google phases out support for IE6
On Sun, Jan 31, 2010 at 8:28 PM, Thomas Dalton thomas.dal...@gmail.com wrote: On 31 January 2010 05:07, John Vandenberg jay...@gmail.com wrote: An important distinction is that IE for Mac users on Mac OS (classic) don't have the copious upgrade options available to IE 5.5 users on Windows. I don't think we need to worry about Mac OS classic: http://stats.wikimedia.org/wikimedia/squids/SquidReportOperatingSystems.htm If I'm reading that right, only 0.02% of users are using Mac OS classic (although I suppose there could be some more that have been grouped into Other, but that won't be many). That is still at least 1000 pageviews per month. If it does not degrade gracefully, we would be telling them to buy a new computer in order to view Wikipedia. How many contributors will be lost in the process? Only developers can tell us how many of those 1000 pageviews were logged in users. We create projects for languages who have only ~6000 _in total_ (e.g. Creek language). I don't see any IE 5.1 or 5.2 in this list: http://stats.wikimedia.org/wikimedia/squids/SquidReportClients.htm Most IE5.2 users should have upgraded to iCab. Do we have good iCab support? IE to iCab isn't really an upgrade... it's a completely different browser, isn't it? iCab was a supported browser long after IE for Mac was dropped. -- John Vandenberg ___ Wikitech-l mailing list Wikitech-l@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikitech-l
Re: [Wikitech-l] Google phases out support for IE6
On 31 January 2010 20:49, John Vandenberg jay...@gmail.com wrote: If I'm reading that right, only 0.02% of users are using Mac OS classic (although I suppose there could be some more that have been grouped into Other, but that won't be many). That is still at least 1000 pageviews per month. If it does not degrade gracefully, we would be telling them to buy a new computer in order to view Wikipedia. How many contributors will be lost in the process? Only developers can tell us how many of those 1000 pageviews were logged in users. 1000 page views a month over the whole of Wikimedia is as close to nothing as makes no odds. That could be just a single user. Most IE5.2 users should have upgraded to iCab. Do we have good iCab support? IE to iCab isn't really an upgrade... it's a completely different browser, isn't it? iCab was a supported browser long after IE for Mac was dropped. Sure, but it's a completely different browser. Upgrade means to go to a later version of the same software, not a later version of completely different software. ___ Wikitech-l mailing list Wikitech-l@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikitech-l
Re: [Wikitech-l] Google phases out support for IE6
On Sun, Jan 31, 2010 at 8:57 PM, Daniel Schwen li...@schwen.de wrote: That is still at least 1000 pageviews per month. If it does not degrade gracefully, we would be telling them to buy a new computer in order to view Wikipedia. This is completely wrong. You do know that it is possible to install new software? The problem has been mentioned several times. It is most likely environments where the user does not have control over installed software. Even then, there is http://www.askvg.com/download-mozilla-firefox-30-portable-edition-no-installation-needed/ Magnus ___ Wikitech-l mailing list Wikitech-l@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikitech-l
Re: [Wikitech-l] Facebook introducing PHP compiler?
David Gerard wrote: http://www.sdtimes.com/blog/post/2010/01/30/Facebook-rewrites-PHP-runtime.aspx Facebook is written in PHP. Unlike Wikimedia, they have money to pay people to speed it up. Looks like they're introducing a PHP compiler. Open source. Might be of interest to WMF and third-party MediaWiki users ... - d. There are some php compiler projects out there, like http://phpcompiler.org/ or http://www.roadsend.com/home/index.php?pageID=compiler However, that article is just rumour. I think it's more likely they made some apc-like cache/optimizer than a compiler. And the conclusion that it will be open source is questionable. In such case, why would they made them sign NDAs? Domas intervention is also noticeable, since he probably knows what's going on. ___ Wikitech-l mailing list Wikitech-l@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikitech-l
Re: [Wikitech-l] secure.wikimedia 503s
On Mon, Feb 1, 2010 at 12:38 AM, Casey Brown li...@caseybrown.org wrote: On Fri, Jan 29, 2010 at 10:26 PM, Mike.lifeguard mike.lifegu...@gmail.com wrote: The whole site went down ~25 minutes ago, and seems to be back up as of ~5 minutes ago. Just a reminder that when the site's down, it's usually best to report issues/follow the status on IRC (if possible). Presumably more info will be available later. Tim said that he's researching a chain of events and writing something up at the moment. -- Casey Brown Cbrown1023 Theres some nerdy information on the server admin log for those intrested: http://wikitech.wikimedia.org/view/Server_admin_log -Peachey ___ Wikitech-l mailing list Wikitech-l@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikitech-l
Re: [Wikitech-l] Google phases out support for IE6
On Mon, Feb 1, 2010 at 10:45 AM, Ryan Kaldari kald...@gmail.com wrote: This entire discussion about support for IE 5 Mac is pointless. IE for Mac used a completely different rendering engine than IE for Windows and was actually (pretty-much) standards compliant. We don't need to worry about what browser people on Mac Classic should migrate to for viewing Wikipedia. I'm reasonably confident that Wikipedia would render fine in IE 5 for Mac (or iCab, or Classilla). In this thread, Chad suggested that the IE for Mac stylesheet could be phased out. -- John Vandenberg ___ Wikitech-l mailing list Wikitech-l@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikitech-l
Re: [Wikitech-l] Google phases out support for IE6
I would definitely agree with that. We may be the last site on the Internet to customize our CSS for Mac IE :) Ryan Kaldari On Sun, Jan 31, 2010 at 5:53 PM, John Vandenberg jay...@gmail.com wrote: On Mon, Feb 1, 2010 at 10:45 AM, Ryan Kaldari kald...@gmail.com wrote: This entire discussion about support for IE 5 Mac is pointless. IE for Mac used a completely different rendering engine than IE for Windows and was actually (pretty-much) standards compliant. We don't need to worry about what browser people on Mac Classic should migrate to for viewing Wikipedia. I'm reasonably confident that Wikipedia would render fine in IE 5 for Mac (or iCab, or Classilla). In this thread, Chad suggested that the IE for Mac stylesheet could be phased out. -- John Vandenberg ___ Wikitech-l mailing list Wikitech-l@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikitech-l ___ Wikitech-l mailing list Wikitech-l@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikitech-l
Re: [Wikitech-l] Google phases out support for IE6
On Sun, Jan 31, 2010 at 6:34 PM, John Vandenberg jay...@gmail.com wrote: Even then, there is http://www.askvg.com/download-mozilla-firefox-30-portable-edition-no-installation-needed/ Excuse me? please read the earlier posts in this thread. I am talking about IE for Mac Classic. iCab support? Is Classilla a sensible replacement for people still using IE for Mac? etc. I couldn't get classzilla running on a blue and white G3 running 9.0.2 when I tried it a couple months ago. I have a couple of these systems for driving some embedded hardware that never got moved to anything more modern, they'd be perfectly adequate systems for webbrowsing if you could get a workably up to date webbrowser on them: The IE the OS ships with hard locks the machine on apple.com of all places! I was only bothering to attempt this because I wanted to get a screenshot of cortado playing videos on something very old, and I only spent an hour or so on it. (Wikipedia, OTOH, worked fine with the IE that comes with the OS on those systems) But seriously. Outright *excluding* these old things shouldn't even be a consideration. Even a very small audience (like 0.02%) is tens of thousands of readers. Mediawiki (and the WMF deployment) already has many features which don't work / don't work well on fairly old systems, so that bridge has already been crossed, but outright dropping support for basic use? ___ Wikitech-l mailing list Wikitech-l@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikitech-l
Re: [Wikitech-l] Google phases out support for IE6
Who said anything about dropping support for basic use? I would be surprised if you could tell much difference on Mac IE between Wikipedia with the custom stylesheet and without. But perhaps you could give it a try and report back to us, rather than relying on my wild speculations :) Ryan Kaldari On Sun, Jan 31, 2010 at 8:27 PM, Gregory Maxwell gmaxw...@gmail.com wrote: On Sun, Jan 31, 2010 at 6:34 PM, John Vandenberg jay...@gmail.com wrote: Even then, there is http://www.askvg.com/download-mozilla-firefox-30-portable-edition-no-installation-needed/ Excuse me? please read the earlier posts in this thread. I am talking about IE for Mac Classic. iCab support? Is Classilla a sensible replacement for people still using IE for Mac? etc. I couldn't get classzilla running on a blue and white G3 running 9.0.2 when I tried it a couple months ago. I have a couple of these systems for driving some embedded hardware that never got moved to anything more modern, they'd be perfectly adequate systems for webbrowsing if you could get a workably up to date webbrowser on them: The IE the OS ships with hard locks the machine on apple.com of all places! I was only bothering to attempt this because I wanted to get a screenshot of cortado playing videos on something very old, and I only spent an hour or so on it. (Wikipedia, OTOH, worked fine with the IE that comes with the OS on those systems) But seriously. Outright *excluding* these old things shouldn't even be a consideration. Even a very small audience (like 0.02%) is tens of thousands of readers. Mediawiki (and the WMF deployment) already has many features which don't work / don't work well on fairly old systems, so that bridge has already been crossed, but outright dropping support for basic use? ___ Wikitech-l mailing list Wikitech-l@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikitech-l ___ Wikitech-l mailing list Wikitech-l@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikitech-l
Re: [Wikitech-l] Google phases out support for IE6
On Mon, Feb 1, 2010 at 2:37 PM, Ryan Kaldari kald...@gmail.com wrote: Who said anything about dropping support for basic use? I would be surprised if you could tell much difference on Mac IE between Wikipedia with the custom stylesheet and without. But perhaps you could give it a try and report back to us, rather than relying on my wild speculations :) Is this file unused? http://svn.wikimedia.org/viewvc/mediawiki/trunk/phase3/skins/monobook/IEMacFixes.css?revision=11898view=markup It seems that the IE for Mac style is littered through: http://svn.wikimedia.org/viewvc/mediawiki/trunk/phase3/skins/monobook/main.css?revision=56937view=markup ... with an interesting comment: /* ** IE/Mac fixes, hope to find a validating way to move this ** to a separate stylesheet. This would work but doesn't validate: ** @import(IEMacFixes.css); */ Would it be acceptable to use a conditional include? http://stopdesign.com/examples/ie5mac-bpf/ Alternatively, we could load the stylesheet at runtime with JavaScript. That approach is already being used for IE specific JavaScript fixes. -- John Vandenberg ___ Wikitech-l mailing list Wikitech-l@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikitech-l
Re: [Wikitech-l] Google phases out support for IE6
What about creating an monobo'oldies theme for them? I mean, move current stuff to oldies, and drop elders support from monobook. -- byte-byte, grin ___ Wikitech-l mailing list Wikitech-l@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikitech-l
