Re: [WIRELESS-LAN] Here come the LTE-U devices...

[Frans Panken]

Mmm, that module you refer to is only carrier agnostic on paper. It means that 
Cisco configures the frequencies for the carrier that wants to use it. I tried 
to use the module for unlicensed spectrum in the 1800 Mhz band but Cisco did 
not support that ;-(
FYI: many regulators in EU allow to use the DECT-guard bands as unlicensed 
indoor spectrum. Practically all phones support it; it is often used for 
private-GSM/private LTE  solutions
-Frans

From: The EDUCAUSE Wireless Issues Constituent Group Listserv 
<WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU> on behalf of Mike King <m...@mpking.com>
Reply-To: The EDUCAUSE Wireless Issues Constituent Group Listserv 
<WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU>
Date: Friday, 24 February 2017 at 17:32
To: "WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU" <WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU>
Subject: Re: [WIRELESS-LAN] Here come the LTE-U devices...



On Wed, Feb 22, 2017 at 3:21 PM, Coehoorn, Joel 
<jcoeho...@york.edu<mailto:jcoeho...@york.edu>> wrote:
Even that won't make sense until handset support is in more than just a few 
devices, though the current Apple/Samsung hegemony means the right device could 
tip that scale faster than we expect. I'm also curious if this is something 
that Cisco/Aruba/etc will build into Access Points and controllers in a 
carrier-agnostic way, so we don't need additional devices, wiring, or 
management and can spread it over a good-sized area when we know we need it.


Cisco and Apple announced a partnership last July at Cisco Live.
http://www.cisco.com/c/m/en_us/solutions/strategic-partners/apple.html

Cisco did have a MicroCelluar module in the 3600 AP that was carrier agnostic 
before.
http://www.cisco.com/c/en/us/products/wireless/universal-small-cell-5310/index.html


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Re: [WIRELESS-LAN] Here come the LTE-U devices...

[Mike King]

On Wed, Feb 22, 2017 at 3:21 PM, Coehoorn, Joel  wrote:

> Even that won't make sense until handset support is in more than just a
> few devices, though the current Apple/Samsung hegemony means the right
> device could tip that scale faster than we expect. I'm also curious if this
> is something that Cisco/Aruba/etc will build into Access Points and
> controllers in a carrier-agnostic way, so we don't need additional devices,
> wiring, or management and can spread it over a good-sized area when we know
> we need it.
>


Cisco and Apple announced a partnership last July at Cisco Live.
http://www.cisco.com/c/m/en_us/solutions/strategic-partners/apple.html

Cisco did have a MicroCelluar module in the 3600 AP that was carrier
agnostic before.
http://www.cisco.com/c/en/us/products/wireless/universal-small-cell-5310/index.html

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Re: [WIRELESS-LAN] Here come the LTE-U devices...

[Jeremy Mooney]

Only searched for that spec, but it looks like 46dBm is labeled Macro
(which is the larger cell sites). At 5GHz with free space loss alone you
have 23dB loss in 7m, so as long as it's more than 7m further away than
your next AP on the same frequencies/channel that seems less of a concern
(assuming the same-as-a-neighbor is accurate). Even our rooftop sites would
probably have limited impact. There's also licensing for those power
levels, but the carriers already do that for everything else cellular so
that alone seems unlikely to stop them.

The bigger risk might be if any DAS or other cellular augmentation on
campus starts using it. The traditional DAS RFoG or leaky coax systems with
shared RF across zones have the most motivation to try to increase
capacity, but those systems seem less likely to pass 5GHz. A collection of
microcells installed on site would be a bigger concern (proper microcells,
I doubt the femtocells the carriers brand as microcells to consumers will
get this anytime soon). Time to double check relationships with the
facilities people who would handle setting up any carrier leases.


On Thu, Feb 23, 2017 at 8:31 AM, Jason Healy  wrote:

> On Feb 22, 2017, at 3:21 PM, Coehoorn, Joel  wrote:
> >
> > IIRC, this has the same power limitations as WiFi and other unlicensed
> applications.
>
> Someone on Slashdot found this report:
>
>   http://www.lteuforum.org/uploads/3/5/6/8/3568127/lte-u_
> forum_lte-u_technical_report_v1.0.pdf
>
> The poster pointed out that the Tx power they used for the LTE-U cells was
> 46dBm (compared to Wi-Fi's 24dBm), or 40w vs 0.25w.  I've only skimmed (and
> I'm certainly no expert), so I don't know if that's the power they plan to
> run it at, or if that's just what they were using for testing.
>
> The other part the concerns me is the throughput testing section.  They
> show that LTE-U is no worse than two Wi-Fi APs on the same channel, but
> that's cold comfort for me.  Right now we're used to having the spectrum
> all to ourselves (at least in the middle of campus where we aren't close to
> neighbors).  LTE-U may not be worse than a noisy neighbor, but I was used
> to having NO neighbors...
>
> Jason
> **
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> Group discussion list can be found at http://www.educause.edu/discuss.
>



-- 
Jeremy Mooney
ITS - Bethel University

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RE: [WIRELESS-LAN] Here come the LTE-U devices...

[Chuck Enfield]

Make of this what you will, but Verizon has been investing in large-venue 
Wi-Fi recently.

-Original Message-
From: The EDUCAUSE Wireless Issues Constituent Group Listserv 
[mailto:WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU] On Behalf Of Bob Brown
Sent: Wednesday, February 22, 2017 1:25 PM
To: WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU
Subject: [WIRELESS-LAN] Here come the LTE-U devices...

FCC announced it has authorized first LTE-U devices (Ericsson and Nokia are 
first two suppliers approved)

CHAIRMAN PAI STATEMENT ON COMMISSION
AUTHORIZATION OF FIRST LTE-U DEVICES
  --
WASHINGTON, February 22, 2017 – Federal Communications Commission Chairman 
Ajit Pai issued the following statement today on the agency’s first 
authorization of LTE-U devices:

“Today, the Commission announced authorization of the first-ever LTE-U (LTE 
for unlicensed) devices in the 5 GHz band.  This is a significant advance in 
wireless innovation and a big win for wireless consumers.

“LTE-U allows wireless providers to deliver mobile data traffic using 
unlicensed spectrum while sharing the road, so to speak, with Wi-Fi.  The 
excellent staff of the FCC’s Office of Engineering and Technology has 
certified that the LTE-U devices being approved today are in compliance with 
FCC rules.  And voluntary industry testing has demonstrated that both these 
devices and Wi-Fi operations can co-exist in the 5 GHz band.  This heralds a 
technical breakthrough in the many shared uses of this spectrum.

“This is a great deal for wireless consumers, too.  It means they get to 
enjoy the best of both worlds: a more robust, seamless experience when their 
devices are using cellular networks and the continued enjoyment of Wi-Fi, 
one of the most creative uses of spectrum in history.

“I remain committed to ensuring a competitive and vibrant unlicensed 
ecosystem that fosters innovation and promotes the efficient use of 
spectrum.  Today’s announcement, enabled by cooperation among private actors 
and collaboration with the public sector, reflects that commitment.”


https://www.fcc.gov/news-events/blog/2017/02/22/oet-authorizes-first-lte-u-devices

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Re: [WIRELESS-LAN] Here come the LTE-U devices...

[Coehoorn, Joel]

IIRC, this has the same power limitations as WiFi and other unlicensed
applications. That limits range enough I don't see carriers just deploying
this everywhere across our campuses. If nothing else, they'd have to get
permission to place the radios. I think it makes more sense for them as
something they can offer to us for micro-cells to improve coverage in
buildings and underground, instead of distributed antennas.

Even that won't make sense until handset support is in more than just a few
devices, though the current Apple/Samsung hegemony means the right device
could tip that scale faster than we expect. I'm also curious if this is
something that Cisco/Aruba/etc will build into Access Points and
controllers in a carrier-agnostic way, so we don't need additional devices,
wiring, or management and can spread it over a good-sized area when we know
we need it.



Joel Coehoorn
Director of Information Technology
402.363.5603
*jcoeho...@york.edu *

*Please contact helpd...@york.edu  for technical
assistance.*


The mission of York College is to transform lives through
Christ-centered education and to equip students for lifelong service to
God, family, and society

On Wed, Feb 22, 2017 at 12:24 PM, Bob Brown  wrote:

> FCC announced it has authorized first LTE-U devices (Ericsson and Nokia
> are first two suppliers approved)
>
> CHAIRMAN PAI STATEMENT ON COMMISSION
> AUTHORIZATION OF FIRST LTE-U DEVICES
>   --
> WASHINGTON, February 22, 2017 – Federal Communications Commission Chairman
> Ajit Pai issued the following statement today on the agency’s first
> authorization of LTE-U devices:
>
> “Today, the Commission announced authorization of the first-ever LTE-U
> (LTE for unlicensed) devices in the 5 GHz band.  This is a significant
> advance in wireless innovation and a big win for wireless consumers.
>
> “LTE-U allows wireless providers to deliver mobile data traffic using
> unlicensed spectrum while sharing the road, so to speak, with Wi-Fi.  The
> excellent staff of the FCC’s Office of Engineering and Technology has
> certified that the LTE-U devices being approved today are in compliance
> with FCC rules.  And voluntary industry testing has demonstrated that both
> these devices and Wi-Fi operations can co-exist in the 5 GHz band.  This
> heralds a technical breakthrough in the many shared uses of this spectrum.
>
> “This is a great deal for wireless consumers, too.  It means they get to
> enjoy the best of both worlds: a more robust, seamless experience when
> their devices are using cellular networks and the continued enjoyment of
> Wi-Fi, one of the most creative uses of spectrum in history.
>
> “I remain committed to ensuring a competitive and vibrant unlicensed
> ecosystem that fosters innovation and promotes the efficient use of
> spectrum.  Today’s announcement, enabled by cooperation among private
> actors and collaboration with the public sector, reflects that commitment.”
>
>
> https://www.fcc.gov/news-events/blog/2017/02/22/oet-
> authorizes-first-lte-u-devices
>
> **
> Participation and subscription information for this EDUCAUSE Constituent
> Group discussion list can be found at http://www.educause.edu/discuss.
>

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Participation and subscription information for this EDUCAUSE Constituent Group 
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