[WSG] Thanks to all -its now compliant 100%!
Thanks to all of you, my http://metacoustics.com.au site is now fully XHTML1.0 Strict compliant!! I've changed the link on the footer with the target attribute to using that little bit of javascript so it's compliant. Whooohoo!!! My first to be completed, styled by me (with a lot of plagiarism that's true!) and since there are no button graphics any more, my weakness isn't showing - my lack of artistic flair. This site is a gazillion times more interesting-looking to my eye than the work I accepted from the client, and while the site itself is relatively simple, for me it's been a fascinating learning experience. The original version of the site looked much like this, but was slower to load. MUCH slower! It used tables for layout and even though I used includes to minimise the amount of code I had to maintain, when the client said I don't like those colours - I think the headings need to be bigger and the main text is too small it meant a day's work to go through and change it all.Doing it this way, if he said the same again it would take me 5 minutes to do what he asks, and 10 minutes to check it all. As I've said before on this list, this exercise is the first of 5 sites I have currently in development, and its revolutionised the way I build sites in my shop. Now I budget less than a quarter of the time I used to for building and styling sites. For me that means I can do more in less time, and also I can charge the same for less work, or I have more room to negotiate pricing. And my sites are much better, faster, cleaner, leaner and more consistent. I'm working on my own sites too, in order to bring them to the same level of compliance. Thanks for all the help. This list has given me a great start on how to do this. Cheers Mike Kear Windsor, NSW, Australia AFP Webworks http://afpwebworks.com * The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ *
[WSG] Coding Standard...
Hey Everyone,
This is a great debate in Perl, C++, PHP...
Its all the same with CSS too!
I HATE It When People code with the curly brackets like this:
div.row span.left {
float: left;
text-align: left;
font-weight: bold;
color: #fff; width: 49%;
}
I prefer to code like this:
div.row span.left
{
float: left;
text-align: left;
font-weight: bold;
color: #fff;
width: 49%;
}
What is your preference
See I hate when things dnt Line up...
I love having nicely formatted code.
Sorry - I hope this standard doesnt make this off topic.
I would just like to know what you like, and dont like.
It will be interesting to see what your opinions are!
--
Chris Stratford
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Http://www.neester.com
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Re: [WSG] Coding Standard...
Properly lined up is better IMHO
div.row span.left
{
float: left;
text-align: left;
font-weight: bold;
color: #fff;
width: 49%;
}
is much easier to work with especially when the program you're
developing highlights matching open/close brackets.
Chris Stratford wrote:
Hey Everyone,
This is a great debate in Perl, C++, PHP...
Its all the same with CSS too!
I *HATE *It When People code with the curly brackets like this:
/div.row span.left {
float: left;
text-align: left;
font-weight: bold;
color: #fff; width: 49%;
}
/
I prefer to code like this:
/div.row span.left
{
float: left;
text-align: left;
font-weight: bold;
color: #fff;
width: 49%;
}
/What is your preference
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[WSG] Need CSS assistance
I am having a terrible time trying to get three columns of different length content to all be the same height. test pages are here: http://www.xperianz.com/jeff02232004 and the css is here: http://www.xperianz.com/jeff02232004/css/main3.css TIA Jeff * The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ *
Re: [WSG] Coding Standard...
Yeah,
Thats my opinion too!
But every tutorial website I see (well most)...
Use the IMO - "goofy" method..
I mean why have the Open bracket on the top line?
It makes it so hard to find the opening, because its not inline with
anything!
So far its:
2:0
for, LUM -vs- GM (Lined Up Method -vs- Goofy Method)
Chris Stratford
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Http://www.neester.com
Neerav wrote:
Properly lined up is better IMHO
div.row span.left
{
float: left;
text-align: left;
font-weight: bold;
color: #fff;
width: 49%;
}
is much easier to work with especially when the program you're
developing highlights matching open/close brackets.
Chris Stratford wrote:
Hey Everyone,
This is a great debate in Perl, C++, PHP...
Its all the same with CSS too!
I *HATE *It When People code with the curly brackets like this:
/div.row span.left {
float: left;
text-align: left;
font-weight: bold;
color: #fff; width: 49%;
}
/
I prefer to code like this:
/div.row span.left
{
float: left;
text-align: left;
font-weight: bold;
color: #fff;
width: 49%;
}
/What is your preference
*
The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/
*
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*
Re: [WSG] Need CSS assistance
Jeff, Would Russ's tutorial help? http://css.maxdesign.com.au/selectutorial/tutorial_intro.htm You have one or two glitches in the current design. The right hand box overlaps the content area in the centre if the window is too narrow. The Xperianz logo repeats at top left. All the best. -Hugh Todd I am having a terrible time trying to get three columns of different length content to all be the same height. * The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ *
Re: [WSG] Need CSS assistance
Hugh This may just be what I needed in a tutorial to get this site working correctly. Thank you so much. Jeff - Original Message - From: Hugh Todd [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Saturday, February 28, 2004 7:06 PM Subject: Re: [WSG] Need CSS assistance Jeff, Would Russ's tutorial help? http://css.maxdesign.com.au/selectutorial/tutorial_intro.htm You have one or two glitches in the current design. The right hand box overlaps the content area in the centre if the window is too narrow. The Xperianz logo repeats at top left. All the best. -Hugh Todd I am having a terrible time trying to get three columns of different length content to all be the same height. * The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ * * The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ *
Re: [WSG] Coding Standard...
Good point james - about the team work :)
i will make sure i remember that before I start any group coding...
Could save a lot of time/effort...
well - I dont understand why whenever I read someones code - its using
the goofy method...
I mean - if most people prefer the lined up method...
That link was very interesting...
I didnt realise there were so many "methods"...
well im in with the BSD method :)
thanks for that james!
Chris Stratford
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Http://www.neester.com
James Ellis wrote:
Chris
We had a chat about this over at sydney.ug.php.net and position :
divided; :D The one you mention is discussed among others at
http://www.kafejo.com/komp/1tbs.htm. I prefer the BSD style as you get:
if()
{
...
}//end if
else
{
... }//end else
And the braces are all lined up which makes for great readability of
where conditionals end. I also comment conditional ends.
CSS is different as you are only applying rules rather than
conditionals and nested conditionals. As long as you are consistent and
document what is done then there should be no problem when handing over
or sharing a project codebase.
Doing this
#obj { position : absolute; color : cyan; border : 1px dotted yellow;}
#nav { color : green; }
#ihaterealitytv { color : black; background-color : white; }
or this
#obj
{
position : absolute;
color : cyan;
border : 1px dotted yellow;
}
#nav { color : green;
}
#ihaterealitytv
{
color : black;
background-color : white;
}
is more prefarable to this:
#obj
{
position : absolute;
color : cyan;
border : 1px dotted yellow;
}
#nav { color : green; }
#ihaterealitytv {
color : black;
background-color : white;
}
If you are working in a team, deciding on the bracing method for these
types of languages is probably the first thing to be worked out amongst
coders.
Cheers
James
Chris Stratford wrote:
Hey Everyone,
This is a great debate in Perl, C++, PHP...
Its all the same with CSS too!
I *HATE *It When People code with the curly brackets like this:
/div.row span.left {
float: left;
text-align: left;
font-weight: bold;
color: #fff; width: 49%;
}
/
I prefer to code like this:
/div.row span.left
{
float: left;
text-align: left;
font-weight: bold;
color: #fff;
width: 49%;
}
/What is your preference
See I hate when things dnt Line up...
I love having nicely formatted code.
Sorry - I hope this standard doesnt make this off topic.
I would just like to know what you like, and dont like.
It will be interesting to see what your opinions are!
--
Chris Stratford
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Http://www.neester.com
* The discussion
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Re: [WSG] Coding Standard...
This is great flamewar material, dude :). I adhere pretty closely to the KR style (opening curly bracket on the same line as the selector [or function or class definition, or conditional, or whatever]), mostly because it conserves the most space (and because I don't think I've ever used curlies to see blocks -- that's what proper indentation is for!). It's all good as long as you keep it consistent, though. -- Andrew Taumoefolau http://www.midspark.net/shazbot/ * The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ *
Re: [WSG] Coding Standard...
On Feb 28, 2004, at 4:37 PM, Chris Stratford wrote:
well - I dont understand why whenever I read someones code - its
using the goofy method...
I mean - if most people prefer the lined up method...
Most people *who have expressed a preference here* - that is not most
people :)
A lot of code examples out there use either the inline style:
.foo { some : thing; }
(usually to conserve space on the page) or this style which is very
common in Java, JavaScript and a lot of C and C++ code:
.foo {
some : thing;
}
Because of my C / C++ / Java background, I tend to use the latter style
in CSS because that's what most other folks around me do (i.e., I am
consistent with their code). Personally, I do prefer the BSD method
but I just don't use it much! :)
Sean A Corfield -- http://www.corfield.org/blog/
Got Mach II? -- http://www.mach-ii.com/
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Re: [WSG] Coding Standard...
I said MOST people, because on teh website that James sent over.
They say that thy have conducted Polls etc...
And found that the most common is the BSD method...
:)
Thats where I got it from :)
Chris Stratford
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Http://www.neester.com
Sean A Corfield wrote:
On Feb 28, 2004, at 4:37 PM, Chris Stratford wrote:
well - I dont understand why whenever I read
someones code - its using the goofy method...
I mean - if most people prefer the lined up method...
Most people *who have expressed a preference here* - that is not "most"
people :)
A lot of code examples out there use either the inline style:
.foo { some : thing; }
(usually to conserve space on the page) or this style which is very
common in Java, _javascript_ and a lot of C and C++ code:
.foo {
some : thing;
}
Because of my C / C++ / Java background, I tend to use the latter style
in CSS because that's what most other folks around me do (i.e., I am
consistent with their code). Personally, I do prefer the "BSD method"
but I just don't use it much! :)
Sean A Corfield -- http://www.corfield.org/blog/
Got Mach II? -- http://www.mach-ii.com/
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Re: [WSG] Coding Standard...
On Feb 28, 2004, at 5:10 PM, Chris Stratford wrote: I said MOST people, because on teh website that James sent over. They say that thy have conducted Polls etc... It's like the cat food commercial... they used to say 8 out of 10 owners said their cats prefer Whiskas and after a while they were forced to say 8 out of 10 owners who expressed a preference said their cats prefer Whiskas... I'd be interested to know how many people actually responded to those polls... I mean, they didn't ask *me*... I didn't even know about it. For much of the early 90's I used to write coding standards for a living and conduct code audits. Folks got very religious about brace styles, indentation and naming convention - three of the least important aspects of a good coding standard (in my opinion). Consistency is the only defensible position for those subjects. As for the other stuff, they were happy to be advised what to do (I'm talking about guidelines for complexity, cohesion, coupling, coding for maintenance...). Anyway, it's interesting to know that people actually do care about brace style in the CSS world! :) Sean A Corfield -- http://www.corfield.org/blog/ The reasonable man adapts himself to the world; the unreasonable one persists in trying to adapt the world to himself. Therefore all progress depends on the unreasonable man. -- George Bernard Shaw * The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ *
Re: [WSG] Coding Standard...
I'll put my hand up for the goofy style. It's my preference, my habit - be it CSS rules, functions, CFScript, what have you. In a team environment, I'd use whatever style made it easier for the whole team to concentrate on the work at hand. What's next? Space or tab indentation? :) --ben If I work on your stylesheet, I'll try to follow your style. If I inherit your stylesheet, I'll format it my way. If you screw up my stylesheet with weird formatting - I'll chuck a wobbly. * The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ *
Re: [WSG] Need CSS assistance
I am still getting a small amount of white space at the bottom of the left column. Any suggestions? http://www.xperianz.com/jeff02282004/test.htm http://www.xperianz.com/jeff02282004/css/main3.css Jeff - Original Message - From: Hugh Todd [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Saturday, February 28, 2004 7:06 PM Subject: Re: [WSG] Need CSS assistance Jeff, Would Russ's tutorial help? http://css.maxdesign.com.au/selectutorial/tutorial_intro.htm You have one or two glitches in the current design. The right hand box overlaps the content area in the centre if the window is too narrow. The Xperianz logo repeats at top left. All the best. -Hugh Todd I am having a terrible time trying to get three columns of different length content to all be the same height. * The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ * * The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ *
Re: [WSG] Need CSS assistance
Hi Jeff,
You need to add a declaration into the following rule set:
div#banner1
{
position: absolute;
top: 10px;
left: 10px;
padding-top: 75px;
height: 96px;
width: 260px;
background-image: url(../images/X_logo.gif);
}
Add this:
background-repeat: no-repeat;
Stops the image being tiles throughout the background of the container.
Russ
I am still getting a small amount of white space at the bottom of the left
column. Any suggestions?
http://www.xperianz.com/jeff02282004/test.htm
http://www.xperianz.com/jeff02282004/css/main3.css
Jeff
- Original Message -
From: Hugh Todd [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Saturday, February 28, 2004 7:06 PM
Subject: Re: [WSG] Need CSS assistance
Jeff,
Would Russ's tutorial help?
http://css.maxdesign.com.au/selectutorial/tutorial_intro.htm
You have one or two glitches in the current design. The right hand box
overlaps the content area in the centre if the window is too narrow.
The Xperianz logo repeats at top left.
All the best. -Hugh Todd
*
The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/
*
Re: [WSG] Need CSS assistance
Jeff You have an incomplete doctype - the browser will be operating in quirks mode. Try fixing this and see if pain persists, consult the list. :D You have !DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC -//W3C//DTD HTML 4.0 Transitional//EN Should be: !DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC -//W3C//DTD HTML 4.01 Transitional//EN http://www.w3.org/TR/html4/loose.dtd; Link: http://www.alistapart.com/articles/doctype/ Cheers James Jeff D. Reid wrote: I am still getting a small amount of white space at the bottom of the left column. Any suggestions? http://www.xperianz.com/jeff02282004/test.htm http://www.xperianz.com/jeff02282004/css/main3.css Jeff - Original Message - From: Hugh Todd [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Saturday, February 28, 2004 7:06 PM Subject: Re: [WSG] Need CSS assistance Jeff, Would Russ's tutorial help? http://css.maxdesign.com.au/selectutorial/tutorial_intro.htm You have one or two glitches in the current design. The right hand box overlaps the content area in the centre if the window is too narrow. The Xperianz logo repeats at top left. All the best. -Hugh Todd I am having a terrible time trying to get three columns of different length content to all be the same height. * The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ * * The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ * * The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ *
Re: [WSG] Need CSS assistance
My mistake...been at this way too long today.
I meant I am getting white space at the bottom of the right column.
My apologies.
Jeff
- Original Message -
From: russ weakley [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: Web Standards Group [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Saturday, February 28, 2004 10:27 PM
Subject: Re: [WSG] Need CSS assistance
Hi Jeff,
You need to add a declaration into the following rule set:
div#banner1
{
position: absolute;
top: 10px;
left: 10px;
padding-top: 75px;
height: 96px;
width: 260px;
background-image: url(../images/X_logo.gif);
}
Add this:
background-repeat: no-repeat;
Stops the image being tiles throughout the background of the container.
Russ
I am still getting a small amount of white space at the bottom of the
left
column. Any suggestions?
http://www.xperianz.com/jeff02282004/test.htm
http://www.xperianz.com/jeff02282004/css/main3.css
Jeff
- Original Message -
From: Hugh Todd [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Saturday, February 28, 2004 7:06 PM
Subject: Re: [WSG] Need CSS assistance
Jeff,
Would Russ's tutorial help?
http://css.maxdesign.com.au/selectutorial/tutorial_intro.htm
You have one or two glitches in the current design. The right hand box
overlaps the content area in the centre if the window is too narrow.
The Xperianz logo repeats at top left.
All the best. -Hugh Todd
*
The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/
*
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Re: [WSG] Coding Standard...
LOL Yeah? Im all for TAB indentation (I set my tabs to be a width of 4 Spaces) :) Tabs are more definable, I use SOURCEEDIT... And when I turn on the SHOW WHITESPACE, all the Dots as spaces are very irritating... :P Chris Stratford [EMAIL PROTECTED] Http://www.neester.com Ben Bishop wrote: I'll put my hand up for the "goofy style." It's my preference, my habit - be it CSS rules, functions, CFScript, what have you. In a team environment, I'd use whatever style made it easier for the whole team to concentrate on the work at hand. What's next? Space or tab indentation? :) --ben If I work on your stylesheet, I'll try to follow your style. If I inherit your stylesheet, I'll format it my way. If you screw up my stylesheet with weird formatting - I'll chuck a wobbly. * The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ * . * The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ *
Re: [WSG] Coding Standard...
I agree, it's a personal preference more than anything else. I can say from the butt-load of site's I looked at, the vast majority used the goofy style. I personally choose that way when I code because it's what I'm used to and comfortable with. The one that drives me nuts is what someone called the inline style, which is a major pain in the butt to look through quickly when attempting to fix or change things. I've had quite a few redesigns recently where I had to run through the old stuff and it was in this format...I shoulda bought stock in Advil beforehand. The coding was very sloppy to say the least. My experience with that is it's a favorite among those ASP/M$ guys. Only one site wasn't, and that site already utilized PHP and had clean clode everywhere (HTML, CSS, PHP, etc.) and was nicely commented. She was a breeze to redo and a pleasure...wish more went like that one did. MD On Feb 28, 2004, at 22:18, russ weakley wrote: Forgive me for sounding grumpy, but I think this sort of thing can go on too long. We are not talking about standards or best practices now, we are talking about personal preferences. Whitespace inside a declaration block is ignored - so it can be used to lay out rules or rules sets in any way you want. It comes down to personal or production team choice. Russ I'll put my hand up for the goofy style. It's my preference, my habit - be it CSS rules, functions, CFScript, what have you. In a team environment, I'd use whatever style made it easier for the whole team to concentrate on the work at hand. What's next? Space or tab indentation? :) --ben If I work on your stylesheet, I'll try to follow your style. If I inherit your stylesheet, I'll format it my way. If you screw up my stylesheet with weird formatting - I'll chuck a wobbly. * The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ * * The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ * * The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ *
