Re: [WSG] Electronic forms building software
Sorry, I didn't know that :-) -- Peter Mount Web Development for Business Mobile: 0411 276602 [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.petermount.com Andrew Boyd wrote: Peter, Jessica has been designing forms for years and seems (based on my observations) to have a fair handle on web standards/accessibility and form coding without tools. I guess that rather than beginner advice she was after a way to code them using tools in a standards compliant way, but I will leave this to her to confirm :) Cheers, Andrew Andrew Boyd Consultant SMS Management Technology M 0413 048 542 T +61 2 6279 7100 F +61 2 6279 7101 [EMAIL PROTECTED] About SMS: Ground Floor, 8 Brindabella Circuit, CANBERRA AIRPORT ACT 2609 www.smsmt.com SMS Management Technology (SMS) [ASX:SMX] is Australia's largest, publicly listed Management Services company. We solve complex problems and transform business through Consulting, People and Technology From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Peter Mount [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Tuesday, 5 February 2008 10:46 PM To: wsg@webstandardsgroup.org Subject: Re: [WSG] Electronic forms building software You would be better off to look at these tutorials on Accessible html/xhtml forms at: http://www.webstandards.org/learn/tutorials/accessible-forms/ I know you asked about WYSIWYG tools for this but if your looking for experience in forms then your much better off starting by learning how to them without a WYSIWYG tool. These tutorials on the Web Standards Project web site (after you look at the forms tutorial on http://www.w3schools.com/) will give you a grounding for judging other tools. Have fun -- Peter Mount Web Development for Business Mobile: 0411 276602 [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.petermount.com *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] *** NOTICE - This communication is intended only for the person or entity to which it is addressed and may contain confidential and/or privileged material. Any review, retransmission, dissemination or other use of, or taking any action in reliance on, this communication by persons or entities other than the intended recipient is prohibited. If you are not the intended recipient of this communication please delete and destroy all copies and telephone SMS Management Technology on 9696 0911 immediately. Any views expressed in this Communication are those of the individual sender, except where the sender specifically states them to be the views of SMS Management Technology. Except as required by law, SMS Management Technology does not represent, warrant and/or guarantee that the integrity of this communication has been maintained nor that the communication is free from errors, virus, interception or interference. *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] *** *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ***
RE: [WSG] Electronic forms building software
Hi Peter, no problem :) Just on form usability - Jessica presented at the last IA Cocktail Hour here in Canberra on form design - Ruth Ellison blogged on it at http://www.ruthellison.com/2008/01/25/form-design/ - and there is some good advice in that on creating usable useful forms. Best regards, Andrew Andrew Boyd Consultant SMS Management Technology M 0413 048 542 T +61 2 6279 7100 F +61 2 6279 7101 [EMAIL PROTECTED] About SMS: Ground Floor, 8 Brindabella Circuit, CANBERRA AIRPORT ACT 2609 www.smsmt.com SMS Management Technology (SMS) [ASX:SMX] is Australia's largest, publicly listed Management Services company. We solve complex problems and transform business through Consulting, People and Technology From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Peter Mount [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Wednesday, 6 February 2008 7:18 PM To: wsg@webstandardsgroup.org Subject: Re: [WSG] Electronic forms building software Sorry, I didn't know that :-) -- Peter Mount Web Development for Business Mobile: 0411 276602 [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.petermount.com Andrew Boyd wrote: Peter, Jessica has been designing forms for years and seems (based on my observations) to have a fair handle on web standards/accessibility and form coding without tools. I guess that rather than beginner advice she was after a way to code them using tools in a standards compliant way, but I will leave this to her to confirm :) Cheers, Andrew Andrew Boyd Consultant SMS Management Technology M 0413 048 542 T +61 2 6279 7100 F +61 2 6279 7101 [EMAIL PROTECTED] About SMS: Ground Floor, 8 Brindabella Circuit, CANBERRA AIRPORT ACT 2609 www.smsmt.com SMS Management Technology (SMS) [ASX:SMX] is Australia's largest, publicly listed Management Services company. We solve complex problems and transform business through Consulting, People and Technology From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Peter Mount [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Tuesday, 5 February 2008 10:46 PM To: wsg@webstandardsgroup.org Subject: Re: [WSG] Electronic forms building software You would be better off to look at these tutorials on Accessible html/xhtml forms at: http://www.webstandards.org/learn/tutorials/accessible-forms/ I know you asked about WYSIWYG tools for this but if your looking for experience in forms then your much better off starting by learning how to them without a WYSIWYG tool. These tutorials on the Web Standards Project web site (after you look at the forms tutorial on http://www.w3schools.com/) will give you a grounding for judging other tools. Have fun -- Peter Mount Web Development for Business Mobile: 0411 276602 [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.petermount.com *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] *** NOTICE - This communication is intended only for the person or entity to which it is addressed and may contain confidential and/or privileged material. Any review, retransmission, dissemination or other use of, or taking any action in reliance on, this communication by persons or entities other than the intended recipient is prohibited. If you are not the intended recipient of this communication please delete and destroy all copies and telephone SMS Management Technology on 9696 0911 immediately. Any views expressed in this Communication are those of the individual sender, except where the sender specifically states them to be the views of SMS Management Technology. Except as required by law, SMS Management Technology does not represent, warrant and/or guarantee that the integrity of this communication has been maintained nor that the communication is free from errors, virus, interception or interference. *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] *** *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] *** NOTICE - This communication is intended only for the person or entity to which it is addressed and may contain confidential and/or privileged material. Any review, retransmission, dissemination or other use of, or taking any action in reliance on, this communication by persons or entities other than the intended recipient is
Re: [WSG] margin auto in css
Michael Horowitz wrote: Thanks for all the help so far. I'm obviously going to have to study up on setting margins to 0 auto in css. I'm going to look it up myself but if anyone can explain how that resolved my earlier issues I'd appreciate it. See: http://bluerobot.com/web/css/center1.html http://www.w3.org/Style/Examples/007/center http://www.w3.org/TR/CSS21/visudet.html ~dL -- http://chelseacreekstudio.com/ *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ***
Re: [WSG] Styling forms
Yes, the only difference between between the input in the label and having it outside of the label with the for attribute set is primarily just some formatting via CSS differences. Beyond that, there is little difference. All modern browsers (and even most older ones) allow you to click on the label to put your focus in the input that that the label is referenced to, regardless of which way it is implemented. Thomas Thomassen wrote: When the LABEL element wraps around INPUT you do not need the FOR attribute.The hierarchy provides the connection between them. However, when the LABEL does not wrap around the INPUT, the FOR attribute is required for useragent to know the elements are related. - Original Message - From: John Faulds [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: wsg@webstandardsgroup.org Sent: Wednesday, February 06, 2008 7:42 AM Subject: Re: [WSG] Styling forms Hi Germ17,I have seen your example presented in GERMWORKS.NETFYI, your approach is perfect to my knowledge, but the INPUT element should not wrapped by any LABEL element. It's not compliant/accessible...I request you to modify this example according to standards, if you believe the same. You're wrong there. It's perfectly valid HTML and I don't believe it is any less accessible as long as the 'for' attribute is specified. -- Tyssen Design http://www.tyssendesign.com.au Ph: (07) 3300 3303 Mb: 0405 678 590 *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] *** *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] *** -- Christian Snodgrass Azure Ronin Web Design http://www.arwebdesign.net/ http://www.arwebdesign.net Phone: 859.816.7955 *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ***
[WSG] repeat x and repeat y
I again thank everyone for all the help. Any good resources for repeat x and repeat y Also would love suggestions for new books to buy. -- Michael Horowitz Your Computer Consultant http://yourcomputerconsultant.com 561-394-9079 *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ***
Re: [WSG] repeat x and repeat y
Michael Horowitz wrote: I again thank everyone for all the help. Any good resources for repeat x and repeat y Also would love suggestions for new books to buy. See: http://www.w3.org/TR/CSS21/colors.html#background-properties http://css-discuss.incutio.com/?page=GoodBooks ~dL -- http://chelseacreekstudio.com/ *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ***
RE: [WSG] repeat x and repeat y
Two books I would recommend - Designing with Web Standards - Jeffrey Zeldman The Art Science of CSS - Sitepoint Hope this helps :) -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of David Laakso Sent: 06 February 2008 16:37 To: wsg@webstandardsgroup.org Subject: Re: [WSG] repeat x and repeat y Michael Horowitz wrote: I again thank everyone for all the help. Any good resources for repeat x and repeat y Also would love suggestions for new books to buy. See: http://www.w3.org/TR/CSS21/colors.html#background-properties http://css-discuss.incutio.com/?page=GoodBooks ~dL -- http://chelseacreekstudio.com/ *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] *** *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ***
Re: [WSG] repeat x and repeat y
I second the recommendation on The Art Science of CSS, it is excellent. The CSS Anthology is also an excellent CSS book (also from Sitepoint). Darren Lovelock wrote: Two books I would recommend - Designing with Web Standards - Jeffrey Zeldman The Art Science of CSS - Sitepoint Hope this helps :) -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of David Laakso Sent: 06 February 2008 16:37 To: wsg@webstandardsgroup.org Subject: Re: [WSG] repeat x and repeat y Michael Horowitz wrote: I again thank everyone for all the help. Any good resources for repeat x and repeat y Also would love suggestions for new books to buy. See: http://www.w3.org/TR/CSS21/colors.html#background-properties http://css-discuss.incutio.com/?page=GoodBooks ~dL -- http://chelseacreekstudio.com/ *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] *** *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] *** -- Christian Snodgrass Azure Ronin Web Design http://www.arwebdesign.net/ http://www.arwebdesign.net Phone: 859.816.7955 *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ***
Re: [WSG] Shouldn't margin be working
Michael Horowitz wrote:
I've added some margin and padding to the #content div
#content {
margin-top: 0px;
margin-left: 5px;
padding-top: 0px;
padding-left: 5px;
clear: none;
float: none;
}
But it doesn't appear to have an affect. I've verified it validates
as CSS
Assuming the above is in reference to your uri
http://terrorfreeamerica.us/
Your CSS is doing as you have asked. Put a border around #content and
you will see it.
It is not exactly clear to me what you are after. But my guess is you're
looking for something that looks more like this?:
http://www.chelseacreekstudio.com/ca/cssd/temp05.html
Best,
~dL
--
http://chelseacreekstudio.com/
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Re: [WSG] Shouldn't margin be working
I guess my boxes are wrong. What you have is what I am looking for.
What I thought I was doing was setting up a
#menu box adjacent to a #content box adjacent to a #right_box. All
parallel. It appears the content box is actually going out to the
entire size of the site while #menu box and #right_box are in it.
What am I misunderstanding about setting up the box model correctly. (I
don't want to just steal your code but understand how to do it right for
the future)
Michael Horowitz
Your Computer Consultant
http://yourcomputerconsultant.com
561-394-9079
David Laakso wrote:
Michael Horowitz wrote:
I've added some margin and padding to the #content div
#content {
margin-top: 0px;
margin-left: 5px;
padding-top: 0px;
padding-left: 5px;
clear: none;
float: none;
}
But it doesn't appear to have an affect. I've verified it validates
as CSS
Assuming the above is in reference to your uri
http://terrorfreeamerica.us/
Your CSS is doing as you have asked. Put a border around #content and
you will see it.
It is not exactly clear to me what you are after. But my guess is
you're looking for something that looks more like this?:
http://www.chelseacreekstudio.com/ca/cssd/temp05.html
Best,
~dL
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Re: [WSG] Shouldn't margin be working
Michael Horowitz wrote: I guess my boxes are wrong. What you have is what I am looking for. What I thought I was doing was setting up a #menu box adjacent to a #content box adjacent to a #right_box. All parallel. It appears the content box is actually going out to the entire size of the site while #menu box and #right_box are in it. What am I misunderstanding about setting up the box model correctly. (I don't want to just steal your code but understand how to do it right for the future) Michael Horowitz Assuming the above is in reference to your uri http://terrorfreeamerica.us/ http://www.chelseacreekstudio.com/ca/cssd/temp05.html Best, ~dL I guess something is not right. If you put borders or background-colors on containers you may see what is wrong with your layout. The left side of #content should touch the right side of #menu. They need to be parallel and adjacent to each other. The first id to open and last to close needs to be #wrapper: it contains, #header, #menu/#content, and #footer. #right_box box is not needed. Regards, ~dL -- http://chelseacreekstudio.com/ *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ***
Re: [WSG] repeat x and repeat y
http://reference.sitepoint.com/css/background-repeat On 2/7/08, Michael Horowitz [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I again thank everyone for all the help. Any good resources for repeat x and repeat y -- Andrew http://tetlaw.id.au *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ***
Re: [WSG] display differences firefox ie 7.0
MH: Someone earlier this week sent a very good presentation that explained a lot of the problems you are facing. It is quite a long presentation (more of a lesson really!) but it answers a lot of the problems you are having. There are also a collection of great links sprinkled through that we could all find useful in our bookmarks list. give it a whirl! http://www.hotdesign.com/seybold/ Joe On Feb 6 2008, at 02:10, Michael Horowitz wrote: I've noticed that my site is centered it ie 7.0 but left justified in firefox http://terrorfreeamerica.us/. What are the issues and workarounds to keep them in sync. In this case I would like it centered both ways but I would love to know how to do it either way. Thanks -- Michael Horowitz Your Computer Consultant http://yourcomputerconsultant.com 561-394-9079 *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] *** Joe Ortenzi [EMAIL PROTECTED] www.joiz.com *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ***
Re: [WSG] Styling forms
Has anyone looked up the HTML 5 pages on form elements? http://www.w3.org/TR/html5-diff/ http://www.w3.org/html/wg/html5/#forms It's all fieldsets and labels... which makes more semantic sense than paragraphs, lists, and dd/dl JOe On Feb 6 2008, at 04:06, Steve Green wrote: There may be specific cases where it would be right to mark up a form as a list, although I can't think of one. As a general rule it would be wrong. The argument against marking up a form as a list is that a form is not a list. A form is one or more groups of form controls, and the fieldset element is the correct means by which form controls should be grouped. Within a fieldset, paragraph elements should be used for individual form controls. Steve -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Michael Horowitz Sent: 06 February 2008 03:38 To: wsg@webstandardsgroup.org Subject: [WSG] Styling forms I've been looking at styling forms and I'm seeing some people mark them up as ordered lists and other using paragraphs. What are the arguments for the different markup types. -- Michael Horowitz Your Computer Consultant http://yourcomputerconsultant.com 561-394-9079 *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] *** *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] *** Joe Ortenzi [EMAIL PROTECTED] www.joiz.com *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ***
Re: [WSG] display differences firefox ie 7.0
On having Layout is a good article that gives good insight to most of IE's quirks: http://www.satzansatz.de/cssd/onhavinglayout.html - Original Message - From: Joe Ortenzi To: wsg@webstandardsgroup.org Sent: Thursday, February 07, 2008 8:14 AM Subject: Re: [WSG] display differences firefox ie 7.0 MH: Someone earlier this week sent a very good presentation that explained a lot of the problems you are facing. It is quite a long presentation (more of a lesson really!) but it answers a lot of the problems you are having. There are also a collection of great links sprinkled through that we could all find useful in our bookmarks list. give it a whirl! http://www.hotdesign.com/seybold/ Joe On Feb 6 2008, at 02:10, Michael Horowitz wrote: I've noticed that my site is centered it ie 7.0 but left justified in firefox http://terrorfreeamerica.us/. What are the issues and workarounds to keep them in sync. In this case I would like it centered both ways but I would love to know how to do it either way. Thanks -- Michael Horowitz Your Computer Consultant http://yourcomputerconsultant.com 561-394-9079 *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] *** Joe Ortenzi [EMAIL PROTECTED] www.joiz.com *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] *** *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ***
