Re: [WSG] Safari Beta 4

[Luke Hoggett]

You tell 'em Dyre ;)

Dyre Hult wrote:
Opera 10 was unveiled already last year and do pass the web standards 
Acid 3 test. Safari 4 was unveiled this month. Both browsers are still 
in the dev stage, so I reckon Mr. Andrew Lyle was misinformed.


http://dev.opera.com/articles/view/presto-2-2-and-opera-10-a-first-look/

Todd Budnikas wrote:

according to Mr. Andrew Lyle:
"Safari 4 is the first web browser to pass the web standards Acid 3 
test which demonstrates how well a browser adheres to CSS, 
javascript, XML and SVG."


So, i'd say it's handling them pretty well :)

http://acid3.acidtests.org/


On Feb 25, 2009, at 10:39 PM, Kevin Erickson wrote:


Hi,
Anyone know about how the new Safari Beta 4 is handling the current 
standards of the Web?
 
Thanks,
Kevin 
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Re: [WSG] Safari Beta 4

[Gunlaug Sørtun]

tee wrote:


By the way, Google Chorme behaves as Safari does.


Not during my testing, but that may be "conditional".
"Conditional" is problematic since that mean behavior may change with
factors like OS and connection speed = highly unreliable.

Tested Chrome, OmniWeb and Arora - all complete WebKit with unique
script engines. All behaved more or less like the latest versions of
Firefox, Opera and IE8 - not like any Safari version on any OS.

Georg
--
http://www.gunlaug.no


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Re: [WSG] Safari Beta 4

[tee]

On Mar 1, 2009, at 3:57 AM, Gunlaug Sørtun wrote:



Without that rule, empty thumbnail box is still clickable.


Not quite so easy, it seems.

Note that what you see as "empty" thumbnail boxes in Safari (without  
the
extra CSS rule) aren't necessarily empty. Those images are just  
blown up

so large, and only the middle-left portion is shown, that the objects
end up hidden outside the list-item box. Thus, the image is often  
there
in Safari too, and therefore clickable, even if you can't see the  
object.


Georg,

Thanks again. What you wrote above led to a new finding.  I was blind,  
something was quite obvious right in front of me that I didn't think  
to look into it. Magento uses resize for all images, in this gallery,  
I have it set to 250px which is what I wanted for the large image.  
Declaring width attribute in img tag is fine as galleria script takes  
care of reducing thumbnail to 80px from '.galleria li'. Somehow, with  
the resize function (250px value) and the cache issue Safari has, it  
must be confused, unable to decide whether to listen to galieria'  
script or PHP resize command.


I took the resize value out, added width directly to #main_image img  
and the thumb in jquery function. I think this fixed the distortion  
issue, at least from my version (3.2.1). Now that resize function is  
out, the image does not resize proportionally, but I think this can be  
fixed easily.


By the way, Google Chorme behaves as Safari does.

tee

 


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Re: [WSG] Safari Beta 4

[Gunlaug Sørtun]

tee wrote:

Thanks for checking. Adding the above rule makes the thumbnail 
unclickable when no thumbnail shows up. If I refresh the browser to 
make thumbnail shows up, then it's clickable.


Yeah, the various Safari versions show very different behavior for the
script.

- Safari 3.2.x indeed behaves as you describe, but doesn't behave in a
stable manner. Extra rule fixes distortion, but Safari's script-engine
fails on that script quite often.

- New script-engine in Safari 4, and in that version the thumbnail isn't
clickable even when the image shows up just fine. The new script-engine
seems to fail on that script every time, but very different from the
older version.

- More as a curiosity: Safari 2 fails in ways more like Safari 4 than
like Safari 3.

- Other WebKit based browser - those that are not just shells, got their
own script-engines and behave just fine.


So, Safari is a moving target for scripts, each script-engine version
with its own unique failures in your case. Need an expert on jquery and
script-engines to work around the problems in that browser, but the
extra CSS rule does fix the distortion problem in all Safari versions.



Without that rule, empty thumbnail box is still clickable.


Not quite so easy, it seems.

Note that what you see as "empty" thumbnail boxes in Safari (without the
extra CSS rule) aren't necessarily empty. Those images are just blown up
so large, and only the middle-left portion is shown, that the objects
end up hidden outside the list-item box. Thus, the image is often there
in Safari too, and therefore clickable, even if you can't see the object.

Safari fails to load the image just as often with and without the extra
CSS rule, so that rule doesn't seem to have any negative effects.

Find someone who can fix Safari's various script-engines, and once the
loading and layering works in all Safari versions you can find out if
the extra CSS rule is necessary to fix the distortion problem.

regards
Georg
--
http://www.gunlaug.no


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Re: [WSG] Safari Beta 4

[tee]

On Feb 28, 2009, at 7:17 PM, Gunlaug Sørtun wrote:


I can only test so far on a snapshot, but it looks like Safari 3.2.1  
and

Safari 4 beta1 behaves well when image-dimensions are styled on class
"gallery" - not just "galleria". Also seem to improve transition in
Firefox 3, which otherwise flashes terrible IMO.

Try adding...

.gallery li img {width: 80px!important; height: 80px!important;}

...which will "calm down" the script a bit without ruining its  
operations.



Georg,

Thanks for checking. Adding the above rule makes the thumbnail  
unclickable when no thumbnail shows up. If I refresh the browser to  
make thumbnail shows up, then it's clickable. Without that rule, empty  
thumbnail box is still clickable.


I am keeping the code for the moment in case you want to take a look :)

tee

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Re: [WSG] Safari Beta 4

[Gunlaug Sørtun]

tee wrote:


On this site, in Safari (PC and Mac) you will see that the
thumbnail(s) in the gallery (jquery galleria) is either not showing
up or the image gets distorted (should be 80px). You may not see it
from the first visit, should this be the case, please click on other
page, then come back to the same page. 
http://citicomm.net/bluetooth-accessories/plantronics-discovery-925.html



I can only test so far on a snapshot, but it looks like Safari 3.2.1 and
Safari 4 beta1 behaves well when image-dimensions are styled on class
"gallery" - not just "galleria". Also seem to improve transition in
Firefox 3, which otherwise flashes terrible IMO.

Try adding...

.gallery li img {width: 80px!important; height: 80px!important;}

...which will "calm down" the script a bit without ruining its operations.

regards
Georg
--
http://www.gunlaug.no


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Re: [WSG] Safari Beta 4

[tee]

Hi, I have been struggling with a Safari cache bug that I found  
absolutely no solution.


Before I trash the gallery script once more time I thought I might  
take a chance by posting my question in this thread, because the bug  
still not getting fixed in Safari Bete 4.


On this site, in Safari (PC and Mac) you will see that the  
thumbnail(s) in the gallery (jquery galleria) is either not showing up  
or the image gets distorted (should be 80px). You may not see it from  
the first visit, should this be the case, please click on other page,  
then come back to the same page.

http://citicomm.net/bluetooth-accessories/plantronics-discovery-925.html

I visited many sites that use the same galleria script, and all of  
them are working; though a few reported similar issue but they must  
have fixed it, so my guess is the reason it doesn't work on this site  
is because Magento save images to cache and this has added a layer of  
complication.


Galleria script has a history calls back function, my understanding is  
that it has a fix for Safari cache bug already. But it's not working  
here. Turning the history function off also no help.


TIA.
tee


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RE: [WSG] Safari Beta 4

[Levell Rampono]

Handling it very, very well and I'm running on a PC! 
 
From: li...@webstandardsgroup.org [mailto:li...@webstandardsgroup.org] On
Behalf Of Todd Budnikas
Sent: Thursday, 26 February 2009 3:07 PM
To: wsg@webstandardsgroup.org
Subject: Re: [WSG] Safari Beta 4
 
according to Mr. Andrew Lyle:
"Safari 4 is the first web browser to pass the web standards Acid 3 test
which demonstrates how well a browser adheres to CSS, javascript, XML and
SVG."
 
So, i'd say it's handling them pretty well :)
 
http://acid3.acidtests.org/
 
 
On Feb 25, 2009, at 10:39 PM, Kevin Erickson wrote:



Hi,
Anyone know about how the new Safari Beta 4 is handling the current
standards of the Web?
 
Thanks,
Kevin  
 
No virus found in this outgoing message.
Checked by AVG.
Version: 7.5.557 / Virus Database: 270.11.3/1969 - Release Date: 2/24/2009
6:43 AM

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RE: [WSG] Safari Beta 4

[dave turner]

dude! 

You not on a mac?  See you next week!

Dave "Citect" Turner


From: "Levell Rampono" 
Sent: 26 February 2009 15:53
To: wsg@webstandardsgroup.org
Subject: RE: [WSG] Safari Beta 4 

Handling it very, very well and I'm
running on a PC!  

  

From: 
li...@webstandardsgroup.org [mailto:li...@webstandardsgroup.org] On Behalf Of 
Todd Budnikas

Sent: Thursday, 26 February 2009
3:07 PM

To: wsg@webstandardsgroup.org

Subject: Re: [WSG] Safari Beta 4 

  

according to Mr. Andrew Lyle: 

"Safari 4 is the
first web browser to pass the web standards Acid 3 test which demonstrates how
well a browser adheres to CSS, javascript, XML and SVG." 

  

So, i'd say it's handling
them pretty well :) 

  

http://acid3.acidtests.org/ 

  

  

On Feb 25, 2009, at 10:39 PM,
Kevin Erickson wrote: 

Hi,  

Anyone know about how
the new Safari Beta 4 is handling the current standards of the Web?  

   

Thanks,  

Kevin

  

No virus found in
this outgoing message.

Checked by AVG.

Version: 7.5.557 / Virus Database: 270.11.3/1969 - Release Date: 2/24/2009 6:43
AM  

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Re: [WSG] Safari Beta 4

[kevin_erickson]

Thank you


Sent from my Centro Wireless Device.

-Original Message-

From:  Todd Budnikas 
Subj:  Re: [WSG] Safari Beta 4
Date:  Wed Feb 25, 2009 11:23 pm
Size:  4K
To:  wsg@webstandardsgroup.org

according to Mr. Andrew Lyle:"Safari 4 is the first web browser to pass the web 
standards Acid 3 test which demonstrates how well a browser adheres to CSS, 
javascript, XML and SVG."


So, i'd say it's handling them pretty well :)


http://acid3.acidtests.org/




On Feb 25, 2009, at 10:39 PM, Kevin Erickson wrote:
Hi,
Anyone know about how the new Safari Beta 4 is handling the current standards 
of the Web?

Thanks,
Kevin 


No virus found in this outgoing message.
Checked by AVG.
Version: 7.5.557 / Virus Database: 270.11.3/1969 - Release Date: 2/24/2009 6:43 
AM


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Re: [WSG] Safari Beta 4

[Todd Budnikas]

sorry to have passed along misinformation regarding which was the  
first browser to pass the Acid 3 Test. It still passes the test very  
very well, and is a decent benchmark to address the original question.



On Feb 26, 2009, at 6:34 AM, Dyre Hult wrote:

Opera 10 was unveiled already last year and do pass the web  
standards Acid 3 test. Safari 4 was unveiled this month. Both  
browsers are still in the dev stage, so I reckon Mr. Andrew Lyle was  
misinformed.


http://dev.opera.com/articles/view/presto-2-2-and-opera-10-a-first-look/

Todd Budnikas wrote:

according to Mr. Andrew Lyle:
"Safari 4 is the first web browser to pass the web standards Acid 3  
test which demonstrates how well a browser adheres to CSS,  
javascript, XML and SVG."


So, i'd say it's handling them pretty well :)

http://acid3.acidtests.org/


On Feb 25, 2009, at 10:39 PM, Kevin Erickson wrote:


Hi,
Anyone know about how the new Safari Beta 4 is handling the  
current standards of the Web?

Thanks,
Kevin




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Re: [WSG] Safari Beta 4

[Gunlaug Sørtun]

daniel wrote:


it would be much more interesting to discuss IE8's compliance again.
 All compliant sites that I've made render fine in Safari 3 & 4 and 
FIrefox 3 but always fail to work 100% on IE...


It isn't about standard compliance for your sites, but which standard
IE8 is limited to - CSS 2.1 pretty much...


Trying to do anything more advanced in IE8, is doomed to failure. Add a
few bugs - surprisingly few for the average site, and you may as well
roll your design back a bit.
Test in earlier Gecko and WebKit versions too, as many browsers in
regular use use those older engines.

side note: I've been using Safari 4 for a couple of days and I 
absolutely love it - it loads and renders pages much faster than FF 
and JS intensive pages are faster then ever - besides, who really 
uses Opera anyway?!


:-)

Nothing but!

I'll leave further commenting to someone who knows more...

...and Safari 4 beta will be put through a round of thorough tests too...

...while we're waiting for the finals.

regards
Georg
--
http://www.gunlaug.no


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Re: [WSG] Safari Beta 4

[daniel]

Well Webkit technically passed Acid 3 around the same time as Opera -  
late March '08 (28th) - but whilst Opera's Presto engine renders the  
final animation properly it doesn't render it smoothly, thus hasn't  
passed the test - so I reckon Mr Todd Budnikas was misinformed (: it's  
really just a pissing contest though with no relevance to the real  
world.


it would be much more interesting to discuss IE8's compliance again.  
All compliant sites that I've made render fine in Safari 3 & 4 and  
FIrefox 3 but always fail to work 100% on IE...


side note: I've been using Safari 4 for a couple of days and I  
absolutely love it - it loads and renders pages much faster than FF  
and JS intensive pages are faster then ever - besides, who really uses  
Opera anyway?! Additionally I've found Safari's developer tools  
indispensable and much more useful than FF's Web Dev addon, especially  
with tools like activity monitor and element inspectors as they have  
the ability to test and examine AJAX, JS and plugin content.


daniel a. thornbury

On 26/02/2009, at 10:34 PM, Dyre Hult wrote:

Opera 10 was unveiled already last year and do pass the web  
standards Acid 3 test. Safari 4 was unveiled this month. Both  
browsers are still in the dev stage, so I reckon Mr. Andrew Lyle was  
misinformed.


http://dev.opera.com/articles/view/presto-2-2-and-opera-10-a-first-look/

Todd Budnikas wrote:

according to Mr. Andrew Lyle:
"Safari 4 is the first web browser to pass the web standards Acid 3  
test which demonstrates how well a browser adheres to CSS,  
javascript, XML and SVG."


So, i'd say it's handling them pretty well :)

http://acid3.acidtests.org/


On Feb 25, 2009, at 10:39 PM, Kevin Erickson wrote:


Hi,
Anyone know about how the new Safari Beta 4 is handling the  
current standards of the Web?

Thanks,
Kevin
No virus found in this outgoing message.
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2/24/2009 6:43 AM



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Description: S/MIME cryptographic signature

Re: [WSG] Safari Beta 4

[Dyre Hult]

Opera 10 was unveiled already last year and do pass the web standards 
Acid 3 test. Safari 4 was unveiled this month. Both browsers are still 
in the dev stage, so I reckon Mr. Andrew Lyle was misinformed.


http://dev.opera.com/articles/view/presto-2-2-and-opera-10-a-first-look/

Todd Budnikas wrote:

according to Mr. Andrew Lyle:
"Safari 4 is the first web browser to pass the web standards Acid 3 
test which demonstrates how well a browser adheres to CSS, javascript, 
XML and SVG."


So, i'd say it's handling them pretty well :)

http://acid3.acidtests.org/


On Feb 25, 2009, at 10:39 PM, Kevin Erickson wrote:


Hi,
Anyone know about how the new Safari Beta 4 is handling the current 
standards of the Web?
 
Thanks,
Kevin  


No virus found in this outgoing message.
Checked by AVG.
Version: 7.5.557 / Virus Database: 270.11.3/1969 - Release Date: 
2/24/2009 6:43 AM



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Re: [WSG] Safari Beta 4

[Al Sparber]

From: "Todd Budnikas" 


according to Mr. Andrew Lyle:
"Safari 4 is the first web browser to pass the web standards Acid 3
test which demonstrates how well a browser adheres to CSS, javascript,
XML and SVG."

So, i'd say it's handling them pretty well :)

http://acid3.acidtests.org/


Smoke and mirrors.

document.ready (a staple of modern DOM Scripting) does not wait for external 
CSS or CSS written in external scripts and is the only modern browser to do 
this. Log on to the Safari bug list and you'll see a bunch of 
double-talkers. Another point is it's not Safari (and Apple by implication), 
it's an open source rendering engine. Apple has contributed several nice 
shades of gray, though :-)


--
Al Sparber - PVII
http://www.projectseven.com
The Finest Dreamweaver Menus | Galleries | Widgets
http://www.projectseven.com/go/pop
The Ultimate DW Menu System






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Re: [WSG] Safari Beta 4

[Todd Budnikas]

according to Mr. Andrew Lyle:
"Safari 4 is the first web browser to pass the web standards Acid 3  
test which demonstrates how well a browser adheres to CSS, javascript,  
XML and SVG."


So, i'd say it's handling them pretty well :)

http://acid3.acidtests.org/


On Feb 25, 2009, at 10:39 PM, Kevin Erickson wrote:


Hi,
Anyone know about how the new Safari Beta 4 is handling the current  
standards of the Web?


Thanks,
Kevin

No virus found in this outgoing message.
Checked by AVG.
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2/24/2009 6:43 AM



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[WSG] Safari Beta 4

[Kevin Erickson]

Hi,

Anyone know about how the new Safari Beta 4 is handling the current
standards of the Web? 

 

Thanks,

Kevin  


No virus found in this outgoing message.
Checked by AVG. 
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6:43 AM
 


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