Re: [Xastir] Archaic default map

[Hal Mueller]

I neglected to mention: I did go prowling through the OSM extracts. There are 
indeed OSM country boundary shapefiles, but they’re at full resolution. 
Downsampling them while preserving topology is a non-trivial task (which is 
what inspired the Natural Earth project in the first place).

Hal

> On Jul 29, 2019, at 11:00 AM, Tom Russo  wrote:
> 
> shapefile
> representation of the OSM data

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Re: [Xastir] Archaic default map

[Hal Mueller]

I was just going to suggest Natural Earth. Their smallest scale (1:110m) weighs 
in at about 200 KB for country boundaries only, as a zipped shapefile.. As a 
bonus, a DBFAWK that works with the smallest scale stuff should also work fine 
for someone who wants to download the large scale version (1:10m).

https://www.naturalearthdata.com/downloads/110m-cultural-vectors/ 
 describes 
the small scale version. The data is published as public domain: 
https://www.naturalearthdata.com/about/terms-of-use/ 


Hal

> On Jul 29, 2019, at 11:00 AM, Tom Russo  wrote:
> 
> On Mon, Jul 29, 2019 at 12:51:56PM -0500, we recorded a bogon-computron 
> collision of the mailto:kilo5...@gmail.com>> flavor, 
> containing:
>> Tiles require either Imagemagick or GraphicsMagick, and as Tom already
>> stated that's not desirable for a minimum install of Xastir.
> 
> Yeah, but his follow-up appears to be volunteering to try to find a shapefile
> representation of the OSM data from which the Stamen tiles are generated.
> So long as the license is consistent (it may not be) that is helpful.
> 
> We're also looking at naturalearth's shapefiles, which include a relatively
> small (750k or so), fairly rough map that could be suitable.  
> 
> We're not looking to have a default map that's high quality and beautiful,
> just one that isn't 30 years out of date.  We already have a low quality
> and ugly map, it's just also wrong.  It's about 250k.
> 
> If a user wants a GOOD map, they're still going to have to do some work,
> either by building Xastir with support for on-line maps, or by finding 
> more detailed local maps that suit their specific needs.  The naturalearth
> maps include much more detailed shapefiles that could be such a choice, but
> they're way too large to be part of the Xastir distribution.
> 
>> On Mon, Jul 29, 2019, 3:05 AM Hal Mueller  wrote:
>> 
>>> Roughly what file size are we targeting? The Stamen stuff is based on Open
>>> Street Map. I think the country level data will be fairly easy to extract
>>> from OSM, or (more likely) already exists. If I see a way through I???ll hop
>>> over to github and self assign.
>>> 
>>> Hal
>>> N3YX
>>> 
 On Jul 28, 2019, at 11:27 PM, Tom Russo  wrote:
 
 Only vector maps need apply, specifically shapefile.  Anything else
>>> requires
 too many TPLs, and that would be too big a "minimum" install.
 
 On Sun, Jul 28, 2019 at 11:25:59PM -0700, we recorded a bogon-computron
>>> collision of the  flavor, containing:
> Perhaps a joined together version of tiles at
>>> http://maps.stamen.com/toner/#5/38.221/17.402? What pixel size is
>>> preferred? How much space can it consume?
> 
> Hal
> N3YX
>>> 
>>> 
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> 
> -- 
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> Tijeras, NM  
> 
> echo "prpv_a'rfg_cnf_har_cvcr" | sed -e 's/_/ /g' | tr [a-m][n-z] [n-z][a-m]
> 
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Re: [Xastir] Archaic default map

[Curt Mills]

I'd lean toward more detailed maps at the cost of file size rather
than less detailed maps these days. Even for an Rpi the file size is
much less important. Perhaps someone can come up with some use-cases
where the filesize is still critical, but it's getting to be less of a
problem over time.

On Mon, Jul 29, 2019 at 11:00 AM Tom Russo  wrote:
>
> On Mon, Jul 29, 2019 at 12:51:56PM -0500, we recorded a bogon-computron 
> collision of the  flavor, containing:
> > Tiles require either Imagemagick or GraphicsMagick, and as Tom already
> > stated that's not desirable for a minimum install of Xastir.
>
> Yeah, but his follow-up appears to be volunteering to try to find a shapefile
> representation of the OSM data from which the Stamen tiles are generated.
> So long as the license is consistent (it may not be) that is helpful.
>
> We're also looking at naturalearth's shapefiles, which include a relatively
> small (750k or so), fairly rough map that could be suitable.
>
> We're not looking to have a default map that's high quality and beautiful,
> just one that isn't 30 years out of date.  We already have a low quality
> and ugly map, it's just also wrong.  It's about 250k.
>
> If a user wants a GOOD map, they're still going to have to do some work,
> either by building Xastir with support for on-line maps, or by finding
> more detailed local maps that suit their specific needs.  The naturalearth
> maps include much more detailed shapefiles that could be such a choice, but
> they're way too large to be part of the Xastir distribution.
>
> > On Mon, Jul 29, 2019, 3:05 AM Hal Mueller  wrote:
> >
> > > Roughly what file size are we targeting? The Stamen stuff is based on Open
> > > Street Map. I think the country level data will be fairly easy to extract
> > > from OSM, or (more likely) already exists. If I see a way through I???ll 
> > > hop
> > > over to github and self assign.
> > >
> > > Hal
> > > N3YX
> > >
> > > > On Jul 28, 2019, at 11:27 PM, Tom Russo  wrote:
> > > >
> > > > Only vector maps need apply, specifically shapefile.  Anything else
> > > requires
> > > > too many TPLs, and that would be too big a "minimum" install.
> > > >
> > > > On Sun, Jul 28, 2019 at 11:25:59PM -0700, we recorded a bogon-computron
> > > collision of the  flavor, containing:
> > > >> Perhaps a joined together version of tiles at
> > > http://maps.stamen.com/toner/#5/38.221/17.402? What pixel size is
> > > preferred? How much space can it consume?
> > > >>
> > > >> Hal
> > > >> N3YX
> > >
> > >
> > ___
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> > Xastir@lists.xastir.org
> > http://xastir.org/mailman/listinfo/xastir
>
> --
> Tom RussoKM5VY
> Tijeras, NM
>
>  echo "prpv_a'rfg_cnf_har_cvcr" | sed -e 's/_/ /g' | tr [a-m][n-z] [n-z][a-m]
>
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Re: [Xastir] Archaic default map

[Tom Russo]

On Mon, Jul 29, 2019 at 12:51:56PM -0500, we recorded a bogon-computron 
collision of the  flavor, containing:
> Tiles require either Imagemagick or GraphicsMagick, and as Tom already
> stated that's not desirable for a minimum install of Xastir.

Yeah, but his follow-up appears to be volunteering to try to find a shapefile
representation of the OSM data from which the Stamen tiles are generated.
So long as the license is consistent (it may not be) that is helpful.

We're also looking at naturalearth's shapefiles, which include a relatively
small (750k or so), fairly rough map that could be suitable.  

We're not looking to have a default map that's high quality and beautiful,
just one that isn't 30 years out of date.  We already have a low quality
and ugly map, it's just also wrong.  It's about 250k.

If a user wants a GOOD map, they're still going to have to do some work,
either by building Xastir with support for on-line maps, or by finding 
more detailed local maps that suit their specific needs.  The naturalearth
maps include much more detailed shapefiles that could be such a choice, but
they're way too large to be part of the Xastir distribution.

> On Mon, Jul 29, 2019, 3:05 AM Hal Mueller  wrote:
> 
> > Roughly what file size are we targeting? The Stamen stuff is based on Open
> > Street Map. I think the country level data will be fairly easy to extract
> > from OSM, or (more likely) already exists. If I see a way through I???ll hop
> > over to github and self assign.
> >
> > Hal
> > N3YX
> >
> > > On Jul 28, 2019, at 11:27 PM, Tom Russo  wrote:
> > >
> > > Only vector maps need apply, specifically shapefile.  Anything else
> > requires
> > > too many TPLs, and that would be too big a "minimum" install.
> > >
> > > On Sun, Jul 28, 2019 at 11:25:59PM -0700, we recorded a bogon-computron
> > collision of the  flavor, containing:
> > >> Perhaps a joined together version of tiles at
> > http://maps.stamen.com/toner/#5/38.221/17.402? What pixel size is
> > preferred? How much space can it consume?
> > >>
> > >> Hal
> > >> N3YX
> >
> >
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Re: [Xastir] Archaic default map

[Lee D Bengston]

Tiles require either Imagemagick or GraphicsMagick, and as Tom already
stated that's not desirable for a minimum install of Xastir.

Lee K5DAT


On Mon, Jul 29, 2019, 3:05 AM Hal Mueller  wrote:

> Roughly what file size are we targeting? The Stamen stuff is based on Open
> Street Map. I think the country level data will be fairly easy to extract
> from OSM, or (more likely) already exists. If I see a way through I’ll hop
> over to github and self assign.
>
> Hal
> N3YX
>
> > On Jul 28, 2019, at 11:27 PM, Tom Russo  wrote:
> >
> > Only vector maps need apply, specifically shapefile.  Anything else
> requires
> > too many TPLs, and that would be too big a "minimum" install.
> >
> > On Sun, Jul 28, 2019 at 11:25:59PM -0700, we recorded a bogon-computron
> collision of the  flavor, containing:
> >> Perhaps a joined together version of tiles at
> http://maps.stamen.com/toner/#5/38.221/17.402? What pixel size is
> preferred? How much space can it consume?
> >>
> >> Hal
> >> N3YX
>
>
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Re: [Xastir] Archaic default map

[David A Aitcheson]

I agree with Curt and echo his opinion on this matter.

Dave KB3EFS


On 7/29/19 10:41 AM, Curt Mills wrote:
> On Sun, Jul 28, 2019 at 6:15 PM Tom Russo  wrote:
>>   - If Xastir stopped letting you turn off shapefile support, and required
>> it just like we require Motif and X11, would you be beside yourself with
>> rage?
> No. A reasonable change and I'm fine with it.
>
>
>>   - If, as is called for in bug #128,
>> https://github.com/Xastir/Xastir/issues/128, we also made PCRE
>> a mandatory third party library and made DBFAWK support (which
>> is the only thing that uses PCRE in Xastir) unconditional,
>> would you revolt?
> No. If we're doing Shapelib as a requirement I think we should do this
> too. It's tiny.
>
>
>>   - Do you have any favorite world shapefile maps that might be suitable
>> as a world-wide default map
> No unfortunately.
>

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Re: [Xastir] Archaic default map

[Curt Mills]

On Sun, Jul 28, 2019 at 6:15 PM Tom Russo  wrote:
>
>   - If Xastir stopped letting you turn off shapefile support, and required
> it just like we require Motif and X11, would you be beside yourself with
> rage?

No. A reasonable change and I'm fine with it.


>   - If, as is called for in bug #128,
> https://github.com/Xastir/Xastir/issues/128, we also made PCRE
> a mandatory third party library and made DBFAWK support (which
> is the only thing that uses PCRE in Xastir) unconditional,
> would you revolt?

No. If we're doing Shapelib as a requirement I think we should do this
too. It's tiny.


>   - Do you have any favorite world shapefile maps that might be suitable
> as a world-wide default map

No unfortunately.

-- 
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Re: [Xastir] Archaic default map

[Jason KG4WSV]

no
no
and (sorry) no.

is the openstreetmaps data license-compatible?

anything i don't know how to do is easy, so it seems it would be reasonably
straightforward to extract country border data from OSM and turn it into a
shapefile.

-Jason
kg4wsv
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Re: [Xastir] Archaic default map

[Hal Mueller]

Roughly what file size are we targeting? The Stamen stuff is based on Open 
Street Map. I think the country level data will be fairly easy to extract from 
OSM, or (more likely) already exists. If I see a way through I’ll hop over to 
github and self assign. 

Hal
N3YX 

> On Jul 28, 2019, at 11:27 PM, Tom Russo  wrote:
> 
> Only vector maps need apply, specifically shapefile.  Anything else requires
> too many TPLs, and that would be too big a "minimum" install.
> 
> On Sun, Jul 28, 2019 at 11:25:59PM -0700, we recorded a bogon-computron 
> collision of the  flavor, containing:
>> Perhaps a joined together version of tiles at 
>> http://maps.stamen.com/toner/#5/38.221/17.402? What pixel size is preferred? 
>> How much space can it consume?
>> 
>> Hal
>> N3YX 
>> 
>>> On Jul 28, 2019, at 8:16 PM, Tom Russo  wrote:
>>> 
>>> The only option is a simple one, otherwise it will be too large to 
>>> distribute.
>>> 
>>> Think of the level of detail of "worldhi.map" but without the nonexistent
>>> countries and obscure APRSDOS map format.
>>> 
>>> On Sun, Jul 28, 2019 at 08:14:44PM -0700, we recorded a bogon-computron 
>>> collision of the  flavor, containing:
>>>> I'll take whatever high contrast, non-detailed map I can get since weather
>>>> warnings and such are easier to decern on a simple background.
>>>> 
>>>> The online sources for maps are good if I want to zoom in on something but
>>>> when looking at the entire US (or more), a simple map is better.
>>>> 
>>>> Dave
>>>> KD7MYC
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> -Original Message-
>>>> From: Xastir [mailto:xastir-boun...@lists.xastir.org] On Behalf Of Tom 
>>>> Russo
>>>> Sent: Sunday, July 28, 2019 18:15
>>>> To: xas...@xastir.org
>>>> Subject: [Xastir] Archaic default map
>>>> 
>>>> We got a github issue today from someone outside the US who points out that
>>>> our default map, the ancient APRSDOS format "worldhi.map," is 
>>>> embarrassingly
>>>> obsolete, showing countries that haven't existed in decades (like, say,
>>>> the USSR, Yugoslavia, the German Democratic Republic (East Germany)...).
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>> 
>>> -- 
>>> Tom RussoKM5VY
>>> Tijeras, NM  
>>> 
>>> echo "prpv_a'rfg_cnf_har_cvcr" | sed -e 's/_/ /g' | tr [a-m][n-z] [n-z][a-m]
>>> 
>>> ___
>>> Xastir mailing list
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> 
> -- 
> Tom RussoKM5VY
> Tijeras, NM  
> 
> echo "prpv_a'rfg_cnf_har_cvcr" | sed -e 's/_/ /g' | tr [a-m][n-z] [n-z][a-m]
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Re: [Xastir] Archaic default map

[Tom Russo]

Only vector maps need apply, specifically shapefile.  Anything else requires
too many TPLs, and that would be too big a "minimum" install.

On Sun, Jul 28, 2019 at 11:25:59PM -0700, we recorded a bogon-computron 
collision of the  flavor, containing:
> Perhaps a joined together version of tiles at 
> http://maps.stamen.com/toner/#5/38.221/17.402? What pixel size is preferred? 
> How much space can it consume?
> 
> Hal
> N3YX 
> 
> > On Jul 28, 2019, at 8:16 PM, Tom Russo  wrote:
> > 
> > The only option is a simple one, otherwise it will be too large to 
> > distribute.
> > 
> > Think of the level of detail of "worldhi.map" but without the nonexistent
> > countries and obscure APRSDOS map format.
> > 
> > On Sun, Jul 28, 2019 at 08:14:44PM -0700, we recorded a bogon-computron 
> > collision of the  flavor, containing:
> >> I'll take whatever high contrast, non-detailed map I can get since weather
> >> warnings and such are easier to decern on a simple background.
> >> 
> >> The online sources for maps are good if I want to zoom in on something but
> >> when looking at the entire US (or more), a simple map is better.
> >> 
> >> Dave
> >> KD7MYC
> >> 
> >> 
> >> -----Original Message-----
> >> From: Xastir [mailto:xastir-boun...@lists.xastir.org] On Behalf Of Tom 
> >> Russo
> >> Sent: Sunday, July 28, 2019 18:15
> >> To: xas...@xastir.org
> >> Subject: [Xastir] Archaic default map
> >> 
> >> We got a github issue today from someone outside the US who points out that
> >> our default map, the ancient APRSDOS format "worldhi.map," is 
> >> embarrassingly
> >> obsolete, showing countries that haven't existed in decades (like, say,
> >> the USSR, Yugoslavia, the German Democratic Republic (East Germany)...).
> >> 
> >> 
> >> 
> > 
> > -- 
> > Tom RussoKM5VY
> > Tijeras, NM  
> > 
> > echo "prpv_a'rfg_cnf_har_cvcr" | sed -e 's/_/ /g' | tr [a-m][n-z] [n-z][a-m]
> > 
> > ___
> > Xastir mailing list
> > Xastir@lists.xastir.org
> > http://xastir.org/mailman/listinfo/xastir
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Re: [Xastir] Archaic default map

[Hal Mueller]

Perhaps a joined together version of tiles at 
http://maps.stamen.com/toner/#5/38.221/17.402? What pixel size is preferred? 
How much space can it consume?

Hal
N3YX 

> On Jul 28, 2019, at 8:16 PM, Tom Russo  wrote:
> 
> The only option is a simple one, otherwise it will be too large to distribute.
> 
> Think of the level of detail of "worldhi.map" but without the nonexistent
> countries and obscure APRSDOS map format.
> 
> On Sun, Jul 28, 2019 at 08:14:44PM -0700, we recorded a bogon-computron 
> collision of the  flavor, containing:
>> I'll take whatever high contrast, non-detailed map I can get since weather
>> warnings and such are easier to decern on a simple background.
>> 
>> The online sources for maps are good if I want to zoom in on something but
>> when looking at the entire US (or more), a simple map is better.
>> 
>> Dave
>> KD7MYC
>> 
>> 
>> -Original Message-
>> From: Xastir [mailto:xastir-boun...@lists.xastir.org] On Behalf Of Tom Russo
>> Sent: Sunday, July 28, 2019 18:15
>> To: xas...@xastir.org
>> Subject: [Xastir] Archaic default map
>> 
>> We got a github issue today from someone outside the US who points out that
>> our default map, the ancient APRSDOS format "worldhi.map," is embarrassingly
>> obsolete, showing countries that haven't existed in decades (like, say,
>> the USSR, Yugoslavia, the German Democratic Republic (East Germany)...).
>> 
>> 
>> 
> 
> -- 
> Tom RussoKM5VY
> Tijeras, NM  
> 
> echo "prpv_a'rfg_cnf_har_cvcr" | sed -e 's/_/ /g' | tr [a-m][n-z] [n-z][a-m]
> 
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Re: [Xastir] Archaic default map

[Tom Russo]

The only option is a simple one, otherwise it will be too large to distribute.

Think of the level of detail of "worldhi.map" but without the nonexistent
countries and obscure APRSDOS map format.

On Sun, Jul 28, 2019 at 08:14:44PM -0700, we recorded a bogon-computron 
collision of the  flavor, containing:
> I'll take whatever high contrast, non-detailed map I can get since weather
> warnings and such are easier to decern on a simple background.
> 
> The online sources for maps are good if I want to zoom in on something but
> when looking at the entire US (or more), a simple map is better.
> 
> Dave
> KD7MYC
> 
> 
> -Original Message-
> From: Xastir [mailto:xastir-boun...@lists.xastir.org] On Behalf Of Tom Russo
> Sent: Sunday, July 28, 2019 18:15
> To: xas...@xastir.org
> Subject: [Xastir] Archaic default map
> 
> We got a github issue today from someone outside the US who points out that
> our default map, the ancient APRSDOS format "worldhi.map," is embarrassingly
> obsolete, showing countries that haven't existed in decades (like, say,
> the USSR, Yugoslavia, the German Democratic Republic (East Germany)...).
> 
> 
> 

-- 
Tom RussoKM5VY
Tijeras, NM  

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Re: [Xastir] Archaic default map

[David Flood]

I'll take whatever high contrast, non-detailed map I can get since weather
warnings and such are easier to decern on a simple background.

The online sources for maps are good if I want to zoom in on something but
when looking at the entire US (or more), a simple map is better.

Dave
KD7MYC


-Original Message-
From: Xastir [mailto:xastir-boun...@lists.xastir.org] On Behalf Of Tom Russo
Sent: Sunday, July 28, 2019 18:15
To: xas...@xastir.org
Subject: [Xastir] Archaic default map

We got a github issue today from someone outside the US who points out that
our default map, the ancient APRSDOS format "worldhi.map," is embarrassingly
obsolete, showing countries that haven't existed in decades (like, say,
the USSR, Yugoslavia, the German Democratic Republic (East Germany)...).




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Re: [Xastir] Archaic default map

[Lee D Bengston]

On Sun, Jul 28, 2019 at 8:15 PM we recorded - oops - I mean Tom Russo <
ru...@bogodyn.org> wrote:

>
> ---  ---
>
> So here's the survey:
>
>   - If Xastir stopped letting you turn off shapefile support, and required
> it just like we require Motif and X11, would you be beside yourself
> with
> rage?
>

Nope, I usually enable it anyway.

>
>   - If, as is called for in bug #128,
> https://github.com/Xastir/Xastir/issues/128, we also made PCRE
> a mandatory third party library and made DBFAWK support (which
> is the only thing that uses PCRE in Xastir) unconditional,
> would you revolt?
>
> No, the only way I've ever used shapefiles is in conjunction with DBFAWK.

  This is pretty much necessary anymore, because
> the alternative, hard-coded shapefile rendering, hasn't been maintained
> in years and most of the shapefiles for which there is some hard coding
> are almost as ancient and useless as worldhi.map.  We plan to remove
> that option for the next release.
>
>   - Do you have any favorite world shapefile maps that might be suitable
> as a world-wide default map that is shown when Xastir starts for the
> first time (until told otherwise), to be included (and maintained) in
> the Xastir source tree and always installed?
>
> I do not.  Normally with offline maps - shapefiles or otherwise - I'm
looking for specific maps in my area, so I don't have a feel for what's out
there for the world.

--

Regards,
Lee K5DAT
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Re: [Xastir] Archaic default map

[Chip Griffin]

- No
- No
- No, but I am fond of the idea of a new default map.

About the only reason I could see for this being a challenge to me would be a 
possible minimal system on a Raspberry Pi (or similar one board style computer) 
where the space for all the requirements might be important. But given prices 
of RAM/SD Cards and the small computers, I’m not concerned much at all.

--Chip/N1MIE

> On Jul 28, 2019, at 21:15, Tom Russo  wrote:
> 
> So here's the survey:
> 
>  - If Xastir stopped letting you turn off shapefile support, and required
>it just like we require Motif and X11, would you be beside yourself with
>rage?
> 
>  - If, as is called for in bug #128, 
>https://github.com/Xastir/Xastir/issues/128, we also made PCRE 
>a mandatory third party library and made DBFAWK support (which 
>is the only thing that uses PCRE in Xastir) unconditional,
>would you revolt?  This is pretty much necessary anymore, because
>the alternative, hard-coded shapefile rendering, hasn't been maintained
>in years and most of the shapefiles for which there is some hard coding
>are almost as ancient and useless as worldhi.map.  We plan to remove
>that option for the next release.
> 
>  - Do you have any favorite world shapefile maps that might be suitable 
>as a world-wide default map that is shown when Xastir starts for the
>first time (until told otherwise), to be included (and maintained) in 
>the Xastir source tree and always installed?
> 
>Licensing matters here.  I found some good ones, but while they were free,
>they were not licensed in a way that is consistent with distributing with
>a GPL code.  I found one or two that were licensed in a way we can
>use, but they're part of enormous sets that would have to be separated
>appropriately.  The one that seems to have the most promise to me
>is mentioned in the bug report for this issue, 
>https://github.com/Xastir/Xastir/issues/152
> 
> -- 
> Tom RussoKM5VY
> Tijeras, NM  
> 
> echo "prpv_a'rfg_cnf_har_cvcr" | sed -e 's/_/ /g' | tr [a-m][n-z] [n-z][a-m]
> 
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[Xastir] Archaic default map

[Tom Russo]

We got a github issue today from someone outside the US who points out that
our default map, the ancient APRSDOS format "worldhi.map," is embarrassingly
obsolete, showing countries that haven't existed in decades (like, say,
the USSR, Yugoslavia, the German Democratic Republic (East Germany)...).

We display that ancient map by default because it's the absolute lowest common
denominator, displayable by an absolute minimum build of Xastir (no 
Image/GraphicsMagick (meaning no jpg or png maps), no curl (no online maps),
no shapelib (no shapefile vector maps), no dbfawk or pcre (no fancy shapefile
rendering unless hard-coded), no XPM (not even cheesey X pixmap images), and
no GeoTIFF (no georeferenced image maps like USGS topos or others like that).

For a very long time (since 2006) Xastir has basically defaulted to building
with shapelib unless you specifically asked for it.  We initially made that
happen by having a copy of shapelib sources in Xastir's source tree, but we
removed that recently (because it was ancient and was starting to be so stale
that it is better if people just use their system-provided shapelib, and 
basically every OS now has it in package management systems anyway).  Now
it's an optional third party library, but is always used if it is found and 
you don't ask to exclude it.

I'm taking a quick survey to see if anyone would have any heartache if we
made shapelib a *required* third party library instead of optional, and finding
a default base shapefile map that isn't in an obsolete APRSDOS map format 
*and* embarrassingly outdated.  It would have to be a fairly simple and
small shapefile, not street-level detail for the whole world (or even a part
of it) --- just continent and current (2019ish) national boundaries.


So here's the survey:

  - If Xastir stopped letting you turn off shapefile support, and required
it just like we require Motif and X11, would you be beside yourself with
rage?

  - If, as is called for in bug #128, 
https://github.com/Xastir/Xastir/issues/128, we also made PCRE 
a mandatory third party library and made DBFAWK support (which 
is the only thing that uses PCRE in Xastir) unconditional,
would you revolt?  This is pretty much necessary anymore, because
the alternative, hard-coded shapefile rendering, hasn't been maintained
in years and most of the shapefiles for which there is some hard coding
are almost as ancient and useless as worldhi.map.  We plan to remove
that option for the next release.

  - Do you have any favorite world shapefile maps that might be suitable 
as a world-wide default map that is shown when Xastir starts for the
first time (until told otherwise), to be included (and maintained) in 
the Xastir source tree and always installed?
   
Licensing matters here.  I found some good ones, but while they were free,
they were not licensed in a way that is consistent with distributing with
a GPL code.  I found one or two that were licensed in a way we can
use, but they're part of enormous sets that would have to be separated
appropriately.  The one that seems to have the most promise to me
is mentioned in the bug report for this issue, 
https://github.com/Xastir/Xastir/issues/152

-- 
Tom RussoKM5VY
Tijeras, NM  

 echo "prpv_a'rfg_cnf_har_cvcr" | sed -e 's/_/ /g' | tr [a-m][n-z] [n-z][a-m]

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