[Zen] Re: compassion for all
Yeah Joe! Don't complain about the slight transgression of the 6th Precept in your fellow forum members' eye when there is a big fat cat hair-ball in your eye! ...Bill! --- In Zen_Forum@yahoogroups.com, Merle Lester merlewiitpom@... wrote:  joe..are you lecturing me?... is there not a couple of old sayings... that point to one looking in one's own backyard before you point out wrong doing to others?... we lead by example joe you telling me your squeaky clean?.. merle  Merle, Having such thoughts -- of aggrandizing oneself while demeaning others -- is a breaking of that Sixth precept. One need not express the boast, nor the insult, vocally, nor in writing, as you have done before us all, here. No. It's not the expression of the thought, or the process, that counts (hurts): it's formulating it, or allowing it to form in the first place. To be able to formulate it shows, moreover, that one is not Awake, in that instance. The precepts are there (Ours...) as touchstones. They are a description of the behavior of *A BUDDHA*, a person who is Awake. We can compare our behavior to the precepts. Do we violate them, in a particular instance? If so, then, in that instant, we are not Awake, i.e., we are not a Buddha, just then. And so, we *practice*. --Joe Merle Lester merlewiitpom@ wrote: yes joe.. i never said a word to the woman..for christ sake what do you take me for?..merle Current Book Discussion: any Zen book that you recently have read or are reading! Talk about it today!Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Zen_Forum/ * Your email settings: Individual Email | Traditional * To change settings online go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Zen_Forum/join (Yahoo! ID required) * To change settings via email: zen_forum-dig...@yahoogroups.com zen_forum-fullfeatu...@yahoogroups.com * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: zen_forum-unsubscr...@yahoogroups.com * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[Zen] Re: compassion for all
Joe, I don't think Merle meant 'snipping', as in editing. I think she meant 'sniping', as in 'taking pot-shots'. ...Bill! --- In Zen_Forum@yahoogroups.com, Joe desert_woodworker@... wrote: Merle, Folks have the full original posts. I preserve what I reply to, as is fitting. Full original posts are all at the website as well. Back to the year 1999. So no more irrational sniping about my rational snipping, please. That's not a conditional request. --Joe Merle Lester merlewiitpom@ wrote: joe...what are you driving at?..where is this heading?..your snipping is getting way to over the top...[snip] Current Book Discussion: any Zen book that you recently have read or are reading! Talk about it today!Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Zen_Forum/ * Your email settings: Individual Email | Traditional * To change settings online go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Zen_Forum/join (Yahoo! ID required) * To change settings via email: zen_forum-dig...@yahoogroups.com zen_forum-fullfeatu...@yahoogroups.com * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: zen_forum-unsubscr...@yahoogroups.com * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
Re: [Zen] Re: compassion for all
no snipping bill..so joe can so neatly get his point and bugger the rest bit like those who snip bits out of the holy bible to make some absurd point merle Joe, I don't think Merle meant 'snipping', as in editing. I think she meant 'sniping', as in 'taking pot-shots'. ...Bill! --- In Zen_Forum@yahoogroups.com, Joe desert_woodworker@... wrote: Merle, Folks have the full original posts. I preserve what I reply to, as is fitting. Full original posts are all at the website as well. Back to the year 1999. So no more irrational sniping about my rational snipping, please. That's not a conditional request. --Joe Merle Lester merlewiitpom@ wrote: joe...what are you driving at?..where is this heading?..your snipping is getting way to over the top...[snip]
[Zen] Re: compassion for all
Bill!, Well, Bill!, as you know, I don't complain. Just pointing at something with a slight Zen connection. Sorry to cloud the issue with facts! But maybe I *should* take a larger view, and truly lighten-up. Or I could try breathing a whiff of Helium from time to time. If nothing else, I could enter Alvin sound-alike contests, in memory of The Chipmonks' singing. Gee, this is putting me a Christmas mood, on June 25! Xmas is exactly six months from t'day. Far-ranging Forum, this is: we've gone from hair-balls to Christmas in 4 paragraphs. Time to bail (this post), Here's a (delicious) Meat Ball in your eye, --Giuseppe Luigi Federico M. Bill! BillSmart@... wrote: Yeah Joe! Don't complain about the slight transgression of the 6th Precept in your fellow forum members' eye when there is a big fat cat hair-ball in your eye! Current Book Discussion: any Zen book that you recently have read or are reading! Talk about it today!Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Zen_Forum/ * Your email settings: Individual Email | Traditional * To change settings online go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Zen_Forum/join (Yahoo! ID required) * To change settings via email: zen_forum-dig...@yahoogroups.com zen_forum-fullfeatu...@yahoogroups.com * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: zen_forum-unsubscr...@yahoogroups.com * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[Zen] Re: compassion for all
Bill!, I'd be glad if that's so, and would make proper apologies as warranted. But, I think it's otherwise. --Joe Bill! BillSmart@... wrote: I don't think Merle meant 'snipping', as in editing. I think she meant 'sniping', as in 'taking pot-shots'. Current Book Discussion: any Zen book that you recently have read or are reading! Talk about it today!Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Zen_Forum/ * Your email settings: Individual Email | Traditional * To change settings online go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Zen_Forum/join (Yahoo! ID required) * To change settings via email: zen_forum-dig...@yahoogroups.com zen_forum-fullfeatu...@yahoogroups.com * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: zen_forum-unsubscr...@yahoogroups.com * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[Zen] Re: compassion for all
Merle, you couldn't sit still for a recitation of the whole Bible. Get real. --J. Merle Lester merlewiitpom@... wrote: no snipping bill..so joe can so neatly get his point and bugger the rest bit like those who snip bits out of the holy bible to make some absurd point Current Book Discussion: any Zen book that you recently have read or are reading! Talk about it today!Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Zen_Forum/ * Your email settings: Individual Email | Traditional * To change settings online go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Zen_Forum/join (Yahoo! ID required) * To change settings via email: zen_forum-dig...@yahoogroups.com zen_forum-fullfeatu...@yahoogroups.com * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: zen_forum-unsubscr...@yahoogroups.com * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
Re: [Zen] Re: compassion for all
joe..try me!..merle Merle, you couldn't sit still for a recitation of the whole Bible. Get real. --J. Merle Lester merlewiitpom@... wrote: no snipping bill..so joe can so neatly get his point and bugger the rest bit like those who snip bits out of the holy bible to make some absurd point
[Zen] Re: compassion for all
Merle, Lessee... well, there's an Audio Book. You'll have to try it yourself; I don't own it, and can't send it to you. I would and I could if I did but I don't so I won't. But, note: such posts may be off-topic, unwelcome, and offensive to un-named un-subscriber-lurkers; we may be driving Members away. Maybe then talk only about Zen from now on. Or General Buddhadharma. Or, their connections with aspects of life. Or, thus, the Bible. Christianity. Recent concerns of Evangelicals for the Environment, owning-up that Humans are the caretakers of Creation. Appreciation of Human creativity, as an outpouring and communication of Zen Mind. Pres. Obama's talkk today about Climate Change, and Carbon pollution. And so on. In other words, follow your nose, and follow Mike's bliss, which he learned about (following) from my friend Joe Campbell. Small world: big Family! So long! A diminutive Chao: -- like everything in Chile -- ¡Chaoito! And, from my own cultural heritage (half), Ciao!. Remember practice. Practice. --Joe Merle Lester merlewiitpom@... wrote: joe..try me!..merle Merle, you couldn't sit still for a recitation of the whole Bible. Get real. --J. Merle Lester merlewiitpom@ wrote: no snipping bill..so joe can so neatly get his point and bugger the rest bit like those who snip bits out of the holy bible to make some absurd point Current Book Discussion: any Zen book that you recently have read or are reading! Talk about it today!Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Zen_Forum/ * Your email settings: Individual Email | Traditional * To change settings online go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Zen_Forum/join (Yahoo! ID required) * To change settings via email: zen_forum-dig...@yahoogroups.com zen_forum-fullfeatu...@yahoogroups.com * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: zen_forum-unsubscr...@yahoogroups.com * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[Zen] Re: compassion for all
Joe, et al... The Way is not hard, just no snipping and sniping... ...Bill! --- In Zen_Forum@yahoogroups.com, Joe desert_woodworker@... wrote: Bill!, I'd be glad if that's so, and would make proper apologies as warranted. But, I think it's otherwise. --Joe Bill! BillSmart@ wrote: I don't think Merle meant 'snipping', as in editing. I think she meant 'sniping', as in 'taking pot-shots'. Current Book Discussion: any Zen book that you recently have read or are reading! Talk about it today!Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Zen_Forum/ * Your email settings: Individual Email | Traditional * To change settings online go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Zen_Forum/join (Yahoo! ID required) * To change settings via email: zen_forum-dig...@yahoogroups.com zen_forum-fullfeatu...@yahoogroups.com * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: zen_forum-unsubscr...@yahoogroups.com * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[Zen] Re: compassion for all
Bill!, Cheers! I'll drink to half of that. ;-) --Joe Bill! BillSmart@... wrote: Joe, et al... The Way is not hard, just no snipping and sniping... ...Bill! Current Book Discussion: any Zen book that you recently have read or are reading! Talk about it today!Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Zen_Forum/ * Your email settings: Individual Email | Traditional * To change settings online go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Zen_Forum/join (Yahoo! ID required) * To change settings via email: zen_forum-dig...@yahoogroups.com zen_forum-fullfeatu...@yahoogroups.com * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: zen_forum-unsubscr...@yahoogroups.com * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[Zen] Re: compassion for all
Merle, Just a note: a point of relevant information to do with Zen Buddhism, in this context. I mention it just for information sake. One the (Buddhist) Ten Bodhisattva Precepts (the Sixth) is: Not to praise oneself while defaming others. --Joe PS [to do so is establish a very unsound lever, which nonetheless provides a kind of leverage that lifts one straight on into Hell]. Merle Lester merlewiitpom@... wrote: mike... i was at tai chi and another tai ch...ier...a lady over 70 plus was horrified that i felt compassion for the killer... she's a conservative catholic having bred 6 kiddies..thank her for the over population of the world. i question did she at any stage ask herself was she worthy breeding material?.. no that would never entertain her tiny mind... Current Book Discussion: any Zen book that you recently have read or are reading! Talk about it today!Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Zen_Forum/ * Your email settings: Individual Email | Traditional * To change settings online go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Zen_Forum/join (Yahoo! ID required) * To change settings via email: zen_forum-dig...@yahoogroups.com zen_forum-fullfeatu...@yahoogroups.com * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: zen_forum-unsubscr...@yahoogroups.com * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
Re: [Zen] Re: compassion for all
yes joe..i never said a word to the woman..for christ sake what do you take me for?..merle Merle, Just a note: a point of relevant information to do with Zen Buddhism, in this context. I mention it just for information sake. One the (Buddhist) Ten Bodhisattva Precepts (the Sixth) is: Not to praise oneself while defaming others. --Joe PS [to do so is establish a very unsound lever, which nonetheless provides a kind of leverage that lifts one straight on into Hell]. Merle Lester merlewiitpom@... wrote: mike... i was at tai chi and another tai ch...ier...a lady over 70 plus was horrified that i felt compassion for the killer... she's a conservative catholic having bred 6 kiddies..thank her for the over population of the world. i question did she at any stage ask herself was she worthy breeding material?.. no that would never entertain her tiny mind...
[Zen] Re: compassion for all
Merle, Having such thoughts -- of aggrandizing oneself while demeaning others -- is a breaking of that Sixth precept. One need not express the boast, nor the insult, vocally, nor in writing, as you have done before us all, here. No. It's not the expression of the thought, or the process, that counts (hurts): it's formulating it, or allowing it to form in the first place. To be able to formulate it shows, moreover, that one is not Awake, in that instance. The precepts are there (Ours...) as touchstones. They are a description of the behavior of *A BUDDHA*, a person who is Awake. We can compare our behavior to the precepts. Do we violate them, in a particular instance? If so, then, in that instant, we are not Awake, i.e., we are not a Buddha, just then. And so, we *practice*. --Joe Merle Lester merlewiitpom@... wrote: yes joe.. i never said a word to the woman..for christ sake what do you take me for?..merle Current Book Discussion: any Zen book that you recently have read or are reading! Talk about it today!Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Zen_Forum/ * Your email settings: Individual Email | Traditional * To change settings online go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Zen_Forum/join (Yahoo! ID required) * To change settings via email: zen_forum-dig...@yahoogroups.com zen_forum-fullfeatu...@yahoogroups.com * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: zen_forum-unsubscr...@yahoogroups.com * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
Re: [Zen] Re: compassion for all
joe..are you lecturing me?... is there not a couple of old sayings... that point to one looking in one's own backyard before you point out wrong doing to others?... we lead by example joe you telling me your squeaky clean?.. merle Merle, Having such thoughts -- of aggrandizing oneself while demeaning others -- is a breaking of that Sixth precept. One need not express the boast, nor the insult, vocally, nor in writing, as you have done before us all, here. No. It's not the expression of the thought, or the process, that counts (hurts): it's formulating it, or allowing it to form in the first place. To be able to formulate it shows, moreover, that one is not Awake, in that instance. The precepts are there (Ours...) as touchstones. They are a description of the behavior of *A BUDDHA*, a person who is Awake. We can compare our behavior to the precepts. Do we violate them, in a particular instance? If so, then, in that instant, we are not Awake, i.e., we are not a Buddha, just then. And so, we *practice*. --Joe Merle Lester merlewiitpom@... wrote: yes joe.. i never said a word to the woman..for christ sake what do you take me for?..merle
[Zen] Re: compassion for all
Merle, In a Zen forum, I am giving examples of some Zen Buddhist principles of practice, regarding ethics. I am not comparing you to me. The Precepts allow you and me to compare our behavior to the behavior of a Buddha. That's what the Precepts do, or can do, for a practitioner. That is more important than your ego, or your low regard for me. There may be others here reading: I don't mind sharing with them, as their minds may be more open to learning about practice-tools, such as the Precepts. So I don't hold back the truth as we know it. --Joe Merle Lester merlewiitpom@... wrote: joe..are you lecturing me?... is there not a couple of old sayings... that point to one looking in one's own backyard before you point out wrong doing to others?... we lead by example joe you telling me your squeaky clean?.. Current Book Discussion: any Zen book that you recently have read or are reading! Talk about it today!Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Zen_Forum/ * Your email settings: Individual Email | Traditional * To change settings online go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Zen_Forum/join (Yahoo! ID required) * To change settings via email: zen_forum-dig...@yahoogroups.com zen_forum-fullfeatu...@yahoogroups.com * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: zen_forum-unsubscr...@yahoogroups.com * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
Re: [Zen] Re: compassion for all
joe...what are you driving at?..where is this heading?..your snipping is getting way to over the top...you snip for snippings sake... be is so..happy snipping..merle Merle, In a Zen forum, I am giving examples of some Zen Buddhist principles of practice, regarding ethics. I am not comparing you to me. The Precepts allow you and me to compare our behavior to the behavior of a Buddha. That's what the Precepts do, or can do, for a practitioner. That is more important than your ego, or your low regard for me. There may be others here reading: I don't mind sharing with them, as their minds may be more open to learning about practice-tools, such as the Precepts. So I don't hold back the truth as we know it. --Joe Merle Lester merlewiitpom@... wrote: joe..are you lecturing me?... is there not a couple of old sayings... that point to one looking in one's own backyard before you point out wrong doing to others?... we lead by example joe you telling me your squeaky clean?..
[Zen] Re: compassion for all
Merle, Folks have the full original posts. I preserve what I reply to, as is fitting. Full original posts are all at the website as well. Back to the year 1999. So no more irrational sniping about my rational snipping, please. That's not a conditional request. --Joe Merle Lester merlewiitpom@... wrote: joe...what are you driving at?..where is this heading?..your snipping is getting way to over the top...[snip] Current Book Discussion: any Zen book that you recently have read or are reading! Talk about it today!Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Zen_Forum/ * Your email settings: Individual Email | Traditional * To change settings online go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Zen_Forum/join (Yahoo! ID required) * To change settings via email: zen_forum-dig...@yahoogroups.com zen_forum-fullfeatu...@yahoogroups.com * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: zen_forum-unsubscr...@yahoogroups.com * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
Re: [Zen] Re: compassion for all
Joe, Fitting to who? You? Why don't you give any thought at all to the posters whose messages you snip? Is it all about you, you you? Edgar On Jun 24, 2013, at 9:17 PM, Joe wrote: Merle, Folks have the full original posts. I preserve what I reply to, as is fitting. Full original posts are all at the website as well. Back to the year 1999. So no more irrational sniping about my rational snipping, please. That's not a conditional request. --Joe Merle Lester merlewiitpom@... wrote: joe...what are you driving at?..where is this heading?..your snipping is getting way to over the top...[snip]
[Zen] Re: compassion for all
Edgar, We've been all through this. Done long ago. --Joe PS (recall, too, that some read while mobile, and pay by the character). Edgar Owen edgarowen@... wrote: Fitting to who? You? Why don't you give any thought at all to the posters whose messages you snip? [snip[ Current Book Discussion: any Zen book that you recently have read or are reading! Talk about it today!Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Zen_Forum/ * Your email settings: Individual Email | Traditional * To change settings online go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Zen_Forum/join (Yahoo! ID required) * To change settings via email: zen_forum-dig...@yahoogroups.com zen_forum-fullfeatu...@yahoogroups.com * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: zen_forum-unsubscr...@yahoogroups.com * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
