Re: [zfs-discuss] questions on zfs backups
Ian Collins i...@ianshome.com wrote: satya wrote: Any idea if we can use pax command to backup ZFS acls? will -p option of pax utility do the trick? pax should, according to http://docs.sun.com/app/docs/doc/819-5461/gbchx?a=view tar and cpio do. It should be simple enough to test, just generate an archive and have a look. What do you understand by backups? Neither tar nor cpio or pax (as found on Solaris) support all the features that people expect from backup tools. Jörg -- EMail:jo...@schily.isdn.cs.tu-berlin.de (home) Jörg Schilling D-13353 Berlin j...@cs.tu-berlin.de(uni) joerg.schill...@fokus.fraunhofer.de (work) Blog: http://schily.blogspot.com/ URL: http://cdrecord.berlios.de/private/ ftp://ftp.berlios.de/pub/schily ___ zfs-discuss mailing list zfs-discuss@opensolaris.org http://mail.opensolaris.org/mailman/listinfo/zfs-discuss
Re: [zfs-discuss] questions on zfs backups
satya g...@zmanda.com wrote: Any update on star ability to backup ZFS ACLs? Any idea if we can use pax command to backup ZFS acls? will -p option of pax utility do the trick? I am looking for people who like to discuss the archive format for ZFS ACLs and for extended attribute files for star. Please choose one of the following mailing lists: star-disc...@opensolaris.orgThe mailing list for Solaris integration see http://mail.opensolaris.org/mailman/listinfo/star-discuss or star-develop...@lists.berlios.deThe general developer mailing list See: http://developer.berlios.de/mail/?group_id=9 Jörg -- EMail:jo...@schily.isdn.cs.tu-berlin.de (home) Jörg Schilling D-13353 Berlin j...@cs.tu-berlin.de(uni) joerg.schill...@fokus.fraunhofer.de (work) Blog: http://schily.blogspot.com/ URL: http://cdrecord.berlios.de/private/ ftp://ftp.berlios.de/pub/schily ___ zfs-discuss mailing list zfs-discuss@opensolaris.org http://mail.opensolaris.org/mailman/listinfo/zfs-discuss
Re: [zfs-discuss] questions on zfs backups
Any update on star ability to backup ZFS ACLs? Any idea if we can use pax command to backup ZFS acls? will -p option of pax utility do the trick? -satya -- This message posted from opensolaris.org ___ zfs-discuss mailing list zfs-discuss@opensolaris.org http://mail.opensolaris.org/mailman/listinfo/zfs-discuss
Re: [zfs-discuss] questions on zfs backups
satya wrote: Any idea if we can use pax command to backup ZFS acls? will -p option of pax utility do the trick? pax should, according to http://docs.sun.com/app/docs/doc/819-5461/gbchx?a=view tar and cpio do. It should be simple enough to test, just generate an archive and have a look. -- Ian. ___ zfs-discuss mailing list zfs-discuss@opensolaris.org http://mail.opensolaris.org/mailman/listinfo/zfs-discuss
Re: [zfs-discuss] questions on zfs backups
Ian Collins wrote: satya wrote: Any idea if we can use pax command to backup ZFS acls? will -p option of pax utility do the trick? pax should, according to http://docs.sun.com/app/docs/doc/819-5461/gbchx?a=view pax isn't ACL aware. It does handle extended attributes, though. Here is pax RFE to support ACLs. 1191280 *pax* pax should understand acls tar and cpio do. tar and cpio handle both ACLs and extended attributes. It should be simple enough to test, just generate an archive and have a look. ___ zfs-discuss mailing list zfs-discuss@opensolaris.org http://mail.opensolaris.org/mailman/listinfo/zfs-discuss
Re: [zfs-discuss] questions on zfs backups
Mark Shellenbaum wrote: Ian Collins wrote: satya wrote: Any idea if we can use pax command to backup ZFS acls? will -p option of pax utility do the trick? pax should, according to http://docs.sun.com/app/docs/doc/819-5461/gbchx?a=view pax isn't ACL aware. It does handle extended attributes, though. Here is pax RFE to support ACLs. 1191280 *pax* pax should understand acls Thanks for the clarification Mark. I think the documentation should clarify this, the grouping pax with tar and cpio in bullet Archive utilities – Save ZFS data with archive utilities such as tar, cpio, and pax or third-party backup products. implies otherwise. -- Ian. ___ zfs-discuss mailing list zfs-discuss@opensolaris.org http://mail.opensolaris.org/mailman/listinfo/zfs-discuss
Re: [zfs-discuss] questions on zfs backups
On Oct 31, 2008, at 13:13, Richard Elling wrote: Paul Kraus wrote: Is there a ufsdump equivalent for ZFS ? For home use I really don't want to have to buy a NetBackup license. No, and it is unlikely to happen. To some degree, ufsdump existed because of deficiencies in other copy applications, which have been largely fixed over the past 25+ years. How about stabilization of the 'zfs send' stream's format? Also I'm surprised Jorg Schilly hasn't chimed yet suggesting star. :) ___ zfs-discuss mailing list zfs-discuss@opensolaris.org http://mail.opensolaris.org/mailman/listinfo/zfs-discuss
Re: [zfs-discuss] questions on zfs backups
Is there anything better than star? That was what I planned to use. Simple, cheap, and compatible with just about anything :) -- This message posted from opensolaris.org ___ zfs-discuss mailing list zfs-discuss@opensolaris.org http://mail.opensolaris.org/mailman/listinfo/zfs-discuss
Re: [zfs-discuss] questions on zfs backups
On 11/1/2008 11:28 AM, David Magda wrote: On Oct 31, 2008, at 13:13, Richard Elling wrote: Paul Kraus wrote: Is there a ufsdump equivalent for ZFS ? For home use I really don't want to have to buy a NetBackup license. No, and it is unlikely to happen. To some degree, ufsdump existed because of deficiencies in other copy applications, which have been largely fixed over the past 25+ years. How about stabilization of the 'zfs send' stream's format? Also I'm surprised Jorg Schilly hasn't chimed yet suggesting star. :) We need _some_ backup format that will preserve ZFS ACLs. star doesn't (yet), nor does any other version of tar that I know of. Sun's cpio didn't use to (I haven't tested it recently, anyone know for sure?), and if it does now, it's still cpio *shudder*. Even rsync doesn't support ZFS ACLs (yet). It would be _really_ nice if someone familiar with the rather badly documented ZFS ACL APIs would contribute code to give us some working options. I suspect star and rsync are the least work, as they already have ACL frameworks. And if Sun's cpio doesn't have ZFS ACL support yet, that really needs to happen. I actually took a look at doing this for rsync, but I didn't have enough time to learn the API by trial-and-error. -- Carson ___ zfs-discuss mailing list zfs-discuss@opensolaris.org http://mail.opensolaris.org/mailman/listinfo/zfs-discuss
Re: [zfs-discuss] questions on zfs backups
On 11/1/2008 4:06 PM, Carson Gaspar wrote: ... (yet), nor does any other version of tar that I know of. Sun's cpio didn't use to (I haven't tested it recently, anyone know for sure?), and if it does now, it's still cpio *shudder*. Even rsync doesn't support ... have ACL frameworks. And if Sun's cpio doesn't have ZFS ACL support yet, that really needs to happen. OK, I just tested with Sol 10 U5 (fully patched as of 2 weeks ago), and Sun's cpio _does_ preserve ZFS ACLs. So does Sun's cp, FYI. Although cp's man page is unclear about how to preserve both ACLs and extended attributes. So for now I'm forced to grit my teeth and recommend Sun's cpio for full backups. Just make sure you include the options -P (for ACLs) and -@ (for extended attributes) if you want a full backup. You probably also want to test what restores look like from a non-Sun cpio (I haven't done this). -- Carson ___ zfs-discuss mailing list zfs-discuss@opensolaris.org http://mail.opensolaris.org/mailman/listinfo/zfs-discuss
Re: [zfs-discuss] questions on zfs backups
Carson Gaspar [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Also I'm surprised Jorg Schilly hasn't chimed yet suggesting star. :) We need _some_ backup format that will preserve ZFS ACLs. star doesn't (yet), nor does any other version of tar that I know of. Sun's cpio didn't use to (I haven't tested it recently, anyone know for sure?), and if it does now, it's still cpio *shudder*. Even rsync doesn't support ZFS ACLs (yet). I tried to discuss the archive format for ACLs with people from Sun. It seems that noone is interested. When I has time to implement ZFS ACL support, the implementation of Sun's libsec was broken. If the archive format used by Sun tar and Sun cpio does not include numerical user/group ids in addition to the names, the usability of backups made with these programs is extemely limited. I am currently working on cdrtools-3.0-final. Once this is ready, I have more time to add ZFS ACL support to star. Jörg -- EMail:[EMAIL PROTECTED] (home) Jörg Schilling D-13353 Berlin [EMAIL PROTECTED](uni) [EMAIL PROTECTED] (work) Blog: http://schily.blogspot.com/ URL: http://cdrecord.berlios.de/private/ ftp://ftp.berlios.de/pub/schily ___ zfs-discuss mailing list zfs-discuss@opensolaris.org http://mail.opensolaris.org/mailman/listinfo/zfs-discuss
Re: [zfs-discuss] questions on zfs backups
Joerg Schilling wrote: Carson Gaspar [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Also I'm surprised Jorg Schilly hasn't chimed yet suggesting star. :) We need _some_ backup format that will preserve ZFS ACLs. star doesn't (yet), nor does any other version of tar that I know of. Sun's cpio didn't use to (I haven't tested it recently, anyone know for sure?), and if it does now, it's still cpio *shudder*. Even rsync doesn't support ZFS ACLs (yet). I tried to discuss the archive format for ACLs with people from Sun. It seems that noone is interested. When I has time to implement ZFS ACL support, the implementation of Sun's libsec was broken. If the archive format used by Sun tar and Sun cpio does not include numerical user/group ids in addition to the names, the usability of backups made with these programs is extemely limited. It does: user:icollins:r-:---:allow:1005,user:ian:r-:---:allow:100 -- Ian. ___ zfs-discuss mailing list zfs-discuss@opensolaris.org http://mail.opensolaris.org/mailman/listinfo/zfs-discuss
Re: [zfs-discuss] questions on zfs backups
On Thu, Oct 30, 2008 at 11:05 PM, Richard Elling [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
Philip Brown wrote:
I've recently started down the road of production use for zfs, and am
hitting my head on some paradigm shifts. I'd like to clarify whether my
understanding is correct, and/or whether there are better ways of doing
things.
I have one question for replication, and one question for backups.
These questions are all about Solaris 10 production release (U5, I believe)
not solarisexpress, etc.
First, zfs send/recv is not a backup/restore solution. You might be
happier using
the available backup/restore solutions in the market.
Is there a ufsdump equivalent for ZFS ? For home use I really don't
want to have to buy a NetBackup license.
--
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Paul Kraus
- Facilities Coordinator, Albacon 2008
- Business Manager, Delta-Xi cast of Alpha-Psi-Omega @ RPI
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Re: [zfs-discuss] questions on zfs backups
Paul Kraus wrote: On Thu, Oct 30, 2008 at 11:05 PM, Richard Elling [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Philip Brown wrote: I've recently started down the road of production use for zfs, and am hitting my head on some paradigm shifts. I'd like to clarify whether my understanding is correct, and/or whether there are better ways of doing things. I have one question for replication, and one question for backups. These questions are all about Solaris 10 production release (U5, I believe) not solarisexpress, etc. First, zfs send/recv is not a backup/restore solution. You might be happier using the available backup/restore solutions in the market. Is there a ufsdump equivalent for ZFS ? For home use I really don't want to have to buy a NetBackup license. No, and it is unlikely to happen. To some degree, ufsdump existed because of deficiencies in other copy applications, which have been largely fixed over the past 25+ years. See the ZFS Best Practices Guide http://www.solarisinternals.com/wiki/index.php/ZFS_Best_Practices_Guide#ZFS_Backup_.2F_Restore_Recommendations -- richard ___ zfs-discuss mailing list zfs-discuss@opensolaris.org http://mail.opensolaris.org/mailman/listinfo/zfs-discuss
