Re: [9fans] Man pages for add-ons: pax?

2010-03-28 Thread tlaronde
From the diverse input, wouldn't it be more logical to do the following: 1) All contrib packages write in /$objtype/bin, /rc/bin and /sys/man (or /man, see 3). 2) It's up the user to bind -c in /$objtype/bin, /rc/bin and /sys/man so that written files end where he wants. Depending on who

Re: [9fans] Man pages for add-ons: pax?

2010-03-28 Thread erik quanstrom
3) Shouldn't /man and /rc/bin be, as /bin, empty unwritable directories, place holders, with an initial bind(1) (without -c; probably $objtype agnostic either, since almost all programs are supposed to exist in an $objtype flavor for man, and should not be a concern for rc) of /sys/man and

Re: [9fans] native install

2010-03-28 Thread Georg Lehner
David Leimbach wrote: I'm glad there's another person out there with 4 machines running plan 9. That's really great. I never got beyond 2 :-) [..] file/auth/cpu server at home: DFI-ACP Board: G5C100-N, Intel 945GM ICH7M installable only eriks 9atom.iso file/auth/cpu server at work: some

Re: [9fans] more little hardware

2010-03-28 Thread Georg Lehner
Jack Johnson wrote: Thanks to Google's targeted ads: http://www.eglobalwireless.com/p-4333-new-7-mini-netbook-laptop-notebook-wifi-windows-2gb-hd.aspx Also might make a good Inferno device if WinCE isn't too firmly ensconced. -Jack Anybody interested in porting Inferno emu to WinCE? It

Re: [9fans] interesting qemu problem

2010-03-28 Thread Georg Lehner
ron minnich wrote: [..] I don't see why venti has gotten so memory hungry, this seems new behavior. I realize I can twist the knobs myself but geez, this is a 4 GB disk -- why does it think it needs nearly 400 MB RSS to deal with it? ron Please note that quite a lot of installation problems

Re: [9fans] native install

2010-03-28 Thread maht
Until today i'm just a stubborn believer in Plan9. Real world experience with this system is, that nothing else works (out of the box) and nobody else uses it, besides people working with and for Plan9 just for the sake of it. Sorry to hear you think like that. I've been using Plan9 for about

Re: [9fans] native install

2010-03-28 Thread erik quanstrom
Until today i'm just a stubborn believer in Plan9. Real world experience with this system is, that nothing else works (out of the box) and nobody else uses it, besides people working with and for Plan9 just for the sake of it. speaking only for myself: http://www.coraid.com.

Re: [9fans] Man pages for add-ons: pax?

2010-03-28 Thread hiro
Wow, I really don't get that grammar. Could you perhaps sketch up some UML-diagram to make yourself clear? Or is it just my bad English? And again my question: do you guys actually try to fix an existing problem or are you making one up for scientific reasons? On 3/28/10, tlaro...@polynum.com

Re: [9fans] Man pages for add-ons

2010-03-28 Thread Ethan Grammatikidis
On 27 Mar 2010, at 16:46, Tim Newsham wrote: enough. We say we deal with it with namespaces, but the bindings on a freshly-installed Plan 9 box already make a much longer list than any $PATH I can imagine! but you don't have a LD_LIBRARY_PATH, a MANPTH, or any number of other search paths.

Re: [9fans] Man pages for add-ons

2010-03-28 Thread Ethan Grammatikidis
On 27 Mar 2010, at 16:54, erik quanstrom wrote: I'm thinking over the idea that we're bumping up against the practical limits of hierarchal file systems as a means for organising stuff, but I've no idea what else might work. Google's approach is not to bother sorting things out. Use

Re: [9fans] Man pages for add-ons

2010-03-28 Thread Federico G. Benavento
I don't know how this search tangent come into play, but in Plan 9 I don't search for files as I already do know where they are. I just search for stuff inside those files which is trivial as, like I said, I already know where the files are. I certainly don't like the gnu crap of having a

Re: [9fans] Man pages for add-ons

2010-03-28 Thread erik quanstrom
another concern I have is where are you going to put 3rd party drivers a new location is going to be created, probably a directory per 3rd party driver, when all this ends? i don't think this is on point, but since your brought it up, i run into a related problem all the time. how to organize

Re: [9fans] Man pages for add-ons

2010-03-28 Thread erik quanstrom
All this reminds me of one of my biggest gripes with unix, which may be relevant to the discussion here. Both env vars and namespaces are inherited, and while that's a strength it's also a weakness. I haven't used Plan 9 enough to know if it's a problem for Plan 9, but using [...]

Re: [9fans] Man pages for add-ons

2010-03-28 Thread Jacob Todd
On Fri, Mar 26, 2010 at 08:21:02PM +, Ethan Grammatikidis wrote: I'm thinking over the idea that we're bumping up against the practical limits of hierarchal file systems as a means for organising stuff, but I've no idea what else might work. I think most of you are making up problems

Re: [9fans] Man pages for add-ons

2010-03-28 Thread Ethan Grammatikidis
On 28 Mar 2010, at 20:36, Federico G. Benavento wrote: I think it all comes down to simplicity, you install the app, you run the app, it looks like some of you would like to add complexity just because you think it's the right thing to do. Well.. it's experience with Linux (and, I

Re: [9fans] quote o' the day

2010-03-28 Thread Eris Discordia
In fact, we have both printed on paper hanging from the wall of the corridor near our office. Let's hope they learn. Learn to... 1. ... not comment their code? 2. ... not include usage instructions? 3. ... not heed that their code might need to compile on any one of a number of platforms

Re: [9fans] quote o' the day

2010-03-28 Thread Jack Johnson
On Fri, Mar 26, 2010 at 5:54 AM, andrey mirtchovski mirtchov...@gmail.com wrote: try as you might, the irony is unescapable (see the attached helpful suggestion by google). It sounds like a competition. Write a program that, when translated by Google into Czech, still produces valid output.

Re: [9fans] Man pages for add-ons

2010-03-28 Thread hiro
Following your logic we must be one of the luckiest mailing list around. We use ls -t. It's better than git for your task. On 3/29/10, Ethan Grammatikidis eeke...@fastmail.fm wrote: On 28 Mar 2010, at 20:36, Federico G. Benavento wrote: I think it all comes down to simplicity, you install the

Re: [9fans] quote o' the day

2010-03-28 Thread hiro
On 3/29/10, Eris Discordia eris.discor...@gmail.com wrote: In fact, we have both printed on paper hanging from the wall of the corridor near our office. Let's hope they learn. Learn to... 1. ... not comment their code? 2. ... not include usage instructions? 3. ... not heed that their

Re: [9fans] quote o' the day

2010-03-28 Thread Connor Lane Smith
Sorry if I'm feeding the troll, but... On 29 March 2010 00:05, Eris Discordia eris.discor...@gmail.com wrote: 1. ... not comment their code? Comments lie. Code can't. Hence clarity of code is better than commented theses. 2. ... not include usage instructions? $ man cat 4. ... not include

Re: [9fans] quote o' the day

2010-03-28 Thread hiro
On 3/25/10, blstu...@bellsouth.net blstu...@bellsouth.net wrote: It's this kind of intellectual ugliness that makes the teacher in me hang my head in shame. How could we be managing to produce a whole generation of programmers who actually buy into that stuff? And it's not as if it's a fad

Re: [9fans] Man pages for add-ons

2010-03-28 Thread erik quanstrom
will be a lot of binaries with names that just don't make sense or correlate to anything. Good luck uninstalling a package or cleaning up when you upgrade one and find the new version doesn't install all the same files so you're left with, for example, stray header files which could

Re: [9fans] Man pages for add-ons

2010-03-28 Thread Ethan Grammatikidis
On 29 Mar 2010, at 00:28, hiro wrote: Following your logic we must be one of the luckiest mailing list around I was speaking of lunix co, on the basis that given enough additional apps things the same problems will arise. We use ls -t. It's better than git for your task. ... Surely