[9fans] About usb mouse wheel
Hi, all. The wheel of all USB mice I purchased in the last year is not managed by Plan9. All of them work perfectly with FreeBSD and Windows. No problem with Plan9 using the PS/2 interface + adaptor, but notebooks have only USB ports. The products on the (italian) marketplace change frequently. To try different models/brands is not a solution. Is this problem solvable configuring usb and/or mouse or I have to patch the "kb" code ? Thanks in advance. adriano
Re: [9fans] problem using a vera font in rio
On 26 Feb 2010, at 02:43, erik quanstrom wrote: it could be a general solution - fontsrv just spits out ordinary font files that you could use on plan 9. ttf2subf is only about 150 lines of code, once liberated from libfreetype. I am curious why the difference in rendering. in your screenshot 't', 'f' and 'g' look especially blurry. subpixel rendering? i don't know. it's not libfreetype. fontsrv asks the OS X graphics code to render each glyph into a box and then concatenates the boxes to make the subfont. all the text was noticeably lighter (more grey) than in your screen shot when i put them side by side. this is due to apple's algorithm for rendering glyphs. with freetype, if you get a purely vertical or horizontal stroke that is pixel-aligned, then you get no grey fuzz. with apple's algorithm, you will get grey fuzz. overall, the color density is more even with the apple algorithm, but it results in many more grey pixels. you can use the built-in screen magnifier to see this. I find Apple's easier to read, curiously enough. Perhaps those who don't could use fontsrv from an X11 build of p9p. i tend to like subpixel rendering, even the fuzz problem. (i don't have an opinion on apple's algorithm. i don't have one.) this is because i use fonts small enough that the fuzz is hard to see and a non antialised font looks poor. the font i use (/lib/font/bit/cyberbit/mod14.font) is about the same pitch as /lib/font/bit/lucidasans/unicode.7.font. maybe i just need better contacts :-). - erik
Re: [9fans] problem using a vera font in rio
> it could be a general solution - fontsrv just spits out > ordinary font files that you could use on plan 9. ttf2subf is only about 150 lines of code, once liberated from libfreetype. > > I am curious why the difference in rendering. in your screenshot 't', > > 'f' and 'g' look especially blurry. subpixel rendering? > > i don't know. it's not libfreetype. fontsrv asks the OS X > graphics code to render each glyph into a box and then > concatenates the boxes to make the subfont. > all the text was noticeably lighter (more grey) > than in your screen shot when i put them side by side. this is due to apple's algorithm for rendering glyphs. with freetype, if you get a purely vertical or horizontal stroke that is pixel-aligned, then you get no grey fuzz. with apple's algorithm, you will get grey fuzz. overall, the color density is more even with the apple algorithm, but it results in many more grey pixels. you can use the built-in screen magnifier to see this. i tend to like subpixel rendering, even the fuzz problem. (i don't have an opinion on apple's algorithm. i don't have one.) this is because i use fonts small enough that the fuzz is hard to see and a non antialised font looks poor. the font i use (/lib/font/bit/cyberbit/mod14.font) is about the same pitch as /lib/font/bit/lucidasans/unicode.7.font. maybe i just need better contacts :-). - erik
Re: [9fans] plan9 kernel on genode?
On Thursday 25 February 2010 17:30:16 erik quanstrom wrote:
> > kernel and there doesn't need to be one. By using Genode, applications
> > developed for one kernel can be ported to all the other supported
> > platforms with a simple recompile.
>
> this sort of thing is built for a knee-jerk reaction. ...
> which i will happily provide.
>
> ah, the chicago crain technique of building complicated
> system.
>
> for(floor = nil;; floor = nf){
> nf = buildfloor(floor);
> jackupcrain(nf);
> }
>
> the main difference is that each floor in a building
> is typically not unique, yet serves a unique purpose
> whereas in chicago crain systems, each layer of abstraction
> is unique, yet does not serve a unique purpose.
>
> maybe i'm looking at it wrong and each abstraction
> layer is actually floor space for some poor programmer
> to make a living.
>
I won't comment on the kneejerk reaction, other than to say
platform portability is not the primary goal of genode -
http://genode.org/about
http://genode.org/documentation/general-overview
At any rate, probably _I'm_ looking at it wrong - but it occurred to me that
plan9 on genode might provide a route to exploring union directories,
namespaces, etc. in a different context than via the current native plan 9
system.
Re: [9fans] plan9 kernel on genode?
> kernel and there doesn't need to be one. By using Genode, applications
> developed for one kernel can be ported to all the other supported platforms
> with a simple recompile.
this sort of thing is built for a knee-jerk reaction. ...
which i will happily provide.
ah, the chicago crain technique of building complicated
system.
for(floor = nil;; floor = nf){
nf = buildfloor(floor);
jackupcrain(nf);
}
the main difference is that each floor in a building
is typically not unique, yet serves a unique purpose
whereas in chicago crain systems, each layer of abstraction
is unique, yet does not serve a unique purpose.
maybe i'm looking at it wrong and each abstraction
layer is actually floor space for some poor programmer
to make a living.
- erik
[9fans] plan9 kernel on genode?
Anyone been watching the genode os framework? () It already supports Linux, NOVA, Codezero, L4/Fiasco, L4ka::Pistachio and OKL4 as base platforms/kernels - I don't know (as I'm sure I'm not qualified to make an assessment), but intuition tells me there might be some interesting possibilities were the plan9 kernel to become supported as well. http://genode.org/documentation/release-notes/10.02 " So why do we address so many different kernels instead of focusing our efforts to one selected platform? Our observation is that different applications pose different requirements on the kernel. Most kernels have a specific profile with regard to security, hardware support, complexity, scheduling, resource management, and licensing that may make them fit well for one application area but not perfectly suited for a different use case. There is no single perfect kernel and there doesn't need to be one. By using Genode, applications developed for one kernel can be ported to all the other supported platforms with a simple recompile. We believe that making Genode available on a new kernel is beneficial for the kernel developers, application developers, and users alike. For kernel developers, Genode brings additional workloads to stress-test their kernel, and it extends the application area of the kernel. Application developers can address several kernel platforms at once instead of tying their programs to one particular platform. Finally, users and system integrators can pick their kernel of choice for the problem at hand. Broadening the platform support for Genode helps to make the framework more relevant. "
Re: [9fans] problem using a vera font in rio
> an alternative is to use the p9p fontsrv to generate fonts. > here's acme with Calibri on OS X. that may be a good solution for p9p's acme. i admit i hadn't looked at it. > the glyphs are a little more washed out than in your > screen shot, but maybe it's easier to fix that than to > keep working on ttf2subf. maybe not, but either way > it's there. I am curious why the difference in rendering. in your screenshot 't', 'f' and 'g' look especially blurry. subpixel rendering? what font works well for go programming in acme nowadays? what do you use? (doesn't matter if it's variable width)
[9fans] RFC: 9p file system with queue semantics (as in message queues)
Hello all! In what follows I would like to ask for your comments regarding a 9p file server that exports a file system with a (message) queue semantics. (My major interest here is more about the actual semantic itself, and less about the implementation details. But all comments are welcomed :) .) To keep things short I shall prepare a small description of my proposal (for those with not too much time), and also a longer one (with more details for the patient ones). Short version [Motivation] I want to obtain a message queue like IPC for (distributed) applications, where it is not possible (or not wanted) to implement / use an existing queueing library / implementation (like JMS or AMQP based) (but where using the file system is a trivial operation). Possible target languages: Bash, Tcl, Lua, even Python or C. Also there could be legacy (or maybe just old) applications that already use the file system like an IPC mechanism and which could be just slightly updated to use a queue. Possible applications: anything related with SMTP, just think about how qmail or Postfix works. [Solution] Implementing a 9p file server that exports a file system with the following structure: / (this / is actually relative to the mount point) --> queues --> --> enqueue -- a folder --> dequeue -- a folder --> commit -- folder :) --> rollback -- still a folder Possible operations (I'm assuming we use it via shell scripting, and the commands found on most UNIX-es): * queue access (creation if not existing, or just "opening" it): mkdir /queues/to-smtp-gateway * enqueue operation: cp/.../path-to-my-email-file /queues/to-smtp-gateway/enqueue/email-192832.eml # instead of cp I could just create and edit the file in that folder touch /queues/to-smtp-gateway/commit/email-192832.eml * dequeue operation: touch /queues/from-pop-server/dequeue/email-9283828.eml # if there is no data in the queue the touch operation fails # do something with the file like reading it or copying it touch /queues/from-pop-server/commit/email-9283828.eml * rollback: in any case just touch the same file name inside the rollback folder and the entire operation is rollbacked End of short version. :) Comments? (Or go for the extended version.) Extended version [Motivation -- extended] My real motives are in fact somehow different: for the moment I'm working at a university, and here we have a large (by our standards, but I'm betting small by your standards) cluster of Linux servers. Sometimes I have to run some independent simulations or jobs on (parts) of this cluster. So my possible solutions are: * Condor, Slurm, or any other true-and-tried queueing system -- the problems with them are that most are big (as in heavy) solutions, which need a stable environment, are tedious to install, and need a lot of care; (also they need root access to install and operate...) * Globus (either pre WS or g-Lite): I don't even want to enter into this :) :) it just scares me... :) :) * XCPU -- I'm aware of XCPU, but it needs me to push tasks onto the worker nodes... (it could be used for the execution of the jobs in my queue;) * SSH + dtach -- my current solution -- I distribute an equal number of job files to the servers, and then I just run a couple of processes that try to grab a job file and execute it; (the problem is that the job assignment is static and if one worker nodes finishes early it just idles;) What I would like to have: * (on the submitter) just copy the job files in a folder on my workstation (laptop) and that's all; * (on the worker nodes) just try to acquire a file from a folder, execute it and write back the result to another folder; [Features] What should the queue file system support: * transactional processing of individual enqueues / dequeues: as seen from my short description I want to be able to obtain the data file (in case of dequeue), read it (maybe multiple times, as in open / read / close, again open / read / close, etc.) and only when I'm done processing it, I want to tell the system to commit the dequeue operation; * transactional processing of multiple related enqueues / dequeues: just think about an application that acts like a pipeline: it dequeues a task, executes it and enqueues it for further processing (to another queue); now the dequeue of the original message and the enqueue of the processed message should be atomic; (this is of course extended to multiple enqueues / dequeues from multiple queues); * (maybe) tagging a messages with some meta-data, and allowing me to dequeue only those messages that are tagged in a certain w
Re: [9fans] problem using a vera font in rio
> i want pretty fonts in acme, but i'm not sure ttf2subf will get us > there without major work (and a new port of the freetype libraries). i've been running ttf2subf with the freetype appendage cut off. i'm using the system library directly from p9p. that seems to work better than porting the whole freetype blob to plan 9 or carting around an old copy of freetype. (generally, i'd rather port to plan 9.) unfortunately, i haven't made time to clean this version up enough to stick out for public consumption. yet. i think the cutoff problem has to do with not extending the antialiasing all the way down to the true bottom of the character. i notice that the ds were cut off, but not gs and ys at least in the last font. - erik
Re: [9fans] Netbook Install Help
that mus be a miracle On 2/25/10, Purple_Q wrote: > Sorry Erik, that particular message was intended for John. > I had mentioned that changing sata controller settings in my bios from > ahci to ide allowed plan9 to see my hard drive but killed FreeBSD. He > asked at what point in the boot sequence this was happening, so I > posted it to show him. > > I can't get BSD to work if I set that to ide. Weird eh? > >
Re: [9fans] Factotum discrepancy
> makes it sound like the -a option takes precedence > over cs and ndb. But the code for _autdial() in > util.c looks for cs first and if it's there, the > -a option is ignored. (In p9p, -a seems to be ignored > altogether.) > > Which way should it be? I'd prefer if -a took precedence, > but if the existing behavior is really what's wanted, > then I suggest we change the man page so it's more clear > that's what's happening. it seems like this code is being very sly. i think the problem the code is working around is that if you first connect to the local machine and later want to mount sources, you will fail since the auth server you've specified in -a won't auth sources. (at least that's how i read the comment, if i squint a bit.) also, if you were to smarten up -a to take an authdom / authserver pair, e.g. -a coraid.com!tyty.coraid.com it could still cause trouble if ndb were updated while you were running one would expect cs to fix things up, but it wouldn't. is this a problem with a 9vx setup? perhaps getting cs looking at the right data is the real problem? - erik
[9fans] Factotum discrepancy
There appears to be a disagreement between the factotum man page and its actual behavior regarding the -a option. In the man page, the wording: -a supplies the address of the authentication server to use. Without this option, it will attempt to find an authentication server by querying the connection server, the file /ndb, and finally the network database in /lib/ndb. makes it sound like the -a option takes precedence over cs and ndb. But the code for _autdial() in util.c looks for cs first and if it's there, the -a option is ignored. (In p9p, -a seems to be ignored altogether.) Which way should it be? I'd prefer if -a took precedence, but if the existing behavior is really what's wanted, then I suggest we change the man page so it's more clear that's what's happening. BLS
Re: [9fans] Netbook Install Help
Sorry Erik, that particular message was intended for John. I had mentioned that changing sata controller settings in my bios from ahci to ide allowed plan9 to see my hard drive but killed FreeBSD. He asked at what point in the boot sequence this was happening, so I posted it to show him. I can't get BSD to work if I set that to ide. Weird eh?
Re: [9fans] Netbook Install Help
Oops. My own trigger finger, sorry. Yeah, the drive is just fine if set in the bios to ahci, but plan9 can't see it. If I set it to IDE, plan9 can see it but it gives BSD the errors you see in the image. Weird. On Feb 25, 7:28Â am, quans...@quanstro.net (erik quanstrom) wrote: > On Thu Feb 25 07:19:14 EST 2010, quans...@quanstro.net wrote: > > > On Thu Feb 25 06:29:21 EST 2010, bitpusher2...@gmail.com wrote: > > > Hmm, might be slightly above my head (I don't know what a node is). > > > That aside, the boot loader fires up fine, and it makes it to what I > > > believe is near the end of the boot sequence in fact. ad0 is my hard > > > disk; > > > queuevonqu.com/bsderr.jpg > > > that's not plan 9, but it looks like a drive failure. > > too quick on the trigger finger. Â i think i understand > correctly that the same drive works fine if the southbridge > is in ide mode. Â in that case, i'm not sure what's going on. > the drive is identifying correctly, but read/write commands > fail. Â if we assume that this kernel uses interrupts to identify > the drive, then the problem isn't interrupts, it's that the > read/write commands are failing. Â that really does look > like drive failure, and i'd be pretty surprised if the drive > worked in ide mode. > > - erik
Re: [9fans] Netbook Install Help
On Thu Feb 25 07:19:14 EST 2010, quans...@quanstro.net wrote: > On Thu Feb 25 06:29:21 EST 2010, bitpusher2...@gmail.com wrote: > > Hmm, might be slightly above my head (I don't know what a node is). > > That aside, the boot loader fires up fine, and it makes it to what I > > believe is near the end of the boot sequence in fact. ad0 is my hard > > disk; > > queuevonqu.com/bsderr.jpg > > that's not plan 9, but it looks like a drive failure. too quick on the trigger finger. i think i understand correctly that the same drive works fine if the southbridge is in ide mode. in that case, i'm not sure what's going on. the drive is identifying correctly, but read/write commands fail. if we assume that this kernel uses interrupts to identify the drive, then the problem isn't interrupts, it's that the read/write commands are failing. that really does look like drive failure, and i'd be pretty surprised if the drive worked in ide mode. - erik
Re: [9fans] What operating systems are the google guys using?
> I haven't logged into a real Plan 9 system in many years, Oh, n!!! WHY?!? As a plain user, a non-techie, I use Plan 9 native as my firs OS on everyday basis... I log onto linux only for testing things that may be worth porting, and for compiling the c++ stuff... Please, do not let the native Plan 9 die... ++pac
Re: [9fans] Netbook Install Help
On Thu Feb 25 06:29:21 EST 2010, bitpusher2...@gmail.com wrote: > Hmm, might be slightly above my head (I don't know what a node is). > That aside, the boot loader fires up fine, and it makes it to what I > believe is near the end of the boot sequence in fact. ad0 is my hard > disk; > queuevonqu.com/bsderr.jpg that's not plan 9, but it looks like a drive failure. - erik
Re: [9fans] Netbook Install Help
Hmm, might be slightly above my head (I don't know what a node is). That aside, the boot loader fires up fine, and it makes it to what I believe is near the end of the boot sequence in fact. ad0 is my hard disk; queuevonqu.com/bsderr.jpg My pardons if that's hard to read. Those messages at the bottom, it just loops those over and over, slowly. Is this what happens if numbering has changed or is this something else? If it looks exactly that way to you, perhaps you can tell me how I might go about finding out the new numbers/locations when set up to "ide" as opposed to "ahci". Perhaps booting off the thumb image I used to install FreeBSD in the first place? I do at least know how to edit the fstab should I get that far. Thank you.
Re: [9fans] Netbook Install Help
> I tried an experiment with both success and failure; > in my bios, I have an option to change "sata controller mode" from > achi to ide. I tried changing that and then the plan9 installer can > see my hard disk, however, the failure is that in that mode, I cannot > boot FreeBSD, it just freezes the system almost right away. Go figure : > ( At least I have it working on my other system. Probably switching from ahci to ide has caused your root partition to appear on a different device node. If that's the problem then you can fix it by telling the FreeBSD loader explicitly where to find the root partition. Then you can boot, at least into single user mode, and change your /etc/fstab to match the new drive numbering. Exactly where in the boot sequence is FreeBSD freezing? -- John Stalker School of Mathematics Trinity College Dublin tel +353 1 896 1983 fax +353 1 896 2282
Re: [9fans] Netbook Install Help
Well, I tried those commands and it did me no justice. I don't know how to change the driver you speak of so I'm thinking i'll have to give up on getting native Plan9 onto this netbook. I tried an experiment with both success and failure; in my bios, I have an option to change "sata controller mode" from achi to ide. I tried changing that and then the plan9 installer can see my hard disk, however, the failure is that in that mode, I cannot boot FreeBSD, it just freezes the system almost right away. Go figure : ( At least I have it working on my other system. Do you know if Bell Labs is still developing Plan9? Will we ever see a 5th edition?
Re: [9fans] sheevaplug port available
That's great. no progress here so far on that front. It's still on my todo list but not on the top of the stack. If it's urgent for anyone, let me know. On Wed, Feb 24, 2010 at 9:22 PM, wrote: > usb has advanced a little; we can see usb devices now but attempts to > read or write them hang. I don't know of progress on flash access or > anything else. > > >
