Re: [agi] Cell

2005-02-14 Thread Philip Sutton
On 10 Feb 05 Steve Reed said:  

 In 2014, according to trend, the semiconductor manufacturers may reach
 the 16 nanometer lithography node, with 32 CPU cores per chip, perhaps
 150+ times more capable than today's x86 chip. 

I raised this issue with a colleague who said that he wondered whether this 
extrapolation would work because of the dynamics of economic cost.  He 
argued that CPUs have been getting more expensive in absolute terms (not 
relative to performance) as their capacity has increased and he thought that 
this trend of CPU price increases would continue.  He said he thought that the 
reasons that computers have been getting cheaper as whole systems has 
come close to running its course leaving the rising price of the CPUs as the 
dominant trend.  He therefore thought that Moore's Law might run out of puff - 
not because of technology limits but because of cost escalations.

Since I had no idea whether he was right (my subjective impression had been 
that the long run trajectory for the price of computers was a long run decline) 
I 
thought I should ask whether anyone has a view on my colleague's argument.

Cheers, Philip

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Re: [agi] Cell

2005-02-14 Thread Eugen Leitl
On Mon, Feb 14, 2005 at 10:04:25PM +1100, Philip Sutton wrote:

 I raised this issue with a colleague who said that he wondered whether this 
 extrapolation would work because of the dynamics of economic cost.  He 

There are several developments which will terminate Moore in semiconductor
photolithography sometime soon (within a decade?). Each new generation fab 
is is getting considerably more expensive than previous. Current bane of 
chips is power density, which is a function of leak currents.

However, there are alternative computation paradigms and fabrication methods,
as well as achitecture tweaks, which do not have such hard limits. Whether 
these 
technologies will arrive on time to prevent a discontinuity in affordable 
integration density (what Moore is all about) is not yet obvious.

Some interesting technologies are SWNT wires and transistors, other
nanowire types, spintronics (MRAM and spintronic logic), reversible
computing, quantum dot self assembly, and multilayer organic electronics.

This is computing, but not as we know it, Jim.

 argued that CPUs have been getting more expensive in absolute terms (not 
 relative to performance) as their capacity has increased and he thought that 
 this trend of CPU price increases would continue.  He said he thought that 
 the 
 reasons that computers have been getting cheaper as whole systems has 
 come close to running its course leaving the rising price of the CPUs as the 
 dominant trend.  He therefore thought that Moore's Law might run out of puff 
 - 
 not because of technology limits but because of cost escalations.

Cost escalation is a technology limit. Moore's law is The complexity for
minimum component costs has increased at a rate of roughly a factor of two per 
year
See moorespaper.pdf in ftp://download.intel.com/research/silicon/ .
 
 Since I had no idea whether he was right (my subjective impression had been 
 that the long run trajectory for the price of computers was a long run 
 decline) I 
 thought I should ask whether anyone has a view on my colleague's argument.

-- 
Eugen* Leitl a href=http://leitl.org;leitl/a
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ICBM: 48.07078, 11.61144http://www.leitl.org
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http://moleculardevices.org http://nanomachines.net

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