Re: DIS: PAoaM v3: Not rushed this time and also better in general

2017-11-23 Thread Alexis Hunt
Fair enough. On Thu, Nov 23, 2017, 16:36 Kerim Aydin, wrote: > > > I wasn't being sarcastic - I quite enjoyed yesterday's brouhaha and > it convinced me parties could be fun. But that's probably because > you were first to market. Everyone has their own separate ideas

Re: DIS: PAoaM v3: Not rushed this time and also better in general

2017-11-23 Thread Kerim Aydin
I wasn't being sarcastic - I quite enjoyed yesterday's brouhaha and it convinced me parties could be fun. But that's probably because you were first to market. Everyone has their own separate ideas how the underlying stuff (eg spending or justice or contracts) should work and *all* of them

Re: DIS: PAoaM v3: Not rushed this time and also better in general

2017-11-23 Thread Alexis Hunt
I'm kind of surprised parties passed, to be honest. On Thu, Nov 23, 2017, 14:04 Publius Scribonius Scholasticus, < p.scribonius.scholasti...@googlemail.com> wrote: > I see this concern and this is why I am waiting on my courts overhaul. I > wish that fewer people were perpetrating their major

Re: DIS: PAoaM v3: Not rushed this time and also better in general

2017-11-23 Thread Publius Scribonius Scholasticus
I see this concern and this is why I am waiting on my courts overhaul. I wish that fewer people were perpetrating their major plans, when the underlying structure is like an airplane made out of cardboard and duct tape trying to fly from San Fransisco to Tokyo. Publius Scribonius

Re: DIS: PAoaM v3: Not rushed this time and also better in general

2017-11-23 Thread Kerim Aydin
On Thu, 23 Nov 2017, Aris Merchant wrote: > On Tue, Nov 21, 2017 at 9:15 PM, Aris Merchant > wrote: > > Have you considered the advantages and disadvantages of having > > combined vs. separate proposal and CFJ currencies? Many systems I've > > seen separate

Re: DIS: PAoaM v3: Not rushed this time and also better in general

2017-11-23 Thread Aris Merchant
On Tue, Nov 21, 2017 at 9:15 PM, Aris Merchant wrote: > Have you considered the advantages and disadvantages of having > combined vs. separate proposal and CFJ currencies? Many systems I've > seen separate the two. In fact The Economic System from a few years

Re: DIS: PAoaM v3: Not rushed this time and also better in general

2017-11-22 Thread Corona
I know, but this is discussion, not taking actions. On 11/21/17, Reuben Staley wrote: > I should mention: while using the Æ symbol is cute and all, it's likely > that it would rack up a few CFJs about whether you're referring to > Aether or something else entirely that

Re: DIS: PAoaM v3: Not rushed this time and also better in general

2017-11-22 Thread Publius Scribonius Scholasticus
Why? It's a standard character with a somewhat standardized meaning and as long as it is used consistently no problems should arise. On 11/21/2017 11:43 PM, Reuben Staley wrote: > I should mention: while using the Æ symbol is cute and all, it's > likely that it would rack up a few CFJs about

Re: DIS: PAoaM v3: Not rushed this time and also better in general

2017-11-21 Thread Aris Merchant
If we made it a few a month, I think existing systems (zombies, deregistration) would be able to handle the wealth collection problem. It's worse to have a few people exploiting a system than to have the off chance that a few people might slip through. I agree with G. that 2 a week is way too

Re: DIS: PAoaM v3: Not rushed this time and also better in general

2017-11-21 Thread Reuben Staley
I should mention: while using the Æ symbol is cute and all, it's likely that it would rack up a few CFJs about whether you're referring to Aether or something else entirely that doesn't exist. On 11/21/2017 1:38 PM, Corona wrote: Sorry for the walls of text; if you don't understand anything,

Re: DIS: PAoaM v3: Not rushed this time and also better in general

2017-11-21 Thread Reuben Staley
On 11/21/2017 8:12 PM, Owen Jacobson wrote: On Nov 21, 2017, at 4:06 PM, Reuben Staley wrote: On Tue, Nov 21, 2017 at 1:28 AM, Owen Jacobson > wrote: On Nov 19, 2017, at 7:19 PM, Reuben Staley

Re: DIS: PAoaM v3: Not rushed this time and also better in general

2017-11-21 Thread Owen Jacobson
> On Nov 21, 2017, at 4:06 PM, Reuben Staley wrote: > > On Tue, Nov 21, 2017 at 1:28 AM, Owen Jacobson > wrote: >> >> On Nov 19, 2017, at 7:19 PM, Reuben Staley wrote: >> >>> Re-enact rule 1994/0

Re: DIS: PAoaM v3: Not rushed this time and also better in general

2017-11-21 Thread Publius Scribonius Scholasticus
This could be resolved by making it be assets "controlled" by a player and have that set by an officer with some appeals process. On 11/21/2017 03:54 PM, Reuben Staley wrote: > My problem with having fixed assets per player per week is that that > will cause massive accumulation of wealth on the

Re: DIS: PAoaM v3: Not rushed this time and also better in general

2017-11-21 Thread ATMunn
On 11/21/2017 2:59 PM, Reuben Staley wrote: [snip] Amend rule 2516 by replacing it in full with: At the beginning of the Agoran week, the Treasuror CAN and SHALL cause Agora to create in: "create in" is an awkward phrasing. Could you change it somehow? Probably. 1.

Re: DIS: PAoaM v3: Not rushed this time and also better in general

2017-11-21 Thread Reuben Staley
On Tue, Nov 21, 2017 at 1:28 AM, Owen Jacobson wrote: > > On Nov 19, 2017, at 7:19 PM, Reuben Staley wrote: > >> Re-enact rule 1994/0 (Power=2) "Ownership of Land" with the text: >> >> Any existent Land for which ownership has not been explicitly

Re: DIS: PAoaM v3: Not rushed this time and also better in general

2017-11-21 Thread Kerim Aydin
On Tue, 21 Nov 2017, Reuben Staley wrote: > On Mon, Nov 20, 2017 at 8:36 AM, Kerim Aydin wrote: > > On Sun, 19 Nov 2017, Aris Merchant wrote: > >> Also, keeping shinies around as a way to pay for things might > >> discourage people from investing in the new economy,

Re: DIS: PAoaM v3: Not rushed this time and also better in general

2017-11-21 Thread Kerim Aydin
On Tue, 21 Nov 2017, Reuben Staley wrote: > My problem with having fixed assets per player per week is that that > will cause massive accumulation of wealth on the part of inactive > players. I believe I've mentioned this before in this thread, > actually. I did want to give everyone the same

Re: DIS: PAoaM v3: Not rushed this time and also better in general

2017-11-21 Thread Reuben Staley
My problem with having fixed assets per player per week is that that will cause massive accumulation of wealth on the part of inactive players. I believe I've mentioned this before in this thread, actually. I did want to give everyone the same amount of assets a week, but I was scared that

Re: DIS: PAoaM v3: Not rushed this time and also better in general

2017-11-21 Thread Reuben Staley
On Mon, Nov 20, 2017 at 8:36 AM, Kerim Aydin wrote: > On Sun, 19 Nov 2017, Aris Merchant wrote: >> Also, keeping shinies around as a way to pay for things might >> discourage people from investing in the new economy, because what's >> the point in getting paper if you can

Re: DIS: PAoaM v3: Not rushed this time and also better in general

2017-11-21 Thread Corona
Sorry for the walls of text; if you don't understand anything, I'll be happy to clarify. About it being rushed - A reform that could singlehandedly determine the (un)balance of Agora will never be prepared enough, if we want to release it in a (kind of) timely manner. That's why we should

Re: DIS: PAoaM v3: Not rushed this time and also better in general

2017-11-21 Thread Publius Scribonius Scholasticus
My idea about actions is less about the specific places, but just having different actions cost different amounts, based off of the previous action you did. So, calling a CFJ after just having called a CFJ would cost less than submitting a proposal after just calling a CFJ. On 11/21/2017 02:59

Re: DIS: PAoaM v3: Not rushed this time and also better in general

2017-11-21 Thread Reuben Staley
On Sun, Nov 19, 2017 at 6:13 PM, Publius Scribonius Scholasticus wrote: > Comments: > > On 11/19/2017 07:19 PM, Reuben Staley wrote: >> This is still pretty rough around the edges with the new mechanics. >> >> Title: Putting Agora on a Map v3 >> Author: Trigon

Re: DIS: PAoaM v3: Not rushed this time and also better in general

2017-11-21 Thread Reuben Staley
Indeed, public land is crucial to the system. In v4 I am thinking of implementing a special clause that allows the Cartographor to promulgate a list of Land Units (and accompanying facilities) that are not changed by normal capture rules, can't be auctioned, and can only be Public. On Sun, Nov

Re: DIS: PAoaM v3: Not rushed this time and also better in general

2017-11-21 Thread Reuben Staley
Actually, I never claimed my welcome package so... No, I'm teasing. I really did intend to add a clause making everyone eligible for welcome packages, but I just forgot to. I really need to write a list of things I need to implement into the next version. Also: HOLY CRAP you guys keep on talking

Re: DIS: PAoaM v3: Not rushed this time and also better in general

2017-11-21 Thread ATMunn
On 11/21/2017 3:28 AM, Owen Jacobson wrote: [snip] 1. Flip the Land Type of every unit of land that is not directly connected to a unit of Aether or is not connected by its own land type to a unit of Aether to You forgot to exclude (0,0).

Re: DIS: PAoaM v3: Not rushed this time and also better in general

2017-11-21 Thread Owen Jacobson
On Nov 19, 2017, at 7:19 PM, Reuben Staley wrote: > Re-enact rule 1994/0 (Power=2) "Ownership of Land" with the text: > > Any existent Land for which ownership has not been explicitly > changed belongs to Agora. > > Land belonging to Agora is called

Re: DIS: PAoaM v3: Not rushed this time and also better in general

2017-11-20 Thread Kerim Aydin
On Sun, 19 Nov 2017, Aris Merchant wrote: > On Sun, Nov 19, 2017 at 4:19 PM, Reuben Staley > wrote: > > 1. every player with an amount of papers less than 2 an amount of > > papers so that eir paper balance is equal to 2. > > > > [ This makes it so that

Re: DIS: PAoaM v3: Not rushed this time and also better in general

2017-11-20 Thread Kerim Aydin
On Sun, 19 Nov 2017, Aris Merchant wrote: > On Sun, Nov 19, 2017 at 5:53 PM, Kerim Aydin wrote: > > My main motivation - we've literally spent the last few months on shiny > > bugs, ironed many out, and I'm just paranoid about going through such > > a thing again. It's

Re: DIS: PAoaM v3: Not rushed this time and also better in general

2017-11-19 Thread Aris Merchant
Another random late night thought: why not give everyone a free piece of unoccupied land in the welcome package? It would give them a way to start participating in the new economy, rather than having to wait to win an auction. One of my biggest concerns with the idea to make estates an economic

Re: DIS: PAoaM v3: Not rushed this time and also better in general

2017-11-19 Thread Aris Merchant
On Sun, Nov 19, 2017 at 5:53 PM, Kerim Aydin wrote: > > > On Sun, 19 Nov 2017, Reuben Staley wrote: >> On 11/19/2017 5:26 PM, Kerim Aydin wrote:> On Sun, 19 Nov 2017, Reuben Staley >> wrote: >> > > Title: Putting Agora on a Map v3 >> > > Author: Trigon >> > > Co-Authors:

Re: DIS: PAoaM v3: Not rushed this time and also better in general

2017-11-19 Thread Ørjan Johansen
On Mon, 20 Nov 2017, Madeline wrote: Maybe the plan is to make Corona and I the richest players :P (I don't think I ever got to claim my welcome package?) I don't think there's any time limit for doing so, if you can catch Agora when it has enough Shinies. Greetings, Ørjan.

Re: DIS: PAoaM v3: Not rushed this time and also better in general

2017-11-19 Thread Kerim Aydin
On Sun, 19 Nov 2017, Reuben Staley wrote: > On 11/19/2017 5:26 PM, Kerim Aydin wrote:> On Sun, 19 Nov 2017, Reuben Staley > wrote: > > > Title: Putting Agora on a Map v3 > > > Author: Trigon > > > Co-Authors: Aris, ATMunn, G., o, VJ Rada > > > > Just to be clear; you're consciously getting rid

Re: DIS: PAoaM v3: Not rushed this time and also better in general

2017-11-19 Thread Publius Scribonius Scholasticus
Comments: On 11/19/2017 07:19 PM, Reuben Staley wrote: > This is still pretty rough around the edges with the new mechanics. > > Title: Putting Agora on a Map v3 > Author: Trigon > Co-Authors: Aris, ATMunn, G., o, VJ Rada > AI: 2 > > [ Version 3: So this is Go + Settlers of Catan + some RPG

Re: DIS: PAoaM v3: Not rushed this time and also better in general

2017-11-19 Thread Madeline
Alternatively, though starting everyone with a welcome package is probably a good idea, it seems clear the intention is to start by working on the public land (you don't need to have coins to build the facilities, and anyone can take from public land) and use the resources you get from there

Re: DIS: PAoaM v3: Not rushed this time and also better in general

2017-11-19 Thread Kerim Aydin
I should add :) The officer thing is a personal preference. But the circular coin thing - I'm just wearing my game designer hat and really failing to see how it will work, I feel like I'm either missing something (which is very very possible, I miss key lines all the time!) or it's broken...

Re: DIS: PAoaM v3: Not rushed this time and also better in general

2017-11-19 Thread Kerim Aydin
On Sun, 19 Nov 2017, Reuben Staley wrote: > Title: Putting Agora on a Map v3 > Author: Trigon > Co-Authors: Aris, ATMunn, G., o, VJ Rada Just to be clear; you're consciously getting rid of shinies, and making it so you need Land to make Coins, but you need Coins to buy land. I'm really asking

DIS: PAoaM v3: Not rushed this time and also better in general

2017-11-19 Thread Reuben Staley
This is still pretty rough around the edges with the new mechanics. Title: Putting Agora on a Map v3 Author: Trigon Co-Authors: Aris, ATMunn, G., o, VJ Rada AI: 2 [ Version 3: So this is Go + Settlers of Catan + some RPG mechanics now. It'll be interesting to see how this all plays out. Also: