Vernon Schryver’s FUSSP is still relevant since what, 2000 or so?
--srs
From: anti-abuse-wg on behalf of Richard
Clayton
Sent: Friday, May 1, 2020 6:28:42 AM
To: anti-abuse-wg@ripe.net
Subject: Re: [anti-abuse-wg] 2019-04 Discussion Phase (Validation of
In message , Elad Cohen writes
>if I will have the honor of being
>elected to the Ripe Board I will
[...]
>At the source BGP router, for any ip packet with a source address
>that is from the network of the source BGP router (lets call it
>original ip packet) - the source
Richard Clayton wrote:
> >There will be an API for the system with an option for email notifications
> >just
> >like abuse complaints are received in email messages now, so there will be
> >no
> >overhead to your staff. Regarding the reporters - this overhead can protect
> >from
> >flood of
In message , Elad Cohen writes
[of RIPE NCC operating a centralised abuse reporting system]
>To my opinion, this kind of anti-abuse system expense will be low and much
>more
>needed than many other expenses in the ~30M euros yearly expenses of Ripe.
Since there is already an (to a large
I can think of at least a dozen other such groups where most of the discussion
is actually operational and on those topics.
The only reason I find it useful to be on this wg is to look at abuse issues
specific to the ripe region
--srs
From: Nick Hilliard
Sent:
Michele,
Ripe have many many expenses in the ~30M euros yearly expenses that are not
related to the core goals of Ripe and can be avoid.
To my opinion, this kind of anti-abuse system expense will be low and much more
needed than many other expenses in the ~30M euros yearly expenses of Ripe.
Brian always have the right sentences at the right moments.
Respectfully,
Elad
From: anti-abuse-wg on behalf of Brian Nisbet
Sent: Thursday, April 30, 2020 4:16 PM
To: Suresh Ramasubramanian ; Sascha Luck [ml]
; anti-abuse-wg@ripe.net
Subject: Re:
Suresh Ramasubramanian wrote on 30/04/2020 14:07:
What would get discussed in an anti abuse wg?
Carrots? Almost all the discussion in AAWG seems to be single-tracked
on turning the RIPE NCC registry into a stick.
E.g. industry standards / best practices, liaison with other anti-abuse
Can NCC members decide to stop following ripe policies one day?
Regards,
Arash
On Fri, 1 May 2020, 00:02 No No, wrote:
> *>> You're assuming that the RIPE NCC has a right to tell organisations
> what they can or cannot do with their addresses.*
>
> It's not *their* addresses, it's RIPE's
*>> You're assuming that the RIPE NCC has a right to tell organisations
what they can or cannot do with their addresses.*
It's not *their* addresses, it's RIPE's addresses, which they allocated.
It's not *their* resources that are abused, it's the peer enabled
relationship that carries their bull
Suresh Ramasubramanian wrote on 30/04/2020 13:42:
RIPE NCC need not decide whether a behaviour is legal or not in order to
prohibit use of resources that it allocates for such behaviour.
You're putting the car before the horse. You're assuming that the RIPE
NCC has a right to tell
I will interject here and say that the WG exists because of the community, not
the NCC. There may be perceived hair splitting here, but it is important.
Obviously 2019-04 does directly ask the NCC to take an action, but we aren't
here because of that organisation, we're here because we care
Even if it's the only restaurant serving food in the region it can
impose restrictions, as long as they are reasonable.
And having a working abuse e-mail address seems very reasonable for any
kind of organization working in the internet.
There are many norms that are not laws, that still apply.
What would get discussed in an anti abuse wg? All the reasons why the
organisation due to which the wg exists must sit on their thumbs and do nothing
about abuse?
--srs
From: anti-abuse-wg on behalf of Sascha Luck
[ml]
Sent: Thursday, April 30, 2020 6:31:11
*"If this restaurant were the only source of food in a region, it would
damn well be illegal to refuse service no matter how (or if) the client is
dressed. "*
and so should not being able to access the restaurant at all because
someone is conducting a DDoS on the front door and flooding you with
On Thu, Apr 30, 2020 at 12:42:09PM +, Suresh Ramasubramanian wrote:
RIPE NCC need not decide whether a behaviour is legal or not in order to
prohibit use of resources that it allocates for such behaviour.
Wearing a T-shirt, shorts and flip flops is perfectly legal and yet you can be
RIPE NCC need not decide whether a behaviour is legal or not in order to
prohibit use of resources that it allocates for such behaviour.
Wearing a T-shirt, shorts and flip flops is perfectly legal and yet you can be
refused entry into a fancy restaurant if you wear them.
Nobody gets to sue the
Suresh Ramasubramanian wrote on 30/04/2020 01:58:
Why would I ask about something I am posting as an individual in my
personal capacity?
because your day job involves abuse / security and in that capacity you
may have access to good quality legal resources.
I see great pains being taken to
Hans-Martin and other fellow anti-abuse working group members,
On 30/04/2020 09.41, Hans-Martin Mosner wrote:
Am 30.04.20 um 02:58 schrieb Suresh Ramasubramanian:
However, being in a fiduciary role - with IPv4 being traded like
currency these days the description fits - RIPE NCC can’t not
Serge,
FIRST have experience in supporting violation of privacy laws.
You are trying to make Ripe LIRs to be informers on each other instead to unite
the Ripe community to fight abuse together, which is very bad to my opinion,
you know (according to presentations that were displayed in FIRST)
Hello,
The LIR in his logged in account will be able to create sub-users for specific
ranges.
The LIR will have an interest to do it because any unhandled abuse complaint
(in the percentage statistics) will appear under the upper-LIR name.
---
Please excuse me for not replying at the time of
I do not disagree with this.
Serge
On 30.04.20 09:41, Hans-Martin Mosner wrote:
> Am 30.04.20 um 02:58 schrieb Suresh Ramasubramanian:
>>
>> However, being in a fiduciary role - with IPv4 being traded like
>> currency these days the description fits - RIPE NCC can’t not get
>> involved.
>>
>
Am 30.04.20 um 02:58 schrieb Suresh Ramasubramanian:
>
> However, being in a fiduciary role - with IPv4 being traded like currency
> these days the description fits - RIPE NCC
> can’t not get involved.
>
...
> NCC owes it to the rest of its membership and the internet community at large
> to
On 29.04.20 18:22, Nick Hilliard wrote:
> To be clear, it's a fundamental right in large chunks of the RIPE
> service region to conduct business. If the RIPE NCC acts to threaten to
> remove this ability to conduct business, there would need to be sound
> legal justification for doing so.
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